Brighton 3-0 Arsenal: Back to Arteta’s lab

0:00Hi, I'm Max Rush in the host of The Guardian Football Weekly, alongside me Barry Glenn Denning my co-host, hey Barry. Hello! Now, although every American found us during the World Cup, for the two that didn't, what can they expect? Found us and fell in love with us, Max. They can expect three episodes each week of occasionally insightful analysis, covering the Premier League, Champions League and beyond. Football Weekly is back. Watch on YouTube or listen wherever you get your podcasts. The products you count on to get the job done right. Get a free two pack of DeWalt 20 Volt Max XR 8 Amp Hour Batteries when you buy a Selex DeWalt 20 Volt Max Power Tool. Plus, save up to 35% on select major appliances. The right products, the right deals, ready when you need them. Our best lineup is here at Loads. Valetue 925, while supplies last. Selection varies by location. This message is brought to you by today's sponsor, Walden University. Set a course for change.

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2:05500 orders a month was manageable. 5000 is madness. Embrace intelligent order fulfillment with shipstation. The only platform combining order management, warehouse workflows, inventory, returns and analytics in one place. It used to take five separate tools shipstation does in one. Automate fulfillment and rate shopping to ship up to 15 times more with up to 90% savings. Go to shipstation.com and use code audio to try shipstation free for 60 days. The thing about Arsenal is that we might be a bit more visible than we thought. I'm Jim Campbell. I'm Julie Dutch. Thank you to our premium. The thing about Arsenal club members who are joining us live on YouTube for this match reaction. If you are not watching live, click the link in the show notes or hit that join button on YouTube to become a member of the thing about Arsenal club.

3:06And remember, you can join on a free trial. We're doing a special Q&A next week for our members too. So you don't want to miss that, especially after that performance because Johnny, you and I got to get straight into this now bright and the re Arsenal. Neil, not a school line. I had as a sort of potential outcome in my mind at all. I knew right when we'd give us a tough game. I didn't expect it to be quite such a comprehensive beating and we were sort of dancing around the possibility of Arsenal pulling off another invincible season on the show any other day. And we didn't actually use the word. We didn't say it. We could have been thinking about anything. We could have been talking about anything. But I do feel responsible. How about you? I do feel I was reluctant. I looked at Shane. I was like, shave, don't say it. Don't say it. I can't really do. I can't really do. You have to go in. Yeah, you have to go and check. We did it. I look, it's this is and we were talking about 19 0 3 and I four when we last had this brilliant start to the season and we did everything we possibly could to jinx this afternoon.

4:08We did. We really did. We really did. And I started to think this before the game. I was in chatting away with all the Arsenal fans and all the other rival fans that I speak to regularly and I was like, look, we could we could slip up today or as it could be a, you know, it could be a banana skin and everyone was like, stop doing this fake cumility, John, you know, you're going to win. You know, you're going to win. I was like, boy, it's nothing fake about it. They're a really good team. And I said on Friday, I've been saying for a while, Jim, they have really good and they're in form. Yeah. I didn't think they were that good though, Jim mate. No, I didn't. I thought they'd give us a tough game and we would edge it or possibly it would be a draw. I thought, you know, we would try and take a sort of grind the approach to it, which we didn't, which is very interesting. Perhaps that's a sign that we're kind of going to try and move away from that style a little bit. Perhaps it was just that bright and we're that much better than us. And they really were better on the day in every single department. The physicality was better. They were quicker. Their passing was better. They won the second balls.

5:09Their off the ball movement was great. Their press was really good. They were more intense. They were more creative. The way they defended set pieces was better than us. Absolutely. All of it. Now, you called them as a sort of outside chance for a Champions League place recently and you're not the only person to say that. And obviously it's early days, but based on that performance, it was really stunning stuff from them. But what's frustrating to me is how we had no answer to that. For me, the worst element of this situation is that nothing changed after half time. Yeah. And that was an act kind of is the issue. I mean, I thought after about 10 minutes, I was like, oh, we're in a washing, we're not in a tumble dryer area. We are getting absolutely ragged about and thrown about and the players weren't ready for it. The first thing I thought was, oh, hurts, there's really done our tech area. But at some point after about 15 to 20 minutes, I can't remember we were just talking about it before we came on. We did gain some sort of control. Havards was, I thought Havards was quite good after 15 minutes and he was very involved

6:11and he was helping us retain a bit of possession and get the ball, keep the ball up, filled a bit more. But even then, it was only fleeting moments of control, the rest of the game, they were so good like you just said to him, they really were. And the players seemed surprised and shell shocked from minute one, if I'm honest. Even David Ryer, who normally is the safest pair of hands, makes the best decisions. He was playing crazy passes into midfield and turning over the ball himself. And the same problems today, it was throughout the team, it was like, we just weren't prepared for that at all. I think you've done really well to find a positive out of that, Johnny. We'll sort of come onto that as an idea a bit later. Yeah, I think you're right. Perhaps it's because, you know, Consuri's still getting used to being in that defense, Timbers back from a long period out of the team. Perhaps those kind of that understanding wasn't quite there as it is again. I'm sort of kind of grasping it, straws to sort of explain that. My suspicion is really that just, baby, no hurts to look at his tactics, absolutely spot on.

7:11And he understood how to sort of rattle us and get to us early. And did a really good job of that because they were under the crush, that we were under the coach straight away. Brighton started really strongly. Ray was forcing to a big early save from Carol Ampus, costaless, who had very, very good game. Pascal Gross gets the opener with a strike from outside the box. Now, this happened twice. He was given plenty of time to set himself and go for goal. And I think another frustration for me is that in both of those situations, I think the first one was Callifurian and Gabrielle, sorry, and the second one was Gabrielle and Esri Conzer. In that situation, both of them are backing off and given the guy's space, he struck it from distance and scored. Now, James Alcott did a video for the Premier League this week explaining how that actually asked them were kind of happy to do that sometimes, to sit off a little bit, get back into the box, get bodies in there so that you kind of nullify the effects of that shot from distance when it comes in. So I'm partially holding James responsible for this sort of grassing on us. But also, I think it's actually just a terrible execution of this idea.

8:13And you've got two defenders there. One of them in that situation should be stepping out, should be making that shot impossible. And Gabrielle's there both times. He's really the senior guy in the team. I think he should be taking responsibility for that there. And it's really frustrating for it to happen twice. Oh, yeah, 100%. Yeah, I think there's this whole thing about allowing shots that have such low XG, just so you can deal with the more, I guess, the greater problem, like you said, if it get in the box. But if you defend like that, you don't defend the situations. If you defend, if you're not aware or you don't react quickly enough to the real problem in the game, then these things can happen because I can be wrong. Both of those shots were, you know, nine times out of 10, they don't go in or a riot looks after them. But on, you know, on a day like today or that one time out of 10, they can go in and then you're 2-0 down and we have no answers. So you've got to deal with it. If they're taking shots from, especially after the first one goes in, if that's happened once, then you start closing down those shots surely.

9:14If you get punched in the nose, you're going to sort of put your hands up and protect yourself surely at some stage. And I don't think we just didn't react. And I thought that was the big problem today is that we weren't prepared. And then there was no sort of in-game management where the player switched on and started to react and do things that he needed to do to mitigate against more situations happening. Yeah. We actually won the game on XG. So that's something you'll never see in that, etc. And also it's just, it does show you that those models have quite bad flaws in them. I think it's kind of rare that a team controls a midfield against us, right? Or generally controls the game. We're very good at wrestling that control back if we do lose it for periods. Brighton just never did that today. They never kind of let up and never relented. And we really had no answer to it. And that's probably the most frustrating thing about it for me. Now the third, again, came way too easily. It was Kima Andres nodded home from a Pascal Gross, cool and Pascal Gross, really

10:17and again as we expected the other day. And again, I thought this was kind of weak really. Declan Rice and David Ray are sort of got in each other's way a little bit. It reminds me of the bad old days of Arsenal defending corners. And I think it was just yet another example of this being a truly terrible day at the office. Yeah, exactly that. When I can't remember the last time, we struggled defending set pieces, but today everything just seemed like panic stations. And I think that it sort of, it's a sort of a multiplier if it happened for acting again where things just got compounded and got worse and how we dealt with them. I mean, I've got us talking about that goal. Yeah, that was, you know, that was a, that was a killer. That was a third goal. But before that, something that was going on the derailleur and I'm not going to get spoken about a lot was how I thought how bad Bruno G was today. I think Bruno G was a lot of the, yeah, wasn't a lot, a lot of the reasons why we didn't control that midfield was because he vacated space a lot of the time. When he should have been there and right, didn't have that ball to play into him.

11:17And then when he did have the ball, he turned it over a lot. So it was, you can have an off day, but you don't expect all your players. I can't really look at one of the players in one of our players today. I think, are you at the Nourite game, which is strange. And I can't remember the last time we could say that about an Arsenal team. Absolutely. And prior to the game, we were looking at the lineup and we've got the midfield three that we wanted of Bruno Gameris, Declan Rice and Martin Odegaard. And obviously, they're going to need some time to gel. Perhaps that was a bit of an explanation as to why Bruno Gameris didn't look at his best today. Perhaps that's a little bit too kind. And Julian Timber comes back and we're kind of thinking that other than William Celeba, that is probably the strongest team that we could put out. And yet it's been found really, really sorely lacking, like really quite badly wanting. And I think we're going to be in a situation now where we go into a very long international break. It's just three weeks, four games, loads of stuff. And that it's not ideal. You want to go into the break on a high.

12:18You want to go into the break with 100% record. That's what we were hoping for. There's a good chance it will be top of the league coming the end of this weekend. And I start to sort of worry about that a little bit. But is it possible that we're just overthinking that, you know, an international break brings a natural reset anyway. Part of it is frustrated that they can't just get straight back onto the training ground and try to fix this sort of thing. But I don't know. Is it as bad as it feels like it is Johnny? At this moment in time, it definitely does feel that way. It's still sinking in. I don't think he's even hit me yet that we've gone on a free-knot because it's just such a foreign sort of scenario for us in the part in recent history. But I was thinking before the game, when we had all that talk on Friday about this could be our best start since for 120 odd years. And now it's thinking, well, Michele would hate, I'm trying to find a positive bit, Michele would hate to kill the momentum of the greatest start in our history. I wanted the greatest start in our history with a free week break.

13:20So maybe Michele's psychopathic mind, this is maybe the thing he needed. Do you think he can actually think, you know what, there's still work to do. I'm a role my sleeves up. Right, who's left there? Who's not going to cry? Are you only going for two games? I'm going to work with you for the next three weeks and we're going to have to sort it out. But I think there is things to sort out. In all seriousness, there is something that I think the person who has picked up on. I think there was elements of it in the winner game as well because we haven't been as good. We haven't been good away from home. We've got we've got we've grand out results, but we've not been anywhere near as good away. I don't think in terms of our performances as we've been at home. And I think going into it, I don't know if we're going to cover it in, we can cover it now. The lack of pace going the other way in our front free, it was very evident today. That means teams can press us higher. You can actually take those risks against Arsenal because you're not fearful of our transitions, not as much as we are of Brighton. That's something we're going to have to work on because we don't really have much. I've been in Mad Work, we don't have much pace in the squad.

14:22How do we resolve this issue for games like today? I suppose the way is to play out of that press or to just be so difficult to press that you grind those teams down and you stop it being an issue. At present, it is an issue, isn't it? There was a moment in First Star half where Saka probably is the best moment of the game, actually put a ball through to Crystal Solis. I think it was a Vukovic who's clearly a real talent. I've got an absolute steal there, just close it down. Not just with the pace of his legs, but with the pace of his thought as well. He would just, I think Solis could maybe have wriggled away there, but that was mocked up quite quickly. And you're right, it's an issue that we've seen recurring. It's quite frustrating. I think you're right to say it's difficult to pick out anyone that put in a really good performance. One moment that was particularly frustrating for me in the second half was that missed opportunity for him, Kai Haberts. Victor Yoko res with his moment of the season so far, we've all been calling out for something from him. He puts in a really great, lofted pass, absolutely perfectly weighted.

15:26And Haberts just can't quite pull the trigger on it. It's that old criticism of Haberts, isn't it? That he's not quite clinical enough in those moments. And you know, we're three-neil down at that point. It ultimately doesn't matter that much, but it was a day where sort of pretty much everything that can frustrate you about your football team was really, really there in evidence. Odd moment at the end of a deck limerice kicked out of Malik Yalkou, I've seen some people saying it could have been a red. That's never, never, never read for me. It's pretty impressive. It's not violent conduct or anything like that. It's very, very petty, but I've seen a little bit of that from him lately, which is maybe something they want to look at as well. Hi, I'm Max Rush in the host of The Guardian Football Weekly, alongside me Barry Glenn Denning my co-host, hey Barry. Hello. Now, although every American found us during the World Cup, for the two that didn't, what can they expect? Found us and fell in love with us, Max. They can expect three episodes each week of occasionally insightful analysis, covering

16:29the Premier League, Champions League and beyond. The football weekly is back. Watch on YouTube or listen wherever you get your podcasts. During Lowes Pro Savings Days, my Lowes Pro rewards members can save up to 20% when they buy more job-site materials. Save 20% when you buy 30 or more select bats and rolls of fiberglass insulation. 24 more cartons or pales of joint compound tape and bead. Or when you spend $200 or more on free and painting and job site essentials, members give more. It Lowes. I'm Jake Stauk, co-founder and CEO of Serval. We built Serval to automate the IT work that slows companies down. Onboarding, password resets, access to applications, my laptop stopped working, while employees wait for help their real work is put on hold. IT desperately wants to automate this work, and that's why they need Serval. You just tell Serval what you want to automate in plain English, and it's built.

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18:31So you can build better habits to not just lose weight, but keep it off. Noom. Lose for keeps. Get started at noom.com. Not all customers will clinically qualify for medications. Individual results may vary. Hello, I'm Monica Reinagle, host of the Nutrition Diva podcast. Summer is here and with it, the hot and sticky weather. A morning working in the garden, or maybe on the golf course, can leave you more depleted than you realize, and plain water isn't always the most efficient way to restore the balance. That's where liquid IV comes in. Its science-backed formula is clinically proven to hydrate faster than water alone. Whether you're exercising, playing outside, or simply surviving a summer heatwave, it's an easy way to stay hydrated. Shop now at liquidiv.com. Liquid IV. It's a combination that goes wherever life takes you. Some reaction from our discord here. Josh UR said, deserve every single second of that. Horrific performance.

19:31Yeah, it is. Honestly, Josh, we are sat here trying to find the positives, and it is without being quite abstract about it. I suppose it's positive that I'm not watching it anymore, and now I can just get on with my life. It's difficult to pull them out, isn't it? John and Jay says absolutely embarrassing performance. We haven't even got off the bus. Which sort of, again, feels right, doesn't it? Because as you said, Johnny, for Minute One, we've really were sort of... Never in it. Second best with a physical battle. Never in it. I mean, the thing is, we have to give, and I hate to do it because Herzler, he will be very, very happy tonight because he don't like us at all. He's made that clear, and he had to go at us for our style of play. So I really wanted to make a statement because he, yeah, you went in about when he beat when we beat him last year. So it was a statement, win from him. And I've been hearing over the last few days about the freebies about, you know, this being the real defining moments of Premier League is coming up against the ballmuffs, Brentford's and the Brightons.

20:32They are all free, really good teams. Like, I'll be someone who refer to them as the Bermuda Triangle, but they're well coached, they're well-dread, they've got a lot of, they play a high intensity, and they've got one thing I've realised today is that they've got ballers all over the pitch. Literally, every single person is comfortable in possession, and that is the one thing today, we didn't at any point look comfortable in possession, and you know, you were saying about us, you know, playing over the press or being able to play through it. Sometimes if you're harried, like, the way we were, you know, we were hustled today, I don't, if you don't get into it again, that worries me whether, you know, I'm not, and I'm sure it will come back, but when you have days like today, yeah, it's really, you can't rely on playing for the press. Sometimes you need out balls, and you need, you know, you need to somehow get out the pitch or you need a target, man, that you can lump it up to and get yourself out the pitch to get away from it. Sometimes you can't play for it because they are so good and they were so energetic as well. Yeah, I think that the three B's, that's a good way of putting it. I can imagine leads getting into that, but maybe that's just because I think bleeds

21:33you knited would really suit them. And we've got them next gym. Yeah, we do. They're tricky. They're looking like one of those teams. I know it's early days, but again, we've got a little bit of time to go away and think about it every waking second for three weeks. So hopefully the players will respond to that because actually sometimes a performance could be so bad, there is no choice but to buck your ideas up and sort of check yourself a little bit. And I think this has to be one of those. I mean, it's a long time since we lost three now. What we mentioned earlier didn't we? When was it? It was 2023. Was it? Right in themselves a long, long time ago. I've never remembered that game, Jim. I'm trying to think to that that was a way. Do you know it was it was out the Emirates and I'll be honest, Johnny, in three years time, I was there. I was there. I was there. Who said I do remember it was a similar sort of thing here towards the end of the season. I was there a horrible game. That is actually work to be fair. That was worse and why there's a positive that three-year felt worse today because we threw away the title of that game. I was there.

22:33Yeah. Yeah. I don't remember any sort of clarity because it would have been a horrible, horrible experience. That is another one of the sort of worries if we're going to open up my box of anxieties too much, which I'm not going to be this day for that. I think like these sort of performances, we have seen them when the pressure is starting to mount and the players are tired and you know, they've been playing loads of games and they're all knackered and there's injuries and there's players, you know, having to play every minute because there's no one else to come in and then the standards might drop a little bit because of that. But it's a bit of a concern to me that this has happened this early. And I think an inevitable narrative that we will see now come out of this will be comparisons to Liverpool and the season they had last season now. Obviously the circumstances are really different. They spent a lot of money on players that changed the way the team played quite a lot. We spent a lot of money on players who were really supposed to complement the way we play and up to now we've seen that that has been the case. But the point and the reason people will make this comparison is because it's always said

23:36isn't it? Winning a title is one thing but retaining it is much, much harder. And we have to look at this and this has to be an idea within the club. This has to be a situation where it's like never again when we are not ever performance like this where we're outfort. Be it home or away, be it, you know, in autumn or deepest winter, it cannot be allowed to happen again. And then we have to refer back to the fog in a standard. Yeah, 100% and I'm not being funny. You would never say that about an RTA team that in recent years that they weren't prepared or they weren't up for it or they weren't tactically aware enough. But that was all that all of those criticisms could be true today. And that's why I find it such a shock. And I wonder I hope it doesn't I mean, I don't want to talk to all the listeners. This isn't panic stations. We ain't we're not that poor. It's like, you know, we've been on a nine game winning streak. We know they don't know. Yeah, exactly. We're not going to be doing all of that. But there is serious questions and serious things that need to be resolved today and to

24:40make sure that this is just a one off. People can have bad days. This was a really, really bad day. Teams kind of have bad days. Great teams have bad days. Free New Always worrying. But you know, how could we have the one thing we have I think over Liverpool is that firstly we have an unbelievable manager, but we are a lot more structurally sound. And I just hope that we can that will be able to rely on that for Rocky moments because I think teams also would have seen something would have seen a little bit of a, um, Tinks in, Tinks in the army today and say, oh, they're not like that. So let's try that. So we just need to be a little bit more aware and it's a bit of a wake up call because, you know, people have been talking about us, you know, winning this lead by February. That is not going to happen. No, he's a, even if I've been drunk and said it myself before, it's not going to happen. Guys, yeah, it's going to be hard. We're going to have to roll our sleeves up. Maybe it's better. We've, we had this day now, rather than in the midst of, you know, post Christmas in January or something when it really could erupt us. It's early. We can fix it. Yeah. I hate being held to things other people have said about my team.

25:42It's a really, really, really, really, really, really, yeah. Um, yeah, I think I just hope they're angry about this. You know, they'll be fuming with themselves, right? Yeah. I'm sure they will. We are, our tetra will be going back to his, his football lab. Um, I'm sure and whoever's not going to the, um, internationals at the moment is going to have a horrible, horrible three weeks of training. I would imagine taking on all kinds of information and whatnot. Um, what did you think of the subs? Uh, it's interesting to me that Martin Supermandy came on, uh, and, and slightly into right back again. Um, I understand that that's out of necessity. But yeah, I'd be a little frustrated if I was here, I think, right now. Maybe it's early to say that. Maybe I frustrated his warm son. No, I think there was, there was some of that when he was, um, when he started there on Wednesday and it's like people from outside the club I spoke to were like, we're a little bit like, well, bloody, Martin Supermandy, this is a guy who's coming to show up. You midfield season guy and I was playing right. But, and then that is effectively getting garbage minutes because, you know, we need to, we can't play timber for the full night. That's the only reason why it's coming.

26:42He's got to come on there. I found the diamond substitution. I didn't get that. Yeah. But, uh, I really didn't understand that because you can't, what can a 16 year old come on and do then? What is he going to learn at that point? It felt like a roller dice to me. Well, yeah, I just thought, well, he's not, surely he's not expecting Max Diamond to get us back from free nil. We've eight minutes left to work whenever he came on. I just, I found that one a little bit strange. Um, yeah, I just keep putting it down to it today. I think Michael was, is as shocked as we are if I'm honest. Yes. Yeah, maybe that's why he did. Sorry, he did actually say before the game, he mentioned about exactly all the things which Brighton did today. He mentioned how dangerous they were and why they were so dangerous. So you'd think he was, would it be more tactically prepared, but on the sidelines, he looked like he was, yeah, he'd had one today. Yeah. Yeah. Um, frustrating for a lot of, a lot of reasons. Um, one positive, um, when the dog traveled to the game and was apparently seen in the

27:44press room, perhaps that motivated Brighton a little bit. I know that actually Brighton is a city that loves dogs. But that is maybe taking it a little bit too far. It's a piss taking it, bringing it back. Is that his first away game, Jim? I don't know, but, um, I think I expect that. Yeah, I'll expect everyone to have a lot of fun with that then. Of course, yeah. That's good. No, no, I said the one positive in the first half, the five, you know, the new five second throwing rule, it went in our favor for once. Yes. And got done for one. There you go. Yeah. That was a massive positive for the first half. Like they got done and we didn't for a new stupid rule. Yeah, I mean, that, you're right. We said we'd try and find the positives. That was good. I enjoyed it a lot. Ultimately, it meant absolutely nothing, didn't it? That was good. Well, did I take out of the game? Obviously I watched the game perfectly legally. I traveled to another country to do that. I know you did as well. So I was, I'm sorry, though, weirdly, they had American Adverson. Uh, and I always quite enjoy that. Quite enjoy seeing Adverson from another country.

28:46But I've literally been watching it for two minutes and Kevin Hart pops up. It's like, how much is enough Kevin? So I was like, say it everywhere. He's everywhere. I was I watched a lot of YouTube golf. He's just started a new YouTube golf channel. And he's massive already. Yeah, he's, he's not very good either. And he's, and he's now massive in YouTube golf. One video and just as you can imagine a user in saying, like, and he is now. So now I've got a fight between him and Rick Shields and, and, and go fly from Kevin Hart as well. He's everywhere. Maybe we try and get him. Yeah. Um, yeah, I don't think you'd say no to something anything. Can I say it's like he's been cursed to be really successful, but you can never say no to anything. Maybe that's a situation here. I don't know where he finds the time. I think there's quite small. I think there's a lot of him. I think there's a lot of, I mean, there's many Kevin Hart's running around. Hmm. Which, yeah, does feel like the plot to sort of forthcoming Kevin Hart. Maybe, isn't it? Right. It's special. Oh, yeah. I'm with our lives not going then. No, we should. Oh, no, I just actually asked everyone. I've had 15 messages saying you're getting picked by the C goals or variations of that.

29:52Can we get more creative if you're going to text me and really kill me? Honestly, my WhatsApp is full of the same sentence. Really? I'm going to, I'm going to have a little bit of talk from foot. What I think Jim. I'm going to go on. Lovely. All right. Well, thank you for joining us on the thing about Arsenal. A special thanks to club members who joined us live on YouTube. Join us on Monday for the weekend show. We're also recording a special Q&A episode of members of the thing about Arsenal club. So hit the link in the show notes to get that or hit the join button on YouTube. And of course, you can get in touch with the pod at thing about Arsenal on Instagram and at about Arsenal pod on X. See you later. See you later. The thing about Arsenal is a stack production and part of the A cast creator network.

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