Jokic Just Revealed What He Needs MOST From Denver

0:00This is the Lockdown Podcast Network celebrating 10 years of your team every day. Running a business shouldn't feel like surviving a software group project. One app for accounting, another for inventory, another for sales, and somehow none of them talk to each other. That's where ODO comes in, an all-in-one business management software that brings every part of your business together from sales and accounting to inventory and marketing all in one powerful platform. No messy integrations, no bouncing between tabs and best of all, no spreadsheets. Stop managing software and start managing your business with one unified system. Try for free today at odu.com slash locked on. That's od o o dot com slash locked on. This is Jake from Lockdown. When the game's on the line, the best no end to pass. Because the right assist can change everything. And off the court, it's no different. That's where your state farm agent comes in. Whether it's protecting your car, your home, or helping you prep for the unexpected, they'll upset you up with a game plan that works for you.

1:02Like a good neighbor, state farm is there. Covered options are selected by the customer, availability and eligibility vary by state. Nicole Yogan just let the nuggets know what he actually needs. He didn't say it. But he let him know what he actually needs from them this season and going forward. Plus, why Denver needs a president of basketball operations. And I'm going to ask Swipe what team he hates the most all that more on locked on nuggets. You are locked on nuggets. Your daily Denver Nuggets podcast, part of the locked on podcast network, your team every day. Welcome locked on nuggets. Thanks for joining us. Appreciate you guys being with us. We're daily Denver Nuggets podcast, part of locked on podcast network, your team every day. I'm Matt Moore joined by Swipe on today's show. We're going to I am going to ask Swipe about who he hates the most, but he hasn't

2:03hated anybody. I know, I know you're a very, you are a man that puts a lot of love into the universe. And I appreciate that about you. But like healthy sports hate is good. Healthy sports hate is good. As a nuggets, like I grew up in Park Hill. So like who, I mean, they just weren't good enough to like hate someone, you know, like they were just, they spent so many years being so mediocre. And when I did an episode about this on Tuesday, you know, it was just, I mean, football, that's a different story. There's a, there's a healthy sports hate between the AFC West. But that's because the cheese for frauds for however long they didn't make a bowl or play off for so long. Very good. The Raiders are the Raiders and then the Chargers are the Chargers. Yeah, it's hard for me to care about the Chargers. I care about the Raiders. I don't care about the Chargers. But, but the Chargers have been better than the Raiders just hold century. That's the funny thing. I know, I know. I mean, like, they need to like win some playoff games and make a day of a championship

3:03game and like do something significant. And then I would care. The Raiders, I do, I do genuinely wish we could bond together more over our shared hatred of the Raiders. But unfortunately, we're like the two. Well, the problem is I like their players now. I like Max Crosby. I like Brock Bauer's. I like the kid they drafted on Arkansas this year and I like Aston Gentie. And honestly, I like for an Anomendoza. Like, so it's hard, you know, because now they have to guard some guys I like on the squad. You'll have to, as soon as you play them, you'll get to the club. And then Kubiaks there. Like they have a, I mean, there's a Kubiak connection now. What do you want me to do? Is this, he was, he was the backup quarterback for John L.A. I look, this is a basketball show. So we're not going to spend much time on this. But I like, I, Vic wants to know, Matt, what's your prediction for the Broncos Chiefs game? I'm not just being like, this is not reversing. I'm dead serious. This is my, my dead honest, very serious gave this out on the action network podcast. I'm doing a Thursday show gave out the pick.

4:04Like the chiefs offent left tackle is out. Benito's going to kill him. Like, my home is going to throw two interceptions because he's going to be under duress. The entire game. He's going to throw two I and T's. The Broncos running game is going to run it down the chiefs throat. This young secondary is probably going to get picked apart. Like, I am not optimistic about this game. Like I felt very good about matchups in the past, right? And like, enjoy that period of my life. I do think the Broncos are going to win by double digits. I do think that is going to happen in arrowhead. That's just how it goes. Like that is my dead honest prediction. I do, I feel terrible about this game. I have. Well, Nick does Nick, the, well, you know, the line is on your side. You're two and a half point favorites. Still, you know, even with John, what's him is being out? It's incredibly disrespectful to the Broncos and it's way too, it is way too much like, well, it's my home's a home.

5:05I like, I get it. But no, you know, Sean Payton uses that stuff in like the. Yeah, of course, of course. This, this line should probably be, I'm trying to think about what this line should be. Well, I think a respectable one. So remember, you get two and a half for me in a home now. Could it used to be three, but actually it's more like two, but yeah. So I mean, it's. I feel like I feel like a, go ahead. So I do like a four and a half point for home field. That's what I do. Four and a half. Yeah, because it's two points for one team and then two and a half points for the other. Usually one of the two teams has a two and a half. You have a pretty strong home field advantage. Yeah. Or if you want to flip it and just be like, oh, you're playing an altitude two and a half. You're correct. Yeah, you're crowns fine. But like, I would probably do like one and a half. Like a neutral on neutral. This is probably Broncos minus one and a half. Like a pick them. They don't do pick them anymore, but it would probably be pick them. Juiced Broncos is what I think it should be. And it's not. And that's why the lines wrong.

6:05Our, our survey of fans are like, why? Because the, what's the line on Yokeh, right? If you had to say, Yokeh, staying in Denver on Fandall right now. Oh, man. They probably get put it to short. It's probably like minus 400. What do you, what would you have it at? Minus 1900. Because of the interview that that produce litafiles. Oh, actually, I did the interview is, is worse. So far. Yeah. So let's, let's talk about it. So to call Yokeh, does another interview in Serbian? I will put the link in the episode description after we get done. I forgot to do that before. And that's my fault. It was on the Jamele, I believe it is the way it's pronounced. It's in Serbian. There's a transcript that's in English, if you want to go through it that way. And my big takeaway from it is, like, there's a couple of quotes that I wanted to note that I think are pretty important to talk about in terms of what he said.

7:07The big one that people are glomming on to is that he was asked about missing the anonymity and how people come up to him and wanted to take pictures. And he says, you know, it bothers me a lot. It must admit. And it bothers me more and more. I'm getting more rude to people who approach me because, honestly, it's exhausting. I spend the whole summer really not taking pictures because that is my time. It might sound rude, but it is what it is. It's been 10 to 11 years. I think it's enough now. It's like going to the zoo and taking the picture of an animal. And he kind of talks about how much he just wants to be left alone. The deal I know where DMVR was like, yeah, that sounds like a guy that wants to go to LA. And I kind of have the opposite reaction, which is like, yeah, because we go to LA. If Joker goes to a restaurant in LA in the nice part of LA at the celebrity restaurants, he's like the 10th most famous person there. Like, he's no longer besieged by people. He can't go to like Buco de Beppo, but like he can go to some sort of Italian spot that caters the celebrities and it's fine, right? The biggest thing that you should take away from this, though,

8:09is just like, Joker like jokes about wanting to go back now. Like, it is just not, it is just very, he talks about the biggest thing that to me was the fact that he talked about how he is like working very hard to resist the influence of America on his kids. Like, that's a big thing for him. And like, he really wants them to be like, as he says, we are lucky that my brother is there and he has kids. So now we have five kids altogether. There are a lot of them who speak our language. It's impossible to isolate them because they will grow up there and go to school there. So it's impossible to take away what they have there. But we will try to drill into their heads, our mentality and our way of thinking and our values. So let me ask you this. So as an American, how do you, if you were, I wish we had Miros Lop up here to maybe go through that. Because that is important, because obviously I do this. That's something I hold on to.

9:09I have a very strong connection to my own culture. So there are many things that I lost along the way or they tried to take along the way of, you know, when you're developing, when you're growing up, you know, and there are certain things that are said to you that are microaggressions that are like, hey, you should consider changing your voice or how you look or how you smile or how you blah, blah, blah. So that's me living here as an American. I can imagine for Yokehitch being in Serbia, his whole life coming over here, and then he's one of Americans, he'd like, no, I don't want to do any of these things, actually. And I also, he's old enough now, he's 31, brother, you're not going to make me either. And I'm also Yokehitch. So like, I think some of this is, I do wonder it's a Serbian for those that are listening and those of you in the chat that will listen to this afterwards. I would love your commentary here. What does it mean for you to hold onto your own individuality as a Serbian? And when you're living in a place that is majority culture like America

10:12and you're surrounded by a majority culture populist that's very self, like we are very like individualistic in the United States. We are taught to think about yourself as an individual and not as a community. We are taught to be very self-congratulatory here. Yokehitch has repeatedly shown that, that is not the manner that he believed he should operate or that he believes his family and people around him should operate. And Peyton Watson, I brought this up in the, in the show I did last Tuesday or two Tuesdays ago about Peyton Watson as something he learned from Yokehitch. Yokehitch is not self-congratulatory at all. He is not somebody who talks about his accomplishments, uses them in arguments when somebody in front of he's like, we're gonna do this, he's like, how about, no, I'm the three time MVP. He doesn't view himself as that. So I'm trying to, I tried to listen to him from his perspective as a human being

11:12and somebody who is literally from a place I have never set foot in. I've never been to Serbia. I've tried four times to go to Serbia, Matt, and it's failed every single time. So I wonder though, for him, and I guess it's you, I guess when you heard that, that's what I took from that part of it. Like there's this real distinction for him and importance to maintain who he is. And I don't know if I can say, well, I know I can't say that's a bad thing, but I'm saying, is that, are we underscoring that to a little bit because we are so American? I think one of the problems that happens, there's definitely an element of our expectation of him existing in our culture and that makes him uncomfortable. I also think there's a little bit of preemptive. Recalcitrant on his part.

12:14Mm. Of like. So one of my favorite words for Calcitrant. Say it again. Recalcitrant. Mm. Recalcitrant. Hey, y'all, just play that back on your ASMR tapes. Recalcitrant. On his part in terms of wanting, he assumes the worst of a lot of times in interactions with the current. So he's a skeptic, naturally. Yeah, I think that's fair to say. I think Yogi's is very, he's a realist that borders on a little bit of cynicism. And I think that that, like, he's especially, I think, cynical about American culture. And if you're wondering about, like, what the basketball side of this? So I like. The basketball side of this is that they need to create an environment around Joker where he is as happy and comfortable as he can be here. Because I think that a large part of his growing discomfort has been very much the emergence of his visibility with an American culture. Yeah.

13:15Right? He's not just visible. He's a visible in American culture and a culture that he is not only uncomfortable with. And I think probably dislikes to some degree for various reasons. And I want to be very clear on this. I don't think we understand why. Everyone's going to fill in the blanks on, oh, I bet he doesn't like this part of American culture. And they're going to fill it in with their own preferences. And I think you should probably avoid doing that. And just be like, it's apples to oranges. You can't really understand it. Because like, we just tend, what we do tend to do is we all, like, Americans do this a lot. Where we take European, and we lump Europe to Europe. Oh, yeah. Oh, 100. And attitudes. Because like, Serbia is not British. Brother, we've been doing this politically with the Middle East for decades. Okay, we're going to dance out of this country.

14:15No, I'm saying, but that's how we do it. That's how, but that's what American exceptionalism is. Like, we don't consider other people as individuals in their own, like, individual experiences. So like, that is 100% an error of what we do here. Yeah. And, but I do think that they're, like, that can happen, I think, the same way there, which is like, I do think there's a kind of a blame that American culture is more monolith than it is, too. But I do think that, like, look, I think a huge priority has got to be creating an environment through basketball, through whatever you got to, where jokers get in a good head space, and he's able to find the joy for the game. Sure. Where this is less of a, I am here, because there is nowhere in the world that I can make more money. Like, you have to get it to where it's like, that's true. Okay? Because you're never going to get rid of that part. He's never going to make the decision to want to be here instead of home. But you can at least make it to where it's like, I'm having fun. This is good. I am able to enjoy my work here. I don't think he's enjoyed his work in several years. I have a question for you on the other side, brother.

15:17Can I think it was relative? We'll talk about that. Plus the need for Josh Kronke to hire a president of basketball operations, instead of trying to do the job himself. All that. Can you say more coming up here on Lockdown for Calcetron, please? More coming up on Lockdown, Recalcitrant Nuggets. Ted Show is brought to you by Odo. Love Odo. Great sponsor for us here on the show. Running a business shouldn't feel like you're trying to connect a bunch of systems that were never designed to work together. One app for accounting and another for inventory and another for sales and somehow none of them talk to each other. That's where Odo comes in. It's an all in one business platform management software that brings every part of your business together in one powerful platform from sales and accounting to inventory and marketing. Everything works in one place. Odo is one platform to manage, grow, and scale your business. The best organizations know that success isn't just about talent. It's about having everyone working towards the same goal. And that's true in sports, just like it is in business.

16:18Do you know how many players there are in the league that have all of this talent, but it's wasted because their team has put them in the wrong position, hasn't realized what their best capability is. Guys are oftentimes capable of so much more, can help their teams win more, but their coaches don't realize the best way to use them. And that's unique communication in order to improve them. And that's what Odo is going to do for you. It's going to give you the best communication. So you can get the best from everybody in your organization. Greater organizations win because operations matter. And that's why you should get Odo. Odo is one platform to manage, grow, and scale. Your business. Try for free today at odo.com slash locked on. That's od. O-O.com slash locked on. We'll be right back on locked on nuggets. Locked on recalcitrant nuggets. Locked on recalcitrant nuggets. Back here on locked on recalcitrant. I'm Matt Moore. I appreciate you guys being with us with Swipe. Swipe, you wanted to ask me something about

17:19this ongoing conversation about that. Yeah. One, we're considering all of this stuff with the Oakage. Do you see this in your perspective after covering him now for 11 years? You've been around him for 11 years of his life. He's known you since you were 34, 3. 33. So you were younger than I am when you first stepped into this role older than Ryan Still, by the way. Just so people can understand Ryan isn't an A's timeline. Do you feel that this is something that is a more callous quality of his? Or is this something that is like, this is him genuinely trying to be maybe a little bit more protective in some. That's a great question. You know, healthier, healthier ways. I do think that I've said this a lot. One of the things that I've grown to dislike about the NBA. And there's a lot of things I still love about the league.

18:21But one of the things I've grown to dislike when covering it up close is the impact of the nature of the league in this way. If you're in college and you lose once on a power program, it's the end of the world, right? If you are, like if you're a, if you come out of Georgia and football and you lose, it's like the end of the world. And that locker room is devastated. If you're a great NBA team, I mean a great one. You're going to lose 27 times a year. That's a 55 win team loses 27 times a year. And I learned this early when I started here in players, talk about, you know, what was the message that you gave the guys? What's the message to the younger guys? What did the older guys told you? And the answer was always the same. Don't get too high. Don't get too low. Next game, you stay steady with your process.

19:23You stay steady with what you do. You stay steady with your habits because you can't get up and then down. Because if you get too high on the win, you lose those habits and you lose. You get too low and you don't have the emotional energy to get through travel and another game and another game. Because you're still thinking about the game two, two, three days ago. You can't do it. You're going to put everything behind you and you have to stop caring about the results. That's bad. That's bad. Right? And I think to protect yourself and then on top of this, you have the impact of the money and the money changes people so much. And I think that some of the money is like the ego and class that it puts you in is entirely different. And those are things that I think are corruptive. There's also the simple fact of when you are somebody that makes that kind of money, everyone knows it and it changes the way people treat you and it changes what they ask of you. And that's really hardening. Like it's really tough, I think, to go through a period where you have so much success that people are like, well, I've known you forever. What, what about, what can you do this for me?

20:25Hey, I really need this thing. Like you have all this money. You can help me, right? That's, that's, I think that is like really damaging to people from an emotional perspective and it causes them to be very protective. And then there's like the security side of it. Like you're a target now. Like they know you have access to millions of dollars. That's kind of scary. And you're a very public person. Everyone knows what you look like. Everyone knows what car you drive. Everyone knows all this, that and the other. And so I think that you can feel very exposed, I think, as a professional athlete. And I think that that causes a real change in a lot of these dynamics. I think Joker, if Joker could just like get up in the morning, go hang out with the horses in the afternoon, drive to an arena, destroy everyone, go home and hang out with his kids at night and go to sleep on the farm. He would do that. Yeah, the parries said he literally would go to the stable and just, he'll listen to the horses eat. And I do think I guess that's what I'm saying, Matt.

21:25Like it's not that it's wrong. It's, but I think we will never have Yokech and the NBA, and honestly, the NBA worse off for this, by the way, man, I think I want to make this definitively clear. We have so many showmen in the NBA that are posers. And I like in, in, in many ways, and I mean this in a way that's like, they are not, most people are don't know who they are. And I think you can attest to that. A lot of people don't actually know who they are. But the thing is, as an ex athlete, and as somebody you've been, either ex athlete and then cover the sport, Matt, you've been in locker room with plenty of people. Their entire identity is their sport. They're good at it. They don't know anything outside of that. And they believe they should be treated in a manner that reflects that identity. And, but they don't have any development in life outside of that. Like they're, I mean, you asked them to help change a tire.

22:26Number one, the know how or even the willingness to help another person doesn't exist. I have been teammates with people that really good athletes off the field. I wouldn't ask them to throw a bucket of water on me. If I was on fire, Matt, because when you go through your entire life, y'all having a crutch of being extremely athletic, very celebrated, everybody opens doors for you. Matt, I didn't even make it to this level. I spent years of my life getting free food, free gain, free gear, free vacation, free travel, free this, free that free this. And it's thrown at you because you got to take care of our bodies. You're there for us, nutritionist there for us, the strength coaches there for us, the academic advisors are there for us. Everything is filtering around to make it as easy as possible for us to perform. And then take it to the NBA where you're the broad James.

23:27What you going to do about it. I'm a hundred and fifty million dollar man off the court with Nike. Yo, Kitch is literally making 60 plus million dollars a year. Has won three MVP's. He is the very best thing to ever happen, not just to a sport in Denver, but might be the best athletes ever walk through Denver. He could get any door he wants open for him at any point in time. But I think yo, Kitch in some way, Matt, which is, I think the commendable thing. Why I think we, I wish we got more of him. He has been so reticent, recalcitant, reticent to accept that that he is pushed the entire legal way. Now, that's made it harder for you to do your job, grind to do his job in some ways, in some way, not in every way, but just, I mean, the way I, the way I would say about that is, I am, I would say that my biggest problem as a reporter is I'm too respectful of their time. I can pop off on here and be and criticize them and call them out and all these type of things.

24:30But like when I'm in person with them, I don't ever want to waste their time. And like, I am just always kind of like, look, I can't get to know you on a personal level, past a certain, a certain point, I've known players, but like past a certain point because I want to be able to maintain my ability to criticize you and not be personal. Like that's important to me. Yeah. Like I do, that's important to me. And also, like, I don't, I don't ever fame the idea that they have any interest in me. Like I just, I'm like, that's fine. The other thing I would say is, um, to your point, kind of getting back to the basketball side of this though, I think it is important to ground yourself in some level of as good as I am, I need feedback. As good as I am, I need to be accountable. As good as I am, I need to be coachable. And those things, I think are very important. And honestly, he's got to do the most work of anybody of doing that because every other person in the organization has to be constantly aware of, if I piss him off, I could be responsible for him leaving.

25:33And if he leaves, I get fired in my life's over. Yeah, I get traded or I get cut. And that's really scary. Like it, it creates this divide. Joker can't just be like another dude. He's Nicola. And that fundamentally changes the way that the people that he works with daily, yeah, interact with him. And for me, I think the big thing is creating an environment where he feels like he can ask for that accountability for the he can go and be like, what can I do better? And feel like he can get answers that he respects and that will help him while also being like, what do I need to do? And it's like, look, I am never going to ask that Nicola be giving a bravado-laced sound bite filled interviews. They don't need that. And I'm not going to ask honestly that he's like giving a raw raw speech about we could do that. That's not going to work either. But I do think that if he's going to lead by example, he's got to lead with a certain level of joy and inclusiveness that brings everybody up.

26:38And that's he's going to be putting a position to do that. Yeah, I agree. All right, coming up. We'll hit on this never need a president of basketball operations. And I want to know from Swipe, what team Nuggets fans hate the most right now. I'm very obsessed with this question. We'll talk about that coming up on lot on. The problem of finding clothes that you can live it all day, be comfortable and do whatever you need to do. Whether it's just chilling, go into meetings, playing golf, being on the move. That problem has been solved by Kozirth. The everyday polo is the answer. It's lightweight, built to move with you, just easy to wear wherever I've got it on right now. And it's fabulous. Plus the Kozirth essential socks. They're exactly what the name suggests. Soft, supportive, comfortable enough that you stop thinking about them halfway through the day. Plus Kozirth backs everything with a 10 year warranty and hassle free returns.

27:39So if something isn't quite right, you're covered. That makes trying them for yourself an easy decision. I've got the Kozirth everyday polo in blue and in black. Check them out at Kozirth.com. Use the code locked on for 20% off. That's right. Locked on for an exclusive 20% off. And if you see a post purchase survey, please mention you heard about it right here. Kozirth.com. Back here in locked on nuggets. Appreciate you guys being with us. I hope you guys have a great weekend. Enjoy the start of the NFL season. If you watch that, enjoy college football. If you enjoy that, what's the stuff going on this weekend? What's up? You want to say something? We'll have been able to watch college football comfortably for several years now. So I'm not the question I used to. Do you watch college football? Yes, I do. I like it. I'm not hard. Yes. Yes. Okay. Yeah. Did you see Kansas?

28:39Oh my gosh. That was beautiful. I mean, that was a lot. We're talking about it in the discord. Just I would just say I do not approve of making these sports rival reasons. You know, some 21 year old intern was like, you know what? I could cook up. You know, I can do brown. John Brown. Yeah. That's, you know, I just, you know, I think about the Missouri students. And that's anyway. I always want to make this, I'm going to keep making this point. This is one of these these subjects that I'm going to hit on from time to time. So if you listen to me talk about this before, I get it. I do want to get swipers thought though. My opinion is why is that the nuggets need not should have need a president of basketball. 100% no question. I look at soccer. I look at Joe over with the avalanche. I look at what the RAM situation has doesn't make sense. And well, it makes sense from the perspective of there is, I will say there is a misnomer

29:43that Josh isn't like is as involved with the nuggets as he is with the other teams. And that is inaccurate. Josh Pranky's more involved with the nuggets than he is with other teams. I think that's the that's the issue though. And he cares. And that's good. You want your owner to care. Yeah. And you want him to empower good people. And this is not about John Wallace and Ben Tenser. I don't I don't have any issue with the job that John Wallace and Ben Tenser have done so far. Like I do not have an issue with any of the moves that have been made. Yeah. We'll see what happens this year and how this works out. We'll see like a lot of this is like, we'll see where they're at in a year. I just think that both from a messaging standpoint from an organizational standpoint. And just from a leadership standpoint, I think they need an experience president of basketball. Not even a question. I don't think that booth Malone situation turns into what it is if there was an experienced person in that role. But I also think that's a beauty. That's a pretty big red flag. If that happened in Stan was the owner and somebody he hired allowed it to happen, you think there was still have a job?

30:45No, but that's what privilege for you. You get to make big mistakes at will and then be like, you know what, I'll be better moving forward. And I think some of this is Josh is also a basketball dude. Yeah. I think there's also a part of this because of relationships, because of his knowledge, because of his love and a fit and deep for the game. I think he feels like he can serve that role better than somebody else could. So there's probably some of that to it. But again, there's a whole, there's a whole system that exists with Stan and Josh as it is. So like, that's a very convoluted even discussion amongst itself. So maybe Josh is doing a phenomenal job, but I guess the question I would throw back at you, Matt, is Josh the best person for that job while Stan is also who Stan is? That's a good question. That's a good question. And I think the answer is no. I think you need another voice in the room. I think I just think from a number standpoint, if you're trying to convince Stan Kronkie to do something, specifically spend money on something, I think you need another voice that Stan Kronkie respects to be able to be like, we really need this.

31:46Like, this is a good time to do this. It's got to be somebody that stands respects and trusts. But if it's, if it's Josh and that person, I think you have a, better chance of getting it done. The other thing is just like, I think messaging is very difficult as an organization. And there's certain people within KSE whose job it kind of is to be those people. And that those are the people that I think have too many hats. And they can't do that. And so John Wallace and Ben Tenser are working on the locker room, player relations, scouting the processes of running a basketball team. You need somebody at the top who's managing the situation. And I think that that's really something that needs to happen. I want to ask you, because I think about this. Right now, I'll ask you and then I'll ask for what you think about Nuggets fans. Do you hit the Lakers, the Thunder, or the Wolves?

32:48Nuggets fans? Yeah. Oh, it's got to be the Lakers. It's not even a question. I mean, how old are you? It'll just always be. So I am asking here, but because I think I think there are times when like regional or like different rivalries will pop in terms of heat at a certain time. Like Lakers and Celtics are always going to hate each other the most. But like six or Celtics, Celtics, Celtics, Celtics, Nicks, those Celtics heat. There's a lot of bad blood there. Like those things will pop. They'll never be Celtics. Lakers, but I don't think Nuggets Lakers is that either. It's what the issue is that Thunder think is so new. Like it's not really a beef either. It's like those fan base just don't like each other because like, but nobody likes to thunder outside of the thunder. So that's like not unique to Denver. Like Denver doesn't have any real beef with them. I mean, I think that there's like a, what I get from the discord, lots of nuggets are supercast.com.

33:50And Twitter is like, there is like a real like, no, no, like I hate O.K.C. Sure. And it's more than the wolves, which I think is interesting given that Minnesota has knocked them out twice. I mean, I thought people think the wolves are more ethical. For sure. And is, you know, I think a favorite for Denver fans personally. Yeah, it's the kind of thing that the wolves are actually good in the thunder or just like Greed. Well, they're gimmicky. The thunder are very gimmicky. Like they're like they're grifters that I'm not saying this, but the idea is that they're grifters that get away with like bullying and physical fouling all the time. As long as I'm trying to. I didn't know you felt that way, Matt. But yeah, I think that like when you look at the thunder, I just think the way they play. And I think even for you as a visual person, there's a difference between like what happens in those games and what happens in the O.K.C. games between the two. Zima says thunder and wolves are sharing first place.

34:52Yeah. It could be. But I just maybe people weren't there for those Laker Nuggets years. Like the Lakers were also. 2009, 2011. 12. Well, you can even go back to the 80s though. Remember when we had the injuries and they were playing the Lakers in the conference finals. Not at like this has been going on for decades. You know, and then the Lakers were sucky. Got shack out of nowhere and then they were sucky and they got Kobe. And then the Nuggets started getting good. And then there was Kobe. Right. And then there was the stuff that happened after that. So remember, like the Nuggets had never beat the Lakers in the series. You know, up until 2023. So this was like, it's weird that Denver and Utah have never been good at the same time. Well, 2000 and the Darren Williams, Kerlinco days, they they they were both good. But Denver was better than that Utah. Remember Paul Milsa was on that team. Remember, Carmelo dunked on Paul Milsa out the open up the season in Denver.

35:55That was the one handed steel pound dribble. And that's when you know, Melo became like. Hi, I was as the Lakers said we're no rivalry to them. Of course not. Their only rival is the Celtics. That's it. Yeah, Lakers just generally do not think that they have a West, a Western conference rivalry at all. I'm sure. And like you can't really you can't really argue with them because they're blessed by the basketball god. Slash the league. Yeah, I mean, it'd be great to have like titles from the 1950s and 60s. I actually think this is a really good question, right? Is like, the Lakers would go to the top of the list of the Nuggets, face them in the playoff series. Incidentally, like they would be reignited like that. And you know, yeah. But like there's a lot of teams in the Western conference that you could face and it wouldn't. Like if you faced the spurs, it wouldn't be like that. Right. Easy. Right. You got face them. It was a couple times you do start to hate them. Which I think is interesting though because like New York, I think really hates the spurs now. The New York does you think? Mm-hmm. They really hated Wembee.

36:55Well, Wembee was doing some stuff in that series to be fair. Yeah, but I mean, they were also just like, they thought they were entitled to the title because they're New York. This spurs were? Yeah, or the next word. Because like, well, even like Phoenix, I think I think Phoenix was on its way to be in a rivalry. After we had a size of four. We have people that still hold it against people for being on that team. Like certain people dislike members of their own team because they were on that member was on that Sunstein. There's people that don't like Cam Johnson because they because he was on that Sunstein. You mean fans of the team that don't like Cam Johnson? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. At least one. Okay, hope you guys have had a great week. Hope you guys have a great weekend. I'll be back with you on Sunday night. Ryan's back next Tuesday for No Jinks. I'll be with you on Sunday night. Swipe, I'll be with you on Monday. Hope you guys have a great weekend. We'll see you on Sunday night. Back here.

37:56Enjoying swipe up what? Yeah, on on. Show name. Oh, you want the actual plug. Okay, you can catch swipe up on players' choice. No, it's our show. Our show. What's the lockdown? No, lockdown. Locked on Rikasa Trends. Yes. Yes. Thank you. See you guys later. Next time on locked on Rikasa Trends. It's nice. Redisense. The Redisense Rikasa Trends. The ambidextrous Redisense. Thank you for making Locked on your first listen every day. For your second listen, find the Locked on NBA podcast where there's no off season. West Matt and Hayes keep you up to date on contract negotiations, rumors and everything you need to be the most informed NBA fan. Find Locked on NBA on YouTube or wherever you listen to podcasts. Part of the Locked on Podcast Network. Your team every day.