The Sixth Bureau Episode 5: One Way In, One Way Out

0:00Support for the show comes from Public. Public is an investing platform that offers access to stocks, options, bonds, and crypto. And they've also integrated AI with tools that can assist investors in building customized portfolios. One of these tools is called Generated Assets. It allows you to turn your ideas into investable indexes. So let's say you're interested in something specific, like biotech companies with high R&D spend, small cap stocks with improving operating margins, or the S&P 500 minus high debt companies. Chances are there is an ETF that fits your exact criteria. But on public, you just type in a prompt and their AI screens thousands of stocks and build a one-of-a-kind index. You can even backtest it against the S&P 500, then you can invest in a few clicks. Go to public.com slash market and earn an uncapped 1% bonus when you transfer your portfolio. That's public.com slash market. Add paid for by public holdings, brokerage services by public investing member Finra SIPC, advisory services by public advisors, SEC registered advisor,

1:01crypto services by zero hash, sample prompts are for illustrative purposes only, not investment advice. All investing involves risk of loss, see complete disclosures at public.com slash disclosures. The thing about AI for business, it may not automatically fit the way your business works. At IBM, we've seen this firsthand, but by embedding AI across HR, IT, and procurement processes, we've reduced cost by millions, slash repetitive tasks, and freed thousands of hours for strategic work. Now we're helping companies get smarter by putting AI where it actually pays off, deep in the work that moves the business. Let's create smart to business, IBM. Travel smarter, not harder, at America's best value in by Sinesta, with convenient locations from coast to coast and value pack comfort at every turn. It's a practical choice for road trips, quick getaways, and every day travel that keeps things simple without sacrificing comfort. And when you're a Sinesta travel pass member, staying at America's best value in means earning points toward free nights, upgrades,

2:03and more every time you stay. Go to Sinesta.com to book your stay and unlock the best rates with Sinesta travel pass. Here today, Rome tomorrow. Join now at Sinesta.com, terms and conditions apply. A quick note. This is the fifth episode of this series. If you haven't listened to the previous episodes, we recommend going back and listening in order. Thanks. About five months after GE Engineer David John agreed to work with the FBI, he was on a plane with Agent Mike Regal, heading for Europe. It's stressful. He's like, I'm taking a huge risk. I'm away from my family. I'm in a foreign country. I'm doing some weird thing against the Chinese government. And we had to make it clear to him, look, you're never going to meet with him. Again, this is just to get him in the country. The mission, arrest Shuyen Jun, a Chinese intelligence

3:06officer. This is something we've never, ever done before. Can we actually get this guy out of China so we can get our hands on him? I was skeptical that it would work out. Like, right, we're going to get a Chinese intelligence officer. We're going to bring him back from China and we're going to try and we're like, right? At this point, I have done some crazy things. I've convinced people way more importantly than the FBI, this is going to work. It has to work. I mean, there's lots of times we try to do international arrests and they just don't work. Something happens. Someone gets tipped off. Someone gets cold feet, doesn't show up. I still have that faith, but deep down you're like, man, if this breaks bad on me, I'm never going to live this down. From Bloomberg News and I Heart Podcast, this is the sixth bureau. I'm Jordan Robertson. And I'm Drake Bennett. So we were in central Brussels. When David and Mike landed, they met up with Bradley.

4:11We were based out of my hotel room in the top floor of a 16th century building. Deciding on Brussels as the site of the operation had been a process. Shoe had agreed to meet David in Europe before the FBI had even figured out which country would be willing to help them. I literally called and said, all right, here's my 32nd spiel. I have an MSS officer. He's willing to come to Europe. Who's going to say yes to this? Not everyone. The FBI needed to find a country that checked a bunch of boxes. One, would they let the FBI run an operation there? Two, would they help with the arrest? Three, could they move quickly? And four, were they willing to detain an extra-dite shoe even at the cost of angering China? And we ultimately settled on the Belgians. So up on the top floor of the hotel, in one small room, it's Bradley, Mike, David, an FBI translator, and their Belgian Shepherd room. We had the most junior counterterrorism officer from Belgium Federal Police assigned us.

5:13And by assigned us, I mean, she just sort of sat there and went, what am I doing here? You could tell she was bemused, but she was along for the ride. Things got claustrophobic. The ceiling was low. It was hot. And sometimes it didn't smell great. You know, it's fragrant. Five of us are crammed into this room, spending most of our day on the phone with Shu trying to affect the next pivot in the operation. You're there, but there's still one more pivot. Correct. Because Shu thinks David's in Paris for a work trip, and that he'll meet him in Amsterdam. Shu had even suggested a specific spot. Ahli, a laser tag venue called laser gaming, but that wasn't going to happen since Belgium is the country that said yes to this operation. So on March 29th, 2018, two days before she was supposed to leave China, David sends him a message. The trip to France is going pretty smoothly. However, my worst schedule has been changed. My boss made me travel to the sub-range of Belgium because we need to give him some technical help with the joint project.

6:18That said, I will not be able to make it to Amsterdam this Saturday. To pivot. But I can meet you at a hotel in Brussels this Sunday afternoon. If I was on that other end, I would be thinking, you don't tell me what to do? I tell you what to do. I'm the handler. You're the informant. He pushed back hard. He yelled at us. I have permission from the Chinese government to travel to France. I have permission from the Chinese government to travel to Netherlands. I don't have permission to go to Blankety Blank Belgium. And of course, David had to respond in real time. As the conversations or the texts are happening, our linguists is translating as quickly as possible again so that Mike or I can point say that. Say that. Don't say that. Say that. It was a sensitive moment. Shu was still pushing for the meeting to happen in the Netherlands. That Sunday. You can definitely make it in one day. Why don't you book your train? And we can meet somewhere near the train station.

7:18But the Netherlands wasn't going to work for the FBI. So David needed a new excuse for why he couldn't even take a day trip. Why he had to stay in Brussels. We spent hours talking about what we could say to make it as believable as possible. We filled a quarter of one of these notebooks with the different. Well, if we said this with that work and someone would say, I don't think it's going to work because of this and we rip it out and we'd start again. In the end, they went with their go-to excuse. We played on things that we knew had worked before. The big bad boss. Sunday is Easter. My boss takes it very seriously. Well, the boss feels so guilty about making us travel on the holiday weekend that he's going to take us out for an Easter brunch. He's reserved in Easter lunch for the traveling team and asked us to please attend. And if I don't show up, that's going to look really bad. And I can't disappoint my boss so I can't leave Brussels. This is why I'll have time to meet you here on Sunday afternoon. But I don't have time to travel

8:22to other cities. You know, we're so sorry we can't help it. This is just a situation. I'll be back in six months or a year or whenever the next time I'm going to be back here, maybe we can do it then. Well, that was unacceptable. It had to happen now. So, shoe finally conceits. He agrees to a meeting in Brussels. He's going to physically come. Why do you think he ultimately agrees to come to Belgium? There was so much back and forth, but eventually he agrees. I think the prize was too much. I mean, the prize was something he couldn't pass up, right? He's looking at large amounts of GE research that helps Chinese commercial aviation cut time off, saves the money, gives them a jump. So, if you're shoe and you bring in this kind of stuff, you're basically saying I'm the guy that did it. The day before his trip, shoe messages his wife.

9:25I put a USB drive in the iGlass box in the middle of the bookcase. It contains some encrypted documents. If something happens, someone will come to you and tell you the password. I mean, I've deployed more than 40 times. Often, I don't tell anyone where I'm going. I can't tell anyone where I'm going, but to add the comment on if something goes wrong. I've never done that. And the reaction that his wife had was what you would expect. Oh my god, don't scare me like this. It seems like he had some doubts at that point. He did, but when you talk about the risk reward, what we were offering, what we were claiming that we were going to provide, was clearly worth the risk. I will never know if he was ordered or chose to go, given that certain circumstances, but it happened. On March 31st, shoe arrives in Amsterdam and route to Belgium.

10:26Photos pulled from airport security cameras show him coming through customs. He's wearing a backpack as a giant suitcase and is dressed in all black. And he's not alone. He's with a colleague. In the photos, you can see shoe talking on his phone. He's on the phone with us. Shoes talking to David about where to meet in Brussels. So I grabbed Ruth, our Belgian colleague who was with us, who very begrudgingly, I think she slept on the floor that night in my room, like in a sleeping bag or something. And I grabbed her and I said, okay, we need to find a meeting location. We've gotten too far. I can't let shoe tell me where we're going to meet. And we just started walking around like tourists. And as I'm walking around central Brussels, I come across Le Pont de Coutierne, it's coffee shop. The chain, Le Pont de Coutierne, in La Gallade de Saint-Hobel. This particular location was in a 19th century shopping center with a high arched glass ceiling

11:26lined with elegant shops. It's completely in case it's the most beautiful architecture you can imagine. And I have slept in a couple of days. I'm tired and I see this coffee shop and I say, this is just like that coffee shop in the opening scene of Tinker Tailor Soldier Spy. With Quintessential John look-a-ray spy story. I like watching spy movies, not that my life resembles a spy movie in any way, shape or form. But I went, this works. This is the spot. So that's the fun reason I picked it. The operational reason was that I was bringing him into a funnel, one way in, one way out. You can't go through the back of these stores. I asked the front desk and the recommended a coffee shop nearby. I woke around and found a coffee shop, which is very close to my hotel. So basically I am walking my guy into a pedestrian only space. He can't drive up, he can't surveil unless he's on foot. One way in, one way out. They have quiet seating on the second floor. Then we said we were going to be on the second floor

12:28of the coffee shop. That means he had to go into the coffee shop, fatal funnel number two. Then he had to go upstairs, fatal funnel number three, to put him in such a tight locale, there's no way that we could miss him. So I'm bringing him into a fatal funnel, into a fatal funnel, into a fatal funnel. Send me the name of the coffee shop. Coffee shop is inside of Calorie Rui Au Sen Wu Bay. I took a picture for reference. Okay, I'll let you know when I'm about to be there. I'll be checking which at all times tomorrow. Okay, keep in touch. The thing about AI for business, it may not automatically fit the way your business works. At IBM, we've seen this firsthand. But by embedding AI across HR, IT, and procurement processes, we've reduced cost by millions, slash repetitive tasks, and freed thousands of hours for strategic work. Now we're helping companies get smarter by putting AI where it actually pays off, deep in the work that moves the business. Let's create smart to business. IBM.

13:33For many men, mental health challenges aren't recognized until they've already taken a toll, work pressure, financial stress, changing relationships, and traditional expectations around masculinity can quietly wear men down. Often without clear warning signs, in season three of the visibility gap, Dr. Guy Winch and his guests explore how these pressures show up, how to spot them earlier and how men can access meaningful support. Listen to the new season of the visibility gap a podcast presented by Signal Healthcare. You need to make a huge presentation in an hour. Adobe Acrobat uses AI to take all your documents and generate a presentation with a single click. Build slides quickly and streamline the process. Need a last minute pitch deck? Do that with Acrobat. Need to level up your presentation design? Do that with Acrobat. You have 30 plus documents that need to be simplified into a proposal. Do that. Do that. Do that with Acrobat. Learn more at Adobe.com slash do that with Acrobat.

14:40Easter Sunday dawns. David John and Mike Regal go to a lavish Easter brunch. A fake one staged by the FBI. They made a reservation at the hotel metropole in Brussels. It had a very fine five course brunch. We basically took every FBI resources in Brussels and we had them become the GE aviation team. Remember, this Easter brunch was the reason David told shoe he couldn't leave Brussels. And it was entirely made up, but they had to have one anyway. In case the MSS was watching. We had a guy sort of walk around like he with the boss, right? Because if they were watching, we needed to have the big bad boss have a face, right? I didn't know what the MSS was going to do in this situation. Meanwhile, across the city, dozens of police officers are out looking for shoe. We had surveillance out everywhere, trying to make sure these guys are going to show up. They go to the train stations, assuming he's taken a train in from Amsterdam. But shoe is in a car, a dark colored jaguar. He's being chauffeured to Brussels by the personal driver of the Chinese

15:44ambassador to the Netherlands. They were delivered for a clandestine meeting in the ambassador's car. Just let that wash of you for a second. That's how confident the MSS were in their ability to operate within the EU. I have never been picked up by anybody at any foreign airport ever for the FBI, let alone get to ride around in the ambassador's jaguar. Bradley is at the Belgian federal police headquarters in their command center. I remember fairly early in the morning, say maybe eight thirty or nine. The head Belgian prosecutor comes into this base and very professionally, but in a flurry. Like, is this real? Is this actually happening? They said, we actually think it is. We think this is going to go down and she's the one who said down and said, okay, let's do this. That's how the morning started. Bradley had spent months running this operation. But now it was Belgian police and Belgian prosecutors who are calling the shots. Bradley was relegated to the sideline. We don't get to participate in the arrests. We're not law enforcement officers in those countries.

16:46This is a Belgian operation. And that was made abundantly clear. So when they would talk to me, they would speak in English. But then when they were speaking to each other, they were speaking in French. And I speak enough French to be dangerous. And they kept saying the FBI needs the meeting to happen before we can affect the arrest. I said, no, it's just a day, no, no, say, say, put the phone and I said, no, if you see him, please for the love of God arrest him. So they were under the impression that the target had to meet with the engineer. Correct. In order to, like, we needed that to happen for the arrest to be valid. And I said, no, no. And they all stop and they turn and they tilt their heads. I mean, realizing I've been listening to their conversations all morning, immediately switched into Flemish. And I have no idea what is happening for the rest of the day. They kept talking amongst themselves until a squawk on the radio. And the Belgian surveillance commander, she said to me, we think we see him. It's 11 o'clock in the morning, 11th or in the morning.

17:48After all the negotiations and all the pivots, she was there in Brussels. And he was early. The meeting wasn't until that afternoon at three. Xu and his colleague, Xu Hang, were there to case the meeting spot. And Bradley was done being patient. Please just arrest him. I couldn't imagine sitting in this space before more hours like this because I control none of this. Like I'm an observer at best. Just please, please, please arrest him. And then she comes back, oh, we lost him. I'm thinking, oh, no. They tell you they lost him. What goes through your mind at that point? I just want to get it over with it. I just needed to end. Then two hours later, Xu was back. He texted David. We're here. Let me know when you're done eating. I'll meet you in front of the shop. Standing in front of the cafe, Xu raised his phone to snap a picture of it. Bradley has that photo. He shows it to us. And you'll notice this gentleman here. The reason he's a little blurry is what

18:52happens in about the next second is four very large, very muscular Belgian slot operators walk up, plane close. They pick up Xu and Xu and Xu and Xu hang by their elbows and start walking later than through the crowd. Really? So this is literally his last second of freedom. There's a bunch of squawking on the radio from the surveillance commander. The SWAT commander's radio starts squawking. I said, what just happened? And she starts closing up her logbooks and stuff and says, oh, it's over. We just all lasted. And in my head, I think this is the pinnacle of my career. I'm never going to do anything more significant that I would ever be able to talk about than this. And what a way for it to end. It's so fair. We arrested him. One of the Belgian police inspectors who was kind of a, is a more senior guy and he's kind of a big dude with the white beard. I just gave him a huge hug.

19:53It was like a big bear hug. And I think he was like, you know what? And no Americans did this kind of stuff because it was like the stress was over. Later that afternoon, the FBI has David sent a couple more messages to shoot. They also have him call shoes phone. They wanted to look like David's got nothing to do with shoes arrest and that he's just their waiting for him at the coffee shop. I'm here now. Are you here? You know, just in case anyone else from the MSS is paying attention. I've been waiting for almost an hour and still haven't seen you. You wouldn't even pick up the phone. Sorry. I have to head back to prepare for tomorrow's meeting. With that final message, the relationship between Shuyen Jun and David John came to an end. A relationship built on lies and manipulation. It's safe to say they both regret it. I remember getting a phone call on Easter Sunday morning early and running up to my third floor

21:10to take the phone call away from my kids. This is Emily Gladfelter, a federal prosecutor on the case. And they were like, they've got him. It took me a few minutes to process. I was like, what? Wait, he's arrested. That was like, wow, I surreal. I just cannot believe here we are. When they got him to the station, talk to him. He refused to talk. Tim Mangon, another federal prosecutor on the case. He pretty clearly said, I want to Chinese attorney. I'm not going to speak with you. There was an arrest warrant there. Some other documentation they asked him to sign. He refused to sign it. The two MSS officers were now in the custody of the Belgian police. On Shuyen, the police found two phones and envelopes of cash. $7,000 and nearly 8,000 euros. On one of the phones, they found a bunch of pictures of David John. And of the GE engineers family. These are sort of social media pictures, but he had a large collection of them.

22:13If I came to talk to one of you guys, or let's say we've just met once, and I said, I'd like you to provide me X, Y and Z. And I basically have on my phone pictures of your whole family, right? It would freak you out. It's unnerving. I mean, this was like many, many, many photos of this guy and his family. Yes. You can sort of use it as leverage to keep them working with the intelligence officer. And we thought he was sort of in preparation from going from the carrot to the stick. Shuyen wasn't part of the arrest warrant, so he was released after a couple hours. When authorities went to access the contents of his second phone, there was nothing there. It had been remotely white. Shuyen Jun was also carrying two phones. One was a Huawei phone with a password of, I kid you not, Shuyen Jun 1980. The second was the iPhone which he had used to so diligently document his life for years. He was jailed in Brussels while the Chinese

23:20government hired a law firm to fight the extradition. But Shuyu pursued other avenues. There was a bizarre escape attempt. A jailbreak. Shuyu had tried to reach out to another inmate and offered money if the person could help him escape. 50,000 euros. But it was spoiled. I mean, this whole investigation in case seemed like it was out of a movie at times, and that was just like another chapter that, of course, you know, there was going to be an escape plan. Six months after his arrest, Shuyu's extradition was approved by a Belgian court. That meant it was time for Bradley and Mike to fly back to get him and bring him to the US for trial. You know, we basically flew on the director's plane over there. The FBI director's personal jet. This is kind of a once in a career type thing. Right. I'm a lowly young guy from Southern Ohio, and this is, I mean, for some executives, this would be like, oh, what's the big deal? To me, it's kind of like, what does it count?

24:20What's this guy? I mean, to me, it's me, you know, to me, it's neat. I'm used to commercial, just I'm a guy that's back in coach, you know, I'm going through Atlanta and, you know, walking eight miles through Atlanta airport. It's kind of like, wow, you kind of get on the plane and you're in Belgium. It was a beautiful day. It was October, so it wasn't hot. It was nice. It's a beautiful day. Blue skies, puffy clouds. We are at a private terminal on the grounds of the Russell's International Airport, where our plane has been parked. A motorcade arrives and drives onto the tarmac right up to the plane. They get out. Their long rifles are out. It's not just like a couple of dudes in suits. I mean, these are some legit looking, like, seal team six looking type dudes. They open the door to the Volvo station wagon and Audi pops. He's just a medium-build Chinese gentleman. It doesn't stand out in any crazy way. He's handcuffed in the European system. At least in the Belgian system, they don't wear prison garb. They wear civilian clothes,

25:23so he had sneakers on, a pair of jeans, a button down, and a sweater. But not for long. As part of the transfer, Bradley makes shoe change into a striped jail uniform he's brought from Ohio. I let him know that we're going to shackle him at the feet, at the waist, and at his wrists, and he's going to fly back to the United States that way. And when we get him on the plane, is not combative, but also not cooperative. The decision was made to basically just, you know, ask him the booking questions. Name date of birth, address, telephone number, this kind of stuff. I think Alias was one of the standard booking questions as Alias is. But yeah, he did not like the questions. He declined to answer some of them or he refused to answer some of them. Shoe was charged with conspiring and attempting to commit economic espionage and steal trade secrets.

26:26He arrived in Ohio and was sent to a federal detention center to await his trial. It was a very long way. Three years. For much of that time, Shoe was confined to his 70 square foot jail cell, alone, for 23 hours a day. He communicated with his wife and family through letters, which were often held up for months by translation protocols. Then, in October 2021, Shoe found himself as a defendant in an American courtroom, a scenario he probably never imagined. Support for the show comes from public. Public is an investing platform that offers access to stocks, options, bonds, and crypto. And they've also integrated AI with tools that can assist investors in building customized portfolios. One of these tools is called generated assets. It allows you to turn your ideas into investable indexes. So let's say you're interested in something specific,

27:28like biotech companies with high R&D spend, small cap stocks with improving operating margins, or the S&P 500 minus high debt companies. Chances are there is an ETF that fits your exact criteria. But on public, you just type in a prompt and their AI screens thousands of stocks and build a one-of-a-kind index. You can even backtest it against the S&P 500. Then you can invest in a few clicks. Go to public.com slash market and earn an uncapped 1% bonus when you transfer your portfolio. It's public.com slash market. Add paid for by public holdings, brokerage services by public investing member Fenra SIPC, advisory services by public advisors, SEC registered advisor, crypto services by zero hash. Sample prompts are for illustrative purposes only, not investment advice. All investing involves risk of loss. See complete disclosures at public.com slash disclosures. So there's a lot of noise about AI, but times too tight for more promises. So let's talk about results. At IBM, we work with our employees to integrate technology

28:29right into the systems they need. Now a global workforce of 300,000 can use AI to fill their HR questions, resolving 94% of common questions. Not noise. Proof of how we can help companies get smarter by putting AI where it actually pays off. Deep in the work that moves the business. Let's create smart to business. IBM. Find home wherever you roam at S&S to ES and simply suites, where longer stays feel comfortable, flexible and easy. Stretch out and enjoy spacious accommodations and home-like amenities designed to help you settle in and stay productive or relaxed, for however long you need. And when you're a S&S to travel pass member, staying at S&S to ES and simply suites means earning points toward free nights, upgrades and more with every eligible stay. Go to S&S to.com to book your stay and unlock the best rates with S&S to travel pass. Here today, Rome tomorrow. Join now at S&S to.com, terms and conditions apply.

29:29When shoes trial finally got underway, the pandemic was still raging. The jury box was covered in plexiglass. The witness stand had plexiglass. The judges bench had plexiglass. We all wore masks. This is Paula Christian, a local TV investigative reporter who covered the trial. As someone who regularly covers the courts, she knows all the lawyers and took note of shoes. He had a whole squad from Taft in a elite Cincinnati firm. As a reporter, one of the first things you look at when you have a defendant is who their lawyer is. And if they have a firm like Taft, somebody's paying for it because it's too expensive for an average person to pay for this. I mean, Ralph Conan probably bills at six to $700 an hour. And they had six, seven people on their legal team in the courtroom. I mean, that's thousands of dollars an hour. Shoes lawyers declined repeated requests to speak to us. And the trial wasn't recorded,

30:34but we do have the transcripts. The defense didn't dispute that shoe worked for the MSS. He's a recruiter. Nobody's ever hidden from that. He's affiliated and works for the MSS. Or that shoe was trying to cultivate aviation experts working outside China. Sure, he was trying to get them to share their expertise. Sure, he paid them and wind them and dine to them. And what does that prove exactly? But they argued that the information she was trying so hard to get wasn't technically trade secrets. Believe what you will about the government's evidence in this case, ladies and gentlemen, but there's no way that you can conclude beyond a reasonable doubt that our client has intended to steal trade secret information. This case is about a man who was caught up in a controversy between the US and China. Over China's advancing competency and abilities technologically. The US was overreaching. The US just didn't want

31:34China to have any technology. So they're just being spiteful. That was their main argument. But they were up against a lot. Because how can you argue with what you said on a recorded line or what you wrote in a text message on your phone or the photos you took? It's tough. The trial stretched over two and a half weeks. David John testified, so did the Honeywell engineer Arthur Gao, so did folks from GE, and a chief inspector from the Belgian federal police. Bradley was on the stand for three days. The last witness was James Olson. He was the prosecution's expert on espionage. I've never seen a jury and a judge lean in the way they did with Jim Olson. I mean, it was surreal. The defense in cross-examining James Olson tried to use his own spy career against him. There was a moment in his cross-examination where

32:39they accused him of lying. So, you know, you've been undercover and you've not been honest with your family or your friends and whatnot. And he said something like, and I would do it again for this country. And it felt like a moment where it was like the flag should be behind him. And you should be hearing the National Anthem. And it was like, you could hear a pin drop. It was amazing. And then on redirect, I went up and asked, if you've been caught, what would happen? And he kind of looks at me and then he looks over at you and he goes, I'd be right there and points right as you. She was shooting daggers at me in his eyes. When I looked at him, I could not help with having a feeling of, he's really not much different from me. He's serving his country. I served my country. He's a spy. I was a spy. He lived under cover. I lived under cover.

33:44He's doing what he's believing is right. I did what I believed was right. How are we any different? And so, I had kind of a momentary pang that we could easily be trading places. I could be sitting in a trial being convicted of espionage. If I'd been caught, and the only real difference between shooting me was that he got caught that I did. I was not totally unaware of the human dimension of what we were doing, potentially sending this man away from his family and from his country for many, many years. But I was there to convict him. This was the only time in our history that we had an MSS staff officer in a courtroom facing conviction in a prison in the United States. And this was a message that I wanted to send to China.

34:46The deliberation process, if I recall, took more than a day. That was a really stressful time. I remember wandering around downtown a couple of days waiting for this verdict and just thinking, what do we do if this doesn't come out our way? And when I followed a tremendous amount of weight on our shoulders, we were concerned that if we fell short in our duty that we would cause some sort of international incident. The verdict comes back and the entire courtroom is silent. You just sit and wait for these words. There's so much anticipation and he was found guilty of everything. We reached out to China's Ministry of Foreign Affairs about the case back in 2022

35:47after the verdict came out and they said, quote, the accusations by the US are completely fabricated. We demand the US handle the case in a fair manner and ensure the legitimate rights of Chinese citizens. When we reached out to them again this year, they referred us to previous statements. A year after the trial, shoe sentence came down. He was given 20 years. I thought the USense was pretty strong. This is Alan Kohler, former head of counterintelligence at the FBI. To get someone 20 years like that, that's a huge hit for anybody who commits economic espionage. You know, 20 months is more likely the type of sentence that we get. But I think there were some pretty serious aggravating factors. The type of information he stole the breadth of the effort that he was being charged with and the sort of like co-conspirators that were wrapped up in it. All of that plus in being Chinese intelligence officer, I think it just worked against him in this

36:51matter. Shoot didn't speak at all during his trial, but at the sentencing hearing he did. He spoke through translator. Here's some of what he said that day. All of this took place within the grand contacts of the trade war between the US and China. All the US government has down is to use the legal system as a weapon in the war it wages to further its political agenda. That has nothing to do with respect and justice. Your honor, I'm just an ordinary Chinese citizen who knows nothing about politics. Nor do I know anything about secrets. Why on earth did I get caught into this incredible legal battle? Thus, this whole case is merely a political force directed and acted out by the US government for self-aggrandizement. It is like the thief who demands that the thief be caught. Regardless what the sentence may be, I will appeal this case

37:56because I stand by my innocence. Thank you. Shoot did appeal, but he lost. In August 2024, a federal appeals court of hell disconviction and sentence. But shoot saga didn't end with that prison sentence. In two weeks, we'll have the final episode of our series, where shoot gets an unlikely lifeline. I don't think China really had a playbook for how to handle this. You just told me about how he was, quote unquote, rescued. I'll never forget the site nor the sound of the FBI agents who banged on the door and said, FBI opened the door and barged straight in. That's coming up on March 20th. Don't miss it.

39:09If you follow markets, you know the value of long-term thinking. You plan, you diversify, you prepare for volatility. But even the best strategies can prevent every bad day. For more than 75 years, Cincinnati Insurance has helped individuals and businesses navigate tough moments with expertise, personal attention, and independent agents who focus on relationships, not transactions. The Cincinnati Insurance companies let them make your bad day better. Find an agent at CINFIN.com. From coast to coast, unlock adventure at Red Lion Hotels by Sinesta, where rest will sleep, friendly service, and trusted local knowledge are part of every stay. Red Lion makes it easy to feel welcomed, comfortable, and connected wherever the road takes you. Whether you're traveling for business or pleasure, you can spend less and make more of every trip. When you sign up for Sinesta Travel Pass, you'll get their best rates instantly. Go to Sinesta.com to book your stay and unlock the best rates with Sinesta Travel Pass.

40:13Here today, Rome tomorrow. Join now at Sinesta.com. Terms and conditions apply. These days, it seems like AI agents are just about everywhere you turn. Every field and every function. But without identity, you can't trust they'll serve your business instead of jeopardizing it. Fortunately, OCTA helps you get identity right by securing your AI agent's identities, giving you a single layer of control, a single standard of trust. So whether an AI agent supports a single user or your entire enterprise with OCTA, you'll turn risk into opportunity. Secure every agent. Secure any agent. OCTA secures AI.