Ep 50 - Trash the Trophies: What Dance Competition Gets Wrong and What to Do Instead with Chasta Hamilton

0:00Welcome to In The Spotlight, raising leaders in the performing arts. We're diving deep into the transformative world of performing arts education. Each week we'll chat with industry experts from seasoned educators to acclaimed artists who are passionate about nurturing responsible young leaders through the power of performing arts training. Whether you're a parent, teacher, or aspiring artist, you'll discover actionable insights and inspiring stories that highlight how the arts can shape character, boost confidence, and cultivate leadership skills. Together, we'll explore innovative techniques, share valuable resources, and celebrate the incredible impact of the arts in developing leaders of tomorrow. Get ready to shine a light on the incredible journey of raising leaders in the performing arts. Let's get started. Welcome to In The Spotlight, raising leaders in the performing arts. I'm Robyn Snyder-Winsek, and today's guest is someone who truly embodies resilience, creativity, and bold leadership.

1:03Orphan Desa Child, Chastahymlton, found comfort and catharsis in the performing arts, discovering early on the power of movement, expression, and imagination to transform not just a moment but a life. That foundation led her to become an arts entrepreneur and changemaker who believes every person has the power to reach their fullest potential and disrupt the status quo in empowering meaningful ways. Through entrepreneurship, writing, corporate counseling, and motivational speaking, Chastah challenges individuals and organizations to rethink success, embrace optimism, and handle life's inevitable obstacles with intention. She is the founder and CEO of Stage Door Dance Productions, the founder and president of the nonprofit Girls Geared for Greatness, which is currently evolving into a think tank model. She's also a best-selling author of Trash the Trophies, handle the horrible, and the children's book The Trophy Trap,

2:06and the speaker behind the TEDx talk you weren't built to break. A true Renaissance woman and thought leader, Chastah lives in Raleigh, North Carolina, with her husband, John, their son, Bash, and their Scottish Terrier, Elvis. Please welcome Chastahymlton. Thank you, Robyn. That was such a lovely intro. I'm so happy to be here with you today. Me too. I was on a walk with my husband this morning and I was telling him what I had scheduled for the day. And he was like, Chastah, I don't think I know her yet. And I said, I was trying to remember when we met. And I think it was, I had brought my dancers to New York City for their company elite trip. And I snuck away because I had teachers who were shabbrowning them. I snuck away because you were doing a dance exec. I don't know what you called it. It was like a little pop-up session. Yeah, it was quite... 15. Okay, that's the year. 11 years ago. We've been friends 11 years. And I've been watching.

3:06You have been a beacon of inspiration for me. I was just telling my husband this morning that you came to this seminar and that I was so inspired by you that I've continued to follow you for the last 11 years. And we catch up every so often. And it's always so wonderful. And I just, I love being in an industry that stands in solidarity with other business leaders like you. Oh, well, thank you. That's so kind of you to say. So we are a mutual admiration society. And we, but we haven't spent a whole lot of time like in person together. So maybe one day we will change that. Or we'll come visit me and we'll sit on the line and talk like girlfriends. It would be amazing. But today I'm honored to have you on my podcast. Why don't you tell our listeners a little bit about who you are in the performing arts world and we'll just go from there? Yeah. So I am so blessed to be a part of this performing arts world. And I started when I was two. My mom enrolled me in dance classes right after the unexpected death

4:07of my father in a truck accident where before I turned two, dance was always something that was so special for me. My mom was diagnosed with breast cancer when I was six. And she passed away when I was nine. So dance was really this stabilizing force. And I think that gives me kind of a unique lens of like what it can really do for a child, a child that is experiencing change or frustration or systemic instability, all of these things that happen. Dance was always what was there for me. And then I received a full academic scholarship to college where I wasn't sure dance was like a scholarly thing to do. So I thought for a short spurt of time that I was going to be an attorney. And then I did an internship with the North Carolina Attorney General where I spent the whole summer researching why a student federal should be behind the counter because we were in such a meth epidemic. And I realized I hated it so much and there was no way that is what I was not meant to sit at a desk for eight to 10 hours a day. I like to be up and moving and having conversations

5:07and creating things and being in a really creative space. So at that moment I decided I was going to stick with dance and opened the first location of my studio in 2009, which was right after kind of, you know, weird financial times of 2008. So it was an interesting time to open but I was so young and so confident and, you know, we started and it was great. I was checking the boxes of what all of the quote-unquote good studios did and we were successful but something just didn't quite feel right to me. I started dance exec which was a blog and I would post blogs every Monday through Thursday of every week and then we did a few of those pop-up sessions in Charlotte, North Carolina, Raleigh, and New York. I met some incredible people through that but then I started, I was like, you know what? I'm not sure I have this right. Like I feel like this could be better. So I always tell people I kind of, you know, had to burn it down and build it back up but we took our studios out of competitive dance. We reconceptualized like what could this dance studio model look like, not only in teaching dance excellence

6:09but also teaching human excellence, right? Leadership, executive functioning, creative and critical thinking, curious conversations, variety of perspectives so that we can really make sure that we are helping change makers in our the world and I think you do a lot of this as well and when dance is at its best it really has the power to shift humanity. I mean all are really music, dance, visual. This is kind of undertone and bringing people together in community. So we hashed a few things out and had a little bit of a roller coaster there. Then I was speaking and I met someone at a conference and she said, I wish I could be brave enough to do that and I never got her name. And I was like, well, you know what? I'm just gonna put this in a book and maybe somebody will read it and it will help shift their thought. And so in 2020, trash detrophies came out and then I kept writing, I had a baby followed up, you know, with a couple of other books started doing some corporate work but my heart stands strong in the stance space and I love it and I love what it's capable of creating and doing in terms of the world and in society.

7:11Wow, that's a lot. That's a nice idea. Well, I have several thoughts. I wrote some notes. You were kind of, correct me if I'm wrong, you were kind of a pioneer in like this whole dance consulting space. Like to other studio owners, how to, you know, run a business better. Yes. Because a lot of dance studio owners didn't come from business background and we loved teaching. Well, first we loved dancing. Then we loved teaching. Then we wanted to be a business owner and then all of a sudden we were business owners. We really didn't know we were doing. I'm not speaking for everyone. I'm saying a lot of us did that. Industry standard, yeah. And then the women that we saw before us were in notebooks and little receipt books and pen and paper and everything. And then all of a sudden here we come into this digital age and I'm older than you, but my generation, it's not there. The technology isn't really intuitive. So I had to, in order to keep up,

8:12had to really work to figure out like computers and quick books and software and marketing and all of that stuff. But it was like perfect timing for me because you said 2015, you're doing this dance exec, little pop up seminar. And I was so into it. I was like, this is what I need. I didn't, I don't want to go back to college to major in business, but I just need little bite size courses or snippets or a blog or a book or something that will teach me just this little thing. And then I'm going to learn this little thing from this person. And that was, were you one of the first people in that one of the early days, yes. And you know, there's always been like motivation, but in this like blog mentality, there were a few at the time. And you know, the space has grown exponentially. Since 2013, it's when the dance exec launched. And that New York City pop up was actually one of our last because in 2016,

9:1322 ticks bought the contents of the blog and kept it because I was like, you know, this is a space that I need to step away from. I felt like how can, how can I teach when I'm also the student right now? Now I've found that balance because we're all, we're lifelong students, right? The people that really keep learning are the best teachers in my opinion. But at the time, I was like, I need to, I need to clean house a little and, but when I go back and I look at the dance exec stuff, it's still the blueprint of what I would do to start out now. So I do feel like there was so much truth in it. And this really amazing, you know, and it was, it was a blog. I didn't really understand Google analytics at the time. I understand it much better now, but I was like, who's reading this? And it's not, no, it's all gone, which makes me so sad. I know maybe it will live, you know, maybe it will come back. We'll see, but I met these, these two women. This wasn't, it wasn't in Arizona, Chicago. I can't remember, but they came up to me and they said, we have to show you something and they opened this notebook and it was literally every guide from the dance exec printed out.

10:14And they said, this is how we started our studio and we were always wondering, who is this crazy lady that is posting all of this information for free? Wow. But I was just, I was really doing it to help. You know, this was, this was pre mastermind, free, free consulting firms. And some days I'm like, maybe that was a space. I should have like stood a little firmer in, but my heart led me elsewhere. And I don't regret it because I have met so many amazing people. Yeah. You know, you have to give it to dance studio owners. I think that they are very generous in sharing their knowledge in kind of a global sense. I wish that dance studio owners in a more local sense were more generous with one another. And that's one of the, one of the things that I actually was talking to my podcast guest yesterday, Robin Tedesco about this. It's like, I think there, it comes from a mindset of scarcity. We feel like, oh, there's only so many potential customers in our area and we have to fight for them and there's ego involved and all of that.

11:15And it's a shame because when we get together in circles, in rooms like more than just great dancing or the dance teacher's summit or, you know, DSOA or whatever they are, my DSO collective, we're so kind to one another. We're like, it's like a sisterhood. Right. Why can't we bring that more local? That's something I'm going to, yeah, in my personal life. Yeah, and you know, and I do think it's tricky and I think you're on to something about the scarcity mindset. And I was reading a quote I think it was Sarah Blakely of spanks said this other day and it was all about how entrepreneurship kind of really is a mirror on all of these insecurities that we have, whether it's scarcity mindset, control issues, you know, trouble with delegation, kind of all of these things that we end up seeing in ourselves as we evolve in our business journeys and our leadership journeys and in whatever field you're in, probably just your life journey. And I thought that was really powerful. And you know, as you do this year after year, you learn and you grow a little and you're like, maybe that is true.

12:16Maybe that is something that I've experienced. So I want to talk about trash the trophies before we get too far along and then we don't have enough time because this was, I never grew up in a competition environment and when I moved my studio from Baltimore to New Freedom, Pennsylvania, it was about 2012 and there was one other studio in town and it was a competition studio. And I knew enough to know that I needed to have some kind of hook, like some differentiator to set me apart because I was starting from no students. So I thought, okay, we don't do competition, they do, that's what's gonna be different. And I kind of leaned into that with my marketing and my whole thing was kind of like dance as an art, not a sport and I just kind of educated people about concert style dance and you know, that the rest is history. All these years later, I hear so many studio owners complaining, I mean, I'm worrying all these groups online, you and I,

13:19and our listeners who might be moms or dads of performers may not hear all this, but the studio owners complain so much about competitions, whether it's the fees, whether it's the not, not hearing back from competitions in time, the scheduling, it's too early, it's too late, too many trophies, not enough trophies, unfair judging, costumes inappropriate, music inappropriate, movement inappropriate, drunk moms in the dressing room, creepy dads in the doorway, like so many, yeah. And I literally say to the studio owners all the time, why are you doing it? And what they always say is our families want it and what would you do with your students if you didn't have it? And you and I know that there are lots of other things to do. So many, so many other things. And you know, since trash the trophies came out, so it came out in August of 2020.

14:20So about five and a half years ago, which is wild, I've been involved in a lot of rooms and a lot of conversations. And there is this kind of breakdown and communication between studio owners and parents and the child, right? Because the parents are doing competition, because so many feel like that's the best pathway for their child's advancement. They don't understand that their child can advance just as successfully without it. Video owner feels like they need to offer this as an opportunity because the parents want it because they want the child to succeed. And then often, even the students, like once they get to college age and are having reflection, they say, you know, I didn't really want to do that, but I didn't want to tell my teacher because I didn't want to disappoint the teacher, the studio owner, I didn't want to tell my parent because I knew how much money my parent was investing. There was almost a circle of misery and everyone is really on the same page and no one is just saying it. Yeah. Like you can opt out. You can opt out. And also, I love it when you hear professional dancers

15:20or college dance professors say things like the trophies that you are winning mean absolutely nothing in the real world. You can even go on a resume like they shouldn't. No. And in fact, sometimes some of the tricks and the little cheats work as a detriment to your overall artistry and technique. And again, I'm not, I don't want to trash competition. Sure. You already did it for us. Am I applaud you? And if someone has like a very convincing argument of why they do it, I respect that, right? But the book was written with the intent of like, hey, I did a lot of thinking and made a really hard choice and I encourage everyone to have that same thought process of just like, why? What's the meaning? What's the return on investment? And as I've even evolved in that thought, I keep wondering what is competitive dance doing in terms of like homogenizing the field, right? Like how much creativity are we losing?

16:21Because you go to a competition weekend and you see 200 contemporary teen solos that really mimic each other stylistically and aesthetically. And we're not really able to celebrate these incredibly unique styles because we're all doing it for a pay to play win. And I think that's a little sticky. It's like an echo chamber. Yes. Yes, it's an echo chamber. And I think that's something to be cautious up to, like is the art now conforming to the standard that is set in these environments? Or are we still moving the needle forward on the art in an organic way? Did you? And I feel like you and I have the freedom to do that, right? So we can play and explore and not have to be set to these conditions. Yeah. So did you get a lot of pushback from the competition industry? I'm sure you did. But I mean, I feel like I've just lived in a space of pushback for since then. But I'm a very kind person. And I always want the opportunity to have the conversation

17:23of let's just talk about it. And you know, there was someone from the competitive space that, you know, was a little displeased about the text. And I actually reached out to this person and said, hey, I saw that you said these things, like, would you be open to a conversation? And it took a little bit of time, but then I heard back. And we had this incredible conversation. And the person in the space of like me sending the email and getting their response really had shifted their thought. Because they were like, they felt like it was a strong act of integrity to hear from me to say, hey, let's talk about this. And then they really watched and they saw and they were analytical. And they thought about, hey, maybe this does make sense. And we had this incredible engaging conversation. And you know, I, the conversation for me is not from a seat of like, holier than now, but from a, hey, I competed as a child. I had my students in competition. I was a judge for competitions. And I just thought, maybe we don't have to do this.

18:26And it's been incredible for us as an institution. Yeah. And you're not saying the competition world should go away. I think what your message was is to studio owners and to parents and dancers, there is another way. There is another path. This is not, and this isn't necessarily the path to where you think it is. Right. And maybe it's not the best use of $50,000 a year. Absolutely. I deeply believe in being competitive at life, right? You have to be competitive at life to survive. And it's, and I felt like there was a disconnect through some of the messaging of the competitive dance space in terms of how to be competitive at life. So how could we infuse that in a more meaningful way with a stronger ROI? Because as studio owners, we are advocates for our clients' dollars, right? So where we pick and choose of where that money goes is really important. And I think parents are relying on us to pick the best way to train their child.

19:28Wow. Yeah. Brilliant. Talk about girls geared for greatness. Yeah, so girls geared for greatness. I call it the little engine that could. It's slow, it's scrappy, it's grassroots. But I love it deeply. It started in 2018, Raleigh, kind of around this whole moving away from competitive dance. Mom come to me and she said, I really think you could offer some incredible leadership training for girls because you've done something really bold that's receiving pushback and you've made your way to the other side. And that's a great skill set to have. Which might I add, Robin? You were one of the first ones that infused that spirit in me when at the conference. You said they conflict can excite you if you look at it the right way. And I was like, yes, that is a motto to remember. So we started it. We just did a few pop-up events. They were so successful. 200 girls came to the first two or three we did. And then we filed to become an independent 501C3 separate from the studio and then COVID hit. And then things got kind of weird. And we tried doing a virtual thing,

20:30but the reality is the kids didn't need to be on their devices anymore at that time. So we've kind of been figuring it out. We have a board and we did like an art gallery event. We've done some public speaking events. But what really trying to hone in on what is this organization? Like what does it serve? So we decided this year to shift into a think tank. So it would provide resources for parents, educators, mentors, girls, basically anyone that wants to help understand how to develop communication skills, how to support leadership skills, how to lean into these issues that are, you know, girl and women specific in just a very conversational way. So it's kind of it's going to be the new website should launch in March, which I'm very excited about. And we hope this will lead to maybe like an annual conference. But basically a passive way to engage with leadership and empowerment as it fits everyone's schedule because people's schedules are full. Wow, that's really exciting. I'm really interested in that. I'm going to check it out. One of the things that I've been working on right

21:31before we hit record, we were talking about, you know, have both of us love to have lots of projects going on. And one of the neat things about running my studio remotely is I have time for these different projects because the studio is doing a really great job of existing and growing without me constantly messing with it. So anyway, one of the things I'm leaning into is my Rising Leaders program. And it's a leadership program at the studio for my teen dancers. And we're making, I'm working on an online course right now for other studio owners who might want to implement something like this at their studios. And it's not just, oh, how to teach your students, your teenage students, how to be dance teachers. There's so much more to it than that. It's like a whole year long, you know, program. And I think that it really is the greater mission for me because it's not about pirouettes or cartwheels

22:34or even learning monologues at the studio. You know, it's not really about that. It's the vehicle that we're using to teach character and leadership and confidence. And so the Rising Leaders program, not only is it great for the studio because we're in a rural town where finding help in the classroom is often a struggle but we're retaining our teens and giving them this new lease on feeling important and feeling valued in their juniors and senior years when a lot of teenagers are like, well, I'm gonna be a nurse. So do I really need to be spending all this time with the dance studio? Let me go work at the grocery store but keeping them involved and giving them this sense of purpose and then they leave and then they already know that they can step into a leadership role. Right. Yes. And they're prepared and they're equipped. You know, it is proven that children with arts experience are, I don't know the start right off the top of my head

23:36but are exponentially more successful in the entrepreneurial and creative space. And as we move into this, you know, kind of AI phase of society, like people are gonna be leaning into the creatives, the people that can think quickly, be adaptable, all of these things that we teach. We have a work study educational leadership program here that's similar to, and I think that's so important, right? That whatever the skill or the vehicle is, that there's that additional layered component of what is this doing to enhance the human as well as the skill? Yeah, so that's exciting. And so we were talking about how both of us kind of have this very creative brain where we wanna, you know, make big changes in the industry that we care so much about, that we've been in for most of our lives. Dare we talk about your latest controversy? Do you wanna say it? Yeah. Is it the private equity one? Yes. Yes. Do you wanna talk about that? We can talk about it because I do think it's important for parents to know, I really do. And that was one of the reasons that I started the conversation.

24:38And this isn't something that's hitting every market, but in the Raleigh Durham area, we're one of the top 40 private equity markets in the country. So it is like a really big conversation here. But, you know, I think we're seeing it in kind of multiple verticals of private equity and even increased franchise space, like making sure parents understand, like what might be private equity owned, what might be franchised, what might be truly locally owned, is really important as you're, as you're choosing where to spend your dollars, or what you might expect in the child outcome of participating in these things. So the conversation that I started was really with the intent to educate. And our industry isn't really open to just like these truly transparent conversations surrounding this topic right now and maybe because it's newer, maybe because there's some fear, you know, change always feels kind of scary. And I always tell my staff and students that we need to be change persistent instead of change resistant. So just really staying informed and on top of these shifts because I'm sure you've noticed it as well.

25:40Like this is a new trend and a new shift that's happening. You know, we know we had happening in studios, it's happening with competitions, Kapizio was acquired, right? And then discount dance supply disappeared because they were acquired by the same person. And this isn't exclusive to dance, right? Like it's happened in dentistry, childcare, sandwich shops. It's a bigger conversation, but it is hitting dance. And I think as, you know, local business owners, it is something that we want to stay aware of. And I want to advocate for my clients to make sure they understand the shifts that are happening in the space too. Yeah. So just to fill in some of the blanks for our listeners who don't know what we're talking about, I didn't set it up well. I just, I couldn't get that word in my head, the private equity, but there is an organization that kind of appeared on the scene of the dance studio owner world where they were offering an option for studio owners who want to sell

26:43as opposed to quietly just drying up their business and then having nothing in terms of retirement or anything to show for their life's work. And it was presented to dance studio owners as a real, as an opportunity for those of maybe who wanted that exit strategy. And honestly, it was presented from an organization that I am also involved in for more than just great dancing. And that's an organization that I trust. And here, you know, I'm like, oh, this is a great idea. This is wonderful. I'm at that age where I, you know, might in 10, 15 years want to have this as an option. I want to learn more about it. And here I'm like, oh, what could be wrong with this? And then here's my friend Chasta on all of a sudden popping up and she's like, wait a minute. Wait a minute. Let's talk about this. This might not be all good. And then it seemed like it was like the whole dance world against Chasta. And you, I was so proud of you.

27:46You were like a little bulldog. Like you did not back down. You were very, and it wasn't a fight. It wasn't like a, it wasn't a fight because it was truth. And I don't feel like we ever should feel attacked for sharing truth, right? And that, that was what made me feel so uncomfortable about that conversation is, you know, it kind of all started because I was asked to not speak at some places because my views were considered a little too radical. So that's what made me start deep diving and being like this. And I, I too had spoken with several of these organizations and it just kept feeling like something's not adding up. Like A plus B is not equaling C and where's the gap? So I started really listening and learning. And then as I was listening and learning, you know, similar to how I was running the dance stack, I was like, I feel compelled to share this. Like maybe this is going to shift the narrative. Maybe this is going to change. Maybe it's just going to make people a little more aware. Again, like with competitions, people have their reasons.

28:48Like maybe it does, it is right for someone. Maybe it's not, but let's just all be mindful of what this looks like and what is happening. And wow, I mean, you're right. It was, was an opportunity to really question, like, well, where, where do my values stand? And is this important? And I still think it's important that we all just know what's happening. Yeah. And I will say that the dance world, the dance studio owner world did come together for, I guess, I don't know who organized it. Did you organize the big Zoom phone? No, I didn't organize it. I was on it. But I think regal kind of led the mission of, you know, it was re and two representatives from Ensemble, Jeff and Mandy and myself that had this conversation. And I think, you know, the thing that felt kind of weird to me is that all of this had happened so quickly. And there hadn't been the level of transparency.

29:48And I will say, even since that town hall websites are more transparent now. I think there's more knowledge. And I think that I think we achieved a lot. I'm not saying I would want to go through that again necessarily because there were, there were also a lot of untruths that were said even about myself. And just a lot of like really kind of icky, eicky things being said on social media. But to your point, like we are saying about the homogenization of the competitive space, we don't want to live in echo chambers. We need this diversity of thought and curiosity and questioning. And if things, if it's all great, then like let's like celebrate, like, you know, come out and let's say like all the great things or if there are cautions, let's share those cautions or let's think about like what a full industry roll up looks like. And then it's, you know, if there's an organization that maybe owns like a competition, a membership organization and a whole variety of studios.

30:50And maybe a, you know, danceware, costume, software that possibilities are endless. Then basically your dollars are all going in the same funnel. And when we're speaking about client advocacy, like even with the competitive space, it's very similar in a lot of ways of like, where are those dollars funding? Like, you know, where are we saying like, looking at our clients and saying, yes, this invoice should be paid because I can guarantee this is a solid use of your hard earned money. Yeah. And also from a parent perspective, a parent who's listening might be like, well, who cares? Like, how is this really going to affect me? Yeah. I mean, like because there's also the idea of like certain standards like when we stop at Starbucks on the road, traveling from here to there, you know your, your Frappuccino is going to be pretty much the same at every Starbucks that you go to, right? Your Big Mac is going to be pretty much the same. There's that consistency. And we know what we can expect. And so parents might be like, well, why not in the dance studio world?

31:51Because then I know that if I love my dance studio in Pennsylvania, but I moved to Arizona, then I can have that same kind of quality. And also the dance studio industry is unregulated. It is. I am actually fine with that. Please do not bring regulation to this industry. But I think that the downside is that, well, for example, this morning, I was just on Facebook's, I got a notification that someone in our community is just asking, where should I put my three year old for dance? And of course, like with every community, it's like Studio A, Studio B, Studio A, Studio B, Studio B, Studio B. And it's like, and they don't say any, these mommies who are doing the recommended it, aren't saying why? They're just saying, this is where I go. So I commented and I was like, hey, it's Robin from EMC Performing Arts Studio. All of these studios are wonderful in their own way. It depends what you want. So do you want to have that choice of different approaches

32:53and philosophies? Or do you want to have everything is standardized? Everything is just carbon copy of everything else. And I would like to live in a world where I can go and say, you know what? I like this philosophy. These core values, this mission, and back to the competition. It's like some dude, parents might want competitions. Some parents might want more concert style. You know, whatever it is, some might want recreational. We get less choice when we have all of this. Like you said, homogenized output from our industry. And similarly, and I think this is what I kept getting hung up on is, you know, it's one thing when it's coffee, when it's hamburgers, pizzas. It's another thing when it's the life of a child. And like when we commodified childhood to become like a profit line, I don't know. It starts feeling weird. You know, it's, and we've seen it in like, that care, health care, and children get one childhood.

33:55And I know you so deeply believe that. I, and so many in this industry do, including myself, it changed my childhood. And I think that's why I stand so strongly in this positioning of like, it's okay. Like differentiation is really good. It's really exciting. And when everything becomes incredibly standardized to your point, we kind of lose that kind of special spark. And I think another frustration is a lot of times with what's happening in the market right now in this equity space is things are staying branded as small. So it's not as transparent for a parent to know and understand like kind of exactly where things are and what's happening. And so I mean, in this whole process, I learned that the vet we were using is owned by like Mars and Eminem. So, you know, it's very prevalent in that veterinarian space, isn't it? It really is, it is. And it's expensive. And that's the other piece of it is, you know, when we were living in Pennsylvania, of course, you know, we have pets and we, you know, we would take them to this vet.

34:56And if it was too expensive, my husband would say, well, I think we're gonna go to this vet. And then, you know, you shop according to what you need and do you really like connect with this doctor or whatever. And then all of a sudden, you started realizing that they were all kind of, it's like, they were all the same. And so now their purchase power gets big too, right? And it makes it more difficult for small people because their marketing budget is so much larger, their corporate office is so much larger, their social presence, right, becomes multifaceted. So it is very, very complicated. We could probably do like a multi-day session on this, but I do think it's just something for people to be like, oh, this is happening. And just one last thing, I don't want to beat it to death, but one last thing from a parent's perspective, I think that a lot of the families at my studio, and probably yours too, know that if they have a concern or if they, you know, they can come to me.

35:57In fact, we're doing a nutcracker next year, which we don't normally do. We've done it before, but not regularly because a parent came to me, a valued long time family, came to me and said, this is something that would mean the world to us. And I listened and I said, okay, I'm gonna try to make this happen and we're doing it. If you go into Starbucks and say, it would mean a lot to me if I could have some sushi right now, they are not gonna give you sushi at Starbucks. So the, like you said, commodification of our industry is going to be detrimental to that personal touch point. Yeah, like we love, like, you know, we do a lot of social impact partnering with organizations. We're working with NC Arts and Action right now, which is a subsidiary of the National Dance Institute. And it's like if there is like an overarching, you know, an overarching corporate entity, more than likely that's not gonna make sense to them

36:59when they're looking at these at this profit driven model. And that's not to say profits are bad because it is, it is a business, but like at the end of the day, like to your point, listening, learning, serving the community that we know and building that trust relationship, I think that's invaluable and I think parents, you know, when you're picking and choosing where your child is spending their time after school, you can't be diligent enough because they're not gonna get these years, this time, these experiences back. So where they go and how it aligns with your family and your family values is really important. Yeah, excellent. Well, I'm sure that won't be your last, the last time that you push against the norms because your heart is telling you to do so. And I commend you for that. It's very brave. And I'm like, whenever that happens, I'm always like, go Chasta, go. I mean, I will tell you, that one caught me a little off guard. Yeah, wow. Well, hopefully it's died down and people have information that they've gathered

38:00from both sides. And honestly, I think that having the option of selling your studio and, you know, walking away into retirement with something to show for your life's work is a good thing. I think there should be transparency and the families should know, hey, this is being sold to someone that's not me. And, you know, as long as it's wide open like that. Yeah, and I think that's huge and anything child-related. It's you're going to be looking for transparency. Yeah. I think that's really, really important. Yeah, it is, it's a shift. So what is coming down the road for you? What else do you have cooking that you want to share of? Yeah, so I am, I've been doing a lot of purpose-driven work. I'm in this past, for several years, but last year my hometown was destroyed by Hurricane Helene. So we actually went on tour back there last summer. I took all my dancers. We did a show in my hometown and raised a lot of money

39:01because it's a very small town and it didn't receive a lot of federal funding because it's in East Tennessee instead of Western North Carolina. So we were able to- What town? Greenville is like the main city, Greenville, Tennessee. It's in between Johnson City and Knoxville. Okay. But it was so special to go back home with my whole Raleigh home and do this show with so many people that had influenced me and my childhood and it was really powerful and I'm sure you felt this before but when you do something really exciting, you're kind of like, okay, well, how do you top that, right? And somehow we always find a way to. So this year, we're working with Arts and Action helping get more dance in Title I elementary schools in our area. We're also doing this huge flash mob with the Coleman Foundation for their 30th anniversary which I'm excited about since I lost my mom to breast cancer and we have so many moms in our community that have breast cancer. So really saying like, okay, well, what pieces of my story can I now lens like my professional experience towards

40:02and continue to help and grow? And our students, you know, they've had so many exciting opportunities from Carnegie Hall to Greenville Opera were performing on a cruise this summer. And then personally, I'm working on a few things, some storytelling things that I hope people will tune into. Okay. I feel there's so many people that are bold leaders. And I feel like we don't talk about the hard parts of that bold leadership enough. It's too much of like a glam highlight reel. And I kind of want to get into the nitty gritty if like you can do this and you can still be a good person. And this is how. So more of that is going to be coming soon too. And I just, I want to be surrounded with great people like you. So when this opportunity came up, I was like, yes, let's do it. That is so exciting. I feel like we are at a really, like at the precipice of so many opportunities. Like I don't know if it's the technology that we have available to us right now or the fact that our studios are doing well. And we're, I feel like both of us are like powered

41:03by our studios. Yes. Also inspired by children and young people. And you know, with the heart that wants to do something that's impactful. And I get, I'm really excited. And somebody asked me about a year ago, are you selling your studio? Are you, you know, now that you're moving to Florida, you retiring? And I was like, no, like I am so excited about my studio and so excited about these other projects more than ever that like I wake up in the morning and especially when the sun is shining and the sky is blue. And I throw up in my curtains and I'm like, I cannot wait. I guess so much to do. Like let's get on it. Let's do good things. So on the other day, I was like a weekend. We had a weekend of, you know, huge events. And on Saturday, I was like, I really love today. And then on Sunday, I was like, I really love today. And then on Monday, I was like, I even love today. And it's like, how lucky are we to be in this space? And you know, I don't think there are enough fields or enough industries that are looking at children

42:05and saying, what is this world going to look like in 10, 20, 30, 40 years? We are given such a blessing and opportunity to say, let's have a little slice of that journey and let's make these lives better. I don't think there's maybe any more important work. Like it is so incredible. I agree. And the fact that we get to do this job is such a blessing. And it's a very creative job. It's, I was telling someone else the other day, I said, the best thing about entrepreneurship is that we can lean into the parts we love and outsource or delegate the parts we don't love. Like, I don't like the math. But I love the big ideas and the creating and then the performance and the interpersonal stuff. Like I love all that. And I can choose to do the parts that I really, that, you know, fill me up and set me on fire or set my heart on fire. What a, and I sometimes, I've heard parents say in the past when they're young girls

43:06that, oh, I want to own a dance studio one day. I've seen parents kind of look like. Like that's not a smart, but like, no, you're going to go to college and you can sort of go to college and be a dance studio. But no, like that's not a real career or something like that. And that makes me sad because I feel like this is the best life. It's like, it's this, it's, it's this falsity, right? I mean, it's, it's kind of gotten lumped into anything in the arts as, as not serious. But it's like, we, we get to decide what's serious and what's not. And I think it is one of the most serious careers. Yes, absolutely. Yeah, I'm proud of us. I'm happy. And the people that will follow in our footsteps because I do, this is, you know, one thing that I've recognized and, I mean, obviously, the last six years I've spent saying a lot of things out loud, but it's like, we, we really have to stand in this power and purpose. And the more people that say, this is what dance can be. Right, so often I see these like videos where these, you know, on social media are these comments

44:07and these threads, like you were referencing. And it's like, it actually diminishes the power of dance. And I want to do more of like standing in the power of what dance can be. Wonderful. Well, you inspire me. And I'm so glad you came on to talk. If you're ever in Southwest Florida, let's get together and have lunch. Yes, I mean, let's just, let's put it on the calendar. Let's do it. Let's do it. So glad this happened, Robin. Thank you. Yes, thank you. And if anybody wants to seek you out online, where should they go? So I have a website, chastahamilton.com, on all the social media. There's not very many chastahamilton's out there. So you'll find me. Awesome. All right, thank you, chastah, it was so great to talk to you. Thank you. You've been listening to In This Spotlight, Raising Leaders in the Performing Arts. We hope you've been inspired and equipped by today's show. Please make sure to subscribe to never miss our latest episode and leave us a five-star review so that more listeners can discover how to shape character and cultivate leadership

45:07skills through the performing arts. This is In The Spotlight.