TV has us falling in love by Canadian lakes

0:00Uncover from CBC podcasts is your source for exceptional storytelling and groundbreaking journalism. Here how lives were altered forever by results from one DNA lab. I'm like, what do you mean he's not my son? And unravel the clues that a gravel pit may hold about one woman's disappearance. It's just odd because there was no trace of a scuffle, there was no nothing. After the very best in award-winning true crime, listen to Uncover wherever you get your podcasts. This is a CBC podcast. Okay, look, if you went to a cottage this summer, did you notice that things were a little busier than usual? That may be because of a new genre of Canadian television that includes heated rivalry and sterling point and every year after. Today on the podcast, how Canadian cottage country got a sexy makeover on television. I'm El Amine Abdelmahmoud and this is commotion Catherine Venne-Arendonk is here.

1:03I'm Neil Niazis here. Sadah Fosities here. Hello to all of you. Hello. Hello. Catherine, I'm going to start with you, pal, because you have coined this genre, right? And the genre that you have coined is sexy feelings by a Canadian lake. That's a wonderful thing to coin. Thank you for doing that. I should also note you're the sole American on this panel. What makes this genre so distinct and appealing, particularly, maybe, to Americans right now? Yeah, I think there's a couple of things about it. One is that it is familiar, sexy feelings by a vacation spot or some kind of exotic location is certainly nothing new in fiction, in books and in television. But it is, I think, distinctive and interesting to see so many of these shows start to focus specifically on Canadian cottages and Canadian lakes. And there's, I think, two major points of appeal for an American audience. One is political.

2:04There is an escapism element to the idea that it is just a lake that has no political associations for, like, if you say it's a Montana lake that has feelings, if you say it's a Jersey lake that has feelings, if you say it's Miss Cokka, we're like, all right. That's a beautiful lake. That sounds great. So I think that is part of it. And also, of course, there are a lot of Americans who feel quite frustrated and think of Canada as like a land of sanity. And so there is an element of fantasy and escapism to the land of sanity elements of that. The other thing, of course, is the idea of not having self-service. And there are parts of America that also don't have self-service. But the idea of these places is that they are remote both physically and digitally. And politically, yes, of course. Absolutely. And so that you could go to these sort of dark, cozy, not brightly lit.

3:06There's no palm trees. There's no burning sun. No. Colors are not that vibrant. It's just moody and cozy and flannel and wood-paneled and fantasy-escape. I mean, I have to tell you, there's, in addition to all those things, the word sexy is very crucial here. But there seems to be a lot of American interest in Canadian lakes this year. How are you feeling about this? Because I feel like we are hearing a lot about Americans talking about our lakes, pal. I mean, I think, well, avoiding the topic of lake, you know what? You could speak its name, you know? I don't even know what to call it anymore. No, kidding. Of course, it's like Ontario forever. But I think what Catherine saying makes a lot of sense. I, of course, as Canadians, for us, all of this stuff is very political. It's actually very charged. It's very emotional.

4:08And we can get into that in a moment. But I think also, you guys are probably just running out of places to conquer at this point, right? The Amalfi coast. There's too many tourists there now. You know, the south of France, all of it has been so Americanized now that we're searching and digging deeper and deeper for a new place for Americans to discover, quote unquote, and take over. So, yeah, it actually feels very political on this side. I sure. And she had setting up that polarity immediately, right? Like the idea of like, if I'm an American perspective, these lakes are like, well, this feels relatively apolitical. And I don't have to sort of have any feelings about a Montana lake because it's happening over there. And then here, the sort of a class conversations that arise from saying, hey, you're going to one of the lakes in the muskokas. Yeah. It's like those are gigantic implications. And we'll get to those in just a moment. But we should probably, you know, just out of paying our respects. Play the scene that maybe started it all.

5:10This is a moment from Heated Ravily. What the f*** was that? A loon? A what? A loon. This is a bird. Sounds like a f***ing wolf. It's a bird. Trust me. You're so scared. What kind of a bird to make some noise like that? A loon. So, let's talk about that. The impact of Heated Ravily on Canadian cottage country. What was the impact? I mean, you know, on this show, we are waiting forever for these two to really fall into their desires to really feel like they can have this love without any pressure. That single line that I think everybody knows now, even if you haven't watched the show, I'm coming to the cottage. What the f***? I'm coming to the cottage. I think it illustrates what's so special about a cottage summer, right? Especially in a rom-com, but just generally. So, it's feeling of hitting life on pause, right? Over a while, this cozy fantasy can play out in all the ways you want it to, because it's like there's nobody else around. It is like a liminal world, dare I say, if I talk rom-com language, you know, romance

6:14can come to life. There's no special rules. You're not at home, so you don't have the usual routine. You're not at work, maybe school. You don't have that. There's no time to waste, too, because there's usually a deadline, you know, you're on summer vacay, Labor Day is coming. That just heightens those feelings even more. I also, you know, it's interesting because that property, too, in heated rivalry, I know it was an Airbnb, and the owner said it's just constantly inundated with fans. It's been booked for like years now at this point, yeah. Whatever. So, like, if you want to sleep in the same bed as Ilya and shame, you can't, if that's what you want. Katherine, let's just talk about that episode from a moment, that cottage episode. How do people talk about the cottage episode of heated rivalry? It is, I mean, exactly as Sadat has been saying, it is this culmination of this burning emotional revelation for them. They have been physical together through the whole show.

7:15That is one of the hallmarks of heated rivalry and the distinguishing elements of it from other TV romances, in particular, have been incredibly physical. But the idea that they have not gotten to a real emotional core is been withheld. And so, finally, they get to the cottage. They are there together in this extremely intimate, but also remote. And I think, yes, separate place from their real lives. And they can shed all of the things that have been keeping them apart from each other. They're busy, busy, hockey lives put away for a while. And they can just be together in this beautiful place. And they go swimming and they're sitting on the dock and they're listening to the loons. And all of this then becomes the setting for them to be their truest, most honest, authentic selves. I think there's a useful context here, which is this idea of cottage. I grew up in Southeast Ontario, so to me, that has a very specific meaning. If you grew up in BC, you would probably call it a cabin.

8:17If you grew up in Northern Ontario, you might call it a camp. But this idea of cottage is actually a very class idea. And back in February, the BBC reported that cottage bookings in Mascocca were up by 110%. The New York Times sent a travel writer to explore Canada's cottage country. That's the thing that happened. I mean, like, going to the cottage, this phrase, people sometimes phrase it as a Canadian pastime, but it's a thing they're rich people do. You told the story on social media, the recently that went viral. Do you want to talk about what that story is? Yeah, so I have three kids, but my middle child is six and she, the other day at dinner, she was like, what is a cottage? What is a cottage like? Like, can we go to a cottage? And I knew she was asking that because all the kids in her class for the last like two years have been like, we're going to the cottage this week. We were just at the cottage. We've been at the cottage. And I was just like, how, how has this happened that my six-year-old child is now the victim

9:22of like cottage shaming? And she feels some type of way about the fact that we have not been to the cottage or that we don't have a cottage. And so you can see that it is clearly a very heated subject. I told that story on Instagram and I said, just stop talking about your damn cottage. It's okay. I can't be grudged anyone having a second home, which is what it is. I grew up in BC. Yes, you call it a cabin, but no one goes to the cabin because we just go outside. It's very easy to go outside and experience nature in British Columbia. You can do it in like in 40 minutes, you can be at hundreds of pristine lakes. But really, in Ontario, it is such a thing that is class coded. It's for rich people, especially if it's something that you is in your family and is in heritid. Like that is generational wealth. People always want to downplay it. Like, oh, it's nothing. It's nothing. It's just like a little tiny place in the woods.

10:24Sleeps 20. Was that rampas? Exactly. And then you get there and you're like, what the hell? And so especially Labor Day weekend, right? The city is empty. And it's just us riffraff walking around the streets going, where is everybody? Oh, they're at their damn cottages. So yeah, and listen, I had so, first of all, it went totally viral. That video of me just complaining about the cottage. 30,000 views. And I'm not, you know, not an influencer. But half of them were people going, yes, I have 100% agree with you enough about the cottage. Half of them were people who followed me just so they could leave comments because only my followers can leave comments. Followed me just a comment, I love my cottage. I'll never stop talking about it. Give me a desperate about the fact that they love their cottage so much and they refuse to even be quiet about it for one second. So that the cottage, especially in Ontario, is such a symbol of wealth and inequality.

11:29And it's a big deal. It would understand we'd be a little bit less viral. Had the phrase been, you know, sexy feelings by a Canadian generational wealth, you know, coded second home. But let me tell you, Catherine's piece came out the day after I made that video. So that was like, I shared it, Catherine. I'm not sure if you thought we followed to the right. I was just like, give me an F in the brain. Not you to cast. Catherine's like, I'm innocent. Leave me out of this. Okay. I just say, okay, there's also there's another Canadian show that reflects the class conversation. Maybe a little bit more. It was written and directed by Megan Park. It's called Sterling Point. I just want to play you guys a scene real quick. Why do I have to be bucket chopping? No, no, no. Baby, this is a front of house face. You've got me in trouble at every event we work at because you get all the married woman to make up with you and my mom so we can't have that anymore. I never initiate. Okay, occasionally I initiate. So, so how does this show touch on like the real life tensions around class and tourism

12:32in Miss Cocoa? Well, it's interesting. So I'm with you guys because I'm a child of immigrants. My family never could have had something like a cottage. You know, it's still such a foreign concept to me. So when I heard about Sterling Point and that it's all about this New York family and particularly these New York brothers and sisters, they inherit this island in Miss Cocoa. I was like, there's no way. I'm not touching that. And then I had every friend tell me no, no, give it a shot. And so one thing I appreciate about it that feels a little bit different is it does acknowledge that difference. Yeah. A bit, you know, because so much of the crux of who this character is, this lead character Annie is discovering herself around all of these people. She maybe never would have integrated with otherwise. She comes from this very ultra wealthy elite family. We get to see what those people are like compared against, you know, the more modest, middle working class families who live in Miss Cocoa year round who work in all of these places that keep the city running. And then you've also got, you know, the rich people who've got their like luxury waterfront

13:32mansions. They've got their boats. So we get to see that comparison a little bit. And I think it's good to see, you know, the challenge that she's facing as somebody who is trying to discover herself and then is also challenged by the idea of maybe not being the upper class New Yorker who's, you know, above everybody in a certain way that there's more to it and there's a spectrum on in this place. It's nice that they touch on it. They refer to it as kind of two Miss Cocoa's. So I liked that. I appreciate it. It's, it is entirely like not usually covered dimension of clotters country, which is like there are a lot of jobs that go into streamlining, you know, how easy life might be if you own a cottage and you're very wealthy and you live in this particular part, or you live, you spend your summers in this particular part of the country. Catherine, I want to also spend a moment talking about the sexy parts, like the sexy feelings of Sterling Point because it is also a romance. How does it stand out for you as a romance? Yeah, it is, I think from my perspective, it is a very effective teen high school end

14:35of high school early college soap romance. It's soap first and foremost because it does have the structure with multiple teenagers and also their parents. So it's very much like its EPs, Josh Schwartz and Stephanie Savage's previous shows, the O.C. and Gossip Girl in that respect. And that structure is there. But I think the lead, Ella Rubin is really, really strong as a romantic heroine and the two teen boys who they have playing her, like which one of they love triangle interests are also really good. There's a, there's a lovely scene where they're sitting on the floor of a, of a closet and he like pulls slides her across the floor toward him and they have a very romantic kiss. And so she gets to have all of that romance, but it is in the same way that he had rivalry is, it is laid in with this idea that the place is what gives this hero an access to those feelings.

15:36Because you are in this more real, more authentic location that is apart from the rest of the world, you can discover these things about yourself and you can explore what you really want in a way that you could not if she was still in Manhattan. I'm not entirely sure what I have done to make my algorithm do this, but I have seen that scene of her being slid across the floor. I think you know what you've done. Exactly. I'm being so pervert. Exactly. I, fine. I did it to myself. I was deliberate and I will, I'm sorry for trying to hide from the thing that I did intentionally. And Emil, we should probably say, like I don't, like Muscoca didn't need the PR help. You know what I mean? Like when we sort of think about shows that are set in Muscoca, like this specific region tends to get most of the attention when we talk with this idea of Canadian cottage country. Why is that? Well, first of all, it is the, like, sexiest part of cottage country. It's where the wealthiest people have their cottages. If you don't know about it, it's essentially like this, like, sort of closed circuit of lakes.

16:40And there are some lakes that are much fancier than others. It already has this, like, built in lore, the way that the Hamptons does, right? You can be part of the upper echelon or you can be part of the middle echelon, but to even get access to this area, you already have to be X amount of rich. And so I think it makes sense that people are drawn to the Muscocas because they just, you know, I can't even believe I'm saying this. Like Lisa Rina and her family, if you watch the housewives, they have a cottage up there. Linda Vanjelista famously had a good share there. Martin Schwartz in the Crawford, yeah. Martin Schwartz, like, any, you could just name any famous person who has any sort of, like, connection to Canada and they probably have a cottage up there. And cottage, like we should just say, it is a mansion on a lake, private lake. And so it lives in the minds of Ontarians, but I think all of all Canadians because of

17:42just who lives there and what it means to live there. Uncover is your source for the best in award-winning true crime. I'm Sam Mullins. And from unraveling the mysterious new AI technology putting so-called criminals behind bars in my series The Expert Witness to the story of a mysterious con man and a diaper bag stuffed with gold bars in sea of lies, find over 30 groundbreaking investigations into cults, conspiracies, and scams. Search for uncover wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Elimine Abdul-Mahmoud and this is commotion. We are talking about the politics of cottage country and the way that it is showing up in pop culture and television shows. There's just one more thing to talk about. One more show to talk about and that is, of course, every year after on Prime, it is based on Carly Fortune's best selling novels. The show is about a woman who returns to Barry's Bay.

18:42She used to spend summers with her family. She reunites with her brothers. She has a little, like, these brothers that she has, like, the sort of love triangle with. So enough, the show touches on a bit of nostalgia and the sort of, like, this idea of, like, generational aspect, right, of cottage in Canada. Want to talk a little bit about that, but, like, this sort of, like, lore of over time. We keep returning to this place. Yeah, of course. I mean, listen, if you've got a place that you've summered to, whether or not it's a luxury mansion by the water, you've got memories there, right, with your family, with the friends that you've had over time, with the loved ones, whoever that might be. So it's kind of, for so many reasons, a lot of which we've discussed, it makes for the perfect romance setting, right? And I think one of the things is, and Carly really plays on this a lot, is this concept of second chances, right? So you get to go back, you're growing, you're becoming somebody else, you get to keep running into Hallmark style, I would feel like, somebody who maybe you had a crush on way back when, or maybe you're enemy, right? Because of course, that's really right for romance or whoever it might be, and you get

19:43to see them again and again. So then I think there's this innate sense of, oh, I get to try again. And that spark gets reignited every time. I think there's something really nostalgic and exciting about getting to revisit this earlier version of yourself, right? And we see that a lot with that book and with that show. And yeah, and I think also just the fact that when I think about cabins or cottages, when it's running through the family, it's something you've inherited, it's not always the fanciest thing. Sometimes you think of a shabby or place. There's bugs in muskoko, okay, I don't like bugs. There's a long drive to get there. It can smell kind of musty. Sometimes there's really bad Wi-Fi. So I think all of that lends to the certain kind of energy. And you get to relive it each time. And it gives you more heightened feelings. It's a lot of yearning each time. I just see all of Carly Forges' novels are set in Canada. But when she saw the first script of the show, she said he was set in Barry's Beddened Wisconsin. And I want you guys just to hear her talking about this on Q with Tom Power.

20:46Yeah, it was interesting because that, I think, was really the writer. It was just kind of automatically kind of this old school mentality where it's like, oh, we're going to change this to America because that's what we do. Shout out to Amazon. They also were like, don't worry. This is not final. This is not Barry's Beddened Wisconsin. That's not our endgame. We really see it as set in Canada. I do think that may not have happened had heated rivalry come out before that. Yeah, you see so. I really do. And I've noticed that the conversations that I'm having with producers have really changed since that show came out. Carly Forges' they are talking about Tom Power. Catherine, what do you make of that? Like this idea, like, do you see an overall shift this year in Americans' willingness to just watch a show set in Canada? 100%. I think it does not take much. It takes one big show to kind of shift a whole mindset about what a trend is. I think it's very obvious that heated rivalry has done that in a bunch of different ways.

21:48And this is one of them. I do think it is also part of this bigger trend that has been happening over the last many years at this point, which is that Americans and I think people everywhere have more access to and more willingness to watch shows that are made in unset in other places and made in other places. And that is sort of most obvious for American audiences when it's like, well, I love K-dramas or whatever. But it is very much the case also for something like Canadian TV shows at my own workplace just this week. People were like, Luke Kirby is on law in order to Toronto. How do we want to order to Toronto these days? And so I do think, you know, this is not something that I think is going to be going away. What I hope is that the Canadian publicists start sending me more screeners for all your crave originals. Hello, I'm out here. Catherine is literally begging. She's like, send them its time. Send them right now. I will say I really enjoyed the face that Emil just made when you said law in order to

22:48Toronto. It felt like perhaps distressed to me or maybe it's a different, maybe it's a different term that you want to use Emil. A lot of emotions run. It's not that bad Emil. It's not that bad. What did I think about it? Luke Kirby is on it. Well, you know what? To that point, like, do you see a shift in Canadians willingness to watch Canadian television shows? Is that something that you think has changed a little bit? Yeah, I do. I do. And it's also thanks to heated rivalry, which says a lot about how we've been engaging with Canada in a cultural way that Canadians are like, all right, I'll give it a chance. But what I think it's done and what I think that the Jacob Terny and his wonderful team have done is really champion Canadian talent, Canadian talent on screen and off screen. I notice that he is consistently casting Canadians and really pushing them to the forefront. And so it's, I think it's reinvigorated both like the people that want to watch Canadian

23:55content, but also the people who are making Canadian content and finally feel like, okay, we're being taken seriously. So 100% net good. And if it makes people watch Lauderdor Toronto, like, wow. Respect. So, Lauderdor Toronto may be an exception to all of this as far as I know. None of it is set in a cottage. But set up, what I'm curious about is if we have this moment, right, where Canadian cottage country is a representative, is representing Canada out there for the rest of the world. If Canadian cottage country has Catherine Van der Renn dog knocking on the door, being like, send me more of this, please. What picture of us does this present for better or for worse? What is the image of Canada being sent out here? Really, very sexy. I'm currently very steamy. I love that for us. Kind of wholesome. Listen, I think it's fun as a Canadian. I also find it a little cringe and goofy. I'm not going to lie. But I think it's exciting that we're getting to have sort of this positive and exciting representation with also younger people who are reading these books, they're watching

24:55these shows. But I think on the other hand, it's also still very white. It still really paints a very wealthy image, which is so not the case. And if I mentioned sterling point in particular, I mean, a lot of those characters are American, a lot of them are British. You know, it's still not going all the way. Like it's still very much half-assing Canada. I want to see full-asic of Canada. Like, let's just go all in. Set it there. Make that your whole thing. Don't just use the location. Don't just go there on vacation. Go all in. Just go inside it there, guys. Why not? Anyway, it's already here anyway. To that point, Catherine, when you sort of think about this, is there more room for more of this genre, this idea of sexy feelings by Canadian Lake? Does this feel like, you know, we're looking back at this and go like, that was a very summer 2026 moment? Or have we, have we birthed the movement here? Is this something that's going to be sustainable for, you know, years and years to come? I don't, I can't speak to years and years, but I can tell you is like heated rivalry season two is coming.

25:57Netflix has its own Carly Fortune adaptation. It does not feel like this train is slowing down. You can do romances set in a place like this forever and ever. Nicholas Sparks is that Ellen Hilden brand? Like we, this is a well established genre. Yeah. Catherine, I'm glad that you mentioned that show, that show from Netflix. That is a show that's going to be set on PEI from Carly Fortune. A meal to that point. Is there a particular place in the country where you're like, this, pay attention to this, go to this lake because I like some sexy feelings by this lake, a meal? Oh my gosh. I would never ruin my favorite lakes with, I was talking about them. Wow. I'm going to say, you're so cute. Jay, keep your legs. Keep your legs on radio. Wow. But I'll say this, the, the, the islands off British Columbia, especially like Salt Spring Island. Yeah. But those places are right for something set there because the locals are very wacky. They're mostly like artists and weirdos and hippies that have like crossed the border during

27:02the war. And then it's this like new generation of people who couldn't afford to live in Vancouver and then keep getting pushed further and further out. And so now they've ended up on this island. And there's a lot of, let's just say, boredom. And that leads to sexy times as we know. And so I do think, yeah, place like Salt Spring would be incredible to see on a show like, like, like Sterling Point, like any of these. And there are definitely a lot of different classes of people there. I think that that's what we want. But set off is right. Like, the race thing is kind of a crucial part of this. And as an immigrant, like, I don't have access to a lot of this stuff. And so it can feel alienating and that's maybe what underscores this and maybe that's what we should focus on is like less the place and more, all the different types of people that might end up there. I can only assume from that sentence that Emil Niazis currently developing a romance set

28:04in Salt Springs that is presumably where that was going to go. In the meantime, I really should. In the meantime, I really appreciate your time. You guys, this has been wonderful. Thank you so much for doing this. Thank you. Well, of course, the best time. Catherine Wright, AeroDoc is a TV critic at Vulture. You can read that piece, by the way, sexy feelings by Canadian Lake online. Her podcast is called TV is Good. Sadaf Asin is a freelance writer and co-host of Frequencies, the reheat podcast. Emil Niazis, the author of the memoir Life After Ambition and she writes a column of a cut. My name is Alamina Bumamud. This show is called Comotion. We'll be back tomorrow. We'll see you then. For more CBC podcasts, go to cbc.ca slash podcasts.