How to Make Headway Discipling Your Children - Discipleship for Dads

0:00Brothers, please join us this October in beautiful Colorado for more info go to generations.org slash shepherds that's generations.org slash shepherds Welcome friends to generations kevin swanson with you and today another segment of discipleship for dads with thoughts from Bill roach and Danny crate And yours true the kevin swans a couple of Homeschooling dads in studio and a homeschooling grandfather. That's right. Three-year homeschool grandfathers. Yeah, and Yes, one homeschool dad is going to be a homeschool of grandfather someday God willing all right So now today we're going to talk about something pretty basic how to disciple your children And this question comes from an email and by the way you can email us at mailagenerations.org for any kind of inputs questions etc Hello, I was curious on if you could guys could do a podcast and practical ways to disciple your children I have six boys ranging from 13 years to two years old 13 10 8 6 4 and 2 wow

1:04That's a while. I'm going for a discipleship book with my oldest son now We have family Bible time at night We have just moved traveling for my work and are going to start trying to go to church this week in the area We are in now it just seems like we are not making much headway a passing on the faith to our children Which is concerning for me. I would like more ideas or advice and guidance on what this looks like on a practical level So great question here and I want to get to the real Basics and the practical advice that we can help this guy with now obviously we can go on for five hours on this But let's get down to some core issues First and foremost, let's remember that it's all in the hands of God. It's a hundred percent God But God does Give us something and that is to disciple our children to teach our children God's word as we sit in the houses We walk by the way as we rise up as we lie down So there are obligations placed upon us in the word if he's in 64 Deuteronomy 6.7 So we've got these Inmonitions from God to be faithful in this area. So so what is it? What does this look like? How do we do this?

2:08Now as I see it Deuteronomy 6.7 is both Something that's prepared as we sit in our house sort of more of an official time where we're sitting together and Doing this we're bringing the word of God in but it's also this ex-temperanius element Where it happens as we walk by the way so there's the ex-temperanius and more of an official prepared Kind of daily exercise that we're doing in family worship So I see it as both so just starting with God's word This morning, which is our authority for this area of discipling our children We we want to start with bringing the word of God to our children on a daily basis And it's got to be integrated throughout the day So I'll just put that on the table Todd, what do you think? What's the what's the thing that That has been most helpful for you? Let's let's start practically here I mean, I do think Deuteronomy 6 is is a helpful guide as I think about our question here I mean this this gentleman has six children six boys. That's a lot like like our we can't look to the world or

3:12Programs or systems. They're actually not designed to have that That's a lot of children right the average whatever 1.9 children in America's like the app So we do need to go to the word of God more more importantly and see what what does God have for me to Disciple to raise these children obviously from Deuteronomy 6 we get the walking with the walking alongside there is an aspect of Teaching communicating that but there's definitely a very hands-on approach. It seems like it's a doing with It's not just instructing and then go out and you know, hope that goes well for you It's it's a very side-by-side and the big thing today that I think probably all dads need to recognize is It's it's it doesn't come out and say it but it's time It's going to be time invested and it's going to mean time sacrifices from other things and how are we going to invest that as dad? I think large families are particularly challenging I mean, there's a reason why the world doesn't want to have children It's because it takes sacrifice to have children. Yeah, and if you have two children

4:13And then you go to four and you go to sex you're going to sacrifice more It's almost like every time you have a new child you have to sit down with your wife and say okay What how am I going to change my schedule now at dad because I have another child that I need that needs me one-on-one and so You're sacrificed. I mean a large family is a tremendous blessing But it's going to be a tremendous sacrifice. What will you have to sacrifice specifically? What are the things you have to start? I mean your golf game. Sure. You're me time You know, it's always it's always the the stuff that you feel like you have to have for for yourself But yeah, it's the golf. It's the hobbies But I think it's and Danny you've mentioned this integrating your children into what you know, yes You can keep your hobby of building things. You're integrating your sons with you Yes No, that's important because a lot a lot of dads think oh, I can't do anything now I've just got to sit in front of the Bible with them 24 hours of well. Yeah, that's part of it But just keep doing what you're doing and bring your your children along and yeah, I mean with eight children

5:16It's hard to get the one-on-one time you still want the one-on-one time But you know, I had to I've had to do a lot of things in pairs, you know Well, I can take two children and do that and that's so sweet and there's a sweetness about that But we have to get we have to think what God would have us to do Yeah, and I I Effectively quit my corporate job was at 27 years ago and And worked with check for a while Christian Hometica's a Colorado and I thought for that and brought my son with me I mean, that was a big part of why I quit my corporate job because I wanted to integrate my son first and foremost into my life And I kept asking myself the question is there a reason why my son cannot go with me Remember I had this opportunity to sort of sell a book to a major publisher and I stopped off at my house and my son said hey dad kind of come with you And I thought I don't know he's nine years old, you know, in this important interview I'm not sure exactly I want him with me at this interview But at the end of the day, I said no, no, I think you should come with me. I think it's a big great opportunity for you

6:19And and yeah, you sat through the whole thing the so-tale room as I sold this concept to this publisher And we drove off he said dad. I think you did a pretty good job There was a couple of areas where I think I would have done it differently. We had all those conversations We would be together for hours upon hours and I think that that did make a difference for him You know, it's thinking about my upbringing and I can remember a few lessons from my dad in terms of like specific teaching moments I can remember, you know, conversations about the path of wisdom the path of the foolish specific exhortations here and there But I remember a whole lot of Watching my dad go over to Russia and work with Russian orphans at age 50 I remember a whole lot of him sacrificing to minister to homeschool families in Washington state I so much of what I remember about my discipleship are the things that we did together as a family To work to serve the Lord and I think that

7:20I mean they say you know more is caught than taught and And and those lessons are the lessons that stick out in my mind Yeah, I'm same thing for me raised on the mission field in Japan again sacrifice is a big part of this I think we have to ask ourselves what are we willing to sacrifice for Jesus now that applies to every follower of Jesus on earth and But within the context of the family as a father and a husband I think we need to ask that question not just what are we sacrificing for our kids But what are we sacrificing for the Lord Jesus Christ in discipling these little ones for him and my dad was willing to sacrifice He gave up pretty much everything to go to the mission field. We were extremely poor But my dad prioritized his family over all things. I mean always the family over the ministry So we were with him, you know 6 724s Constantly my dad had us integrated into every part of that ministry work But the two things that I think my dad did that were most effective was that my dad was was consistent with a family worship

8:21Consistent just very consistent. He had a consistency about Just that 40 minutes in the morning and family worship six days a week and then faithful church attendance morning and evening service And that steadiness that consistency was really big my dad was humble I think that humility is what marked my parents You know looking back and thinking you know Maybe as a child he didn't recognize it But looking back after all these years. I'd say the characteristic that was most Important and significant for our family was the humility of my mom and dad my mom was a prayer warrior Constant prayer and still is to this day hours per day For family for children grandchildren great grandchildren So I think those are the sorts of things that made a difference in our lives now six children serving God In various capacities around the world today So and I think you know when you have a lot of children especially you have to create systems Just you have to On things you're going to do every day when you prioritize something you create a system so that you're you're in a rhythm of doing it

9:25But there's also then the danger of relying upon the system To be the the salvation and that boy. It's a hard balance between them because you know You do need that every morning at seven 20 come out and read the word of God your children need to see that But but at the same time you're not relying on all these systems to do the saving it's you're you're you're you're asking God to do the saving So create systems, but don't rely on the systems to do all the work for you At root of faith in love at root faith in love. I mean, it's the faith of a father matters and You know the faith is exhibited in prayer. It's coming to Jesus bring your children to Jesus right But all in faith you know looking to Jesus the author and the finisher and relying upon God to do the increase we have to be faithful farmers I think the farming analogy really works for a couple of reasons one Is that you pretty much have to farm for 18 years before you see it the increase. That's one

10:26Two is that you know Farmers can't guarantee an outcome, right? You know what I'm saying you get you're gonna get a bad years Not in a frame, etc So I think the farming analogy really works in that you're planting seeds watering the seeds over 18 years Just this humble consistent Word they work on yeah, but looking to Jesus looking to God to bring forth the increase right? I mean increase is a hundred percent in his hands And so that that's one way we we avoid the recipe oriented if I just do this I will be sure to yield this kind of an increase the thing the second thing is love I mean just to love God and to love our children Deuteronomy 64 begins with love God with your heart so minded strength And then the the word of God is is dwelling in the heart and that results in this sort of natural sharing of the word of God As we sit in the house as we integrate it into every aspect of our children's lives

11:29So I know I was thinking as I was we're driving in here that this love for God and love for your children is key if you don't love God Then then you're just mechanical. It's just a mechanical thing. Yeah, and and it's just you know It's just not going to work that you put your kids first In not God first and that's going to be a disaster But if that's don't love their kids the kids will figure that out pretty quick So so not loving God putting your children above God or putting yourself above God is not going to yield any good fruit I mean there are exceptions obviously, but God will do some things in our lives in the lives of our children But also our children need to know that that we love God number one and that we love them And I think those are the two basic questions to ask first before you get into all of the discipleship stuff I mean, I mean maybe the first question is how how's your relationship with God? You know how's your God-wordness? Yeah, because we are examples to our children

12:33They're watching closely when we don't even think about it. You know how to start there And then I would go to how's your marriage? I mean, you know, we have to have these building blocks first. I know we we do tend to kind of jump to I got a disciple my children. Amen. And we do need but these are the found how do I do I love God? How's my My spiritual connection to God my devotion to God how's my personal holiness how's it my growing and then how's my merit right Marriage it's very very important and then we can go let's go to other things like we have to have these in the right order Thinking in terms of a relationship with you know with Jesus relationship with our wives a relationship with the body of Christ and our relationship with our children It's interesting how relationships can grow warm and then they grow cold And it's just you know that happens right. Oh, yeah, and so if we ask ourselves where's my heart? Where's my relationship with Jesus right now? Yeah, and where's my relationship with the body of Christ right now

13:35Because your relationship with the body of Christ is a lot to do with your relationship with Christ himself And so as your heart grows harder towards the brothers and sisters in the normal church Oh, your heart grows harder towards your wife. I bet your kids figure that part out. Oh, that's a question Yeah, I mean, you know Right from the beginning of time Adam and Eve had a very warm Relationship with God. Oh, yeah from the beginning and sin came in But what did they do? Yeah, they hid yeah, they didn't want to admit that they did something wrong And then then the distance happened and the relationship got broken and the same thing happens with his foster children Maybe if we think of passing on the faith to our kids. It's just propositional They're going to believe certain things and they're going to do certain things. That's a real pitfall But what we're after is a relational idea of passing on the faith. It's covenantal in in which we see ourselves Connected to Christ. We see our family is connected to Christ Relationally, we see ourselves connected to the body of Christ and passing on the faith is to see our kids in Christ

14:40In our family and in our church So Danny you were talking offline the discipleship cannot be just the 40 minutes or the 30 minutes in family worship now That's kind of core. Yes, because we're starting in the word on a given day and you do that What else is involved in this discipleship? You know piggybacking off of what Todd was saying if I want my kids to be disciples I have to ask myself in my disciple And I think one of the sweetest things in parenting is being a disciple of Jesus alongside your children. Yes And that's how I like to think about discipleship conversations with my kids, you know I have these conversations with Katie right now She's you know kind of the the the type A has it together oldest child But man, you know, she she she has her daddy's pride And so that's the conversation. I say Katie. I see this in your in your the way you're treating your siblings But and you have your dad to thank for this. Okay. I'm sorry I'm sorry for the way that I've exemplified this

15:42But here's how God is discipling me. Here's what he's teaching me and and here's what his truth says for you and me together And that that is so sweet. I love that. I love these Opportunities to come alongside and sit at the feet of Jesus together with my children I think it's it you mean you say the word of God is a basic you that 40 minutes. That's the mirror What do you do with them with that? What do you do when you see yourself in the mirror if it doesn't lead to confession on a daily basis then Then the 40 minutes is almost I don't want to say useless, but it's not doing what it ought to do I want to tell you guys just something happened to me Last week I was at a restaurant with a client and then I could see but I you know, sometimes you're at a restaurant You see somebody at the table next to and it was this 17-year-old Lady, I mean, you know and her and her father clearly but I mean You know and you observe you typically 17-year-old daughters, you know I don't know what their relationships like with their dad, but wow she was just going on

16:44And the dad was like and they were smiling and she's just talking and talking and he's listening and he's not saying much Exactly and I thought that man has invested in that relationship. I mean the trust he has built she On she just I trusted him so much. She's like oh daddy and this and she would just going oh my friend told me this and he's just listen I mean the investment over 17 years is obvious. That doesn't just show up. No, it's absolutely not absolutely not and I imagine that wasn't just cultivated in Discipline and corrective Absolutely, no, they've been going on dates together. Yes, for years All of these building blocks of positive serving interactions working. Yes, ministering together. You know, I could tell that together that man Listened slow down and listen and I go I was convicted. I go do I do that very well You know, so it's amazing. I'm growing in the one-on-one. I'm growing. You know, I'm getting better. I'm getting better at it

17:48But you guys are in the middle of this. Yeah, you've got five children Yeah, I might is it seven or eight well, I have eight children eight. That was it six are at home still Still a lot. How do you do the one-on-ones because Bill you said one-on-one is critical One of the greatest challenges we have as Christian parents is to pass on the faith to our children not just in theory But through the living and active word of God That's why we've created teach me the faith. It's a brand new podcast from generations And it's based on our scripture memory catechism helping children learn who God is What he has done and how to walk in his ways one question one verse and one simple episode at a time It's sure it's clear and it's meant to be done together as a family on the way to school around the dinner table or before bed So start listening today at teach me the faith calm. That's teach me the faith calm

18:53I believe so but so how do you do it? Let's hear these guys Eight children with five children. How do you do this? You know, I've done a variety of things I have taken my daughters out you know for lunch or something I mean that's more more maybe more customary But I think it is sometimes you know We'll try to do a lot of things as a family like we'll do these little work projects or landscaping projects And that's all part of it But there does need to be a time where you pull them aside because particularly the big family Some children kind of get lost in the mix and go yeah Well, I'm here part of the covenant thing and that's wonderful But does does dad and mom know me do they know me and because God each has made each child different We we have to know the differences So that we can minister and disciple them and love them Accordingly we I think there was a program. We talked about correct correcting children Well, it depends on the child, you know how how you're going to same thing with when they're When they're launched in the life. How do you do you know them? So there is one-on-one

19:53I said, you know with eight children I've done a lot in pairs You know, I would I would do things in pairs just because yeah finding the time for all the one-on-one is important But it looks different. I mean it could be as simple. I mean you'd be amazed in a 30-minute walk Go for a walk with a daughter There's you'd be amazed what can happen in 30 minutes and you know, it just being open and sharing But with sons it might be let's go do something together with let's go work together And it might be let's let's go out and talk So I think a variety of things is is is helpful and good but just committing to it Investing in it being intentional about it, you know putting it on the calendar my wife's good at reminding me like Yeah, I think you need to spend a little time with this child and it's like you're right. I do What about doing projects together? Yeah, we made the decision to finish our basement recently and one of the things we talked about was Okay, dad doesn't have a lot of margin is this the sort of thing that is going to take away from the kids or add to the kids And we concluded that our kids are at an age where they can be

20:54Involved in in this and so yeah last Saturday we were Grind and down concrete floors prepare for laminate flooring. We were doing plumbing and and Jed and Katie were there Along with for the ride. So yeah, I think that's a real opportunity The other thing though is just the moments. Uh, I think affirmation just small opportunities Hey Jed, I saw how you did the the dishes at dinner time That was really good. Just even that little I see you I recognize what God is doing in your life Helps with those one-on-one connections as well one last practical thing that we I don't think this has been a strong suit for me, but I'm growing We started doing and some of you are probably like while Danny you're a real underachiever, but we're doing Tuesday night daddy dates And it's literally 45 minutes with one child once a week. That's wonderful And that's not a lot. I admit, but it's it's more than we were doing sure I know dad who does 30 minutes with each of his eight children every week. I'm not there

21:57But my kids Know when it's their daddy date that way man By the way, I missed it for session meeting But and he was a little downcast, but it's a little something that has been helpful And then that's great. That's wonderful. Yeah, I think the day I did it on Saturday morning when my children were small I took one of them out each Saturday morning and We would I didn't have any money So we would do banana and peanut butter sandwiches. I would make those Those are either early that morning or the night before and we would go out and then When they were like seven or eight years old I'd take them into a parking lot an empty parking lot and let them drive My last one boy they they just love that. Yeah, yeah, go ahead. I was just saying we do ours at home You know, so it's very low budget. We share one sparkling drink. Okay, and that's your date. That's our date Yeah, so we go into a bedroom upstairs. We play kevoblocks or talk It's at home. It's it costs us about 80 cents

23:01Food A big thing switch for me when I thought about these projects and I thought Any project I have to do I want to know how to integrate my children to it Sort of like I don't want to do my product this project unless they can be part of it Sure, and that was a big shift for me and to where even there were some projects were like Ah, I think I'm just gonna hire this out because if they can't be like concrete You know, I mean if they can't be involved. I'm not really interested in it. I want to do this I want I want every opportunity. I want to live life together. Let's talk about the church I look at the church is important All right That's a it's a vital element of our lives I know our our family-based ministries are interested in the reforming of the family But if the church doesn't play a part that's an issue that isn't issue how do our children get saved Well Romans 10 it has got to have something to say about that

24:02How shall they call on him in whom they have not believed how should they believe in him of whom they have not heard How should he hear without a preacher And I believe that ties into the church There is something about the preaching of the word of God that has an influence upon the hearts and minds of people of children And this is one of the primary means God uses by which to bring about the salvation of his people right and And I know there's a lot of families out there going actually we don't need the church. We're actually doing just fine But but I would argue that The church is important right the church is Jesus's body right the church is the means by which our children will be saved Generally speaking some of it Kevin is a pushback against Like the church in the 90s for that I went to was was grabbing the children You know as soon as we walked in the door everybody just split off right and you know even in church You weren't worshipping together. They had junior church

25:03That's not true right so not really what the Bible intends to be happening right in the church They were trying to help you with your children, but it was kind of the wrong direction because you're making the point They need to be hearing the preaching they do in there from from the preacher Absolutely one of the things every Sunday one of the questions my wife and I asked early on was When our children are launched, you know, where that being to marriage or something What are they going to say about the church? Like the church is important to me or the church is kind of a like cherry on top But you know what what was their view and I remember um, you know It's a good thing to ask your children too. What's important to you in a spouse as you approach marriage Are they going to say I I want a spouse that loves the church of Jesus Christ, you know I mean as I mean these are these are the things we were thinking through But of course you can't manufacture that like we talked you can't just force that in but how do you do it? Well, you love the church dad you love the church and church can be hard right churches aren't perfect

26:08All of that but how do you walk through that faithfully knowing that this is what God has for us This is the body of Christ we're to lean into right and a faithful church is a basically a church that teaches the word of God There's church discipline. There's accountability going on in the body They love one another. Mm-hmm. We've learned how to work our way through conflicts. Forgive one another Right and In the preaching the word of God is there We're equipping and also discipleship. I would I would put in discipleship as a major portion of what the church does I like to say it's the second time of the two two four two thing Um, yeah four one and two as you preach the word in season out of season right but two two secondly two Is that faith there's a discipleship of the young men? Mm-hmm by the pastors in the church. Yeah To prepare these 18 to 28 year olds to be the future fathers pastors elders in the next generation So that they will continue this process this replicating process of building the church of the Lord Jesus Christ generation upon generation

27:11So so if your church is not preaching the word of God and is not Discipling the young men in the church then I think we're off center on the two most important things That the pastoral pistols. I mean if we're gonna trust God's word if I trust Paul or trust Jesus with this Um evidently whatever second to me two two and four two is saying to the pastors has got to be important And so so the discipleship of the young men. I'm talking about the 18 to 28 year olds To prepare them to be the future pastors and fathers and husbands in the church for I would say, you know next gen church is crucial. It's just gotta be happening and and in terms of this the context of this I Dad's I would encourage you to Serve the church with your family with your children Um, I talked to a lot of families and you know, they're they're doing a lot of things. Amen for that You know, well, we had to go to swim lessons and and we had to set up the garden and we had to do and like

28:15But we just see you on Sundays. I mean, but how about let's set some of those things down and figure out how's a family How can we serve the church be integrated the church that will definitely shape your whole families view of the church some ways to do that Todd. I mean, just threw out some proud things here. Well, um, I mean first of all, there's the local church and then there's the the wider church of Jesus Christ I mean, you know, I always thought about that when my when my children were little like, you know What are they getting there? I don't know six and under. What are we going to do? You know What what what can we do? But there's there's you know rest homes with widows out there that would do that for no Absolutely would just I mean all you got to do is show up And they're delighted to see anybody and my girls would play their violin and things like that But there's there's just just being there is a big part of it I mean, there's simple things you can do. I remember we'd go and pick the weeds out of the rocks at church You know, and there's always the fabulous lessons, you know from the word like working just Jesus picks the weeds out of our heart, too, and he replaces it with good things

29:18I mean, you can just go on and on so it doesn't it doesn't have to be complicated And I know some churches that don't have oh here's 50 ways you can serve the ministry Well, sometimes we need to think of think about remember your daughters bill would help with some of the the mothers in the church You're going through a period of struggle and they needed a little extra something on the side And we had to make sure that we created a culture where there was flexibility in our schedule for that to happen You know, they weren't off working at McDonald's at 16 or 17 Not that that's necessarily wrong But we had them home and there was lots of flexibility where they could literally go for two or three months at a time To do that work But I think we need a culture of warmth towards children in the church Right, this idea again a Ten in a mouth during the preaching or they're you know, there are distraction if there's a few babies crying Yeah, children will pick up whether or not they're welcome And I would challenge even pastors and and and deacons and and leaders in the church to have a warmth towards children

30:21You know that you when a child walks by you, you know, they're you're recognizing a child that you have interactions with With even small children and babies. What Jesus took them in his arms. He blessed them And of such as the kingdom of heaven So, you know, I think children should be members of the local church. I know that's controversial But would you find household membership throughout the New Testament? So this is not unusual Biblically speaking So let's just bring whole households in as members of the local churches And so they can consider themselves to be part of yes the visible body of Christ But that's okay. That's okay. Mm-hmm. You grew that Absolutely Very important. Yeah, yeah, that's very important because we don't we don't want to Segment we just don't want a segment and don't that's not what that's there's nowhere in the word You're gonna find that uh brother recently was Communicating to me this dynamic in some churches that he's been a part of where it's sort of the the job of

31:22The parents to see their kids through to their sort of conversion experience their public profession and their baptism and And then from there that's like the end point of discipleship almost Just beginning The baptism is the beginning of this like that's how you say a I think that's a map somewhere the bible, you know like a Matthew 28 Baptize them and then what? Teach and teach and teach and teach and teach and teach and teach and teach yeah But but maybe we need to guard against this idea that uh We're we're we're there's a point at which we stop daily calling our children to faith and repentance and this is our job As long as they're in our homes. We don't turn it over to the youth group We don't turn it over to other people fundamentally although we we absolutely believe in in mentorship from other godly men We continue uh to daily call our children to faith absolutely and it's a discipleship ministry And I think if if the if the family is seen as a discipleship center

32:25And the church is seen as a discipleship center. I think we're on track. I mean, this is the great commission So um, let's talk about areas in which we get in trouble. Okay mistakes that are made In the discipleship and we don't have much time left, but I'm gonna throw out a couple of them One is just the lack of consistency. I think is an issue Rhythm self-disciplined consistency, but always rooted in priority set by love And that's the that's the key your priorities will be set by your values your values Will be set by your affections the things that you love do you love God do you love the things of God do you love the church of God You know, that's gonna set the rhythm in the consistencies of your home I'm not talking about a discipline that is just military just get out there We just could go to church and it doesn't matter why and we don't really love God But we're gonna do it anyway kind of mentality. I'm not talking about that. I'm talking about loving God That results in a daily rhythm and a weekly rhythm

33:26So lack of consistency in the word over-controlling parents focusing on externals And I believe the externals are important. I'm not negating that But if that becomes the major deal the only deal we're in trouble. Yeah, so You know, what are the mistakes? I'm throwing a few on the table here. Somebody piggyback on this Here you hypocrisy Yeah, yeah, that's a big issue and and we've got to be confessing our sins I mean even to a very little child Dad confess your sin to a one-and-two-year-old if you discipline harshly or you pick them up harshly Look them in the eye and say I'm sorry My little one-year-old that can't even talk yet. It's right. I'd say I'm sorry That shouldn't have done that. They're gonna see it in your face. They're gonna see. Okay. This is a house That mistakes are made sin happens and then we confess it and then God's forgive that and heals it and we go on That you got to create that culture of confession and not being screwed actually the other one is is is work

34:31I mean too much of the world sees that children have to play play play and and I I think we have to teach our children how to work I mean life is difficult when when God brought Eve to Adam It wasn't for a playmate. It was for a help me. Yeah, right that there was there was a job to be done and and we needed He needed help and getting the job done. He needed to help her So we're teaching our children how to how to work and we're finding joy and in the work It's not like work is one thing and then play is the next thing You know you'd be grudgingly do all the chores and then you get to play for two hours Don't create that in your home. No, and I think you know dads need to example that. Yeah That you need to be a hard worker yourself Joy-work But but yeah, and and that is inspiring be inspire the dominion mandate really which is we get to go and liquid God's given us to do is go and do things for him right and and there yeah There needs to be obviously a joy and excitement about that but uh

35:34It's also celebrating a firming as you said those like look what we did we picked up that pile of trash Take a picture before take a picture after show it to mom I mean there's a lot of things we can do that that really would inspire that kind of that kind of love for work Hey, man, right. I think uh for me losing a sense of delight for my children Can be a real pitfall in the teaching or the discipleship I remember growing up father came to my my dad one time for some advice and he said hey Neil I'm losing the heart of my daughter. She's having crushes on movie actor She's never met before any advice and my dad wisely said Um To this man do you enjoy your kids do do do delight to be with them? He says that I love my wife. I love my kids, but enjoying my kids never really thought about that before And my dad said I think you should start there cultivate delight And I think that's just a reflection of the heavenly father-son relationship This is my beloved son and whom I'm well pleased and the son says back. I delight to do your will. Oh God

36:39So a may we cultivate that sense of I love you and I like being with you I remember what great Harris said train your children well enough so that you actually enjoy being with them Yeah, there's a couple of good resources that could be practical. I was thinking about this particular gentleman I think it's created for work and practical happiness. Is that Bob Shultz? Yeah. Yeah, those are sell those here Yeah, okay, those are really good. I mean particularly maybe for boys This gentleman has some boys, but just to help like kind of get you going on some of these ideas Those those references are really good So yeah, relationship Consistency discipline work. We've talked about a lot of good things here. The church is still important church hopping Be very careful. I think it's deadly. Yeah, I think it really eventually results in apostasy I just think that's if you're gonna positize with the faith if you're planning that trajectory for your kids Church hopping is a great way to do what you're teaching your children is when you run into a problem Just quit and go do something else right and if you do it with a church, they're gonna do it with their spouse

37:42Yeah, yeah, it's not gonna go well Attending a bad church and I do think you know, we need to think about this It is important to you know take the eight churches in the community sure as you're moving into a new community Okay, you got a new job in a new community. I've done these guys moved into a different community Yeah, churches and it does make a difference. I think you need to choose the right church God-centered church not a man-centered church and that talks about doctrine Are they really teaching the word of God? Is it a god-centered approach to worship to life To the teaching itself Is a superficial church? Is it a entertainment fest kind of church? Is it lacking the fear of God and real love for God These are important things and then the other thing is be careful with competing discipleships Oh, yeah, and sometimes I think we can do this almost inadvertently Well-meaning parents can sort of introduce their kids into a homeschool co-op or Introduce their kids into a youth group or a scenario in which they're actually getting the wrong kind of mentorships

38:45The wrong kind of discipleships from their peer group in the culture. So the kind of movies you watch and these sort are We've talked about these things before but I'm just saying these are the sorts of things that can get in the way Of our discipleships. So watch out for these things any last words as we wrap this thing up Just just generally what would you recommend for this this brother? Yeah, I think the biggest thing we took away here was Doing with doing with I mean we can teach you know work hard But work hard with alongside just it is the Deuteronomy 6 working alongside walking alongside Investing the time recognizing your you know dads. We're gonna have to set things down in life To pick this up and this is a very important car. Let me piggyback on that the scheduled versus Extemporaneous and I think what we're talking about here is the absolute integration Of your love for God and the love for the word of God and the word of God itself Into the life of ourselves and our family. It's the integration. It's to avoid we like to call the post it note

39:49Oh, here's a neat Bible verse You know kind of this meme Bible verse will start with the meme, but we don't live it. We don't walk in it It doesn't just show up in an integrated fashion right in the discipleship and you spoke to that just a little bit off air You know, we had a situation recently where I had my kids Doing scripture memory together in the morning and they're going through Ephesians 4 25 through through 32 The no corrupt word proceed out of your mouth be kind to one another and they're fighting About how to do the scripture memory together Hey, children. Let's let's say you're on a second Let's look at what you're saying. Let's apply. This will be a really good place to apply the verse This is why we do scripture memory. Isn't this great? Yeah, the God's word actually is useful. It applies to situations like this one right now And it was just this beautiful moment of like connecting the dots. I'll this is why dad is having us do this routine But it's not just 13 as you're saying. It's applying it to real life and one of the thank heaven just a

40:51piggyback on what you said the beginning about the sovereignty of God That shouldn't produce this sort of fatalism about our parenting. No, it's it actually produces a hopelessness because it's because God is sovereign that he's able to pull off his promises in our life And there are so many encouraging promises about what God does when Parents faithfully disciple their children as for me says the Lord This is my covenant with them my spirit who is upon you my awards which I put in your mouth She'll not depart from your mouth Nor from the mouth of your descendants nor from the mouth of your descendants Descendants says the Lord from this time forth and forever more and let's just wrap it up by saying let's be faithful farmers but hopeful farmers And grateful farms because already God has given us a great increase in our homes We know that and he's going to do even bigger things in the future and we can rely on the promises as we as we Engage the faithful cultivation of the word of God in our children's lives Men as we walk by the way as we rise up as we lie down. Right amen and amen. Okay. Well that wraps up this edition of generations

41:56Please email us any of your edition subtractions questions things that we need to be discussing in this Segment of DFD discipleship for dads and the emails male ed generations dot org This is Kevin Swanson along with Todd Strasser bill roach and any Craig inviting you back again next time as we continue to lay down a vision for the next generation This has been a production of the generations media network for more information go to generations dot org slash media Thanks for tuning in to generations radio if the conversations here have strengthened your biblical world view I want to invite you to take the next step with the resources at generations from curriculum to world view books to daily discipleship tools Everything we create is designed to help you apply the word of God to every area of life And today listeners can save 15% on any order with the code gen radio at checkout that's g-e-n-r-a-d-i-o

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