[Rerun] Maya Hawke

0:00I thought I'd ship myself. And then I had to go talk to the Hollister model. And I had to explain to him that we needed to hike six miles off the trail. Welcome to Podcrushed. We're hosts. I'm Penn. I'm Nava. And I'm Sophie. And I think we would have been your mental school besties. I'm using touch on high school and never reconnecting as adults. Hello Podcrushed. You know, I'm trying to combine them in the sky. He's already been. He's already been. Really. All bad, unusable. And in between a scene where I had to have a grizzly, I'm dealing with death. And so, you know, so for lunch, we had this free dance photographer shout out to Rick.

1:01He came and he set up all these partitions with just enough of an opening so that everything could be seen by anybody who was entering the lunch room, but not eating lunch. And he did his best because that's all that was provided. I mean, you know, so I go in and he was just so thoughtful and kind. But I just had to say he did not bring the spirit of my show you. He brought much more of the Podcrushed spirit. And there was something about those two spirits in that moment that was, they were really fighting each other. And, you know, we like, I have this prop of a stapler. Thanks to Sophia Navas, genius, genius, creative implementation of a stapler. It's Navas. I have to give Navas credit on that one. I mean, I brought the stapler, but it was really Veronica, our photographer who became a Navarro. No, we came enamored with the use of the stapler in the shop. We're in dead end. Our photographer? Robin. Robin, I keep feeling it Veronica. Robin, our photographer Robin. We're both good men. We won't edit that out. We're really indebted to Carotop. Iconic prop comic.

2:02Yeah. I stapled my finger during the shoot. I mean, it was a bloodbath. And so it really brought them together. No, that's no. I did staple my finger. Yes. I was trying to be, you know, sweet in some way. And Rick was being so encouraging. Bless him. Did not have any idea who I was. Or like, I don't think what my show was about at all. And you know, he kept on trying to like encourage me to, you know, he saw like your guys pictures which you'd already shot and they're very, you know, you're doing a lot of like, how do we describe it? Like, what are you doing? You're doing a lot of poor, a lot of unusable. I was talking to my mom and I was like, there's not one normal picture. No, not but every picture I'm rolling my eyes or making a kissy face or using a steak. It's definitely a lot of like a lot of what is that just just to just like and like, yeah, you each had enough of like a normal shot, I think.

3:06But so that's what we had to go off of. And so Rick is, you know, kind of trying to encourage me to do those things. I don't think of myself like, I'm not doing that. I'm not. I'm not. And so I actually, I'm just, I'm very like, you know, thinking of you guys, thinking of him and just time and I'm like, I'm just trying to, I'm trying to explain to him like, so the whole, that's actually what you did with his finger. He was like, I'm already in so much pain. I just need to just try to explain to him graciously, you know, in some way that like, you know, they really do their thing and like, I do my thing. And like, He's like, He's like, This is set the set as a heart. So it was just, it was a good, it was a good time in the end. The moral of this story is that the decision to have Sophie and I go first and you based your, your takes off of us was, there are harsh words that I can use, but I'm going to stick with the star. Clearly, I know it hit me after we did the photo shoot that the purpose of this free brand was

4:13to age it up. I feel like I got home and I was like, shoot. I totally did not think about this. Well, we'll see what we have with you. You'll know. You already know this thing. Yeah. There's six, there's six year olds being here. I don't like ladies guys talk. More roadblocks, please. So yeah, speaking of growing up, let's get into our guest. So yeah, we have Maya Hawk. She's an actor and musician. You know her from films like Asteroid City, Maestro, Once Upon a Time in Hollywood. And then of course, there is a series like Stranger Things, which you've probably heard of and seen. You might know her from that. Also, the BBC's Little Women. She's got a growing catalog of records. Her new record, Chaos Angel, is what she was here to talk about, but we covered a lot of ground. You're really going to enjoy this one. Don't go anywhere.

5:14College football is back. So Hilton called to me the superstition concierge to make your fan rituals a reality. Need a room to match your lucky number? We got you. Want to make sure our team doesn't wash your lucky jersey? Oh, that smells lucky. Hilton's unmatched hospitality can keep up with any superstition. Even a marching bandwreck up call it 555 and 55 seconds. Hit it! When you need a team that will do whatever it takes on game day, it matters where you stay. Hilton, for this day. Good things come in force. Like ukulele strings, boy band members, and PayPal paying for. No fees, no interest, no impact on your credit score. That's the flexibility to pay the way that works for you. Strum it, hum it, pay it in four. Download the PayPal app to get started. Subject to approval. Learn more at paypal.com-payin-four. Paypalling, NMLS 910457. Hi, guys. Hi. Hi. Welcome. So Maya and I did, we did the most recent thing we did together was a reading with a bunch

6:22kind of like an all-star cast. I'm not including myself. I'm not saying, but I mean, you're ridiculous. This ridiculous cast. That was back in 20s. It was a long time ago, 2016 or 2016, maybe in 2015. I know that I was touring at the time and it was, I just happened to be in Brooklyn for like two days and I made it happen. But we just like, we stood this play up, read it, you know, after everybody having only read through it like one day prior, I think. Wow. And it was Chekhov's, uh, cherry orchards, yeah. It was a modern adaptation setting Chekhov's the cherry orchard in the American South. That's right. And then before that, the first time we ever met was, uh, it would have been a month of a marauder's short film. Yes. And he directed something that I'd worked in with your father. What's funny is that I have worked with Maya and both her mother and her father. Wow. That is amazing. It's a very strange, very small community.

7:22Yeah. It's an off-you-py space inside of you at 12. You know what we do here. I mean, where are you at 12? How do you see in the world? Where were you and what were you doing to? Understand where I was at 12, you have to kind of go back where I was before, which is I started off at a really preman proper, um, school in New York City called Briarly, where you had to wear a uniform. It was only girls and, um, I was able to disguise my, uh, dyslexia from them until around the third grade. And then the chapter books started getting harder and harder to memorize and I got, and I was exposed. And then pretty much asked to leave. And then I went to a school called Winward. I mean, I think that if whatever administrator heard that they were going for a mutual decision, thinking you'd be benefited by a different academic, but it was, you know, I was like bumped down from lower and lower reading level groups until there was the bottom and then there was nowhere else to go. And fourth and fifth,

8:23I did it Winward. And then six, seventh, I did this place called Rural Steiner, which is a really like specific kind of style learning place. And so I mean, just around when I was 12, I just gotten out of an environment that was really focused on like kids' individual learning styles and kind of put back into a more normal schooling system, but it was still really specific. And I was intensely more holistic. I was really political. Mostly like environmental, I was an avid environmentalist. I really didn't think anyone should curse. I really thought that any day now I was going to be able to talk to animals and have full conversation with my powers. My powers were going to set in any moment now and they would explain my whole origin story. And I wore like nightgowns to school. I had not yet reached the point of like, I remember right at 12, my mom made me this amazing parrot

9:25Halloween costume where we glued multicolored feathers on the angel wings and I wore a rainbow dress. And I showed up and it was right when kids started punning like nurses, you know, like like, or trying to look slutty. And I was crying in the closet because I was so ashamed to be ashamed of the costume that my mom had made me, you know. And so I was right, that was kind of right around that time period. My, this is the most beautiful, like evocative portrait. I think we've ever had from a guest. I have so many questions. But I guess my first question is the no cussing thing. Did that come from your parents? Like where did that sense of morality, propriety come from? I think my parents just didn't very much. And then I started interacting with some other adults in the world. Like people, my parents were dating or and they did a lot. And I was like, that is a, I like, you are bad. Like

10:29that's a bat. And that was a power that I had as a 12 year old to reprimand adults. Interesting. And I think I had, I had a real like, I want power complex. And that was like, I have a lot of responsibility and no authority, you know, in my head. And I was like, I have an authority on this. Kids do it in TV shows all the time. And I can tell you that you're bad because you said, fuck. And that makes you bad. And I can't talk about the other reasons I think you're bad. But I know that I got you on now. Oh my gosh. Wow. That's so insightful. A little, a little controlling. Yeah. I was going to say like that paints a little bit of a picture for me of you as like, maybe a little like bossy. I wonder if you were like that with other kids. I was in all the sibilant on. So I was definitely bossing with my brother and and and how much younger is it? Three and a half years. Okay. I was bossy with him.

11:32And I was bossy with people who I saw as being like, wow, I realize I'm just about to justify my bossy. And it's like, I wasn't bossy to the good children. Yeah. But I was. And I think in that in that one, I just said, I guess I was bossy. But I was also, it's a weird contrast because I was also shy. Like I was also the kind of kid who'd wait at the top of the slide and let kids go down in front of me wanting to take my own time going down the slide. You know, like I and so I it was a weird contrast between being like, you shouldn't do that. Be nice to your mother. Like this, that was and like, no, go ahead. You know, like there was a strange, I think just adult complex. I just thought I was an adult. I started auditioning for the first time at 16, but I didn't get the part. But and it was an exception where I hadn't been allowed to audition for anything. But then because it had happened organically through like a school acting teacher and a community reach out, I was allowed to audition to this one project.

12:36But that was the only work experience I'd had until I graduated high school at 17. Maya, we, you know, we did do a lot of prep. We all are fans of yours. We sort of follow your career. And in one of these things that we were reading, we heard that it wasn't in common for you and your dad to write poetry, paint, play guitar together well into the night. And I was curious. I had two sort of follow ups to that. Do you remember what your early poems were about? And did you have kind of a similar relationship with your mom or how did the arts kind of express themselves in your relationship with your mom? You know, my mom was much more interested in information. Like my big memory of like I had a really hard time sleeping as a kid. So I think a lot of these things of like word tools with which to kill time before I would pass out, you know, and trying not to put on a bug's life for the 50,000th time, you know. But my mom, what I remember her doing really was teaching me information. Like my, I like teaching me about how tectonic plates work. And what the

13:38center of the core of the earth is and like the different layers and about Pangaya and like tectonic shifts and earthquakes. And like she is one of the smartest people I've ever met my whole life and is a really avid reader and it really prefers nonfiction. And is kind of consuming a ton of information. And she would teach me a lot about the world and history. And then, and then we would wash them with these together and stuff like that. But then kind of the, the, and we would make, like I said, like she would make our Halloween costume together. Like there was tactile art making steps. And then with my dad, we just read a lot of poetry and do a lot of watercolors. There's a story that you've told, which I think was at 12 years old, where you attended a dress rehearsal. My dad loves this story. I went to the dress, my dad was doing this thing called the bridge project where he was doing the

14:42cherry orchard and a winner's tail in rep, which is extremely cool. PSA, I would like to do one someday. And I came to, it was at a, like I was at Rudolph's time. So I probably was 12. And I went to these, to the dress rehearsal and I sat and, and watched the whole thing. And it was pretty much pornographic to me as a kid. Like it was so exciting. The dance, the people were, they did this amazing dance and Rebecca Hall was so beautiful. And I like, and she stood still like a statue for, like what seemed to me like eight hours. And I didn't understand how she did it. And she moved again at the end. And I was like, oh, her magic powers have kicked in. And, and, and this whole show, it was musical and colorful and sensual. And I felt like my brain electrified.

15:45And my dad cites this mall. And then I wanted to stay and watch it again. And my dad cites this moment as the time in which he knew that it was, I was unavoidably sick and would become an artist. Like that there was no way around the, the, the illness. And, and I do think that like, it is, it was a moment for me, but it was a moment in the spectrum of many moments of falling in love with this work. And really that that whole, so let us heart rate a different shape between coast of utopia, the bridge project and Macbeth. Because two of them happened at Lincoln Center, and they were all really important to me because I loved to be backstage. And I loved to like go to the different departments and hang out with costume. And like, it's just where I wanted to be. And then I wanted to watch. And I remember at coast of utopia, I got to go out on stage. I don't know if anyone saw that play in New York, but at the beginning of it, there's like a,

16:49a fake ocean, where there's a big silk sheet that was thrown over the stage. It's gorgeous stages. And then all the cast stood under it and like bumped it up, like creating waves. And I got to go under it and bump it up. And then they pulled the stage up like this thing back and re-author one. Yeah. And you know, hide back again. And I still have the moon from that sky in my, why I used to have it in my bedroom all throughout my teen years. And I think being backstage at these incredible theatrical performances and getting to watch them is a huge part of the reason why I wanted to be an actor. That makes sense to me. Being on a set can be if you're sort of made for it. It's a very exciting place to be. I mean, there's almost nothing more exciting if it's what you, and it's to me, I feel like I learn a lot about people sometimes based on whether they're not they enjoy being on set when they're not working. I think that that's it. Not that it's not a positive or negative, but I think it speaks. It says a lot. Because I would notice some people

17:50you bring into set and when they don't have a job, whether or not they work in the arts and they're like they have fun. They watch a take. They go get a snack. They shake some hands and they're like, all right, that's it. And other people go and they're like, I'll hang out all day. I like, I want to go check out all the departments and I want to sit and talk to people and it's and just watch take after take after take. And that's what I was like as a kid. And I there's a it's very rare that people don't find that boring. And if they don't, it says a lot, I think my sister, my half sister, who I say half because she she's so much older than me 17 years. And we really didn't grow up together. Words sort of like two only children, but she came to and she really is not a part of this world. Like she she has six kids and lives in the suburbs and you know, it was just really, really not a part of a media making like the apparatus that it's Hollywood. And when she came on the set of gossip her old years ago, she said that she said that I seemed like an astronaut

18:52going into space because the whole thing as she could tell, I mean, she seemed fascinated by it, but she she said like the whole apparatus like sort of pivots around the actors, you know, for better or worse, but that is sort of how it how it operates like when they're ready to shoot, you get called up. And then everybody is is getting quiet. And then everybody's sort of like making sure you look good everything in front of camera looks good. And then once you're in front of camera, it's, you know, pin drop silent. And there's like a good set. Yeah, I was like, it's not they're been dropped silent. Yeah, I feel like on a good set, they figure out how to make the actors feel like the set revolves around them. And on a bad set, it's revealed how much it doesn't. Like, you know, and like and that's that's my take. But yes, I agree. No, I think I think I think that's accurate because it really it doesn't. It's it is quite collaborative. But I think

19:52those moments leading up to, you know, action is when everything has to really tamp down. And and that's so, you know, just from from an outsider's perspective, I remember that's what she was saying. But yeah, I can't remember being I honestly cannot think of a time right now that I was on set. And which says something that I and I wasn't working. I don't think it was to go right might say it might say that you have worked your whole life a lot and really hard. And that, you know, that your relationship to set is as a place of work. And mine wasn't necessarily. I mean, it's becoming that and that's true. But it still has all of this embedded. I still feel like a lucky visitor a lot of the time. And and like and I have a relationship to it. That's like community. Where it felt like the family that I was being brought up by were a family of the people that come together to make movies and put on plays. And so still when I walk on a set, I feel and sometimes

20:56it's literal. Like sometimes there's a ripple come up to me and be like, just so you know, I hung out with you when you were four or ten hours, you know, but sometimes it's a literal family and literal history. But what I really feel when I walk on set is history and family and yeah. Yeah, but well, you know, both your parents seem to me. I mean, I don't know either of them very well at all. But I think in interviews when they're speaking about you and what you've said is it just it seems like they both highly value the sort of the cultural contribution it is to make art. You know, for the for the person who makes it and then for hopefully, you know, the people that you're making it for. And there's something that it seems like you got the best version and the best combination of that. And sure, there's, you know, nothing is perfect, but you just seem like you you love what you do. You're like thankful that you're doing it. And you're very excited

21:58to be doing it. I think that's 100% true. And I think it's actually a really lucky thing to feel because I'd be interested in what you thought about this. But I feel like in today's time, I worry about people who are growing up and and trying this industry now and learning about this industry now because even just that horrible word, that content word, like is we're all feeling like what was it you're going to say? It's like which word which word is it going to be? That one. Yeah, that horrible that's horrible. See word. Content is drives me insane. And I feel like I grew up raised by people who like thought about films and saw the culture impact of films, shot on film, where people really seem to care about like what the movies were that were being made and whether or not they were good and if this good director made another good film are bad one and and like who makes commercial movies and who makes art movies.

23:00And you know, all of that was really important. And now it feels like it's all kind of blurred together and become this hodgepodge mess of confusion. And so I feel lucky to even though, because I think there's actually maybe an equal amount of opportunity to make art movies now. There's just because there's so much more accessibility. It's just the conversations really different. So I feel lucky to have been brought up understanding at least understanding that old conversation. Stick around we'll be right back. College football is back. So Hilton called me the superstition concierge to make your fan rituals a reality. Need a room to match your lucky number? We got you. Want to make sure our team doesn't wash your lucky jersey. Oh, that smells lucky. Hilton's unmatched hospitality can keep up with any

24:02superstition. Even a marching bandwick up call it 555 and 55 seconds. Hit it! When you need a team that will do whatever it takes on game day, it matters where you stay. Hilton for this day. Good things come in force like ukulele strings, boy band members, oh yeah. And PayPal payin' for. No fees, no interest, no impact on your credit score. Just the flexibility to pay the way that works for you. Strument, hum it, pay it in for. Download the PayPal app to get started. Subject to approval. Learn more at paypal.com-payin-for. Paypalling NMLS 910457. Out of your workout and get back to your best self. What propels you? Propel with Gatorade Electrolites. I'm also interested in what the future of media is going to be like because the automatic

25:06part of it, the numbers, the algorithms, the computation, that's not going away. So I'm curious. I'm really curious to see as you said the next 10 years. You'll just come on season 14 of Todd Crush. Yeah, I'd like that a lot. I would like that. I'd be hosting. I'm curious too. I agree. I don't think anything is going away. I do think that as conscious thoughtful citizens and artists and people, we get to examine our responsibility to consume that information. And whether or not it is our responsibility or if it's actually our responsibility, not to. There's always old stories about like Sam Shepard's friends not letting him go to the party at what his first play was on Broadway. They were like, you're going to get consumed by the industry if you do that. You can't take the praise. You've got to just go back and keep writing. You're an artist man. You're not an industry hack. Now it feels like that whole attitude

26:07is dead. Maybe for the better, but nobody would tell you not to go accept your party or your award. There's no there's no cool level to being like fuck the man. No one will tell you not to give your song away to an advertisement or the industry is so economically deprived that artists are in no way being encouraged. You can't make a living wage and fuck the man. So you know, we're like, you used to be able to kind of buy a house and fuck the man. And now it's really hard to. So yeah, it's on. There's a different context in which you have to fuck the man in order to have a house now. Yes, basically is the no. Yeah, it's true. No, that was a last not a not a scout. Yeah, Maya, before we were talking about your career in some sense, we're talking about art and and movie making and music making. But before we talk about specific projects, I want to just ask you a couple of questions that we ask every guest on pod crushed about middle school.

27:10One of them is what were your first experiences around love and quotation marks? Maybe a crush or your first rejection or heartbreak around that time, around 12. I remember exactly 12. I had my first kiss and it was actually in the apartment building that my mom now lives in. Someone was having like on an eighth grade graduation party. And my first kiss was this boy who I will name drop, name Carter Scott. And I thought he would be an appropriate person to kiss because he already made out with my two friends. And I was like, well, if that had already happened, then he's probably pretty safe. And it was right around like when hookup culture was starting, but not where like so people would come up to you at a party and they'd be like, do you want to hook up? Which in some ways is just like a good consent dynamic, but it's also like that's what I think is the best part of that. Yeah. Is the do you want to? Yeah, sure. It's good. But it was also pretty intense

28:15when there was like three not to overestimate my prettiness. I was just new at a new already environment. I was not I was kind of an unfortunate 12 year old, but I was there and there were three boys and they were all like, hey, we're just curious like which one of us do you want to hook up with? And and they were all standing there and I felt a lot of pressure. So I picked the one that my friends had already hooked up with because that seemed safe, you know, vetted territory. And then we went upstairs and we made out and I remember my eyes were open. And at one point I was like, I'm so sorry, my mom is calling and she was not and did you have a sex? I just got to take this call and and I didn't enjoy myself very much. And so that was interesting, interesting chapter. But my first real crush was cut it twofold. I had like a really big crush on my friend that I went to middle school with. And it was like that confusing period of like, is this girl my friend

29:20or do I have a crush on her? Like what what what's going on in this environment? And I had I so I had that. And that was kind of sweet and confusing and like playful and lovely actually. And then I had a big crush on this boy I would just go with was like the bad boy who like smelt a lot of weed and like skip class and played piano in the lobby. And and that was the first person I was like, I love yeah. And like cried. I've already had too much ice cream and yeah. So those were kind of my first experiences of that. I love it the bad boy played piano in the hallway. No, like he's a bad boy, but he's still an artist. Yeah. Or he's still an artist. That was that was like my school was like sort of was like the bad kids were like, I'm cutting class and going to met. I ended up going to St. Anne's, which Penn I think you're familiar with. And yeah. And I end up going there and it was like, yeah, the bad kids were the kids would cut class to go hang out with

30:22their art teacher. You know, it was a it was a strange environment. We have one other question we ask everyone. I feel like your parent's story might count. Can you use that one? But if you have another one that comes to mind, we ask our guests if they have like, there's like a particularly awkward or embarrassing memory from those tweenteen years that like really stands out. There's so many. So, so many. But here's here's a classic. The parent one is poetic and great, but a classic is that I was on a like kind of like an outward bound style camping adventure with these two. It was like this was 10 12 year olds and two 18 year olds. One of whom was a Hollister model. Okay. And actually, yeah, I forgot about Hollister. He was still. He breathing. And he liked Taylor Swift. Oh my god. And he had it all. He had it all. He liked Taylor Swift. He made amazing playlists. And he was a Hollister model. And that two week period when we were in the

31:25middle of nowhere was when I first got my period. And we're on a camping trip on the top of the mountain. Like in a tent. And I thought I'd ship myself. And, you know, because that's what you think sometimes. And I was like, what is going on? And then I had to go talk to the Hollister model and tell him that we have figured out what was going on. Because I'd been appropriately talked to by, you know, parental figures. And I had to explain to him that I we needed to hike six miles off the trail to a convenience store with which to purchase the appropriate equipment. And it making making 10, 12 year olds, like six miles for a tampon. Yeah. That's horrific. Wait. So you did. You did. You guys, hey, we did this. Wow. And they all knew why. I don't know if they did. But we ended up as a convenience store. And, you know, and I told one girl. And so, you know, you know, you don't

32:27have to tell one girl. Yeah. Yeah. Well, Maya, that is really that's a classic period story. Like at the summit with the model. I mean, it's classic. It's classic. Was his shirt on or off. It was on. It was on. It was on. It did come off at times. It did come off at times. Yeah, it was it was in a very advanced trip. We also got chased by a bear at one point. It was really. It was actually a funny story and very fast. But we got chased by we were hiking up this mountain. And then all of a sudden, we turned a corner and it was a bear. And then we had to run the other way and like drop our packs because that's what you have to do. So we were all dropping our packs at our passports. And then we got to the bottom of the mountain. We just gave the bear. And we all needed our packs back. And so we found out that they they got in our packs back because the bear had drunk all of our Michael and then passed out on top of all of our pack. This is like opposite of cocaine bear. He just dropped all the water on Michael and like passed out. And then

33:34they they were able to move the bear on. And off the bear and move the bear and then take the this whole trip sounds like it's scripted. Yeah, that's amazing. Yeah, I know it was very it was very funny. So my you were currently in Atlanta filming stranger things. One of the most iconic kind of projects of all time. We have a few questions. How excited are you? What is it? I'm actually shocked that you haven't shot it yet. And I know how this stuff works. But like that was a long time ago. Part one. Wait, I'm sorry. Isn't there a part one? Yeah, there was a part well. You're the last season. The last season. You're still last season. Yeah, okay. Okay. But the first part did come out. Is that not? No. I guess it depends on how you're talking about it. Like that's a lot. Season four. Season four and season five are very connected. That's what it is. It is. And season four had a part one and part two because they separated

34:36them. So the last two episodes came out at a different time, which is unusual for streaming. But this is its own season. It is a continuation. But it's the finale. And it has been a long time since last season. This show has been a little bit cursed. Like the pandemic happened right as we were starting the season four. The strike happened right as we were starting this season. It, you know, we're very lucky. And our showrunners, Matt Ross, are really take a lot of responsibility. They have an amazing team of writers, but they're very involved. And they write a lot. And and they are very intense and serious about the quality of the continued writing. And so it takes a long time to write each season. So there's always a big and it takes a long time to shoot. Because they're, you know, we're making basically eight movies. Yeah. The episodes are very long and any episodes. But like how long does it take to shoot it? Oh, a year. A year. That's really long

35:37production for a TV show. Yes, it is. That's true. So when I was like your second home. Yeah. You know, it's become that I've had a really interesting relationship to it over the years. When I first came here, it was the loneliness place in the world my first season. I, I was so lonely. And I really, I think I saw that I was going to go to like summer camp. Like I, and but because it's such a big ensemble show. And I wonder if you know, you've worked on big ensemble shows end on leading parts and being on a big ensemble show is like a lot of time off. It's like they have, they've got you, right? They've like your series regular. They've got you, but they don't need you every day. So it's a lot of waiting for your turn and being on hold and weather cover. Yeah. And it's like just enough that you're always busy, but you're not. And so you're yeah, you're just you're in this. Just enough that you're not available to do anything else, but not enough that you're actually busy or tired. You know, so it's it's it's tricky, but it's

36:44great. And like it's every year, I've gotten closer and closer with my cast and gotten more and more comfortable in the city and more and more able to take care of myself here and bring community here and and build both bringing in build. So this season, I'm really happy. I love my house. I figured out what neighborhood I want to live in. You know, all these things that are so important that yeah, when you grow up in New York, especially like that city is so small in a certain way, like you can kind of live anywhere and get to anywhere and you don't have to drive. And when you when you're out here in the world, it's important that you're in the right in the neighborhood that you like me or people that you like and your restaurants you like and that you can walk and it takes a while to figure that out, you know, but I did it just in the nick of time. Yeah, I loved I love your character of Robin and I feel like you a character brought something really playful to season three. And I wondered what it was like to become part of a show that was already such

37:46a sensation like to join in season three. You know, it was intimidating, especially because I'm a person who loves TV. Like as a as a viewer, it's almost a little embarrassed about it, but not but getting less and less like I like procedures, I like sitcoms, like I love our movies and I go to the movies and I watch them, but I watch a lot of TV in my personal downtime. Like it's on when I'm doing a laundry and I put it on in the morning and it's like I'm a little bit addicted to background noise, I think. And I often feel that when they bring in new characters and shows that I get frustrated, like I'm like I like my original cast. I don't need this to follow this new plot line. I like, you know, I understand that the main cast wants some time off, but but you know, but the either end the show or so I was worried about, you know, people searing about my character that way. I thought you'd love it show and I was intimidated and you know, but what I

38:50quickly figured out is that the star of Stranger Things is the writing and the style. And that is actually such a functional kind of apparatus that if you just kind of breathe and exist within it and tell the jokes and you know, and follow the story and care, it really holds you really well. It doesn't leave you hanging out to dry in any way. And so I was very pleasantly surprised. You know, my another you're saying that I feel like Stranger Things has introduced new characters better than almost anyone like Sadie in season two was so well received you in season three, Eddie in season four, like every new character has brought something new and fresh to the show that I think almost everyone would have welcomed. But yeah, that is actually unusual. I think that's true. I think that the a lot of credit goes to Carmen Cuba for that. She's an incredible casting director and she is so thoughtful about what the

39:55show needs and what like what what a good counterbalanced energy. And also the premise that the brothers do where they always take a new character and put them with a beloved character, especially in the beginning, like putting me with Joe. Yeah, everyone wants to see what Joe realized he didn't do that. And and and putting um, you know, Eddie with Gaten. And you know, you literally anytime Gaten's on screen, it's a fun, it's a good time to watch. So they really also take care of their new cast by not leaving them out to dry on their own arc that no one's invested in. They involve them in essential arcs, which I think is a crucial way to introduce a new character. Yeah, that is amazing. This is an aside, but have you ever seen the treatment for stranger things? What they use to sell it? No. Okay, you should we can send it to you, but I think you can also Google it. Just for anyone who's listening, who's in production, this gets passed on pen and I are producers. We have like TV shows and movies in production. This gets passed on to as a new producer for like this is the gold standard of treatments.

40:58If you can emulate this, your treatment will stand out and it's completely true. It's like the treatment for stranger things is art. It's incredible. I highly recommend it. Yeah. Oh, I want to see it. That's awesome. We'll send it to you. But awesome. Yeah, it's a lovely, lovely thing. And we'll be right back. College football is back. So Hilton called me the superstition concierge to make your fan rituals a reality. Need a room to match your lucky number? We got you. Want to make sure our team doesn't wash your lucky jersey? Oh, that smells lucky. Hilton's unmatched hospitality can keep up with any superstition. Even a marching bandwink up call it 555 and 55 seconds. Hit it! When you need a team that will do whatever it takes on game day, it matters where you stay. Hilton, for the sake. Good things come in force like ukulele strings, boy band members,

41:58and PayPal payin' for. No fees, no interest, no impact on your credit score. Just the flexibility to pay the way that works for you. Strument, hum it, pay it in for. Download the PayPal app to get started. Subject to approval. Learn more at paypal.com slash payin' for paypalling NMLS 910457. With Gatorade electrolytes, zero sugar, and vitamins, PayPal hydrates better than water to help you get the most out of your workout and get back to your best self. What propels you? Propel with Gatorade electrolytes. Okay, I have some questions about working with your dad and I think you have an upcoming project with your mom. So you start opposite if anyone doesn't know her dad is Ethan Hawk. You played his daughter in the miniseries the Good Lord Bird. What was it like to play your real father's fictional daughter? It wasn't as eventful as he would think. He's a wonderful actor and is

42:59wonderful to act with. I've been acting with him my whole life, reading plays in our living room and doing things like the play reading that Penn and I did together. That's been a constant in my life and so it's actually just out very integrated. Maya, you are also a musician. I know that Penn is the most musical of the three. So I think he had a few questions about your music that I won't steal from him. Yeah, well so first of all I did notice that you said that you're and any quote even if it's not a sensational quote I don't want to take it out of context and like hold you to it but you have been quoted saying that you were the most excited about releasing this record and it's coming out end of May is that right? Yeah, I've never been releasing a music project. Okay, that makes sense. And I think that what I'm really talking about is that I feel like I've been in every realm of my work actually but especially in music really learning on the job. Learning about recorded music, learning about writing music and I think that with every record

44:07that I've made the space between what I want to have made and what I made is getting narrower because I'm learning more how to have this song I hear in my head come out of the speakers. And so I and I'm surrounding myself with people who are getting to know me more and better and better and know how to help me do that too. And so that's why I hope that every record I put out I it's becomes the most excited I've ever been to put anything out because I hope that I just keep closing that that gap. Yeah, that makes sense. You mentioned the people that you're making it with. I know two of them. I forget if you know this Ben and Will. Are you know Ben and Will? Yeah, so they so they've played not only with my wife but Domino. Yeah, I do nervous a little bit. They they also have played with Joan as policewoman. Have you heard of this? Oh, yeah, of course. Yeah, they're amazing together. Yeah, they are amazing together. Ben is this incredible. I mean, all the people we're mentioning are incredible multi instrumentalists really. Ben

45:11is particularly in just the the technical craft of playing a few different instruments. He is like he's a master, right? I mean, you can either have him in your band or have three people. So he like he does the job of three people. Yeah, he's he's he's incredibly talented. He's got a little bit of like savant energy. He's very very gifted like as a bass player. He's just insane. Yeah, he brings as a so I don't know a lot about him as a as a songwriter or Will and Will plays guitar. I'm hope I'm remembering that correctly. Will plays will play guitar like no one I've ever you plays a lot of things you can play piano only play but but his his his extension of his arm like his soul. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, is his guitar. And yeah, so I'm just curious how you know, how did you meet them and and is your writing process with them or do you sort of write more like you in a guitar or piano? It's been different for all of my records. I my first record,

46:15I met them as session musicians. They were hired by Jesse Harris who I was co writing with for my first record just to play in the band. And I've got along with them really well and was really inspired by them. And so then I made my second record with Ben producing and Will and Ben writing. And then Ben gotten this guy involved in Christian Lee Hudson who also now happens to be my boyfriend and the wrote music and played on that on my second record. And now he's produced my third record and Ben and Will have written music and played on it. So I've been kind of like just collecting people and writing styles and adapting and changing in the way it was. And for my first two records, it was very clean cut. I would write poems and send them and they would put music to them and send them back. And then we would kind of see if they fit right and make some little changes. And then

47:17that would be the song. And then on this record, I wrote a lot more music. And it really darted me on a journey that I'm on in a major way right now of becoming a more empowered writer and musician on my own. I think that something I wrote all my own songs and sang until I was like 14, then I stopped playing music for a while. Then I started again. And when I started again, I started working with Ben and Will and Jesse. And they're so good. Like I'm saying, they're so amazing. And at the stage that I was in my own development, when I kind of heard the song being played by them, I was like, I don't need to play. Even if I could play that song, why would I bother? And it kind of wasn't until really I saw the, no, it wasn't until I started realizing that there were people who were playing on stage and writing songs and singing them with chords that I knew. You know, Ben and Will are like jazz trained school of music.

48:22And they did stroke everything. And they play in a way that you can't see yourself doing it. You just do like, no, that's impossible. But then I started to realize that actually there are simpler ways to play the same songs and that I could play along that that wasn't embarrassing. That it was actually inspiring. I saw especially some women artists on stage playing and not just standing there singing and playing chords I knew. And I was like, whoa, that actually even though I know that that person might not be as skilled and instrumentalist as Will, I am inspired by them. And I want to have that effect on the young women who come to see my shows and people who come to see my show primarily on women. And so I want to play guitar. I want to not just write the words to my songs, but write some other music too. And so I've been in a real, I don't know, musical renaissance in my life right now. That's so cool. I want to be mindful of

49:24your time. And so we'll get to the last question. But right before I just wanted to highlight something that I heard you say about music that really struck a chord with me. All right. Yeah. Actually, the other day we were asked what the worst fun we've ever made. That's probably the worst. Okay. Anyway, this really struck me. And I don't really have a question about it. I just want our listeners to hear what you said if they don't go and listen to that other interview. But I was wondering what it does music scratch for Maya that acting doesn't and vice versa. Like what what what do they give her? And you actually answered it in this interview, you said they feel like like music is a place where you learn about yourself. And acting is where you learn about other people that like acting as an empathetic exercise where you like put yourself in the shoes of someone else. But that music is like more introspective maybe. You said it really much more beautifully and succinctly. But I just wanted to highlight that for our listeners.

50:24Is that really struck a chord with me about like just highlighting the differences between those two art forms? I thought that was beautiful. But I think everyone also has their own. I think some people really see acting as a exploration of the self. And you know, and on their music as a character they play. You know, like I know I know people who write that way and think that way. For me, I feel like I'm always a better actor, the better I'm in relationship with myself. Like I think therapy helps with acting. I think music helps with acting because the more you know about yourself, the more you can imagine yourself relating to anybody, which might be a little bit of what I was talking about about seeing too much gray. Is that I find that I can like understand the point of you, even of people who are doing horrible things. Like, you know, and I think that's an important thing about saying is you really have to see your character. You have to see the world from their point of view and not not judge their actions more than they would judge their own actions.

51:28And but then with music, I really feel myself trying to delve into my own thinking and my own processing and getting to know myself better. So I think that the two really service each other in that way. The better you understand the world, the better you understand yourself, the better you understand yourself. Runs the world. I like that. You know, it makes me think that in a certain sense, it depends on which part of the process we're talking about because writing music in my experience has been deeply introspective and I think I agree with what you're saying. But then once you're playing it live and it's been released, it very much becomes a character. Yes, I completely agree with you. I completely agree with you. And you're actually discovering things that you never intend. Well, in some sense, you seem to really intend. But these deeper spiritual truths emerge out of the music when you're playing them for like two years on end, say. And you're like, wow, that's really deep. And I did mean that about myself and what I was going through. But I didn't even understand that then. And I did want to access that part of myself that I have to use to perform this song. And now I have more agency over because I've done it over and over again for a

52:31year. Yeah. And with acting, I wonder if, you know, for me, I sometimes have the most personal reflections after it's over and I'm having to talk about it endlessly and press. Because then I have to connect it to myself. And I'm like, what? I do relate to this. Yeah. And I'm like, yeah, that I do want to kill this journalist right now. That's not fair. I've never had that thought ever in my life. Should I set it more like this up at the end? I never had that idea ever in my life. Okay. So back to you for our last question. If you could go back to 12 year old Maya, is there anything that you would say or do? I feel like I would talk to myself about practicing. And about about about body in a big way. I think I think that happened in my late late teens, early 20s that I wish had happened in my earlier development is my relationship to my body

53:36shifted from one that was about how it looked to about what it can do. And that really happened through physical movement where I was initially only really saw even taking a walk as like a path to burn calories kind of like and as of like and and and and then I started it was really in drama school where I was like, whoa, I think it's fun to be able to do this dance and to be able to do a cartwheel and to be able to be you know on stage and not get tired and to be able to work this long and feel good in my body and to you know, asleep on all kinds of different beds on tour and not being pain and and so both in terms of like practicing guitar, practicing dance, physical exercise, yoga, movement, team sports, like that you it's not about being good, it's about doing it and if you do do it, you do get better and I would try to help my 12-year-old

54:41self understand that when that it's not you're not failing like that in all of these things you apply yourself to even if you feel like you're not as good as the other kids or whatever it doesn't matter do it like you we will I will thank you later um and I think that would be one of the things I would talk about and the other things I could imagine telling myself I it's hard for me to know what the negative ramifications of them would be like if I was like you don't have to worry so much or like wait a little while to have sex or like you know whatever whatever the advice would be I feel like there's a role in which there could be ramifications but I think I'd be like look everything is gonna be okay your wildest dreams are gonna come true and you're not even gonna be that happy about them um like don't worry um you're gonna be disappointed by

55:41everything you could possibly dream of right now and and it'll all be fine we would be really grateful uh you know as a team older self plus younger self if you would um like do some more sports and um and and go to go to your dance class and go to your guitar lesson we'd like to be a little better guitar and we'd like to be a little bit better of a dancer so uh you know practice makes my second to match of yourself as well request and and and and maybe like don't get an isle um yes like I know it seems cool don't do it like just stay with that I love that shock a lot you got that chocolate that little that little fun on keep that shit don't do it don't go um and uh that those might be my my only things that I think would have no negative repercussions those all sound like 12-year-old Maya would would receive them except for the iPhone I think she'd turn around after you left and she'd be like walk into an apple cell phone get an iPhone 12-year-old mile Maya actually wouldn't I was weirdly this is a part of the tree hugging me no cursing

56:44vigilante like when a wifi got installed at my um at my mom's house upstate I cried like I was like this this is the place where my my you know my adults I have all their attention like please don't like please don't bring this force here I like that we have to use a DVD player I like that here and I think I would have been like okay and I would have rode it out of the like future self-set yeah and then we were like 15 and we wanted one um I remember actually even when I was first given one I wasn't that excited about it the whole addiction had to be formed like I yeah I wasn't initially that interested and and then when the addiction was formed now I find it difficult to think about getting rid of it um and I can think of all these practical reasons why I should like the Google maps or um all these in drama like why couldn't live without that and uh but of course people did and I could and so I you know all these reasons why I keep my little addiction to my reels and my background television yeah thank you so much thank you

57:47Maya thank you for coming on thank you you can keep up with Maya Hawks acting and music work online at Maya underscore hawk that's hawk with an e Maya do you remember your first impression of pen it's okay if you don't it's complicated honestly because I am I'm 25 so I didn't get to form a first impression okay my uh my my first impression of pen was as uh was a gossal girl so my great pride and so I uh I I didn't get to form a proper first impression but my first impression was oh this guy is very nice he is quite shy he is uh like I cannot tell if he is completely disinterested in me as me or if he just is minding his own business

58:49in like a really cool way um and uh and that he was a very good actor and a very kind person so I can also tell if he is completely disinterested in that or if he is going to say yeah the only one so I'm trying to figure that out this episode is brought to you by state farm no two football players are exactly alike and the same is true off the field that's why state farm gifts to know you so they can help personalize coverage for your life and budget like a good neighbor state farm is there on any journey using uber it helps to know you're getting into the right car pen verification as an extra step to make sure your ride is your ride before the trip begins your app gives you a unique pin just tell it to your driver and they'll enter it in their app before the ride can start hey what's your pin mm-hmm two five three eight that way you know you're in the right car taking the right trip and your driver knows you're the right passenger make sure your ride is your ride with pen verification from uber one more way uber is putting safety at every turn learn more on the

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