What do you think about the teachers' strike?

0:00Lunchtime Live with Andrea Gilligan on News Talk. This work to rule by teachers amid the ongoing public sector pay dispute, take a listen to John Boyle, the INTO General Secretary. He spoke to Jonathan about this earlier this morning. There's three things not going to be happening in October and possibly in November if this dispute continues. We won't be doing the crow pack hours that were introduced in the austerity period, so there's 36 of those. We won't be doing the parent teacher meetings outside school hours or the staff meetings. So there are additional hours the teachers have been giving for free and in our sector it's been reported that the biggest impact is probably going to be because the teachers won't be out parading the playgrounds before the school bell goes. And that was John Boyle speaking here in News Talk breakfast earlier on this morning, but the primary school teachers who are members of the INTO have begun that work to rule today over the ongoing public sector pay dispute and they are the country's largest teachers

1:04trade union. They represent about 48,000 teaching members. We want to know though how you feel about this. Are you impacted by this work to rule? The potential further strike action next week as well. 08 7 1400 106 is the WhatsApp number. Dara's with me on the line today. You're a parent. You've been listening to Claire and Jonathan this morning talking to the various different teacher trade unions, but why they're doing this. How are you affected today? Hi, Andrew. Yeah. Yeah. I'm affected like most parents. My my my lad is six and he's in senior infants now and he has a few difficulties and that parent teaching teacher meetings are very, very important for us to ensure that we're both aligned with what he's doing in school and what he's doing at home. I know this I believe we've been informed that there's potential strike on the 14th I think it is and I've already had to yeah, I've already scheduled that in.

2:05I work for myself. Right. So I've had to I have to cancel all of my clients just to be on the off just to be on the off chance. I look out for him and but you know, I don't like that's a small inconvenience for me. You know, this is an ongoing thing that I think it's just been going on for years and years and I think our public sector workers get just this really hard deal and it's not just teachers. It's our hospitals, our emergency services, but now it's you know and I did this work through is affecting them as well and local authorities as well. And now it's affecting our schools and we're known across the world of having a fantastic education system and we have fantastic graduates from our from our education sector. But you know, a piece that just keeps going back to me all the time and I don't know if you know I'm a customer experience consultant and I work with both private and public sector and Richard Brownson said this best, look after your staff and they look after your customers

3:06and we want to ensure that our children continue to get the highest level of education in Ireland. We have to look after the teachers and it is such a thankless job with the teachers and they're wonderful. A quick example for you as I said, my son has a couple of difficulties and this story kind of broke my heart. And while he was in his Eckee years, he had a wonderful teacher who practically he sucked up all of our time and he absolutely loved her, he did some fantastic and everything she did really brought him on so much over those couple of years. But about a year after he and he just finished junior infants, we were at the swimming pool and we bumped into her and I saw her coming and I thought he'd be so excited when he saw her because he loved her so much but he totally forgotten who she was. Just a year have gone by and it's such a, like that's a long time in his short life. He totally blanked her. He had no idea who she was.

4:07She may have been a stranger and never seen her before and these are the people that were, these are the people our government are arguing with about pay. These guys need to be looked after. It's just, you know, and I don't know the specifics of how much they get paid but these are the people that need to be looked at. People who teach our children, the people who keep us safe, the people who save our lives in house rules. This is something that our tax money should be going on. This is what we need to, we need to, you know, we need to support them so, Darabai, you know, you do and the fact that we're talking, and I know today you talked about, you know, there's the impact for parents around just the drop off and the collection, you know, those that additional time period, like the classroom teaching is still going ahead as paranormal. It's the time beforehand and the time after and there was mention too as you said of, of the likes of parent teachers and meetings and I heard the secondary school teachers on about, you know, communications between emails and phone calls and all of this kind of stuff. So the kids are still being taught today. There's no impact on that front.

5:09But the idea of ramping this up next week, from what you're saying, sounds like you support that. But the thing about Andrea and they are still being taught, but they are being taught by a lesser motivated person because as they're constantly having this fight in the background, they are still trying to do their job at the best of the best of time. But as humans, the more demotivated we get, the more we get upset with our employers, the less we don't mean it and these are real conscientious people and I know that they certainly wouldn't think that we will do lesser teaching. If that's that's good grammar, but it is going to affect them and it's something that we don't need affecting people when they're doing a really critical service for us. That's the way I think. No, I think it's a fair point and I think there's probably a lot of people, Dara, who would agree with you today and that's why we want to talk to parents about this about whether or not you support this work to rule 087 1400 106 is the WhatsApp number.

6:14This text or though, they don't seem to agree. They say just on the parents' feedback on the teacher's action, I really genuinely admire teachers' work, but I don't support this action today. I feel the teachers have come across entitled and in denial to other industries and sectors out there just hearing that they're annoyed that they didn't get a pay rise to meet inflation realistically. Who did get a pay rise to meet inflation? My company has done a lot of pay increases as there is a pay freeze globally. Sorry, they haven't done a lot of pay increases because of the pay freeze globally and I feel that the teachers don't recognize the huge advantage of having 14 to 18 weeks off. Says this texture. Another listener's got to touch to say fair play to Dara for speaking out and support a teacher's today. I think it's a great tick and I fully agree with them. Owen Dolan, who's the principal of the mother of divine grace national school in Fingeless in Dublin is joining us here at Dara on the line as well. And what was the mood like after school gates this morning? Well our school gates actually open at the school start time so it's supposed it didn't

7:16have the same knock on effect as other schools. Other schools, yeah. Just as our entry point is it's right beside the school gates but it's supposed nobody likes this situation and I suppose you want to come in and do our jobs which we are doing as your previous car reference hit that you know the children still being toppled. I do think and our reference is you know there's an awful lot of cool wheel that goes on within school and 15 minutes area in the morning and people have said they're watched by that because they're dropping the children to school and then they're going off to work. And what I find amazing is the the minutes of education by having heard from her and you know nobody's heard from her. You know this was a predictable thing that was to see coming down the line and one of the big struggles that all schools will tell you is around recruitment because it is more chartered for recruit teachers into skills now because it's not a viable option for two young teachers who are together are trying to buy a house in Dublin.

8:18It's not a viable job anymore for that. So we do think it's not not a viable job. It's not a viable it's very hard for two teachers now who are you know a teacher in a nurse to buy a house in Dublin and that's very hard to rent in Dublin. It's economically it's becoming more charter and I'm not saying it's impossible but it is harder and it skills are finding that harder and harder to recruit teachers into skills because they're choosing under industries because they have what are options. And you qualified primary school teacher starts an agro salary of about 45,000. Yeah but what I'm saying is when you compare that to other options in private industries you know and the thing about teaching is your pay scale you know will go up and it goes up as you go along and teach them but it goes up there's much less kind of promotional opportunities you can become a system principal too which is about four tells them are a year

9:22but that's after a number of years but you know we're seeing it on the ground it is much harder to recruit teachers into the industry but like the unions are looking at other other areas society which have protested recently or saying well if they're able to get allow this white country get like all they're looking for is to meet the inflation. Is that is that really kind of on what what a lot of this is is a bias like I accept that previous discussions and negotiations you know hadn't commenced before the end of the last pay deal but but is a lot of this kind of looking at what happened in April and May of this year and the streets been shut by you know various different sectors that were obviously very you know very and rightly so in some cases you know agitated and and aggrieved by the impact on their industries but is that what this is kind of about today that like you know maybe the unions don't feel they're they're getting what they want and this other people take to the streets. I know represent the unions but I'm sure they looked at and said you know well you know we're

10:29doing what we're being asked to and I think what it's being shown in in these worked real days that teachers do an awful lot else outside of they do there's no way to do this and open the skills there really parent teacher means and like for me it would be an absolute disaster if we come to a point next week where the skill causes of the only. Tell me about that own because I just want to bring in some of the other callers in a quick moment but but this you know this sort of increased action next Wednesday the 14th of October what exactly will that look like for parents tuned in today. Well their children won't be gone to school so and the staff will be here and present and will be taking industrial action but you know the children won't be gone to school which for me and my skill will be an absolute disaster because it's children this now in a day school which is so important and we talk so much about attendance so like I just want to see both sides now at this point you know make sure that that doesn't happen because for me it will be

11:30a huge disaster because we are at the point a really crucial point in the skill year at the moment where we've got through September we're setting in the children in they're just getting used for new routines and we don't want to have to have an unnecessary break in that routine it will be my personal thing I want to see the children come to school every day when they're fit and ready to and I think that will be a disaster for both sides at the happens next week. Okay 100% this behind the teacher says this texture all of that extra work and time they give is free and it is taken for granted says this listener. Another texture has gotten touched to tell me I'm not a teacher nor do I have any connection with teaching I'm just a parent however I have to support the teachers they've been expected to adapt to so many changes supporting integration in the classroom but they have no support in the classroom they still have to cover the curriculum and now deal with the many many difficulties and another listener for the moment says teachers four reasons to be one June, July, August and the pension and the good will

12:30is present in every single profession stay with me on for a moment I just want to bring it in Emer today Emer good afternoon. Good afternoon and how are you? Not too bad at all how do you feel about say this work to rule today Emer? Okay well I support workers and rights to be able to you know take industrial action I've been member of you in all my work and life which is nearly 40 years I think it's it's it's awful when it gets to that stage why do you have to get to that stage why hasn't the department why hasn't the minister been in proper negotiations like I imagine the teachers unions didn't just sort of you know throw their toys out go out here we're just going as like you know there's a process here so why wasn't that far why where these negotiations going on why is this it's it's it's over a 1% pain grease which the teachers were due to gas so they should have gotten that in the vice at the right time it was delayed they were meant to get

13:311% doesn't it sounds like they're looking for you know 25% pain grease or something they do work very hard they do extra hours many people do I work in in assembly stage I work hours extra hours here and there because I don't I only get paid you know for my eight hours per day I do extra time because you know well I just want to get something finished then we all do that and let's give them take with our employers so you know the teachers get grace so my holidays that's fantastic and they get the two weeks they get coming up to a midterm break now that's all wonderful they do give there is give and take 1% pain increase is not enormous they're due to gases I know that the politicians they got their 1% pain grease that that what they were due and fair place them but why haven't teachers got this why haven't got to this stage that the teachers should have to do that yeah and I know teachers want to be out and it's very it's awkward it sets up you know difficulties with families with parents teachers don't want to be out but why you know it shouldn't have gotten to this stage what about you Jason 1800 453106 is

14:35the number and do you support the work to rule and and the the likely increased strike action next week Jason hi Andrea yeah I would be a hot up stamp start behind the teachers I'm the father of twin boys and one of them has special needs and in our school the SNA is doing an incredible job it's a way off my mind and my wife's mind every day we see the improvements that they're made with our children and we're aware of the workload they're under and there's more and more children being diagnosed and with special needs and these SNAs are stepping up to the mark they need to be renewed and raised appropriately I mean you can't trust someone like Finland which is the highest education system in the in the world very content people very great society trust in the government etc their teachers are paid like doctors they do outside schooling sort of twice a week the children they go out in the snow and the durus and everything like that and they're professionals ultimately professionals now if we want to attract and keep the

15:39professionals we have as teachers they need to be paid properly I mean I'm a managing director of a company my staff will mess me out for the days and I'll have to collect my child early I'm copying him lace me some of my wife will wait for work every morning but it's nothing compared to feeling unrecognized and unwanted I look after my staff they're all very happy they're all very content being made sure that they're paid appropriately and that the workload isn't too stressful so the government has one job to do and pay their staff appropriately they manage it themselves they look after children who are the future of this country and the the days of us not investing on our future is should be gone we've a massive you know bank balance if you like some easy money corporation tax which is easy money it's it's it's come in from big tech they don't have to do very much there's not a lot of imagination from the government to garner that amount of taxes and this idea that they're going to keep it for a rainy day no no that's not that's not on

16:43this is most of the people this country now paying taxes are entitled to see that spent in things like education in health so I can even see in the text something is you know sprudent to keep a rainy day fun given the experiences of the past and I know you talked about Finland like there there is a disparity though in the income tax that we're paying here here versus what what's paid in Finland and with a further strike action or increased strike action or whatever you want to call it next week Jason it is something you'd support by teachers they should stick their ground to the ground I think they're undervalued and it's the same old argument comes out oh they've got free months vacation and they're going to pay pension well so they should so they should they look after our children throughout their their early lives and early teens and they do an excellent job interesting tax here from this listener who says I actually I have to say I used to take the anti-teacher side in arguments like in this debate until my son who is autism started school and I now see the work that they put in on a daily basis just pay them what they want

17:46like the nurses were a wealthy country apparently and we seem to have plenty of money to uh to spend on other things says this listener as well oh and you must take some comfort from the uh the response today it's uh overwhelmingly you have to say according to our own text line here in favor of your action yeah I suppose I just wish we didn't have to take this action because you know we have a fantastic job with you know great experiences with the children and like I think as people have mentioned there what needs to remember the particular areas of economic disadvantage we are often taking the place of occupational therapists speech and language therapists we're doing things that are outsoil about our qualifications you know in order to help the children and our job is to see the children come to school happy and smile every day and leave haven't had a happy experience and that's all we want to do and I think when in this really difficult time where like skills don't

18:46have enough money to keep the light and he are not time just to sit down and engage with for both sides to engage to ensure that that they still don't go ahead or doesn't continue because none of us want to be in this position no well look what we'll see to be more in this tomorrow and I know Jack Chambers the public expenditure minister had only last week said that the the public sector workers were unwilling to sit down and engage with government on a new national pay deal and discussion plenty more to come on this just a final text for the moment the teacher's strike I agree with industrial action but the fact of all of the time off I find it's hard to support yes some of the work after 3 pm or out of iris but none of the more Halloween Christmas Easter or during the summer and just one more this listener says I'm a hundred percent behind the teachers it was a great career years ago but my god it's tough going they deserve absolutely everything they're looking for and much more as well email if you want to share your thoughts with us is launchtimelive at newstalk.com my thanks there to um teacher in fenglish oan dolan dara eamer and jason thank you for getting in touch as well.

19:49launchtimelive with Andrea Gilligan weekdays at midday on newstalk conversation that counts