Capitol and Kayfabe - RIP PAC, WWE Sign Guy, Mr. Belding

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3:58Hello and welcome to the latest episode here of Capital and K-Faib. I'm your co-host, JP Itterpods. It's your new power trip, of course. You're on me. It's the political pundit, former campaign manager, the author, the historian, Mr. Jack Hunter. Jack, welcome. How you doing? I'm doing fantastic. We got some fun stuff to talk about today and some not so fun, more sorrowful stuff. So yeah, there's obviously a crazy weekend, a whirlwind for AEW. They had their roll out. They had all this crazy stuff going on with Stephen Borden and then this going on with this and Osprey finally getting revenge on Moxley. And then we hear, which is crazy, like 24 hours after that, we hear that pack passed away. The bastard pack, been Saturday passed away. And obviously we don't know really what the circumcensored would happen. We just know that he passed away. It's only 40 years old. What were your thoughts when you heard that? I mean, it's crazy news. I was shocked like every other fan. And I couldn't imagine what the people who've known this man for years and worked with them and knew him personally were going through. But just as a fan, I'm like, pack.

5:00When Bill Dundee died, I was sad I liked Bill Dundee. I watched him wrestle as a child. But at some point you knew that was going to happen sooner than later, correct? Because that's, when I say sooner, within the next 10 to 20 years, to my like pack that's only 40 years old, you don't expect to hear that. You know, unless they've got a reputation, it's just like a wild party or a drug addict or it's just out of the blue, out of nowhere. You just watched him wrestle. I just watched him wrestle on Saturday night. One of the best matches on all out with Andrade. What is that? It's the all of a suddenness of it that really shocked everybody the most. Especially when the guy, literally just wrestled, had a great match and then he interfered in the main event. You're not even thinking anything about them. It's just literally like, whoa, what the hell happened? Like, wow, they can't say anything. Yeah. Andy Williams, the butcher, was kind of the same thing and then this. And I think, and I think Mel Sir, a few other people said this is probably harder for the

6:02wrestlers because with Andy Williams, you know, he'd been gone a couple months at a minimum. You had that. But with, he was just there. We all watched him on one of the biggest pay per views. All the hands of the biggest one and all out, you know, follows it and, you know, and something very memorable with Andrade. It's just crazy, man. I don't know how many. I don't know what to say to that other than what I just said. Yeah, and people were kind of speculating this. It's that, and valvinesis out there speculating nobody knows as of yet. Obviously, the autopsy hasn't come back. But it's just crazy even to speculate at this point. I think it's just nuts. I think it's disrespectful and it's insensitive when you don't know. You're just pulling, just making it wild crap, which people do on social media. But when there's a person's life at stake and people are mourning the family and all that, I think that's insensitive. What did valvinesis say, probably vaccines or something like that? Yes. Yeah. Yeah. Watch out or whatever. Her key calls it, yeah. He might be right, but he's not a doctor. No, I'm not either. And but like who? No, just leave it alone and let people figure it out.

7:02And then we can talk about it. I don't know. I think that's disrespectful and insensitive. Yeah. I kind of don't like when guys do that just for the fact that it's like, okay, we don't know anything, but you're putting your perspective on it that you want to be true and your political spin on it that you want to be true. And it's not the right timing for it. And they're ultimately making it about them instead of the deceased. Like that's not cool. So yeah, they're comporting the tragedy to their world viewed to serve their own purposes. And that's not, that's not right. And even like the anti AEW people were, you know, ripping AEW and stuff for it as like man, it's just uncalled for. It's just they wanted an excuse to make for an AEW and I guess that was their excuse. I just thought that was crazy too. Like some of these fans got to calm down a bit here. Absolutely. And like look in the 90s when all these wrestlers were dying under 40, there were things to talk about issues and whatnot. But I as a fam was never like, that's the WWE's fault. I was never like that. You know what I mean? It was, it was come more complicated and nuanced than that.

8:05And those hardcore WWE people just looking to say something nasty about AEW go along with the popular narrative then. You see what I'm saying? Probably not because they're WWE lifers or whatever you want to call them. Is that fair to say? Like, you know, it's just, feel like a little bit triples when you shouldn't have it. Like you're kind of bad timing. They write some of those fans for sure. Well, that's, you know, I post stuff about what's going on in Gaza and stuff all the time. There'll be like a picture of a dead child. And some a halls like, oh, that four year olds in Hamas. And I'm like, really dude, you think that's what's going on with you? And this is how much you love whatever your political stance is that you see that four year old dead kid. And you're like, oh, that's, it's about me. And that could go on the other side too. This is the similar to that. This should be about pack and his family and his co-workers and friends and colleagues. And us as fans, what it meant to us, what he did to us and entertaining us all those years. And stuff like that. Stuff that you think if he was around the right, the second he would, he would want people saying about him. And putting on a wonderful wrestling tribute show as Dona-Mite was as we're recording

9:10this last night. I don't think they could have done a better job. I think Dave Moultzer said it was one of the best wrestling shows ever. It's not even close. I don't know if I'd say that because the metrics he's using are so different than what you would usually say outside of that context. Yeah. That's a good way to put it. But he was praising it. I agree with that for sure. I just don't know what to make of it as far as like a wrestling show. So to speak, like judging a match is like it's weird on a tribute show. I don't really even look at that kind of stuff. It's like, yes, they're entertaining. They're good. But I don't really rate or look at matches like that for a tribute show thing. I'm like, oh, it's the best wrestling show ever. It's like, I don't know if that's the time or the place for that. It's not really the right words to use. I remember the wonderful tribute show to Eddie Guerrero. And it was a wonderful show. You know what else was a wonderful show when Hulk Hogan was the third man. Those are two very different things. Right. So it's just, you know, what are we talking about? Like beautifully done for sure. But to say just wrestling shows, that's like, I add a bounce for me. I think that's not really the right verbiage.

10:10I agree. I think it's always a balance. First and foremost, to do what the family wants. And hopefully that's in line with what the deceased would want. And I think they accomplished that. And then they give the fans kind of a show within those parameters. And boy, did they? I mean, he had some great wrestling on there. I almost felt sorry for, you know, Osprey and Orange Cassidy and Mox and Marina Shaffir, for sure, like they're going in there. They're doing their jobs. They're paying tribute and the best tribute they could give to this man who was professional wrestling. Like he was born to do this. I'm the first person to say that. But what's in your head? You're not just thinking like, I'm a whip this dude's ass. And that's what it's about. It's not, that's not really what it's about the situation like that. So obviously Brian Danielson came back and wrestled. So kind of shows you something, you know, that, which is really, really cool and pretty shocking. I mean, you got a good moment for the fans for, you know, it's a huge pop for Danielson Retarded, even Wardle came back. That was wonderful. I think I read that Kenny Omega flew back from Japan to be a part of the show. And after him losing to Osprey back it all out, we didn't expect to see him for a while.

11:13I don't think that would have happened otherwise. All sorts of things like that. I'll say this too, you know, being an AGM and watching as long as I have, I appreciated AEW saying whether you knew him as Pac or Neville and then I'm saying, you know, his name Ben and all that. But also like some of the pictures they show were him and Kevin Owens and him and Sammy Zane. And just, I think at the end of a wrestler's life who's worked in the two big companies or more than, it's all matters, share it. It's not about market competition in that moment. And I like that they did that and mentioned that. I haven't watched the world's collide. I understand that Corey Graves, they inserted some sort of tribute. I look forward to seeing that. But what I was going to say is about being a fan of a certain age. You know, we'll also pretty talk in his tribute about looking up to Neville. This whole goal was like, I want to wrestle Pac, you know, basically. And if you think about the age where Osprey is, the English connection, all that, the style of wrestling they do, that generation around the age they are, like he was sort

12:15of a forebearer in a sense, sort of like the motor-sitting machine guns are with that style. And all that. But Neville was kind of that to guys who were, you know, Ospreys, what, seven, eight years younger than him, six years, something like that. Certainly the young bucks, what they do. I think they mentioned that Akikon, Neville or Pac, he both was sort of their mentor in Japan when they were really young, talking about the young bucks, stuff like that. I was just thinking the age of all these people and the wrestling I was watching and kind of paying attention and like, oh, they were doing this in VWG and, you know, Neville was tearing it up in NXT before they sent them to the main roster. But like how they all knew each other, how it interconnected was kind of a fun remembrance as a fan, that history as it relates to Pac and his history. What are your favorite moments or what are some of your favorite moments of Pac? And he could be Neville as well. I liked almost everything you did in AEW, but it was the NXT stuff. I just remembered, you know, it's the red arrow in NXT, right? And it was the black arrow. That's what I remember.

13:16And you were like, holy crap, what the hell was that? What did he just do? I remember having thoughts about, man, this guy, it cracked me if I wrong. Was that like the dawn of black and gold NXT when Neville was tearing it up there? Yes. So that like set the tone for like all this awesome stuff and Seth Rollins being built. And Kevin Owens would become just all the cool stuff that Triple H was booking at that time, you know, undisputed air, all that stuff. He was like the beginning of that. That's what I remember more than anything. That style, maybe a wrestling fan and seeing him like, that's the dude. I felt it was a fan like Osprey said, like, oh, I want to go wrestle him. I didn't want to go wrestle him, but I wanted to watch him and I wanted to see what came after him and who he influenced. And boy, did he? What about you? Now, he's not like a larger than life guy or like a huge charisma guy, but he's a great wrestler. He's always great in the ring and he even said that. He focused more on like the in-ring stuff, which is crazy because WWE you would think like there wouldn't be for that, but it seemed like Triple H was trying to put the impetus very early on that, hey, we're going to have like the best wrestlers here at NXT.

14:20No, not necessarily WWE, like we're going to have the, so I feel like putting a belt on him and him having that long title run. That was great because that was really like, okay, Triple H is serious. You got one of the best wrestlers having the best wrestling matches and he's their champion. So I like that. He awesome match on if you've ever seen it with TJ Wilson Tyson kid. They've torn it up before that love that match at NXT. What Triple H was doing was sort of doing an in-house WWE version of what Ring of Honor was already doing, which I didn't mind from a competition standpoint and all that, but Neville to your point, John, like he was the perfect wrestler for that style that they needed. Did you really see on the WWE man roster and something that Vince McMahon didn't really think you needed to see that like that wasn't in his purview. But Triple H being not only a wrestling legend, obviously the son and all the bits of man, but also a fan. He's paying attention. I remember the first time I saw Apollo Crew stand up. I'm like, I didn't even know who he was, but that was Uja Nation. He was popular on the Indies, but Triple H was thinking that deep. Neville was a part of that bringing them in. Would he've come straight from Dragon Gate or Ring of Honor or both to NXT?

15:22I don't even know the time limit. Everyone talks about how challenging it is to raise kids. But what about protecting them? Outlet covers, kitchen cabinet locks, baby gates, where do you even start? Well, protecting your home in auto is a great place to start. Progressive offers customized cover adoptions so you can be sure you have the right coverage. They're basically the baby gates of insurance. Get a quote at progressive.com, progressive casualty insurance company affiliates and other insurers, not available in all states. I'm there. Kind of both because he was doing both around that time period. And obviously that's kind of where I feel like he got on Triple H's radar. So hey, check out this guy. Yeah. Yeah. So that's the kind of stuff I said when I think of his professional wrestling career, I liked him being a badass with the death riders at the end. I thought that word. I love the promo that Moxley gave about when I'm dead and gone out. What do you want to be remembered for? Right before. Pac is in that scene. He's the last person you see.

16:23That was kind of poetic and I kind of believe those things are not coincidences necessarily. So he does also in WWE have an awesome match against Seth Rollins, where one of those things where the crowd was so into it kind of shockingly. So you know what I mean? Usually it's like, okay, never. It's not what it's up. The crowd is so into it. I remember there was one false finish. Like inches and Rollins got his toe on the rope. The crowd thought he won. The crowd went nuts. They thought they had a new champion. Obviously, Rollins ended up pretending. It was an awesome match I remember with him in Rollins. I remember that now that you mentioned it. And that's the way I remember. You know what I'm going to do these conventions. And I'll see like a Q&A in the fans will be like, I remember this with Oli Andersen years ago, hey, Oli, at Starcade 89, you did this W and I can see he's booking me, whatever. But he's like, who was I wrestling? When was that? What what's your what are you talking about? Like that's what you need to know. When you just said that John, like, oh yeah, this is the road people go crazy. I remember that. I couldn't have told you probably who is wrestling, which was Seth, which is a big deal. But you hear anything that I remember the moments like that.

17:24So yeah, it was a bit memorable. A bunch of good stuff. Aries, Austin Aries and him had a really good match that I love. He had a bunch, even in AEW, I wasn't as into it because I didn't really particularly like the death riders that give him. I feel like he's a standalone guy or could have been on his own. So I don't know if he really fit in that group per se, but obviously the match with Androdi and then he had an awesome match with Ocata and Omega too, a while back. Totally. And we might disagree on that. I think that if he was going to be in a faction in AEW, that's the one he should have been in. But there's also an argument as you said, just to be on your own. Yeah, it should be by himself. To me, I feel like too many guys are in groups. We don't need that. Yeah. Kyle Fletcher should be on his own right now. Like it should have been for a while. So we could do that with a bunch of get same with Androdi. And you know, I guess he kind of is now, but you know what I'm saying. So yeah, it's a sad situation. But there was something in my brain. I just forgot what it is. I don't do me when we're talking about something else, but it had to do with pack. Deal, mega match maybe. Got the head? 30 minute match. I don't know.

18:24But I mean, obviously awesome in the ring. He's had so many good matches. And if I even think back like Dragon Gate, Ring of Honor and stuff, I mean, he's had a ton. He's been one of those guys that every time he's out there, you know, it's going to be a good match. Yeah. And I said to say sometimes you have to, in somebody's absence is when you really appreciate them. Oh, let's go back and look at all this stuff, which is what they did on the tribute show. I did like the chair with the table across it. The death writers surrounding it. Yeah. That was really great. Oh, I remember it was good to say the reports about, I guess, Pinta and Phoenix were texting each other or whatever, but you know, the death triangle people remembering that. Obviously, both of those guys are doing it very successfully in WWE now, but it was talked about. It was remembered. You've heard about it. I just love that. That those guys had. Yes, one of those things where I'm glad the wrestlers don't care about who up promotion there and that type of thing. You know what I mean?

19:24Like they'll, they'll tribute everybody. I'm not mad at it from a basic comp, like I really like when Jay briscoe, you know, tragically died and it was mentioned on WWB television because he never wrestled there like ever. But he was such a big figure that they meant I like that. But I'm not mad at it if it's somebody never had anything to do with it. Maybe it wasn't as big a figure as Jay briscoe. Like I'm not, I'm not going to be that nitpicky about it. But somebody like Neville has been in both companies talk about all of it and let your, let your wrestlers, the people work for you talk about all of it. Now we're mentioning or I mentioned this briefly forward, not a good week for a W just, I mean, pack dies, the butcher who just was in a WPES as a way, not that long ago. People weren't about pack dying at the Andy Williams tribute. Yeah, yeah, because they were going to a celebration of life. Yeah, which is just, man, shocking beyond shocking. Especially considering he was only 40. But when you look at 80 W the pay per view, I feel like people were going crazy because of the Steve Borden injury. So they were even jumping on and piling out even further with that.

20:27And then it was almost like packs death kind of they stopped making fun of the Borden stuff and we're talking about that. But I think just as far as a W would Steve Steve Borden, I know they're throwing them in the deep end. I know he's things done. But I personally just don't think you need to do those type of spots that young at the business. I know people will say, Oh, Logan Paul was doing this and that. But I'm sure Logan Paul's a good form. Well, yet that and I'm sure at the performance center, he probably, it's supposed to be practicing with these guys for hours on end. So he probably got to the certain point like, okay, if we jump this way in the ring, I don't know Steve Steve Borden was able to do that because it's almost like they're thrusting him into something quick. Logan Paul knew about this a while ago and then was working his way into crazy spots. So I can agree with you. I'm always reluctant because I'm not a wrestling athlete like I'm not a performer. But like, Oh, I would have done, you know, I'm kind of like that about it. He is new. But if he was also known for being able to jump a great distance, like I could see where their mind would go there. My understanding is that he feels a he's okay.

21:28Yes, yes, thank God. Yes, thank God. Yeah, look, B that he feels really bad about it because he knows the perception going to be like, we want to cheer for this guy. Sting son. Look, he looks great. Talk. Boy, he agreed. That's what people are going to say. He's a little bit, he wouldn't want that. I don't mean to put words in his mouth, but I did hear to say that it really bothered him. Right. And I get that. It makes me respect him even more and like him even more actually. When you look at it, it's like, okay, he probably shouldn't been doing that to body. He's only a 10 matches like, but they are throwing them in there with guys that do that stuff. So it's very wishy-washy. It's like, yeah, probably shouldn't have been doing it. He's got to focus more on just doing certain spots and maybe not doing risky stuff yet. Well, let me let that come later. But I don't know with that injury. I'm going to guess he's going to stick away from that kind of stuff and maybe just go basics and fundamentals for a while until, you know, until he feels more comfortable in the rain. I mean, it's only a 10 matches. He doesn't have to do it. There's so many people in that company that can already do it more spectacularly than he can.

22:28It doesn't have, I mean, you tag team would Darby let him do it. Yeah, exactly. And he's, he's staying son. He looks like him and his whole persona doesn't need to be that for the rest of his life. I think they're working on that now, but like, it's a different thing. You don't have to be, you don't have to be that reckless. Yeah, you're sexy Steve, if you will, or whatever they're calling him, right? Like you don't need to do that. Do you think because he's with Darby, you think that's why he's doing crazy stuff? Like literally kind of almost feeding off of that? Maybe and look at his dad and his late six, he jumping off stuff like, yeah, yeah, should I do this? No, son, I wouldn't do it low. He's still like, I don't know. I don't mean to get in their family business, but like all of that, you kind of can't be like, man, Steve's a dummy. He shouldn't have done that. And people around him is dead as way older than him doing that stuff like that. So I don't know. Man, it is crazy that when you just think back like, staying, what are you doing? You're like one of the best ever. What are we doing here? Like that wasn't that crazy that he was doing that? Oh my God. I mean, it is. It loves staying and he could do whatever he wants and get away with it.

23:29I was like, man, you're crazy. Why are you nuts? You're 60 or so. Do you remember Flair falling off chairs and WWE's version of ECW and going through tax and all that stuff? What was Flair like 55 years old or something when he was doing that? Do you remember what he would have like a heart for? Oh, yes, 55 or 56. Yeah. And as a fan, I was like, no, you don't have to do it. Like I didn't like it. But at the same time, I was like, he just wants to show he can do anything. Like I get that mentality too. So. I just wonder though, if like 80 W, it's not out. People go crazy on Tony Kahn. It's not Tony Kahn. Obviously the guys are putting together the match. He agreed to do the move. But I just wonder if like that's where you step in as the producer and whoever you are, as far as the producers and that wouldn't you shoot that down there? Like, ah, you're a little green for that spot. You know, you might think like no broken glass to somebody once said to Jack Perry or no real glass or whatever it was. You know real glass, yeah. Right. And he was right.

24:29Come on. Come on. I'm over the garbage matches myself anyway, but that's a whole different subject. Yeah, I guess I guess you're right. John, somebody might have stepped in, but who knows? When you're looking at 80 W looking at all out in Otar to kind of talk, that could be just a thing about packed and we're talking about Andy Williams a little bit, talking about obviously Stephen Borden's injury, old very, very serious stuff, but all out. What did you think? Thumbs up, thumbs down. Osprey finally gets to win over Moxley. Do you make anything of the paper viewers or anything? Nope, worthy. I thought it was a good show, but it was an average show compared to their usual threshold, their usual high mark. That's all it is. It's not an insult like it was a good show, but like their shows are so out of this world good, it was it pale compared to those. That's not what everybody was talking about on Wednesday night. We were talking about pack and we weren't talking about Steve Borden. We were talking about pack. So, you know, what do you think? I only saw some of it, didn't see the whole show, but it honestly didn't seem like it

25:30was up to par with the last pay-per-view. So it was almost one of those things where, oh bless you, almost one of those things where it's like, I don't know, like to have a show that fast after all in, I wouldn't do that. You know what I mean? Like, I'd wait a while to do another show. I know WWE does it sometimes like, oh, backlash, but backlash is never really, usually as good as many. I don't know one of those things where I guess you can go either way with it. I just felt like, oh, it's a little soon for the pay-per-view. At least they kind of did mocksly osprey because they had a storyline for six months. But, I don't know, I just felt like a little lackluster compared all in. Totally, I think everything is or should be. It should be booked that way. All in should be their WrestleMania. Yeah, yeah. It needed to be great. I'm just saying it was nowhere near as good as all in was. No where near as good as that, but it was good. Like, it wasn't, I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I'm paying my money. We've gone from, we have all in one Saturday or Sunday and then the following weekend, we have all out. Now they've spread it out a month. Maybe they, maybe you just have all in and don't have all out anymore.

26:31Just wait till the next pay-per-view. My girlfriend and I are going to wrestle dream on October 17th. Where the heck is that at? Three weeks from today in Orlando. Oh, that's in Orlando. Oh, okay. That's in three weeks. Is that a far drive for you? It's about five and a half hours, I guess. Not terrible. It's her birthday and I can't think of anything better to do for her birthdays as big a wrestling fan as you are. So yeah. Nice. That's right. Nice. So obviously talking about W, gotta talk about WBD because of this new thing with WB and Nature Report. Everyone's saying that, not everyone, but I mean a lot of the media, wrestling media that covers you are saying, oh, it means nothing. Even Meltzer was saying, oh, it doesn't mean that much for Bleach Report WB, but then he kind of walked it back a little bit. So Alistair, the guy who made the deal and obviously Paramount WBDs come together, then WB kind of sneaks in there and they're working with Bleach Report who was originally working with AEW for a while. Hell, I even have Bleach Report pay per views.

27:32So WB kind of sneaking there, they do all their highlights, they're doing video packers or doing all this different things for WWE content on Bleach Report. What does that mean for AEW and WBD because their deal is coming up and I can't imagine that they would want it to both. I don't know. Tony Collins seems pretty optimistic but as a businessman and as his business he would expect him to be like you're not going to go, even if it was really bad situation, he's not going to go in there act like that or speak out negatively. I don't know. What I think of is does AEW have value? Yes. Did they get a big TV deal last time around? Yes. Are they hot right now? Yes. Are the ratings slightly improving? A little bit maybe. I don't know. But it seems like it has value especially in a media environment where live sports is like one of the most valuable commodities, right? Especially in cable, like everything streaming and like what is cable? I don't know. I think AEW is in a good place and is going to be, if they had nothing to do with WWE

28:34BD every again, I think they would be okay. If it was a crappy product and like not as valuables what I just described even though it's not a bad thing. And they lost the deal. I don't think Tony Conn would let his baby just with her on the violin like that. And they've got the means to not let it with her. So I'm not that worried about it as a fan. What do you think? I don't think necessarily worry because Amazon Prime or somebody will pick them up or maybe even some sort of TV station I would imagine Fox or somebody, I'm not exactly sure who, but I feel like somebody would definitely scoop them up. They do better ratings than hockey and hockey is on TV. So it's like somebody will want those ratings and weightless production money. So I feel like somebody would definitely want to do that. My only thing is the bleach report. That was crazy because it's like wait, bleach report, part of TNT, TBS, that whole infrastructure there or WBD, that whole thing. It's like wow, now they're working with WWE on highlights. That's like to me the first way in, like the way they're way in. And then it's like okay, then they're going to continue working with them and try to up their game and do coverage and all this other stuff.

29:35So that would lead me to believe they wouldn't be doing any more AEW because they why would they be doing both, which kind of leads me to believe that WWE is the favorite if you would. Maybe, I mean they're the bigger company. There's no doubt about that. But you know, if the cons have more money than WWE, technically, what are we talking about? But too, if you look at it though, which is kind of crazy, Ellison is Ari Mannell's good friend and he just recently been saying all this is mentoring, loves him and all this other stuff. But that kind of also like Ari be like, hey, by the way, get rid of that company or don't resound, you know what I'm not that he could or is allowed to say, but I wonder if that's like a little hint nudge nudge, you know, knock, knock there. And to the degree that WWE has seemed to want the, you know, what we could talk about Worlds collide coming out on the same Wednesday as the tribute show and all that stuff. But just in every turn, trying to do something that hurt AEW and it doesn't work, you know, maybe this is another version of that they're trying to get a foothold in as you're insinuating.

30:36Worlds collide, I know it didn't affect AEW didn't hurt them at all and that they were apparently surprised, AEW still drew well despite them being in town that day. But they were doing basically a tape show, it was supposed to be for club WWE and then it's obviously was released on YouTube yesterday. But it's one of those things where, okay, they thought they were going to hurt them, they didn't, then they're like, whatever, let's just put it out on YouTube. Okay, so they 13,000, actually 14,000 people were at Worlds collide. I mean, that huge success and they had over a million dollar gate for essentially a house show. My only issue is like, okay, you thought it was going to hurt AEW and it didn't, they still sold 9,500 tickets, they still sold out and they still did well for the pay-per-view. So what is this? Like, what are we doing here? I don't care about the, like, airing out the tribute show because that was planned before they announced the tribute show. So I don't care about that. I'm just saying, what are we doing here as far as why do we need to run the same town on the same day and then shocked that they did that day, Drew? Well, that's what any, I mean, from the start, from a business perspective, it doesn't make sense. It feels personal, it feels petty.

31:38I mean, you've heard reports from credible sources that the ideas, when TKO bought WWE, they didn't envision a wrestling environment where the talents could command more money because this other company existed. With that company didn't, other company didn't exist. They could get back to the original plan. I mean, that's the way it's, yeah. But despite, but it's not working. Like, sure, you want that to happen. You know, I want a million dollars and, you know, all sorts of stuff, that doesn't mean it's going to happen. It just looks petty. You know, the controversy with Worlds Collide airing on Wednesday, the same time as the Pack tribute, it's just like, people in both companies love this guy. Like, to me, I would have put the YouTube ad on against collision on Saturday, which is a live show. You know, go against the AEW's Lesser Show. It's going to be a storyline driven show, do that and leave the Pack tribute alone, but that's not what happened. I'm going to watch, as we speaking, I still have it watch Worlds Collide, other than a few clips with, you know, a punk in a mask and El Grande and stuff like that. But since it's on YouTube, though, you don't, like, people are like upset, like, when it drops, it doesn't matter.

32:38You can watch it whenever it's on YouTube. That's why I watched, after the baseball game, I watched AEW because I could watch YouTube whenever. I know I technically, you could DVR AEW, but I mean, they were on Wednesday night. So I prefer that to YouTube thing. I could watch whenever the hell I want. That's, that's how I think of YouTube also, but I think there's some symbolism in it. Hey, it's coming out an hour before this tribute to Pack. But wasn't it announced before the tribute, child? It was, but wouldn't you have changed your mind after you found out this beloved man passed? Like I would say, no, because you already announced it. Like, just, just keep it going. It's on YouTube. You can watch it anytime, put it out Tuesday. Something, but you're trying to go after AEW and that's your thing, even though it's not going to work. I think it looks, it makes me look, think less of WWE. Not the performers. Not that I was talking with somebody about this yesterday. I'm not mad at anybody who wrestled on World's Collide because of these decisions. I'm fans of them. Like it's not that. That's whoever thinks that I just think it's disrespectful. Do you think Tony Khan, if he could make the decision and like, oh, I don't know Roman Pass,

33:43you know, heaven forbid or something like that. There was a big WWE tribute show and AW had something scheduled. Do you think Tony Khan might rearrange out of respect? I think he would. I don't know if Tony Wood or not. Maybe. I'd say it's more likely he would than WWE would. I think that's a true statement. And I think the people that he might respect in his own company, he talks to my Urge him to do that too for the same reason. And it's just a basic professional courtesy, as is good a word as respect. Especially when somebody's gone. I'm not a big fan of tribute shows. I don't know. You know what I mean? Like that. It's like not that the show's itself, but just like it's depressing because it's like, wow, I can't believe that. Like I remember Eddie had one, Benoit had one. Like they're very sad. It's just a really, really depressing. Next up body should be a fan of funerals, but you kind of have to have them. Right, right. This is the tribute show. Somebody famous. It just is what it is. It's something what AW did for Pac was beautiful. Do I want to watch that at the end of the night? No, I don't. But I watched him for years and what they did needed to be done and it was beautiful.

34:45And you can see in the reactions of the wrestlers who really knew him and how much it was tearing them up, you can see that. I think it was good for fans to see that and remembered some of him. And I got to be honest, I popped big time for Danielson and his one way all time favorites. There's no doubt about that. I love it. What are you talking earlier about that generation and that style of wrestling in the age of all those guys? What a great tribute to Danielson to use his return, even if it's just for that time, for his fallen friend, who was in Danielson's obviously choked up and him, how did he moxley before he did that? So it kind of makes sense. Yeah. They have like the whole thing was really great. Nobody expected that. Even though moxley tried to kill him, he's okay because they made up because of pack. Yeah. Yeah. When they were hugging him, I was like, moxley, she put her back on his head. You know, just that wasn't the fun for me to show, but you know, our wrestling minds go there. Yes. So Walt's collide. It was a success. Whether, you know, people are going to view it or not on YouTube. I'm not sure. I mean, we both of us would agree we will, but maybe not today or anything, but definitely down the line.

35:47Yeah. Another interesting thing though, will you watch Rumble? WWE main event is now on Rumble. What do you think about that? Which I thought was a conservative outlet, but maybe I'm wrong on that. So that pisses me off. Excuse my French there, but like people say calling it a right reason. It's considered right wing is when the Biden administration was happening and they were trying to have a government disinformation board that would regulate speech and all this crap and the people before Elon Musk bought X were censoring. I got censored all the time. The Hunter Biden laptop thing. I posted about that. They took it now. All those people got pissed off and went to their own platform where most of them conservative and right leaning. Yes. So people are always. Okay. Now makes an important point. It's a platform by default. Glenn Greenwald gets more hot about this than I do because he moved his own show over there. And you know, out of the name of free speech, Rumble does it. Right. They're left with people on Rumble. But for a time, you wouldn't say that now what Trump's doing and trying to harass universities and deny funding and bother college students and deport people for their views like Trump's

36:49just as bad as the Democrats were then. But when Rumble exploded, that's what was going on. So that makes me angry. Am I going to watch main event? I didn't watch main event before it went to Rumble. And although only time I watched main event, if I was at a live show, they would tape and main event. And that's just because there's only so much wrestling to watch out there. And I know that's the least of what WWE puts out. There was time me and my son went to them as G show and Penta was wrestling on main event. We ran to our seats because we were like, wait a second. Because we're like dogging it because it's like, let's go get merch or let's get food. You know what I mean? Because we know the show's not going to start yet. And it's like, all right, we kind of want to see the beginning of the show. And does main event really matter? No, no, no. So you kind of want to bait in your seat, but it doesn't matter. All of a sudden we're here, Penta's usually like, what? And we're like, we got our seats because we're so much better. I like Penta. So it's like, wait a second here. On main event, but that never usually happens. That's like a one off type of thing. You know, it's the least match that you want to watch. And there's guys in there that could go on to be big stars. That's happened, but like it just is what it is.

37:51You know, I watched rampage when it was on because I'm a wrestling fan. And why not smack them? Just went off there. There's another hour or something, but like you can skip that show and be fine. Main events less. Right. Regular basis in the rampage ever was. So like you would think it's like, I remember your school, Protestant read. They were kind of getting a look at him because Vince, like, it didn't know who he was. Whatever. I remember I watched that match because I was like, I knew him obviously from New Japan and stuff. I mean, I've Jonah, like I was watching this guy. He's really good. I was like, what are Vince's like this guy, like this style of every? And I remember I watched him like some stupid match on main event. I remember who's wrestling. I was like, hopefully Vince liked it, but it was on main event for Christ. You know what I mean? It's like, it's like, they're dark match, if you will, just to get away with it. It is. And I like stuff like that when I know about it in advance in sort of the context. I remember whatever that night was when Vince McMahon turned his chair around. I think it was on SmackDown and said the NWO. That had been in 2001, pre-9-11, something like that. 2002, 2002, so after night I loved it. Whatever night that was, that was in Charleston. In the dark match was this wrestler named Prototype.

38:52I've been on the internet enough to know that was John Cena and a lot of people believed it. And I thought it was cool that in my hometown I got to see this guy. They thought it was going to be a big deal wrestling in the dark match. So I like that when main event's like that, but you kind of have to know going into what's going on, which rarely happens or I guess it happens more now. But in 2002 was happening less and I thought that was cool. It was Prototype was John Cena for anybody who's been there. Yeah, of course. Yeah. Just a few little political tidbits. I wanted to ask you about before I go back into just a little bit of wrestling. Before we wrap this bad boy up, but anything come out of that UN General Assembly, anything new, was there anything there to talk about or no? Because it didn't seem like it to be out there. Everybody walked out on Netanyahu. Whoa. That was like the only thing new, was worthy, right? People got sideways with Trump. He was basically telling Iran should I annihilate them all. Right now, like he did not do well either. As we record this, we're about four weeks out from the election. You asked about the UN specifically. It's just thing.

39:53After thing, after thing, like Republicans are going to get slaughtered in four weeks. That's just another, that'll be forgotten by them. It's just another mile marker in this long march to GOP death in the midterms. So that's the best way I can answer that. Trump said all sorts of stupid stuff. Netanyahu is his usual BB self and people walked out on them. I mean, most civilized nations in the world called that a genocide. France is sort of boycotting Israel at this point. Like, what are we talking about? Yeah, it seems like he's not a popular guy. Yeah, when you commit a genocide, other than the Holocaust thing, is they'd all Hitler all right? That's where we're at. I agree with that. You sound like a Norm MacDonald there for a second. Do you hear Hitler routine? You know, it's not the scale of the Holocaust, but it's tens of thousands of people who've been killed according to United Nations numbers. Many, so many of them, children and women and innocents. And we got to act like this is okay. It's not, it's not justifiable.

40:53I agree with Macklemore when he says like, you know, everybody can have a difference of opinion, but like, you can't be neutral and a genus. You can't be neutral on the Holocaust. You have to say it. That was bad. That shouldn't happen. It shouldn't happen again. That's where we are on this. And a lot of people can't say it because of their political inclinations in it. But I think when we look back in history, you're going to see a different picture. What about Trump and the Chinese president? People were up in arms and upset that they were like, you know, yucking it up, if you will. Those people can suck it. To quote DX, I like that Trump, Kamala Harris beat the crap out of him in the last presidential election for this talks to our enemies or perceived enemies. And he did this big roll out the red carpet for the Chinese president. The White House answers what answer was when we went to China, that's what they did for us. Yeah, big time. Yeah. The diplomacy works. As Winston Churchill said, jaw jaws are always better than war war, meaning diplomacy is preferable to war. Anti-war types like myself. I'm a right wing anti-war guy.

41:53Left wing diplomacy is so key. Neocons hate diplomacy. Don't go talking to Iranians. Just bomb hell out of them. Don't talk to China. Let's get in the war. Kamala Harris was running around a Liz Chaney in 2024. I don't bow down to kings. I don't bow down to dictators. Trump is in love with dictators that pissed me off when I would see Democrats who once were for the anti-war Obama, who was, you know, like now that I, yeah, they're sounding like Neocons. I hate Trump. He bows to dictators. Don't fall for that Neocon crap. Anybody who's against war and Trump's not in that space now wants to talk to our worst enemies. The chef talked to John F. Kennedy and vice versa in what 1953 they wrote down Pennsylvania Avenue right after crew chef said he was going to the United States. Why? Because they wanted to prevent a nuclear war. That's what leaders do. Reagan spoke to Gorbachev. First time was in 85, then again in 86. And although same war mongers in the United States, many of them Republicans hated Reagan at the time for talking to Gorbachev. They wanted something closer to war. It's crazy that sound. So Trump meeting with the Chinese president.

42:54Absolutely. Roll out the red carpet. Do the whole thing. That's not saying that China is good. That man's a dictator. He's a horrible person. It's a horrible country. Communism is horrible. That's not what we're talking about. We're talking about looking out for our own interests and what that looks like on the global diplomatic stage. And just two more RIPs, unfortunately, this coming in three thing. I'm not really a big fan of this at all here. So RIP to the WWE sign guy, Rick Ashburner. Everybody knew him with the red backwards baseball cap and all the signs. Man, it's just crazy to see all those tributes coming in and like Batista was like close with him. Triple H was close with him to a certain extent. The coach had a bunch of great things to say about him. So very, very cool to see. And obviously everybody, if you're a wrestling fan, you know, for certain time period, have seen the shows you know about the sign guy, the WWE sign guy, who literally had his own commercial on USA talking about being the sign guy. So very, very famous wrestling fan, maybe one of the most famous wrestling fans. Yeah. You know, like Vlad, the famous wrestling fan and him, there's just, I think I had a

43:58pack guy, an ECW and a guy who was dressed like Howard Stern and ECW. Like, there's a guy that stands to this day. He's in front row at AW and WWE. He's got long hair. He's always with his mom. I don't know his name. I've seen him for 10 years now. But he's, I've met him one time in a thing and he told me his name and I forgot that like, you know, I think they just have a lot of money from my front row tickets. Yeah, just a green shirt guy. That's a word. Yeah. No, it's sign guy with somebody beloved, do us fans who, even if he didn't know his name at the time, like you knew who he was and obviously you knew who the wrestlers do because they interact with him. So RIP. And it's funny too, leaving the guys he's making fun of. They all like, you know, they took it and they laughed. Like, oh, I wonder if he's going to make fun of me today and then like Triple H is crap and you know all this other stuff and then when Triple H is a baby face, he's bumping him up so Triple H loves him again. So great kind of back and forth too. Just like a great guy for the business. One guy making fun of you is like, Weird Al making your song. It's a tribute. Yes. Yes. And by the way, Weird Al's best song is there to be stupid and it is important to be a

45:03transformer soundtrack just to throw that out. But and he's making fun just of Devo broadly. But that's neither here nor there. But as far as another RIP want to throw this out there before we wrap this baby way up, Dennis Haskins, aka Mr. Belding, who by the way has appeared on wrestling shows, has gotten into it and was a huge wrestling fan. So RIP Mr. Belding, who was awesome, I'd say by the bell. One of my closest women's woman friends who I was like a sister to me. Her dad looks like Mr. Belding, like a doppelganger. That's the first thing I thought of. Obviously all of us of a certain age grew up on say by the bell. Mr. Belding, we knew he was a wrestling fan. So rest in peace. That was kind of sad to see. Yeah, man. I was like, one one there after another here. Not good. I'm Mr. Belding and of course RIP to the bastard pack, who all time great in ring competitive. There's no doubt about it. So let's wrap up this baby boy head towards the boys, follow me on Twitter and on Instagram at 2manpower.com. You jack. You can find me on X on jack 174 for all everything we talk about here and more.

46:06All right. Thank you Jack. Thank you everybody out there for listening. We'll see you right back here next week for capital and K5. See you next week folks. This has been a John Paz power trip production in conjunction with the two man power trip of a wrestling. You could follow us on Instagram and Twitter at 2manpower trip. You could check us out on Facebook. You could subscribe on YouTube. You can go to patreon.com slash TMPT empire to become a patron and also check out the website TMPT empire dot com. And by a shirt at pro wrestling T's dot com. 2man power trip where the power lies. Brother. We love the 1980s wrestling era. When K-Fabe was king and wrestling did whatever it took to protect the business. When all the territories dealt with the rise of the WWF, the NWA emerged as its greatest

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