First Responder Mental Health: What a Helicopter Crash Opened Up

0:00Hey Spotify listeners, when you travel with American Airlines you'll enjoy comfort and convenience at every altitude. Before takeoff, unwind in the Admiral's Club lounge, with curated self-serve offerings of hearty bites and refreshments. In flight, stay connected with high-speed Wi-Fi, sponsored by AT&T. Your journey is designed to feel easy from the moment you check in to the moment you arrive. No matter where you're going, American gets you there. But now at AA.com. For 27 years, Jeff has been the guy who runs toward the thing everyone else runs from. Paramedic, flight medic, swap medic, out of Buffalo. He always believed he was built for it, and for a long time he was. Then in April of 2022, a helicopter went down and his friend and pilot Jim was gone. And something in Jeff started to crack open that he couldn't push back down. This is a conversation about what happens when the person who holds everyone else together finally lets himself fall apart. And how learning to ask for help became the thing that put him back together. It just ate at me. What is wrong with me?

1:00Just driving to work. I'm like sobbing or emotional. Shame that I can't control my emotions. Shame that it's affecting me the way it is. Shame that I'm looking at my boys for comfort. I can't do it myself. You're listening to the LifeShift podcast. I'm your host, Matt Gilhoely. This show is built around one simple idea that sometimes a single moment can change how we see everything. Each week I talk with someone about the moment that shifted their life and how they learn to live differently after it. These are not stories about having it all figured out. They are stories about what it looks like to keep going once the story changes. Thank you for being here. Here's today's story. Hello, everyone. Welcome to the LifeShift podcast. I'm here with Jeff. Hello, Jeff. Hey, Matt, how's it going? Thanks for having me. Yeah, of course. It is going well. And for those of you not watching the video, I really like your shirt.

2:01It says shift happens, which I don't know if you plan that. No, it's well, I kind of did, but it's sort of a place I've been that I'll get into later on that kind of helped me along my way. Thanks. Yeah, you know, this journey with the LifeShift has allowed me to hear so many stories and so many stories of things that I listen to. And I'm like, I don't know how anyone can move forward through that. And yet somehow, and I put a caveat to this, if we're lucky enough to be able to do some kind of work or take the next step forward. The human spirit is so resilient. That's somehow so many people, but some people can't find that. And I want to honor that as well, because it is a hard journey when shift happens to you, especially if it's a tragedy or something really hard, which I know yours is a hard moment.

3:02It's amazing just doing the job I do and seeing the things I've seen. And then people always ask, what's the worst thing you've seen? Like my joke, being from Buffalo is people eating their wings with ranch. That's how I used to diffuse it. But typically just, I've seen a lot of great miracles and crazy things happen. And then just good outcomes that follow it as well. So it's not just one side. Yeah. So well, actually, let's find out a little bit more about you before we get deep into your story. But who is Jeff in 2026? How do you show up in the world? How do you identify these days? And however you want to answer that is good with me. So I'm 51 years old. I grew up in the Riverside section of Buffalo, which was a blue collar, rust belt area. But back then it really wasn't rust belt. We went from middle class to poverty and months after my dad lost his job at a couple of mills. And it was a struggle. I mean, I didn't know it that.

4:02And I mean, kids don't know it. But it was a hard work in neighborhood. I watched my dad work two, three jobs my whole life. My mother raised us. The oldest of five. And I also had an uncle that lived with us our whole lives who would be deemed high functioning on my heart these days or uptistic. But he was always there. We had a big family, very close family. After I graduated high school, I wanted to be a military pretty much my whole life and then had a knee injury. No, it was just my grandfather's both dead, both were war two vets. I was always drawn to law enforcement, growing up watching chips. And I did. First I just want to ask you had a big family and a lot of people around you. Was it a good life that you felt as a child? Yeah, I mean, it was crazy. It was crazy, which kind of plays into my career choice. But it was crazy. I mean, five kids, neighborhood kids, my cousins were always over and we were close with my aunts and uncles and it was just a big, big family. But then when I graduated high school, I joined the Air Force and had a knee injury,

5:05which kind of threw me back at the time. And honestly, for 20 years, I didn't realize the effect had on me because I had no backup plan. Came home, killed your children. I needed my ass off. Yeah, hardied my ass off. I mean, it was the early mid, early to late 90s. I just hardied my ass off. Well, I mean, how old were you? Twenty something? Nineteen. Eighteen. I mean, I think the, that's exactly it. It's a blue collar. It's buffalo. That's what we say. It's a, it's a, it's a drinking town with a sports problem. So, I feel like that's what, I mean, the average American at 18 goes to college and that's what they do too. So, that's experience. Military just a bit. When I came home, started moving pianos and furniture and then, like I said, I was always drawn to law enforcement. So I think it was 96 or 97. I went out to Los Angeles and got doing the Indoc process to get hired by the sheriffs. And I just, I hated LA, couldn't live in a big city. Quite different.

6:05And I came back home and got my EMT figure and it might help me get on the job as a police officer and started working in ambulance and that was it. Like I was in it. It became a paramedic within a year and, you know, worked, worked the streets for the east side of Buffalo and the North Towns for 10, almost 11 years. Had a bad knee injury and it was off for a year. And I started writing my stories down. Didn't think anything of it. Just home with nothing to do. No job, you know, couldn't really work. So I just started writing all the absurd stuff and serious stuff that I had seen in the decade I've been doing the job. And then, went back to work and a buddy of mine, one of my old partners was a copper down in Fairfax, Virginia, started contracting. And I rack and he's like, hey, they need medicine, Afghanistan. You want to go? And I was like, yep. So I went and did a contract in Afghanistan. So it was my own little personal redemption in the military. Right. Was it considered part of the military or no, I mean, it was a technically defense contractor,

7:09but it was a department of state contract. Got it. Nothing really bad at all. Yeah. But did it feel, but it did it feel like that redemption? Yeah. And a certain degree, a certain degree. And then came home and got picked up as a SWAT and flight medic and I'm still doing that to this day. So yeah, you see that in 2012. Yeah. And so, yeah, that's me today. And back to me starting right in that book, I picked it up just before Christmas, I found it in an old email. Totally forgot I had it. And it's been, there was a slow winter for flying around here the last couple of years. I finished my book and, you know, the story in August of, or I'm sorry, April, April 26 of 22. We had a helicopter crash. My friend and pilot Jim died. So that kind of messed with me. And I didn't know it at the time. Like, you know, I wrote the book. I named it built for this because I just thought I was built for it the whole time. And when you're young, you don't notice the toll the job takes on you and life.

8:12And then it always takes, it's just one thing that'll put you over the edge. And for me, that was, it was a slow, smoldering decline for me. So I just had to face it eventually. Well, you don't have to, but you chose to. And that's everything. Yeah, well, that's true. You know, I think there's a lot of people that can't face it and worse things can happen. So we thank you for for sharing that and giving us that context. And I'm assuming the, the moment that you just mentioned is probably one of the largest life shift moments for you that kind of triggered a, that was a version of you. But before we get into that, I was curious about when you found that draft before you started writing again, was it fascinating to read and see the younger version of yourself and how you told stories? Yeah, it's funny. You say that, Matt, because I look back and anybody in emergency services will tell you that, you know, they don't, they have calls. They don't remember them. And it's like, I'm reading these stories.

9:13And I'm like, what the hell? Who's my partner that day? And I'm like, laughing. And most of it was absurd and whole areas stuff. Stuff we got away with back, you know, 25 years ago, we would never get away with nowadays. And it was just, it was, it was hilarity and there was a serious stuff that I look back at my younger years and looking, looking at how the serious calls affected me back then and how different I'd approach them now. So it's like, you notice the maturation process and it's evident in front of you at that point in time when you, when you're in retrospect, right? It's, I mean, how to me, I think of that as like such a blessing that you were able to write it down one, but then go back and see that, that growth that, you know, and who you were back then. A lot of us don't have that or we haven't taken the time in the moment back when to be able to then reflect on it years later. Right, right. We discovered it. It's trying to, trying to recollect those calls and it was like, it was profound and it was

10:16hilarious at the same time. But it must have been amazing how much you forget. Yeah. And I must have given you some fuel to want to continue writing and put this together and something that maybe could be valuable to other people. Did you set them to actually make it a book or did you set out to do it for yourself? No, back then it was just, let's write these down. Okay. I actually thought maybe it, you know, my boys were very little at the time. And I was like, ah, maybe when I'm done with the job, I'll read these to them or my grandkids and tell them about the old days on the ambulance, but I never really thought, quite honestly, I never thought I'd make it. I'm on my 27th year this year's in EMS and I never thought I'd last this long. I tried multiple times to leave, but it's kind of like the mob that drags you back in. Well, I mean, the good part of it is that you're helping people and saving lives, doing things that matter to a lot of other people beyond the victim or the person that you're helping. So I think there's, there's a good thing that keeps pulling you back. I'm sorry, it feels like the mob dragging you back.

11:16That's just, that's just the joking. No, I think, I think it's just, I don't know, I think there's something really valuable about being able to see the younger version of yourself in what you were doing. If I, if I equate my own experience to that, when my mom died when I was eight, everyone around me kind of didn't know what to do. So I just assumed that I had to show them I was okay, which meant that I had to show them that I was perfect, which meant if I wasn't perfect, everyone that I loved, everyone else that I loved would also leave because when you're eight, someone dying is like a band-in-mit. Yeah. So it happened with me with my grandfather, I get it. Yeah. And so I assumed, I assumed that role, but at some point, maybe like when I was like 16, I started writing about how I felt about it, which was a long distance in between. And it would, and if I look back now, it was so carefully curated, the things that I wrote to really define a certain emotion that I thought people needed to see for me.

12:18And so as I've now I'm 45 and kind of write about this experience and failing, I agree, for 20 plus years in a different perspective, but it's so interesting to look at those early days and go, wow, I have come a long way. Yeah, exactly. And you're still trying to fit in that box, right? Like I look back and it's like, especially with the writing and it's, I look back at my, I can remember the mentality and what I wanted to be and how I wanted people to perceive me, which was the big point of this book was I always thought I had to fit the certain mold to be, to be who I am in the industry and looked up to and, you know, proficient and, solid to do the job. Yeah. Did you have to be? Did you learn that you didn't quite have to be? Eventually, yeah, I mean, back then, 25 years ago, we didn't, we didn't talk about this stuff. This shit was taboo to talk about. Yeah. You didn't talk about your feelings. Yeah, no. Guys weren't allowed. Major week. Yeah. Nor were kids with dead parents.

13:20Right. Right. Right. Couldn't talk about it. Exactly. Yeah. Well, anyway, I think there is a lot to be said about that and what the expectations we took on from society to show up in the way that we thought everyone needed to see us. And so I'm thinking of you in this career, you're building this career, you're creating friends, co-workers that probably because of the things you're doing, are do they feel like family at some point? Do they? Absolutely. I mean, it's probably the biggest point in the book is what I've realized in retrospect and looking back at this. I've always been blessed with great partners and huge, huge circle of friends, like close with a lot of people that I say it all the time. Like I have an umpteenth list of people that I could call. And they would they would show up at the drop of a hat. I mean, that's that's the value of this job or anyone that you know, it's done that in combat. Anyone in the military will tell you that it's not so much about doing the job.

14:23It's about the people around you. Professional athletes will tell you that law enforcement, firefighters. It's all about the person next to you. And do you find that this is very ignorant of me asking this, but is in those relationships, do you find you can fully share or is it still okay? No, nowadays absolutely. Okay. So it's not like, oh, I'm look how tough I am, but you could be vulnerable and it would be okay. Yeah. The shift and actually when I started opening up after our our Suttonal event, people people were coming up to me and they're like, like, I really appreciate a guy of your tenure talking about this and your experience talking about this because people need to hear from guys like you and it was like, you know, I just kind of blew it off at first and I was like, are they just blown smoke or what? But I've heard it time and time again. Yeah. You think of those younger people and that's where it starts where you start bottling all that up and how healthy is that? You know, it's not.

15:26These are all very difficult questions. Really, you know, I, because you and I have found the space where, you know, like we can probably show up more ourselves than we ever did earlier in our careers. And the really endearing thing and optimistic thing is the younger generation they're in tune with their feelings and they're okay saying it and talking about it and going that extra step to make sure that they're taking care of. And you know, today's society we always say the younger generation is a lot different whatever adjective you want to hand it to them, but I give them a lot of credit because they prioritize themselves to a certain degree where guys of our generation like you worked yourself silly, you paid your bills, you did what you had to do and you moved on where we didn't realize the cost that it took from us as well. No, we just followed the checklist and we thought the next check on the list was going to be the one that made us happy and it wasn't. And the next deposit, the next vehicle, whatever it is, the next beer. Yep. And now none of it does.

16:28And you're right now, they're a lot, I mean, they're not necessarily selfish. They just put themselves first in a lot of situations to take care of themselves, which I think is admirable. And I kind of think that absolutely the younger version of myself, I'm like, damn, which I could have done that. Yeah. What did I take care of myself instead of going out and getting hammered overnight? Yeah. So my question about this kind of feeling like family was leading up to this this pivotal moment that kind of triggered the rest of what comes. Was this individual very, you said you were partners, right? Yeah. And so you were pretty close. Yeah. I mean, he was my normal Tuesday, Thursday partner. Every other Tuesday, there's a pliates to a seven day on seven day off rotation where we do a two week, hit we call it a hitch or rotation. Yeah. And so we rotate through pilots, but Jim was, Jim was just one of a kind. Nobody did not work him. And was this situation or this shift where the actual work shift was this one that you were supposed

17:31to be part of or? Oh, yeah. I was there. You were with him. Okay. Yeah. They went, they went and did a train, they went and did a training flight. My partner, Joy and I had a respond in another helicopter to the scene. Okay. So you were part of this. Yeah. In a way. Yeah. And so was that so was our right. And so was our ground units. One of my oldest friends that I went to medics school was the first medic on scene. And so I mean, it was it hit all of us. It affected the whole company, the whole area. Because I mean, you know, we work with the fire department. We work with the Sheriff's Department, the police departments. You know, we work with everybody. You know, everybody knew him. Yeah. So for you, when this happens, do you go into work mode? Do you break down? We're like, what is Jeff do? When this happens? So I mean, there was nothing we could do. So we had to return. Obviously, helicopters falling out of the sky or fatal. We just returned and I'm the base manager. So people just started showing up.

18:33And I was just like, I got to be there for my people. I got to be there for my people. And I carried this on all day, exhaustingly stayed there. And then you know, went home and broke down in my wife's arms. And then we had to do a stress debrief at work two days later. And you know, the the anger, like for me, it was anger that that set in. But and I've learned anger is the mass that fear and shame where. And I wore it. I didn't work for a year and a half. Oh, really? Yeah, it was it was a slow, like I said, it was a slow burn of just festering anger. Could you point that anger? Like was it like what were you? It's multifaceted. A was anger. My friend was dead. You have no answers on how you don't get it. It's not like a car crash where you know, Billy Bob ran the red light and we know how this accident happened. Wait for two years, we didn't know how this accident happened. Oh, wow. So that's frustrating. So that was, you know, and then, you know, there's then you got to have to deal with like the family like our families.

19:36I don't see that our families, you know, worrying about us, worrying about each other. The co-workers worrying about each other, but the pinpoint it. The anger, obviously, other than the accident was just internal at myself and why am I falling apart the way I am. And like I don't crack. Like that's what that's my job and that's pretty much what I explained through most of the book. And it just it just aid it me like what is wrong with me just driving to work. I'm like sobbing or you know, just just emotional. It's an unnecessary shame, but shame nonetheless. Right. Shame that I can't control my emotions. Shame that it's affecting me the way it is. Shame that I'm looking to my boys for comfort. I can't do it myself. You know, shame that I'm drinking my, I went right back to drinking. I mean, I never really stopped. It's, be honest here. I just, I drank and I drank and I drank and I should have helped. No, no. It wasn't a party and the sad part was I owned a bar at the time.

20:38So it made it even easier. And you know, my best friend and I owned a bar. Just I'm in a bar. I could drink. I could mask it. And if I wasn't working, you know, I was drinking and still operating still still being the flight medic, being, you know, being a paramedic and the dad and a husband. And it just you try masking and into you can't no matter what you do. A little bit. But that's about it. Yeah. And that was a, and that was like, like Jim's death. Yeah, was a catalyst, but as I got help and moved on and learned, it was more than just that. It was the jobs and a few months after the crash, I had taken a nasty call and for like, I couldn't get out of bed for three days. I look at the house wrong with you, dude. Like get your ass out of bed. Like, it's your job. He chose this. He's what you signed up for. Let's go. Let's medic up and you got cracked open with the list of Jim and. And then and then call start. Call started. Old call started popping up in my head.

21:38Things I have been thought of in years started resurfacing. And you know, once you get therapy and you start learning how your mind actually acts and your body actually acts with stress and and trauma and. And all the the facets of life that we don't really process at the time or know how to process. I mean, what we just push it down. The feelings down or we compartmentalize and I can imagine someone in your job. You see such terrible, horrible things that you wouldn't want to carry with you. So I'm sure there was some compartmentalizing. And oh, yeah, we're built. That's what we're built to do. We're taught to do it. But then you go to therapy and everything floods out and you're like, whoa, whoa. And even even finding I got to the point, Matt, where I was so desperate for help. Like I didn't know what to do. And I just wanted a therapist and finding a therapist is like finding a mate. It's not cookie cutter. And I'd sit in front of a couple and if they just didn't understand my job or what we see

22:41and what we do, it's like I couldn't connect. And until I found my therapist Denise, I mean, she was a lifesaver. I mean, she dealt with combat stress in the military and she deals with law enforcement and you know, first responders and understood like she, she got me within 30 seconds. Like just talking to her like she just knew and I could open up to her and actually she could understand what I was saying instead of just saying, but that's okay. And again, like their professional and compassionate and great people, they just, they didn't get it. Yeah. No, I think that's a really important thing for people that haven't sought out therapy just yet is that it is a journey. It is something where, I mean, you might get lucky and the first person you meet is someone that feels right, but I would bet that most people have to try a few different therapists to really find the one that works. Like for me, it was five. I went through five people and the one that finally helped me,

23:45if you were to like be like, look at her on paper, you'd be like, that is not someone that Matt is gonna, that's not gonna work. And that's exactly what I needed because she cut through whatever things I needed her to cut through for me to like get it. And I think, I think funny enough for me, it was like less coddling. Like there were the earlier ones were more soft. And she was just like, are you gonna die? Like, you know, whatever I was worried about. And I was like, well, no, but no, you know, so it was really, you know, it's really helpful, but I think it's really important to tell people that it's not a, you know, like you said, it's not cookie cutter kind of thing. It's not like looking on the internet and you pick one and it's gonna be sunshine and rainbows after that. You might have to choose a few to find the one that feels right for you and that understands your particular circumstances in the way that you need them to. And I think you kind of referenced the deliver the message to the way you need,

24:47not the way her previous client or their previous client or client two hours from now, can needs it delivered. Everybody's different. Yeah. Yeah. No, so good for you for continuing on. And I can imagine with all that stuff that you probably had pushed down, did you want to quit when things started flowing back up or deep where you like, I just mean it so bad. At that point, I was so desperate. Like I was, I was so tired of spending my wheels. I wasn't sleeping. The nightmares were terrible. My wife's like, you wake up screaming and just, I'd have panic attacks. Like we have a place in Kabul. She'd be sleeping. I'd be pacing. It just, it was terrible. I wouldn't wish it on my worst enemy. In all the years, you know, taking people that call 911 for panic attacks, you know, we're like, yeah, come on, man. Like you said, are you dying? No. You know, it's just kind of, I don't want to say apathetic, but it just routine run of the milk call. But now it's like, I don't wish it on my worst enemy. Yeah. I know I'm jumping here, but

25:49does all what you were going like all that experience of the nightmares, the panic attacks, the things like that. Does it make you better at your job now that you can understand it? Or does it make it harder because you're more empathetic? Yeah, because no, it makes it easier. Doing this job is a lot easier when you have empathy because you don't have any biases when you're empathetic or minimal biases. When I first started in the business, I always had a soft spot. Again, I'm 51. So I started in the late 90s, early 2000s. You know, you still had a good, good amount of homeless Vietnam vets. And I always had a soft spot for Vietnam vets. I mean, my family, my uncles were Vietnam vets. So like, it was always different. It wasn't like dealing with the typical homelessness issue. I mean, because quite honestly, Matt, like people will call 911 for the stupidest reasons, because they need to ride downtown or they just don't want to be where they are. And that's frustrating when you're working in a system that's just nonstop.

26:49And it taxes you. And we found that out to COVID too. How you can have empathy, fatigue or compassion, fatigue. It is real. And when you have true empathy, it makes the job worth it too. That's the other part of it. There's the rewarding part of it. So yeah, I didn't find it to be a hindrance on my job or all I did my job. Yeah, I would, I don't know. Like I could see how having that empathy would make it harder too. Just because you want to spend more time with this person doing this. And then you know, you got to rush. Or it stops you from doing your job. I mean, a lot of stuff we see and do, you can't stop and think. You just have to react and treat. And then pivot again and treat again. You can't do it. I've seen it. We've anybody with any time in this business have seen the new hires or the students come through that just freeze. And they're just, they're just not, they just can't do the job.

27:50And there's nothing wrong with that because it takes a lot of self-control and awareness to be able to function in those environments. And not to spend out of control. Look at where we call it the pucker factor. Like everyone's going to have the pucker factor. You have to have the pucker factor, but you can't stay in the pucker factor. You have to move on from it. Yeah. A lot of what you're saying is very reminiscent of growing up. My grandfather was, well, he first he was in the Navy. And then his, what his career was after that was a firefighter. And he did it for 35 plus years. So like pretty much all of my life, I knew him as a firefighter until, you know, and obviously until he had to retire because he was too old for it. And all the stories he would tell and the documentation that he would do and the books he would write and the things about, all the things you're talking about, about the family nature of the people you're working with, about the stories and the wild things that you guys did. And probably wouldn't get away with these days. I can imagine.

28:52Yeah. And the crazy, you know, fires and helping people and all the things that come along with his life. And it sounds, it's very reminiscent of, you know, what he would share with me, what you're saying right now. And I can imagine. Mirrors it. Mirrors it. But. Mirrors it. But his generation. He never he pushed everything down and it was blocked, right? Like he was never going to release any of that. Whereas you now were kind of forced to, right? Because something so major that you couldn't push down, cracked you open. How long was that period from when the accident occurred to when you, like we're like, I have to find help. So it was just over a year. Okay. I, we had actually dedicated the new air, the replacement aircraft to Jim. And I gave the speech. Jim son Josh and I had gone out after. And I was actually referred to by my buddy Rich,

29:52who brought me over to Afghanistan, who hooked me up with that gig. He kept saying, can I hold it in his Boulder Crest place? Can I hold a Boulder Crest? And I'm like, ah, whatever. It's a place for combat vets and first responders. It's a retreat, PTSD retreat. I'm like, ah, I don't need this. I don't need this. And I finally did. I was like, you know what? You know, I had been back and forth with a good friend, SE on this stuff. And Rich and SE were really my two signing boards along this whole path here. And Rich was just like, do it. And I did it. So I went away to the Poke Nose. So the day we were, sorry, I digressed, the day we dedicated that ship to Jim, Josh and I were out and I got a call from Boulder Crest. And they were like, hey, can you be in North East Pennsylvania tomorrow morning? So I'd call my boss. So and I went and it was a week long and that was like the first treatment I had. And it didn't fix anything, but it made me a lot, made me aware of a lot of stuff. I wasn't paying attention to like how my behavior and how the shift and my mentality and everything that I was going through was affecting everyone around me.

30:56But that was, it was that. But it just kind of made me cognizant, but it didn't fix anything. And then a year later, almost a year later, I had just hit my breaking point because I was still drinking. And it's still just running ragged. And again, I had owned a bar at a time. I was still a full-time flight medic. I had three teenage boys that I was ferrying back and forth to football and lacrosse. And whenever school stuff they had, and going and showing up and, you know, the act of social life doing stuff with my wife. And they're just running. I just I was burning the candle at both ends and drinking. And that every time I wasn't at work. I just couldn't take it anymore. And then I had I had a pretty bad panic attack at last days. And I called Rich. And Rich was like, let me see if I can get you in a mic there, or a person. Once I started with Denise, probably two, just over two years later, was when it really started. Once I started therapy, I got on the path I'm on, the healing path I'm on. Yeah, which was not quick, I'm sure.

31:57No, no. And it, you know, it took, it took months. But I could tell you this after the first, first couple, was I started going like every day or every week. And after each appointment, I felt better and better. An EMDR was a big, big portion of it as well. Like it, we all joke. It's just how it's like, voodoo magic. And it feels like voodoo magic. But I actually was able to sleep, which I wasn't able to do. Probably felt like a different person after a while. Yeah. And like at Boulder Cross, when I was at Boulder Cross, it taught us transcendental meditation and breath work. And that, that, like that's what really has helped me. I still do it daily, meditation and breath work. And then the therapy on top of it, you know, covering two years, just over two years after, after the crash. Could you imagine like 15 year ago, Jeff talking about transcendental meditation and breath, breath work? And I mean, even just the general public wasn't really talking about that back then.

32:59And now it seems to be way more mainstream. And people are not, I think back then, it would have been, oh, I don't want to tell anyone, because people are going to think, um, this or that. Not. Yeah. And now it's like, you're not. Yeah. And now it's like, this worked for me. And if it doesn't work for me, for you, cool, but it worked for me. And I believe in it. And I'm going to do it. And I think there's been a societal shift. I think so. And in medicine, and I think COVID accelerated that. Yeah. You know, yeah. And people, you know, with with the internet and the flow of information, albeit good or bad, truthful or not truthful, it's still out there. And if you find something that works for you and it don't harm anybody else, hey, all the power to you, bro. Yeah. More sister. During this experience of the hard part, before you sought out help, if you talk to your wife or your kids now, would they say that it was affecting them or were you to them showing up as a normal? No, they. Everyone around me knew I was full of shit.

33:59OK. I mean, I thought I thought I was covering it up at work. And I talked to one of my buddies, Jim, and one of my partners there. And he's like, yeah, dude, we knew it was obvious. And I'm like, no, do you guys set anything to me? Like, you couldn't say something. And then like, that was part of the anger too, was like, like, it felt like nobody wanted to sit in the moment and realize immediately, like, Jim's dead, dude. Like, you guys are just moving on. Like, nothing's happened. And like, I kept wanting to build memorials and stuff. But then I wouldn't talk about it. And I'm like, none of you guys could drag me aside and say, hey, get your shit together. Would you have accepted that? Yeah. Yeah. Well, yeah, for my coworkers, yeah. OK. I think some people are afraid. Well, one, we're not taught how to confront, not confront, but talk to others about our caring nature. And we're worried about people because we always think we have to have the solution. And so therefore, we just don't talk about it. Right. In the air industry is different. Because we debrief every flyer. To me, I looked at it like that.

35:00I was like, why didn't you guys just debrief with me? You're walking around the base like a Grinch. Are you OK? And I could talk to a couple of people about it or two pilots and then joy, my partner that day. And we joke we're trauma bonded. But just, but that was my own symptomology taking being the symptomology that it was. I wasn't in the right state of mind. And if I was angry, I mean, look at me. I'm sure that I'm not very approachable. I don't look approachable. So I looked back and I was like, man, that's the other part, too. Like you look back and you have that debrief mindset. You're like, that's a point where I think I could have pivoted and bent on a better path. Just change my heading. Just a degree or two to get me out of that crummy path. Right. And then it snowballs into, well, you should have done it yourself, jerk off. You should have been strong enough to do it yourself. Yep. It's just snowballs. Yeah, it's a beautiful game that our head plays with us to make.

36:03Most dangerous place in the world is the eight inches between our ears. Well, and I do say that often that, you know, I encourage people to say things out loud or write it down or something because it's much scarier in my head when I'm worried about something or panicking about something. If I say it out loud or tell somebody, I'm like, well, one, it's out of my head. And two, seems much more palatable. Like I feel like I could, you know, I could handle it now. Yep. Quantum physics will tell you the minute you acknowledge something. It changes, it changes right then and there. What would you end up in? It sounds like this journey has really changed you, though. Oh, totally. What's the biggest difference? I think it's just taking life as it comes. You can't hold too tight on anything. You can't get too high. You can't get too low. We all, and you talk about the thoughts in your head. How many, how many conversations have you had in your head that never, ever, ever, ever came to be? And that's like 95, 99% of them, right? Like we create these worlds in our head, thinking we have to know how to handle it

37:04or know how to manage an outcome. And they're just, it's frivolous. It's just wasting energy. I heard this, I can't remember what it was from. I think it was a movie, but it says, it's kind of like a rocking chair. It gives you something to do, but it gets you nowhere. Like, what are you going to do? You're going to sit there and perseverate over it and steal the moment. And I think that's, I answer your question, Matt. That's a big one that I have really, really, really tried to do is just live in the moment and not try to live in the past. And I'll pass this for, the past is for reference, not residents. And you can't predict the future. So it's like those conversations you're never going to have. Why, why put too much energy into it? The way you say it, it sounds so easy. It's not really right. It's really hard to handle. No, it is a struggle. Like, I just think about trying to be in the moment. I remember one day after I started thinking about, I got back from Boulder Cress, and I'm like, I have chickens. And I'm like, just watch the chickens stupid. And I just sat there and watch the chickens.

38:05It started like snowball, that started snowball. Like, I catch myself getting spun up. I just watch the leaves or find one thing to focus on. And it literally works. And then you, I incorporate breath work into it and slow, deep belly breathing. And it just, it changes. And the physiology, there's no arguing. It changes the physiology, too. And restructuring your neural pathways. And there's so much science behind all of what I'm saying. I can't reference it because I'm not that bright. But I've seen countless studies, countless studies of all this neural science. And it's so readily available. Now, if you want to, if anyone wants to take the time, just Google it or chat GPT, it'll pop right up. And it's amazing. And knowing physiology the way us in the industry know it, like it's easier to grasp. And for me, you know, the weird one is the counter to this is I wanted to try and do a half iron man before COVID. And I started swimming. I'm not a swimmer.

39:05And it's funny because I'm trying to build the endurance and I'm swimming. I'm getting out of breath. But in my head, I'm like, I know the physiology. Like, I'm not exhaling enough. I'm hypercarbic. Like, I'm not trying to breathe too fast. And so I know the physiology. And it just sunk my ship. So it's a double-edged sword. Yeah. Do you find now in this newer headspace, maybe a clearer headspace? Are your relationships different now at work or at home or with your children? Yeah. I don't have time for frivolous stuff. Like, I don't have time for, I mean, I always wanted to be the guy that everybody would like to laugh with. I try to make everyone laugh. I'm the jokester. Now, I don't need those meaningless relationships or the frivolous relationships. I want a connection with everybody that keep your circle small. But at the same toll, treat everyone like a human being and make the strangers day. The random acts of kindness, you still got to do that stuff because it actually benefits you.

40:05Yeah. I would say that it benefits you more than it probably helps the other person. Yeah. They might not receive it. But at least you know you held the door for the guy who looked like he was having a crappy day. Yeah. Yeah. And then also, you're also living this professional life in which you are required to help people in a way. And is it more meaningful for you? You said yes through the empathy part. But does it feel like you're being forced to do it? Are you still enjoying it? No. Good. I like to think. I like to think that I'm still the medic I was. I always was. I never cared about awards or anything like that. As long as people said, hey, if I have it's the guy there, that's why I want to be my family. That's enough of an award for me. But the job's the job. And I think that's the other thing is giving the job too much power over you. It's a stressful dynamic environment at baseline. It's the getting too high, getting too low, getting too upset about certain things.

41:07The health care system's terrible. The 911 systems terrible post COVID, post 9-11. It's just been a rocky career. And people don't take care of themselves as much. We sure should. I can tell you we sure should don't. Because especially in EMS, the pay was always so bad for decades and decades. I mean, now it's good. But after COVID, we were running ragged, man. And it's sped up for a lot of people. A lot of people left medicine. Doctors, nurses, EMS still happening. It is. And it's a system based on money, not compassion and treatment. The downfall of that is you lose the humanity and the compassion. And that takes away from the benefit of the job. Yeah. So in your book, did it pivot when all this started happening?

42:08Or did you finish the book before all this happened? Oh, no. I started and I'm like, I have to finish this now. Once I started healing, I literally found this in December. And I just published it in July. So again, we had a lot of downtime. And after I was done doing my administrative stuff. And if I wasn't taking a call, I was right in our come home. And I'd write for six, seven hours and just knocked it out. I was like consumed with finishing that book. But that was the whole purpose of it. I was like, oh, here's my funny stories. Here's the first half of my career. Now, here's the chunk of my career where the biggest change and the biggest growth happened. And if it weren't for the people that helped me and let me know it was OK to ask for help, what could am I doing with the gift I got if I don't share it? Yeah. And anyone that seeks therapy, they'll tell you journaling is one of the number one things they will tell you to start with. Whether you show it to another soul or not. Get it out of your head. Yeah. It helps you process things.

43:10The response I've gotten from people with decades in the industry, nurses. I had an acquaintance that actually mailed me a letter, a very heartfelt letter. And this person lost two sons, one to suicide, and one in Iraq. And when this person told me that they read my book and how it changed for them and their suicidal ideation, it was like, if I had any doubt that I was put myself out there, because look, it's not easy to put yourself out there either. I do it. I was like, yep. Good, good. I give you all the credit in the world, because it takes a lot. It takes a lot. To do it. It takes balls to do it. You're exposing yourself in this day and age. Anyone can attack you online, right? But good for you, man. I'm proud of you. I get it. I get it. When you arrived, I know you said kind of alluded to this with the therapy and the journaling.

44:11But as you were writing this book, in this while you're in this healing journey, did you find that it helped you heal more and put things together? Just putting it on paper helps. Or in a word document, but it still helps. And even just when you're piecing it together and you're connecting the dots, like something else would pop in my head. And I'd always forget to make a note in my phone for it, because it was always when I was driving. Like, oh, I got to add this. You find another lesson or another piece of information that you think might help somebody. Or you realized it helped you, but didn't know it at the time. And it was like a waterfall of lessons and good vibes. And there was hurt there. There was definitely hurt there. But I could process it because I was doing something constructive with it. Yeah. Well, and to your point, commendable to put it out there and publish it and share it and stand behind it

45:11and be like, this is me, like, flaws and all. And that makes me a full human. Yeah. I'm not the pillar I thought I was. Nor did you have to be. Right. Right. That's the acceptance right there. The self acceptance. And I think that's the big one. I don't care whether it's some medic like me or a cop or whoever or a school lunch worker. The self acceptance is the barrier. That's Mr. Gorbachev bringing down that, what take down that wall. That's the wall that has to come down. Yeah. Well, we're not taught to do that. Or we weren't like we were saying the younger generation. Are you seeing your kids more accepting of who they are and finding that as they grow up? Yeah. Well, I've always, I've always encouraged them to just be who they are. It doesn't matter. I will love them no matter what. You know, as an internship. And I've tried to prepare them for the world. And look, my daughter, my stepdaughter and my three boys, especially my three boys, they're like my best friends.

46:14And I didn't want to just be their friend. I wanted to prepare them for the world. And I've shown them pictures from my job that most people would cringe at. And I was, I hope I did a good job because I prepared them. Because you don't know what you don't know. And I've always told them that like guys, you don't be telling people I'm showing you this stuff. But this is what happens when you text and drive. Or this is what happens when you play with a gun. This is what happens when you're speeding. Like when I was a kid, yeah, don't drink and drive. Why? Because I said so. Oh, okay. You also told me not to cook when you weren't home either. You know, so if you don't know the consequences, or have a grasp of the consequences. Yeah. And within that, I was always like, just be yourself. But be yourself and do it safely. Well, fair. Yeah, I think we should all do that. We should all take that advice. Not just here. Here too. Because I look back and when I say be myself, like I wanted to go out and drink 12 beers and get on a four wheeler. You know, the stupid stuff that young boys do.

47:16Young men do. Yeah. We are long list. We are long list of dumb things. Yeah. Yep. And somehow so many of us make it through those dumb things. And then we'll never do them again because they were really dumb. They either cost us a lot of money or a lot of hurt. Yeah, exactly. What would you, 2026, Jeff? Is there anything you would want to tell Jeff that day when you went home after that accident? Anything you want to tell him? It's like a sex accident, after losing your friend in that accident. Oh. Yeah, just that it's going to be okay because for the longest time I didn't know whether it was going to be okay. I didn't know where I was going to end up because I had no grasp on myself, let alone anything going on around me because there was just such a whirlwind of like, and I'm used to to survive in and taking care of myself. I'm a very independent as a young guy. Just that guy that never asked for help. Now, I think the other one is the other point to this

48:16that I would say is it's okay to ask for help. That's all point of the book. Yeah, in fact, it might be better to ask for help. Yeah, well, it absolutely would. You know, I think we can't do it all. We're just one person. No, you know, like you can't do your thing. Take it as far as you can take it, but when we said it, you know, when that rock sack is too full, hey, hand some stuff off and let somebody else carry it or at least show you how to carry it easier. Exactly. And even if we think about your healing journey, like, I mean, you could have read a bunch of stuff, but there are people that know these modalities and things that could have helped you way better than you would have figured out on your own. So why not ask for help? Oh, yeah. I mean, I didn't wake up one day and figure out how to become a paramedic. Like I was taught. Like I wasn't insane for us. You're right. I didn't just wake up one day and be like, I gotta get five milligrams of versatile for a seizure. Oh, I had to be taught it. Yeah. Well, you know, I think it, I think it, it's funny

49:17because we, most of us go to school, right? Like we most of us go to kindergarten through 12th and we learn yet for some reason, we then still think we need to figure it out all along our own. Yep. And that's the human spirit to a certain degree, but the human spirit sometimes is dumb. Yeah. Well, I think it's great that you, unfortunately, this event brought you to it, but I think it's great that you found this version of yourself and you can show up a little differently. I'm sure you're still the same in a lot of ways, but you can show up in the world and your profession and your family life as this like more you than maybe you have ever been. Absolutely. You articulated that perfectly. I feel more alive than I ever have. More in touch, more in tuned. Again, you remove alcohol, excessive alcohol. I mean, I'm not, I don't, I still like to drink my beer. I'm a bills fan for God's sake. But when you're not depending on substances

50:19to dull the edges or escape anything like you more in tune, then you know, a lot of anyone that'll tell you that that's gotten sober is like the first thing they notice is the clarity. And for me, it's a clarity in the connection that I can pick out or connections that I can't pick out and won't even try to pick out. That's the other one. I'm not going to try to force a relationship that just doesn't feel right and it's not working my energy. Yeah, yeah, it's just, it's amazing. It's amazing when you actually dedicate time to yourself, how good you can be for yourself. Yeah. And it's also lighter, in my opinion, it feels like it's really heavy to carry the masks and the things you think that other people need to see from you. It's probably a lot lighter to set battle inside your head. When you're fighting yourself constantly, it's like a giant MMA ring with yourself in between your ears and it's exhausting. It's exhausting. Yeah, well, welcome to this new version of yourself. I'm glad that you're out here.

51:20Sharing the vulnerability, I think we need to see more of that because the end of the day, we're all just humans trying to do the best we can. And the more we learn, the more other people can see how we're operating or we can see how they're operating. And that's how we build community. That's how we build connection is like being ourselves and being as much as we can with each other. And that doesn't mean showing up as a perfect specimen of a human because that doesn't exist. No, and I think at the end of the day, when you remove all the barriers, you remove all the expectations and you sit down, you have conversation with somebody no matter what race color or credo you have more in common, then you don't. Totally. And it's happened consistently. And the day and age we live in, we're they're monopolizing and trying to use our own attention against each other. It's even tougher now than it was when we were growing up or before our generation. Yeah.

52:20Well, I mean, you see the literal similarities between humans. We all bleed the same. Like our bones break. Like your doesn't matter what we're doing. I say to my mother all the time, I've seen countless people, I've seen countless people of every race color and credo and we all die the same. Yeah, which is really great way to end this conversation. Thanks for that. Yeah. If people are looking like they want to connect with you, they want to share their story with you, they want to read your book, they like what's the best way to find Jeff these days? The book is built for this paramedics reckoning. It's available on Amazon. I'm trying to get the, again, I'm just a stupid medic. So putting the Kindle version out is this forthcoming. Yeah. Yeah, I know. Like I should have done that when I was proofreading it. I had a bunch of people proofread it. But my son comes and was like, Dad, you should have used Claude. I'm like, who's Claude? Who's Claude, buddy?

53:21One of your kids put that Kindle version together. Good idea. Thank you. Make them earn their keep. It's on Amazon by Jeff Abbott, built for this paramedics reckoning. And if you want to get in touch with me, Jeff at paramedicabit.com. All right. We'll put those, that information in the show notes so people can reach out and we'll try to mask it so people don't just find your email address and send you a bunch of emails. Oh, great. I ask for that contact piece because I think you know this. There are people out there that feel very alone in how they're feeling or they feel like nothing's ever going to be OK. And maybe they hear your story and now they feel like they're not alone or they feel like something could be OK. And that's what I'm finding. And I only released this book, July 26th. And the response I've gotten from my cohort in the Western New York area from between Rochester and Buffalo, and maybe a couple spots down south, where I have connections, personal connections, and former coworkers has just been amazing. And you know, if this isn't just for first responders,

54:23if you have a family over first responder, you're just curious about, you know, EMS or whatever. But this is basically, it's just a human story. You can interject any stupid story that I put in there with your kids, anybody, or the drunk neighbor. It doesn't matter, but the feelings are universal. Everybody's going through it. It isn't exclusive to first responders in the military. It's a human problem. Yeah. And it's a human solution and a human connection. It's all of those things. And I agree with you. It's funny. I'll hear so many different stories on this podcast. And be like, that's nothing like my story, yet the feelings and the emotions and the things in between. Absolutely. I don't feel the same. Because again, different circumstances, same kind of experience as being a human. So I appreciate you going on this journey, wherever this conversation wanted to go.

55:23I think that was a beautiful way to do this. I think we need more of that. And I thank you. I thank you for taking the time to talk to me and listening to my story and pushing it out there and making accessible to other people. I think what you do is great. I went through a couple of your podcasts just to see what you were about. And you're a dude right up my alley that is just being genuine goes a long way in this world. And we overlooked that. Because we're always looking for the falsities that were sold. Genuineness is something that can't be replaced. I commend you for that. I appreciate that. It took a long while. Just like it took you a while to get to where you are. And now I'm unapologetically myself. And you know what? If people don't like it, they don't have to associate with me. And here we go. Well, I appreciate you. I appreciate everyone listening. I do encourage you to reach out to Jeff if something that he said or part of his story resonated with you or you want to share a little bit of yours.

56:23I know the power in letting that out for the first time. So I highly encourage you to do that. And I know Jeff would welcome that. So with that, I'm going to say goodbye. And I'll be back in a couple of days with a brand new episode. Thanks again, Jeff. Thanks, Matt. Thank you for listening to the LifeShift podcast. If you want to learn more, go to www.thelifeShiftpodcast.com. There you can check out all the different episodes. You can check out the blog, some of the reviews for the podcast and the LifeShift Journal. Links are there so you can purchase your own copy, whether in digital or print format. Thanks again.