Lanterns - S01E07 - Feedback

0:00A vacation rental shouldn't come with surprises. It should come with verbal care and 24 seven life support. If the hot tub's broken, that's a verbal care thing. If my teenager starts calling me Leslie, that's a family thing, Leslie. Verbal care and 24 seven life support. If you know, you're verbo term supply, see verbo.com slash trust for details. Hey, everybody, future editor David here. So I'm traveling and I have my mobile set up and I thought I had everything good, but I had a wrong setting and I didn't set my microphone, the right input to the right thing. And so the audio, my audio quality on my end is not great. And I just wanted to let everyone know and I apologize for that. I'm kind of a stickler for reasonable audio quality. So I was like, oh, it's a kind of a face palm moment. So I tried to do some repair on it, make it as sound as best as I could. But again, apologies for that. And hopefully it doesn't impact your enjoyment too much. Otherwise, let's get into the feedback episode with John.

1:16Welcome to comments versus where the lore hounds. I'm your host David with me as always is John, John, what we got going on today. Yeah. This is our feedback episode following episode seven season one of the lanterns, the Jordan boys legacy. So thank you to everyone who wrote in who sent us voicemails who was on the discord. We're going to get to some of this stuff, which I'm so missing Nancy's help right now. This feedback action. There's like Patreon messages. There's Spotify. There's the discord. There's the emails. There's the voicemails. And it's like, oh, man, I forget how much work it is to pull in everybody's comments. But geez, even the Patreon was popping off. They were like, people were commenting on their comments and everything and having full on discussions. It was like a whole separate site. That's awesome. That's what we want. Change me. Go. This right. You know, I'll say this later when we talk about one of the

2:20messages that we got, but you know, there's there's different kinds of podcasts in the world. And they're not, you know, we're not exclusive in terms of, you know, podcasts are cool because they're not like you can listen to multiple podcasts. I listened to multiple podcasts, right? It's not like you have to be just walked in on one. One of the things that I like about the community that has come together around the lore hounds is that it's yeah, we're talking at you, but we really want to be talking with you. You know, I'm saying it's it's not like, oh, it's like, you know, a couple of people with their authoritative opinions. We're just like everybody else. We're just the fools. We're just foolish enough to have microphones in one of like your own voices on the podcast. But everybody else has got as much interesting and valid takes and insights and different life experiences. And so to be part of a podcast where there's a community where it's a engagement dynamic where it's not we're not

3:22engagement farming here like we want engagement because that's like that's where John and I when we started this podcast, we came out of the community. We were just a couple of people who want to do some stuff for rings of power, prep season. And then we're like, oh, this is cool. This is fun. Let's go. And so like we carry that spirit with us. So it's just really cool that we can see when the community's digging in on something, you know, the conversations flowing and the messages are coming and the people are having their own side conversations that nothing to do with anything that you and I say on the podcast. This is great. I just love it. It's very cool. Yeah. So anyway, all that said, remember if you like what we're doing and you like what we got going down and you want to support the podcast because you know, we make sure that we're fair and equitable with everyone, you know, the subscription. It's not cheap to produce these things. It takes a lot of time. I'm on the road again. So you may actually hear a little bit different audio quality again

4:23because I got to fly out for some unexpected family stuff. You know, we make it work as best as can and part of the way that we do that is through the support that you guys can offer us. And whether it's listening to the, you know, the public feeds where we got ad revenue, you know, coming, but that's like fickle and it's not great or the subscriber stuff, which is really the best way to support us. But you know, people can rate, review, share the podcast. Those are all other great ways because we know everybody's circumstances are a little bit different. So we really appreciate y'all for showing up. If you want to send us email, comics versus at thelorhounds.com is the best email address. And of course, there is the discord where there is a lot of me just later this week. It's a little quiet and then suddenly just lit off like somebody who lit something and like people were talking. So go check out the discord links for all of that stuff is in the show notes. Also, be sure to check out our affiliates because we got a whole bunch of other podcasts

5:27that we're in network with. We'll ship dust. At least you'll have a great get there with the book writer and showrunner of the silo tv series. And she's wrapping up her coverage. Dungeons, Dubu guys guys are having a great time covering lanterns. It's pretty hard. Oh, they're enjoying it. They are having a good time. They are definitely having a good time. But you know, they're having a good time throwing some eggs around and digging into some different aspects of the show. But they are definitely having a good time. So go check them out. Never mind the music. Nicole and Mark, psychology and music. Cosmere Corner, John and the guys from our other podcast Radioactive Ramblings. They're covering the Brandon Sanderson's books. And of course, Marilyn and Dr. Sarah Brown to, well, Marilyn's our favorite Tolkien scholar. Maybe Sarah's our Sarah's our our second favorite Tolkien scholar. But they are doing their on screen analysis of season two of reigns of power in prep for season three, which is going to start next month.

6:30And they look at all the rituals that are on screen and sort of break it down and do some really amazing analysis. So we got that a whole bunch more. I just was trading messages with Anthony and probably Howard is going to be coming back soon. So you know, things are cooking. Things are cooking. Definitely be sure to check out Connor's reading list. If you're down for the comics, if you want to get into a Greenland or comic reading, there's a link in the show notes. You don't have to link to another link to something else to get it. It's just like right there. It's a Google Doc downloaded. There's a PDF printed off. Add it to your own Google thing. We try to make that as publicly available. And it's actually funny. Connor has been so good. He's been emailing in, sending in voice sending in like really good high voice. Yes. Yes. Yes. But he's even signing his emails, you know, Greenland, turn these. He's like being in a group to us. Oh, it's great. We're having a really good time here. So go check all that stuff out. But we got a ton of feedback

7:31showing to get into it. So we're not even going to take our first break. We're just going to launch right into it. And then we'll get in our first break here in a little bit. But thanks again for your help today with the feedback doc. First up is Melissa W. Long time more how to subscribe her posted a message on the episode six Patreon posting. And said, I just want to say I really love your discussion on the show. I'm getting a lot out of it. I didn't listen to this episode in time to add feedback, but I've got a thought. I think John looked on Hal's hand for the ring just so we know in episode one that Hal isn't wearing the ring. Now we know John would have now we know John would have known it wasn't there, but we didn't know that when we were watching the scene in the first episode. So thanks Melissa. Long time subscriber, long time supporter of the pod. John, any thoughts on this is interesting to think that they set that

8:38up just for us, the viewer, you know, just to give us something to to chase around what it's season. Because I agree with her knowing what we know now, John probably shouldn't know that the ring because he's not wearing it if he's dead. Right. Right. So that was just a way for us to signal for them to signal. And it kind of makes an importance to when we think about the fact that he had John has to trick guy, Gartner into getting it for him. And so it again, it just it focuses our attention on the ring in general. Right. Now, so think that as I don't want to say that but maybe he was checking because he had a reason to check. What was that reason? No, that's the question. And the reason is if he, if you're looking at someone

9:43who's been wearing a ring for a long time, there might be evidence of that on that ring finger. Okay. So maybe John is looking to see if there's evidence that this is how. How's Warren that ring on his finger for 30 plus years? Right. Okay. So I think it's all of the above too, right? It could be. Yes. Right. And it just sort of closes the loop and highlights everything for us. So yeah, I mean, 30 years, so he's making sure that it's how. Yeah, kind of. Okay. Because as, you know, excuse me, as Melissa says, at this point in the timeline, John should know that once a green lantern, once someone is dead, they don't possess the ring anymore. How has been in jail

10:50for, we don't know how long he's been in jail, but he's been in jail. So presumably he didn't have the ring in jail, right? But there would still be some, I think there would still be some sort of physical sign that this ring finger has had something worn on it for 30 years. Right. Right. Yeah. Because you wouldn't, like if you're the green lantern for the whole sector, you don't take it off. However, he took, he took it off though. Wouldn't he? Didn't he? No, he took, I mean, you should take it off. He gave it to John. He took it off. He didn't have it in John. Yeah. He didn't have it when he was in with making. Just John had it. Yeah. But you hear, I mean, it makes me think that if he's the green lantern for the sector, but earth, United States, Nebraska, or whatever states they have in the

11:53in the DC verse, you break some law, local state federal. And then they want to put you in jail. And here's the green lantern with a ring. I don't think you're giving up that ring and I don't think you're going to do the time. You've got places to be and things to do. So it makes up an interesting, it was actually if we go back to the early episodes too, when he got locked up, he did, he got locked up. Right. How got locked up? Do they get locked up? So because you worked before the judge, remember? Yes. So yeah, it begs an interesting question of like what's the authority of the green lanterns and actually here on the earth, right? Who recognizes the authority. It's okay. It's a weird analogy, right? But technically, the police do not have the they're supposed to follow the speed limit when they're driving around. And it's only when they

12:56activate their emergency lights or whatever, they have to say technically, right? I'm top technically that they're supposed to follow the speed limit except if there's an emergency, then they have an exception to violate traffic laws, but they have to be on a bonafide emergency to do that. And it's sort of a super scenes, but that's codified into law. Like, you know, how do you codify a green lantern? But they're still bound by the laws of where they're at. They can't break the laws of the planet that they're on. So murder is murder, stealing is stealing. They're still bound by those things. There are other things they may be bound by, but they can't just go around really nearly. I'm a green lantern. I can do whatever I want. Exactly. So that's not in the cold. So I mean, he made the money, so that's counterstition. He made that bill to play the

13:56highlight because you remember rollercoaster over and over and over again. Right. So he broke a law. Kerry told him in the first episode, this is not your jurisdiction. You deal with, you don't deal with terrestrial things. Right. Right. And so, and he had to understand that. That's what we get. No. This is this is part of my jurisdiction because this is alien. Because he was going with this guy. Right. Right. Which thing, you know, then if we talk about his gut, then we have to talk about the fact that, you know, is Kerry complicit in his, his house murder. So I'm using that we'll find out about on Sunday. I can't believe, I can't believe that this is over and they got it won. And I think I can had a comment, can W had a comment later. But he, I think he checked the times and I think he saw that it's still just like an hour episode. Okay. Okay. Cool. Alright. So Julia C on Patreon, a long time supporter friend of the

15:05pod was cooking off the baked young and her and G Joe were having a bunch of conversations as well on the side. It was great. So I and there were like nine or two messages. Julia is like leaning in hard, which is great. Love it. And so I just scraped like four of her messages that that seemed to be sort of not sub sub plots and responses to responses, but to, you know, straight comments that we could use. We could take terms reading these here. She says first, hello, well, no wonder I love the pot. I grew up in North Jersey, walked there close like a lot Brooklyn and Manhattan in my childhood. So what Jean is saying and how he says it is always ringing true to me. And I live in Vermont in the Northeast Kingdom. I didn't realize that, Julia, which I just heard David mentioned. I was reminded he is a fellow green mountain boy, no gender

16:07attended triple, triple heart emoji. Dude, Northeast Kingdom is like remote. That is a remote place. So the tri state is not so no, it is not. I try to remember if I knew Julia was up in the Northeast Kingdom as well. So I was always good to talk to a fellow reminder. I am a transplant though. So I will be I'm a, where do they call it? Call us gofers or groundhogs or something. I forget they have some funny names for no on Vermonters. We are internally displaced pandemic people. But we do love Vermont. I do not read her second message. Yeah. Is reverse whoosh sound a thing? I don't have a technical way of saying it, but sound number one sounded like an inverse for sounds two and three amazing catch your house. Dave live on the mic. Huh? You are afraid. Absolutely fucking tear.

17:16Motherfucker. That's all. Love all his little under the breath comments. So this isn't that first move you get real. Are afraid. So she's thinking that that sounds a little bit reversey. What do you think? I don't know because I still hear the big signing wound at the end of all three of them. So it sounds to me like it's someone taking off not landing in all three. Interesting. Well, yeah. Okay. All right. Rather than incoming and then yeah, it's out going. Right. Right. Now there was a bunch of other sort of backgroundy music and so, you know, they're not, they haven't given us anything more on it. So now we're starting to feel a little

18:17bit like, oh, did I write about this? Because it sounded wooshy to me. But then there was some other sound effects, you know, some background music that was like, oh, is that actually a sound, you know. So, but then they gave us really clear two more times and the rules of three, right? Like when John sings the song, for the third time, he sings it twice so that when we know when how says they're playing our song, John gets the signal right. So that's, you know, it sets it in our consciousness. We need it like three times, right? So that it's like, yeah, this is a clear signal and we are established it. Right. All right. Julie's next message. I don't think Bernadette was lying. I think how probably seated that invite on purpose. However, John's theory that forgiving how could lead to forgiveness of Bernadette is so good. I wouldn't be surprised if I'm wrong about her not like.

19:24But good mom or bad mom, good mentor or bad mentor, I completely understand how Bernadette and how would be friends. They're equally intelligent and formidable and are peers. It's not a magneto professor X1 for one, but definitely see an idea of equals craving the companionship of someone who quote unquote gets it. Anything. That's interesting. I didn't think about that. I didn't make those connections, but that is an interesting connection to make that there. Yeah. I can see that. I can see that. It has that kind of logic to it, doesn't it? It does. Yeah. There's an intensity about both of them. She would have been a formidable Green Lantern. Oh yeah. Oh yeah. Because she does not broke fools. She sussed out in the honor real quick. How will is

20:33and knew how to play the game and set things up. She would have been a formidable Green Lantern. I think Julie is on something there. There's a kindred spirit vibe between the two. There's also that parental vibe. In a way, Jean Jr. is as a mentee. I do happen to be a junior as well. It's true. Just say. I have not seen you making green bubbles. That's a good way to view them. Yeah. Magneto and professor Esk,

21:43not exactly the same, but sort of like that. I can see that. Right. Are you going to pick up the next one? Yeah. LOL. Sorry. I'm commenting. I'm live commenting. My listen, but I had one last thought. I don't want to fail to record before Sunday. In that first episode, I don't think Noah needed help throwing in the football. I think that was the start of his seduction of John, not sexual, only using seduction because that's the manhunter's whole thing. Look how comfortable John felt that dinner. I felt that kickback with a beer relaxation. My cackels were up, but I was happy for John to have a moment to relax, even if he was only a relaxing because he's under a man's spell. That's interesting. I like her turn to man's spell. They put that thing in there. That's interesting. And then he too. Yeah. He too comments out on her comments saying, Julia, I like this. I wonder

22:46if mother and son have manhunter or going to talk about that in a minute are seducing John. That's actually in some way. Very interesting. I love how in the middle of the podcast, you can literally hear David's mind get cooked. I'm down for this because one of the things that the D&D guys have been catching a little friction point for them is especially for Ron. Is it the manhunter's are as powerful as their portrayed? Then it seemed a little bit easy for John Jr. to kill Zoe in a way. Like, well, it was sort of a one headshot sniper thing. And I was planning when we go over there to do some season wrap-up conversation with that,

23:47I was going to bring this thought over, which is one of the things that we've seen about Zoe is she's not Iron Man with like impenetrable suit and death rays coming out of her eyes and rocket packs coming out like unfolding out of her back like the dropship and aliens or something like that. This manhunter is like a tuber intelligent plotting the thodicle works behind the scenes kind of manhunter. They're insidious, right? And we even get some of the talk about like how she views, you know, things when she was getting John is new skin. So the power of this manhunter is in their influence like D. Joanne, Julia here are saying that they're putting John under a spell just like they put

24:48care under a spell just like they put will make an under a spell like they put everybody in rush bill under a spell, right? How was that? I was only doing that. And in this case what Zoe was doing was creating a protective bubble around herself because she knew someday that somebody would come looking for her, be it the guardians, be it Anton's people, you know, Anton's people or whomever the green lanterns. And so she was using the people of the town not in a, you know, she wasn't trying to undermine the earth because if she was trying to undermine the earth, we'd already been cooked. But she was just creating a protective bubble around herself to be able to survive. I don't disagree. Here's something that's just starting to occur to me now too because we've been talking about this that maybe Noah is Zoe's offspring, right? Because Anton was like, hey, you know, like, oh, we can never procreate.

25:50There's been lots of talks about genetics and oh, you know, if the father was fearless, maybe that that's present to more of the sons and, you know, family, you know, there's a lot of family stuff going on. So what if if this is new right now in this moment, what if Zoe, after the thing with Anton, she was like, hmm, you know, maybe I do want something more from life. Maybe I do want that legacy of being a parent and, you know, having offspring. And so when, when she got the chance from having sure, instead of saying, hey, I'm going to corrupt this world and, you know, wipe them out, I'm actually going to use them and I'm going to have a child and I'm going to create this town as the protective bubble for my offspring. I mean, I think that's all of all of that makes sense.

26:57But what I will say, you know, after seven episodes is that if I had a chance to speak to the showrunners, the team behind this series, I did. I did the Midnight Boys. I listened to it on your recommendation. But the question I would ask is perhaps they didn't want the man hunters to be DC Ultron. Right. So the ideas that we have about what the man hunters are, they're overwhelming power from the comics. Maybe that's not what they intended to have these characters portrait. They wanted power to be shown in a different way. Because again, we're talking about Android,

27:57we're talking about, you know, sentient robots who wipe out organic life that's Ultron 2.0. Right. And the MCU already did that. So maybe taking the tag that will do this story, but tell it in a different way is why we don't have the boom, bam, pals of robotic power being displayed on TV. With like massive green scene set pieces of, you know, super OP powered, you know, it could be wrong. Giant, you know, trucks, trucks at each other and stuff. You know, I'm not saying that's what they intended, but it is plausible to me that that is the way that they envision portraying man hunters in a different light than we've already seen sentient robots

29:04being portrayed. So Connor sent in some material and one of the his, one of the things that he's, he sentient was about man hunters. So we're going to do that at the end, right. Comics corner comes at the end so that if people are like, whoa, a little too nerdy for me, like that's down there. But he's got a voicemail about man hunters. So we'll hear about that a little bit more later or about his comics thoughts on what man hunters are. But I like what you're saying in as much as these are smart showrunners, these are smart writers. They are aware of what's been done in the marketplace in the last 20 years. They've seen what's worked and what's not. Whether they're conscious of that or not, that is in their brains. They they have a residual sense memory of going to see the what was the Avengers, you know, the Avengers movie, the

30:13final Avengers age of ultra. Yeah. Well, and age of ultra, but what's the final one? The end of December. Ending, thank you. They will have a sense memory of seeing Black Panther. They will have a sense memory of seeing Superman, Aquaman, whatever, all of these things. So that is in their space. They can't not separate themselves. They haven't been living in caves, right? They they partake in the modern media. Damon Lindlove, Mystery Box, silliness aside. Right. But like who are the writers and what are the what stories are they trying to tell? That they know that if you just start throwing magic ringshit all over the place from the get go, then you've just changed the scale of the show and then there's no stakes. Nothing means anything because everybody's OP. Everybody's overpowered. And so making a man hunter not death rays and rockets coming out of their back is a far more

31:13interesting challenge as a writer. And far more interesting for us as an audience, I would assert that having some killer robot that is like amazingly powerful and insightful and can just manipulate everything, right? I agree. I totally agree with your take on this. Yeah, so I think that that really might be why we don't see, you know, like you said, the OP and tagging us here. Like so I could be wrong. Maybe we get all of that in episode eight. Maybe all of that comes out. Thank you. Just to all the effects of budgets. I did the last episode right into the last episode. We get all this spectacular, you know, on-screen mashups and blowups that we want to see. But I think for the at least for the first seven episodes that they wanted it down on purpose. Right. So but that's the question I would ask of the show

32:21on this. And they did mention that on that Midnight Boy interview. They just said if you just start popping off of the ring from episode one, then you just change the scale and the scope of the and the expectations of the show from the beginning. Yeah, but I think what some people are expressing that they wish that they had more of the spectacular on show. And I get it. I understand it. For me, you know, I just think it works for me personally. You know, what they've done. I don't miss the spectacular. There are times that I do miss the spectacular. Did I do want what I see on comic book pages to be replayed and re done on screen? Like there are moments that I'm like, how the fuck? I want that. But I'm engaged in this story and I don't find myself missing

33:21that with this show. I'm the same way. And I think all right. So I'm going to react to the D&D guys a little bit real time. Oh gosh. They got some complaints about that. You know, it's you know, it's too much this way and not enough that way. And I'll say I'm going to say this when we go over there. I want to say, I think if it had been the other way you guys would have been complaining and the other. I think you would have complained either way. Nothing they give it. It'd been all Biff Powell bang. You'd be complaining that it wasn't grounded enough and there wasn't enough true detective in it and whatnot. So to me, you know, this is what I'm I'm want this is again, personally, perfect show for me. It's like an end or right that we didn't and or didn't have skywalkers and lightsabers and force users. But it dealt with all these these really deep issues.

34:23Peng winded this for me. We talked about this very early on in the beginning of the run of the show is like where are these shows that are set in these supernatural worlds and with these super powered individuals and things like that. But yeah, they're not giving us all green screen action, but they're actually telling story and you said this a lot. I don't care what the story is, but tell the story well. Yes. Develop the characters, build the tension, pay off the the drama and take our characters somewhere interesting so that we are taking somewhere interesting. Yeah, adaptations are adaptations that someone else's views of how they see the things that you know, you might have read. I might have read. And they get to make, you know, the choices that they want to make based on how they view the story. But again, if you tell a good story, then I'm cool with changes. And I just

35:29happen to think this is a good story. If other folks there are other folks who don't, that's cool. We're not old. Yeah, we're not begging. We're not. We're not trying to make you anybody like something they don't they don't want to like because God knows you're not going to make me like something. I don't know that. Obviously, the first one we like, hey, it's just things, you know what I mean? But it's um, but again, I just think that given how the first seven episodes have played out, it has to be to me, it would have to be like a conscious decision that they made to portray the man hunter in this way. Right. And I'm really grooving on this theory that Noah is Zoe's offspring that carry somehow involved in the surrogacy of of Noah. Because you know, back to where she said, you know, to how she gave me a miracle. Yes, yes, right. So we're all assuming it's Noah. Yeah, exactly. And how that actually went

36:34down and what was, you know, what with the mechanics word of it and everything, but we know that carry is maternal to Noah, regardless of whether it's biological or adoptive, right, or whatever that whatever the structure is there. But I like this idea that that Zoe created Rushville so that Zoe could have the opportunity to have something more than the um, the, uh, what's the way I want to say this, this pursuit of, and in contrast, we're going to talk about this later, but this, this particular pursuit of justice and justice, and what that actually means in practice. All right, let's do this. Let's take our first break and then we'll come back, we'll finish, we'll keep going on with some more feedback. All right, cool.

37:35And we're back. All right, you want to pick up Steve's next email. Howdy fellas. Well, what's up, Steve? David, I totally didn't catch that was Melanie singing the Bob Dylan cover in this last episode. Do you guys remember episode one, the song that Hal kept playing on the jukebox to piss off the locals? That was Melanie's famously annoying song brand new key. Oh my, uh, the main words that repeat in that song are, I've got a brand new pair of roller skates. You've got a brand new key. I think Hal's song selection certainly makes a lot more sense now. Six episodes later, whether or not the roller skates refer directly to the ring, the key is certainly significant to Hal's story in juniors now. What do you think? Yeah, well, I think you should keep reading email because there's no comment to this story. Then now with the mel, I will just quickly interject, oh, however, is that? Yes. I didn't connect that

38:40that Melanie from brand new roller skates to this Melanie of the Bob Dylan cover. I didn't, I thought the cover that they played us was more contemporaneous, contemporaneous, more recent, but Melanie was, she was an artist from before. And so I didn't actually make good, because it sounded like a more of one of these, there's a lot of covers being made these days. I know Mark has talked about it. I'll never mind the music a bunch. And I forget what they're called. They're not covers. There's some other name. It's like a remake. On original? Yeah. Yeah. Sorry. Almost a spin taker. Yes, exactly. So anyway, that's that cherry on with his email. Okay. And as far as Melanie's Dylan cover goes, the last line and don't think twice could easily be both Hal and junior directing that sentiment towards each other in a banter sort of way.

39:41So long, honey babe, where I'm bound, I can't tell. Goodbyes to good a word, babe. So I'll just say fairly well. I ain't a saying you treated me unkind. You could have done better, but I don't mind. You just kind of wasted my precious time, but don't think twice. It's all right. Yes. So I love it when the music folks on a show could find a song that says something about what's going on on screen, but that song I'd have been written 20, 30 years ago or something. Or maybe, you know, it may be even more recent, but written and performed in an entirely different setting with no intention that it's going to be used for the show. But I love it when they can find a song that not only is

40:42sonnically interesting, like it says cool song, it sounds good, it's fun, it's cool. But then there's lyrics in it. Right. Actually, to add something to our conversation that adds something to our interpretation that adds something to our experience of the show. And I so love the fact that Steve like, got in, got the lyrics and like, that's Laura out and stuff. That's like, this is what makes the Lord like, we I love digging this stuff up and then go, oh, look at this cool. Like, perfect, perfect insight, Steve. Thank you so much. And then we have a PS. Also, I don't know about anyone else, but that scene on the dead planet where they're in a rowboat and those little red apples started floating by one by one. I was hella transported right back to the sewers of Derry. I'm not saying that the showrunners turned Zoe into Pennywise, but her shifting her strategies and focusing on manipulating a small little town sure make it seem like the general idea of it was on their minds. Huh. That's cool inside. I did not watch.

41:48Yeah, I'm very, very home. Yeah, but I know John and Alicia and Martin. Yes, they did. Yeah, so when Alicia, Alicia, this for you, when you when we do our seated rap all together, put a pin in this one because I'd love to hear your insects. Take diving with with with the Steve. That's interesting. That's interesting. Yeah. I like it. I like it a lot. All right. Next up is Troy Beans email. Yeah, I got it. Troy says hat ceremony Noah brought up his team, which is a shield. He is hiding behind. Like the man hunter used the town as her shield. Troy's on his own here. It's good. Noah redirected the full blunt of the attention on him in this moment and directed it towards the game. Directing the whole town like a man hunter would. Don't look at me. Look or do something else

42:51because something may happen at the game. Okay. Troy does. This is the first music. This is something may happen at the game. I like this. I like Troy's insight here on how Noah is doing exactly what a man hunter would do. But Troy but Noah is not a man hunter that was created by the guardians. Noah is an offspring. So in all offspring are always the same but different of their progenitors. You always carry something with you from your creation, so hers. Whatever. I don't know. It's a weird way to say that from your parents or what have you. But then you are your own person and you have your own trajectory at the same time. So Noah interested in being into politics because Anton said, oh, it's not like you to have taken

43:59a alpha position like you would always take a subservient role to hide yourself to manipulate better. But then Noah, if Noah wants to get into politics be a senator and all that kind of stuff. That's that's a bit high profile from what Anton would have was suggesting that how Joey as a man hunter operates. So that tracks because then the offspring is their own person. Noah is his own person. And if he's part human in some way, if he's not pure man hunter, that makes even more sense that he has his own ideas about his own trajectory. Does he even know that he's a man hunter? Hmm. I mean, so is it the consensus around law hounds galaxy universe that not only is there another man hunter, but that man hunter is Noah? I don't know if people need to. Is that what I'm hearing from you David?

45:03Maybe I'm just using my position to to to ask questions and think about things. But I think that would be revealed in episode eight. That's the question. So the I think everyone is settled on that the mystery is not over that there is more to the mystery of rushville than just kill. Okay. Okay. Then from there, the theories, I think are are numerous. I think if you ask the deities, guys, they're certainly thinking that somebody else is a straight up man hunter. I'm fully settled on the fact that Noah is the offspring of the man and whether he's part human and part man hunter or he's full man hunter or he's a man hunter, the construct of a man hunter like the mid. He's some sort of a copy. What's the

46:12japaedo right? Was that the puppet? The pinotchio do? It's kind of a japaedo. What was pinotchio situation? Some sort of creation that was that Zoe breathed life into in some way? I don't know yet. Okay. But I don't think people are anti that theory. Okay. I haven't heard I haven't heard people say otherwise. But I think people are still very suspicious of what's going on in rushville. Okay. So I just answer your question about our musings. A little bit. All right. You want to pick up KW? Yeah. Let's get to KW with this wonderful subject line that we saw Jack and shit. I mean, with somebody sends an email with that subject line. You know, you're immediately like, oh, yeah. Kent is your attention. What do we talk about? Kent W. Friend of the pod. Long time. So, yes. Hello. When they already have hook, have you

47:18hooked but keep throwing more entry? Got you. Both have serious childhood trauma. And what's going on with John, the first green lantern without the need for the ring? We all thought that how was gone, but they can keep him going into season two now. Which I read was happening, but not officially said yet. Okay. So yeah. Great. That's good stuff. Hopefully fingers crossed. Who shot? How Jordan? Who frees a nest room? Who shot? Who shot? Come on. Okay. Okay. Who shot? HJ. There you go. Come on. Heather. Long. Oh, my gosh. You would have to say that. I'm not letting that one go. There's a bunch of things I'm not. Obviously. I see. Who frees a nest room? Why? Will John take a suit from

48:20house? Place? That's, I don't think he will because this key can't fit a suit from now. Yeah, I don't think no, no, John. John's physique would not allow him to fit into one of houses. No, Ken, you're off base on that one. Is there something more going on in rush field? Is it possible? There's another man who's looking about, we just talked about that, like, who will John pay reparations? And how many rocks does John want to kick after giving his watch away? Let me tell you just, you know, first of all, we're not, we're not going to use the racist terminologies that they're trying to get us to you. She mag you, told my reparations. This name reparations is blackmail. You know, what's funny is in that same conversation,

49:21she said, we're not racist. Like in the same, like it was a perfect setup. It was a perfect, sort of little rope of dope thing that the writers threw in there. And again, given the way that was, that's like a large, it's a rich, that's not watch. And it is $500,000. We shot, we shot, sorry, we don't see Richard. We say Richard, Richard Millard, Richard, Richard Millard, it's a Richard Millard, you know, saying that how you do it, John, you do it. What is our, what are we doing in this world? You're paying two, three hundred thousand dollars for a piece of years on your wrist. And there's something wrong with that. Yeah, you ran a headpiece made of gold and diamonds to show people who you are. That's a, you know, yep. So you build your own to, to show people who you are. Yeah, do you show that?

50:22But you remember, so people who you are, some people want to build arches and big ballroom. Oh, no. So, you know, yeah, it's, it's this more, it's this sense of mortality that, that, that, and when you fear, when you can't imagine the world without you, and it's not just something that's happening in now, it's happened across the span of human history, right? That there are people who can't imagine the world without their, their imprint on it. Right. And the pair men are one of us. And so's the wish we saw a million. Yeah. And John, John gives her that three, 15. Now we scrapping. I'm not only scrapping with John, you know, we go on a rush, we know, we demand that three, 15 back because you got three, 15 and the watch. And we ain't letting that go. We ain't letting that happen. You know what I'm saying? I'm calling the bros. I'm calling everybody. I'm calling Bernard, I'm like, hey, you know what your son just did. You think Bernard

51:28that gonna let that slide. She not letting that slide. Three, 15 and are they sure? Come on. No way. No way. We're not doing that. We're not doing that. So many rocks will be kicked if she gets that three, 15, many rocks. And finally, Ken W says, and 60 minutes of pure joy ahead me things. I, you know, I kind of, I'm thinking, yeah, it's gonna be a really good, I think they land the plane. I really do. I would be shocked if they did. I know there's a lot of moving parts. I know there's a lot of moving parts. There's so much that we want to get answers to, will they give answers to everything? I can't say with confidence that yes, they will. But I feel like even if we don't get all the answers that the plane will be landed, and we will disembark safely. I really do. And I hope I'm right.

52:30It, I would have a hard time if it would be crushing. It would be crushing. It would. It would. It would. Because the show is just worked from confidence to confidence all season. Yeah. Yeah. Now, great. There's a few things here like nine months, sniper missions and, you know, a few little whatever's. But none of that has taken me out of that issue. I like it's all fine. So, right. Right. Looks like you want to pick up Ken's other. Yeah. Yes. That we've got from the Patreon. Hello. Gun has said online that it's season finale, not series finale. And unfortunately, I've seen episode eight is just one hour long. Hopefully into webs are wrong. Ken. Yeah. There's a lot to do in that hour. I totally agree with you. Like, I, you know, I'm used with you the other day that I said, I hope they have two hours set up for

53:32this one. Yeah. I think this is what his message is in return. Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. So it's just, um, yeah, just, yeah. There's a lot to do. But again, I, I, I am hopeful and I feel fairly confident that given the hour timeframe that we will be satisfied and left wanting for more obviously. But we will be satisfied. So can they do it optimistically? I'm saying yes. These are experienced showrunners. And I think the writing credits were for Lindelof and the other two showrunners. They don't have the Wikipedia. I think it's Lindelof and King for this. I just jumped over to the Wiki page here and it says Monday, Lindelof and King are credit writers. There you go. So. And they wrote the, for now, the pilot as well. They wrote the pilot. Yeah.

54:39You know what's interesting is on that interview with, uh, Brett Gibson and, uh, Vanessa Maiden Kelly. Yeah. I would be in Kelly. One of the questions that they asked them was about dish episode order and stuff like that. And apparently they juggled all the episode, the order of the episodes after in post production. And I'm like, yeah, whoa, that is wow. Like if a show can hold, if a show can withstand that kind of, hey, we're going to shoot it in this order. All the actors are working in this order. Right. And then we take it and then we go, okay, well, this episode goes here and then that episode goes here and they, they scrambled two or three episodes around like that for a show to hang together and have as much coherence as this season has had with all of the moving parts and all the intricacies to me. That is a strength of the writing because we know we show that shall not be named that our brother over there was

55:46writing it on the fly as he went and it was a complete shitshow and made no sense. And he was feasting on the bones of another show and script and it was, he was like writing it while they were shooting it. It was like a complete mess. So this they wrote it, they shot it and then they juggled the order. That's wild to me that the show. Yeah. Go ahead. I don't remember which pod it was. It might have been the DC official pod with with the writers. Okay. After episode three, Vanessa Baton Kelly said that I believe episode three originally was going to be episode five. Right. And they're like no. And they jumbled. There's like two other episode they jumbled like it's three and five switch and I think there was a couple others that switched as well. So like four episodes got moved around in an eight episodes. That's half the episode in the season. Yeah. And the season can hang together and it's better for it. That is an amazing level of writing.

56:49Yeah. That is just because the show is so coherent and so well read you know the red yarn on their board when they were breaking story, you know, the the whole conspiracy board thing. That they did some masterful work to be able to do it. All right. We got banana. Sent in an audio music. Thank you, banana. And again, you can send in one of these two. You just do a voice memo app on your phone and then just email it to comics versus works real simple. Help. I'm trapped in a mystery box. The only way to get out is to share my theories. Here's my theory for episode seven. The last minute of the show gave me this idea. The team up between Halagram and John is working so well. I wonder if this was Hal's plan. His backup, his failsafe 20 years ago when he defeated Sinestro. It warm out so badly, so emotionally that he thought I can't do it again. But if I leave

57:52my backup from before, maybe he could do the job. So now in 2026, this is working. This is what's happening. Hope that's a good theory. Either way, I'm excited for it. Next week's episode. The whole series has been no wasted screen time. So I know it's going to be a great finale. That's interesting. That's interesting that how it was like, yeah, these next 20 years are going to be shit. Yeah. Let me let me leave a better version of myself because I can feel it coming. A pre-Synestro fight version of myself. That's, yeah, that's that's something. But I'm gonna deep deep into the role of tinfoil there. He's got the whole role out. He's just playing it. That's the room in the tinfoil. That's that's a great musing. Yeah, seriously. That's some great musing right there. I like that. And then when he, when John, when Hal comes across John Jr. and

58:58says, wow, this guy really is my replay. Like, this is the guy who can inherit the Greenland Turnt mantle from me. I'm going to be pissy about it, but he's still the guy. Guy Gardner is not the guy, right? Like John Jr. is the guy. And he knows that he's got the halogram there. That it's sort of like, wait, it's like one of those plans where you're like, oh, I'm going to set this thing up over here. And then, oh, wow, circumstantially something else crops up. And then it plays perfectly into the thing that I had set up before. Right. Right. And so that's when he, when he calls him to rush Bill, right, he's got to trick him to get Bernadette to say, you know, do the whole apology thing. And then after he strikes him and he's like, Hal is afraid. Like, John Jr. has never seen Hal afraid. Can't imagine him afraid. And when he's lying sideways in the booth saying, don't tell me when you're here for whatever you do, like with that fear, that palpable fear emanating

1:00:00off of him, those are all just big signals to John. Lock in. And you've got everything that you need. You know how to, you know, the halogram, the ring, like all of it. I know that you can use it. And then he's got the halogram there as this excellent, pre-jaded version of himself. But that's deep. No, that's good. That's good. I like that. I like that. All right. Chamberouski, aka Chamberunny, a lore master. I posted this on the discord and I wanted to throw this in. And this goes into the second manhunter theory, which helped me sort of refine my theory. So this is like a little bit of an earlier version of at least my thoughts. Chamberunny says, I haven't been reading all the comments in the threads every week, but I'm thinking sheriff, the sheriff is the manhunter. She's able to continue to be the

1:01:04lady sheriff in a small ass Midwest. Okay, Chamberunny. And everybody's seemingly likes her. Her stepmom is a manhunter. Her son is looking obviously to be one as well, but has anybody ever considered that the sheriff is the lead manhunter? So he was the decoy, like number two, ready to take the all for the good of the mission kind of person. Or maybe she was the leader and sacrificed herself. And so now it's just the sheriff and her son as the only manhunter's left, but I just see a lot of people totally riding off the sheriff as the manhunter. Like the midnight boys, for example, don't even list her in the who's who the manhunter list. Well, they do in the episode seven recap. So I think this was said before their episode seven came out. And I just find it crazy that nobody is thinking that she's probably a manhunter regardless of what health things. I mean, after all, aren't they supposed to be seducing people to gain advantages on situations, marrying Billy to get into the rich family in town, banging Hal after he got out of prison to probably get close to him and

1:02:09learn whatever she could about the Green Lanterns plans. I don't know. It would be a classic kind of lindel off twist that was in plain sight the whole time, but also hidden due to us wanting to trust secretly untrustworthy people. What are your guys' thoughts on this theory? I know you'd like it. I don't. I don't like Rudy, but I don't like the deer. Why? I like Chambruni's thought processes because it helped me clarify my thought process. What's the difference? That sheriff Carrie is not a manhunter because she was escaping Gotham, cut off her own finger, and Zoe said, let's grow you a new finger. I think they were laying tracks for us all along that her and Hal had actual genuine chemtons. And when they were arguing on the open road, and she was like, Zoe gave me a miracle. And it wasn't the thing, it wasn't the

1:03:14pinky. It was the opportunity to be a parent and to be a better parent than she had. Because this whole show is a lot about parent-ful-it, right? It's this like soaked through and through. It's about parents and children. And so this is what so Chambruni's theory helped clarify his musings, helped clarify my theory. But I'm actually putting it as a theory. I'm actually wager at her points that Noah is the offspring. Is the second manhunter? No, not a manhunter. Not a manhunter per se. Right. Not created by the guardians to the force justice throughout the world. But Zoe realizing after her experience with Antan, she's like, oh, what would it be like then? I don't know. I get you know, Zoe is like was it to create something of my own? Yes, to create something. Because Zoe's whole experience as a manhunter is to destroy things.

1:04:16And maybe Antan as the spurned lover, right? You know, she was like, she had regrets that they couldn't have an offspring. Maybe she did actually follow in love. Maybe a manhunter can actually have feelings. Interesting. Because I like Chambruni's thought process here. Yeah, I like the process. Because I don't trust Kerry. Right. Like, she suspect 1,000 percent for me. So there is something shady about her. I just don't know what that something is yet. And from you, she's protecting herself. That she's protecting Noah. Yeah. But I can see how it could be that she is also more than what she showed. Yeah. I could get that. I get that. Well, one of the questions that we nobody's really done, none of us have really dealt with is

1:05:17what happens when you have a little bit of manhunter blood in you? Like she dropped some blood in John. Yeah. How does that manhunter procreate? How does how did she grow that finger back? Right? Like, you know, what do you become when the manhunter, you know, repairs you? It gives you a piece of themselves. I guess we'll see. Episode 8. That's a question. That's a question. That's a question. But I like which I like, you know, Chambruni's asking the questions, which are opening up the thoughts. And I know a lot of people are hunting for the second manhunter. And I don't think there's another manhunter. I think it's, yeah, I've said that. I don't need to keep peaking on that. Okay. All right. Do you want to read G. Joe's? Or do you want me to read G. Joe's? Either way. Yeah, it could be. All right. So G. Joe on the Patreon said, on the

1:06:20heels of John's comments, they end the pond about representation. So this is a, so we're going to veer off a little bit here. Let me just set this out real quick. We're going to veer off and talk about the social impacts and the social context of the show for a minute. And then after this, we'll take another break and then we'll do comics corner with Connor and we've got some musings on Noah on John as an architect and then on manhunter comic accuracy. And we've got an audio clip from Connor there going into some of the comic history of the manhunter's like the origin of the manhunter's and how the guardians created the manhunter's. Why they created the manhunter's or why the manhunter's went squiffy kind of like how, right? Oh, real quick shout out to, if you're into sci-fi film, definitely go check out Ayesha's podcast every single sci-fi film ever. Speaking of how and speaking of manhunter's programming getting corrupted, she's covering 2001 space

1:07:22obviously right now. She's up to that part of her timeline and she just dropped a double episode, a two hour conversation that she broke into two pods with two excellent guests going into the first part. She's got four, she's going to four episodes about 2001 space Odyssey and its impact, its context and filmmaking history and all that kind of stuff. So if you're into robots, going weird, getting weird and stuff, make sure to go check out Ayesha's podcast real quick. So anyway, Connor will have that clip and we get, he's got some other information about Carol Ferris and Guy Gardner and we can see if we want to cover some that or not. But for Gido's comment here, I just wanted to create the context for it which is about what this show is representing to a whole bunch of people and what, and picking up on what you were putting down the other week about being a young black man watching all these shows but then you know, being able to see different kinds of stories and see people that look like you

1:08:26on screen or not see people. Yeah, let's read, let's read his email and then, right. So Gido says on the heels, John comments at the end of the pod about representation and feeling seen in the media, I am a South Asian man and was a boy in the 80s. I remember once we moved into a new apartment and I was making friends with the kids next door. I remember telling them that I'm Indian, but I'm the quote unquote good kind, not the kind that hollers and hoots and eats people. It's interesting as a child what I thought about Indigenous people and myself for having to feel like the need to clarify that I'm the quote unquote good India. Later as I became a teenager, I overcompensated my masculinity by being overly aggressive and violent towards peers who made fun of me and asked stupid questions like do you own a 7-11 or speaking

1:09:30in to speak in an accent as an Indian. We South Asians were always portrayed as weak and lesser than others in the US oftentimes immasculated, so I felt the need to be overly masculine. I'm glad to say that now in my 50s and understanding what was done to me and the healing has started and is ongoing. I understand now that masculinity can be tender and merciful along with being strong when necessary. I love this show and shows like Wonder Man that do a great job of representing people of the minority that should be seen as heroes and not villains. Hoping that the show gets renewed and more shows like this get made. Thanks for all the work on the plot. Well first I just want to say to Diju thank you for writing this in. Thank you for having the clarity and the sense of purpose but also like you know welcome home I guess I don't know

1:10:36like you've found a bunch of people that you can share something like this with and feel comfortable sharing this with. That says something about the kinds of conversations that we're having in this community. So thank you for taking the time to write this in. Yes it's great email and you know on the heels of what Diju said and what I said at the end of our last part is just that you know I I think we get into media and we're watching shows and movies and oftentimes critics and people who are speaking on them are not will say this is not for me when they when they happen to be white and what's on screen is not white and that's that's the thing that really pisses me off because for those who are not white this is new quite frankly right there was a moment in

1:11:47there are moments in time you know in the 70s you know early to mid 90s where you had films and TV shows you know sometimes in the 80s that had what based and featured non-white characters as the protagonists these these shows were about them. But growing up blockbuster fair the stuff that got toys made they were never featuring people who were not white and I still went and watched Star Wars and aliens and you know all these other things that

1:12:47you know back to the future so many you know movies top gun you know that the characters that I wanted to see and identify with they weren't black but the movies were fun and as a teenager and as a kid and as I got to be an adult it was like okay I don't see myself on the screen but I can still imagine myself in those films in those settings and you can still enjoy the story tell and I can still enjoy it and I did and I think you know we do ourselves at this service when we see something and say that's not for me because you don't see yourself on screen

1:13:48it makes it infuriates me correct when I hear that from people I remember you know people saying black panther wasn't for me I'm talking about people who collect comics right and I was like huh I had to reevaluate relationships that I had you know not close friends but you know people in passing that I would meet at the comic shop or a comic column or whatever I had to reevaluate why am I even speaking to this person why why we like what do we really have in common because if you as a comic book collector could look at me and say black panther really wasn't for me then what the fuck are we doing here what are we doing here you know so it's those moments that I realized that for a large part of our culture they haven't had to have things that don't look

1:14:58like them and imagine themselves in those settings for black folk for brown folks it's always been that way and that's okay that you don't see yourself on screen but you go and sit down in the theater you might see yourself in the story even though the characters don't look like you so yeah being immigrant son a son of immigrants first generation American it's you want to you want to embrace all those things that make America America right and I'm happy to be in a space where my kid can go to the movies and see you know faces that look like his

1:15:59not as adorable they'll get you wrong you know that's answer he gets to see faces that look like him and not look like him he gets to see both both he gets both you only got one I only got one and and again I'm not saying that there weren't movies that featured black people right what I am saying is that in the broader cultural zeitgeist it those films that made impact in those ways were very few and far between right there's a real like black panther was such a cultural phenomenon right because it hadn't never he got caught I didn't see it in the movie theater because I was not a yes we were too young in that movie in the movie theater but you you know every the hill's cop was not the norm and the 80s right and he Murphy was not the norm in the 80s but I know people

1:17:07who still black and white love that movie you know so this I did that because I don't see myself in the character the character doesn't look like me that move so excited I knocked on my mic that I did that I don't see myself on screen the person doesn't look like me it doesn't mean that the movie is not for you right and I wish we could get away from that thinking right and then when we get to see other stories centering on other people who look differently we now get both we get more it's not a taking away it's not a diminishment of other stories it is there's more for everybody right in in all aspects because now I

1:18:16get to learn about or I get to experience like when watching Wonder Man and you know yeah yeah like oh yeah what's his family story like what's it like to be a black actor in Hollywood you know doing all these kind of things I get new insights into something that you know in new ways it's more it didn't it adds to it yes yes it adds and you know again this is a very I'm not speaking for the rest of the world but I am speaking for this American culture that we're in especially in these times that we're in that is important for white folk to actively not do that right right of all the things you can or cannot do could do just don't do that one thing yeah don't do that

1:19:19right you don't don't do that because I'll tell you right now I am worried with the merger that just passed right yeah we will not see as many faces of you know a diverse casting as we've become accustomed to seeing on screen right that worries me greatly and that's a huge conglomerate now it's huge it's huge and what's wild is is that okay well now we're veering too far out here there's yeah let's let's say because there's a reason deregulation has been so active because things were regulated before to keep these companies broken up and so they've undone that now and now they can create these big behemoths that then can actually

1:20:23be reduced the kinds of storytelling that we want to participate in which is a broad spectrum of stories and a broad spectrum of people of characters of gender representation of cultural representation of ethnic representation that are just good stories we just want to watch good stories no matter who is starring in them but we want a bunch of people to star in them we want to see a bunch of stuff speaking of which just as we were talking Alicia just published an episode on the main warhouse feed it's called Forgotten Island 2026 and the first half of it's a Filipino movie that's a it's this is the start of Filipino heritage month oh yes yes that just came out and she's talking to Paulo one of her friends from the Oscar death race podcast and it's a new dream works animated adventure for Don't Forgotten Island based on Filipino culture and

1:21:27mythology so she had a conversation with Paulo and so that is out now as the this will be out I think Saturday morning and so she just released a Friday night and they get into Filipino culture or in mythology and then they talk about the film the second half so the first half of the podcast you can listen in and not get spoiled about the movie if you plan to go see the movie but then I think as to your point John go see that movie or see that movie somehow some way some way shader are formed as an active thing that we can do as a community to expand our exposure to storytelling yeah and to support creators who were creating other things that are outside of a narrow band of of storytelling cool all right anything else on that no no good I could go on and I'm just again

1:22:30again Gigi thank you so much thank you for the time to share a little bit about your personal history and your personal perspective on that and I think this is what one of the elements of what makes the lore homes a cool community this is that we can all come and bring something of ourselves in these different ways and that's why we like to talk about stories because we get to show up in different ways and go oh yeah I had this experience or I had that experience or this is what influences me or these are the kinds of things that I'm into because of yeah of who I am and how I grew up and all that kind of stuff so it is I just I'm just glad that people get these opportunities so yeah it's important to me all right so let's take our final break and then we come back we have a little bit of comics corner with our green lantern liaison officer Connor and we'll be right back and we're back with comics corner with Connor Connor I think is also

1:23:44traveling right now so I feel you Connor and I appreciate you spending some time to to write an email into records some audio to send into us it's not always easy so he starts off with a little bit of general comments it's yet again and wonder it's yet again wonderful writing in the show continues to be an excellent time I'm super excited to see where it goes with these final two episodes so he wrote this in just before seven I wanted to try and be a bit more concise this week with my feedback since episodes itself was pretty cut and dry there are a few things that came up in the show that made me think of comic related things and I figured I'd bring them up this week and thanks again and then he says he sort of wraps up thanks again for all that you've been doing with this I eagerly anticipate the remainder of the show but I have to admit the true highlight for me has been this pod oh bad thank you truly deeply thank you thank you for me and we thank you yeah because you have you been amazing dude like every week solid like pages and pages of feedback we

1:24:53can't read everything that he's sending in he's recording on he's like you know you get this opportunity to shine so Connor it's great really good do you want to kick off with his first comment so episode six Connor writes in Noah for president Noah immediately stood out to me Noah saying that he wants to run for senate lines up perfectly with what was said earlier in the show that being the man hunters that being that the man hunters don't want to be the leader but positions of authority to influence leaders notice how Noah said no to be in president I'm definitely suspicious as well even more so now yeah a lot of track really a lot of track for for Noah the the man hunter offspring there we go and then he also writes in about John as an architect John is an architect in the comics that was his original job later with the Justice League animated show they made him military

1:25:56the modern era made him both I went over this in a prior email I bring this up though because I love that they actually went all in on it with this last episode it's just nice seeing John's intelligence and creativity being included in such strong and beautiful ways totally agree all right we've got a voicemail from him down so I'm gonna get that cured up and here we go I wanted to take a second to talk about the man hunter comic accuracy originally the Guardians of the universe wanted a way to police everything they saw the man hunters of Mars you would know one of the last surviving Martians Martian man hunter John Jones and he comes from that same lineage of entities the man hunters but they guardians they saw how effective these man hunters were for policing Mars and they decided to create their own version of that they became the man hunters that we know today that version that the Guardians created robots built by the Guardians

1:27:03using the Martian mindset is the basis for their coding eventually a rogue guardian known as Krona found an exploit and he wanted to prove that the exploit was a problem and that it should get fixed and so his solution was to exploit it and this caused their programming to go haywire the resulting incident was the massacre of sector 6666 which I'll come to in a second but the way he did it was by taking their catchphrase no man escapes the man hunters and making it their core programming this overroad that Martian man hunter mindset and it removed their ability to see right from wrong resulting in them just seeing any type of free will as evil and so they have to take care of it they have to expunge it they have to destroy it they have to wipe it out whatever the Guardians actually in the comics personally hunted down and destroyed all the man hunters or

1:28:07so they thought some escaped to areas of the known universe and others unknown areas of the universe and they hidden all very kinds of difficult difficult to find places such as the planet biot others stayed transformed into alien forms or human forms in some situations to remain inconspicuous from the Guardian I'm going to pause the recording really quick because I don't want to forget this point I think this was brought up before and I did we have some talk about some feedback about it is that when a man hunter trains forms changes their shape it's not just like cloaking device that makes them look like something else no they physiologically change into the thing that they're mimicking and so in answer to the dung the doer eggs guys yes a headshot from a sniper rifle would kill a man hunter who is masquerading as a human because

1:29:10right they are a human being in that in that moment correct yes okay all right let's pick up from the Guardians which brings me to the silver age James Gunn's personal favorite age to reference back in the silver age of comics man hunters did operate as we're seeing in the show they infiltrated disguise themselves and created cult followings most notably the cult of the man hunter I know really on the nose name but they did this so much that they would take over entire worlds by doing it obviously they would eventually get defeated by green lanterns when green lanterns found out but it's interesting to see that this is the direction that the show's going with them a more classic take a more silver age take similar to the way the Superman movie treated the character of Superman I wonder if we're going to see the robotic form in the final episode or if we're going to have to just leave it up to our imagination I mentioned many times now that I believe Noah to be a manhunter

1:30:12the way that he's acting and so perhaps that's our opportunity or maybe we get a flashback to see Zoe turn into her human form or to see Zoe create Noah more over I mentioned in some prior emails as I mentioned earlier even in this voice recording the massacre of sector 666 which resulted in the creation of the five inversions led by atrociousness since they've brought up a massacre on the show I'm hoping we can see an actual glimpse of the massacre happening in the finale it's interesting to note having now seen episode seven that the fear is prevalent throughout that massacre that was used and so I'm curious if there is some kind of repurposing I'll say of the atrocious origin to create more of a synestro core origin and then the atrocious sort of thing can come later down the line if that

1:31:13makes sense but regardless the manhunters are actually very accurate to the comic right now in the way they're handling them specifically though the silver age of comics and I'm happy to see so much silver age goodness getting embraced by the show nice all right that's uh what do you think about this silver age take no I I think I haven't read a lot of those comics but I know that what sure but I do know that gun is fond of those stories got you so I can actually see that being the case that gun is shaping his DC more towards that kind of storytelling in a way from what slider did with his DC run right what do you think of the interpretation that the

1:32:14excuse me manhunters are tracking with canonical no yes for the manhunters definitely definitely definitely but again this is what I'm saying is that I think that the show is doing this purpose food they're they're not they're downplaying the manhunters physical yes you know overpowering selves right in lieu and replacing that with infiltration you know spy you know things of that nature an intellectual approach as opposed to something physical um and we see that in episode seven when we learned how Anton's people were genocided right right it wasn't like a blast uh yeah it wasn't in

1:33:19Nuke it for more it was something insidious a gas but how long did it take to exactly to set that set that up and get the gas there and set it up in the system so that it affected everybody yeah that takes a lot of planning a lot of patience a lot of you know beguiling yeah to put those pieces into place we got cool yeah I think I think when we go over to Dungeons and Doorag we got to have a conversation with Ron because he's like really stuck on the fact that manhunters are supposed to be like you know uh Iron Man like you know Ultron like so all right a cool thank you Connor for those got some comments about Carol and Geikartner we got some time do you want to you want to get into this one yeah we could talk about um Carol really quickly yeah so Connor starts I want to start

1:34:24by saying Carol is an integral is as integral to Green Lantern as Alan Scott the first Green Lantern how Jordan and John Stewart Carol appeared all the way back in house first comic showcase number 22 Carol was originally house on and off girlfriend love interest she was eventually possessed by entity known as the star star sapphire this entity is fueled by the power of love she becomes a recurring antagonist due to this possession Carol and how frequently break up because she struggles with understanding the life of a superhero and she hates the possession stuff that's true um later on during Jeff Johns era he had the Zamoran an all female offshoot of the guardians create rings to harness the power of love this creates the stars sapphire court or violet lanterns

1:35:24Carol is once again brought into this and forced into this life Carol has been the queen of the Zamorans leader the violet corpse and just your average business leader she is a remarkable woman and continues to come up in Green Lantern adjacent comics um yeah so then Connor writes about guy Gordner yeah no but there's something here I want to do more though we should wear it's a it's right here oh sorry this more than the previous paragraph but you know I don't know personally personally I'm just happy we got an appearance the show would have felt incomplete without her now I know the point guys are complaining about Carol and not having Carol's you know context added or whatever so it's interesting that for some people in the know yeah yeah and it didn't distract it didn't take anything away from me I picked up well

1:36:26enough that she was a prior love interest she's delivering the paper and she was the third person as a funeral right so that worked for me yeah and and I think you know if people didn't know who Carol Ferris was then like you said you couldn't infer that there was a relationship between her and how prior to how funeral but again I get why people would say who is this and why don't we know more about her I can understand that as well right but you don't need to have no one so we'll see if we get more of Carol or not in the in the final season two in season two there we go come on season two come on come on come on come on all right so now um gag dog kind of writes in about gag gardener gag gardener is earth second green lantern guys and asshole let's just stuck there that's what Carter wrote does not my john said I don't know if you

1:37:32agree with that essentially yeah I agree with that all right there you go but no one should ever be questioning why guy is a hero guy might be the most insufferable unbearable ridiculous castle you have ever seen but he has a heart of gold an endless willpower behind it he's right absolutely I still don't like him but yeah right yeah yeah exactly guy was originally created as a gym teacher or athletic director and he was pretty normal created by john broom and gilken he became the backup green lantern for a period of time and occasionally was the primary one when they wanted to spice things up however eventually Steve Engler heart and Joe stepped in got a hold of him in the 80s this changed everything the guy that we know today and we see in this show comes from them changing him guy became significantly more interesting for people to read because he was a parody of the american matto man's stereotype however he was always able to back it up

1:38:38moreover he always does the right thing regardless of consequences and I want to say to that he goes and gets the ring yep right he goes and gets the ring and in superman the movie from last year he goes he's very much they there's a part point in the superman movie where another country is being invaded on blah blah blah blah blah the justice gang right officially is not supposed to operate outside of united states um territories okay guy at the behest of superman right telling them this tragedy is about to happen people are about to get wiped off wiped out he does go and help he does do the right thing right so you see those

1:39:44two instances those two instances with guy on screen where yes he's insufferable yes he's an asshole yes he's a jerk but when presented with doing something good just because it's good he doesn't waver and not doing that thing he goes and does it so that's an important thing that Connor pointed out it's it makes me think about this idea of you need to be fearless but how do we know that fearless is righteous if that's a way that I can say it that there's a a moral center to the person that there's a ethical value equation that people are making ethical and moral choices that are that promote the well-being of others

1:40:53in an equitable fashion so just because you are fearless does that mean your righteous I'm using it in a smaller I don't big are small I don't just but that you have some sort of moral center he does he does underneath no but I'm not saying that he does or doesn't I'm just saying like when the ring chooses somebody who's fearless does what if you're fearless and an asshole and and choose the wrong thing right right how does that work and we still we don't know that the ring chose in this universe if the ring chose guy or if he was chosen that's what others entities right because there's a whole bunch of comic lore stuff around how ring gets chosen right and I'm wondering who does that right that kind of stuff because he doesn't have house ring right and he clearly says that house ring house ring was decommissioned right so

1:41:59he's he gave the gift with the guardians they gave her ring right the ring didn't choose them they gave him a ring hmm interesting so was Leana down there fucking around with some other stuff and keep in track like how do they figure him out yeah right I think you're question question questions season two season two so no news in the stage regardless of consequences this is why people love him all right later what's that no I said season two season two we'll find out a season two season two you bro I think I I started reading again Marco all of this uh when I started reading again then I heard you say all right cool oh no don't I'm not gonna even market this we're just gonna let it go out rock because I can't I'm traveling and it's hard to handle oh yeah so we're just gonna keep rolling y'all can see how some of this sausage is made all right let me let me just let me just let me just let me just let me just let me just let me have this email um later renditions of his backstory have made him a discharge cop from a police

1:43:01family and the modern era treats him at both um after being kicked out of the core he uh out of the cops excuse me he becomes an athletic director guy has some love interest most notably ice um Torah he has shown much more calm he has shown to be much more calm around her most know most notably losing the dickie side of himself and becoming more of a goofball um when guy is written at his best he will be a goofball jerk who complains the entire way but still these but still does what needs to be done a great example is the end of the Superman 2025 movie which I just I just um talked about um so yeah guy is a beloved character in the Green Lantern mythos um excuse me and we have to say that he typically works best as a supporting character with other Green Lanterns

1:44:06or justice league members so I think Connor is saying we will not get a guy gardener stand alone series or movie it won't be guy it won't be guys but we probably will get a John Stuart movie I'm just saying we need to man because air appears a star that no matter what you think about this the season like uh you know you don't need to act to me twice air appears a star oh god god I had to do it I got an audience you want me to play the audio clip I got the audio clip I know you do I'm surprised you didn't play it already where to go where to go where to go thanks me if I'm afraid what I said thanks me if I'm afraid you afraid follow I need to have like a greatest clips real like and our children are best

1:45:13from us the dragon some of those other things David's favorite clips from the cool all right well I think that's uh all the feedback we got us again to everyone for writing in thank you for uh sharing your thoughts and ideas with us and apologies if I didn't get everybody's uh things there was like a ton of stuff uh on the both on the discord and the patreon that I get into I want to eat the mainline stuff and uh email is the best way comics versus at the lorehounds.com links are always in the show notes for for those kinds of things uh John what what else is going on with you you guys got vision question clashes vision question is about to start on the 14th where recorded in 15 how to run my man you went from house to dragon to land turns to vision quest vision quest yeah yeah so at least and I were recording at least and I will record on the 15th um everything stays normal that's what we'll

1:46:17do and yeah it's gonna be um it's gonna be a wild ride because this last trailer is the one that got me super excited for the show um so we'll see what they do with it um we've just talked about his god is doing a one shot about that so we're gonna about that movie which is on my top 10 viewings of the year regardless of medium tv or big screen um so yeah we got some things coming up so we froze a little bit I'm probably not gonna edit this out because I just gotta get this thing cooked what was the movie that was your top 10 was that his god is his god is yeah yeah we were talking about doing mm-hmm so that will happen soon soon our wrath of it later and um yeah so we got things cooking up sweet all right uh we and then we're gonna be on uh we gotta figure out tensions and two rags compressations yes and then we got rings of power uh starting up uh as well

1:47:21that's coming up and uh as as I plugged earlier go check out all the affiliates join us on the discord server we'd love to have there and if it works for y'all then feel free to subscribe and if you wanted to subscribe for a minute and bounce after a little bit totally fine we don't think twice about people coming and going from subscriptions because we get it like times are crazy right now and uh you gotta do it what what works for you for for your situation but if it does work for you then it does mean a lot to us to have your financial contributions to keep in the network and going uh i'm not gonna do the shout out to all of the uh people's but to the community volunteers the discord server boosters the lore masters thank you all so very much quick programming note because I am traveling uh I'll be on the west coast when the episode drops I'll be coming back in the middle of the week and so john and i work we got to figure out we may be slightly delayed for our actual

1:48:21episode eight recording uh if you're on the discord i'll try to post a message to let folks know what to put that and then uh a week after that we should be planning a a wrap-up pod with elisha so it'll be you me and elisha we'll get the we'll get the gang back together uh that's good uh uh podcast on that brazil thanks no man but you're right man everybody peace out thank you for listening to the lore hounds please send any questions or feedback to lore hounds at the lorehounds.com or dc you at the lorehounds.com and check out our super cast and patreon feeds for ad free access and bonus episodes look for all those links including links to all the other podcasts on our network and the link tree and the show notes any opinion stated or ours personally and do not reflect the opinion of or belong to any employers or other entities