AEW DYNAMITE POST-SHOW (9/30): Keller & Lansdell discuss magnificent and moving tribute show to Pac

0:00Dave Roberts here. There you are surrounded by fans, sharing wings, sharing drinks, high-fiving random strangers. Everybody remembers the game. Nobody remembers the guy coughing behind you until a few days later. At 2am, you wake up with a fever and your throats on fire. Now what? Urgent care, clothes, ER, slam, telehealth, maybe, but the pharmacy's clothes. You needed a medical emergency kit. These aren't first aid kits. They contain essential prescriptions used for over 30 common conditions. Sinus and ear infection, UTI, stomach bug, travelers diarrhea, and more. On hand before you need them. Use your doctor-developed guidebook to select the right prescription or call their telemedicine doctor standing by. It's like an urgent care and drug store at home. When you're sick, traveling, or stranded, you'll wish you ordered a medical emergency kit. Order online in minutes and it's shipped to your door and say $45 with my promo code blue at urgentcarekit.com slash blue. That's promo code blue at urgentcarekit.com slash blue.

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3:05you need a medical emergency kit these aren't first aid kits they contain essential prescriptions used for over 30 common conditions sinus and ear infection uti stomach bug travelers diarrhea and more on hand before you need them use your doctor develop guidebook to select the right prescription or call their telemedicine doctor standing by it's like an urgent care and drug store at home when you're sick traveling or stranded you'll wish you ordered a medical emergency kit order online in minutes and it's shipped to your door and say 45 dollars with my promo code blue at urgentcare kit.com slash blue that's promo code blue at urgentcare kit.com slash blue for a limited time in McDonald's get a big Mac extra value meal for eight dollars that means to all beef patty special sauce lettuce cheese pickles onions on a sesame seed bun and medium fries and a drink we may need to change that jingle price of a distribution may vary Dave Roberts here there you are surrounded by fans sharing wings sharing drinks high-fiving random

4:06strangers everybody remembers the game nobody remembers the guy coughing behind you until a few days later at 2 a.m. you wake up with the fever and your throats on fire now what urgent care close ER slam telehealth maybe but the pharmacies close you needed a medical emergency kit these aren't first aid kits they contain essential prescriptions used for over 30 common conditions sinus and ear infection uti stomach bug travelers diarrhea and more on hand before you need them use your doctor develop guidebook to select the right prescription or call their telemedicine doctor standing by it's like an urgent care and drugstore at home when you're sick traveling or stranded you'll wish you ordered a medical emergency kit order online in minutes and it's shipped to your door and say 45 dollars with my promo code blue at urgentcare kit.com slash blue that's promo code blue at urgentcare kit.com slash blue

5:09now pw torch and spreeker bring you the wade keller pro wrestling post show it's time to talk this week's a.e.w. dynamite. Wow um if you didn't know Ben saturday pock aterinevel you wished you did at this point yeah um what a uh what a magnificent true show um in any context for any human being um Chris i been texting and talking to people who knew him um i talked Monday night on the raw post your bottom i talked on the flag should be a straight bottom was that k-dorn and i was conveying and and i wrote the newsletter cover story this week um is cover story about pock and all those places i said i learned so much about him since the tragic news broke Sunday night um and i didn't realize the degree to which people adored him and respected him um loved him

6:20and so yeah i mean it just like it was so um but i didn't expect it to manifest to the degree that it did so effectively and in such a moving way as it did on this episode of dynamite i mean i just i i don't i mean i we all should be fortunate to be cared for by our friends and our peers um colleagues as much as him i told you right before i went on the air was a picture of him and it's dog that like broke me i assume it was his dog um don't know how the picture was you know but it's just like sometimes you don't think about that there's a dog waiting for him to come home and doesn't know what's going on and everyone's sad um but so many moments in that show the the way he god there's just the the pre-recorded tributes you know that the allowing wrestlers to cry on camera and express their their love and emotions is great and i think for the viewers that

7:21even if you don't even if they're not saying much or you're not hearing what they're saying it's it means something but the actual stories they told the anecdotes every one of them said something that made you understand better why he was so beloved as a person as a colleague and a friend but also sprinkled into that not as important but to pocket was is why he was so respected for his craft that the the the the the the priests um i'm going to complete who said it if it was ricochet or osper someone else but like the precision of his moves like the the perfection of his moves and i i wrote about that newsletter and the cover story i talked about it that that's what people this week have been telling me like what they respected about a style through the lens of being a wrestler so yeah i Chris your your thoughts those are my initial thoughts coming out of this it just emotionally heavy first and foremost how do you love once everybody um because you don't know what tomorrow holds uh wow i know i didn't know the guy

8:27but i know some people who did know the guy you've been around this business way and i know you hate that expression of this business but i think we're allowed to you know no it's it's a business except on television during a show that's a sport that's that's i don't mind the business term in this god you've been around this business long time i've been around it not quite as long the it is rare that a person can be in the industry for this long and not have a single person have a bad word to say about it uh you have seen with one well no not even you've not seen a single person on social media say anything but glowing stuff about this man and the fact that it never came through on air because that wasn't the character he was supposed to play is just an indication of what a consummate professional he was i've had stories about a camera crew being backstage there was a new cameraman and paxette hey can you please turn the camera off just to protect

9:32the business and when the guy said oh yeah i'm new here here's my idea and it instantly pax just relaxed around him and started just being friendly because he knew he was safe around him and to see tonight's show to see my my huge advocate for this men not being afraid to show their feelings and to have the confidence and the security to do that on live television in front of millions of people because of the man that they love does it they'd lost suddenly i spent the last three or four days doing a lot of thinking about him and his his career at his legacy but also worrying that we were going to hear some stuff about this that we didn't want to hear and i'm just i'm really thankful that that hasn't been the case and that this this tribute show was able to take place without that specter hanging over our heads you know uh everything we saw tonight was as close to a perfect thank you to a man as you can get um i've the more i thought about

10:36packers of wrestler and and his career and how i've seen him improve from the days i saw him in in dragon gate and how he went from somebody who was only a high fly to somebody who literally had no holes in his game like when you think about what he could do he had the technical wrestling he had the power moves he had the high fly he could cut a promo assuming you could understand his accent he had everything the only thing he didn't have was a us passport and that is probably what held him back in the end yeah but it's just if you watch this show you could watch this show in five years time for somebody who never saw the guy wrestler and they go wow this must have been a special special man and by all accounts yeah he was i said earlier this week on one of the podcasts that you're always gonna have wrestler saying nice things about a colleague who dies and if they're big enough star you get a tribute show i mean it's just the way it works it's fine um but sometimes

11:38in the position that i'm in you hear other things you know like the things that would be um inappropriate rude um and bad taste to say publicly you just you don't you don't what you know the tribute shows not time for a complete picture on someone it's it's especially put on by the company they work for with their colleagues you put the bet you put the most positive um face on on the person who just died for the sake of decorum and their family and their friend but you hear other but again here stuff you know and with venue did i didn't yeah yes it was like wasn't single hint of anything negative about him um and like and and so yeah i i said it was it's remarkable like there's no you know well you know yes but or yeah he had this side of him like none of that um and so i don't know i just say that because like it is people can watch this show and not be cynical is my point there's it like this this is

12:43this is how people felt about him i've been communicating with some of the people on camera tonight and their emotions match their texts you know what i mean like this is that was not that was not the the performance that there was no performance there there was no i'm going to get myself over now um i think sometimes that cynicism that wrestling fans have kind of beat into them um creeps in this was just a true reflection of how people felt about that guy um and it yeah it just did yeah i'm gonna stuff that happened in the show i got some stuff to raise on that front but i don't have anyone near the connections you do but i do have some people in both companies that i do know and have have communicated with and actually a couple of them proactively reached out to me and were like please don't ask me for anything the the entire locker room is just hurting and nobody wants to talk about it but he was loved in both companies in Japan everywhere he

13:43went i i have not seen hints of a single story even the guy who ostensibly was the reason he left wwe he's talking about what a great guy he was now that and so one of the reasons that was floated around the park left wwe was to stop but did not have to work with andzo more anymore and even he was on social media talking about what a great guy he was yeah when you when even the people that you dislike love you man you you've done something right the story of darby saying i thought you know when he showed up he's gonna be like i don't want to do any of this circus stuff i don't want to do any silly stuff um i came over to get my term used and they's like no he was kind of game like that was fun you know he was because park is the guy that you would expect would be you want me to do what no i take this too seriously um you know i'm signing that i commented on that i was like i didn't i didn't think under right i do and the stuff he was doing fit the the attitude somebody should have if they're actually taking their opponent into consideration in that moment

14:43of defending a title um as much as a fans dug it you know it was on my mind watch i had no idea it was pop box last match when i watched that but it's like i always had this feeling like he deserved to be because of how good he was as a craftsman in that ring and how very very seriously he took his craft and his approach to it i felt he deserved to be respected by his opponents to have a match that reflected how seriously he took things and i and i went to brought that up except darby did tonight you know what i mean like darby's like yeah i kind of thought he wouldn't want to do it and it was kind of cool that he was like i know i'll play i'll play in your i'll play in your sandbox in literally and figuratively um i think it would be our own destiny as well yeah yep um but when it was you know when it was time to turn it up and have a a serious match i mean he is you know uh you know Chris Benwamy it's down to my kid meets Brett Hart you know style wise um you know i told i think it was uh zaccato on the flagship when he called him a high flyer

15:48and i was like yeah of course but that's not the first thing i think of when i think of pop there's a lot of high flyers but what pop did was the the christmas and the perfection of the execution the precision adding a little extra oomph to the basic moves i wrote that in the cover story this week too that that it wasn't yes he was a great high flyer but it was it was the other thing the little things that he does that i really like and appreciate in a match you know more than just fintin in a bunch of high spots and flying moves he he was an embodiment of that in what came across and all my conversations with with wrestlers who knew him now and in the past and um that he was and i'm gladdix caliper said at the beginning of the show and his prepared statement that he had trouble getting through that was a start of a whole two and a half hours of of uh people joking up including people sitting at home and trying to type up reports um he said that he was your wrestlers favorite wrestler um your favorite wrestlers favorite wrestler and that came through

16:49more in the last few days and i realized but it didn't surprise me at all you know like but i was like oh did some people think oh we took things a little too seriously heard that about bread heart sometimes like oh it takes himself a little too seriously that was not pop like i specifically asked someone did he have trouble doing jobs because a little bit of reputation that you know he might have not wanted to do jobs i heard that he goes no he wanted to be on the show that's what he wanted he didn't have any problem um being asked to do jobs he just wanted to participate and be put in a position where he could show what he could do against a good opponent um so yeah i just i'm i uh so park bence sadly we we got to know him better um because of this show i don't know that i've ever seen a better seen a better tribute show um a double plus from a w on the in that regard um it has to be so difficult to like well first of all we saw it with like orange Cassidy i mean

17:51trying to yeah when the bell rang and he just looked at the sky and he looked and he's like i can't do this and then he kind of went through the motions monster put on a hammer lock and he's like oh let me reach for the ropes throughout a break it and he wasn't doing stick when it was kind of slow motion it's hard just wasn't in it it was just um you know the the nick nick jackson was just sobbing on the stage and and i mean you could just see the the the love that people had for him and how they pushed through Tony shivani said Tony shivani by the way did a great job with the in ring tribute tonight and i thought did a really nice job on commentary saying you know it's really difficult for these wrestlers to do what they're doing tonight with with what's going on in all the emotions but it you know it's what pakhu don't want it it's what pakhu would have done um it is it is out of respect to him you go and you continue on that line sometimes feels like it's just an excuse to not give up revenue or not give up a show or you know got tv time to fill so we just say it's what he wanted but i do i believe that would have either done in this situation or would want

18:53everyone to go out there and do their best but he also i think would be obviously you know touched and honored by what was said about him and and the uh you know the level of of of intense positive feelings were in professionally and personally um like i said we can all only hope for something even close to that um yeah Dave Roberts here there you are surrounded by fans sharing wings sharing drinks high-fiving random strangers everybody remembers the game nobody remembers the guy coughing behind you until a few days later at 2 a.m you wake up with the fever and your throats on fire now what urgent care close ER slam telehealth maybe but the pharmacies close you needed a medical emergency kit these aren't first aid kits they contain essential prescriptions used for over 30 common conditions sinus and ear infection uti stomach bug travelers diarrhea and more on hand before you need them use your doctor develop guidebook to select the right

19:54prescription or call their telemedicine doctor standing by it's like an urgent care and drug store at home when you're sick traveling or stranded you wish you ordered a medical emergency kit order online in minutes and it's shipped to your door and say 45 dollars with my promo code blue at urgent care kit dot com slash blue that's promo code blue at urgent care kit dot com slash blue show button here football season is finally back and prize picks is bringing out their best offer new users who sign up will get one hundred and fifty dollars in lineups if you win your first five dollar lineup that's right if you win your first five dollar lineup you'll get one hundred and fifty dollars in lineups on prize picks you simply pick two to six players pick more or less on their staff projections and submit your lineup then sweat it out as you watch your picks play out live it's the best way to get more locked in on game day make all the picks you want this football season all in the same app also prize picks is going crazy with the deals to start the football season

20:55giving users a new promo every day during stack September and now prize picks is available nationwide so what are you waiting for lock in for kickoff because everyone and everything is on prize picks what you want download the app today and use code blue wire to get one hundred or fifty dollars instantly in lineups if you win your first five dollar lineup prize picks run your game Dave Roberts here there you are surrounded by fans sharing wings sharing drinks high-fiving random strangers everybody remembers the game nobody remembers the guy coughing behind you until a few days later at 2 a.m. you wake up with the fever and your throats on fire now what urgent care close ER slam telehealth maybe but the pharmacies close you needed a medical emergency kit these aren't first aid kits they contain essential prescriptions used for over 30 common conditions sinus and ear infection uti stomach bug travelers diarrhea and more on hand before you need them user doctor develop guidebook to select the right prescription or call their telemedicine doctor

21:58standing by it's like an urgent care and drugstore at home when you're sick traveling or stranded you wish you ordered a medical emergency kit order online in minutes and it's shipped to your door and say forty five dollars with my promo code blue at urgent care kit dot com slash blue that's promo code blue at urgent care kit dot com slash blue did you know that you can enjoy commercial free versions of all of your favorite weight color podcasts and pw torched daily cast on Spotify just go to patreon dot com search pw torch and subscribe to a vp membership tier you get a seven day free trial by the way to kick the tires a bit see if you like the service and then think it was Spotify and you can listen to commercial free versions of our free shows like the weight color post shows the weight color podcast flagship our flashbacks and also the pw torched day the cast line up again all commercial free and nice streamline listening experience but with third tier membership you can also unlock all the VIP podcasts including everything with rich and weighed the fix with Todd Martin that I host with Todd every week the weight color news bulletin

22:59post pay per view round tables and an array of other VIP exclusive podcasts with different hosts and different themes check out the lineup go to patreon and search pw torch and subscribe and sync it up with Spotify or stay within the patreon ecosystem either way works go to patreon and start your seven day free trial day robber tier there you are surrounded by fans sharing wings sharing drinks high-fiving random strangers everybody remembers the game nobody remembers the guy coughing behind you until a few days later at 2 a.m. you wake up with the fever and your throats on fire now what urgent care close ER slam telehealth maybe but the pharmacies close you needed a medical emergency kit these aren't first aid kits they contain essential prescriptions used for over 30 common conditions sinus and ear infection UTIs stomach bug travelers diarrhea and more on hand before you need them use your doctor develop guidebook to select the right prescription or call their telemedicine doctor standing by it's like an urgent care and drugstore at home when

24:04you're sick traveling or stranded you wish you ordered a medical emergency kit order online in minutes and it's shipped to your door and say 45 dollars with my promo code blue at urgent care kit slash blue that's promo code blue at urgent care kit dot com slash blue show button here football season is finally back and prize picks is bringing out their best offer yet new users who sign up will get one hundred and fifty dollars in line ups if you win your first five dollar lineup that's right if you win your first five dollar lineup you'll get one hundred and fifty dollars in line ups on prize picks you simply pick two to six players pick more or less on their staff projections and submit your lineup then sweat it out as you watch your picks play out live it's the best way to get more locked in on game day make all the picks you want this football season all in the same app also prize picks is going crazy with the deals to start the football season giving users a new promo every day during stack September and now prize picks is available nationwide so what are you

25:05waiting for locking for kickoff because everyone and everything is on prize picks what you want download the app today and use code blue wire to get one of your fifty dollars instantly in line ups if you win your first five dollar lineup prize picks run your game Dave Roberts here there you are surrounded by fans sharing wings sharing drinks high-fiving random strangers everybody remembers the game nobody remembers the guy coughing behind you until a few days later at 2 a.m. you wake up with the fever and your throats on fire now what urgent care close ER slam telehealth maybe but the pharmacies close you needed a medical emergency kit these aren't first aid kits they contain essential prescriptions used for over 30 common conditions sinus and ear infection UTIs stomach bug travelers diarrhea and more on hand before you need them user doctor develop guidebook to select the right prescription or call their telemedicine doctor standing by it's like an urgent care and drugstore at home when you're sick traveling or stranded you'll

26:07wish you ordered a medical emergency kit order online in minutes and it shipped to your door and say forty five dollars with my promo code blue at urgent care kit dot com slash blue that's promo code blue at urgent care kit dot com slash blue Chris I feel like a lot of what he's done is flown under the radar because of his visa problems and the fact that a lot of his early career was in smaller companies I don't know how much you saw of him been like dragging gate but to start his career not only was he a high flyer but that was basically all he did a lot of his matches he spent an inordinate amount of time just climbing to the top rope he started a backyard wrestler and that was all about yeah you know yeah that era was all about just doing stunts remember the first couple of matches of his I saw when he was still jungle pack and he would hit the top rope move and then immediately go back out and climb up the ropes again and I was just at some point this stops being wrestling but he has refined and reinvented himself to the point where he became a

27:09complete wrestler and he literally could do it all and then you could see how much it meant the one one of the moments that was taken by head orange Cassidy was rough to watch because that that was so incongruous for him but the one that really sticks in my head is Will Osfer's reaction after he hit the black arrow yes and you could see how crucial that was to him I would imagine he's done move similar to that a hundred times but he nailed it perfectly and you can see how much it meant to him to hit that move in that match and that one that one really broke me for people to see it he just he kneeled on the mat and just pounded the mat and had this emotional eruption that was pent up in a lot of people let the emotions flow on their ring entrance and in the ring itself and Osprey was holding it together you know just he just wasn't emoting in the same way

28:12that that you know plenty of other people did on the show and it was interesting because it was there but he he didn't show itself until that moment that was his tribute to Pock it was him doing a move that that was Pock's move and he landed it and then then you know the hugs with Ricochet that the start of the match at the end of the match I mean there's just so many moments on this show I mean I'm just randomly you know recalling them yeah I just I don't the I mean seriously like we could have led with the the mock sleep promo from Saturday night in front of the retaining wall it sounded like this like that he knew something was going to happen didn't know what I have notes on on that yeah talk about it Chris yeah at and if this for any other night we would be probably leading the show with what a phenomenal promo that was and how it really hit at the essence of what they do it was a great way for mock sleep to sort of reposition

29:13himself after losing a title shot but instead I found myself and put and and by the way and put over will Osprey like yes the the the generosity and and the gesture of it was all I mean he took every ounce of credibility he had and and passed it as best he could like if there was that was the most genuine heartfelt intentional torch passing in a promo that I've seen in as much as that you know that that was a story and that was to a degree in real life I mean that moxley endorsed you like that Chris are interrupting but like yeah I want to get across like that that that the the storyline in real life endorsement of Osprey and then the speech of what is on his shoulders and the responsibility of Osprey has it makes the world title and Osprey's reign feels so much more important just magnified it it is an incredibly difficult line to walk because not only did he put Osprey over but he said you know Osprey was a better man tonight he left the door open to say on another

30:14night I might be the better man that it is so hard to walk that line but it was a phenomenal promo and I found myself doing two things I was waiting to see if Pac was going to talk if they were going to put him on the camera if that was part of that promo and then every mention of the of the stuff that you said where moxley sounds like he could feel it he talked about losing matches losing in life losing people and I cringed and then he talked about eulogies and being a people's funerals and there's two types of eulogies people talk about what you did and people talk about who you were and I cringed again am I is he is he some sort of seer yeah and I think that's why they when they introduced it they said it was going to be an emotional message but it was on another level of eerie and yet it still resonated as an incredible promo if if moxley had not done promos in that realm before I don't know what conspiracy theory there would be about you know what was going on there and what affected it have or yeah I mean

31:20like it eerie is right but it is the way that moxley approaches the business like he takes he takes it seriously in a similar intensity but in different ways that puck did you know that the he is speaking his passion and his truth when he talks about you know this is what his kids would dream to do it yeah and there's not enough people around here appreciating it um you know now is the beginning of the kind of the moxley story arc in the death writers which is always confusing because it's a baby face promo but he was playing heel and you know and it it felt incinerate with traditional storytelling and that's why fans keep cheering no matter what he does and he does some over the top things that sort of aren't super credible in the world of pro wrestling and yet there's this authenticity and this intensity and a cool factor to him that where you just hang it on his every word and you're not hanging on his every word because it's witty or

32:21breaking a fourth wall in meta or shooting on someone you hang it as every word because it does feel like a genuine ra-ra speech I don't like inspirational speech from somebody who is trying to make wrestlers respect the business as much as he believes it deserves to be respected and to appreciate the craft and the opportunity to perform it in front of huge crowds but also you know mox is willing to work in front of small crowds like he said he told me in the interview when he was edit a w or left when he left out of it he was like I didn't even open the envelope with their offer I just want to go do my thing in c z w in front of 80 people like I it's not the money you know and and with pocket talk about him and in all the all the small shows he worked as he kind of worked his way up and you know where where was his place in wrestling at during the time that he was coming up because he went from backyard wrestler to us to us

33:21a world where w didn't exist then sick man was the dominant us promoter he had the accent and he wasn't tall and he worked a style until 205 live that wasn't something that would be featured and and and it was you know he got his places I mean that's where you know pwg that's where he went at the bucks and next caliper had a history with them there for sure and so many others who are involved in a w now there's so much about pox journey that it that parallels the journey that led to the launch of the eight w brand and we can say that about a lot of people I mean Cody Rhodes don't forget about him there's something about Cody leaving doubt of e and starting a new company um in can you Omega which a pan and how influential new Japan in Japan wrestling in general international wrestling is not a w but you know in the young bucks obviously with with the us indies and I mean it a lot came together but pox was all of those and first he was Japan yes he was Japan he was international indies scene he was he left a company

34:24like Cody did um kind of on his own terms to a degree I mean there were legal things that kept him around a little bit and pwg I mean pox embodied aspects of Cody and Kenny and the bucks the four wrestling founders of the brand he he was he was he was he was part of all of that and that is that's part of why the reaction to him tonight was there is everybody shared something in common with the journey he took who are well not everybody in 80 but like almost everybody w maybe everybody identifies with something about his journey and so much of what he was great at is what a w stands for or aspires to stand for or what its fans want a w two embody without hack there's no will us pray there's no gate kid these are all british wrestlers who followed his template for how to get seen because british wrestling for a long time didn't exist like it was just you know there's a whole lost generation in there people like jody fly shoot was a phenomenal

35:28high flyer that nobody in North America ever saw really and pack almost fell into that category but he managed to catch on to the wave of North American indies being revitalized just at the right and he got noticed through ring of honor's pro partnership with dragon gate and then when he started working and with he when the young bucks went to japan he basically took care of them if you read the young bucks book it's all in there it's not the greatest book in the world but I did learn a lot about their their upbringing and and how they got into the business and pack plays a huge role in that and when you when you think about obviously dynamite kid was in new in japan long before but pack really was the modern day trailblazer for somebody who just went around the world and showed that you can make success by traveling with wrestling and it's yeah it's kind of eerie to think about how much of what we saw tonight wouldn't have been that without his

36:33way he's showing the way of how to do it well put i mean yes yes the the the opportunity that wrestlers had to tell the story tonight um it's sharing those you know aspects of everything you just talked about there created a complete picture i mean there's there's so many fans who saw a pack as a really good wrestler you know one of the not often talked about but one of the first big signings for aw you know it doesn't get talked about in that way um because it was on in off stretches of time working on dynamite um and working a w um for all kinds of reasons but the the i think of fan who didn't understand is going to be curious to explore more about his career after this show um if they didn't fully appreciate him and and kind of had him sort of interchangeable with other just good kind of cruiserweight size wrestlers who who do dives and

37:37there's just so much more uh to him all right not sure how much so i got yeah no no you go go christian i was just because i'm not sure how much dragon gate you can actually find online these days some of the older shows but they're definitely worth watching um because you wouldn't even recognize the guy if it wasn't for his ears hey there's journey is phenomenal well i keep having instances of why this tribute show is just phenomenal um and and one of them is the the video at the end and showing him as a little kid and as a teenager um they had grainy footage of him wrestling brody lee they had uh footage of him sharing um a room with uh andy docha williams that was on the photo montage too on the big screen and and obviously just him wrestling so many aw wrestlers you know brin Daniel synnononononon um it's just a phenomenal video and um perfect song accompaniment um during the video

38:41jeez i mean the the um it was uh they know how to speak by the Manchester orchestra and it was just yeah i mean oh and then the closing scene that's what i was thinking of um he to have a clip of him sitting on a chair looking like pock you know like um just kind of street closed you know of him just looking at the camera sitting on a chair and saying till we meet again and blowing kisses at the camera where is i was like is that a i like where do you come where how do you have such perfect yeah footage you have the moxley promo from saturday night you got that there's so many other clips that i don't know what that production team did and who who was behind and how much time it took to put that together but they had you know a few days and i mean i i i don't know they just stayed up all night but i mean i just want to give credit to whoever put that effort and time and perfection in because that was pulling video from a lot of different

39:46places a lot of different sources and it was i'm sure they didn't own all of it either like to put that together that must have taken forever i really hope there wasn't AI but yeah wow oh i'm sure i i i say that facetious i don't think they don't think they would have done that it was my point is it was so perfect how could it not be you know what i mean um and uh okay so zack barber says that clip was actually poxed to be put from collision a couple weeks ago yeah um makes sense um and so so they they they they they artfully put so much of this and then the the rest of promos you know in the locker room um yeah i don't know i'm just i'm gushin i'm like i just it was what he deserved and they can be proud that they gave him what is there if i can only imagine how his parents and and wife feel i mean you you know your your family member comes home from work and he's hurting and he might be complaining about something or he might be telling a funny story

40:49did they have any idea truly how much he was beloved and respected you know how could they to that degree this has to just be uh uh you know i'm amazing for them yeah for sure all right uh let's take the breath uh introduce ourselves quickly here um i want to throw some uh check comments up we got Rudog waiting to uh join us on the show as a caller also um not a lot to the show to talk about but you know we can do a little bit of that but um you know the it was just background for people talking about pop understandably um so and as it should have been Dave Roberts here there you are surrounded by fans sharing wings sharing drinks high-fiving random strangers everybody remembers the game nobody remembers the guy coughing behind you until a few days later at 2 a.m. you wake up with the fever and your throats on fire now what urgent care close ER slam telehealth maybe but the pharmacies close you needed a medical emergency kit these aren't first

41:52aid kits they contain essential prescriptions used for over 30 common conditions sinus and ear infection uti stomach bug travelers diarrhea and more on hand before you need them use your doctor develop guidebook to select the right prescription or call their telemedicine doctor standing by it's like an urgent care and drugstore at home when you're sick traveling or stranded you wish you ordered a medical emergency kit order online in minutes and it's shipped to your door and say 45 dollars with my promo code blue at urgent care kit dot com slash blue that's promo code blue at urgent care kit dot com slash blue right now at subway try the 499 sub of the day get a different six inch sub every day for just 499 each like neatball marinara on Mondays tuna on Tuesdays and the BMT on Saturdays it's a different six inch sub every day packed with protein and your choice of chopped veggies for just 499 each or make it a meal with chips and a drink for just two dollars more but hurry it's only for a limited time and only its subway at participating

42:54restaurants prices higher in Washington, Alaska and Hawaii and on third party delivery add-ons taxes and fees for delivery additional Dave Roberts here there you are surrounded by fans sharing wings sharing drinks high-fiving random strangers everybody remembers the game nobody remembers the guy coughing behind you until a few days later at 2 a.m. you wake up with the fever and your throats on fire now what urgent care close ER slam telehealth maybe but the pharmacies close you needed a medical emergency kit these aren't first aid kits they contain essential prescriptions used for over 30 common conditions sinus and ear infection uti stomach bug travelers diarrhea and more on hand before you need them use your doctor develop guidebook to select the right prescription or call their telemedicine doctor standing by it's like an urgent care and drugstore at home when you're sick traveling or stranded you'll wish you ordered a medical emergency kit order online in minutes and it's shipped to your door and say 45 dollars with my promo code blue at urgent care kit dot com slash blue that's promo code blue at urgent care kit dot com slash blue

44:02searching for more great pro wrestling talk then join me Jason Powell host him to three weekly pro wrestling boom podcast each week he'll hear the latest news and analysis for me and my team at pro wrestling dot net along with other pro wrestling media members plus the pro wrestling boom podcast features long form interviews with notable names in the pro wrestling industry subscribe and I tune stitch your downcast and all your favorite secondary apps or visit us directly at pw boom dot com once again that's pw boom dot com Dave Roberts here there you are surrounded by fans sharing wings sharing drinks high-fiving random strangers everybody remembers the game nobody remembers the guy coughing behind you until a few days later at 2 a.m. you wake up with the fever and your throats on fire now what urgent care close ER slam telehealth maybe but the pharmacies close you needed a medical emergency kit these aren't first aid kits they contain essential prescriptions used for over 30 common conditions sinus and ear

45:03infection uti stomach bug travelers diarrhea and more on hand before you need them user doctor develop guidebook to select the right prescription or call their telemedicine doctor standing by it's like an urgent care and drugstore at home when you're sick traveling or stranded you wish you ordered a medical emergency kit order online in minutes and it's shipped to your door and say 45 dollars with my promo code blue at urgent care kit dot com slash blue that's promo code blue at urgent care kit dot com slash blue right now at subway try the 499 sub of the day get a different six inch sub every day for just 499 each like meatball marinara on Mondays tuna on Tuesdays and the DMT on Saturdays it's a different six inch sub every day packed with protein and your choice of chopped veggies for just 499 each or make it a meal with chips and a drink for just $2 more but hurry it's only for a limited time and only its subway at participating restaurants prices higher in Washington, Alaska and Hawaii and on third party delivery add on taxes and fees for delivery

46:03additional Dave Roberts here there you are surrounded by fans sharing wings sharing drinks high five random strangers everybody remembers the game nobody remembers the guy coughing behind you until a few days later at 2 a.m. you wake up with the fever and your throats on fire now what urgent care close ER slam telehealth maybe but the pharmacies close you needed a medical emergency kit these aren't first aid kits they contain essential prescriptions used for over 30 common conditions sinus and ear infection UTIs stomach bug travelers diarrhea and more on hand before you need them use your doctor develop guidebook to select the right prescription or call their telemedicine doctor standing by it's like an urgent care and drugstore at home when you're sick traveling or stranded you'll wish you ordered a medical emergency kit order online in minutes and it's shipped to your door and say 45 dollars with my promo code blue at urgentcare kit.com slash blue that's promo code blue at urgentcare kit dot com slash blue this is the weight color progress

47:08link post show on Wednesday September 30th of 2026 I'm weight color host the show editor publisher founder of the progressing torch weekly newsletter and the website pwtorch.com I also host a number of podcasts throughout the week including yesterday's blue logo show the flagship we talked about pop for I don't know 45 minutes at the top of that show so check that out Zach Hadorne formerly a processing torch now sports illustrated brass ring media and frequent contributor to the pw torch vip form by the way join me yesterday if you have not listened to that I encourage you to do so search weight color in your podcast app and subscribe to the blue logo show the flagship will be one of the top shows on that listing with a lot of a lot of details on the pop situation including just talking about the the you know what's known about the circumstance of when when he was found and and his death and so anyway wow um and uh oh you'll see a red logo pop up too uh that's our post show podcast feed the audio only feed so subscribe to that too and while you're at it be sure to search pw torch to subscribe to the pw torch daily cast feed that includes the

48:14all elite conversation club certainly Joel and Greg are we talking about pop um and all out and much more brine danielson uh will be a talking point once we kind of get past the uh the the the podcast back to this too um so look for that different show each day the week on the daily cast feed it's free and it has different shows each day the week with different pairs of hosts and different themes and topics um so check that out if you aren't a pw torch vip member um encourage you to become a pw torch vip member just search or just enter pw torch vip info.com for full information on that you can join the conversation on pop in the vip form and also read this week's cover story that i wrote on pop and also um our coverage of all out including the newsletter exclusive roundtable reviews from the team giving their scores and long form reviews that is also posted on the vip website that includes my review and score for the event too uh we're here to talk down to my tonight and i am joined by chryslands deli pw torch

49:14contributor of freaking cohost with me on uh post shows uh chrys welcome thanks for uh thanks for doing this yeah um my pleasure as always um maybe one of these days i'll do a post show that isn't a memorial show because i was on the rebel show it was the last time i was on and now with this one so i hope i'm not bad luck i hope i'm not a cast but um yeah yeah just um it was a really emotional night and i'm glad that we get to to chop it up with some people yeah all right as i said we got some uh lots of uh chat comments that are responding what we're saying and also just and looks like weight has dropped off temporarily i'm sure he'll be right back but yeah emotional night lots of feelings and weight is back yeah i put put fingers on the track pad and uh hit the and ended up taking me back a screen uh i'm sorry about that so um a lot a lot of comments we're gonna start with um the uh super chats uh thank you

50:17ready for super chats um we'll start with uh is that barber mox's promo no hyperbole might have been the most extraordinary promo of all time it was eerily prophetic and powerful i want box to do my you legit now don't be so sure about that sack you gotta run it from spec first uh um i think mox would be pretty blunt um i don't think we want to randomly assign um uh euliches because mox is real yeah i'm obviously i'm joking joking sack he got to know know you well i'm sure it would be a positive eulichy um uh yeah that that that was there's something about the way mox and i mean we need to talk about the the hug with daniel sin and mox either and i know zack commented um in in the chat elsewhere on that um that it that moment given what's happened storyline you know um yeah this is uh it's ax comment to brand-annison coming out and reconciling with mox absolutely destroyed me that was just wonderful um

51:21the symbolism of this we we are brought together for the love because of our our mutual love for pock and respect for him what was another one of dozens and i'm not exaggerating dozens of moving touching great moments included in this a double plus tribute uh episode to uh to pock um coming on that Chris i don't think we're going to see much more of that going forward i think this was a one night only type of thing yeah uh because storyline it makes no sense but we're gonna ignore that tonight it was incredibly moving um i was sitting on the edge of my seat terrified the entire match because daniel sin doesn't seem to know anything other than all full speed all the time all gas no brakes you gotta mean um kind of terrifying but fitting because he was a part of daniel sin's career um both in and outside AEW and yeah it was just to see the two of them sort of hugging

52:23not gonna lie when there were only four death riders dressed and moxley was being coy on the mic i fully expected ilia dragon off to come out oh wow would have been a perfect fit but probably not a great time to be debuting someone so yeah yeah um yeah they they do a lot of attention to mox sitting at ring and mox yeah playing coy was was entertaining um and uh and then the death rate of music morphing into daniel sin and him coming out and the crowd just interrupting with yes chance i'm not gonna i know there's some comments in the chat you know it should he or shouldn't he and i don't want to focus on that um you know i don't i don't think it's it's uh and obvious i don't think there's an obvious answer and i don't think it's egregious enough to to condemn outright um but i'm with you chris in terms of you know just you did you know if daniel sin has the issues that he has um and he has retired i mean if there was ever going to be

53:28a context where he returned this would be it but i certainly i'll just say i was certainly hoping he would be um limited in what he did so that it didn't distract the concern for what what's he doing didn't distract from what was meant to be a tribute to him and and that's that's a concern i had and you know once the bell rang and as you noted he you know he doesn't know any other speed so as showman brunny was retired and trying to talk his way back into coming out of retirement in the wb and he was like i'm learning a whole new style where you don't do bumps it's just tumbling it's just rolling you're just doing a hold and then you're rolling and i'm right here like he wants to be in there you want to be in the ring so bad that he would talk about doing a style completely different that he could then convince the doctors to clear him because i'm there we know impact on my neck i'm going to do i'm going to reinvent wrestling and i mean that's how i interpreted his you know just childlike enthusiasm for what he was do what how he's still able to work out of the ring and do something different and that just sticks with me how much you know i don't i don't know what when it obviously nobody twisted his arm to be in this match but um i wonder you know how much he insisted

54:30and if there was any pushback from people going there's other things we can do it he's like no i need to do it i need to do it and you know i'm not gonna say no probably yeah i don't think anyone could because he does have some sway back i think he still works a lot of the production side too yeah um i don't i didn't have a problem with him being in the match i had a small problem with some of the stuff he did once he was in there like he could have done what prepare a caspin doing and played it very safe but you know he did everything that brianisin normally does yeah and not it was a smart probably not but it's just the time to care about it probably not yeah yeah it's direct michael says i personally don't think tonight's the night to cast dispersions about daneson being uh back in the ring um you know that that's just because there was a discussion going on you know in in in the chat uh david brant welcome david uh says i don't think the average fan had any problem with daneson being in the made of it i think we're looking at this through a niche lens because they're niche fans um but that's fine you know i mean we're going to notice things and talk

55:33about things that maybe the average fan wouldn't that's um more of a feature than a flaw but the reality is true but you know what's david saying people just like oh he came out of retirement and isn't this cool and so i i don't think the average fan um was sitting there going oh this ruined everything or this is taking you know oh now now i can't concentrate i'm worried so you know we we feel that way um okay other uh chat comments here uh super chats excuse me uh Derek Mitchell's this tribute shows like the one held for Owen Owen Hart Eddie Groe Brody Lee or Bre White are extremely difficult to watch tonight's tribute was no different for puck by accounts a wonderful man and beloved by everyone um indeed uh i mean indeed i yeah um so i don't want to rank tribute shows i'm just saying this was magnificent uh Derek Mitchell and another super chat says when a w held their first press conference it featured the elite in jerico however many forget puck was an integral part of that event and helped establish eight w along with veterans like jerico and moxley yeah he just was that you know he was you know cruiserweight champ and

56:39but he didn't have the the the star power to be the guy that you would like say to the mainstream fan look who we got you know like it's just he didn't he didn't get that kind of stat he didn't have that stature in any of the categories where he was featured especially to a five-live being a bit of a of a you know b show or c show for w w by the end um but he was you know kind of uh he was an embodiment in retrospect and even at the time but especially in retrospect in a body man of so many things that that caused a w two need to exist and cause in why there was a fan base willing to embrace it from the start and make it sustainable you know six seven years in now um yeah so he embodied that at the point jerico was the star power and later on moxley moxley don't forget was he showed up on the first paper view yeah i don't even know if it was the first one but he he he was not at the original signing uh feels like the press conference thing yeah omega and bucks were the indy diolings hangman was the next big thing but pack was the

57:44reclamation project pack was almost like the the mission statement for a e w's we're going to show you what could have been done with these people because they don't know what to do with them yes and it it wasn't like a shalton Benjamin or someone where it's like no he didn't get pushed because when they tried to push him he he flocked no it was they don't know how to push some of these people and pack was the embodiment of that like a guy who just did not fit the mold of the kind of person that got pushed ironically in his recent times he would have fit that mold with the with the build that he managed to to put together right whatever it means but he was yeah he was a reclamation project i want to know before i forget then we'll get back to super chats and we'll get to redog too um uh allen for all allen kuna han a pw torch columnist and podcaster and part of the vpp form did a tribute podcast to a number of wrestlers

58:49and he wanted and this was back in early 2024 so um you know over two and a half years ago he did a um two hour twenty two minute uh two hour twenty six minute show on pop on shins then um he said uh he he knew him a bit from his dragon gate years uh allen did and he said that that um you know they talked in exchange e-mails back in those days so he knew him back then um he said there was a a lovely young man like when he got to know him early on and then he grew into a great man from all accounts and so he wants he he suggested um he wants to share those memories again with a large audience so we're gonna uh post them we're gonna post that show on one of our podcast feeds um this week so look for that could be on red or blue or daily cash i'm kind of logistically figuring out um where we can fit it in where it'll uh not be bumped down and and be featured so um

59:51please just be on the lookout for that um because that's was a vpp exclusive show uh over two and a half years ago we're offering it for everybody um just allen you know like i mean he knew him well and he uh i mean when i say well not as well as people on the show tonight but like he knew them then back then you know like um had a number of interactions with them but followed his career you know from the outside looking in as a as a viewer as a like no one else um and so that's a real special show so if you're if you are you know i said you watched this show and you're like oh now i got it i want to do a deep dive out of respect for for Ben but also because i want to know more about him if he was this special i didn't i didn't really fully appreciate him allen's podcast will will help you do that and piece together his career in a way that we're just not going to be able to get into on tonight's show uh okay uh it's great to have allen on the staff um he just brings something completely different uh Derek Mitchell uh with another superchesses r ip pocket really great performer who's gone way too soon it is surreal to realize his

1:00:53last dough to be matched was on september 26th 2017 and his final match took place this past weekend add all out on september 26th 2026 and had noticed that and thank you Derek again generosity of superchets appreciated uh zack barbers says i wish to god they didn't have e but a w soul amazing attribute shows in making it feel like a true celebration of life um on uh home going service um yeah you know so how i feel zack i've gushed about it for 45 minutes here just uh amazing job that they did um yeah dav robberteer there you are surrounded by fans sharing wings sharing drinks high-fiving random strangers everybody remembers the game nobody remembers the guy coughing behind you until a few days later at 2 a.m you wake up with the fever and your throats on fire now what urgent care close er slam telehealth maybe but the pharmacies close you needed a medical emergency kit these aren't first aid kits they contain essential

1:01:57prescriptions used for over 30 common conditions sinus and ear infection uti stomach bug travelers diarrhea and more on hand before you need them use your doctor developed guidebook to select the right prescription or call their telemedicine doctor standing by it's like an urgent care and drugstore at home when you're sick traveling or stranded you'll wish you ordered a medical emergency kit order online in minutes and it's shipped to your door and say 45 dollars with my promo code blue at urgent care kit dot com slash blue that's promo code blue at urgent care kit dot com slash blue right now at subway try the 499 sub of the day get a different six inch sub every day for just 499 each like neat ball marinara on mondays tuna on two days and the bm t on Saturdays it's a different six inch sub every day packed with protein and your choice of chopped veggies for just 499 each or make it a meal with chips and a drink for just two dollars more but hurry it's only for a limited time and only its subway at participating restaurants prices

1:02:58higher in washington alaskan hwai and on third party delivery add on taxes and fees for delivery additional davor obritte here there you are surrounded by fans sharing wings sharing drinks high five random strangers everybody remembers the game nobody remembers the guy coughing behind you until a few days later at 2 a.m you wake up with the fever and your throats on fire now what urgent care close ER slam telehealth maybe but the pharmacies close you needed a medical emergency kit these aren't first aid kits they contain essential prescriptions used for over 30 common conditions sinus and ear infection uti stomach bug travelers diarrhea and more on hand before you need them use your doctor develop guidebook to select the right prescription or call their telemedicine doctor standing by it's like an urgent care and drugstore at home when you're sick traveling or stranded you'll wish you ordered a medical emergency kit order online in minutes and it's shipped to your door and say 45 dollars with my promo code blue at urgent care kit dot com slash blue

1:03:59promo code blue at urgent care kit dot com slash blue iPhone users if you're listening to us on the native podcast app on your iPhone you can unlock our commercial free versions of our free shows by searching pw torch in apple podcast you'll see a charcoal gray logo that says pw torch vip on it click on that there's some free samples of vip shows and you can unlock the entire vip line up which includes vip exclusives plus commercial free versions of the free shows by searching pw torch in apple podcast and clicking on the pw torch vip logo and then activate your three day free trial and after that you can become a vip member using your apple account it's that easy enjoy a streamlined listening experience to our free shows and unlock all the vip exclusives including our post pay per view round tables the weight-calor news bulletins everything with rich and weighed the fix that I host with Todd Martin and a variety of other vip exclusives just search pw torch in your apple podcast app davor obert here there you are surrounded by fans sharing wings

1:05:00sharing drinks high-fiving random strangers everybody remembers the game nobody remembers the guy coughing behind you until a few days later at 2 a.m. you wake up with the fever and your throats on fire now what urgent care close ER slam telehealth maybe but the pharmacies close you needed a medical emergency kit these aren't first aid kits they contain essential prescriptions used for over 30 common conditions sinus and ear infection uti stomach bug travelers diarrhea and more on hand before you need them use your doctor develop guidebook to select the right prescription or call their telemedicine doctor standing by it's like an urgent care and drugstore at home when you're sick traveling or stranded you'll wish you ordered a medical emergency kit order online in minutes and it's shipped to your door and say 45 dollars with my promo code blue at urgent care kit dot com slash blue that's promo code blue at urgent care kit dot com slash blue meet the red bull dragonberry energizer it's one of the many new drinks out now who knew ice cold

1:06:04drinks could be so fire try them all only at my dogs show button here football season is finally and prize picks is bringing out their best offer yet new users who sign up will get $150 in line ups if you win your first $5 line up that's right if you win your first $5 line up you'll get $150 in line ups on prize picks you simply pick two to six players pick more or less on their step projections and submit your lineup then sweat it out as you watch your picks play out live it's the best way to get more locked in on game day make all the picks you want this football season all in the same app also prize picks is going crazy with the deals to start the football season giving users a new promo every day during stack september and now prize picks is available nation wives so what are you waiting for lock in for kickoff because everyone and everything is on prize picks what you want download the app today and use code blue wire to get one of your $50

1:07:06is doing a line ups if you win your first $5 line up prize picks run your game so I want to give some time to some other chats but first I want to bring a root dog onto the show to talk about this so if you had other check comments will devote some time to it in a moment here a root dog good to see a good talk to you again how's it going good good to talk to you I just want to let you know in my end for whatever reason I can't hear Chris so it might just be me talking to you I don't know why that's the case but I can hear you just fine with okay well Chris this is your chance I mean I normally do anyway so I have a feeling if that were a larger problem the chat the snow by now so yeah root dog that's very weird but apparently it's just you oh yeah oh sorry Chris but yeah if you're not Chris's thanks

1:08:07in litter don't apologize Chris because you can't oh I guess Chris does hope that you hear what he has to say so it is a loss for Chris too I guess all right go ahead but yeah I mean you really can't do a tribute show any better than that like if you let's say you weren't even a wrestling fan and you just happed him to tune in on TBS to watch that you would have thought like one of the biggest most popular wrestlers in the world passed away like they just treated him with such class and like I don't think I'm going to be able to cry on this show because I don't know if I have any more tears left of how that was like I broke down so many times like and it got a little exhausting but it but but it was worth it and it was a beautiful tribute and man like

1:09:12I mean I'm just I'm blown away yeah yeah yeah great uh huh is that part of the check goes a man to that yeah I mean I think I splashed him cold water before going on the air just uh you know you know I mean you saw all the wrestlers fighting it I mean orange Cassidy at the beginning all the wrestlers in the pre tapes um you know the way that osprey just erupted with his emotions mocks after danielson came out I mean just that hold on the top rope and different people had different moments where it just it just came out um and in so many different ways and Bryce Remsburg on the on the stage and I mean they're just that that really stood out um marina shefier as well yeah really really touched yep Austin create uh ducky d points out yeah he was um just sobbing on his way to the ring I mean I don't not gonna everybody has different ways to mourn and and react some new him better than others

1:10:15um some people don't show their emotions in that way others do mean so it's it's not a contest but those who do show their emotions in that way and share that and we're able to and willing to share that with the national audience um contributed to you know the the better understanding of of I'll beloved and respected pakwats I mean uh yeah our redog gave you a minute to gather yourself here anything else you want to say well yeah you brought up awesome creative I was so happy the way like you know the people even if they're heels like treated the better I mean I don't I don't even know what the new level are but uh but I know they had a long relationship but they uh you know through wwe uh Ben used to be on their uh up up uh down down uh video game podcasts and that was like one of the first chances you got to see him being just like a regular guy like

1:11:16like you know behind the scenes yeah and you know when I when I met him briefly like that's what I what I saw of him of just like a super downer like cool guy and you could see that on there and I was like oh no when I saw the new level like I was like they're not gonna be goofy and then I was like oh wait a second they have big history together and it was so it was just so cool to see the respect paid by everyone and and there was a lot of people that could have been better about like you know this was supposed to be my day type of thing talking about Brent Baker coming back to Pittsburgh talking about Wardlow getting his return out of nowhere I mean that's definitely a shadow caught over his return but I mean it was just like everyone was game everyone was cool and it was just a really moving show

1:12:19Tamaranish fear beat Britt Baker you know to escape Brits Finisher and tap her out well in Pittsburgh was the right thing to do and I wasn't expecting that you know I didn't rule it out I wasn't thinking that hard about well what's the finish gonna be but you know she fear could have done the job um and you know because it was Britt in Pittsburgh and she was a focus but man um that was if if that's if Britt insisted on that it was classy if AW came up with the idea and everyone along with it it was classy because you know she fear was by I don't know for a fact I shouldn't say I I'm thinking she fears closer than Britt was to pop I think that's pretty safe to say based on the information I have but I don't I'm not downplaying with Britt but it was just she fear was on camera also you know in canon so to speak tight with Pock and so it was cool that there was that moment also you know I bring that up because it was if it wasn't in Pittsburgh it's like well no big deal you know Brits not featured

1:13:21as a world title level restaurant she's more of a manager and a and a kind of a special attraction but given that it was in Pittsburgh it was more so yeah other two people holding animals so yeah I really think Mobsley like showed that he is the true ace of of AW today I mean if there's any question about it like you could tell he's the locker room leader and you could tell that you know he's like kind of holding everyone together type of thing like you know I've read that you know because Marina Schroffier was at the the butchers tribute show and she found out about Pock's passing there and she was like what am I supposed to do and like contact Mox and was like you got to go out there and wrestle that's what Pock would have worn and so it's just like

1:14:24they're really lucky to have someone like that there because the whole locker room could be a mess I think we'll power them honestly yeah yeah I'm a those acts as way those a brutalizer Pock's finisher yeah got that on our report that she she won with her she escaped Brits finisher and then applied the brutalizer so kind of like with with Osprey you know they were doing tribute moves to Pock and it was a nice touch also and added to the moment that she won with with the move that that Pock won so many matches with yeah anyway Rudog anything else you want to say I know you can't hear Chris so I'm not throwing a Chris until we're done with it's sorry Chris I do want to hear what you have to say so I got stopped to hang out with the lockout lockout lock in that shouldn't that shouldn't be an issue yeah well well I don't got much to say I'm kind of exhausted from the shrew right frankly so

1:15:29but one thing I was like is someone going to try to pull off the black arrow and then when I saw it was Osprey versus Ricochet I was like oh here we go this is where it's going to happen and I was like I thought Ricochet probably could do it the best but but they're not going to have him beat Osprey so I was like all right all right well and you could see him sucking himself up like I'm going to do this I'm going to do this and then he finally did it and it was great and then broke down like I don't know it was just it was special yep it was all right all right and one last thing I was going through all the pop matches I've seen live in the w and there was a lot more than I expected like just just to see all the I think the first I saw him in the w is in night in 19 in Chicago's all out against Kenny Omega which was great

1:16:36and some other highlights I got to see him at Grand Slam against Orange Cassidy at Arthur Ash Stadium which was great and it's so odd that they're like Orange Cassidy might be his like number one singles rival in AEW and I was like maybe it is number of matches I think at least is yeah yeah and then saw the depth triangle versus the elite at the presentoral center at full year and then the last match I saw him was in 25 at full year we're packed versus Darby Allen so I got to see some great matches of his and there's more too that I you know those are just kind of the highlights but yeah it was just I just want to like give a W some props like because you know he was handed so handled so poorly and WWE with that creep trying to make him

1:17:36mighty mouse with a cape and like finally he got to show what he could do like in AEW and I wish it would have been more I wish there would have been more singles matches because a lot of his matches were like multi-man but you know he got to show what he could do so that's all I got to say and thank you sorry I didn't get to talk to you Chris but you can't talk to you okay sorry sorry I didn't get to hear you curse me out Chris but anyways but there's a there's a theory Zack Barber says Rudox speed won't pick up a British accent I don't know about that but I rude dog will talk to you soon take care all right take care everyone thanks but yeah go ahead Chris you want to come at anything Rudox had to say no I'd agree with basically everything he said there was one of the very few people I never actually got to see perform live

1:18:42most of my favorite wrestlers I've actually seen him wrestle live wow I never got to see him unfortunately but yeah like everything he said just kind of echoed what we were saying earlier and the thing about Moxie I think is a particularly poignant because there's been so many times where people are said oh Moxie's do a vacation but he never seems to take one because it's almost like the locker room which was full apart if he wasn't in it and he's he's got a strong character I imagine he's one of those leaders that people listen to not because they're afraid of him not because of anything other than they just respect the living daylights out of him yeah did you where did you think the storyline was going if if anything in particular with him and the deathwriters Pock and Moxie and did the promo Saturday night point towards anything because they they lingered on Pock at the end and he was a last to leave but I don't I think we'd be we'd be guessing to read into Pock's expression because it wasn't he didn't do anything over the top but it's

1:19:46consistent with the number of things which is I second what Moxie said or I'm grumpy and I want to else this guy he's two he's too okay with losing and we can't have that and I was kind of thinking they were going to have had that direction with Pock that it was going to be Mox you're too gracious to Osprey that there's no room for graciousness in the deathwriters or I can't be part of the deathwriters anymore because you guys are two okay losing and I can't stand for that like I it's still my guess where things were heading I felt that way for months and months and there's been some mixed signals so yeah and I think the the finish to the match with Moxie sort of on his knees basically laughing because he knew that he he'd done his job and he'd turned Osprey into that weapon that he wanted him to be that was a could a bit of key piece in the in the fracturing I think you would have seen Gabe kid and Neville go off together who if they dragged anyone with them I don't know they those two on their own would be an interesting pairing maybe they would have dragged the

1:20:48the the the dogs with them and that would have been the faction that that came out of it and then he would finally separate it those two groups but it was definitely something going on there and yeah the camera lingered on him because because Gabe kid was in Japan wrestled a few hours after that against Jule of Maloney for the global title I just watched that match this morning so yeah there was probably something coming there but I guess we'll never find out well we might find out there might be some reporting on where this was going to go you know but we won't get to see it yeah obviously you know just tiny tiny fraction of importance compared to you know his life but yeah it is it is a undotted eye and on cross D in terms of where you know where this might have been headed yeah meet the Red Bull Dragonberry Emergizer it's one of the many new drinks out now who knew ice cold drinks could be so fire

1:21:58try them all only on my doubles show button here football season is finally back and prize picks is bringing out their best offer yet new users who sign up will get $150 in lineups if you win your first $5 lineup that's right if you win your first $5 lineup you'll get $150 in lineups on prize picks you simply pick two to six players pick more or less on their staff projections and submit your lineup then sweat it out as you watch your picks play out live it's the best way to get more locked in on game day make all the picks you want this football season all in the same app also prize picks is going crazy with the deals to start the football season giving users a new promo every day during stack September and now prize picks is available nationwide so what are you waiting for lock in for kickoff because everyone and everything is on prize picks what you want download the app today and use code blue wire to get one of your $50 lineups if you win your first $5 lineup prize picks run your game

1:23:02meet the red bull dragonberry energizer it's one of the many new drinks out now who knew ice cold drinks could be so fire try them all only on my doubles admitted you love Nick Barbati when he co-hosts with me on the weight color post shows well now you can listen to him every week on the nicky's club a VIP exclusive podcast here's Nick to tell you more hey wrestling fans it's Nick Barbati and I'm back with the nicky's club the place where the family of nicky's comes together for big laughs and shart takes on WWE from WrestleMania rumors to surprise returns I got you covered the nicky's club where the wrestling feels like the coolest club in town Nick Barbati wants to be part of your progressing life every week so why not let him go VIP PW torch comm slash go VIP for full details on signing up we're compatible with patreon spotify apple podcasts and just about any other iOS or android app out there you can also stream directly from our ad free VIP website the nicky's club waiting for you every week at PW torch VIP show button here football season is finally back and prize picks is bringing out their

1:24:06best offer yet new users who sign up will get $150 in lineups if you win your first $5 lineup that's right if you win your first $5 lineup you'll get $150 in lineups on prize picks you simply pick two to six players pick more or less on their staff projections and submit your lineup then sweat it out as you watch your picks play out live it's the best way to get more locked in on game day make all the picks you want this football season all in the same at also prize picks is going crazy with the deals to start the football season giving users a new promo every day during stack september and now prize picks is available nationwide so what are you waiting for lock-in for kickoff because everyone and everything is on prize picks what you want download the app today and use code blue wire to get one of your $50 in lineups if you win your first $5 lineup prize picks run your game kitchen and bathroom professionals know what goes behind the tile matters that's why trade pros trust fiber cement party backer board to keep tile firmly

1:25:12in place resist cracking and held block moisture chosen in over 40 million kitchens and bathrooms party backer board what the best build on shop now at participating home depot lows and floor into core stores for more information visit jameshardy.com slash hardy backer okay uh let's uh throw up some more uh some more chats on the screen here just get a lot of the people have some things that they want to say about this show uh uh uh uh uh uh uh uh uh uh uh uh dorell freeman regular boys on the show says i was well put together show you could feel the heart in the show very well put uh david brine a very tasteful tribute uh atom kid the final video package and the doctors uh the i'm sorry the death writers the dr um the death writer standing around the chair was a perfect ending that's that's another thing i don't think we've talked about that the final scene of the chair that that the death walk by i for the main event that was sitting in the

1:26:14rep the empty chair that represented pock and with a towel over it and then they played the the tribute video to pock which was just magnificent and then they come back and wrestlers in the dark you know kind of partial darkness are standing around in a semi-circular around the chair and the chair has a spotlight on it i mean it just was one thing i thought oh it's just gonna end after the main event and everyone's gonna in the ring to attribute and no we have this video and i'm like oh and then it was just good it was just good and it was a lot but it felt perfect you know let's just let's see more of him and more photos and um the music in him with his with his voice you know like we got to hear from him um more than we did the rest of the show um you know don't you dare forget about the bastard yeah one point you know he said um so that was but and then i'm like okay well that's how it ends and they know they then have the chair with the spotlight i mean just breaks it just they they're just trying to break everybody like emotionally uh oh we didn't get you yet

1:27:18we got more that we want to do it as a tribute to this great guy that we loved um and yeah just like i said i mean it feels weird to say but i do i mean and i don't want maybe i'm overdoing it i just think this tribute show is a work of art i mean i think it was a a work of art with the tools that a w has to work with um the setting um what they could do today earlier today and what they're able to do in production and all the all the footage that they grabbed so yeah uh my good says emotional and well done episode and the best work by Tony shavani in his eight w tenure Tony's great yeah Tony was was great i mean stand it's not he's a stand in that ring in front of a wreath and in a photo and and you know be the void the the veteran voice um but his tenure and his history carries some weight um and he's been in situ you know so many situations on tv and you

1:28:18know you referred to him as ben um he said that he was a wonderful human being and he said what they can learn from him is to be kind nice friendly the things ben was and that's the impression left on him Tony speaking specifically to everybody in a w and he just you know that what a what a pithy and precise and perfect just like pox wrestling style summation of what overrides the the honor stuff and the politics and and the star ratings and the flying moves it for Tony to for everyone to kind of know and Tony to deliver the message it's the kind and nice and friendly thing and um who was it that said was a ricochet some one of them said like every time when pox spoke like it was sort of everybody listened and he knew what needed to be said he didn't say a lot but when he did talk he he said what needed to be said like you got the impression he wasn't withdrawn because nothing was going on upstairs he was withdrawn because he was a good listener

1:29:24he was yeah processing he was observing he was respecting not just being like offering unsolicited advice but he had picked a spots and he's good at reading the room you know I mean that so yeah 20 degree job I think it was 12 that was talking about that it was like he didn't say much but when he did it was only you needed to hear yeah yeah yeah it was that was powerful for show absolutely all right um mark pesquetti says an amazing emotional show not amazing wrestling even though there were some good stuff in it it was amazing to see the wrestlers come together for pox um indeed do you have anything to say about the wrestling matches Chris I mean a bit of a blur there were designed to be feel good matches tonight right I yeah the people who needed to go over go up went over there were they what I call best off matches where you just saw a bunch of people in the ring and let them go through their moments yeah the ricochet Osprey match I was talking to my son about it I said this feels like an evolution of their match that went

1:30:27viral they say what they would do with that match if they have the knowledge that they have you know how many years it is later because they still did some of the acrobatic stuff they still flew around the ring but there was most psychology to it it made more sense it didn't look as choreographed there was there was one particular spot in that match that really stood out to me where Osprey went up to do a top row runner slipped still managed to pull it off convincingly made it look good and Osprey and ricochet still landed on his feet and I just say if that isn't a perfect example of how athletic these two men are there's very few people in the company could have pulled that off ironically pack what have been one of them this was it pox wrestling family was largely an AW to companies been in for many years um but he is a former annexed champion and I think NXT should have done more last night than a graphic on the screen I'm almost glad that they didn't I think

1:31:27you need to let AEW do that tribute shift first because that's where he was working that's where most of his friends are and then if you're going to do one do it Friday I'll do it next Tuesday I think if you if you do a bigger tribute than that it almost takes away the thunder from AEW not that you really want thunder but like it's that place to do it uh Corey Graves did read out a statement tonight on worlds collide after dynamite had started um which was a bit more than they've done up until that point on the wwe so I would like to think that they just they wanted to let AEW be the ones that did the big goodbye and maybe they'll do a little bit more either on Friday or on that next year on Tuesday I just think being a guy who won the NXT title a little more I'm not saying compete with AW don't try to steal the thunder you couldn't do it but I don't know I mean it's I'm not I'm not I'm not like me I'm just it's what I wish and think they out to have done I'm not being critical of what they did because I think there's like you know there's a there's room to to to

1:32:29justify it but my vote would have been let's show more footage let's acknowledge you know 40 minutes into the show or an hour tenness of the show hey the wrestling community lost um you know a wrestler who was who was beloved and traveled the world and uh he was on top here and you know here's here's a few highlights of what he did I don't know just something like that I think he and it would have been my vote anyway yeah uh yeah uh Derek Mitchell I've been watching wrestling since 1982 when someone of the wrestling business dies it takes a piece of you but the last years with Brody Brody Lee Bray Wyatt the butcher in Alpac it's too much it's the first time I saw I the first wrestler I knew who died who was acknowledged in some former fashion I'd heard of and it wasn't because they were of advanced age in long past retirement it was David von Erich that was just shocking to read that in a newsstand wrestling magazine it was probably six weeks after his death when I heard about it um just given the the nature of wrestling media and technology

1:33:29then but um but the first time on TV um I'm trying to think of the order of the Von Erich deaths which is really sad um but I think it would have been Gino Hernandez I don't think there was another announcement of Von Erich death unless I'm I'm doing some I'm positive I'm like did I see Attribute to David von Erich and real-timer did I end up seeing that unlike VHS later but I think the first time I found out about a wrestler dying on TV the first time I found out on TV was Gino Hernandez and it was just shocking um yeah so I think just in it you know the the the it was you know filmers are standing there just going you know sitting there just going we've lost uh someone you know I don't know what his address where I don't want to put words in but the world-class announcer it's just it's part of wrestling you know I mean it's just something you know you there's the 10 bells salute there's standing on the stage there's the graphic on the screen um there's wrestlers you know crying when they are current colleagues and and we're close to them um but AW's had you know an ECW which has happened you know you know a lot too um we went

1:34:36through so many of them I mean I got we all with those of us in those of us in the you know wrestling journalism realm it just it you didn't get numb to it but you were there was a stretch of time where you're just like I almost expect you know you just kind of we're one two seven two thousand yeah yeah I will it I'll never forget like test and uh garrison cade and um or who else died around that time there was a stretch of time where it seemed like every month another guy in the 30s or 40s was dying because of what they've done to their bodies on the road uh and then I remember waking up one morning and of course being in in Newfoundland and an hour and a half ahead of eastern time I was always up before anyone else on the site but that I was writing for at the time when I found out about Miss Al was death which was it practically in the ring yeah and trying to get that news posted and just he he was another one different reason but it was all in that time stretch

1:35:45uh Sean O'Hare was another one that died around that time um yeah wasn't crash holly in there as well I'm pretty sure he yeah it's it's just seem like every time he turned around somebody else was gone too soon and it it's hard man you know when you you watch these people you you get engaged with their personality you buy into it you're you're invested in their careers in a lot of cases and then they're not there anymore yeah and it's been a long time since we've had that it seems like a long time anyway since we've had that happen with an with an active wrestler dying you know yes we lost superstar Billy Graham the other day um but it's not like he was young it would be hard to say he went too soon super char bill andy but they'll done date yeah yeah let's get this to crust all the time um you know when when somebody who is in advanced age like you said when they die it's it's sad but it feels different it feels like oh okay you've had you've had you had a good

1:36:50innings as we say anyway but when somebody who literally was on TV 24 hours before it's just man how do you how do you reconcile that like how do you reconcile being at work with someone 24 hours before I know I mean the the the recency of it he was you know I mean people say it it's natural like he was just here like when you haven't been around somebody for a long time it's just weird the way our our minds and our emotions work but it's like oh it didn't feel as is you know as much a part of of your existence if it had been a long time or they just grew old well you weren't thinking about them or interacting with them the one of the first young wrestler deaths other than june ornand it was a wrestler I saw in the indy scene in the late 1980s worked a lot of the shows at shambalman and jerry lin worked and it was Larry the butcher Cameron I saw him at ropers and fredley george isn't fredley a nightclub there he'd always hit his head on the ceiling because the at a low ceiling and he'd stand on the ropes and I hit my head um and the AWA hired him and he did some some work for them and he died in a match in in bremen germany um back in 1993 and he was

1:37:5441 years old died of a massive heart attack and he was a heavy steroid user um so he was you know he doesn't get talked about a lot as one of the first steroid deaths but um he was you know um by by you know as much as we can ever know you know I mean because it isn't um you know a a gunshot wound at the heart that's how you died with when you have a heart attack at age 41 and your heavy steroid user and there's generally we connect those dots and we feel um safe seeing that contributed even if there's some genetic conditions or other factors that play into it um but that was that was another time and it wasn't you know it wasn't a tribute joke to him but it was somebody who I knew like a shot photos are ringside I got to know him in my very early years as a teenager shooting ringside photos and it was just like that can happen you know like jino rnett is like he wasn't around I didn't meet him you know but larian he was a first wrestler I knew who died um and way too young and surprise in fact I I um I went to uh um

1:38:56a windy uh windy city wrestling show because he worked for Paul Heyman when Paul Heyman was booking witty city wrestling at Chicago and I drove a cargo and Larry Cameron was with me he was one of the drivers and Eddie Sharkey was another one in the car the front of my Brad was in the car and we drove there and I remember driving down Hallstead street and Larry Cameron was driving and the windows were down and I would have been scared to drive down Hallstead street never been to Chicago before but Larry had his arm out the window his bicep was out the window and I was like I'm feeling pretty safe with this guy well you know I don't feel bad at stoplights and stop signs um so yeah as I hadn't forgotten that but I probably should have led with that that like I not only knew him enough I took a seven hour car ride trip with them to an indie show that he was working um booked by Paul Heyman and so yeah when I just you know was we're thinking about you know a wrestler that you knew like for L Alan Koonan right he knew Pock um these wrestlers

1:39:56knew him way better than I knew Larry way better than Alan knows Pock but meeting them and knowing them and it hits more too um and you know wasn't that long after the windy city show that Larry died so um yeah anyway just some random random thoughts there before pushing play on the weight-color pro wrestling post shows check out pwtorch.com and our tv review section and skim through a full rundown of the tv show if you didn't see it that's your way to get an overview of what happened before you dive into our in-depth analysis of the key happenings on the show that's pwtorch.com your home for live tv coverage every Monday Wednesday and Friday with my tv reports and also check out our NXT and impact coverage on Tuesdays and Thursdays our collision reports on Saturday nights and of course our live pay-per-view and PLE coverage on weekends all waiting for you at pwtorch.com. I'm gonna throw up a few other comments and we got Sean Plicta uh on hold also uh Mark Piscetti says tonight show brought me back to my own died. The show must have

1:40:59been so cathartic for everyone I'm sure it was I mean this they had enough time to do the show they did but not so much time that they had to grieve without each other you know like they had they a few days together talk chat text be with their loved ones their own family whatever but to know when's the we get to come together and just cry and share memories and tell funny stories and and like cathartic is certainly I'm a good word for that I thought you know in Saturday with what happened um with Stephen Borden that's what brought back on heart to me the shot of the announcers we're not looking back at the ring but you see the announcers Tony Schwaini was in the role of Jerry Lawler what's going on this does not look good oh man like you're you're vicariously trying to figure out what happened to Borden through Tony Schwaini's body language and facial expressions while he's on camera while ex-caliburant has are trying to fill time and it I took me back to Owen and I remember that pay-per-view get together and I remember people who are over

1:42:02and some were going oh I think it's a storyline I'm like it is not a storyline this is like but you know you're in clonation as a cynical wrestling fan we're in it's cynical because you know for its fun Eric fake to heart attack to try to sell tickets in world class in the mid 80s when ticket sales are going down in prey don fans thinking something that should happen so you know long time fans believe that's possible um but nevertheless like yeah that Saturday during all out it brought it brought those feelings up so then 24 hours later start getting texts about pocket just like God I already kind of went through being kind of those emotions being triggered bring it going back to that time watching the announcers and hoping that it isn't what you feared um so anyway yeah I did the only thing missing was the the Owen moment is forever an edge to my memory with Jim Russ saying this is not a part of tonight's entertainment which really drove hungry it was real and I think that was the only thing missing from the Stephen Borg moment that would have really made

1:43:03the parallel but yeah and by the way shame on double to be in any other promoter whoever recreated that scene in order to create false drama that made us think something was really something bad is really happening and it's one of the reasons I was never fan of Danielson playing that up in his matches in in AWN recent years we had legit issues and he was you know playing it up to drama um I just nights like this or nights like Saturday night and what with what happened with Owen like there's there you should never cash that in to try to um play with fans of motions because fans care too much about the resters I mean they do this this industry brings people together and historically it often is people who are looking for something kind of counter culture that where they don't feel they fit in necessarily with other parts of pop culture I was in an LGBTQ uh uh uh documentary and pro wrestling and and talked about that I can't remember if it made the the documentary or not I don't think it did but I thought it was a really good quote and everybody was watching um it was filmed at my interview there was filmed at starcast um during all the

1:44:08out weekend and uh and I thought people were acting like yes that you you said it really well and I don't think it made the documentary but pro wrestling brings together people who feel a little bit like outsiders are outcasts or they're not included and and it is it's it it is different than I it's there's I think there's other things that are you know the punk rock culture and comic book culture and what there's realms but some things are just they're for the cool kids you know NFL fans it's just so mainstream and MMA it's for you know whatever that is now um it made history so um because of that I think wrestling wrestlers and wrestling promoters have a responsibility to not exploit fans and put them in a position of being suckers and marks by praying on real emotions that they because they feel I think a greater connection at a bond with wrestlers than I think a lot of fans or in the business itself I think they feel a sense of community and ownership more because wrestling fans and wrestling as in as a form of entertainment is look down upon in your

1:45:10sneered at or you're judged um so I'm always sensitive just I think it's it's it's cheap to do that and so as I'm talking about Owen I don't want anyone to recreate what happened to Stephen Borden to try to pray in our feelings um also like just that should be off off the table I think you've had an important nail on the head there and I think it actually relates to pack as well uh people often look at me and government you do so many things you have so many side projects and they don't have anything to do with each other and they're very wrong because they are all the same they all have that community of people who are looking for somewhere they belong because they don't feel like they belong in the mainstream communities yeah for wrestling for less uh it could stand up comedy it's all the same we're looking even magic the gathering it we're looking for a place where we can be different and be ourselves and belong with people who share those interests now the fact that I haven't found another person who overlaps all of them is not anything but you have to remember

1:46:14that humans are inherently a social species and we seek out our own and if we if we find that the groups that we're supposed to belong to don't want us that we don't belong there then we need a different group and it's when you find that you latch on and you can't you become so close to those people and the parasocial bonds are deeper than a sports person because everybody can watch sports but not everybody can get into wrestling not everybody can get into drag or bolesco or any of that but when you when you look into the bonds that are formed and why they form you understand how important this stuff can be to people yeah and you know I was surprised at how hard the butcher's death hit me because he wasn't exactly somebody I paid a lot of attention to when he wrestled but the words that was said about him and how close he was to my age and how he died and I'm just sitting there thinking geez but now with Park who you know is even younger and is somebody I paid attention to

1:47:20it it does come at you from an angle that most people wouldn't expect unless they've had caused to feel it themselves yeah yeah I'll put the application process to get into magic the gathering is really difficult Chris you're not just what you're listening I have a problem that whole bookshelf behind me is full and I sold my collection once to buy this house that's that's wow wow yeah my down payment on this house came in large part from selling my collection and then I got back into the game few years later like I was into this thing yeah yeah no the board game community Kelly Wells knows about that I've got an independent game shop one location not a chain just cross-free for my house and there you know so many nights of the week it's just a bunch of people sitting at tables playing games I don't even know the names of but it is it is that is there that's their people and it is an unmistakable group of people if all

1:48:23you saw were the people and you didn't know you didn't see the table or the games you'd go oh those people are playing games together like you just know and you know there's a there they found their people and it doesn't mean they all look the same you just you can just see they are in there they're in the world where they belong and in that setting it's it's it's it's it's fun to see I mean it's just whatever you know there's people who are going to rock shows there's people who are doing art some people are introverts and they're finding their own way to to exist and and connect with people but not necessarily in big groups all the time socializing everybody has their own their own way but pro wrestling is a communal experience in in good ways passion passion is passion right yeah yeah uh ducky d in the chat says peace chat tough watch but that was very cathartic in its execution long live pop the man and the wrestler um and uh so I do read Derek's comment there oh uh Dan Carroll welcome to the chat says very well done the closing video

1:49:28was eight stars yes I I uh I agree with that uh there you go um ducky d says I also love to have the promos and videos educated educated us on the live pop lift and the impact he made I learned so much tonight um yep indeed and uh let's see uh bob oh c to w i says uh in life you have friends and family and your wrestling family perfect timing I'm thankful for mr. navel pock and mr. bend thank you for everything my condolence this to his family and friends indeed um i'm david brian says mox is promo is a great example of why people should put their all into every second they spend in front of a microphone you never know who'll hear it and how yeah uh definitely yeah that was something um ducky d says pock being a Jamaican dance hall righ ifan might have been the low key surprise of the night

1:50:32l o l yeah i love that he left talking about the hedgehog in his garden that that was that was really cool yeah yeah those those those are the those are the fun anecdotes you know just like these are people and they have their little little little things that they little quirks that you know they're birdwatchers or magic gathering players or whatever you know they they have their thing um yeah just but despite surprise you've done has them plays magic the gathering i'll wait for the shock to subside um so dancehall thing really shocks me not least of which because there are a there's a lot artists in that art form who are quite problematic and some of that music is not at all pleasant but i grew up on it like it i grew up in the carapy and so it was part of my daily life interesting it it blew me away um i do know that he and sammy zane shared a lot of music with each other because sammy being a big scoff and and he is actually probably one of the people who i wish we could have heard from most tonight because those two are pretty close and he would have been somebody i would

1:51:33if i were to nikan i might even have been tempted to reach out to triple h and say hey can we get a statement from sammy for this yeah there the pocket all generic images um yeah oh that's a different guide though who was who was that like it yeah something right now guy um i would be very curious to know if there was an approach made um to see if anybody from wwe wanted to say anything um i think you'd be hard pressed to justify saying no for it even if it was on social media not on tv maybe they could have done something but yeah sammy uh kevin ohens would be another one um a few people but sammy i know what they were particularly close i'll see maybe friday yeah yeah uh in the chat can play stuff says i came away from the show feeling like i didn't respect pop enough that's how i felt the last few days like just text from people to know him um and it wasn't like there wasn't respect there but it's like man uh zack barbers is my heart breaks first parents having a

1:52:35berry they're only child boy that was early in the show they mentioned that one and only son and and the mess and renae peccat haven't mentioned i mean i mean when i say there's like so many things mentioned that were just wonderful about the show renae at ringside reading the statement collectively written by mom dad and wife um and just how touching that was and for her to get through it you know because ex-caliber just haven't trouble at the top of the show he's had to do a lot lately and then his voice cracking early in the opening match with mox and orange and toni going it's okay you know it's okay we're all feeling it um but renae having to read that statement and the statement just amazing um to have that on the show and include it was part of what made it you know magnificent uh duckie this as i'd love to your tk get a chance to speak about his relationship with pock in time indeed yeah yeah the the story about from the family speaking of which you know where they's they said in the the family statement that you know when pock met toni con they hit it

1:53:38off and it changed his life in his career it'd be nice to hear hear more there uh toni con is on the stage with the wrestlers by the way at the for the ten bell salute uh syphique says they always say the best wrestling characters are people who are themselves with the volume turn to eleven and pock seems to be the exception of that because in reality he was the opposite of a bastard there's the old thing though that the heels are the nicest guys and the baby faces are the jerk so it's always that the story in the eighties um when fans started you know doing the fan club bulletins in the late seventies early eighties and then the legit journalism style newsletters came out the bulletins with with actual news reporting not playing along to wrestling being real the torch one of the you know one of the not the first one but one of the early first ones um it was always like okay now we're gonna uncover all these all these things about the rest of it was a super cool time I mean there's just there's I know there's newer fans watching and listening and you know I think more will end up being written might be me might be somebody else about that era um the rise of the newsletters in the pre-internet era and that sense of community that was there and how it manifested and the

1:54:42politics the you know the the the wars between newsletter editors and writers jumping to one newsletter to the other and um you know marketing that was done by one newsletter copied by another I won't say what side of that I was on but I was on the right side um no no it's fine no it was flattering um um but I bring that up not because it's actual beef but like that's the kind of thing that was going you know like it was just all that kind of stuff was going on you think flame wars and trolls it was like there were like full-page editorials with tons of passive aggressiveness aimed at it's very small audience of a writer who's very mad at another writer and another newsletter it's a fascinating time and one of the things that would happen is we'd all compare notes like what do you hear and what if you found out are you getting you know into the locker room you be friending a wrestler and then you had a whole generation of wrestlers who grew up reading the sheets and they felt connected to it or I can play the sheets I can work the sheets to get publicity to get ahead and it started off with you know the Eddie Gilberts of the world Jim Cornett Paul Heyman were like

1:55:45the next generation of mines who who were like we're gonna brace this and then he had old commasions like Bill Watts who utilized my newsletter to try to lobby for a job in WSWP it it became such a thing and one of the things during all that era and we're just everyone's trying to figure out how do we deal with real journalism and wrestling what it wasn't just that wrestling was matches are pretty terminated we were writing about it it was we were writing about who were really nice guys and who weren't and the baby face is so often where the jerks and the heels were the where the artists who were really creative and they didn't have the ego that needed the cheers they just wanted the art of being a heel to get heel heat and so this goes back to the suffix comment which is Pock is kind of old school in that way you know he played a heel some of the time but it wasn't who he was and there was no trying to hide that on the show you know there's a full ignoly of it and so yeah to suffix brings up some memories of that that notion

1:56:47that yeah the good guys were the jerks and the heels were we're always a good guys and this plays into it i some of the wrestlers i've met really portray that like one of the nicest guys i ever had to sat down with and chatted with was dealer bram and he was a heel at the time i met him bison smith in ring of honor sadly passed away now it was a big dude did some time in in japan also absolute sweetheart had nothing but praise for basically everybody i asked him about never but he never worked with but played an absolute monster heel in the ring and then i get to sit down with austinaries and who boy let's just say that one was not as fun um it does it does kind of play out you know um yeah it's it's good to see that some people like like Pock still have that this is how wrestling is supposed to be the person you see on tv is not who i am but you're never actually gonna see who i am unless you're part of the family i love it i love it

1:57:48on twos day nights the conversation doesn't stop when nxt ends it's just getting started i'm Nate Lindbergh and alongside my co-host kelly wells we bring you pwttocks nxt we go live on the pw torched youtube channel about 15 minutes after the show to break down matches storylines and surprises and we take your questions and comments from live chat miss us live but you still want me part of the show send your thoughts to pw torched nxt gmail dot com and catch the replay on youtube or on the pw torched daily cast feed just search pw torched on apple podcast spotify or wherever you listen and of course you can always stream the latest shows at pw torched dot com um yeah and he was guarded you know i talked about that earlier so we can road in the cover story before they even talked about it tonight that that Pock was a guy who was distant from strangers distant until you he he felt safe and he felt like he was with people who just who he could trust to see who he really was and then he would loosen up and be fun you know i mean that is old school i mean to you know not everybody has that personality to people have different

1:58:51ways of dealing with it but yeah he was guarded in a way that was much more common in the 1980s i would encourage people to seek out there's a no there's a youtube primarily wrestling news site well create a content site that i follow because they're all from England and one of the guys new pack personally from new castle knew him very well and you did a like a 15 minute tribute to him from the point of view of a person who is in wrestling content creation and was his friend and i highly recommend people seek that out um it's moving his heck good good glad you mentioned that uh duckie he says it was a w's first sanctioned feud pocket against hangman pocket was truly day one david brine says the commentators were fantastic tonight yeah yeah uh duckie he says mox bromo's terrifyingly prophetic i rewatched the all out maturelier today and marineist facial expressions and mannerisms after the match were

1:59:54eerie as well interesting maybe elaborate on um david brine says wrestlers are artists a lot of people forget that but they are in totally it's part of what i tell people they don't really understand as an adult like any wash that they just think it's something you know fake fighting for kids over the top cartoon characters like uh you're not you don't understand but i you know i get it but i'll kind of try to help you understand um all right um let's see uh surgio kruz six one six one says that mox br- welcome to the chat this mox bromo is beautiful and eerie it's like he was eulichizing pocket but pocket was standing right there and then the camera lingering on pocket after the promo was over it was intense stuff yes um duckie he says i have such huge respect for mox as the ace and the leader of that a w lock just a little poe handles every aspect of his job yes um uh yes zack barbers says i really don't understand or i don't know how rene got through that

2:00:58reading that statement from pox family no show us didn't yeah i know yeah uh david says rene david brants says rene seems like such a class act yeah indeed uh during michael says eight w's on such a good job honoring brody lee and he volumes and i'll pop and hope we don't see another tribute show for a very long time yeah second that how about we get a retirement tribute show for someone who's still alive and can actually watch it i can handle that yeah yeah yeah i thought tonight was ricochet's best night in a w um yeah and uh bob omens says not gonna lie probably the best ricochet match i've ever seen and Derek Mitchell says uh he was a cornerstone of nxt black and gold but not gonna say don't he drop the ball with him not everyone even as great as great in entering talent is going to be a star and don't be at all worked out and he starred in a w still wish he'd starred more you know i mean it just i i feel like just didn't fully get what what what he could have been i talked about that earlier this week

2:02:04another podcast that there was more that could have been done with him along the way um sirgeo says i wish toe to be did a little more i'm with you pocket a lot of friends there would have been nice to let them pay tribute pocketing the red arrow on set almost winning the titles of my favorite pocket moments ever good yeah um i one of my favorites is still the silly one um where he wrestled gravity and gravity stood in the middle of the ring in the other and remember me and poxley yeah because he was always belled as the man gravity forgot that's that's hilarious that's great yep i was so glad that they did that um i do want to before i forget i want to give props to wardlo um it was kind of weird that they brought him back but they did advertise him they on all out they said he would be returning to dynamite tonight and i guess they wanted to to keep that promise but i thought wardlo told the line perfectly by smiling acknowledging the

2:03:04cheers for him when he was announced they used the camera angles brilliantly so you couldn't see who he was standing behind i think it was um uh jake doil and then when they announced him and the crowd erupted and he sort of walked forward he didn't like go nuts and hold his arms up and really celebrate with the crowd he just gave us sort of a little right smile and acknowledged it got in the ring and did what he had to do and wrestled like wardlo wrestles which he could easily have tried to oversell that and inadvertently made it about himself and i'm really glad he he told that line and kept it down plated a bit but still acknowledge it yeah i'm back thank you this isn't about me tonight yeah good good point good point by the way Rudog says uh rabble got the tribute while she was still alive yes yeah so that's good um

2:04:05i'm just trying to pick up a few more chat comments before i go to uh shan but i think we got just about everything that i had seen that i wanted to put up so yeah thanks shat for for for this so Derek Mitchell bring up the Von Erickson in the mid 80s i remember watching those david van erick memorial shows and carry van erick beating work flare at the end of the end of the eight world title that was david van that a titled david van erick was supposed to win Rudog notes statistically pock was in annexed out of e for five years total three in annexed two in doubt ab in a w pack was there for seven years yeah um um yeah i just i ducky d says uh dody streaming that show tonight was tasteless and greedy i don't care that moving days or times would have earned a lot of respect for me um yeah uh um sir geo just says yeah i wish dody be in general did a little more oh i think i already got that okay so let's uh let's bring uh shan into the conversation here um

2:05:05um shan welcome uh good to talk to you again how's it going no it's going well um i can you hear Chris oh yeah oh you've been able to hear Chris that's a reference for Rudog who couldn't no no no no no you were you not around for Rudog's call i was not no because i uh then you're fine then the joke you won't get the joke because Rudog couldn't hear him so i was like well can you hear him it would be funny if you well no it was it was sad i i got i was in line i i got home and i was watching and then i got behind for other reasons and i and then i won't even tell you why i did the other thing but that's a whole other story um so i'm here i wanted to you know get the chance to talk about the show a little bit uh Chris first of all i want to say i always enjoy when you called inweight shows before like you know obviously you know we've been close we've talked many times since then but i'm honestly just thankful you're doing okay better and i'm you know i've been praying for me man and i hope you continue to you know just get the positive vibes because you are a good you

2:06:07are a good person that cares about people and so i you know i'm just glad you're back on here talking about what you love to talk about so yeah so um i would i did talk to Jason on his show and i did say the same thing going into the i was really yes double to be can do something on friday if they wanted to quote unquote but Monday they had a chance and yes they did the graphic and that's fine man they should have done more i was disappointed i thought they should you know they didn't have to do what a w did tonight and i knew they weren't gonna do it a w did tonight i knew they wouldn't but come on man he was a very vital part of what you were doing he was on WrestleMania he was the Cruiserweight champion he had a he wrestled a KO and samy like you said he he had a lot of those matches i think people could have talked about him a little bit and there didn't have to be super super long but talk about what i thought you know i thought Monday they were just gonna save it for next heat like that's where you know he he had up you know kind of a more of a peak main event push

2:07:08like okay i can deal with that but i don't i don't want to get in doubt abushing i mean i get you because their heart might have been in the right place even if he disagreed with the decision which is that he was an eight big guy all these years he was a bigger deal there than here he has so many friends there let's just and let's just let a w do this and you know that's what Chris has posited and so i don't want to be critical i'm just saying i would have voted for them doing more and i think you were too shod but i'm not gonna be critical of them for not doing it but i would like to see them do more friday i don't think it would be too little too late i think it would just be like hey eight of you got their turn now now i'll be critical of them for running worlds can i tonight though yeah okay yeah right yeah they could have even if they had delayed the debut until dynamite went off the air you could have kept it on the same night and just put it on after dynamite it's not a live show there was no reason to start it when they did yep that i will the matter that i will tell you what i was doing before yeah yeah but everything else like

2:08:09i'll see what they do friday before i get on the case yeah yeah you know that last segment you're just listening to and the next one that you're waiting to listen to those can be one second apart with a vip membership you can unlock our commercial free versions of our shows pwtorch.com slash govip tells you how to do it that's pwtorch.com slash govip options exist within the apple podcast app using your apple account through patreon which by the way you can sync up with spotify or just about any ios or android app with a full vip membership you can customize the feed for individual shows and clusters of shows and themes go to pwtorch.com slash govip for full details on all the options to listen commercial free and with upper tier options unlock our vip exclusive podcast that run throughout the week every week um so now so when i was watching the show i watched all out late a day late so i had just watched his match actually like right before that it came out you know like i had a bleacher report you know that thing that came out and so

2:09:15it was really even surreal for me because i think i just seen it like maybe 15 minutes before that came out and so it really just hit me like oh my gosh like and then he came out at the end of the show and i was like oh my gosh like it was so surreal to me and then wow i was uh and i was actually talking to Jason different people about it and then so when i saw the show tonight it was like i was so it was very obviously very touching i mean everything about what they did was so even though we don't want to see these shows and like you said i hope we never do for a quiet quite a while but they did a just a really good job the the only thing you know again you can nitpick which i'm always a little worried with a w sometimes with not even how they do the tributes it's just like with some of the the characters just some of the heel-faced dynamic but i'm trying to be i'm being cool tonight because again it was a different circumstance yeah we have a tendency not to talk about that but yeah yeah and i'm worried

2:10:16next week i'm just worried next week what they do with some of that because of those issues and i pray they they can figure those things out but everything with with mox was just so cool um everything let me let me push on on that issue Chris just does is tonight canon that a w is responsible for or is this an exception that they can we give them a mulligan for the minimal pivot back to the way things were or or like can if we're gonna say just shows up next week aha and just does is does this bid is all cocky it's like i mean i just this is kind of like the whole pandemic covid era i was just like these pre-recorded matches that are phony and overproduced and like i would be critical of them under normal circumstances but they're just trying to fill dv time without an audience getting creative i said they get creative license for this and there's a reason though to it doesn't air highlights of that stuff it's it's it's it kind of it was in its own category and i think something like tonight it might give you an idea or an inspiration to

2:11:18do something else it might create fans going i've never booted on moxley again i mean they might have a problem with that right but in terms of uh integrity to the storytelling my argument is i i will give them a mulligan and give them flexibility on it but i'm okay with them looking at tonight and going maybe there's someone we want to cast differently going forward because we saw side of them and fans won't be able to forget it so Chris were were you on this that's kind of where i'm at i think they can if they want to use some of it as canon go for it but my default assumption is none of that actually happened this was almost like a very special episode or one of those time travel episodes you used to see on sitcoms where none of it actually happened right um if they want to talk about uh osprey beating ricocheted on eliminated match sure you can do that if they want to talk about danielson returning to the ring but not really say anymore but then that you can probably do that too but they don't have to and it this was not a night for story this was a night for everything in the ring was designed to make you feel good

2:12:19that faces one all the matches tonight and you know everybody got to do their signature spots everything was about being spectacular paying tribute to a guy i'm putting on a show that made people realize how special he was but still go home feeling good and i i if any of it gets mentioned next week it'll be minor and i'd be surprised if it matters going forward i want to be clear danielson came out of retirement tonight they can't take that away they can't like a a year from back on first time in years right like no it um this happened like i'm owning that i just think storyline why i've shan like uh king of the north pw says i see zero reason why they can't why i can't just talk this up as a one-night only thing so i think they have to own something like danielson came back and wrestled warlow returned they're not going to next week warlow can't come out and they go where's he then like so this is canon in that sense but you know i danielson is not if he's on color commentary he's not going to ignore what happened with moxley tonight but i don't think it has to be a major turning point in moxley's character

2:13:23because i don't know that it necessarily even is it's just more of who he was i mean this is this was felt not this is obviously in the realm of a work shan but this wasn't that disconnected from what moxley did sunday at the end of the match with with osprey and the post match promo that was recorded with you know obviously no knowledge about staff this just what happened tonight with danielson felt like a natural continuation of that yeah and so and that's what threw me off you know initially when and of course when mox's promo hit you know again like you said it was before that that happened so when i'm watching the match of all out i'm seeing mox try to do everything to cheat to win and then all of a sudden he you know he just loves moxley or sorry he loves him so he loves osprey at the end it's like okay that's just kind of weird you know but tonight everything they did was fine like he said again tonight was fine because of everything that happened with pack i mean that that's fine i'm not being critical of that i'm just worried about them going future forward because it's just weird when you're seeing gave kid like do you know you know again for a good

2:14:26reason tonight but then next week he or the two weeks later he's going to be back to being a heal crazy heal that's just if i'm fine with i'm not worried but yeah i'm fine i just think people get it i mean i it almost feel it's it i mean not that i'm a fan of don't be unreal but it's it's sort of like this yes it was opening closing credits on a dynamite episode it wasn't a documentary but it's sort of also just what it just felt like a special it was a blend of it i understand it's there's a bit of a conundrum in terms of what to what to own and what to discard or not address but it's not a big deal what what i'll shine and just talking about when everybody was talking about their own specific instances and that's what i like when they go back to everybody you know at least definitely osprey which i loved and hang man just being as emotional as he was talking about the very beginning and what he meant to me it was just cool seeing everybody's unique perspective of what he meant to them because i didn't see him before he was never and so but then i got to watch and i kind of thought all the same things you guys have as far as how crispy was in the ring

2:15:29like every match he did was so like they told a good story behind them and there was there was a the professionalism and the just everything about him i really really liked everything about his character and what he portrayed and what he was trying to get across and so yeah it's just it's crazy that but i'm i'm glad they did distribute it was so well done all the way around and that's a really all i want because i think it's really talk about it with a lot of people so i'm glad i got to least get on here and kind of share some of that because i i have no issue with this show tonight is a whole i i i loved every bit of it i mean it was great i mean i i um they because i was it was crazy because it is good as they did with the rebel show and they did such a great job at the rebel show obviously now you know like said she hasn't passed on i pray it's a lot while before she does but with packets like it was so sudden but they were able to get the show together get everything that they could to honor him and it's about as well done as you could and

2:16:31i i'm thankful that we as wrestling fans get to talk with each other and share all these these memories and all this history and all this um and it was a great osprey ricochet match too it was really you know it brought us some of that old match that had um brought some of that even though you know you could say some osprey stuff you know just the it's my wish you know sell stuff but the big again it was fun in this match because again it was just they were honoring him and they're honoring what they've done before and it was all it was all good i really enjoyed it and um it's uh it's it's it's good but i'm interested with what you know what the show does next week how they pivot and um it's uh it's always hard to pivot you know you have to and uh band and Tony thank you and this was really good tonight you know as bad as he's been on other shows and tonight he was just fine he was just enjoying what they were doing and it was good i i was just very catholic and it was just it was good so great thanks Sean yeah i'll get in the chat and listen to the rest of the show sounds good few uh comments along these on through ducks as even though it's

2:17:36a touching moment with danielson and mongi hugging i think pop would have been happier if danielson would have kicked mox in the effin head um i don't know i i mean i i get it i i get it but i mean the the in the i think pop would have his character would have been rooting for moxie to do it danielson but because he didn't then pop would have been like yeah danielson you do it to moxie i guess the zack barbarus says i do think the death threat is their total baby faces for good now but we are good at still in the group uh he's the chief baby face listen tada's on my side with we are you i've heard him say yes uh duckie says i also think ricochaine us have been showing some begrudging respect for each other for a while now um uh hm made his peace with the elite dRT did in their match despite the cheers it was okay uh king of the north is i don't think osprey's just gonna continue hitting black arrows in his title matches going forward it's a time capsule to me uh but zack barbarus says i'd be okay with him pulling out the black arrow from time to time

2:18:38i would i would too i mean that's a just very personal choice i don't and put a lot of thought into it but um i mean if we stoke up people doing the three amigos leprite center i don't think pulling out a black arrow from time to time is a problem especially because there might be six people in the rest thing who can actually do it so yeah i think i think it has a place still anything else you want to bring up chris i we weren't i'm not in the mood to analyze the show there's not the mood to analyze spot faster you know ring psychology or breaking up pins like yeah just that's not this is i mean but i thought obviously some marina shafel look pretty good um i really like that jaw break and move she did that look brutal um but for the most part apart from that maybe i thought we're gonna get earlier dragon off which i've already mentioned yeah this was this was a show designed to make you feel good yeah bread was looking like she needed or acting like she's gonna need dental work after after she knew someone yeah exactly i don't think that just make good dental patients um they always say doctors are the worst patients but yeah um

2:19:43who knows all right thanks chris appreciate it yeah absolutely anytime appreciate being here for this yep thank you already in the chat wonderful contributions and so many different ways so thank you for that um yeah go VIP with love to have you as a VIP member pw torch vipnfo.com and be on the lookout for the allen forl uh tribute show two poctator and novel to Ben we'll have that up on uh the blue red or daily cast feed in the next few days one and where the other uh or free pot or our apple podcast free sample feed and we'll we'll draw attention to it on the other shows so that um cool thanks um what a night great job uh uh AW and uh feel like privileged that everyone who poc as well as they did as well as they did were willing to share with us the viewers their love for him and help us get to know him better um

2:20:44i think this was you know we praised the show but it almost felt like a privilege to see them share with us um you know it's cathartic for them but um yeah and where's it and he was a word but i felt like it was kind of a privilege for us to share in in their grief and in their celebration, i think Your time is valuable. Go VIP and listen to our show's commercial free. A nice streamlined listening experience. PWTorch.com slash Go VIP for full details on a commercial free listening experience.

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2:22:52Pull yourself away from the vacuous social media experience that I know many of you regret once you get lost in it for minutes, if not hours at a time and settle in for high quality PWTorch brand at wrestling coverage. In minute, you love Nick Barbati when he co-hosts with me on the Weight Color post shows. Well now you can listen to him every week on the Niki's Club, a VIP exclusive podcast here's Nick to tell you more. Hey wrestling fans, it's Nick Barbati and I'm back with the Niki's Club. The place where the family of Niki's comes together for big laughs and shart takes on WWE. For WrestleMania rumors to surprise returns, I got you covered. The Niki's Club, where the wrestling feels like the coolest club in town.