How AI Apps Are Transforming Smart Glasses for Blind Users & A New Audio Game for iPhone

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1:23Carlos Velocidad de datos moviles reduce, después de 20 guicas al mes. Big news for meta glasses winners, and a new blind racing game. This is double tap, we're blind people talk tap. Here's Steven Scott and Sean Grease. Ah, Sean Priest, how are you today? Happy Humpty, by the way, happy Humpty. What, sorry, what day? Why, they really do have a day for everything now, don't they? Ah, yes. Happy Wednesday to you, sir, you okay? I'm all right. I'm all right. It's Wednesdays, the middle of the week, so they call it the hump, you see, it's all downhill to the weekend. Oh, yes, sightment, all fun all the way down hill. Oh yeah, that's right, rather than uphill struggle. Yeah, no, that's right. Yeah, every day's a hump day for me, Steven Scott. I hate every day, so move on. Wow, enjoying your seven days a week on double tap, right? Oh, he's sleep-repeat. That's a double tap right here.

2:26Hey, listen, we have got quite a lot to get through today. We're going to be hearing about a new blind racing game. Well, you've been finding out about this. That's right. Yeah, a developer got in touch with us here at Double Tap to tell us about a game that he's developing that he needs your help listeners with developing. He wants your suggestions and feedback. This is Jamie Wallace, right? So this guy developed an application. You might remember us talking to Jamie a while ago, he developed an app called J-Key for making it easier to type on your iPhone. It was pretty well received, I remember rightly. I mean, it wasn't just around visual impairment. It was around physical disability as well, the reason he developed this, but he's since gone off and developed this blind racer game. I'm going to hear about that. I know lots of you are, if you can go online and I'm reading with someone else on one of the Facebook groups, whatever they're all talking about, different audio games. Very popular. I don't get it. Well, you don't get having fun, Stephen Scott. Of course. Yeah, Stephen Scott is not down to fun, apparently. I realize the only games in my life involve the NVDA progress bar

3:31going up and that little beep, beep, beep, beep. I love it when it's a slow progress. I kind of love the beep, beep, beep. I know. You know what I do. I like that. I like trying to, okay, this is going to be the last beep. Is that high pitched? This is 99% beep, beep, and I'm always wrong. It's always loose. Yeah, it's always higher to go. It's like, okay, that's fun. Why we really do need an accessible game. That's the welcome to Blind World. That's your games. That's your experience. Never mind Grand Theft Auto 6 or Call of Duty 12 or PlayStation 9. None of that for us blind folks. No, no, no, it's NVDA progress bars. Is that the final beep? Is that high enough to be fair? That might not be a blind thing. That might be a nerd thing. I remember watching the Northern disc deepfragger back in the day just for hours watching the red blocks move to the green blocks. Yeah. It's not wrong with us. Anyway. Oh, it's so funny. It really

4:33is, but yeah, we're going to hear from Jamie Wallace a bit later talking about that, but we are going to kick off with some, I kind of think this falls into this category. Oh, definitely. Okay, it does. Okay, it does. This is big news. And for those of you who wear, like I am waiting right now, my meta Rayban glasses in generation two, although they are a little bit waterlogged at the minute, that's the only problem. Yeah. Well, don't wear them under one. I mean, well, I live in Scotland. I'm permanently under water. If it doesn't rain in Scotland, you're five minutes away from it, starting. I guarantee you. It's either raining or about to. But to be fair, the meta glasses usually are pretty good. They, you know, they're not waterproof, but they are rain shower proof, I would say. No, no, no, not Scottish rain proof. They're not. I'm sorry. Mark Zuckerberg, if you're listening, but these are not Scottish weather proofs. I'm sorry. They don't deal very well with horizontal rain. That's the problem.

5:33Vertical rain, not a problem. Horizontal rain fine. Yeah. Awesome. I think I've, I think I've maybe, I mean, look, put it this way. One speaker is a little bit dodge. No. And when I say HEY meta to try and, you know, wake up the assistant, nothing. Yeah. Time for some new ones, Stephen's go on the sixth attempt holding my hand on a set, in a certain way, it kind of works. Works. 100% of the time, 60% of the time. Yeah. That's right. Absolutely. Well, look, for those of you who do have them, those of you who have not destroyed them, you'd be pleased to know that there are lots of cool features. Now, I did alluded to this when I was in Vienna that there's been some really cool developments going on. And I probably annoyed some of you a little bit by saying, yeah, there's things I've tried. And they're really cool. And especially I see some others saying the same. And it's like, you know, let's just get out in the open. Let's just talk about it. I don't have a mind. NDAs never minds contracts. Never mind any of that. Just let's talk about it. I don't know who this man is. I don't care about NDAs and contracts.

6:39Yeah. Three letters in my life. There's only three minute letters in my life. I care about AM and I. Oh, well done. God bless you, Mr. F. You are absolutely. I should see you are 10th year of life. You are absolutely right there. I'm seeing it all over the place on social media. You know, these sort of these cheeky little I'm using this at the moment. I can't tell you what it is, but I'm using this. And you know what? And we've talked about what's coming up on other platforms. I think it's only fair. We give people all the information that things are coming. Yeah. And look to be fair to be 100% transparent about it. We have reached out to some of these companies and they are very much keen for people to know what's coming. And it does feel a little bit like secret society at the minute. And I don't entirely know why. Partly, I believe because there's a lot of beta testing going on. There are groups of people who are testing out a lot of these features that are coming. And there's a real desire to get that right before it's announced or at least made public when it will be available. But I think we can actually

7:41talk about some of these companies because we know, for example, Microsoft are working on seeing AI. We know that is going to be coming to the glasses. Again, we don't know when. We don't have dates on any of this. The only company that's actually come forward and given any kind of indication of a date is Ira on the meta glasses. They've said end of March. They told that to our very own Shelley Brisbane. So, you know, I think we break some news there. But, you know, what again, with that caveat of that's what meta tell us. So, meta are clearly the decider on when this gate is opened officially to the public. Now, will it be available across all the borders as well? That's another question. I hope so. I can't see why not. But then there's lots of things with meta, I think. I understand why that wouldn't be available here, but it's not. So, we shall see. But what we can tell you, as I say, seeing AI from Microsoft, Ira, are going to be bringing their features to the glasses, to the meta glasses. At human wear, are working on some kind of AI-powered navigation. That sounds very

8:43interesting. We've not heard much from them on that since that conversation that we had with human wear last year. Not long to see. That's right. The actual device kit itself was announced. So, we know those companies are working on things. And many others as well, but specifically in our space, these are the kind of leaders at the minute. There's another couple I want to mention, two, that you may not know about that are coming to the glasses. One is scribe me. Now, not to be confused as Sean does every time we have this conversation. Every time. In every meeting we have, Sean says, I'm your solution. No, it's not. Because they have scribe. But this is scribe me. Now, this is another, you'd see Sean, another live AI assistant app, right? Which is kind of like scanning surroundings, being able to identify things. Yeah, absolutely. I mean, it's initial purpose. You could tell from its name, probably, is to make inaccessible PDFs, another document successful.

9:48But it also has now this live assistant feature, which is where the meta glasses come in. It becomes very interesting. It does. And one particular thing, which I must have been rather intrigued by. And this is something that scribe me has talked about quite publicly from the app perspective. And of course, this will then apply to the glasses as well is to be able to audio describe what's in front of you. Say, for example, a TV show. No, I haven't tried this yet. But that sounds very interesting to me. Because look, audio describing anything, anything's going in front of you. If it's a TV show in particular, that's quite challenging because I don't imagine, I don't know, but I don't imagine it's going to work around dialogue. It's not going to know when it can speak and when it can. So it's going to be pretty much telling you information on a constant basis. And is that something that helps when you're trying to watch a movie? It's sometimes hard enough to watch a movie with audio description, keeping up with what's going on,

10:50with the AD and everything else. If you've ever watched a movie with a fight scene in it and the AD is trying to keep up, it's almost impossible. It's like an attack on the ears. I mean, God love them for doing it. And they're putting as much information as possible. I can't really wish to just say these two guys just get into a fight and they go for it. You know, and that's it. Yeah, that's all I need to know. I can hear all the banks, mash, Kapau, Kaboom, etc. But I mean, that's a good example as a kid of I don't know how that would work in practice. I haven't tested this out. I'm not on the beta program. So I don't know, but I mean, it would be a great use. But you kind of think that's kind of what live AI. Let's just call it that as a sort of catch all term. That's what it does. Anyway, whatever happens in front of you, it describes right? So it shouldn't make any difference if you're watching a movie or walking down the street. But at the same time, as we all know, and as you mentioned there, when it comes to audio describing a TV show, it is different. There is certain things that you would want describing and certain things

11:50you wouldn't. So I don't know if that's down to prompting or what? That's very interesting. It is. I can't wait to try it. So that is now they did publish on Facebook just yesterday, I believe, that they were going to be launching on the glasses. They made a bit of splash about it. But you've not seen you've noticed that the website has no mention of it. So I don't know if they've maybe published information too early. We're back at the focus 640 situation again from Vespero. It's like, oh, someone's pushed same done that little bit of article deleted immediately. I saw it on Facebook. I saw in a few hours, we'll be available on the meta classes. Yeah, no, nothing. That was a couple of days ago, a few days ago. I was actually seeing a couple of hours. I didn't see that right. Yeah, that's fair. Yeah, I didn't double check that it's definitely from the scribe me people. Maybe it was. Yeah, well, definitely it was. Deva, you saw it as well. I've just been on the scribe me website and check the recent announcements. There's nothing mentioned in there. But as you said, all of these companies,

12:54they could have it ready to go, but they're perfectly happy with it, ready to go, but they've got to wait for an update to the meta AI app, which adds it to the accessibility wherever at the bottom. I'm assuming anyway. So it's not just on the company, they're waiting on meta as well. I'm sure. Yeah, we don't actually know yet how this is going to work, do we? In terms of, I suppose my thinking was, rather stupidly, I thought, no, I think about this. Would it be like some kind of lesser experience than be my eyes has? You know, be my eyes is in there. It's in the meta AI app. As an accessibility option, you connect through the meta AI app under be my eyes to the be my eyes app and then you essentially connect the account. So am I mixing this up? Is it basically going to be the same thing? Do we think? Yeah, we don't know. I'm assuming it will be. I think meta want total control here. And I think it will be you need to connect it through the meta AI app. As you do with be my eyes to

13:55let's in this example, scribe me. Currently, during testing, you don't have to do that during the beta stage. Like I said, I'm going to try it all of them, but I'm assuming the others are the same as well. Just downloading the app and it will connect to your meta glasses without anything being said in the meta AI app itself or even having to open the meta AI app. But I think that will change when it comes to official launch, I think meta will have, well, be the gatekeeper, basically, and you'll have to do it through there. I don't know for 100% that's why I'm assuming as well. It's a deeper connection than just a Bluetooth link. In the way that, for example, I don't know, your headphones work. They just connect and that's connected and that's it. It's a deeper connection. It would seem between meta and whatever app it might be, scribe me or whatever app it would be. Well, I don't even know if that is the case. I mean, because they're all doing this through the power of the new SDK, the software development kit that meta have made available. Now, I'm assuming that gives it easy access to the meta AI app itself.

14:58So it's definitely going through that I would have thought and not just connecting directly to the glasses. I could be wrong. I don't know. I just have this impression of my mind of all these apps that are going to be available through this SDK. I just imagine all these people who are sighted going through that app one day going, what's all this? What's all AI? What's this scribe me? What's all this? Well, blind people doing here. But to be fair, is it cool? I don't know, the meta AI app changes so often. There was a button connected apps or connected experience or whatever it was and you double tap in there and that's where you see Shazam and whatever else Apple Health and that's where you connect all those through party apps. So the accessibility rather than just being part of the menu, I think we'll have a sub menu. You'll have to go into it and tell me, be my eye, scribe me, I'm seeing AI and whatever else. Interesting, isn't it? Isn't it interesting? I know it's not the only apps and there are other ones. I think it was a golfing app or something I remember reading about. So there will be mainstream apps that will use

16:04this SDK, but it is interesting how many of them will be accessibility focused. I think that says all quite frankly, there's a story here. There's a real story to be told about the interest that the disability community has in these classes because it's not just blind people. I've seen some articles from people. One of them, a good friend of ours, Colin Hughes, who listens to the show and a very fantastic brilliant guy who talks about all kinds of stuff, relating to muscular dystrophy and other physical disabilities. And as Haz actually said, why are all these things loading up with apps for blind people at the time? What about other disabilities? I think that's a great question. There's a great question. I think there's a deeper question there about who's developing it, where these ideas are coming from. I think in some ways, the blind community has got these set technology requirements. And because they're so visual, the camera immediately lends itself to that. The camera becomes the eyes. So it kind of logically means that we do tend to think anything with a camera in it. How can we make that accessible?

17:08Yeah, of course. So yeah, I mean, absolutely could be the case that it's not just a camera for people who have got physical disabilities. It's the ability to do things hands-free. That's going to make the big difference. The more you can do with an Apple watch or your glasses on, hands-free, the camera will be important, but that's the lesser important part for you. Interesting isn't how we all can look at these glasses from a different perspective. We'll look at the different parts of it. It's like that's my bit, and that's your bit. Much like a sighted person may look at a pair of smart glasses, say, well, how on earth is a blind person going to make any use of that? I kind of look at other disabilities and think, okay, how are you going to make use of, basically, what we're talking about is having a camera and microphone and speakers that's in a certain place on our face that makes it ideal for us, the camera being getting the images described for us. But when you think of other disabilities, honestly, I'm thinking, well, what use would they be? And that, as you said, it comes down to those sort of disability organizations to say, hang on, this is what use they could be. This is

18:11how we could use this technology. I'm sure that will come about, be it for death, hard of hearing, or whatever it may be. Yeah, well, I mean, for people who've got even, maybe not so much deaf people, but people who are hard of hearing or people who have any issues, even mild to moderate hearing loss. That conversation focus mode is going to make a big difference to a lot of people. You know, that's a great feature, which I have yet to be able to, well, I've tried it once. I tried it once with Meta and Vienna. And that was, that was really interesting. We were in a very busy room. Now, it doesn't close off the sound. It doesn't cut anything away, but it really does. I mean, it really does give you focus with the person you're speaking to. I could hear them clearly. There was no lag. It wasn't like I was hitting them coming back to me twice. I had that once with the live listen feature with the airports. And I couldn't use it because what happens is the phone, you put the phone on the table, angle the microphone towards the person who's speaking, and then you wear your airports and you would listen to that person speak and you would hear them that way, which was great. But there was a lag. And so it was actually quite, you know, the active

19:19noise cancellation wasn't in those airports I had at the time. That'd been really useful at that point because you kind of wanted to just isolate and just hear back. But I think if you were doing that as someone who could see who had hearing difficulties, it might be like watching a movie with a sink is off. You know, exactly the point. Yeah. You're right. Well, it just doesn't feel right. About your experience using real-time translation, right? In Vienna. In theory, it sounds fantastic, but when it comes to practical use, once that lag gets involved in a conversation and you find yourself talking over each other or just, you know, the delay becoming so long, it's awkward. It's how it works in practice, really. We can do that without the need for any delay, you and I. We do it anyway. Or just, yeah, awkward silences. I'm quite happy with that. Can I ask a question? No. Fair enough. Okay, we ask it anyway. I don't care. I'm in that mood today. I don't care. Do you, when you're using your iPhone with voiceover and you use the metaglasses,

20:23when you want to do stuff on the phone, like really dig into, it might be sending messages, maybe it's an audio message and what's that? Maybe it's, you know, you want to quickly run through email or something or even take something. Do you keep your glasses on or do you switch the glasses off and just switch them off? Yes, the lag is unbearable. I'm doing that all the time. Now, I feel like I'm turning my glasses off more for voiceover than I was before. I don't know why that is. I think it's because I think it's that lag thing. The dictation thing is a nightmare because you double tap on the screen two fingers and it's like, it feels can age. And then you have your way for the beep. And then sometimes the beep comes and sometimes the beep doesn't, you think, is this the date? Is it working now? Hello, hello, and nothing's happening. To be fair, though, I mean, the whole point of the glass is it's a hands-free option, I think. You know, when I'm using the glasses, the phone is usually in my pocket anyway. I don't think wearing the glasses well, trying to type using the on-screen keyboard is sort of a use case that I

21:24think I don't really care about. Well, I want the moon on a stick. You want everything. You want like free Bluetooth connection while you're wearing the glasses. No, no, no, no. Here's what I want. I want the phone audio when I make a call, for example, to go through the glasses, but I want the audio from the voiceover to stay on the phone. Or at least the choice. Used to be able to change it with audio destination, but that doesn't even work anymore. I've had so many issues with that in the past. I don't know. I've never, I'm using audio routing to set to automatic. I don't even bother with that anymore. So, so that before anyone doesn't know, audio destination is an option in the rotor settings. So you can go into audio, you can add this in and what it does is it's supposed to theory if it works. I'll let you choose where the audio for voiceover comes from. So good example of this is if you connect to a Bluetooth speaker, this is what I think I love what they've done here with this apple. I don't know if this works in Android, never tried it, but when you connect to Bluetooth speaker, the the voiceover voice remains on the phone and the music, however, travels to the

22:27speaker. So it is possible, totally possible that it can happen. Well, try it. Stephen Scott, I haven't tried it. So I thought I was going to do something. Oh, I do apologize. Yes. So having you do the rotor gesture and so on. I just want to complain. I just want to complain. I don't use my glasses like that. I know everyone uses them differently, but I just I grabbed my glasses when I'm stepping out the door. That's it. They're permanently charging on the side. I just grab them when I'm going outside. I don't use them in the house. As I've mentioned many times before, I don't think the current implementation of the AI for reading things. I don't trust it. So what would I use it? Yeah. It's true. Well, you tell you. It's so true. Anyway. Yes. Subscribe me. But it's fairness. You do wear sunglasses. You do wear sunglasses all the time. That's the point. I do. So for me, they're always on, but you don't use all the time. And most people probably do it in fairness, but you know, I tend to keep them on. Well, you're a celebrity all the time. Yes.

23:28Well, it's because my life is still I mean, no, it isn't. I'll keep fine. I'll go with celebrity. Thank you. No, it isn't fair. Give me my secrets. I never used to wear sunglasses. Anyway, being an RPI, I was trying to cram as much. You wanted tons into into my eyeballs as possible. So you wore LED lights. Yes, I would. The rest of tubes. In my eyes, like stepping into heaven. Let's talk about one other app, which is coming to the meta glasses. And I think this is going to be one, which I think scribe me as well. I mean, and I haven't tried this app, but I have played with this one. And this is cold. And this might make you smile a little bit, because I call it U Ryan. Yes. And we certainly know our good friend from the archers also calls it U Ryan, because he is U Ryan. Officially, he is the U Ryan actually. I did pull. Yes. That's right. He's changed it. So yeah, this is an interesting app. This is another app, which allows you to identify objects around you. The design of this app is for indoor use, although we could potentially

24:33use outdoors, but ultimately it is for indoor. So it's that thing of where have I put my mug or where can I find my keys or whatever it might be. And it would be able to identify those objects for you and help you locate. Now imagine you could do that with your glasses. That's what's coming. Yes. No. I think we can see this. Oh, so did it. Let's see it. Right. So we've been playing with it. Oh, yes, we have. Oh, dear. Yes. Sorry. Yes. I have to say, I think this is going to change the game for a lot of people out there. I think if you've been in any way doubtful about meta AI, you're going to not care once you try something like this. I think you're going to be very impressed because I tried this in Vienna. This is the app I was telling you about. At the time, I was asked not to talk about it. And I respect that. But we're at a point where this is all about to become live. And I just want to wet your appetites, folks, because if you're thinking of buying

25:34the gigas or you're thinking of buying the envisions or whatever you're thinking of buying, you know, I just like you to know what the options are. I'm not saying ones better than the other. I don't know because I never tried the echo visions. They could be infinitely better in some ways than others. I think they are in some ways. Actually, there's certainly plus points for them. Ally solos. Yeah. Judy seems to be out on these ones. I think that's me being very delicate about that. And you know, the envisioned glasses themselves, the original Google glass is, I would say, end of the road. But absolutely. I mean, the end of life. It was in life in 2017. Let's be honest about it. Hardware is done. Envision have done an incredible job with the hardware. But I think that's probably as far as it wants to go. And there's also rumors flying around. But what's going to come next with the invasion? Who knows? All right. I mean, would it be a huge surprise if they dropped on the meta glasses? I don't know if they will. But would it be a huge surprise? I don't think so. No, not at all. I mean, you know, that's where everyone else needs to be heading right now. But yeah. So, you know, look, I think if you're looking for the options, I would say,

26:36are you looking for what is coming? What is the big deal? Well, you know, this is it. This is this is the beginnings of it. And bear in mind, this is just part one. All right. This is part one of a very long story. But look, tell me your experiences, because I've been playing around with the app. And we're actually going to play in, we've got some time. So we're going to play in a feature in a minute from Jeanine Stanley, because Jeanine last year, back in January last year, she sent as a demo of the app itself. So that'll give you an indication as to how the app actually works. It'll give you a chance to hear it. But we'll play that in a minute. But tell me your thoughts, Jean, because I know you've been playing with this. And I know you were you were at pains to tell me your thoughts. Okay. Yeah. Okay. Let me calm down. Before I say anything, we should say this is all beta, right? This all could change. But I've been using this. You mentioned about the Orion, its main selling point was the ability to train it on your own personal objects. Things around your house and it could locate them and it did it incredibly well. And we'll see a demo of that

27:36in a minute. But for me, has ever, what's my dream of using AI is going outside when I'm walking the dog every morning and not walking into a parked car on the sidewalk, falling over a trash can on the side, whatever it may be. So as soon as I was testing this out, I stepped out of the house and I simply said, tell me if there's any obstacles directly in front of me. And do you know what? It did. So that thing of being proactive, you mentioned being reactive or proactive the other day. And actually it's both. So I do want it to react to what's happening in front of me. But also you're preempt that as well. But as I'm walking, it's telling me the path in front of you is clear. The path in front of you is clear. There are some cars parked to your right. There are some cars parked to your left. There is a curb to your left. It's about four inches high. There is a slope on this road and it appears wet. Watch you don't slip. And as I'm doing this,

28:39I'm thinking, OK, this is cool. I still don't trust it. Right? Yeah, of course. So I've been using it for a few days and I now trust it to a degree. I mean, the left and right, OK, AI in general, has trouble with that. But I trust it. And every day I'm going out now, I'm turning that on straight away as long, along with voice vista, that is going on. And it has saved me a couple of times from walking into an unexpected parked car. And yeah, it's, it's exactly what I've been hoping for for a long time. Now, is it perfect? As I said, this is beta. But I am very much excited by this. Now, the beta part, let's be clear here, a lot of functionality that you're talking about already exists in the app. So we're not really telling you any state secrets here, right? I mean, this is, this is stuff that you can already do in the u-ray and app. Right? That's that's

29:43already there. Well, I mean, I've never used it in that, in that way before, haven't, you know, stepped out of the house, held the phone in front of me and tried the live assistant in that way. I've only ever used Orion previously to find, you know, the keys that I dropped or the teaspoon that I've dropped on the floor in the kitchen and I cannot find that. And to be clear, that's what the company are saying it's for. They're not suggesting at the moment that this would be used outdoors. So you're doing something with it. It's not really designed for not something they would even suggest you do with it. Well, they do. But it's interesting. It's doing well with it. That's the interesting. But yeah, I mean, that is the use case that a lot of people are going to use it for. The outdoor use, the obstacle detection. That's what everyone wants from these at the minute. And that will, that will, I think, differentiate. Is that the word I'm looking for? No, the various different apps like when seeing it, seeing AI comes along. I'm hoping that that is going to concentrate more on giving me a word-for-word verbatim OCR experience

30:46using the glasses, which I just cannot get from AI at the moment at all. So I think there are going to be things. These are just extensions of the apps themselves onto the glasses. What exactly is the hands-free experience of it? That's my point is that, yeah, you should get, it should be the same experience on the app. I mean, if there's more to it, that's great. But you know, at the very least, what I would want and what I'm looking forward to is the app experience so that I can say, for example, what are people you seeing AI for? The classic is opening up to see something's wrong with the computer. What's going on? Always performing another update of 8 million is 25% there. That's the stuff. Yeah, stuck it like that for three hours. And then it just, boom, it's done. But that's the stuff I want to know about. That's the instant stuff. You know, what is this food? What is this can? What does this say? That's the important stuff. What I love about this app is the ability to identify those products. But with the glasses, I would say the extra function that you're getting is that ability to locate. That's the bit that's quite cool. Being able to actually locate the item.

31:49And I'll just get like a... But, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, when you've reached it, you do get a moment for your mum. Left or right here, beep, beep, you know, you pan your head and it centers and you know, it's in front of you. So, yeah, absolutely. And I did test it out in my house. And, you know, as I was moving from room to room, you are now in a kitchen with this and that and that's there. And then I just walk out, move into the living room. There's a TV, there's a sofa, you know, without having to weary it every time. It was just refreshing itself. It was very cool. Nearby objects and the nearby objects, it was telling me we're all spot on as well and very quick. So, yeah, it's exciting. It is. Well, let's hear from Jeanine. So, Jeanine sent us this back in January 2025. Of course, there have been updates since. I think it's still good for us to get the overview of how the app works and how it's intended to be used at home. Here's Jeanine in our much long missed segment, half of the week, which appears to have

32:49disappeared entirely. But yes, let's go back to January 2025. Hi, double tap folks. It's Jeanine Stanley. And I wanted to show you an app called O-O Ryan. This is an app that uses generative AI to help you locate things primarily. But it can also be used to read text out and about. I really like the way this app is laid out and the way it performs. It is available on the iOS app store. I'm not sure about Android. Apologies in advance for all the background noise. Object button. You open the app. You're going to come onto this main screen. And the first thing you're going to see is search object. And this means you can search for an object anywhere. But let me show you because this is really amazing. Double tap on search object.

33:56Search object. Enter your search. Search field. And here you can dictate. You can do something specific. Voice dictation. Double tap to start. Voice search then speak what you are looking for. Button. Recent searches. Henning. Backback button. Okay, that was something I just searched for. And we're going to search for that again. Cup button. Generic objects. 86. Henning. And they have 86 generic objects in here. I'm not going to go through all of them. But let me give you a little bit of a picture of all of the objects that it now recognizes. Apple button. And I assume that's an Apple device, but it might actually be the fruit. Ascending staircase button. Backback button. Banana button. Battery button. Bed button. Bench button. Bicycle button. Bird button. Food button. Food button. Food button. Fottle button. Food button. Bus button. Bus stop button.

34:57Bus stop. Now that's just a sample. Like I said, there are 86 of them. I'm going to back here to Backpack. Bus. Oh, bottle. Book button. Oh, button. Bird. Bicycle. Bench. Bed. Battery. Button. Banana. Button. Backback. Button. Double tap. Searching for Backpack. Loading. Elixis. Scan your surroundings with the camera. Now I have my camera down on my desk, now my phone. And I'm going to lift it up. And right now I am facing my computer and a bunch of stuff. So I'm going to move to my left. And scan down on the floor where the backpack probably is. And I'm turning slowly to my left. Object found. Beep. Object centered. Get closer. 2.3 meters. Black. Medium-sized backpack with two shoulder straps. On the floor, slightly to the left, near a wooden cabinet. 1.5 meters. 90 centimeters. Object last seen to the right. Scan your surroundings with the camera. OK. And whoopsie. Object found at 90 centimeters. Center the camera on the object by following audio signals.

35:581.1 meters. It's a blue backpack with zippers in a small mesh pocket. Located on a surface near several cardboard boxes. 90 centimeters. And it's going to see my- Object last seen at the top right. Scan your surroundings with the camera. Here we go. And it saw my hand grab the backpack it described it. And I'm just going to scan again. OK, so that is finding- Object found. The object is close. It may not be with an easy reach. Be cautious of the surroundings in between. 1.2 meters. I'm going to go ahead and close. The object is close. 1.0. Object close. Searching for backpack. Close. Button. Close. Space. So as you can see, I have probably have a couple of backpacks there. I have a cross body bag that probably look like a backpack, which is fine. Now, let's go back up to the upper left. Single finger swipe, right? Search text. Enter your search. Search field. So I can enter something to search for. And I have brought a bunch of bottles in here to my desk. So we're going to type this in.

37:01Aspirin. OK, so we are going to search for Aspirin. Searching for Aspirin. Loading. Alexis. Now. Scan your surroundings with the camera. I'm just going to put this camera down on my desk for a minute. If you- this is the first time you've searched for something or you've cleared the search out, you're going to get the on-screen keyboard. Or you're going to want to hit enter after you type whatever it is in to activate the search. So now I'm going to hold my camera up toward my computer here. And I'm just going to pan it along my desk. There's the beep. Text found. Center the camera on the text by following audio signals. Aspirin bottle. Yellow with a teocat. Has dosage in warnings on the label. On a shelf. Near a box label. Not too soft lead scrub in some other containers. Okay. Text last seen at the bottom. Scan your surroundings with the camera. And there it is. I found it. Aspirin is in a yellow bottle with a green cap, containing 81 milligrams of the active ingredient. It's on a shelf near other health products. Okay. Close. So don't forget close that space.

38:02So that is finding the text. And for me and my house, that is probably invaluable if I'm looking for something specific in the pantry or on the very cluttered kitchen breakfast island. So we're going to go back here to the main screen. Objects button. My objects. Now I'm not going to show off this feature in part because it's a lot like the short text feature with seeing AI. Like a lot of those features where it just tells you everything around you. And it just spits out objects, you know, wherever they happen to be. Nearby text button. Nearby text. Same thing. Just super handy though, you know, if you're in a hotel or some place like that where you want to read signage. I actually like the layout and the way this app presents. Better than I do seeing AI. For some reason, I don't know. It's just I have more trust in it. Personal objects button. Personal objects. This is so cool.

39:04I'm going to double tap in here. My personal objects heading. So you can teach it to recognize personal objects. leash button. I have taught it to recognize my guide dog leash. David new personal object button. Can actually scan and save a new personal object if I want. And the way that you do this is really pretty cool. And we can go over that. But let me show you how it finds the guide dog leash. I'm first going to new personal objects. Delete objects button. My personal objects heading leash button. Okay, I'm going to double tap on leash. Searching for leash loading ellipses. Scan your surroundings with the camera. It's hanging on the back of my door. So let's see. Object last seen at the bottom left. Scan your surroundings with the camera. Object found. Center the camera on the object by following audio signals. Okay, that's over to the left. Oh, I lost it.

40:05Object last seen to the left. Scan your surroundings with the camera. There we go. And. Object found. Center the camera on the object by following audio signals. Found it. There we go. And. Searching for leash heading back button. Okay, there we go. Search object button. It can actually learn objects. The next thing I'm going to probably teach it is my guide dog harness. Because I'm forever misplacing that when I. Good or a hotel room and take that off the poor dog and throw it down. And then I can't remember where it is. So where I throw it down. But this is super handy as you see when you activate the generative AI. A pretty interesting app actually in terms of what it can do. And just the ease of use that it has. I really, really like it. I really use these apps because I thought I don't need that. I can find things. And then I get to my super cluttered table. And I'm trying to find one pair of keys.

41:05And oh, my anyway. This is a great app. Check it out. Enjoy it as much as I do. App of the year. Oh, we love genie. Absolutely amazing. And let's be clear here that that isn't the meta glasses. That is just a demonstration and making it clear what the app is capable of. The features and function of the app that's used on a smartphone on the iPhone. I mean, that alone is amazing. And the fact that you can teach it objects. You can I mean, your own special mug or whatever it might be. If it doesn't know that I mean, I had to teach it my mug. In fact, I'll tell you I had to teach it. Yeah, to teach it my table coaster. Because I couldn't see the mug because it was in the table coaster. In it. Oh, yeah, you've got the special in on this thing. Yes. Okay. Yeah, which you absolutely need.

42:06And so, you know, I have it in there. Have you got my mug here? I'm holding in my hand. I was mentioned this yesterday. Mug with the lid in the straw. Oh, I don't know what to do with it. Sippy. Sippy, come. Yeah, okay. Very nice. I've actually got my table coaster. I've gone fully. This is what 100% safe environment in here. My safe space. I did try. So imagine that like all of these apps, right? Imagine the convenience of doing that through your glasses. So I did try that out with Orion. Fine. No, what did I say? I'm searching for a door. Yes. I thought, you know, when I'm going to the shop, I'm trying that last 10 yards problem. So again, just, I write my house. I was trying this, I'm searching for a door. And exactly the same process. Now, how well that will work in the final? Who knows, right? This is beta. But that functionality is now available that you can activate with your voice. I think I then went on to say, I'm looking for my dog.

43:07And it was, beep, beep, beep. So there's over there. And that convenience of using it on your glasses is very cool. And it's speedy. That's the thing that got me about it. It's on the glasses anyway with the test I did with it. The one in Vienna. It was so quick to identify what I was asking it to find. And it kind of just, I thought, this is a game changer. Absolute game changer. This shows you the power of the glasses when paired up with these apps. You know, it's going to be a really exciting time. A really, so I just, we wanted to share some of that with you today just to give you a sense of where we're going. Do you think it does show the power of the glasses or just shows the power of AI used in the right way? No, I don't mean the power of the glasses as a hardware. The power of the glasses as a wearable for you. As a platform. Yes. As a platform. Yes. I think Ira, by the way, when that is officially rolled out, I think they're going to see a huge spike in their usage. Just because of the convenience, like Be My Eyes did, I'm sure.

44:08Because I use Be My Eyes so much more, because it's just so easy as I'm walking down the street to say, hey, Be My Eyes. And bang, I'm talking to someone. And having Ira and all of these apps in the same convenient manner, it's a game changer. Absolutely thing to change it. And I don't think I'll use one less than the others. Don't look like I'll use Ira more as a result. I tend to use Ira for very specific tasks, because I'm paying for the minutes. Whereas with Be My Eyes, there are certain tasks I think, I'll just call it volunteer, because this is far more, I want to use that service. And so I think, well, this particular thing I want to do, for example, one thing I had to do rather embarrassingly the other day, was check that my top wasn't covered in food stuff, let's just say. And it's going to be more useful. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, it's going to be more accessible. But, you know, I wanted to check that. And it feels embarrassing to do it, but you realize the power of having that volunteer able to say, nope, that's perfectly cleaner. Actually, yeah, there's a stain there. You know, because you've clearly been having too many high-ends beans last night. Disgusting person.

45:09Basically, you know, it turns out to be. That's why, you know, people say to me, why do you eat so much dry food for this very reason? It doesn't leave stains. Yeah, it does. No, but you are absolutely right. I mean, I use Ira, I don't pay. I still use the, I'm so terrible, I know. No, no, no, no. I use the five-minute call feature, which is still there every day, fantastic. Ira is amazing for knowing exactly where you are and giving you directions. Absolutely, no one can touch it, because they have access to the GPS. They can see where you are. And it's those dashboard agent tools that they have on their side that make the difference between that and, you know, the also excellent VMI's volunteers, which don't help access to that. I put a challenge to you, Sean Priest. Yes. After yesterday's show, we had all but we assist launching. And of course, this is available in the U.K. as well as Canada and the U.S. So, come on, get, get that dry. You know what? You're absolutely right. I should. I've still got it in my head. Why don't we walk in? So, why would I download the app?

46:10And you're absolutely right. I could try this out. Look, stick around. We're going to hear from Jamie Wallace next. He has developed an app called Blind Racer. And he's looking for your feedback. Jamie Wallace, welcome to Double Tap. Thank you. So, Jamie, you got in touch and told us of a new accessible game you're developing. And you wanted to talk about. Tell us all about it. Whenever somebody build the piece of software or just, you know, makes a product, they used to really do it because they want to scratch it on edge. And I was one reason in England.

47:13So, I was born and raised playing with scale ethics, which I'm sure you know about. Which basically is a slack car racing game. And then, when I had kids, I started to play Nintendo Mario Kart. And, and, or I had to do with the basic recipe there. And, randomly, perf buns. And, I got really annoyed and really frustrated. And I said, I want to create a game that I'm actually able to use. So, I decided to build Blind Racer. I remember playing Mario Kart. That's what you're trying to recreate here. But you mentioned the scale electric side of it as well. Or the slot racing. I'm not sure if scale electric is a global term or just a UK term. But slot racing, we all know about setting up those tracks in your living room at Christmas Day. So, that's what you're trying to recreate here. The slot racing. Yeah, the slot car racing idea.

48:14You can play it either in voice of a mode or not. It not only speaks to you as you're playing, but it also has sound. Now, by a sound, I mean, it has beeps. So, as you're moving, it increases beeps as you go faster. And as you're about to hit a curve, it will beep in the right or left year. So, you know you're about to go on a curve. Now, with slot car racing, you'll be going too fast to fly off the track. And if you fly off the track, you get half the feedback. It beeps and then buzzes. And if you left the track, it puts your back on the track. But it's a sure period of time later so you just can't go. The only control for Blind Racer is a single control. You press on the screen to go. And you would go to the screen and you would go to the screen to slow it down.

49:15Yeah, used to drive me crazy always flying off the track all the time and then trying to find a car afterwards and put it back on. It never lasted past Christmas day for me. But this may be different. The controls are very, very simple. As you said, basically, you're just controlling the speed. Does it matter if it's left or right turn because you're not controlling that anyway? No, it doesn't really matter. It's just that if you want to know that, then you know, you can know that. But you know, it really just matters because it's a slot car. You don't have to turn a steering wheel when you need to go right or left. It just takes you around the corner. So, is this the first game you've developed? The first game on iOS. So, when it comes to accessible gaming, we've had this discussion on Double Tap many times. You know, is it less of an experience when it comes to accessible gaming? Because basically, we're always reacting to an audio queue.

50:17So, making gameplay mechanics that actually draw you in can be difficult on, I think, anyway, on accessible audio games. How have you found that whole process when you sat down and thought, I want to make an accessible game? I wanted to build something that I could enjoy, being that, you know, I thought about it from the point of view as I can see some things, but I assume we can't see everything. And when it comes to using the phone, I have to use the voice over in order to be able to use the phone properly. But I wanted to make a game that I could enjoy. And I wondered about really thinking about how the mechanics of the game would work. I wanted to make it simple to use. I thought about how best to make it so that the user wouldn't have the way about

51:19turning or moving on the track, which in a game like Mario Kart, if you can't stay on the track, you end up just riding the curve and then you go really, really slowly. But, you know, I wanted to create something that would keep the car on the track and in turns. But also, be realistic enough that if you went too fast, you'd fly out the track. But I knew that if you fly out the track, that I wouldn't be able to get back on the track. So I made that automatically put you back on the track after a delay of time. You can't move. This is very early beta stage, right? Yeah, I mean, it's been out in beta now for a couple of months with a really small good, but better users. That's why I'm hoping to expand it to a bigger, good, but better user sound.

52:19So that's why you got in contact with us. Yeah, so this is a public beta. You're looking for people to come out and give you suggestions, recommendations, and let you know what they think. Right. If you go to Dr. Dr. Meier's Life Beta, you can see all the beta software that I have out right now. There are two. There's Blendways and GRSS, which is an RSS breakdown, but can both of which are in beta and you're welcome to join the beta and down with them. So if someone wants to get involved, again, they should go to your website, which is doxyd.media, M-E-D-I-A, forward slash beta, B-E-T-A. Is that right? That's right. Jamie, thank you so much. I wish you all the luck and hope to see lots more games in the future. Thank you very much. I mean, a really cool app developed by Jamie there. Yeah, another amazing app. I love hearing about all these developments, blind and disabled people are doing, you know, for ourselves, essentially.

53:22Well, that's exactly the point, right? And reaching out and wanting that feedback, you know, let's make this game as good as it can be. So yeah, definitely check it out. I read a lot about audio games online, and it's funny, I mean, I'm just not a gamer at any level, but I think sometimes it's because I hate to say this, but sometimes I think, you know, it's like I hear people talk about the PlayStation and the Xbox games, and I think, yeah, it sounds great. But is this really good for someone who can't see anything at all? Is there anything out of this? I know people do get stuff out of it. I get that, but it also feels like a huge learning curve as well. What we're talking about here with Jamie is much simpler. Well, yeah, I mean, look, Jamie is trying to recreate a very specific thing here when it comes to slot car racing, you know, scale electrics, as I know it as. So there is basically only one control when it comes to slot car racing, and that is how fast you're going, and you know, slowing down when you go around corners so you don't fly off the track as he said. Now, is that mechanic enough for some gamers? You know, gaming covers a huge range now.

54:24For some people, it's just a quick five minute time killer while you're waiting somewhere, you know, just something to fill the time. That is kind of where mobile gaming started out. But I think, actually, when it comes to accessible audio games, I think there is something there. There is a mechanic that it's very difficult to pull off, but I think there is something that can really draw you into the gameplay, and it doesn't just feel like you're playing the, you know, digital version of Bopit, where you're just reacting to an audio cue. I think there is games out there that can pull you in. Not boring like Night Manager, for example. How dare you, sir! It's a new season. Hello, fellow night managers. I'm in the Lazarus order, I believe, this time. Yep, level 1,800 at the minute. Sean of Shed. They took away my THE from my name, some reason. What? Yeah, well, they didn't like it. They took away everyone's THE's from the game. God, I know you've got this cutbacks. They are moving the words there.

55:26Has it moved from the dictionary as well? Can I use the word THE? That's going to change things around a bit. I don't know if they did it very often. They allowed you to use it again, but I just so lazy I haven't changed my name back. Sean of Shed, I like it anyway. To the point. Sean of Shed, I like that. It sends more glad tutorial, doesn't it? Sean of Shed, yeah. Maybe. Anyway, Night Manager is a great game. Great example of an accessible game. Yeah, no, absolutely. Well, listen, thank you, Jamie. Thank you. I wish them all the best, and I do. I really do. I just know it's not for me, but I know many of you out there will be into this kind of thing. So, yeah, absolutely feedback to Jamie on that. Thanks to him. Thanks to Jeanine, of course, for that one-year-old demo. Let's just celebrate our anniversary. He's here at Double Tap. And so, yeah. Are you career-sizing after Jeanine? Jeanine, I'm career-sizing. I'm career-sizing if you've ever known us, but I am intrigued by what is kind of trying to reverse it or this. Well, in that game, that driving game, can you reverse it out of the situation

56:26that you've just got yourself? Back on track, Stephen Scott. Ultimately, we've got them all there. Just a quick reminder as well, I was at site village in Glasgow yesterday. You can look forward to all of our conversations that we had in our Double Tap weekend episode. Mainstream, of course, back on Sunday as normal with having into all the big tech news of the week there. But of course, we continue here on Double Tap tomorrow with lots more of your feedback, join us for that. John Priest, as always, thank you and goodbye. Now, thank you and goodbye. Thank you. Bye. Bye. I wanted the last walk. So get out. I'm meeting you. Don't do it. Don't do it. Bye. You want better internet? Cox's internet of 300 megas has the speed, speed and confidence

57:27that you're looking for. Perfect for streaming and gaming and working from home. All for only $45 per month when you add Cox's mobile. Include a team of Wi-Fi and guarantee a price of two years in your plan. Yeah. Don't wait. Change your box. You want to buy a box? You want to buy a box? You want to buy a box? You want to buy a box? You want to buy a box?