Timeless Wisdom with Dennis Prager - Does Atheism Make Human Life Meaningless? | Ultimate Issues Hour

0:00Life Audio A Today's episode of Timeless Wisdom New York Times Magazine has a piece which raises a subject that is near and dear to my heart and that is the increasing non-specialness of the human being. The view of so many who are atheists that the more we know about the greatness, the incredible vastness, incredible, unfathomable vastness of the universe, the more insignificant we humans become. That's coming up on Timeless Wisdom with Dennis Brager. Dave Roberts here, there you are surrounded by fans, sharing wings, sharing drinks, high-fiving random strangers. Everybody remembers the game. Nobody remembers the guy coughing behind you until a few days later. At 2am you wake up with the fever and your throats on fire. Now what, urgent care, close, ER, SLAM, telehealth, maybe, but the pharmacies close.

1:03You needed a medical emergency kit. These aren't first aid kits, they contain essential prescriptions, used for over 30 common conditions, sinus and ear infection, UTI, stomach bug, travelers diarrhea and more. On hand before you need them. Use your doctor-developed guidebook to select the right prescription or call their telemedicine doctor standing by. It's like an urgent care and drugstore at home. When you're sick, traveling or stranded, you'll wish you ordered a medical emergency kit. Order online in minutes and it's shipped to your door and say $45 with my promo code blue at urgentcarekit.com-slashblue. That's promo code blue at urgentcarekit.com-slashblue. Welcome to Timeless Wisdom with Dennis Brager. Here thousands of hours of Dennis' lectures, courses in classic radio programs, and to purchase Dennis Brager's rational wibos, go to DennisBrager.com. All not to be. That is the question.

2:04Where was God? Isn't God supposed to be good? He needs to boost the levels. Does God want us to suffer? Ten years you're not finished yet? Why did you give it up to me? Who are you? Bruce? I am God. Bingo! Yotsi! Is that your final answer? Our service has God! Bingo! Bingo! Bingo! Well, it was nice to meet you, God. Thank you for the grand canyon and good luck with the apocalypse. Hi everyone, Dennis Brager and it is the weekly ultimate issues hour, an hour on the great, on some great issue of life. New York Times magazine has a piece which raises a subject that is near and dear to my heart. And that is the increasing non-specialness of the human being. The view of so many who are atheists that the more we know about the greatness, the incredible

3:10vastness, incredible, unfathomable vastness of the universe, the more insignificant we humans become. We used to think that the sun went around the earth and we were the center of the world. Then we learned that in fact the earth was just one of many planets or not many, but of some planets that went around the sun. That the sun itself was just a medium star, that there are countless stars out there to begin with and that so many of them have other planets around them and that's only in one galaxy and there are any number of trillion galaxies out there. And so the more we know about the universe, the more obvious it is that we are beneath worms that worms are far more significant to the earth than the human being is to the cosmos. And so there was again another piece on this in the New York Times magazine and it speaks about, it's in part it's just has a

4:12few paragraphs on the worthlessness of us humans. I will read that to you. It's always sneaked in somehow. We are only coincidences of evolution. We are only coincidences of the big bang. Everything is random. If you turn back the clock, we never would have been made. The universe is incredibly vast. I have told you often my friends that I had Carl Sagan on my television show, the most well-known astronomer probably in American history who's popularized with his famous television PBS series Cosmos. And he said, Tennis, the more I look into the universe, I'm paraphrasing here and see how vast it is the more I realize how insignificant we people are. And he said it with this big smile as if there was some joy in announcing how utterly and totally insignificant we are. I just, I found it remarkable that he had some joy.

5:20If he had said it and say, you know, Dennis, I'm sorry to say, but we're really, we're infinitely less significant than any worm. At least if he would acknowledge that his emotional reaction was one of saddest, but he seemed to revel in the fact that you and I are absolutely worthless nothings in a universe that couldn't care less about us and is so vast anyway that we are far smaller to the universe than a worm is to the earth. You realize that folks. We are far far smaller in the scheme of the entire universe or the universes that they now say exist than any worm is to earth or any ant. We're probably I guess on the size of an atom compared to the universe, not hardly a worm. So I read to you from the New York Times piece, it is about how that we are coming up to realize that is cosmologists, astronomers, physicists that we know nothing

6:25about the vast majority of the world of the universe. Nothing. And now you have to understand, it doesn't mean we can't we can't get there with telescopes. It's that we know nothing because it's not knowable. 96% of what's out there is not matter. It's not energy. We don't know what it is. We can't measure it. We can't see it. It has no gravity. We don't know what it has. We don't know anything about it. 96% of the universe. So I read to you a revolution that has forced their colleagues, that is the colleagues of these two professors of physics that the article speaks about. A revolution that has forced their colleagues to confront a universe wholly unlike any they have ever known. One that is made of only 4% of the kind of matter we have always assumed it to be. The material that makes up you and me and this magazine and all the planets and stars in our galaxy

7:32and in all 125 billion galaxies beyond. The rest 96% of the universe is who knows. Cosmologists often refer to this possibility as the ultimate Copernican revolution. Not only are we not you remember what the Copernican revolution is that that said that the sun was at the center of the solar system. Obviously that's what solar system means the sun is at the center and the earth is not at the center. So he said that already made us less special. When we realized we go around the sun and the sun doesn't go around us but now he writes this is the ultimate Copernican revolution. Not only are we not at the center of anything we're not even made up of the same stuff as most of the rest of everything. We're just a bit of pollution. I love it I love it that said we're a bit of pollution that's even better ice I said worm.

8:37Words are far better than pollution. I love this is bad the best Alan we must remember this. We are just a bit of pollution. Lawrence M. Kraus a theorist at Case Western Reserve said not long ago at a public panel on cosmology in Chicago. If you got rid of us and all the stars and all the galaxies and all the planets and all the aliens and everybody then the universe would be largely the same. We're completely irrelevant. I love it. See this stuff it's funny these things have the opposite effect on me the the the facts of the story. I don't challenge their facts. Science is science. I don't know enough science. I don't have a clue. If they tell me that 96% of the universe is not made up of anything that we're made up of that's fine. I believe them.

9:39I wish you were 99.9. We're pollution. Did you hear that my fellow pollutants? I think I'm going to begin each day. Hi everybody my fellow pollutants welcome to the Dennis Prager show. Now they go on to say that the thing that what is the 96% they now call a dark matter and dark energy because they have no better term they know nothing. I mean folks you have to understand nothing about it. Nothing it's hard for us to imagine that there is 96% of the universe we know nothing about and not only do they know nothing about they have no way of believing that they will ever know anything about it. It doesn't it's not governed by the same principles that our 4% are. Astronomers still wouldn't know what dark energy itself is. The term doesn't mean anything. said David Schlagel of the Lawrence Berkeley National Laboratory this past fall. It might not be dark

10:41it might not be energy. The whole name is a placeholder. That's right. Whatever it is that dark energy involves we know it's not normal either. That's so that's dark energy is supposed to dark matter. In that case maybe the next round of evidence will have to be not only be on anything we know but also be on anything we know how to know. We don't even how to know what we don't know is what the article says. All right one eight Prager 776 number one question. If indeed the statistics are accurate and I will not challenge then I have no basis on which to do so. That that only 4% of the universe consists of anything a consists of everything. 96% of the universe consists of nothing. In other words

11:41I'm just paraphrasing what I just read to you. We humans we physical beings the physical the physical universe that we know the galaxies the planets the suns the stars. They're all of this all of this even energy is only 4% of the universe. Now if you are only part of of that which makes up only 4% of something does that make you more insignificant or more significant. I will talk about that and more about how human significance has been rendered well we're pollutants we're just pollution and that is the atheist look at the human being an honest atheist look. That's this subject for the ultimate issues hour on the Dennis Prager show. This episode of timeless wisdom will continue right after this.

12:43Dave Roberts here there you are surrounded by fans sharing wings sharing drinks high-fiving random strangers everybody remembers the game nobody remembers the guy coughing behind you until a few days later at 2 a.m. you wake up with the fever and your throats on fire now what urgent care close ER slam telehealth maybe but the pharmacies close you needed a medical emergency kit these aren't first aid kits they contain essential prescriptions used for over 30 common conditions sinus and ear infection UTIs stomach bug travelers diarrhea and more on hand before you need them use your doctor develop guidebook to select the right prescription or call their telemedicine doctor standing by it's like an urgent care and drugstore at home when you're sick traveling or stranded you wish you ordered a medical emergency kit order online in minutes and it's shipped to your door and say 45 dollars with my promo code blue at urgent care kit dot com slash blue that's promo code blue at urgent care kit dot com slash blue now back to more of Dennis Prager's timeless wisdom

13:51Dennis Prager here the ultimate issues hour and this this particular hour is devoted to the following the atheist position and i'm not arguing atheism this is not i'm very precise on what we talk about on any given hour i'm not arguing atheism not arguing against it not arguing for the ism i am making the following statement atheism inevitably leads to the utter and total insignificance of the human being it is ironic when there are people who are in who are atheist call themselves humanists i know they mean well that is not my my point is never about their motives it is about the intellectual inconsistency you you are not you are you can't elevate the human if you have a position of atheism that is why i read to you

14:55i read to you from this New York Times magazine piece that we are as this as this great physicist said we are pollution we humans that's all we are we're pollution we're nothing we are worse than nothing we're pollution does he love his children i have no doubt he loves his children does he have friends i have no doubt he has friends that's that's not my point my point is that intellectually life is pointless it is pointless if you're atheist it's pointless because we are utterly insignificant we are undesigned unmade unformed we have no soul we are in the image of nothing except this tiny 4% of the universe which is measurable and that's it we're pollution now i believe that it ultimately has an effect on the way people do behave and maybe not the first generation of people people who believe were pollution but by the second and third generations

15:56because if we are if we are truly just just nothings why why act nobly why elevate there's nothing to elevate yourself to nothing that's why i consider this article in the New York Times magazine so so important we go to your calls Helen and Denver Dennis Prager thank you for calling hi thanks for taking my call right i love your show good me too i do scientists that are telling us this now the same scientists that are coming from the same universities that are telling us that we're ruining the world with global warming i mean how can you have it both ways yeah why why not why not what right exactly what difference does it make we're just pollution to begin with so it shouldn't matter whatever effect we have should not really affect the universe well it's certain oh right well that they would have to acknowledge it will not affect the universe it would only affect the earth oh i see yes that that's that's what they would that's

16:58what that's exactly what they would answer all right thank you Helen thank you all right take care and let's go to Nancy a seventh great teacher in mesa arizona hi Nancy hi Dennis thank you for taking my call my husband and i love your show go wonderful i have been so weary of hearing comments from my students and reading in their essays and this has been going on now for the last three years how important the animals are how the animals of the world are so much more important than their very lives are they virtually worship the animals and of course they're getting this from their elementary school indoctrination and they're getting it from liberal parents and so forth and the other day i had just had it i went out on a lamb i figured what can they do fire me or sue me but i'm going to teach these children and i told them that their lives each one of them are of infinite worth that they are more valuable than they can even begin to imagine that the

17:59animals are here for them they're not here for the animals that the animals are the creations of god and they are his offspring and there is an enormous you said this in a public school class i said it in a public school class you are you still employed i'm still employed that's good that's good but but the things these children are believing and i told them that if they understood their worth if if if our children and our teenagers and our young adults and if they understood their worth and perhaps they wouldn't feel so inclined to destroy their lives with drugs and with alcohol and to desecrate their bodies with tattoos and piercing and all the things they do if they understand how very very valuable they are well said mancy that's the whole point of this ultimate issues hour i'm not trying to convince atheists not to be atheists i'm not trying to convince anyone to believe in god i am far more interested right now in in your

19:01understanding that if an atheist position must lead inevitably and it does it does to the belief that we are worthless we humans are our worthless i have talked to you at another time about how life is obviously therefore if there is no god meaningless but please understand that that we have no worth we are i love this professor statement in the new york times magazine piece we are pollution that's it what else pollutes we pollute were the only things that pollute the universe would be just fine not only if we didn't exist the universe would be fine if nothing existed because 96 percent is non-existent anyway that's the point of this whole article but there are consequences to that belief and the other belief the belief that we have inherited from what we call Judeo Christian values is that the human being is created in god's image and is infinitely sacred the human life is infinitely you are infinitely valuable there was a heibou saying that i learned in

20:03my heibou school bishvili nivra haulam for me the entire world was created what a difference what a difference the opposite of the of what's called the companion revolution of course i have no problem with the with the earth revolving around the the the sun that's what it is why why are we more valuable if the sun comes goes around us this notion that i am valuable or not valuable based on the the revolution of the earth is is preposterous it's preposterous one has nothing nothing to do with the other one eight prager seven seven six is the number and let's go to fill in long beach california filled in his prager high morning danis first of all the science makes me laugh i i remember you talking to a scientist admitted that the multiverse is in the rest of it

21:03is absurd compared to believing in a god uh steven hawkins in his latest book a briefer history of time i believe it was on page 76 but somewhere along in there said and i don't know why it hasn't been noticed or or acknowledged that it is impossible to explain why we're here other than a god created is that so yes i i must i will check that up during the break check that out that that's to come from steven hawking yeah we must look into that immediately i i i i thank you i i i can't either allan for for another ultimate issues hour the question that we should raise is is god good god's existence is to me a given it is the only thing that that makes rational sense but the goodness of god that's a belief factor we'll be back in a moment you're listening to the ultimate issues hour on the danis prager show this episode of timeless wisdom will continue right

22:07after this yes davor obert here there you are surrounded by fans sharing wings sharing drinks high-fiving random strangers everybody remembers the game nobody remembers the guy coughing behind you until a few days later at 2 a.m you wake up with the fever and your throats on fire now what urgent care close er slam telehealth maybe but the pharmacies close you needed a medical emergency these aren't first aid kits they contain essential prescriptions used for over 30 common conditions sinus and ear infection uti stomach bug travelers diarrhea and more on hand before you need them use your doctor develop guidebook to select the right prescription or call their telemedicine doctor standing by it's like an urgent care and drugstore at home when you're sick traveling or stranded you'll wish you ordered a medical emergency kit order online in minutes and it's shipped to your door and say forty five dollars with my promo code blue at urgent care kit dot com slash

23:07blue that's promo code blue at urgent care kit dot com slash blue now back to more of denis pragers timeless wisdom venis prager here this is the ultimate issues hour of the hour each week devoted to some great issue and they the one today is that atheism leads inevitably not not because atheists are bad there are good atheists and bad atheists there are good religious people bad religious people i say that all the time but atheism leads inevitably by by its own logic to the to the utter deemphasis of any worth to the human being pollution as we are as this professor in this new york times article about how insignificant another one about how insignificant we are in the universe not only are we are we infinitesimally small but we are part of an infinite a very small part of what makes up the universe only four percent

24:10of the universe makes up anything that we can see or or anything that we can measure and so we are we are nothing we we are nothing and we are just we are coincidences of evolution in the same view on the on the other side is the notion that we are created in god's image that we have infinite value since when does does how big we are matter i mean the universe is so large that even if we were the size of a planet if you were the if every one of you listening were the size of Jupiter you would be insignificant so what what what is the point it isn't the size that matters as funny as that statement is with it with its double entendres it so obviously so either we are a value or we're not a value but our value can't be on what

25:13percentage of the universe do we make up one eight prayer seven seven six one eight p-r-a-g-e-r seven seven six and we go to where you rabbi steven vacaville california high rabbi steve Dennis Prager I Dennis I got to tell you ultimate issues and happiness hours of my two favorite hours of the week well thank you i'm happy to hear that um i just have a challenge really i guess not really a disagreement obviously i'm a believer but you know as a philosophy major at the uj and i just i have to say that that logically number one it doesn't have to inevitably lead and for many it just would say it wouldn't because if you find a ten thousand dollar bill there is such a thing it's not less valuable because it's random or it's chance so you know you're you're in my favorite what do you know he crimes in mr. mea's he makes the same argument precisely because we're rare one could say even without god therefore we're more valuable we have

26:14to do whatever we do to make our value more so both on a logical basis as well as on a will basis an atheist can argue it doesn't have to inevitably lead to our worthlessness yeah if you if you equate rare with significant but an atheist could do that it can it can't evidably lead to value well no it's a choice i i think steve i think it's a choice that the that the atheist would then be making and i and i want him to make that choice but i don't think that it intellectually is inevitable i didn't say it's inevitable but you're saying it's inevitable yes i am yeah yeah if one finds a ten thousand dollar piece of gold it could be just yeah but what if one finds all right but what no no no no but but that that's different because that ten thousand dollar piece of gold matters you can do something with it but what if you find a very rare piece a unique

27:16piece of garbage that's what we are in the universe that's the point of this article we are garbage we're not ten thousand dollar bills but that's that's the difference you see your your you're making a fallacy of equivocation because the fact as you say of of of of equivalence the fact the fact is the fact but the opinion is an opinion a fact doesn't have no but it no it is a fact that we are meaningless to the universe that if we we and for that matter all matter died out it would make no difference that's a fact no no no no no no that's not no you are confusing subjective with objective it would have no impact on the universe if we if if earth exploded tomorrow absolutely not it would impact your feelings and it would impact a lot of atheist feelings they love their children like theist do i have no doubt about that but objectively speaking which is what scientists do we have no impact our disappearance would have no impact

28:21and that's what they're talking about i'm honored that you listen to that you call rabbi steve we continue on the ultimate issues hour on the dentist prayer show dear mr. prayer this is an year old triggers and i look i've listened to you for years i just want to tell you that you are a blessing to humanity i am praying for you so god bless you may the lord heal you soon and i always wish you the best you're an incredible man i admire you in so many ways i respect you and if anybody ever asked me who would i have liked to have the opportunity to sit down and dine and get to know a person you will be first in my book so god bless you again this is anemia of a triggers and i'm a long time listener i've been a long time listening of your show you take care and make a copy with you always and your family bye bye

29:23dentist dentist dentist dentist prayer dear the question you've always wanted to ask dentist prayer well now is your opportunity for upcoming ask me anything episodes of timeless wisdom with dentist prayer we're inviting you to leave dentist a voicemail you'll personally answer selected questions and your question could be featured on a future episode whether it's about faith, morality, politics, history, relationships, happiness or simply navigating life dentist would love to hear from you just call 877-243-7776 and leave your question oh and be sure to include your first name and where you're calling from that's 877-243-7776 while we can't feature every question dentist will listen to every voicemail so call today you may hear dentist prayer answering your question and an upcoming episode of timeless wisdom with dentist prayer and thanks for listening and supporting dentist prayer dentist prayer here the ultimate issues our

30:23and effect of atheism one consequence and I'm not debating whether or not there is a god this hour so don't even call in on that that's not the issue the issue is whether or not humans are more or less valuable if there is or isn't a god in whose image were created or who would give us a soul or whatever belief you have about god in humans and it is so obvious that we are more significant if you have the the what we have what we call loosely a biblical view of the human being and that is that we are created in God's image and that we have therefore some deep sanctity the whole concept and I talked an hour about this of holiness which I define is elevating us from the animal like to the god like if there is no god there is nothing holy but I but I specifically am talking about human worth we are pollution says a professor and he's right that's the point we are pollution if there is no god in this universe we are we are specs of

31:29of pollution that's that's that is exactly what we are in this in this New York Times magazine piece that I've been quoting to you it's titled out there and it is about how the 96% of the universe is completely unknowable we don't even know how to know it we're just a bit of pollution Lawrence Krause Krause a theorist at Case Western Reserve said not long ago at a public panel on cosmology in Chicago if you got rid of us and of all the stars and all the galaxies and all the planets and all the aliens and everybody then the universe would largely be the same we're completely irrelevant there you go as opposed to the view that we have infinite worth because a god designed us the powerful stuff Vernon Hills Illinois Dennis Prager Pete hello Pete thanks for calling hi thank you for your call it's cooling on our privilege to talk with you thank

32:33you very much I have to say first up I'm not a great thinker of the world so what I'm going to tell you is or what I'm talking about is happenstance that I remember from reading Anne Rand's books but she postulate in right in rational objectivism that our ego and self-derived value in of itself so that we can exist outside of God and have value and create intrinsic worth yeah but that it I understand every word you said but it's all subjective the very and even ego itself ego itself is just a psychological term it's a construct to better understand us but there is no you can't find an ego if you dissect the brain but does that does that the diminishing's worth in and of itself I guess what I'm does that diminish the worth of what of one's deeds and one's actions because our actions and our deeds that they only matter in so far

33:35as you ascribe importance to them but that's a completely subjective call objectively it's quite irrelevant if you murder torture or or build hospitals right I agree with you I'm not I'll obviously altruism is the the state of being that you want to be in as far as well as the state well it's the state of being that you and I hopefully want to be in but it isn't the state of being that a lot of people and by the way even religion itself doesn't guarantee that you'll be in a state of being of altruism as we see the murder in in the name of of God today taking place where people have slaughtered and and religious incantations are made so we have to be intellectually honest religion doesn't guarantee anything I'm not even talking about that that's another question will do another time as religion make people better elements a good one for a UI hour in ultimate issues hour my only question today is do you do you or do you not acknowledge that atheism leads to the

34:42utter and total in significance of the human being that's all I ask you what doesn't mean you'll be bad it doesn't mean you won't be able to enjoy a great music or your or your grandchildren all right that's not the point okay let's let's go to James and Phoenix Arizona high James Dennis Prager and thank you Pete okay very quickly when I first heard you throw that statistic out about the 94% 96 can never understand the first thing I thought was does that not at least open up the possibility then that there is in fact a spiritual world and in fact yeah is I know it's almost as if God is saying hey hello hello dear scientists who are a little bit arrogant exactly you you look now acknowledge that you don't even know how to discover 96% of the universe precisely so so why are you all also arrogant about that nothing non material exist because you

35:43acknowledge right now that 96% of the universe is non material it is not matter it is not energy you don't know what it is but by golly you know there's no God very good James well said exactly right over to Utah and is that Syracuse Utah Patrick yes hi hi how you doing well you know I'm no genius but when when I hear what you're saying about these scientists and the and the point that they're making that you know we're such an insignificant percentage of all the matter in the universe or that all matter is insignificant quantity to me I look at it like it's similar like a diamond you know if every rock was a diamond a diamond wouldn't mean anything it wouldn't have any value but because you know if this is the fact that we are such an insignificant percentage then wouldn't that argue exactly the opposite point that what they're saying that that we are in fact

36:44even more special because well yeah this was what the rabbi who called up earlier said that they that the atheist could argue but that presumes that rarity makes you it makes something significant but if I've as I said what if I found a unique piece of garbage yeah I understand what what uniqueness isn't isn't valuable and nor is nor does common make something not valuable if they were if there were 500 billion people we would every single one of us would still still be infinitely important if you believe that there is a god who invests us with a soul and in whose image we are created final segment coming up I will tell you the ramifications of all this when we return I'm Dennis Prager this episode of timeless wisdom will continue right after this

37:44now back to more of Dennis Prager's timeless wisdom final segment here of the ultimate issues hour every week at this time at this hour third hour of my radio talk show on Tuesdays I broadcast the ultimate issues hour and today it has been about the insignificance of us humans when you adopt an atheist worldview it is not an argument for God's existence that would be a separate hour it is not an argument that religious people are better than atheists that is not the point at all there are some beautiful people who are atheists it is a fact of life it is simply that one needs to take seriously what one believes or doesn't believe and if in fact one believes that there is no designer no creator no god then one believes that we are indeed as this professor in this New York times

38:45magazine piece that I have been citing to you said we are just a bit of pollution we are completely irrelevant to the universe 96% of the universe in any event is not even matter or energy they don't not only do they not know now scientists what the nearly all of the universe is they don't even know how to figure out what it is and as one listener pointed out earlier one caller but then there's certain that there is no designer they admit that they can't even understand the idea that something isn't matter or energy that the universe is not composed of that well they call a dark matter and dark energy but as one professor put it it's just a placeholder it's just the word that they use in order to say we don't have a clue we don't even have we don't even have a clue what how to how to find out what it is and what are the ramifications they are huge if you raise a generation of young people to think that that ultimately it's all insignificant

39:48we are just we are just coincidences don't do you not acknowledge that that will have a deep impact on the way in which people see themselves see other people in the way in which people will behave of course it will why why not just live for the moment we all die and it's all pointless anyway and we're all a coincidence in any event why why bother trying to elevate my life why bother putting a check on my own animal nature why that's what I am I'm nothing but an animal anyway that's what they are taught I'm not arguing against evolution I am arguing for the understanding the consequences of teaching all these things as if there is no God there are huge consequences you don't think that a generation raised to believe that it is in fact essentially pollution will not act in a polluted way pollution acts polluted

40:52and those who believe that they are in God's image may aspire to something higher there are consequences to atheism and this is one of them that spelled out on the ultimate issues hour of the Dennis Prager show I thank you for listening tomorrow untimeless wisdom with Dennis Prager question for those of you married that I would like to have your input with regard to I think it might help others and maybe I can help some of you don't know what do couples do who have religious differences and I don't mean two different religions that's one of the religious differences obviously but what do you do I think even more common than being in different religions is one being religious and one not I think one of the things that attracted me to my wife 23 years ago or 24 or 25 years ago when we were dating

41:55was that I was going to be a missionary pilot in that my strong sense of wanting to know God and who he was I'm a shagot you are a non Jew that's correct right okay you're using a term I'm not a fan of but it's it's it doesn't matter it's it's a yetishism for non Jew but go ahead right and and and actually I consider you something of my rabbi okay I'm honored by them thank you I listen to you all the time right and your your your discussions on religion are haven't valuable to me and to my wife great not always that he thank you now now you you are are you in any religion I'm Catholic my wife is is Jewish okay go ahead so we we made decisions early on when when we were first dating she was you know she had been by Smith's foot but she wasn't very observant and when when we decided to get married we know we got married by a

43:03priest in a rabbi and and the rabbi and the priest both counsel us that we should bring the children up in a religion and not try to do both it was too confusing for the kids recently got my wife cheating on me with another man and this is when I say recent this is probably not only four days ago and our problems have spawned from the topic you're talking about right now I have always been religious growing up and but when we dated we weren't religious I was in my religious I guess you would say and then when we got married the older I got we we've been married for two and a half years and the older I got the more religious I got because I guess maybe the wives are I got the more I felt that religion became more important to me as we went on and the reason I've hurt her and I guess pushed her ways I wanted her to be involved with well what is your religion I'm a Christian I think the Church of Christ and so when you married

44:07neither of you was particularly religious not necessarily no I was on the inside but I didn't know okay but to from her perspective you the two of you were similar religiously yes join us to hear more on timeless wisdom with Dennis Prager visit Dennis Prager.com for thousands of hours of Dennis' lectures courses in classic radio programs and to purchase Dennis Prager's rational Bibles we want to take just a second to thank the team at Life Audio for their partnership with us on the podcast go to LifeAudio.com to find dozens of other Faith Center podcasts and their network including shows about prayer Bible study parody and more