Cardinal Burke Went on Shawn Ryan. Here's What He Actually Said. (Audio)

0:00Go into the world. And tell every man that you meet. There is a man on the cross. A Catholic take. What you need to know right now. A bold synthesis of inspiration and information. Keeping you up to date on the news and issues from a courageous Catholic perspective. A Catholic take with Joe McLean starts now. Christ, be to Jesus Christ. Welcome back to a Catholic take. A bold synthesis of information and inspiration. I'm your host. Joe McLean, praise be to God. It is good to be on with you. If you know, if you've hung out with me at all, you know I've been paying attention to Sean Ryan for years. Praying for him actually. Ever since, like it was like four years ago or something, I learned that he was a fallen away Catholic, raised Catholic, but fell away. I've been praying for him ever since. And to see his journey come back into the church,

1:02kind of a big deal, praise be to God. And now he's on this wild ride, exorcisms. He's got Cardinal Birk on. He's had some great Catholics for a record, a bunch of others. And I'm grateful for it. But there was something interesting said in the podcast on the Sean Ryan show with Cardinal Birk that really peaked my interest. And we're going to cover that today. What did Cardinal Birk say about the old test? And specifically the first five books of the Old Testament, the Pentateuch, did Moses not write those? Hmm. As a guy who's written a book called Catholic by Design, where I specifically say Moses wrote the first five books, and it is the Catechetical class, greatest Catechetical to Catechetical class in the history of the world, where Moses is teaching the Israelites who they were, who created them, and where God is sending them. So we're going to get into the Cardinal Birk, air quotes controversy here, what he said, and what it is all mean today with our good friend Mark Lambert

2:02from Catholic unscripted at 30 past the hour. He's going to be joining us to weigh in on the Cardinal Birk controversy. But there's another one, and that is the president for the Pontifical Academy for Life. It's saying Catholics can support Euthanasia law. What? Michael Haynes, Vatican journalist, joins us to 14 past the hour to weigh in on that one. What exactly did the Archbishop say? What did he mean? What is it all boiled down to? Is he playing fast and loose with the nuance in Catholic teaching here? Because there's another principle, give him an inch, and they take a mile. And we're going to cover that with Michael Haynes at 14 past the hour. We will, of course, put the show notes up at the top of the hour with links to everything. And we encourage you to check them out. Go to thestationofthecross.com forward slash ACT. And while you're there, you can get the show notes, watch the livestream, and you can give us your Catholic take, be a part of the conversation on the livestream.

3:02And then, of course, you can sign up to the email list where I'm going to be sending you the latest and greatest cheat sheet that we talked about yesterday on the birthday, the Nativity Feast Day of our Lady back in the early centuries of the church. I gave you that cheat sheet yesterday else and that to the email list this week. All of that, when you join the team at thestationofthecross.com forward slash ACT, let's get after. We have a lot to talk about. It's going to be great. Do us a favor, share us with a friend. And the name of the father, the son, and the Holy Ghost, Amen. Remember, almost gracious Virgin Mary that never was it known, that anyone who fled to thy protection, implored thy help or sought, thine intercession was left unated, inspired by this confidence I fly unto thee, O Virgin of Virgin's, my mother, to thee do I come before thee I stand sinful and sorrowful, O mother of the word incarnate, despise not my petitions, but in thy mercy here, and answer me, Amen. And the name of the father, the son, and the Holy Ghost, and now your saint of the day.

4:06Saint Peter, claver, pray for us. Peter was born in the year of our Lord, 1580, to a Catalonian farming family. He studied at Barcelona before entering the Jesuit Novician. His fellow Jesuit, Saint Alfonzus Rodriguez, urged Peter to evangelize in South America, and the young Jesuit lost no time in heating the other saint's words. Peter crossed the Atlantic to what is now Colombia, where he would finish his priestly training, and the young man was immediately struck by the horrifying plight of the African slaves in the colonies. The trade flourished, despite the repeated efforts of the papacy and other Catholic authorities to suppress it. So father Peter, declaring himself the slave of the slaves, dedicated his life to alleviating the terrible conditions where he could, while never ceasing to preach and teach the faith. Despite his own natural timidity, father Peter boldly met each slave ship as they arrived, and won the goodwill of the brutalized slaves with his virtue and material aid.

5:07He trained interpreters as catechists, and stood firm against enemies in the slave trade, and even within the Catholic hierarchy who opposed his work. After over four decades of service, and the baptism and education of hundreds of thousands of slaves, father Peter died in the year of our Lord, 1654. For more about the saints and seasons of the Catholic Church, visit thestationofthecross.com, forward slash saints and seasons. Saint Peter Claver, pray for us. And now your headline news. Lifeside News reports Trump ad men ways making stay-at-home moms eligible for nine grand. The Trump administration is considering a plan to make stay-at-home mothers eligible for federal subsidies originally intended to pay for daycare. The vehicle is the Child Care and Development Fund, a Department of Health and Human Services fund established back in the 1990s, that gives low income and working parents roughly 9,000 per child annually up to the age of 13 for daycare.

6:12Zeal reports U.S. bishops issue new guidance for clergy on preaching faithful citizenship, the document centers on three themes. The Church's role in transforming society, Christ called to recognize every person as a neighbor, and the need to place faith before politics, and presents them not as a single issue agenda, but as a part of an integral Catholic life-rooted in scripture and tradition. The bishops warn that Catholics who take a steady diet of partisan sources often end up embracing political ideologies, rather than the whole of church teaching. And the National Catholic Register reports, Scotland's bishops warn that proposed reforms would permit abortion up to birth. Bishop John Keenan, president of the bishops' conference of Scotland, is urging the Scottish government to reform the country's expansive abortion law and to reject efforts to expand it further. The government does not plan to change abortion law this year, but intends to follow through on recommendations

7:14from a pro-abortion advisory group and to fund late-stage abortion. You might remember, Scotland makes it illegal to pray for the end of abortion. Let that sink in, and those are your headline news. The Gospel today in the 1962 missile comes to us from Luke 7 verses 11-16. At that time, when Jesus went into a city that is called Name, and there went with him his disciples in a great multitude. And when he came nigh to the gate of the city, behold, a dead man was carried out, the only son of his mother, and she was a widow, and a great multitude of the city was with her, whom when the Lord had seen being moved with mercy towards her, he said to her, weep not, and he came near and touched the bear, and they that carried it stood still.

8:14And he said, young man, I say to thee, arise, and he that was dead sat up and began to speak, and he gave to him, but he gave him to his mother. And there came a fear upon them all, and they glorified God, saying, a great prophet is risen up among us, and God hath visited his people, the Gospel of the Lord. Laos Tb Christi, the great prophet has risen among us. That's a direct reference to what Moses would say in Deuteronomy, that one from among you is greater, it's coming that is greater than me. So this is one greater than Moses. He is raising people from the dead. The poor woman, not only was it her, her blood's child, her son, but this was her only means of support. So now she had literally nothing, no one to support her.

9:17Machiveli says the bereaved widow represents the church who bowels over each of her sons by mortal sin, dead to God, and Christ raises them mercifully to life and restores them to their now rejoicing mother. But I got to tell you a story. This past Sunday, at our parish, we go to a traditional mass parish. The Gospel was this one. This was the Gospel on Sunday. And as I went to mass, I sat there, you know, and mass had begun, and I'm sitting in the pew, and I noticed that most of the men are gone. And then my daughters fiance, he got up and he walked out, and I discovered that there was a child missing from one of the families that are parish. So I got up and I went out. And we're all searching this property, every square inch, two, three, four, five times. We can't find this little boy, little boy under 10. And we're all searching and searching and searching, 40 acres, woods,

10:19fields, buildings, culverts, ditches. We're calling his name. We're searching in the whole time, the entire time I kept thinking, this is a worst case nightmare scenario. As time went on, I kept saying to myself, this is not going to end well. How horrible this will be if this doesn't end well for this poor family who has six boys or six kids. I think most of them are boys, most are under the age of 10. And they now do not know where their little boy is. And as I was praying to St. Anthony, the Blessed Virgin Mary and all the angels and saints, including my guardian angel and the boys, we discovered at last the boy was safe. He was sound, completely healthy and happy, and there was no criminal intent involved. He was simply doing his little thing in his little quiet corner. And nobody could see him for some odd reason.

11:21God's grace, God's will be done in all things. And then it was after that that I went into mass to read the gospel for the day. That our Savior Jesus Christ restores to the mother, the lost child. And I thought how great and glorious is God? That he would teach us this lesson in reality, that he's trying to speak to us from his sacred word. Give praise to God today for he who was lost has been found. Praise be to Jesus Christ. Welcome back to a Catholic take a bold synthesis of information and inspiration of your host, Joe McClain. Praise be to God. It is good to be on with you. Coming up at 30 past, we're going to weigh into what Cardinal Burke had to say on the Sean Ryan podcast. It a lot to say actually, but I think what I think made the rounds today on the X

12:22was what he said about Moses writing the Pentateuch. We're going to talk about that with Mark Lambert from Catholic unscripted. But there's some other stories I want to jump in on Michael Haynes, Vatican journalist with the Catholic Harold. He has a great article. I'm going to link to it in the show notes. Academy for life president, Catholics can support imperfect youth, a nasi law. That's definitely one subject. And then there's another one about a lot of mass being canceled for the pilgrimage, the annual pilgrimage, the St. Peter's Basiliki joins us this afternoon. Good afternoon to you, Michael Haynes. Thanks for hanging out with us. Good afternoon, Jay. Good to be with you. Praise be to God and all things. Always appreciate you. Okay, so let's, I want to, let's start with the Latin mass one first, because the other one is going to need a little bit more. Let's just do this. So last year didn't Cardinal Burke say the Latin mass at St. Peter's Basilica and now all of a sudden they're canceling this. What's the story? That's right. So last year, Cardinal Burke said the mass in St. Peter's and it was viewed by a lot of attendees as quite a change.

13:23And one of which many people thought was a hopeful change for this year, obviously, and then going forward under Pope Leo, because in the last couple of years under Pope Francis, the pilgrimage had not received permission to have a mass actually in the Vatican. And for the couple of years before that, when permission had been granted for a mass, then it hadn't been granted for a preletit to offer the mass. So for Cardinal Burke to come and make a sort of almost sort of a grand return, if you like, of the traditional mass to the Vatican, it was a huge event, particularly because Cardinal Burke, Cardinal Burke, was persecuted under Pope Francis, people saw that aspect to the mass as well and they said, okay, this is a notable sign of change and pontificate change and direction in many ways. What we've learnt today is that the pilgrimage, the annual pilgrimage, will not be having mass in St. Peter's. It will have the Saturday mass in one of the people of the city,

14:23because in St. Mary Mages, so instead, what the pilgrims will do is, we will all process into St. Peter's normal and then we'll pray at the relics of St. Peter and then have to make our way across the town to St. Mary Mages. And this, according to what some sources are telling me, close to the organisation is because essentially the Secretary of State has informed the organisers that there will be no mass in the Vatican. Why the Secretariat is getting involved rather than the Archpriest of the Bistula, is very strange and it suggests to me that the level of opposition to the traditional mass amongst many of the old guard, as you like, in the Vatican, is still very strong and rank, particularly from attending the mass last year, many people at the Vatican were surprised by just how numerous the attendees were at the mass last year. And they'll be a little bit worried about that, that growing year on year, I think.

15:23So is it, I mean, I don't know if I was going to say is it fair to say, but perhaps maybe it's not even fair, but nonetheless, if the Pope doesn't directly say you're going to allow this, then the Bistula, the staff, who makes these decisions on a day-to-day basis are going to say no every time. In other words, they have to be told by the Pope or else the answer is no. Is that fair to say? I think so that the understanding is that Conor Burke's celebration of the mass last year was a fruit of his own meeting with the Pope during August last year, when he raised it with Pope Leo during that private encounter they had. Pope Leo doesn't seem to be the one to get too involved in many things. There are some issues which he does get involved in, as we saw with the Rubenic case, which we spoke about recently, but it seems on this issue he's quite happy to let either diocesan bishops or local bishops or Cardinals involved just handle it. And this case it seems to be the arch-priest of the Bar of the Basilica.

16:25Maybe Cardinal Parallel also is involved, if it's coming from the Secretary of State, could well be that Cardinal Parallel is somewhat leaning on Cardinal Gambetti to ensure the traditionalists do not have as warm a welcome in the Vatican as they did last year? How sad. We're like secondary citizens in Holy Mother Church to be traditional Catholics in a not a good situation and certainly not a good look. And I mean, what are the chances that Pope Leo will get it, will intervene yet again and say no guys this year they should have it too. You think he'll do that or is he just going to get out of it, get out of the middle of it? These are my, I think particularly now it's been announced with the schedule. I think it would be a little bit out of character for him to then intervene. Sad. But it would be very welcome, but I think the fact that the masses now will move from the Vatican is quite significant because it just further pushes that pilgrimage away. A strategy. Let's go to the other story, Catholicare, thecathacerald.com.

17:26We're going to put a link to it in the show notes. But Academy for Life president says Catholics can support imperfect euthanasia law. What is the Archbishop saying here? Right. So this is the President of the Motivical Academy for Life. He was speaking an interview a couple of days ago on the topic of assisted suicide and euthanasia. And it's something which the Italian bishops and Cardinals are interviewed on every couple of months. It's a very sort of current relevant topic in Italy. He stated, and I'll go there, the full quote in a place where we can delve through it. He stated, from the Catholic perspective, the issue boils down to assessing whether we are dealing with an imperfect law to which it would be nonetheless morally right to give one's consent. Given that Parliament might instead readily approve more permissive and libertarian laws that are far more detrimental to dignity of the sick and the value of life. The issue many people have with this is that firstly he doesn't outline in this hypothetical scenario

18:30whether an alternative law is on the table. So he doesn't show whether it's between an extremely horrendous euthanasia law or a slightly more curtailed euthanasia law. He just says Catholics can vote for an imperfect euthanasia law. But he also implicitly acknowledges in that statement that even a slightly tailed back euthanasia law would still be detrimental to the dignity of the sick and the value of human life because he describes alternatives as being far more detrimental. So in his logic, actually, he's actually undermining himself. He's arguing for Catholics to vote for something at the back of the box, which is directly undermining the sanctity of life. I just don't know how you limit evil. He's quoting JP too. It is basically what he's doing here. And we're limiting evil. But what evil are we limiting by allowing euthanasia exactly? These people are trying to kill themselves.

19:32So is there like a murderous gang of a band of people that would murder them unless they kill themselves? It feels to me and I would like you to correct me if I'm wrong about this, Michael Hanzes. It feels like he's playing fast and loose with the nuance of Catholic teaching, allowing the consequences of that to just, oh, it is what it is. You know, it just feels like he's playing with fire. Because the other thing, the other phrase I said at the top of the hour is, if you give him an inch, they take a mile. Scotland is now the one, more than the most, abortion, pro-abortion countries on the planet. If they catch you praying inside your house within a certain zone of abortion mills, they could arrest you. Like, that's how bad it is. Now they want to kill babies all the way up to birth. I mean, you give them a little bit, they keep taking it, they keep taking it, taking it. I see that with euthanasia, I see that with abortion and gay marriage and all the rest. Like, we can't be playing fast and loose with this stuff, can we?

20:35I completely agree. And that's why we have this understanding, if say, in the spiritual life, for instance, you can't remain stagnant, you're either progressing in the spiritual life or you're regressing. There's no space for just remaining in one constant state. And it's the same with all these moral questions. Every time there's a vote or there's a parliamentary move to allow some opening, for instance, whether it be for abortion or whether it be for euthanasia, that never remains the case. There's always a push the next year or the year after for more progressive laws. We've seen that in Canada, as you say, we're seeing it now in my own native UK, where they want further and further demands so that you can kill the baby in the womb at any point. So for the actual trip to advocate for Catholics to defend in law, or the killing of the old or the sick, is it following this exact same pattern? It's actually just giving Catholic support to this entire culture of death.

21:37And I think that's why many people find these statements so concerning, because the academy for life is the Vatican body, which should be leading the way in encouraging Catholics, first of all, to stand firm on these principles of morality, and to engage in high level theological debate or debate with parliamentarians in order to make the Catholic case. Instead, what it seems we're getting from the academy for life time after time, is just a constant way to compromise on morals, rather than encouraging us to stand firm to those same morals. As you said, nobody is forcing us with a gun to kill ourselves. If we go to the ballot box and vote for your furniture, that is a direct action we're doing. And we're called the Sixth and Humanity. It notes that you can tolerate a lesser moral evil if in order to have a greater good and he outlines the conditions in which you can do that.

22:38But you can never directly do evil so that good may come of it. And it's that large respect, which does see much for Bishop Pegaro, is encouraging Catholics to support, to directly support your thinking. Did he do this? Did he do this with contraception in the past? I think you mentioned this in your article. He did indeed, and that's the issue. And he's aware of the hot topic that's become because he's not responded to any questions on that. And that's one of my concerns as a reporter covering this academy and this individual is that he knows how to be very vague with his language. And when he steps in hot water, he just moves away from the issue. But the damage is already done. And he's undermining people's faith and undermining the firmness in which we should practice it, particularly the time when the sanctity of human life is under attack, like never really before in the legal system in countries across the world. Oh, and this guy was supposed to be like an upgrade from the previous Pontifical Academy president,

23:40but it turns out he actually worked well with the guy behind. Are we getting the same things like zero change? It seems to be, I think the status quo seems to have stayed the same. And until you have another gutting, if you like, of the Pontifical Academy of Life, but in the opposite direction, undoing that which was enacted by Pirifrancis, I don't think that many faithful Catholics are going to look to the Academy of Life for serious moral direction on this point. That's a strong statement to many people. You know, that's probably shocked to that, but this is true. We have statement like this coming out. Then you can't actually trust the judgments of these individuals. So yeah, it seems very much status quo in terms of continuing the legacy of Archbishop Micke and these more. Call me naive. Call me naive. But I would, I would, has you guys that most Catholics would want the Pontifical Academy for life to never support things like Euthanasia or abortion or contraception.

24:41But I mean, what I'm just a red trot, I suppose, because that seems rather bizarre to me. Can we make the Pontifical Academy for life great again? I doubt it, but you never know. Michael Haynes, thank you for your time today. I really appreciate your reportage. I want to encourage everybody to check out the article at thecathacherald.com. And we're going to link to it in the show notes. I'm also going to link to his post on X about the traditional Latin mass canceling us pray that Pope Leo steps in. Somehow doubt that's going to happen. I'm not going to hold my breath. But boy, it should you. Your holiness, I know you're listening. I know you watch the show regularly. Please get involved. We're begging you. Uh-uh. Come back to the break. Let's weigh in on Cardinal Berks. Big, big opportunity to proclaim the Catholic thinking on Scripture and Salvation. History to a huge 6.5 million audience on the Sean Ryan podcast. What did he say that triggered me? I'll tell you in two minutes. Don't go anywhere.

25:51Praise be to Jesus Christ. Welcome back to a Catholic take a bold synthesis of information and inspiration on your host. Joe McLean, praise be to God. It is good to be out with you. Cardinal Berk was on the Sean Ryan podcast talking about the Bible, the Old Testament, Salvation history. What an opportunity. You know, as I said, I've been praying for Sean Ryan for three or four years. Now, ever since I heard he was a fallout away Catholic, I started praying for him routinely. And now he's back into the church. He's got so many issues he's dealing with. And now he really wants to understand Scripture. So I mailed him a copy of my book with a personal note on it. And I'm praying for Sean, but big opportunity for Cardinal Berk. But he said something that upset some some some Catholics. It triggered me too. Just have a listen to this. Those are often called the book books of Moses that Moses wrote them all. We don't necessarily think that Moses wrote all five books. But and so there could be the exact number of authors I wouldn't be sure.

26:51I cringe at that. It's not is technically not wrong. But at the same time, I supercringe at that. And joining us to weigh in on this is a convert to the show Mark Lambert, co-founder of Catholic unscripted.com market afternoon. Thanks for hanging out with us. Hi, Joe. Thanks for having me on. Did you did you did you watch the how much of it did you watch the whole interview? I'll be about that bit, but you said me. You missed a lot, Ben. There is a lot more meat on that bone. Yeah, there's a lot more meat on that bone to be sure. And I'll bring up a few bits and maybe get you to comment on them. But let's just start with this Moses thing first. I woke up. I listened to it yesterday. I watched it yesterday. I was waiting for this this interview to drop. It was kind of a big deal. Sean's been on such a big roll of coast to ride. He's having he's he's basically got some demonic harassment, perhaps even possession issues. And he's admitted this publicly. He's gone to exorcisms father-lipperger being one of them. And he's really trying to learn his faith. He's going to mass daily.

27:53He's really trying. And so he wants to do this whole Bible series for his audience. 6.5 million subscribers. That's a few more than I've got anyway. And he starts with Cardinal Burke. And Cardinal Burke is giving him the Catholic breakdown. And you know, he's a Cardinal. I'm just a guy with a microphone. So what do I know? But at the same time, I feel like he's not wrong. But at the same time, there's some missed opportunity here. What was your reaction to him saying Moses? We don't necessarily believe Moses wrote all five books. What was your reaction to that? Well, that's the scholarly position. That's exactly what the church teaches on that issue. Does it stress me? Does it? I don't know. I think, you know, like, I mean, the sort of night in O60 Cray that some people are bringing up about,

28:54it gives a lot more latitude. It does. Yeah, then there's been sort of sighted against Cardinal Burke. And, you know, as someone who studied theology extensively, that's sort of the normative position. I don't really see it as being in any way controversial. It's, yeah, it's not controversial, which is why I thought it was interesting to even talk about. But I think it's missed opportunity. That's, I mean, he's not wrong. I'll read exactly what the 1906 statement was on this issue. It said, I think it was on question number two. It said, did Moses have to write every line himself? The answer was, this was out of the Vatican 1906. Does Mosaic authorship require that Moses wrote everything with his own hand or dictated it to all scribes? Or may one hold that the conceived that he conceived the work under inspiration, entrusted the writing to one or more others who faithfully rendered his meaning, added nothing against his will, omitted nothing.

30:03And that Moses then approved the finished work and the public and publish it under his name. The answer to the Vatican gave was no to the first part and yes to the second. In other words, he doesn't have to write every line. And he keeps welcome to use scribes as he needs to. And I think this is the missed opportunity. I think what the problem is is there could be many Catholics, non-Catholics who are now watching this Cardinal of the Prince of the Church say this, and they're going to say, they're going to go in the complete opposite direction with it, Mark. They're going to say, you see, they totally deny the inerrancy of Scripture, even though that's not what he did. You see, you see, they deny that Moses is the author of this. It's like, I think that's the reaction, the sort of the tread flinching here that's, that I'm having a little bit. I just know and I can almost hear the voices that they're going to totally deny now. Instead of the Catholic position is, yes, Moses is the author, but the versions we have aren't the originals.

31:03And Moses was certainly welcome to use scribes, just like Thomas Aquinas did. But that doesn't mean he's not the author, right? Yeah, well, in some sense. And I suppose that's the question you have to say to the criticism, in what sense do you want Moses to be the author? Otherwise, I have a problem with this joke where it's like, you know, what are we sticking to? Surely, if we've got confidence in our faith and in sacred Scripture, then we don't have to, you know, we're interested in finding out the truth of things. Well, I don't think there's, I know any Protestant, serious Protestant biblical scholars who would contradict what Burke said. I think the problem more is that Cardinal Burke, God loving, I think he's a hero of the faith, but he, you know, I've actually met him in person and he's not the most, what's the word? He doesn't tell the cross. He's not, he's not the most charismatic speaker in the world.

32:05And even though the content of what he says is always excellent, you know, so you kind of think like if Sean was trying to evangelize his audience, it might have been better to have had someone like Father Mixmiths, you know, someone who's who has been a prisoner of faith. Yeah, I'm sorry. I sort of imagine that he's received a list of Catholic Bible scholars that he should interview. Scott Hans is going to be on that list. Cardinal Burke mentioned him in this interview. I imagine Mike Schmitz is going to be on that list, Father Mike, because he has the world's largest podcast, the Bible in a year. Like that went super mega viral, so I can't imagine he doesn't make that list. I would love to see a few other scripture scholar Catholic scripture scholar professors make that list. Scott Hans himself wrote a great book on criticizing the historical critical method of the Bible. It's called politicizing the Bible. It's a fantastic book.

33:07And he goes into like why modern scholars really started to cast doubt upon the historicity of scripture. And I think that's really what's at stake here, at least in my concern for what Cardinal Burke said, but they're one of the bigger like missed opportunities when Sean Ryan who's simply just trying to be a sponge. That's what he's doing. He's trying to be a sponge and good on him for it too. And Cardinal Burke is trying not to like get lost in the and the details, I suppose, keep it, keep it high level, keep, you know, it's a survey as what he's doing. But like I would have loved for Cardinal Burke to say never what and I said it's because I say it in my book. That's why I wanted to say it. It'd be better if he quoted me. I'm just teasing, but never was there a time when there was sacred scripture and not the Ecclesia, the assembly, the people of God. First always the people of God, which is the custodian of the divinely revealed word of God.

34:07It's always in that order. We aren't the people of the book. The book is from the people. And even in the Old Testament, there was always the people first. Then there was the scriptures that came from those people that were divinely inspired and collected. And when the when Christ and the apostles had to, especially their successors had to decide what was and what wasn't in the Old Testament, you know, they had to make decisions because there was no table of contents of books in the Old Testament that was handed on. This is the official ratified list, you know, the successors of the apostles. They had to determine these things. I feel like that was part of the missed opportunity. Like that nuance should have been said. Do you think that's fair? Yeah, I think that's probably, you know, part of what I'm trying to say about the way that it was approached. And I think if you had someone, if you look at someone like Scott Hahn, you know, no one would reasonably accuse him of wanting to undermine biblical inspiration. And the way that he explains it is that he takes mosaic authorship extremely seriously and thinks that mosaic influences historically,

35:13defensible, but he also recognizes that Catholics are not required to believe that Moses personally wrote every word of the five books as they now stand. Now distinction isn't modernism. That's perfectly orthodox Catholic Catholic biblical scholarship. And I think that, you know, this is we don't need the Bible to be something that was, you know, like that Joe Smith found buried in a hole written on gold plates. You know, it doesn't have to be that the angel Gabriel dictated the Quran and every word of it was the dictation of God. That's not how we see the Bible, you know, just the very word Bible, you know, from Biblos, which means a library. It's a collection of books and it contains lots of different literary genres. And it's understanding that this is an immense gift that's been given to us under the inspiration of God that teaches us so much.

36:13I think it's understanding that the beauty and complexity adds more to that. It doesn't take anything away from it. Still, I'm going to cringe even further when he gets his first Protestant so-called scholar up there. And then they start trying to dismantle everything the Cardinal said, which again, I don't have any, I don't, I mean, the Cardinal says technically is good and true and I don't have issues with it. I'm just, I'm feeling like the optics here, the missed opportunity and the optics of it are going to not going to go over well. And a lot of these, I think these non-Catholic Protestant scholars are going to start to dismantle some of these arguments or at least attempt to. I've been doing a lot of that lately on the show, sort of refuting West Hoff's false claims about the Bible itself, you know, the Canada scripture, been doing a lot of that here on the show lately. So I feel like there's like Catholics, Catholics need another Bible, but they don't do that. Like, why don't, why don't more Catholics study their scripture? Why don't, why don't we dive into the Bible with the zealous and fervency?

37:20Is that a tread thing? Like, is it a tread thing to not do it? But it's like a Catholic convert, like I'm a convert to the church. Like, is it just because we have the zealousy of converts that were into that? Like, is it not Catholic to study one's Bible? So I was in the Basilica of the Immaculate Conception in Washington DC a few weeks ago. And the thing that struck me most about it was that the biblical narrative is emblazoned on the walls in Mosaic in a very powerful way. And I think historically that's been the way that we understand the Bible as Catholics. It's intrinsic to our faith. So the Protestant application is almost a different one. And if you think about the contradiction between the way that we say our lady appears to simple children quite often, or the lack not to scholars necessarily, but the people who have got great faith.

38:25And they don't need to know scripture in order to have that faith today. And there's a thing about Protestantism that I think it's almost like you need to be able to, you know, that it's not the sort of faith that a child can pick up really because you have to be able to read, you have to be able to understand scripture, which you know, can be it's an ancient book, it's quite complex. So I think that the Catholic faith is very accessible to everyone. And it doesn't rely on scripture study. Now for those of us who are like myself and I know yourself, who are fascinated by this great gift, this pearl of great wisdom that's been given to us, then that gives us a fantastic opportunity to dig into it and to learn all about it. And you know, all the different facets of scripture, scholarship, scholarship. But I don't think that it's essential to be a devout Catholic, do you? I don't know, I'm torn on this issue. Mark, I'm going to be honest with you.

39:27I'm a little bit torn on it because I hear, I've seen this argument, I've heard this argument. And I'm like, I guess maybe it's because I'm a convert group in the church of Christ Sunday school that I've always just had this different idea, but the Bible perhaps as my bias, you know, impacting this. But even like dare I say as a tried Catholic, even Dave Airboom says the Catholics must study their scripture. We must dive in. I talked to a bishop Strickland about that. Yes, or last week and I actually posted a long form highlight video on the channel today about that. So I think as Catholics, I don't, I feel like there's no excuse. Literacy is an all time high access to not only the scriptures, but access to great Catholic scholarship, which is replete and plentiful. There's no excuse. You do not need to go read some Protestant scholar when you have an ocean of great biblical, uh, Patriarch, uh, you know, the gift of the scripture study available to you more in two minutes.

40:40Praise be to Jesus Christ. Welcome back to a Catholic take a bold synthesis of information and inspiration of your host, Joe McLean praise pretty God. It is good to be on with you. Let me tell you about our friends at Catholic match.com sponsors of the station of the cross Catholic media network. And the Joe McLean YouTube channel so grateful for their sponsorship. They make it possible for us to get up and do what we do Monday through Friday here on a Catholic take in the station of cross Catholic media. And we're so grateful. That's a dad who's got kids discerning marriage or if you know any singles that are discerning marriage, you want them to have a tool that cuts through the noise because you want a spouse who's 100% on the team with Bishop Athanasius Niter says 95% just won't do. It's got to be 100 and hundreds of thousands of singles on a platform free to download in your iOS or Android app store and create a free profile. And you can start asking the tough questions. And I would encourage you to do that. Ask the tough questions. You don't want to just leave it up to emotions because it's a sacrament marriage. It's an actual sacrament.

41:42It's a man and woman committed and sacrament and sacrifice and love to get each other to heaven and their kids also that God entrust them with. And God's actual grace is communicated through the sacrament through the spouses. You got to take that seriously. It's not an emotion in any good time. It's a sacrament. We should treat it that way. And Catholic match.com is trying to do that very thing to build strong Catholic families. Around the world. I've got thousands of testimonies now as a result of it. Catholic match.com. Check them out. Catholic match.com. We're having a conversation with Mark Lambert from Catholic scripted. Catholic unscripted. Forgive me. Boy, my brain is shut off this afternoon. Catholic unscripted.com. Catholic unscripted.com about is eminus Cardinal Leo Burke on the Sean Ryan podcast. Great opportunity. I love Cardinal Burke. By the way, I just am thinking. I think there could have been a bad guy. There could have been a better way to phrase of some things. But I want to put another log in the fire here. This is a clip about him speaking at the Blessed Virgin Mary. Have a listen.

42:43Jacob covenant and David. That's five. I think five would be. It would be the right correct number. Who was David? David was the people at a certain point. I got the wrong time stamp here. I want to say he spoke of the Blessed Virgin Mary as not being an unwed mother, which is how she is often characterized. And it always makes me cringe. You know, when they try to say that the Blessed Virgin Mary had an unplanned pregnancy, that kind of thing. Let's have a listen. Jesus sometimes people say today that Mary Mary was the first unmarried mother. And that's not true. Because she was perfectly married to Joseph before the angel Gabriel arrived in the Jewish law. There were two stages to marriage. And the first stage was the contract of marriage. And from that moment on, the couple were husband and wife.

43:47But then there was a period of time before the husband would lead the wife into his home. Mark, I want to bring in on this because I think this was actually one of the better parts of the interview was that Cardinal Burke did a great job of trying to help Sean understand the role of the Blessed Virgin Mary as Queen mother. As intercessor, the woman of Revelation 12. And how often even Catholics, but let alone non-Catholics, get that wrong like she is, you know, the unplanned pregnancy, this crazy analogy that people have to make. I know you can get a chance to watch the whole interview, but I wouldn't get your thoughts on that. Yeah, I think you are absolutely right. It's a horrendous thing when people try and say that the Holy family were illegal immigrants. Yes. And they're trying to make all these sort of seamless garment analogies, aren't they? And we know what they're doing. They're trying to subvert their progressive politics into the biblical narrative, which is a real shame because the truth is much more important, isn't it?

44:56The truth that Mary was someone who had a choice and chose to participate in this incredible work that God had planned. Right. Yeah. Just yesterday I wrote, in fact, I was giving out a cheat sheet. I've been doing these cheat sheets, these PDFs where I break down some of these concepts and give you lots of resources. Yesterday I read from St. Andrew of Crete in his discourse on the nativity and it is absolutely stunningly beautiful. And this is eighth century. He dies in 740 in Crete. I also read from the Puerto Rican evangelical James, which is mid-second century, some more between 145, 161, 171, 18, some more in there. And already the early church had a huge esteem, a beautiful devotion to the Blessed Virgin Mary. To the point by the set by the eighth century, St. Andrew of Crete sees her as he calls her the gateway, the doorway to salvation.

45:59And even to even says in his homily that there is no other woman, and I often say this, like it's not like the Lord said to the angel Gabriel, all right Gabriel, tell you what, start out in Nazareth, okay? See Miriam, she's in Nazareth. If she says no, go see Betty in the one village over and see if Betty will do it. Like there's no, there was only one name on that list. And she had complete free will, didn't she? Where it's amazing the way that our Protestant brothers and sisters completely miss Mary out of the Bible. And in my little Bible study class at the Baptist church, I was amazed to find my Protestant brothers and sisters arguing that Mary wasn't really involved in she was just like a surrogate and that God had insane, you know, sort of put Jesus like a little homunculus or something. Into Mary's womb without any sort of participation whatsoever. And then when you start going into, you know, the beginning of John's gospel or looking at, you know, the narrative in Luke and they're blown away by seeing stuff that they've never read.

47:15They've never seen to have read before. And of course, we know as Catholics that Mary is the nexus from stereo or I'm into say that it's fundamentally Christological that the foundation of Christology is understanding Mary. And that's the way that the church fathers solved all the Christological questions, you know, like the, you know, the communication of idioms was by looking at the incarnation and the way that the church was looking at the end of the world. And the creation and Mary's fear. So if we miss out that we're, you know, we're missing out everything. The whole lot in a way we're missing out the whole purpose of the incarnation. Let me go to this other clip before we run out of time in. When he says strike the shepherd and scatter the sheep. In other words, this is how the devil works. He corrupts the shepherds and then the sheep are scattered. And then don't we see that in the whole history of the church too? This reminds me, Mark, my dad asked me years ago, oh, that at Pope of yours, he says some crazy stuff. And I leaned in and I said, Dad, you have no idea how bad, how bad it can be in certain hierarchical circles.

48:26I think this blows Protestant's minds because I think many of them naively think that we, we put our head in a sand. We don't pay attention. We don't, like we just give a pass to all of the evil that happens whether they're wearing collars or miters or whatever. I mean, they think that don't they? Yeah, definitely. Well, I think they've got a false idea of of people in fellability, haven't they? They think it's impeccability. And that what they think that Catholics believe that the Pope can't say or do anything wrong. But of course, that's not what we believe. We believe that, you know, the the folks can make prudential statements and sometimes they're horribly mistaken, you know, we've just had, you know, in my opinion, probably one of the most disastrous papacy's in the history of the church. And so, yeah, that's it. But it's the whole model that again, going back to the Bible in scripture is given to us is Peter and Judas and the, you know, the sons of thunder and the apostles constantly making mistakes, constantly getting it wrong.

49:29I wonder if God was trying to prepare us for something with all of us. Exactly. We can't we we cannot have our utopia on this planet. Can we? Like we, I think the Lord is making it clear. You are not going to have your perfect little bubble where nothing ever goes wrong and everything is pristine and perfect. You have to live in the hot mess that is this fallen world until you are you make it to the beat of evisión. Mark Lambert, so grateful for your time today. I want to send everybody to Catholic unscripted dot com Catholic unscripted dot com. Mark always appreciate your opinion and your feedback. God love your brother. We're going to go into the after show and maybe take your Catholic take. What do you think? How did Cardinal Burke do? I'd love to get your opinion on that. You can hang out with us on the live video streams. If you go to the station of the cross dot com forward slash a CT. We'll see you guys back here tomorrow for another round of the Catholic day.

50:29Good afternoon everybody. What is cooking? If you're new here, please subscribe. That would be helpful. That'd be pretty awesome. Praise be to God. And by the way, if you are my cheat sheets, I still have yet to get this one up on the website. But I will be emailing it to everybody on the email list. So we'll hit your inbox this week no matter what happens. But hopefully by tonight, I will get the Mary Mary at her birthday, feast day up on the on my website, Joe McLean dot com. But if you go to Joe McLean dot com, there's a link at the top called cheat sheets. And this is where I'm storing all of it now. It's it's an exchange. It's a you know, you got to give me something I give you something. You got to give me your email. That allows me to harass your inbox on occasion. And I think it's a good fair trade deals. So you'll get you'll get a little download button. And you'll be able to download the cheat sheet. I also include timeline on there of all of the oldest documents that reference the Blessed Virgin Mary outside of sacred scripture.

51:32So that's on there as well as a breakdown of the 12th chapter of my book on Mary's role as intercessor. That is also on the cheat sheet. It's right there. Praise be to God. Catholic by design. Check it out. By the way, you can also still get the where was the cannon only fixed at Trent is something we touched on in the show in the conversation with Mark was on the candidate scripture. And there's something that I pointed out two weeks ago when we were doing the debunking of West Huff's you know incorrect claims about the canon of signature scripture prior to counsel Trent is there was no canon of Old Testament books that was handed on to the to the church in the New Testament that did not exist. So we went through all of that and you can see that in this cheat sheet here I would recommend that and you can get that one right now if you go to my website you can see where St Peter is in the Bible we did that last week.

52:34The assumption of the Blessed Virgin Mary a cheat sheet on the reign of the Antichrist is there in the canon soon I'll put the nativity of the Blessed Virgin Mary up as well. If there's a particular topic you're interested in you want me to talk about let me know let me know. But what did you think what were your thoughts about Cardinal Burke on Sean Ryan's podcast you know overall I'm not displeased about Cardinal Burke I just feel like when so many non Catholics falling away Catholics agnostic Muslims Hindus seeks a guy named Bob and a girl named Sally are all watching and listening. I just would have preferred a little bit more meat on the bone a little bit more precision but I mean that's easy for me to say it's easy for me to be a backseat quarterback honestly I mean my opinion and a nickel pretty much get you know where but none of the last words my thoughts I love to know what you guys think about it let me know in the comments below. But I was pretty pleased with the section on our lady.

53:37I thought you did a fairly decent job keeping it high level but at the same time trying to help them understand in glazed contra moondom good afternoon to you thanks for being a member of the channel appreciate you. Mary's a blessed mother of God and deserves to be venerated as such Robert you are correct I'm on the team totally agree. Get to eat meat on your journey cigar mode gets to eat meat adventuring this past week God's great outdoors yay and amen I'm jealous I wish I could go adventuring. Hello 334 one of the one thing that confused me about Cardinal Burke's interview. Is he said there were 45 or 44 books in the Old Testament okay so. That's that that's early on. That that comes very early on let me go to that point. Hold on need to find the time stamp exactly 30 K hold on let's go to.

54:37I studied them intensely my another. And that do you know how many how many books do they so through to formulate the Bible. Actually I have to confess say. I love the scriptures and I of course studied them intensely my I'm not a what they call scripture scholar in a sense of an expert but one thing that is. I feel like that's where we're going to get in trouble right you know it's just like that right there. You're a prince of the church now I'm not trying to I'm not again I'm not really trying to be critical of his evidence I'm really really not I love Cardinal Burke. I'm just like cringing because I know like with my family watches this my non Catholic family members. Like this is going to make them feel like see those Catholics don't know the Bible they're wrong but this I feel like they're going to keep saying they're going to they're going to say that very. How should we see. Typical and and of the scriptures is how many times the books of the Bible make reference to other books of the Bible when sees the unity.

55:46In the in the whole of the scriptures and they there is a wonderful unity there and their things for instance it can seem to us less important for instance in the book of. I don't have the right time to run and I have a bit of a little bit of a lot of God is giving very deep appreciable means with forth. And people can think of that as less as a manifesting worship him in the way that ends their genesis oh God made what he from here and so that's a. First very fundamental essential teaching. But there are there be more or less. Here is the book you think that how many authors are there. Oh that some of the books are written by the same author I there be more or less. Forty or so authors the five books first five books called the penitucer so okay there was two there was another bit and that might have been actually earlier I just don't know the time stamp. When he said it but it was like there was a good brief thing about how some publishers and I'm paraphrasing him because I remember exactly how he said it and I can't recall the exact time stamp if.

56:54Is your James you can find her for anybody has a time stamp I'll go to it let me know in the chat. But there was a brief statement he makes before this point where he basically says that some publishers combined some books and some broke them out in and okay and that's a valid point for instance in my. In my do a Rams version of the of my Bible in the Old Testament like right now if you went to the to the tape go ahead pull out your Bibles because I know you have them because your Catholics so you obviously keep your Bibles closed right. Right right but in my do a Rams version I don't have. I don't have first and second Samuel I don't have that at all I have first king second kings third kings for four things you see so. Those books are number definitely depending on like if you have the you got maybe an RSVCE you're going to have first and second Samuel you're first king second kings first and second Samuel and whereas I have first kings second kings third kings fourth kings and then I have first.

58:01Parola Parola. Pullman on I can't even say correctly you know and second is a second version of that so it's like they they name the books differently in the do a Rams versions which is based on the last and vulgate then say more modern translations and some publishers of combined books and that's what he's referring to so he's what he and I my interpretation and I don't have the time stamp I wish I did. But my interpretation of that was it's not like there was less information less actual words or content it says that they organized it differently that's what he was saying there here what he's saying is the authors because some authors wrote more than one book or the law. So the books are written by the same author I there be more or less 40 or so authors the five books first five books called the penituk or the law. Those are often called book books of Moses that Moses wrote them all we don't necessarily think that Moses wrote all five books but and so there could be the exact number of authors I wouldn't be sure but any number of authors.

59:12Well I guess what I'm getting at is several different authors over thousands and thousands of years is and it formulates one story yes it references itself over 62,000 times yeah and I think this is beautiful right I mean again I've been praying for Sean for four years at least and I am very happy to hear that he's in the church I'm I'm concerned for him and his family that he's you know got so much demonic harassment. Going on in his life right now and I pray for his deliverance I pray that you know perhaps perhaps he's continuing to undergo this because he makes it clear to Cardinal Burke that that it's continuing to manifest even though he's been to a few different exorcisms but even the exorcist will tell you that it's not a one and done situation most of the time. What for the serious cases so I'm happy for Sean I'm glad he's on a journey when I mailed him a copy of my book Catholic by design I didn't ask for anything I didn't want him to like reach back and you know or doing interview like none of that I didn't want to promote the book I just said hey I've been praying for you my family's prank for you I think you're on a journey please keep going it's amazing and then I said I think this book will help you better understand sacred scripture and I left that that and will you ever see me.

1:00:32And will you ever see it I don't know there's a chance because the where I mailed it to is legit it's it goes to the Sean Ryan show so but he probably gets a truck backed up to the doc every morning full of packages that people send his way when you got an audience of 6.5 million subscribers you know my book is probably lost in the sea of stuff so will you ever see it I can't say but I sure hope so. I'm happy shons on this journey I just that. Sean is still going to hear an earful I guarantee he's already got in and dated with text messages and private messages and emails and just comments on you to you can't talk you know these these cards like you know paddocks these these you know horrible on you know they're just outside you can't do not save you know they whatever whatever. And like to Sean no better I see for like prepare like I'm concerned by that number one number two is going to have a lot of these non Catholic scholars on and.

1:01:33I just like I want him to like get the goods I never learned the gravity magnitude of sacred scripture especially the old testament being revealed in the new. I never learned that as a Protestant no matter how many Protestant services I went to Bible studies and Sunday schools never never never never never never. It was only in the Catholic church that I discovered the depth richness and beauty of sacred scripture in the story of salvation history which is why I published this book which is why I've led a 13 part Bible study for my ACT insiders on salvation history went from Genesis to the book of Revelation because I'm. Passion about that and when Sean asked these questions I just wanted to say oh not that I mean not that I'm not equating myself or comparing myself to his Eminence Cardinal Burke not at all forgive me I'm not that I'm suggesting. But I'm like I just want to tell him I want to make clear to him in his audience never was there a time in the history of creation when God's holy word was not being steward and protected cared for curated.

1:02:43By the people of God first the people of God. Then the word of God a written down inspired authors writing writing God's word down that's the design that is by design I actually talk about that in the book in the in the book in fact in the introduction I go over that very point never was there a time when the word of God existed outside of the people of God the Ecclesia the church. The assembly the church exists by design to be the guardian and steward of God's divinely revealed word and that is by that is that is the design and I really wanted that point to come out I felt like it was only vaguely hit upon I don't know I just I could just I was sort of talking to my phone the whole time I just like you're in and say this say that what am I I'm an idiot what are you going to do fill up Sean is going through what many of us veterans have before him prior during and after service he'll come out OK I think so too Philip I think he's going to come out OK I think he's on a journey he's going to daily mass praise be to God he's seeing and talking to the right Catholics praise be to God so I'm incredibly hopeful for him and I'm excited because he's got this massive platform with which he is going to help and share.

1:04:04And share a Catholic thought theology philosophy ideas in ways that I could never dream of doing right so I think it's amazing Sean Ryan has become the largest Catholic podcaster on the planet how amazing is that I this is a when this is like in this is like getting St Paul to convert from salt to Paul and be on the team I think it's amazing. Inglace contra moondom says also Sean has to stop using cuss words it's a journey he needs to read the book of James that's how I stopped costing about seven years ago I think you're right about that too you know my wife got turned on to Sean Ryan a couple of years ago I think it was when Jim Kovizel was on you know it was awesome you know and then you got father of the ripper there and he's cursing now here's the thing how women perceive cursing and how men perceive cursing are kind of two different things but at the same time you know one of the reasons why I I will praise be to Jesus I start my segments I start my show off that way I say that frequently is because I'm trying to do active

1:05:11reparation for for so much foulness that has come out of my mouth over many years I'm trying to use my mouth on a more positive way after having used it in such a negative way for so long and I think Sean will get there you know but like I had a mystical encounter with Jesus in April 2002 I've told you guys this so many times purity chastity was one of the main things that came out of that I had to look it up in a dictionary didn't know what it meant but I really felt you know I was feeling compelled that I needed to grow and virtue and holiness and I remember I was on the phone one day I think with my dad and I'm f bomb this f bomb that f bomb the other thing my dad just said can you do me a favor would you stop using that word please when you talk to me and it was like a slap across the face but in a good way and I was like you know what you're right like I'm why am I talking this way like is this speech gentifying no it's not so from that day forward I have I have attempted to not use that that language now maybe I have lesser versions of it that I still slip in there I still use on occasion so I'm not perfect and nobody is so even though Sean Ryan has had his own bout of mystical experiences and or scary demonic ones

1:06:31he's clearly on a journey which I am grateful for but he's clearly not arrived yet neither have I and neither of any of us so we have to keep pre-inform Sean is going to do a podcast on the new testament anybody know who he's having well his first the old testament was Carlin of Burke but just the other day Sean I think it was on was an on Labor Day Monday Labor Day Sean put out a video basically talking about the release of the Cardinal Burke episode in the start of the series on scripture and he said he's going to have all kinds of scholars Protestants Catholics and everybody in between so it's going to be a multi year multi show is going to have a bunch of people on but I was guessing based on based on the on the assumption that I have no doubt that Father Ripperger has already handed Sean Ryan a whole list of names these are the people you should interview on your show about the Bible so cardinal Burke has already mentioned doctor Scott Han so I'm an imagine we're going to see Scott Han on the show that would be great there's a bunch of other great Catholic biblical scholars that are fantastic I would love to see William Martian from

1:07:53Christendom boy his lectures from 15 or 20 years ago fantastic his he and Father Mitch Pacquat teamed up to do a debate against I think it was James White and some others about 25 30 years ago and it was just like mind blowingly amazing William Martian or fantastic biblical scholar out of Christendom College I mean there's a lot of great Catholic biblical scholars out there I just was hanging out with Edward three a couple of weeks ago when San Antonio he's fantastic you know there's some great ones but I'm a big fan of John Bergsmum brand Petry brand Petry's work on Jesus and the Jewish roots of the Eucharist is truly great groundbreaking not really groundbreaking but amazing you know it really it just synthesizes this really scholarly stuff and brings it makes it more approachable for the rest of us I just think it's great could you imagine Mel Gibson on his show yeah he could totally get Mel Gibson and I wouldn't be surprised if we don't see Mel Gibson soon on the

1:08:59Sean Ryan podcast because Mel is having to hit the he's got to hit the press right he's got to get the word out he's got the crash of the Christ coming back into theaters in 4k so he's got to promote that and then of course he's got to promote his resurrection films so he's going to be he's going to be beaten the bush he's going to be going on all the podcast of course he was on not even all that long ago what's his name's Joe Rogan's podcast so I have no doubt at all we'll see Mel Gibson on the Sean Ryan podcast soon we'll see um Phillip says the best thing about Sean I think our hope is he just is who he is he is talking he's talking to what he's taking us on his journey he is not grifting like many podcasters only trying to hit what is trending for compensation yeah I would say that's one thing as a guy who as I've interviewed literally thousands of people in my career and that's not

1:09:59as the standard exaggeration I've literally interviewed thousands so I've interviewed a lot of people I have a lot of experience interviewing people one thing I really have and I've always appreciated this about Sean is he doesn't pretend to be what he's not like he like for instance when he's he's he's he's interviewing Burke here and there's like this moment where Burke stops and Sean doesn't try to fill the void he just lets it sit for in silence he does that often doesn't he I guess the guy who interviews people that is like that is the biggest no no in broadcast media you never let silence happen you always must the the train is rolling you gotta keep going no matter what happens your your guest has a heart attack and you know dies on set well guess what the show must go on so you know guest loses connection their internet's all flanky or whatever like you just got to keep rolling and that's I was trained that way I you know I'm in that business so

1:11:02when I see Sean pause and think and he thinks and he's pondering he's really thinking about what they said and what question he wants to ask next as a guy who's interviewed people man did that speak to me I'm like whoa I would never in a million years do that ever stop and think stop and ponder that consider what I want to ask next I would have already had that worked out I've got my cheat sheets I've got my notes I've already I already have the flow of the conversation I already know where I wanted to go not Sean and it's almost like it's almost like when Jesus brings a little infant amongst the apostles you must be innocent it's like this little child in order to inherit the kingdom of God kind of like that I was I'm like man that's I'm jealous so I wish I wish I had had that wherewithal to just be present and not not overthink it sometimes um

1:12:05Chester tins just Dr. Peter Krief would be awesome on the Sean Ryan show Yeah, he would be I would say he'd be great in philosophy that's for sure I would say he's probably not my go-to pick for anything for scripture scholarship But it's not to say he doesn't know his Bible he does I used to love listening to Dr. Peter Craves like he had he used to on his website I don't know if it's still there but used to be just like a whole list of lectures he's given over the years and he did this whole series on Lord of the Rings that I just absolutely loved And I'd listen to him over and over and over again But he he's a philosopher so everything is is all Phil philosophy versus just pure scripture scholarship um Land worker garden of Soul welcome back says justice suggestion But if you really want to punch the devil in the face pray a rosary for the conversion of George sorrows And others like him on that note god bless got a run well god. Let me thank you for hanging out. Thanks for stop him by

1:13:11um De Carre needs to stop hanging out hanging out with Rogan Mel needs to stop hanging out with Rogan I don't know. I mean I I thought it was amazing when Sean started interviewing these Catholics. He had Jim Kavizelon and then Then he had a bunch of other Catholics on like Father Ripperger and and uh Uh Dan Rehill has been on and I mean a bunch and I'm thinking man that's great. I mean like what a great witness These people are for the Catholic faith To such a large audience that I think it's amazing Drew black Thanks for being on thanks for being a member of the team says creeped is one in a million he is he's amazing Doug Sean flies by the seat of his pants frequently. Yeah, you could tell It's true um

1:14:11Michelle says Sean asks dumb questions that most are afraid to ask that's what I love about it's like naive And it looks like it's innocent. There's like an innocent quality to that. Isn't there like that's how I'm interpreting that Let me know if you take it differently Not into his conspiracy artists on the show though He's with Tucker and Joe Rogan can interview anyone he wants Yeah, I'm jealous. That's the one thing I would say as a guy who does this for a living. I am super jealous. I If I had to choose If producer James said to me All right, Joe You can choose do you want to interview Tucker Carlson Sean Ryan or The guy that they get to find anybody on planet earth to to interview Like who who is the who is the you know the The intern who has access to the roll it x the the person who's never whose name will never be known on planet earth

1:15:14But that guy has everyone's contact Who would you prefer to interview my answer is going to be that guy not Sean Ryan not Tucker Carlson I would love to know The kind I would love to see the how the the You know the the food is made on the back end. I would love to see how they reach people like male Gibson how they reach The unreachable for people like me I would absolutely love to talk to that person for 10 minutes. That would be so amazing Um got to run god bless you too. Thank you. Inglis for being on we do appreciate you If I had to choose between Tucker Carlson or Sean Ryan I would choose Sean Ryan Although although If you get a chance to talk to Tucker Tucker Tucker Tucker's heard some solid Catholic arguments But he's denies them. He's not Catholic. He has no intention to become a Catholic Wouldn't it be an an awesome opportunity to plan a seed in his heart? I think so

1:16:18I think it would be um Carl Kelly bishops Schneider what about him? He would be great in the Sean Ryan podcast. I think he would be totally amazing And he would be great scripture scholar as well I've had the great pleasure of interviewing him a number of times When I was doing the morning show now that I'm in the afternoons. I can't really interview him anymore unless I pre-record it Deez Zoomers don't know what a rola dex is. Do you know what a rola dex is James? Yes, I do I rest my case They know what a rola dex is. I'm barely a zoomer though. You can't really count me Okay, what are if you're then what are you? I'm like the first year of it So I'm right on the right on the fringe in your cusp So you are this close to not knowing common things that were known 10 years ago Depends on what you would consider commonly known Roll it x Well, I knew that so hey, that's a start

1:17:18So I'm doing something right you are it's true. Moui ties as I'm I'm new at all of this I returned to the faith for a year now praise be to God welcome home. So glad you're here praise be to God um If you really want a great book other than mine, which is not a great book, but I think it's okay Catholic by design I would I would encourage you to get that book if you want a different book I would say get dr. Scott Hans a father who keeps his promises. I quote that in my book several times I gave an entire 13-part Bible study just on that one book alone It is easy to read super simple and profoundly A capable of expanding your understanding of salvation history in the sacred scripture I highly recommend it It'll give you that 60,000-foot view I dive a little bit more in detail and deeper on certain key aspects in my book a Catholic by design like on

1:18:19typology in particular the blessed virgin Mary the hierarchy the church the sacraments You know the structure of the church the exact reason why we have it the way it is Is because it was designed that way from the beginning and I show that in sacred scripture in the Old Testament and and the new But Scott Hans gives you that 60,000-foot view of salvation history going through the covenants and it's just so good Recommended highly Sean could have interviewed pastor Jimmy FJ where Where do you think that interview would go I'd pay money for that one father father Father Jimmy Father Jimmy It's the bridge just the we're just doing the bridge thing with father Jimmy today I just can't see I can't see Sean interviewing father Jimmy. I can't see father Jimmy coming on pastor Jimmy coming on to To Sean Ryan's podcast it'd be kind of funny though Here's the question hat no we should start a whole new game show

1:19:20I know I just actually wear this whole new game show I need game show music and and sound effects fixing you depend on me To has producer James ever heard of your old boomer type reference Come on down The answer to the rotary phone is yes. I have dialed the rotary phone. Have you really you know for owned one But I have dialed one yes Can I just say that today I think I can't remember was it Facebook knows Twitter was Twitter On Twitter there was an ad on my feed today For a device like a phone a handheld phone from 40 years ago that USB C plugs into your actual Smartphone so you can hold it like you did when you were a kid. I've seen with them The cord and everything That's funny Who remember my son was come I was getting on my one of my sons the other day Because he was on the phone house phone hiding in his room talking to his friends or whatever for like ever and I'm like do what are you doing my come there

1:20:24Go stand in the kitchen like I had to do when I was your age with the cord attached to the wall All right pal stop hiding in your room As I live and breathe Um Hmm Robert Tucker Carlson needs to convert to Catholicism. Yes. He does and so does everybody else a moody tie girl uh Send us an email if you do you live in the United States or do you live elsewhere Send me an email you can do that ACT at the station of the cross.com. It doesn't come directly to me. Go through producer James But if you send me an email with your address I can I'll may have free copy my book autographed just to say thank you for being on the team If you're outside of the country that could get a lot more complicated. So but send me your email Send me email no matter what ACT at the station cross.com Has producer James ever use a typewriter? I know

1:21:25I don't know Hey make sure to go to the station of the cross.com Forth slash ACT join the email list. We'll see you guys tomorrow. God love you