Elissa Slotkin Spots a Big Warning Sign for Trump’s GOP | Command Post

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1:00Hi, I'm Ben Parker from the Bullwork. Welcome to a special episode of Command Post on the Bullwork Takes Feed. I am joined as always by our very own Lieutenant General Mark Kirtling and our special guest for another repeat appearance on Command Post Senator, Melissa Slotkin of Michigan Senator. Thanks for joining us. You just gave a big speech all about what you've learned about aocracy and democracy on your recent trip in Europe. Can you tell us a little about what you said and what do you want it to communicate? Yeah. I went to visit Poland and Hungary this past September, this month. I think for me it really crystallized a number of things and brought home here in the United States a number of things. I think the lessons of how both countries and their different ways kind of came out of authoritarian government was really important. There's a playbook for these authoritarians, but there's also a playbook to get out of it. I just thought it was worth talking about that. I think the other thing, certainly that I saw in real time in Hungary was, okay, you can

2:03do all the right things and win elections. Then you have to actually deliver for people. I want folks here, meaning particularly, hopefully Democrats, thinking about, great, okay, so we're hopefully do well in a month in November elections. We hopefully do well in 2028. What is the plan and how do you actually deliver for people once you've won an election in a way that doesn't just send you pendulum swinging back four years later? Yeah. Senator, if I can ask, because I saw your interview and it was fascinating. I had been in Poland and some of the Nordic and Baltic countries last summer, but when I left Europe as a commander in 2012, it was very important. It was interesting to me because I kind of placed Poland as one of the best countries in Europe at the time. And then they kind of went through a bunch of travails. Hungary for a long time has been in the valley of misfit toys, so they're really recovering in a big way. So I'm curious, you talked about the recovery of Hungary after Orban.

3:09I'm wondering if you heard from many of the citizens, are the government officials you talked to? How long do they think it will take to recover from those decades of his abuse and just dictatorial reign? Yeah. I think it's fair to say, you know, I went there and they were 120 days into their administration. They were still like picking up the carpets and looking at the creepy crawlies underneath. I mean, they were still trying to figure out how to like run and recover their ministries and like, who should stay? Who should leave? They were still trying to figure out the depth and breadth of corruption and what the previous administration had signed Hungary up for, you know, which contracts were binding and which ones were, you know, complete fabrications. I mean, they were in a moment of discovery on a lot of things. At the same time, they were under and still are under tremendous pressure to like deliver and to hold people accountable. So they were, I think, drinking from a fire hose and they were coming out of it after

4:0916 years. Certainly, the lesson can be start thinking now. What was very interesting to me though is that we spoke with some of the advisors to the Prime Minister and they were talking about how they had a spreadsheet literally on all the things that if they managed to win, they wanted to address and take care of. And that spreadsheet was broken up by like, are we going to get a very, very thin majority, a medium majority or a super majority? And then they got a super majority. So they're like, holy crap, we're going to do like the large version of what was on my spreadsheet. But to me, you know, that idea of thinking ahead, having a plan based on what your, you know, your outcomes are, I thought was really smart. Yeah, are you going to start driving that? Do you think? We have the same. I think that there's already some of that going on. I certainly think there is lots of different groups doing their version of Project 2029,

5:12right, kind of thinking ahead to the presidential. And the fundamental question for me is the Democratic Party doesn't have like sort of the leadership style to be able to say, okay, we're not going to do 25 different plans. We're actually going to sing off the same shit of music. We're going to combine, sit together and come up with a combined plan. We have sort of bred that out of the gene pool a little bit in the Democratic Party. And this is why I'm so interested in having a new generation kind of across the board come into government because the times we're in require more strong handed leadership. Frankly, but I that work is going on. And I think frankly, once we get past the midterms and we're like headlong into presidential primary, like then those candidates are going to have the opportunity to bring in some of that brain power and think about what they want to deliver for people.

6:13Senator, I'm struck by some of the things you're saying about leadership at the Democratic Party now. Some of the things you said in your speech, you said, unfortunately, too many leaders on both sides of the aisle believe that the Trump era was behind us and not worth the heavy lift of changing laws to protect the future. Last time you were on command post, you made some similar noises about the Democratic leadership. Maybe first of all, do those come with an at Chuck Schumer or are there particular leaders in your party that you think are stepping up to the moment right now? Well, certainly I feel like I've said, I mean, I know that I've said for a long time, I mean, from kind of the presidential Biden or Biden, Biden years, that I think we need a new generation of leaders across the board. We need House Senate White House, Governor, local leaders, like we want that next generation coming into these positions and shaking things up. I think the one thing I can say consistently, no matter whether you're talking to a Trump voter or a recent college grad who tends to vote like everyone saying the same thing,

7:17same two things. We want a new generation of leadership and we want big and bold ideas. They're not saying it has to be one party or the other and they're not saying it has to be progressive versus moderate, new generation of leadership, big and bold ideas. And I think you see people who embody that are successful, right? I mean, I think like what Mom Donnie is doing in Manhattan, like he fits, he hits the checklist on those two things. And I think we need to hear that here in Washington. And so, yeah, yes, I'm aiming it at an old guard that doesn't feel the tectonic plates of American politics shifting under their feet and either adapt, they'll either adapt to that and realize that or they should allow a new generation to come forward. Well, that's some great thought.

8:18I'm going to go back though. I was fascinated by what you said in your first answer and then wanted to get a question side. I allowed him to do that. Now, I want to come back. So, you basically pointed out that there are the dynamics in Hungary specifically of fighting or going against and basically bringing out into the open air the corruption that's been taken place for the last two decades, plus the desire of the people to get moving. How do you balance those two from a governmental perspective? Is that going to be tough when we try and do it? Yeah, I actually think it's a three-legged stool, right? You need the agenda that's going to actually help real people. That is affirmative things. Big economic swings, I think we need to declare a housing emergency. I think we need a public insurance plan. I think we need a tax code that reflects reality. Take some big swings but deliver for actual people.

9:19My stepmom back in Michigan has to feel what that government change is and how it helps her. Helps her, her grandkids, her pocketbook. My stepmom's leg is accountability, particularly on corruption and the abuse of taxpayer dollars, which is illegal, up to 20 years in prison for fraud, waste and abuse of taxpayer dollars. Also for weaponizing the government, as someone who they tried to criminally indict me for a 90-second video, you should feel some accountability for that. Then the third thing is what I call Trump proofing the government. It's more out of the limelight, a group of people, a task force who says, okay, look, what we thought were laws in this country are actually just norms and this president has just blown right through them. How do we make sure no other president in the future, a Democrat or a Republican, can ever abuse our system in the same way? I think it's a three-legged stool, but how do you keep the stool from tipping over one

10:23direction or the other? Leadership. And that, to me, is going to be the hard push and pull. Yeah, Senator, I am such a huge fan of this idea of Trump proofing the government. I know there was a book written by two former very high-ranking government lawyers called After Trump, that had a whole plan to do this after the first Trump administration, and most of that was just never taken up. So I think it's hugely important. And I wonder, do you hear some of your colleagues on either side of the aisle, on Capitol Hill talking about this, talking about reforms to anti-corruption laws or the relationship between Congress and the executive and changing some of those things or the powers of the courts or any of it? Do you hear that coming from other Democrats at Capitol Hill? And do you hear it sort of whispered maybe behind the scenes coming from some Republicans even? Yeah. So there's definitely, I think, lots of ideas about what we need to do. It's kind of like, fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me.

11:26There were concrete suggestions after the first Trump administration, like we need a task force that Trump proofs the government. And literally the message was, look, he's gone. We got to focus on our legislative agenda. That's in the rear-re-re-re-mirror. I mean, we did. And so now, I think we've learned that was a mistake, right? I think what's interesting is, and this is part of the tectonic plates of politics changing kind of as we talk, is I'm watching the ground swell on issues that span the political spectrum, forcing change in the body I servant. So I think in September, we had a complete shift in the conversation on AI, public shift. In the conversation on AI. We are having an American cultural moment on artificial intelligence.

12:27And it's driving change here in Washington. Suddenly my Republican colleagues are doing AI bills. And they are often in contrast to the president who says he's the only, you know, accountability we need on AI. They are responding to this ground swell, data centers, part and parcel of the AI conversation. But man, I've seen few issues in the state of Michigan go from zero to 60 as fast at the local grassroots level than data centers, flock cameras, surveillance by the government. You know, health care for sure. I mean, you can go on and on. And it is not Democrat versus Republican. It's ground swell, the grassroots. And when it comes to my colleagues on the other side of the aisle, they've spent two years now doing everything Trump wants. So they're just like, in some cases, just vessels for whatever, like they think the political winds are.

13:28So it used to be Trump. But the only thing they're more scared of than Trump is losing their own elections. So I think that what I'm finding interesting is this ground swell that's nonpartisan or bipartisan, like Bernie Sanders and Steve Bannon co-hosted an AI conference in September here in DC. I mean, we're living in weird times. So I'm more interested in that. Hey, what's up guys? It's Hayley Bailey. Okay. I need to tell you about something. I just got YouTube premium. It's got tons of awesome features like offline downloads. So I can download my favorite videos before I travel and watch them whenever I don't have Wi-Fi. Because we all know airplane Wi-Fi is the worst. I get out free, I get back room play, and there's like a ton more in there. You should try it. If you like YouTube, you'll love YouTube premium. Try it now for two months free at youtube.com slash premium. If you like YouTube, you'll love YouTube premium. Hi, I'm Sean Evans from Hot Ones, and I want to tell you about YouTube premium.

14:31It has offline downloads, so you can watch without Wi-Fi. Background play. So you can lock your phone, and it still plays, baby. Oh, and it is completely ad free. Yes, I said it ad free. Try YouTube premium for two months free at youtube.com slash premium. Trial eligibility varies, terms apply, cancel anytime. The kids really love that playhouse, huh? Yeah, it's not just a child's playhouse. It's a rental property. Kids, off-carries roof. Someone lives in there. Lives, works, and thrives. Your Wi-Fi reaches all the way to the playhouse. We're good galee-nairs. It reaches everywhere. Can I check it out? Sorry. But solid, but the treehouse just opened up. Live without limits. Get home internet from AT&T and cover your whole house. Even your playhouse turned rental property. AT&T Extended Wi-Fi Coverage Service Required, limited availability. Visit AT&T.com-forward slash internet to learn more. Let's take the Iran War as an example. We know there are some Republicans in the Senate who are not comfortable with the way this war has been conducted

15:32with the way Congress has been involved, or in many cases not involved. Even if you look at the reporting with the way that, like you, the Democratic members of the Senate have been cut out of briefings from the Defense Department and things like that. So do we think that there's maybe some room for reform of the War of Powers Act or some sort of reform of Congressional oversight of the government of the Defense Department in particular if Democrats take back the Senate? Well, I think, I think, again, the most important sign that things are starting to change and crack within the Republicans on the war is that the Senate candidates in places like Michigan, Mike Rogers, have completely flipped and done a 180 and now against the war. He was advocating for the war literally three weeks ago. Now he's completely flipped. The only reason you flip on those issues is because you're doing a Hail Mary,

16:33you're not going to win your election unless you flip. That's a very important data point, more important than polling, more important than polling. So we got a crawl walk run when it comes to finding a backbone from my Republican colleagues. First their candidates are the canaries in the call mine. Then they need to get shellacked in an election, lose. Then they get the fear of God putting them that the rest of them that are left are going to risk losing their election. And then they'll start with small bills and changes that look like they're doing something brave, but actually are not brave at all. And then the hope is, again, with upward continued pressure from the grassroots that they actually then work on big legislative issues that can change the conversation like on war powers. But we are still a ways from that. You know, growing a spine takes a long time.

17:36Yeah, and this is the part that I'm kind of fascinated by because I'm a big student of leadership. You mentioned, and in both an outward way and a nuanced way, about the need for leaders as soon as the midterms occur. This might be a tough question, but who do you see in the Senate, primarily from your side, but also if you can include some Republicans, who are going to be those leaders that are going to help us recover from the last two years of debacle. And I hate to ask you to name names, but can you do that? Yeah, I mean, look, I think there are a number of really substantive people up here in the Senate who work very deeply on issues. I mean, there are people who have worked on issues like their entire careers, right? So Tammy Baldwin on health care, like Tammy Baldwin knows health care, right? And I care about it.

18:37But that's not my background. That's not my special expertise. And so I'm super interested in those issues, but man, I think she's going to have a very important role to play as we try to recover from these really sort of devastating cuts to our system. I think the key thing is, and I always felt this in when I was serving in federal government at the Pentagon or the CIA, the right combination I always felt like was you need that experience and that institutional knowledge combined with new and bold ideas. And energy too, right? And energy. And so I think like there's, you know, I think there's a lot of people who are just constantly looking for Democrats to fight each other, for instance. And I really think that is so deeply counterproductive that actually what you need is just like in the military, you take the best attributes of very

19:41different kinds of people, a very different MOSs, you know, specialties. And you put them together and let them work as a team. That to me is how we do big and important things. If we turn our guns on each other and constantly say, well, you know, you're not, you're not grounded in reality or, you know, you're, you know, too much about the existing system. You got to throw all that away. The right combination is both. I'm going to ask my last question that I'll let General get the last one of the interview. This was actually to me, the scariest and most disturbing part of your speech. You mentioned that you went to a bunch of different universities and think tanks in DC and said, I just came back from two post-authoritarian countries in Europe. And I want to talk about post-authoritarianism. And a bunch of them said, no, don't say that here. Go somewhere else. Can you tell us more about what you told them you were going to say and why they turned you down and maybe name some names if you want to? I'm not going to name some names. You know, everyone's got to speak for themselves. But so I was actually in Hungary as we were trying to figure out a

20:45place to host the speech a couple of weeks later, right? And the irony was not lost on me. But as I'm there learning about how they are coming out of 16 years of authoritarianism that in my own country, I can't find a venue who's brave enough to host me in talking about coming out of authoritarianism. You know, it's hard to miss the irony. We kind of fanned out and put the feelers out. And all we said was the senator wants to do a follow up from her speech at Brookings last year about authoritarianism in the United States, what she learned on her trips to Hungary and Poland and how countries can come out of these his moments of time. That was it because I hadn't written the speech. So there was nothing more to share. And a number of universities and think tanks said we're sorry. Like she's she's nice. Nice lady, but we just can't take the risk.

21:46We don't want to draw that kind of attention to ourselves. And I thought that's a good host to kudos to Carnegie for hosting us, right? I mean, that's the other side of the coin is like fear is contagious. It's so it so was courage, right? So, but, but it's like a sitting senator giving their opinion on what's happening in our country was, was too hot to handle for a bunch of institutions here in DC. Well, I had about six other questions I'm going to give you one because we have limited time with you, but, but based on what you just said, I'm going to follow up on that. Bullwork is not a think tank, but we have courage. And what maybe I could ask you to do is if we were a think tank, what would you tell us today? What would you tell our audience in terms of what you wanted other think tanks to know? Cause I had the same experience when I was trying to save forces in Europe. No one wanted to talk to me. It was too hot of a topic. And it doesn't compare to what you're talking about right now in terms of

22:49authoritarianism. What are the top three issues? Look, I will forever feel as a national security person by training that the existential issue threatening the United States is not coming from abroad. It is coming from the deep threat to the middle class and the American dream. That is real. And that spans beyond Trump. It's the reason we have Trump, I think, but it spans beyond him. And so I'm interested in, you know, organizations that are actually trying to address that problem. And that's a hard problem. That's, that's not an easy talking point. It's a slog, but I can't think of more important work than that. And we've got a lot of people around DC who want to talk about a project 2029 for their niche issue, which I appreciate.

23:53But the only one that really matters and the only one that to me will allow for clear thinking and clear decision making on the other issues, niche issues that people care about is if people in places like Michigan believe in their bones that if they work hard, they can get ahead. And they are starting to really not believe that. But the system is rigged against them and with AI and other things, it's getting worse. So that would be if everything tank was just, just absolutely bubbling with concrete ideas on how to change, to be able to foster a stronger middle class in America. That'd be my dream. Good stuff. Thank you so much. Senator, we really appreciate having you and you volunteering to come on with us. You know, it's always fun to talk to you. And, you know, not only you're a great guest, but you're a dear friend and thank you for what you're doing in the Senate and for national security as well.

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