Expressions - September 11th, 2026

0:00Turks and Kekos. Welcome to the program expressions, our Mewhost Robert Hall. What a lovely Friday morning it is here in Providencia, and I'm sure it's just as lovely all around these beautiful Turks and Kekos Islands. First, let me apologize for the late start. This has been beyond my control and certainly beyond the control of my guests. We're all here ready, waiting and ready to go. I will put management on notice from now, like they say in the United States Congress. I'm going to reclaim my time. So let me welcome all of you around the Turks and Kekos Islands, where we are over there in Salt Key, the nation's capital, Grand Turk down at Salt Kekos, over

1:00in a North Kekos, Parade Key, Pine Key, Providencia Alies, West Kekos and Amigree Skies, all making up that beautiful by nature, Turks and Kekos. Today I'm continuing the series from whence we came. We are celebrating 50 years since the introduction of ministerial system. We have come a long way, but we have much further to go. I have a very important guest with me today, one who has played her role, shattered the proverbial glass ceiling, and today she will tell her story. But before we get to that, let's have a word of prayer. Our father and our God, once more we thank you for joining mercies. We thank you for all of us who have lived

2:05to see this day. We thank you for those who have labored to build this country to wear this today, and not just the politicians, but the street sweepers, those who work in their hotels, the government offices, civil servants, policemen, all collectively we have helped to build this land. We give you thanks for your blessings, and we pray that you will continue to bless us as a people. I pray that you will pour out continuously your blessings on my guests, and her family. For all these we give you thanks in Jesus' name. Amen. Amen. Now, like I said, I have a very important guest, and I just say we go way back, not only when I was speaker of the house, but you know what endeared me to her in a way

3:15is that my late brother, Boy Hall, was her uncle. So that made for me a connection. And let me be blunt, although we were of political persuasions, it might surprise her to know that I never spoke ill of her efforts, and when she won and became the first, and up until now the only female premiere of this country, I wanted her to win, and even though I could have influenced some people, even some close to me, not to vote for her, I certainly didn't, because I felt that she was

4:18a woman with substance. And I've said many times, when she goes abroad to represent us, people like not to use the current premiere and some others, I could always feel proud and sit back, because I know they're representing us well. Without going any further, it is my utmost pleasure to introduce a lady who really needs no introduction to the honorable Charlene Coutwright Robinson, like I said, the first, and up until now, the only female premiere of the Jackson Caker Silence, welcome to expressions. Thank you Mr. Hall, thank you for having me, I chuckle because on my mind, just now around, the last time you and I sat together, out came the famous phrase, I can't stop the

5:19loops. Well, I get that, and I said to somebody this morning, I hope the line doesn't come up. Yeah, like I can't come up no more, that's why you don't play politics, my things like loops and constitution and crime, you know, I mean, if I had the size loops today, I might have turned myself in. I'd tell you. Yes, but it's a pleasure to be here, it's been a very long time since I've done this here in Jackson Cakers, and I'm happy to to appear in your series, reflecting on the 50 years and celebrating our 50 years since the introduction of Ministerial Government. Well, following a pattern that I've done with others, and my guests could see, we both don't even have a piece of paper before it's totally unscripted, it is a conversation. And like I've said to the others, I want you to tell your story, and the best way to tell this

6:21story is to go back to your early childhood, because like I said, even with regard to myself, many individuals just see where we are today, be it in high or low position, but do not understand the struggles we went through to get to where we are today. And so take us back to your early childhood, be it South Cakers or the Bahamas wherever it started. Well, anyone that knows me knows I boast about being from East Habo. I know no matter how it is, I am from South Cakers, but I was born into Bahamas, and just like other Turks and Cakers, I understood my parents did go to the Bahamas, not together, they actually met each other in the Bahamas. Bertram, most people know him as Bertram Codreverty's Paul Codre, the second, and Louise Codre, most people know his big sister, and so my brother and my sister and I were born in the Bahamas.

7:25But at age 6, 1978, we returned while we came back with our parents. So I've been in Turks and Cakers for my was six years old. So all I really know is South Cakers, where I was raised, then all of my schooling up to high school there. I think we had the, I always subscribe it as a fairy tale child, growing up in South Cakers was just absolutely awesome. We had our maternal grandparents, church was very much a part of our, it was central to our bringing. School was important, report card, it was a big day. You can do excellent at mommy looking for math in English, and then the one thing I would say that my parents did was make sure that we understood the importance of serving in the church and in the community. So we were always brown use or girl guides or boy scouts, and then we also learned the trade. She made sure we learned

8:29the trade, she made sure we learned to play an instrument. Trades such as? I crochet. Okay. Late mooney taught me to crochet. She still do? Yeah, I still do. I still do every now and then. So they didn't give us any time to be idle, right? But we had such a wonderful child, my parents were very, very present and very, very involved. I said to them, holidays are just not holidays because how it used to be, families will go together to the beach. It was a big beach day. And the community was just so much more together, right? On South Cakers, and when we got to come around, you know, it was a special occasion. Christmas was a big deal. So I mean, growing up in South Cakers was just awesome. I wouldn't trade it anywhere else. And in those days, regatta was regatta. So mom's sisters would come over from Grand Turk. The cousins will come over. And of course, my grandmother's house was where everyone, you know, congregated. And it used to just be a time.

9:35Everybody used to come to South Cakers and it was just great. Yeah. Really great. I can see a number of my viewers' listeners are logging on. I might not be able to acknowledge you from where I sit. But of course, you're always a very important part of this program. It's for you that we stage this program every Monday evening, 6.30 to 8.30 pm. Every Wednesday and Fridays 10 am to 12 noon, except when their outside broadcasts, meetings of parliament committees, and so on. And so I want to welcome all of you who have logged on. Just let everybody know that I have a very important guest in the house. So listen up. And let me pause for a second to wish a few persons happy birthday. My middle-aged Cakers girl Ruby Harvey, celebrating her birthday today, happy

10:36birthday to you. Editor of the Sun, Hayden Boyce, my brother, keep up the good work. Excellent writer. As far as I'm concerned, tell it like it is whether it is in favor or deemed to be a gang, because that's what journalism is supposed to be. Fair, square, balanced. I appreciate the contribution that you are making. And then on another note, today is some people look back and remember 9.11, because of the date yesterday. And the author Rita Gardner wants to say hi to DeGena Stiles and one of her other friends in the states who went through that. I certainly cannot forget that date. Incidentally, I was actually in Providencia at this time,

11:42and I'm back here today. And so again, out of a Rita Gardner, wishes to say hi to her dear friends who went through that. I'm digressing just a little bit on the Charlene Carter at Robinson. Where were you at that time? In Music and Standbrook, working. My senior attorney at that time, Aerial Music, had a television in his office. And I think we were all numb because we couldn't believe what we were seeing. They were showing the photo, the video of the plane flying into the Twin Powers. And I can remember clearly, we were all standing in Aerial's office and looking at what was happening. I'll tell you one thing. And good morning again to Miss Alicia Wilson. Others of you, you can message me at 244-7332.

12:50Because unfortunately, we can't get the telephone calls in today. I certainly hope. Whenever I have another show here, that we'd be able to do that. And perhaps we're possible. We'll try to get as many persons into Gran Turk, the nation's capital as far as possible. Of course, I don't think you're the proper to ask our guests to pay their way up. But anyway, we'll have to work on that. So, continuing your early childhood, who were some of those persons at the primary level that had some significant impact on your life? The education psychologists tend to say that a greater percentage of what a child learns, he learns between that age of four and six,

13:54that early part there, the rest are like building blocks. Well, I am one who always expressed gratitude to my teachers. I can lean every teacher straight up to high school, all of my teachers. I've had some really influential teachers. And I usually start with, well, I'll stop when my childhood pastor Reverend Peter Hall was one of the greatest influences for me. I always taught people my life and who I am, really reflects who my pastors were because I tell them I came up on the three strong middle-kakers pastors and they were known nonsense. As Reverend Peter Hall, Reverend Ruben Hall, and Reverend Dyer Hamilton. So, when you see me in a particular frame of mind and particular way, that's my pastor. So, they were very influential throughout my life, but Reverend Peter Hall was very influential. In primary school, I always tell people the first time I got a leadership position was Maria Clare for the brownies. I was lead of a group called the Ims. You know, I always remember that.

15:00She was always very, and still to this day, very supportive. Aside from her, Kay Darn was a very strong influence for me. She was my grade five teacher. Ms. Norma Sema was a sweetheart. You know, Ms. Malcolm, I always tell them in grades six taught me how to route and how to defend myself. Emily Malcolm, Lole Malcolm. Okay. So, she would always, anytime I introduce her to somebody, or she's somewhere I say, listen, that's the lady who taught me how to defend myself and to represent myself and to argue. So, you know, she was really very, very influential still to this day. And then in grade seven, Bishop George Fulford, he was my neighbor, the youth leader from my church, and my grade seven teacher. And I think if had he not come in my life at the time, he did, I honestly believe despite the strict parents, despite the present parents, despite me not being easily influenced under peer pressure, anything, I would have been a different person. So, I give

16:02him a lot of credit for who I am. You know, many individuals might not remember that Bishop Fulford was really a teacher. Oh, they remember the part that he now plays. But he has been there many, many years. Well, children who got beaten by snakey will remember him. Sometimes Mr. Fulford, Mr. Fulford would wish him fulfilled, as I said at this respect. But when you had to go to his office, he would preach to you. He would tell you a script and by the time he finished, you repentant, you cry and before you even get beaten, you know. So, he was very influential in a lot of kids' lives, very, very influential. You know, then that came up to high school and I had teachers that I don't know, they, I was always, I wouldn't say favored, but they saw in me what I wouldn't have seen as a child. You know, but I would always say, Bishop, Brantford Gale. He was the principal

17:04in my latter years. Mr. Knight was there for the first two years. You, you know, orchestrating your way through high school. And I had a lot of good high school teachers, but Mr. Gale, Mr. Gale took it to a different level. You know, I have people like Mr. Catoi who's still teaching, I wrestling methods taught me five years' foods, right? And people who taught me a particular part and didn't, then the other like, Struing Your Williams, live slowly. Those persons who, you know, paid particular attention to me, Dr. Carlton Mills, you know, and guide me and help me. By the time I finished high school, Dr. Mills had me map out what college I'll go to, what university I'll go to. So, when kids were trying to figure out their way, I know I was going to Barbados Community College or CLB. I know I was going to UE after that. And that's through all of my teachers became like guidance counselors, you know. And in that period, all they had to do is call mommy, you know. So, you act the fool, they pick up the fool and they call a big sister and

18:08big sister just activate. So, you know, you really had a village. Yes. Oh my gosh. You had, and that's why it is so hard for me to watch the young people today. We criticized them so much, but they don't have what we had. And we're unfair to them for that. Right? So, tell us perhaps a little bit more about the community life in South Cacus at the time. What the people did, perhaps even sure as you had to do. And what about some of the celebrations other than regard time? South Cacus was always a party. I mean, as kids, my best friend, my childhood friend is Brenda Barron. And we had homes that we will were only allowed to go to because people weren't, your children didn't go all over the place. So, I could have spent a night by the barons or I could have spent a night by the nights, you know.

19:10So, a lot of it was what you made of it yourself. There are certain activities that happened that we as kids, even older couldn't go to. Right? I think the community was so close that not only your teachers could call your parents, this was real stuff. I would get in the fighting grade grade six and I had to walk from where the old community center was home. And by the time I got home, somebody don't call me. And it isn't the teacher. The old shelly was on the road fighting, I used to fight against the whole. I used to fight a lot physically. I went through a wrestling phase. I used to try and add on people's skills. One most of them were your last people. Oh, no, I used to win. Oh, I used to win. Trust me. I praise the law for deliverance. You know, but I went through that phase and the community wasn't just the neighbor next door, but that person, one likely was your teacher or was your Sunday school teacher or was in your church. So, everybody just took

20:13care of each other. Now, I also came up through the big south period. You wouldn't, you were very really here in my call, South kickers, big south. That's the era when there was a lot of drugs flowing. So, I had childhood friends who got involved in that. I had childhood friends who lost their lives through, I mean, the age pandemic and epidemic, I'm sorry. And so, I don't really I don't really boast about the big south days because a lot of people don't know we had losses. Right? We had family members who were settled from Inago and Go missing. Yes. You know, people don't talk about that, but that affected those of us, you know, who really on the show that was going on. I always say, you see the thing about it, we will always talk about and celebrate perhaps the more beautiful aspects of what we've come from. But some of the negative

21:19things you rather pushed them on the covers, as it were, I've said a lot to many of my friends, you know, I would love to write the script for a movie about the drug days. Oh, you and I both. I love to. But the thing about it, of course, it is just like when people tell me write my book, I don't want to write it because I've got to be truthful. And what will be said may be offensive to a whole lot of people. And at this phase of my life, I don't want to. But I think we do a disservice to the young people when we don't write the truth, right? We're coming life is full circle. Right? And while we're not talking about the white lady or snow and in South Gakers, we see a lot of what is going on with this new gang culture. And we see here, we see retaliatory killings and all like that, but it is driven by drugs. Absolutely. A lot of it is driven by drugs.

22:19And I saw a beautiful South Gakers come down to nothing. I saw a man in South Gakers like a cigar with a hundred dollar bill in the big South days. And I got old enough to watch that man work for a hundred and something dollars a week. I remember the days as a teacher some of the holidays, I used to like go there and dive, you know? And if I took out say a hundred dollars and I need some change, the guys will pull out a rule and shuffle through. I have no change, you know? And so I can understand what you're coming from. A lot of people don't talk about it, but you have to because those were the formative years of my life, you know, one of my childhood best friends I lost during that period. And you know, people don't talk about it, but you have to let the young people know. And because I think we had that easy-going party kind of, don't get kind of life in South Gakers, it actually transcends to generations where the fishermen should be the wealthiest people

23:21and the Turks and Kakers, right? But we just passed through so much and passed through so much that, you know, we just think it's going to come the next day, you know? So I think it affected us, right? But there's a whole lot of persons who came out of South Gakers and we did great, we did great for our island. Yes, yes it did. When we talk about that, it's like I was watching a documentary other day and we had Norman Solomon, a former member of parliament, the Bahamas, you know, he was being interviewed. And he said, mind you, the drug trade did a lot, apart from the negative, there were a lot of Bahamas in terms of building it up, that's what he said. Now I'm not sure that relevant to South Gakers and perhaps let's move on from that, from that aspect of it. All right, you spoke quite a bit about your primary and the high school level and perhaps under the guidance you got, particularly from lots of mills with regards to colleges

24:23and possibly universities. So I take it from granted, then you went to college before you went to university. I was just telling this story. The Bahamas, I had a rough time. I graduated as valedictorian. Back then we got something called the governor's copy, we got the most CXC's, I got that. I was head girl, of course. But when I came out of school, I was promised three scholarships. I had taught Spanish briefly because the Spanish teacher was late and coming, so I did Spanish for a term to all of the high school forms. And then an opportunity came up for where Lindsay Mascova went to study, hospitality, management, and Canada. And then there was another teaching thing that came up, but I always wanted to do law. From I was 10 years old, I wanted to do law and I remember a particular teacher. And that's why you have to be careful with your say to children, pick something more realistic. Oh wow. And I promised myself at 10. When I get my

25:27law degree, I'm going to copy this degree and show it to this teacher. Yes. Yes. What do you have to do No, I didn't show a tour, but she's very proud. I got over the little spike thing. Yes, yes. But when I finished high school, I was like days away from actually leaving to go to Canada when the scholarship was canceled. None of them came through. So I ended up going to Barclays Bank. Barclays saw... But, but, but, to take a pen. You ever got a reason why, what, what, what about it being canceled? Right. I don't know. I, I, it was, I mean, it was like a thirst and I was supposed to leave the Tuesday. I remember the church had done a little something, gave me a check and all these things we had to give back. And at that time, most people who knew me know EJ Sanders and I were close family. So they were in school in Canada and mom had already arranged with me, Sam Lee. Right. You know, her cousins wife to take me to shop for winter clothes. Everything was, and then they were just told us it wasn't going to happen. Right. So neither of them

26:28came through and I secured a job. What year was that? I'm trying to just think. 89. 88. Sorry. 88. Yeah. Because 89 is when I, I then went and replaced Jennifer Leibmann. She went on maternity leave and I thought grade one. I tried to teach him thing. It's the heart. It was it for me. I tried to check the date because depending on what time there was 88 would have been the first interim administration. 88. It would have been, it would have been after. I graduated, of course, July. Okay. Right. And I should have left this. Well, other than that then, it would have been during the skipping season administration because skipping one day 88. Yeah. I see. But that was a private scholarship. Yes. Remember that was something offered by the Canadian government. Okay. Right. Myself and Judy, Judy, Henfield. We were the two. And it was a, it was a Canadian government offered scholarship. Right. But at that time, I was already denied a scholarship to study law.

27:33But I was going to the community college in Nassau and the whole thing was towards a lot of degree. So I didn't get a scholarship. I taught primary school and then I went to Barclay Speng. So I never lacked it until two years after high school. The government was then offered a number of scholarships by the Bahamas government. And there were seven of them. People like at Gauha, my husband, Tammy Howell, James Cox, Deena Hamilton, they were some of the recipients of this scholarship. And I was the seventh one. And the government never sent the letter. So every, I'll tell you, the government never sent the letter to say that I was in each time I would go and God bless the registrar Mr. Brown, who would allow me every time to register and say, sir, the government is going to send the letter. Yes. So I didn't have the benefit of summer school. So I did like seven and five and five. I took very heavy semesters on. I completed my associates in four semesters, really. Right? It was two years before semesters. And I graduated

28:40the second highest and the associates in history program. Because I had a debt, I couldn't collect my associates degree to go to university. Oh gosh. So it was a year. I came back and went to Barclays. I worked. And when I went back to the Bahamas, I made a case. And the Bahamas government wrote off what I owed. Oh, that's great. Yeah. So I always tell them I got a scholarship after my program. Because I graduated with a high average. And they gave it to me. So I then went to University of the West Indies in 1993. That was a Trax and Kakers government scholarship. I applied for scholarship eight years before I got it. Oh gosh. From 88. So when you started university, how was that funded? My parents. Wow. So I worked at Barclays Bank. I saved and then my parents put up their home. And so we got assistance. My mother was an associate at Mac Teacher. The early part of my year was she was in development board then. And we were able to secure

29:43$15,000 to go for me to go. But they only gave me five thousand a year. So that's how I ended up even keeping the behavior passport because I read it as a behavior student. So I got to credit the Bahamas. Let me see. This is where these types of dialogues are so important. Because like I said early on, the younger generation in particular, looking at you today successful in the history books, blah, blah, do not understand the struggles you went through to get to where you are. Because actually, I myself, some of the things you're telling me, it's new to me. Oh, I had to work. I had to work through. I had to work every Christmas, work every summer. That's why I have to give it to Barclays. Because I mean, my dad was a taxi driver. My mom was a stay-home mom. No, no, no, but she was so well. Yeah, but they were committed, but there's only so much they could do. So I ran to school and I was telling them my monies were safe for calling home and food. I didn't have much, you know.

30:48I didn't have much, so I really struggled through university. And then that was 93. And then 94, I had to go to Barbados. You know, that's a different cost of living because my 93, that first year was in Jamaica. So the dollar worked for me. But now I had to go to Barbados. And I tell you, I had a good relationship in Barbados, banking the Lake Port Williams call and say, you know, Barclays is about to offer some student loans. You need to get this document, that document be ready for when they're ready to go. And so I was like, well, I already have a loan, right? But it so happened that I was one of two people in the Caribbean who they granted a loan to. That's why. Before they realized they weren't going to be making any monies. Before they realized they weren't going to make any monies on these student loans. So it came in time, they were 96 when I had to then pay development board because I had to start

31:51making payments in three years. And I just had time to go. So I was able to get the loan from Barclays pay off development board and help me. And then eight years later come, so scholarship from government. Wow. 1996. So I mean, everything kept together for me in that year, but it was, it was rough. It was rough. Every year though, I faithfully wrote and applied for scholarship. I remember P.S. writing back and saying, we don't offer law scholarships. And I was right on the side of NetDark Island in Barbados who was studying law on a government scholarship. You know? And I mean, you tried, you tried not to be better and angry. But you know, I was, I was actually, I was really driven because I really wanted to do law. So what a great story. I tell you, it really, really come a long way through lots of difficulties. So when you finally got your law degree and then called to the bar, what do you do? Did you do thereafter? Well, I was called to the bar

33:00Dems in Company. Mr. Fimbabwe Demsie, Gordon Carter and Owen Foley, Owen hired me and Dems in Company when I started my bar school because I did that in Jamaica. And I had a really good relationship then, you know, with the law firm. They assisted me. So they hired me, fresh out of law school. But I came out of law school in May 1998 and went straight on the Campian Trail for Direct Halo. So kind of blurred. A lot of people don't remember me as much as the lawyer, as they do as, you know, they do more as a politician or being involved in politics. But I kind of merged both almost at the same time. But I worked with Dems in Company and then I went to Michigan's time broke. And then I had my own firm when I was in Grand Tech. Okay. So how many years then did you practice law before going to politics? I practiced law actively. I didn't, I, my firm closed about 2008. So from 1998, about 10 years solid. Okay. Between major firms,

34:08like Dems in Company and their Michigan's fabric and then Cartwright and Poe. Let's see. What aspect of law did you specialize, I mean in your practice, commercial or criminal? Commercial. Commercial. Commercial. I didn't do, I didn't, I wasn't too crazy about the court. Still not. It's amazing. I'm not even going to talk about the judiciary today. But I did more convincing immigration, but more commercial law contracts, that sort of thing. And during that time too, I taught at the community college, designed the law program there. And I taught there at the college. In fact, well, let's talk it outside there. A young lady was talking about you being her lecturer there. Yeah. And none of them have done extremely well. I'm so proud of them. Chateilly is with the, I always boast about her because that year we started out with about 10 or 12 students from the prison, from the police force. And it came down to Chateilly alone. So sometimes Chateilly and I would just have class at my house. And she did extremely well.

35:10She's, she's, yeah, Liana Brooks, all of them, they were the faster me. As I always say, you know, that is one of the great things about teaching. Yeah. You don't get rich from teaching. No. But when you look at the lives that you've impacted, I mean, you know, you feel so great about that. No doubt about it. Now stepping then from the legal feel to the political feel was that always your plan? No. Okay. What motivated you to take that next step? Now, I should say to you, I come from a very political family. My mom made was much more political than my father, right? My dad's mouth was big and whatever he talked about. You know, so a lot of people with here, sometimes at the airport talking politics, but my mom was, my mom was an avid campaigner and supporter for the PDM. Questions probably know or don't know, but Louis Aswet is my aunt's uncle.

36:11I'm about aunt's husband. But my dad and him grew up as brothers. So he heavily influenced that part as well. His, my mom's sister, Milder, which was just as political as Louis Aswet, she just never ran. You know, so the women and my family were very strong in politics. And so when they come to Southkiggas or the Wendell Swann, their tailors, it's Gibbons, Jake's McCartney, they ate at my house. Mom cooked for them. So I would always mingle with them. I remember being on a battella, their tailor from I was very, very young. And mom always talked so highly about him. So when I came home, I didn't just jump in to say, I'm going to be a PDM. I looked at what he was doing. And it was really what he was doing in my commitment to make sure he stayed in office that dragged me back there. You know, and I said back there because his children used to, I said to someone the only time I remember really traveling with my father and the islands, is our entire family went for PDM Convention and Grinter. That's how

37:15committed our family was. And so mom didn't keep us involved like that, but we saw it around us. But my commitment to Honoura Directayla is what got me really involved in that. Yes, you referred to your dad and the late dad, the late Louis Aswet. Although I supported a different party, I had a very good relationship with your dad. When we went to South Cacos, we would talk a lot. And particularly with the late Honoura Louis Aswet. And I have said many, many times when I was brought to Providencia, I was to do a radio program. And after Erman Maria, the sponsorship was withdrawn immediately. It was persons like the late Honoura Louis Aswet came to the rescue. And I remember him writing a check for something like $1200. The sponsorship

38:22from month was maybe about 300 or something like that. And although a PDM, and I said bluntly, no PNP ever wrote a check to that son. Yes, Bell and Erwin made sponsorship, but not to that level. And I always remember him so many times who would call me up. And he and pastaed Dean and Shining, we'll have lunch by the Butterfields restaurant. Was it still light? Yeah, or the chicken place on the other side? A little months. It's headquarters, that's what I'm telling you. Yes, yes, yes. I have fun memories. But that's people who are committed to the country. Between 2002, my husband transferred to Granta. That's how I ended up in Granta to head the Public Health Department. And any time I did anything for PDM, kids' party, Oliver Oda's Mars,

39:27used to be one of the first sponsors. We know he's not, you know, he's that's not his body. And I will always say that because people like him, he just wanted to help. You know, he just found a way to help. And I always say that about him. So people like him and the late Louis, they just saw a country. I know just what you mean. You know, I take a lot of heat because people know my political history. And so even now, no matter what I say, you know, maybe, oh, you're just damn bias, BNP, you know, but anyway. Now, what is the first time you contested an election? Well, let me let let's go back because I did say I campaigned for Director Taylor in 1998 on Patello. But he made me his appointed member in 1999. So I went into the house of a Sunday. That's why I tell a lot of people, they go, oh, use quits. No, I didn't quit so soon. I didn't want 20 years. And in front line politics, we have a high position in the party or in

40:28parliament. I've done three terms in parliament. So he appointed me on in 1999 to 2003. You and I were there together. I was the PDM's appointed member. You were the PMP's appointed member. And my boss, then, Ariel was the governor's appointed member. And I always remember that. And then coming to 2003, when he would have gone for his third term, I was approached by the party to run. Little, little brave me took on my home island of South Gekers. I remember one of the seniors in South Gekers, good like this, Brassi little Taik. That's the first time I hear the word Taik. But Norman Sanders is my mom's first cousin child. As political, as people know my mom, my aunt Sarah, my late aunt Lloyd's, Norman was their little cousin. So mom wanted to make sure I'm

41:30not running against Norman because she don't want that family drama. Lauren, behold, Norman, step back on the scene. I ended up running against him. I took my time to make sure that people understood I was in running against Norman, but for South Gekers. So I remember like now my first slogan was a breath of fresh air, old dreams, new vision. Took my time as the whole and I wrote every constituent, male, and delivered going to every home. And all people were like, oh, just son, why you know, I'll ask Norman to let you run in his place. Or you can't go with Norman. I kind of got the feeling like we were going, but I still had a head first. So I ran in 2003 and was unsuccessful. So I never, and between when I ran again in 2012, I was the chairman of the party, the first vice chair, the chairman of the party, the secretary general, all position self. I was the first woman to hold those. So then I came back in 2012 and ran after the

42:36interim administration, you would remember I served in the consultation forum. South Gekers was always a tough nut to crack. That was like the bedrock for the PNP. Something like how overbacked overbacked for PNP too, but particularly like what we call cashier God. To the bone as they say. Those really were indeed some interesting days, still interesting, but the politics is a bit different now. But I tell people the strongest and I say this, the strongest PNBs are from South Gekers. And I think because they lived so close, especially to the number of non-Nomods on this. And I always tell them the strongest PNBs are not out of cashier God and they are the same KGAs. Because those people who live the CUA, until all of our noise skippers crack that and they kept consistent. That's a different kind of commitment. Let me just acknowledge a few commands that have come into me by way of what's up.

43:39And it says good morning, Annabelle Hall. Please give my regards to Honorable Karprat Robinson. She is one of the many Turks in KGAs, I have a great deal of time and respect for. I'm looking forward to great discussion today. And that's from Ryan Williams. Some people don't like to have their names called, but certainly in this case call it out. And Sinclair must grow, that must ring the bell to you. She says, I'm so proud of my high school class, made very inspiring interview listing. I can relate to the fighting. And let's see. Yeah. Others of you, you can share your commands. So if you have a question, have a question as we go along. It's two four four seventy three thirty two. Just remember I said for internet reasons, we cannot have any calls. But you can certainly fill your questions and your comments to my WhatsApp. Two four four seventy three.

44:49Thirty two. So time is looking at my own number. Yes, I'm continuing on that line. So the first time you won was in 2012. In 2012. That can be introduced the the oil island. And I should step back because I think some of my greatest memories of public service came and when I was at the end there as the appointed member. I was able to share the white people. You remember the white people. Yes, I remember that. Partnership to progress. And then on the dark tailor gave me the afforded me the opportunity to serve on the first constitution review body. That was shared of course by the late Daniel Malcolm. It was myself again, Erie, music, Norman Sanders, Randall Swann. Norman, you had Norman Sanders, Jr. Right. Secretary was Mr. Dudley being. And I think that is that kind of

45:50that appointment kind of locked me in wanting to be a part of building Turks and K-Guts. You know, so it was really good in 2006. All of our Michael, Mr. Kim and continued the groundwork and so we were reappointed in 2006. So I think it kind of shifted then for me just supporting chief to me really wanted to be a part of nation building. And then again, our Michael, music had appointed a 10 year planning committee. And he appointed me in 2007 to the population and immigration sector of it. So I got more and more and more involved. And then I came up as the chairman of the People's Democratic Movement and the Secretary General and then the consultative forum. So from both parties point of view, it is not accurate to say

46:52that skills from the other party are not always tapped when a given party is in power. Is that fair to say? I've written speeches for PMP members. I remember when our Michael, music had to go away as well. And I think it was something under constitution and something else. I helped to write that speech. Great. Right? At first the Turks and K-Guts and K-Guts. Tell them like it is. So sometimes, and I often engage in a lot of debates when they talk about politics being so divisive. But I tell them in some ways politics is hardly any more divisive than the church. People have opinions. But at the end of the day, the more mature politician will understand that the country is more important than... That's the word you know Mr. Hul? That the party. But shorty mature. Yes. I went into the House of Assembly, but I did

47:54COB and I had opportunity to rub shoulders with the late Lyndon Pindland. And I always heard them say so Lyndon Pindland and the lead successful Wallis Whitfield were extremely close. No matter the fact that they were opposing parties. And I came into parliament not really appreciating that. I remember one session. Same for me, current for me, and all the director had a shelter match. And they sheltered across the room and I can remember a Taylor point in his end. Shirt coming out of his pants and I the radio shut the sitting down. I mean, and we going into the lunchroom and it was like nothing just happened between those two. And I told them that was a defining moment for me. You know, I always tell them, you know, a man and I, a lot of people don't appreciate that. A man and I are very good friends. You know, a man and I were arguing the House and we come on sit down and have lunch. Dr. Ewing and I, very good friends. I was a leader in the

48:55opposition. He was the premier. We would argue that come down and have lunch. But I, you know, but I find that's for mature people because you have politicians today or who came after who would look at you and walk at you, walk past you like. Yes, yes. Come under the issue. You know, and I'm like, okay, you know, we didn't used to be at that level. Sure. So it's become divisive a lot of the times from the actual politician, not so much the institution or the modesty. But the individuals make it that way. I have certain supporters from certain people who will treat me the way their constituent had treats, treats me. Right? It comes with maturity. See, that's why I often say while a lot of people say politics is a dirty game, if you call it a game, it's not dirty. It can only be as dirty as some of the players making the individual. You know, and omelettes only as good as the egg. Absolutely. Absolutely. And so when we

50:00look at all of that, as I often say, we have come a long way in the past 50 or so years. I don't bother to get in this old debate of whether it's 50 years or over 50 years since. I just simply celebrate the occasion because when we look back 50 years ago, there's hardly anything in this country. You were talking about scholarships and the challenges you had. Now you know, back then, the British was one to policeman, one to maybe teach a, and that's about it. And like I said, on previous program, we start seeing the chains when Jigsdow is established a Philatelic Bureau scholarship. For the first time, we had a little hundreds of students and cessative governments, including the administration, continue to build on that. But let's get back to the point, or get to that point, when you ran head of the PDM and became the premier of discussion.

51:09You skipped an important part because when I ran in 2012, I was not the leader. It took a little convincing from my mom. She didn't want me to go in politics. Okay. Because we were the home that when the PDM lose, they were through Pampers and I. It was always really nasty experience for us. Yeah. Yeah. You know, so mom didn't want me to go into frontline politics. It took some convincing from my own Sarah. Yes. Right? So it was a tough cookie. Oh yeah. She ran it over back. Remember she ran it over back. No, but that was a lady. Yeah. Again, the spite party, she loved me did. Oh yeah. And was a frequent listener to expressions. Actually, she had challenged me on Domino's, but unfortunately I didn't get to take it up before. She would have been you. I promise you. No, but when I went back into active politics because I had taken a break from it, I started my family. And 2012, I became the deputy leader of the PDM in June. I had gone to that convention

52:17with no intentions of being elected to any position because I went in as an alternate delegate. And I came out as the deputy leader on the ball also skipping was the leader. And then the election was called in November that year, November. And he was unsuccessful. So it was kind of like fell to me. And I always tell people I was not present at my convention when I was elected leader of the PDM. So what? I was, I was, as I am today, the director of youth for the Texas and Kekizahatis, the president, and they called a special convention because we had the chance of becoming the government with a by-election. You would remember, which I hold, because it was close, close victory anyway. And I was at the funeral of the first young person that I ever really died on my leadership, my watch. And I told them, I'm going to the funeral. You can go ahead with

53:20your convention, but I have an obligation. And when I walked into that door at one o'clock after the funeral, I was shown an opportunity, congratulations Madam Leader. Wow. I'm telling you. How did you feel? How could you let me in my absence? You know, and then I mean, it took, it was not the right way I, I had no intentions of being leaders. I would have run for leaders six months before. Right? Despite the experience that I gathered and the, I had given a lot of knowledge, I didn't feel I was ready to even consider something like that and was never on my mind. I've always been the one who write speeches, the one who organized this or write letters and that was me. And so because we were at opposition, you didn't have time to be in your feelings. This was December and we had a bi-election come January. So I just went straight into the world. Right? I was then elected amongst my peers

54:25for the leader of the opposition position. So again, I took that on. First of all, with the thing, that on that was, that was special because people didn't know how to treat you as the leader of the opposition and being a female. But we came in with a new constitution. So not only did I take on that traditional rule, but I ended up cheering up a very public appropriations committee and a more aggressive public accounts committee. So when you had to speak to civil servants and people who hear you, you're trying as much as possible and they're not responding or they're not answering what you know to be truthfully. I'll tell you that. I mean, people were offended by that rule. So I started gaining enemies, right? Because you have to hold people into account and you have to hold them into account publicly. This was the first time. You know, first time it was done. So then

55:29I made it through 2012. I was, I tell you one thing that surprised me being the top vote earner. Because while I'm from South Kekers, we have a very small vote in Poland. South Kekers was the island that perhaps treated me the worst politically in terms of numbers. But Grand Turk supported me. Provo came across, but North Kekers, if there was one island that consistently supported me, solid. What's North Kekers? North Kekers. And I remember my friend, R.D. Anabel Dunhu-Gardner, whose birthday was yesterday? Happy Belated birthday. Said that's that Baptist thing. I was just thinking so, you know, I was going to have to get back. If you were enrolled in the churches and that's Baptist's influence, that's not a lot to do with it. Because they knew me, you know, I remember this lady who very strong, I could call her names. We called her the general. She's Deva Williams-Mal. She helped campaign for me. All for me. She

56:33knew BDM. And so, conference happened and I had to be an appropriations committee for the first day of conference. She told my sister, say, hey, I didn't campaign for her to be able to talk me no appropriating. She got to come church. So, you know, they wrapped that up and go to church conference. But North Kekers has really always been good to me. Always been good to me. And then Provost, Provost, the Kekers Islands, I got to say, pulled me through and done next time. Let me apologize to many who may have posted comments in that, despite wearing reading glasses, I cannot see it from that distance. So, I hope you would understand. So, I encourage you to send your views to my phone, message me at 244-7332. I have one here from a beautiful lady. I think I know she is, but she just has a self-style as

57:35misunstoppable anyway. And she says, and anyway, she says, please give Honorable Charlene Robinson her credit when she said she could not stop the slums. Oh my god. This matter would never die, it would be a good thing. I almost won't quote Finland, but let's say you have a big country, you know, but you and I had that interview and the clarification was made and the show you said, when you said, you remember, you said, when you said you can't stop the slums, I say, no, I'm saying I'm going to do everything I can to reduce them. But because it's a push factor and a pull factor, we don't control what happens in Haiti. You know, the US cannot stop it, the UK cannot stop it, so I won't go and wreck it like a Finland. If these big countries couldn't, you know, and it's just getting worse. Before we go back to the direct political part of it, of course today we see an uptick. Oh my gosh.

58:37And the numbers are unbelievable. Slips coming, the number of persons. What should take on all of this? And what would you say to the people of the Turks and Kekers Islands? The government of the Turks and Kekers Islands? Well, let me say this. Be real and be honest with the people. The government must be honest. Coming in and telling them you could stop it, everybody realized now that you can't, but your job is to reduce. So when I was in the chair, I did quite a bit of national security, but particular reference to that because we drafted the first ever national security strategy and illegal slums and in number of illegals was high priority, right? The expansion of the radar was important. The ship rider agreement with the Bahamas, and I have to credit the former prime minister, the human, in a human menace and Darren Hanfield. They decided on the Caracomph Law. Listen, she's here representing the Turks and Kekers,

59:39but this our girl and they decided they wanted to assist me and we created the ship rider agreement. There's so many things that have to work together, but what you have to do is to not just work at the and expecting them to stop it and hate it because it's good for them to come out and send back money. Oh yes. All right, that's good for them. That's a good economic plan. Quite right, but as you go on, for the benefit of the public who may not know, well, I'm fully aware of when ship riders agreement star and United States have them with the Jamaica and many other countries explain to the benefit of the people. Because our resources are limited, Bahamas have bigger boats, more manpower. We entered into an agreement where they could patrol so much of our waters. But they identified a bottleneck where we can cut them off because you know where in Agua is, you know, they identified areas that they could patrol that were kind of like ward them off. And it happened. In my term, we reunited our relationship with the US Coast Guard in our back,

1:00:41and there were six or seven loops heading for Turks and Kekers in one night. And the Coast Guard and others were able to turn around. And I think it was two that ended up, the Bahamas. I'll take one and you process the other. You know, that's the kind of relationship we had. Some people will say, why are you have the radar there and you need to detect them, right? Before they become on the cloud every Sunday land. So you're not losing, yes, to the man on the street and losing when you're repatriating. But that's people that didn't make it to the land, right? The other thing that we have to concentrate on the post-actors. And that's why you're going to hear me. Even if I die and they don't create the trade school, you're going to hear me from the Grave City Real Trade School that's necessary. A lot of them come and they're able to get cheap get work because people are looking for cheap labor, or particular skills that they now only have, right? So you have to upskill your people. You have to make sure the people are part of

1:01:43the plan. When we started Operation Guardian myself and Oliver Sean, we were doing a regular, I won't say pick up, but we were doing regular patrolling of the streets and removing illegal and gave them the opportunity to leave if they wanted to. Over 200 had responded. And Jackson K. Gizalis would write me and Oliver Sean and they said, oh great job, but don't touch my action. Yes, I know. That's the problem, right? So while the government can try all it can create the trade school and give us some people some skills and take away the need for us, but that that that labor they'll we will always need them for. Just don't get me wrong. We need our people to come along with it because there's a people that continue to hire them. Quite right. Right? You don't want to and it's not just the sluice that coming from Haiti, but we have people who come and overstay from all countries, all countries. And let me make it clear that

1:02:45Jackson K. Gizalis, our illegal numbers is not really from sluice. It's from people who have reprimanded or came illegally from visas and overstay it. Well, I'll fail out of status. So it's to me it's not it's not an easy fix, but it's something you have to keep working at. You can't just throw up your hands. Right. Now let's go back then to your term at the helm. The first female to be made premier of these Jackson K. Gizalis, how is that alike? I think I came in on a high. Well, I'll be honest with you. I after my term is leader of the opposition, I always see you in an election in the ballot box as close in the votes are counted. Sure. Right. So when I came out as the top vote gather again, Jackson K. Gizalis people shocked me. They really, really did. The win, we worked for that. We worked for that win because as opposition,

1:03:51we didn't just oppose, we sat with, we helped, but we worked consistently for those four years. So people got to know us. They saw an alternative government. We had a shadow government, you know, so even when I, the night of the results, we left the party headquarters with no final results. A lot of my, I think all of the constituency said come through with no oil island. So that morning, I got up and my husband says, check it for me, nobody say anything. No. So I said, you know, when I left, left the headquarters on the Sean Arthur start talking about seren and I said, buddy, I ain't got no sea. I still stand it. You know it. That was a joke for us. So that morning, my husband said, well, I don't turn on RTC. I return on RTC. And it wasn't even 20 minutes. The supervisor elections that Lewis came on to announce the oil island. Nobody said anything to me or anything. So he announced the, the numbers. I missed the hall. I was so excited. I ran up and down my corridor. Karen win, Karen

1:04:54win because I said Karen can win the seat. And people felt like Karen couldn't miss. I celebrated Karen. And my husband says, I said, you idiot, you to prevail. I said, you to prevail. And I caught myself and I felt like I spaced out. And then my yard was swarming with tactical officers. I don't remember how that conversation went, but the police just showed up with guns and then black. Right. Secure my promise and take whatever. Well, they anticipate like something. No, no, no, no, that was how they do. They security checks and they showed. Yeah. So I didn't know that's how it's going to be. So I said to them, hey, hey, give me a break. Give me a break. My kids aren't here. They you know, they used to say no guns. But they showed up to check security and to do everything. And I was I was blown away, honestly. And I said, give me the weekend. Just give me the weekend. I

1:05:54promised you I said, you're gonna come. I said, you're gonna do all your assessment. I said, but don't this is just too much. I felt overwhelmed in that moment. And Mr. Holden, I go on to not kick us to celebrate with other world pigs. I saw a couple of elected members. My husband and my two children got stuck on the back. And I had to call that same police that I tell them please give me a break. You know, so I mean, you know, things became calm. And I knew I just had to get to work. So I worked on a four year clock. So we had our manifesto. I created something called promise tracker. So I knew I was premier when I took on finance that there was 72 promises out of the change document that I had to make sure was delivered and every one of my ministers. And we went to every permanent secretary, every head of the department and gave them a manifesto. Because La La Land says the civil service works for you. Reality may be a bit different. But there was some

1:06:57civil service. Oh my gosh, I would I would call their names, but they were just incredible. They were from opposite party, but they understood the assignment. This is about country. You know, so I started off of smooth by February. We started operation. Got in and taken on the amount of illegal vehicles. We repatriated over a thousand not some slopes over a thousand. We realized we can't afford to keep doing this. You know, and so we were coming along. We had our ground game, everything. Dan came September nine months later, hurricane. Shifted all of your priorities. So instead of getting a lot of the stuff you anticipated to have done in the first year, by that time, I tell you how we hit the ground running. We bought that building that the police is in the headquarters before the end of the financial year and people say, send money back like it's be money. We bought that for the police and we bought the customer service park, the former cement

1:08:03employees. We bought those. So every year the end of the financial year before I just write whatever off. We bought the national stadium and then we bought the building for the trade school. National stadium, your main which private school has for us. So that started our trend of buying stuff. If I should put it that way, but we bought it in a plan. So when the hurricane came, it upseted our revenue base. We had to move quickly to try and get places like beaches back up that was a great source of revenue. But I'm sort of normalcy because everywhere was really affected the school stuff. It was just something I remember that night sitting and people said I was in Jamaica. I don't know why I would have gone to Jamaica but anyway, I was in. One of my husbands boss place, up like fourth floor levelling. And I was there with my husband who was a former

1:09:09public health director and my brother-in-law Clyde who was a planning director. I hear these two men sitting up to the table basically planning this rebuild that. I went to sleep in the store. I prayed and when I woke up though it was so loud. It's like a train was running around the building at. I got so scared because I'm like, oh god, what am I going to wake up to tomorrow? And the spirit, I always tell them, say get out of the store and find a magazine in this place and just anoint every page with the oil that I had just received the day before and put the sign of the cross on every island so you preserve life and you know, ask God for help. And I did that and I went to sleep. I woke up the next one I could not believe it. Having lived through Ike, I still think Ike was worse than Irma. A lot of people can't appreciate that but it was really devastating and driving through provost. I'm like, okay, I only affected that part but now here

1:10:17it is really a bread basket. So I felt the heaviness of that and then I went to all the islands when I flew over South Cakers, maybe four houses from South Cakers was unaffected. And Dr. Virginia and I were on that plane and neither of us wanted to see the other one cry at. I people over, she see me and I you guys see me. You know, because it was really hard. You know, it was really hard. And I know what we didn't like post Ike. So I used all of my own little experiences but thank God, you know, we were able to create some policies that move things quickly. One of the disappointments for me in that period was the Kim and Islands government, all done so all done now. I'm like, Lockland, he and I were very close. The premier of Kim and so he sent his helicopter to help me because, but that morning three prisoners had escaped. They let the yellow wing on fire. A lot of people don't appreciate all the struggles. So when the government and I got to the airport, they said we're

1:11:23basically coming there in the helicopter and we don't want you to go to Grandeur Cantella with Seaf in whatever else. So they did all of that but they didn't come back and they gave us the clearance but this helicopter that was used even during the Music Administration after Ike was there and the government and I decided we're going to take this helicopter because we had already communicated to Solky that we were going to come and see them. We had already communicated to the islands. I got reported for that to the Integrity Commission. I vaguely remember something like that. Yes. I didn't even know I was sitting at a table in November the next year for graduation of so many medical students and I visited a heart trust in Jamaica and I got a report from the Integrity Commission telling me a letter saying you've been clear. I said, clear the what? That's when I knew I was under investigation for securing or procuring the use of the helicopter without approval or whatever whatever. Anyway, I told them that I would have paid. I wrote overseas

1:12:24territories, leaders and I told them what I was going through. Everybody was like, okay, we'll help you pay and all like that. I said, but I don't think I should. It isn't as if I understood the process. Don't get me wrong. It's not impersonal for you. Yeah, but I understand that's when I realized something. Shall I? That's procurement thing. Just do what you got to do. So I, we got through that. We created a recovery plan that was obviously not supported much by the public service. No matter what we did, we had appointed Wesley Clevel as the chair of that and we didn't get a lot of responses or a lot of work coming from the public service. So we ended up doing the recovery projects in a regular budget. But we were satisfied. To this day, I am satisfied with the rebuilding. I'm satisfied. People who looked in, I actually got an award from UE Legacy Foundation when they looked at how quickly Jackson Kaker's was able to bounce back. And that is because we focused heavily

1:13:30on photos, assisting photos. One day, Alba Daroia and I were at the airport facilitating the people who came and making sure they formed the right knowledge that just to get them into turn back on the power, we gave all sorts of concessions and stuff for beaches and everybody else to just be able to open their doors. And I remember the late butch, it says, I'm going to give you a Christmas present. I said, you think you can? He said, yes, I said, what do you need? And he's like, I need this, this, this, this, this. No, you can't get that, that, but you get this, this. And by Christmas, beaches was out. So that helped our air left. And then we, people said we should have used the fun for people's homes. But we had so many schools that had to be rebuilt. And remember how revenue was was was nonexistent at some point in the end down. And so we used that to help rebuild schools. I tell you another story how I know God was so so present. And a lot of people understand, don't understand how I got through a lot of things, right? Apart from that oil, there was

1:14:39Bishop Noza. Which prophet Leo Adely? Which oil you referring to? I would tell you the oil that I used to pray over the islands that night when Irma was passing. Bishop, a prophet Leo Adely came to Bishop Brian Cox Church, every birthday Bishop Cox. Can this is a birthday? Yes. I'm going to save my special birthday for for for hate and after. But he came and I went to this service and he called me, and he said, Lord said to get this country ready for a storm. Like, like, seriously, not Lord. Seriously, I just got here, you know? And I remember sitting down talking to my P.S. and we agreed, we're going to up our payments and we got to increase this part of the insurance. And that's how we ended up getting as much as we got. And he left a bottle of oil for me. And that's the same oil that I used to pray over the islands the night. But when he, when he did that, some people say don't accept stuff. But I got settled in my mind like, okay, this is going to happen. So I kind of mentally was

1:15:45prepared for what came because, you know, I had like months notice. When I went through even the pandemic, right? I think the one thing that got me through more than anything I prayed, sometimes under a caron and I will get in my office and be prayed, right? I didn't have a lot of people come to my office to pray for me. I don't believe a lot of people come in and lay in hands on you. I come up in a different way. You know, but a lot of people supported me and prayed me a lot of email post in this country, carried me. You know? So I credit a lot of, you know, you got over the hurricanes, you started rebuilding. You know, you got the kids back to school parents, mines are more settled, you know, they can go to work, workplaces were opening again. And so you, and then two years, you're just going at your goals and then comes the pandemic. I remember. And I could

1:16:46like, that I killed a priest and didn't bury him. And then I had my friend and brother and then probably just a minute and then he's like, what, what, what, I saw you're completely because I didn't have a door yet. You know, that was even worse. You know, but I firmly believe that if I weren't relying on God, I really would have thrown up my hands. You know, I really would have thrown up my hands. But in the period, don't miss the whole, I think we were able to accomplish a lot. And I think because a lot of people choose to focus on certain things, they missed a lot of important things that were done. You know, you see, like I constantly say, each administration in their own way helped to take us to where we are today. And so while it may be convenient and cheap politics, that administration did nothing, that's absolute nonsense. And it's

1:17:49just like sometimes I find myself answering some with regards to the current administration. And the current premier, because many of them don't know this struggles, the hardships, because you know, being the leader of a country. Or the story behind certain decisions. Yeah. Why you had to make certain decisions. Right. You know, and being the leader of a country, that's no easy time. No, whatever. And it's amazing that you're looking as young as you are considering the other day when you, I'm not going to announce it when you took told me it's your birthday. I said, wow, you don't look one bit. 55. That number. 55. Can you reach where I turn it? I still 55. I could write that. Congratulations. You're doing real, real great. That about it. Let's get back to the again, your tenure. You mentioned a number of the good things that you were able to do during that period. But I would say no doubt the pandemic as it were really through a spanner

1:18:58in your works. And it is felt that particularly God to the stimulus. First ever. Yes. And how you handle that. Some persons feel that may very well have contributed to your defeat eventually. Yeah. How do you feel about that? But you see, it's narrative as well. Public relations is a very important thing. My husband always burns that. But I find that. Say that again. Ask me. Public relations is a very important thing. So my government, remember, we did a lot of press conferences. We did town hall meetings. I believe in going to the constituencies. So they can form that budget, right? But the stimulus was the first ever. I had to make a decision. My government had to make a decision. At a time when we closed down, a lot of people don't appreciate them. When you close down the airport, the ports, that's like 20 million, 20, 25 million dollars a month that you're not making. So your leftward savings, your savings is just building

1:20:03because you're just recovering from a hurricane. And you had to close the airport. Why we had to close is because. Primary health care was lacking. Of course, we didn't have the machine. We were sending our tests to the Bahamas. We just didn't have a public health lab. So we're trying to build a lab, build staff, build capacity in a pandemic. When we closed down the airport, a lot of people says all she gave the farthest stimulus. You close down the airport, you lock in foreign people. They ain't got no way to make no money. And it isn't a stimulus that was given to the foreign people alone. It was given to everybody in the tourism sector or who was serving the sector. So the people on the boat, the security at the airport, we ended up getting involved. The people who have jewelry stores or souvenirs stores, they're all of them. But what people saw was them getting their monies first. Now let me explain to you, of course, I don't carry out the payments. We make

1:21:07the policy. A lot of Turks and Kekis Islanders did not have documents. That's one of the core problems. Some of that continues today. So you have Turks and Kekis Islanders that don't have a status card or don't have a passport or I mean it's all ironed out now because you know these are several stimulus later. So we had that challenge. We had a challenge of how many people were put to process from the public service, put to process it. We had the challenge of the narrative. Some people were like, oh, I ain't getting any resources. Some of them didn't even have a life. But it was not the only stimulus. We gave TCI Islanders the two stimulus. One was Turks and Kekis Islander alone. That's the broader sector. When we realize it's going to be we're going to be closed longer than that. Let's take a bit of Turks and Kekis Islanders alone or Turks and Kekis Islanders and British or CIS. Turks and Kekis Islanders alone. We didn't give BOTCs. Well, that's an interesting one.

1:22:08And so I have to raise with this government, with this government, why it's always Turks and Kekis Islanders. That was something new to this government. Is that you think then British insistence? They tried to with us. They did. I'll be honest with you and the people in cabin can say they suggested it. But we didn't have much money coming in. I mean, I guess you can do it now because they got way more money. But we had Turks and Kekis Islander only stimulus, business, 100, I mean, majority owned for Turks and Kekis Islanders. So we were discriminatory in a number of our stimulus. And it was suggested to us because even the food we did, food through social, that we didn't allow for expatience to benefit. And our position was if you kind of want to take care of yourself, that's one of the reasons for you having a workman. And so under that, if you

1:23:11kind of want to take care of yourself, then you have to leave. I remember that was a sticky point for us. But nonetheless, we kept our position. So we had the unemployment benefit was for everyone. And to this day when the other slow season is coming on, when hotels close, persons can actually benefit from the unemployment benefit. So we put in a whole lot, the people only remember that one stimulus. And there was like before five stimulus. So you had people who, up a couple of months ago, this lady goes like, miss, I got the first stimulus because I was in the sector, the second one because I was a Turks and I got the grocery voucher for her sister, I think, actually had the unemployment benefit. And a lot of people just took the narrative. And the truth is, yes, you would say it, but you couldn't spend all the time saying it. Things were just moving so rapidly, you're trying to keep people alive. So that was definitely, I think, one of the reasons I wasn't

1:24:19reelected. I think that's what I was saying. A lot of people even up to now people say, oh, she kept the fire and I said, yeah, I gave you more. I'm still looking back in your tenure then in government and as premier of the country, what do you view as your greatest success and what do you, as somebody pose, your greatest regret or failure? I think my achievements with uplifting people, like saving homes, giving people an opportunity to own a home to the STEM duty policy, providing stimulus for people when it was a difficult period, the achievements in national security, even setting up the national security unit and having the government and the premier work closer. One of the things a lot of

1:25:20people don't see from the spin-off, people hear me talk about joined up government and I always have to praise Rodney Adams because he introduced me into this phrase, peer prevention, intervention, enforcement and rehabilitation and sad leaders and kickers is really, even the public is just too focused on just enforcement. They're cheering on ill for our young people. But out of that came the Department of Rehabilitation and Communities, which I think is really key for what is happening now. I think it for structurally, we did extremely well. Every time I fly into South Kakers, like a little boost, I said, that's just my apple. I was happy to do that for the SOLKY. Providencialities and grant repairs. We had gone so far. So we did a lot in terms of schools and roads and government buildings. South Kakers got its first government complex and however many decades. In terms of youth, we did solid policies.

1:26:21We increased scholarships by more than a million dollars. We bought the building for trade school, which I think is still a part of crime fighting, helps you with immigration and also gives these young people a skill. We did a lot in terms of health care as well. My treatment of broad policy took a little while, but saving lives I think is always an important thing to do. I think when people look around, Turks and Kakers of their honest, every constituency could see something that my government did. And I made a major investment. We poured into communities, no community was left behind, no constituency and anybody, nobody could back-talk me on that. Right? So we carried out quite a bit. I think the failure comes with not having

1:27:24not having a public service that you could really hold into account. Governor Deakin became a very good partner for me unlike the governor before because I was at Lorda Marg's dinner table saying you need to call this man home. Quick, because I felt that he the way we even sat in cabinet, I'll say this because this is even our term. My cabinet members will sit here and the governor and the AG and the DG will sit like we are. Yes, when Governor Deakin came in the very first meeting, he said, come and sit on the side of it. Who do you want on the side of you? And he just positioned everybody differently. Right? So I think for me, I was able to achieve quite a bit in the end because of him. But you criticized quite a bit, particularly for saying that you all could complete each other's sentences. Oh, I never said that. He did. That's something. And let me tell you why. And it wasn't his sentence I was finishing.

1:28:29He bought into our plan. So when I said I have 10 projects that are stuck, I need you to work the civil service. We had special meetings and he would chase his public service. Yes. That's great. So I'm telling you, I'm telling you, you know, and say what you like, you really need a governor that works with you because the civil service is still on slams. You know, and a lot of times I used to have capital board. That's one of the reasons why so much was accomplished one year. If our capital program we did over 90% achievement. So when Oliver Rufus was doing like 20% what we budget we pushed through because they had capital board meetings every month with all the permanent secretaries. When is your business case coming? And a lot of people didn't like that. You know, so for me, if I had a governor who partnered with me the whole time and pushed a lot of public service to do much of what policies and everything we would have done.

1:29:30We would have achieved more. Earlier on you referred to working with Rodney Adams. And of course I always give him his credit. I've watched his rise. People might not know. I think his first job out of high school might have been with my ministry. But anyway, and so I was always in his corner. Now, to me it became obvious that he has reached a point where the British wasn't putting him anywhere further. So it's the point that he'd been that same drum. But fast forward to what we have today. And I recall some years ago you and bull in oxing for a commission of police. At one time anyway to keep you warm or whatever. How do you feel about the current changes, the recruitment of Bailey and Bailey style of management with number of

1:30:32these other people bringing in for top management and what have you. Against the cry of a lot of the public, members of the public are claiming that qualified local Turks and kickers are on us in the force of being overlooked. But you take. I'm not happy at all with what I see happening in the police force and even the style of policing. I'm not a big fan of the Jamaican style of policing. I live there. I watch a lot of their news. I know the the extra judicial killings is something they complain about. They're not not using the body cams is something they complain about. I felt from the time we as a people call for outside help when we should have given commission an Edward Hall more. We went down a slippery slope. We kept experimenting. If you remember over the years, I would say we got to cut out the experimenting. Because when we bring

1:31:37persons a lot of times the persons aren't adding, in my opinion, when I called for certain heads and they weren't allowing the local police officers to contribute to their management. So a lot of people go like, oh well they didn't do anything. They weren't allowed to do a lot of things. I think Trevor Bauding is the one that came closest to engaging more of the locals. What we see today is a succession plan that's going on where it's intentional or not. But when you're bringing in a number of senior persons putting them in certain positions, they are more empowered to take over when certain people leave. I'm not seeing the capacity being built internally. I have a problem at this stage of us still having to bring in commissioners. So worse, when the head looks like the photo I see yesterday. When I see the photo yesterday of Kenny Grant acting I saw Rodney at the table, but I don't recognize the other people

1:32:40who are the seniors now in the police force. This is a period where we have to build and not break down. A lot of police officers morale is low. A lot of them don't feel like they are part of the organization. And then of course you have a particular nation that's always boasting. And they are the ones being recruited in the larger numbers. I don't get what statistics they put out. It is showing. And then you have a public that is just so grateful for the murder drop. That we're not paying attention to the same force that we're going to have to go back to. We're at a number of these individuals go back to their home. I trust that we get a lot out of them because it's happening. The governor is allowing them to be recruited so she knows more than we do. The premier is funding them so he knows more than we do. There are three posts that's making more than I did when I was pre-demo. That's right. So we've become, I chuckle and I say the other day,

1:33:44I say these guys are going to be national heroes because I saw the statistics the other day from the FSC where Jamaica kind of like pushed out one of his new little countries and to the modern monies they're sending home. But what we are risking now having a force that doesn't look like us. The culture doesn't look like us. And those who have given their lives are feeling left out. And if you talk to a number of them they're ready to leave. And you have to say to them, you know, this one lasts forever. I know it is rough but we have to continue to support our beliefs. I wouldn't make a lot of public statements because I still think I have a voice of influence. What is happening in the police force is certainly not a direction that I was premile that I would sit by and allow to happen. The organization itself is in deep trouble. And the ash change is difficult and people go like, oh yeah, but it's how you bring the change.

1:34:50It's how you bring the change. But I mean apart from that we require a lot more transparency. It's unfortunate that you know police officers feel that they have to take you know the stab-dishment to court over promotions and people don't see the big of picture. It isn't that I didn't get a promotion. It is something that's wrong with the process. And the matter we allow people to not be held into a conno or not transparent, then that's when we head down a wrong path. All right so we don't really need to pay more attention to the police force. I do value your response although I have a different take on some of the matters but I need not go into that today because it's not me telling my story. Hey you are the focus. Now after a full term as premier and then elections recalled you who got the most votes the first time now lose your own seat.

1:35:56First and second time. Yeah and now lose your own seat. How do you reconcile that? It isn't anything to reconcile. I mean when I say that Rufus docked to you and rather someone in a similar position although he didn't get maybe kind of votes you got but anyway he lost his seat. Yeah but Voters are and that's one of the reasons I want I feel think we need to do a public education program on a lot of things because voters are emotional creatures. They wake up that morning and I walk past them in the and the voting booth and I didn't see them they get upset they go and they vote against me. You know I mean I got up that morning and I remember this guy man related to Oliver he said, Shale and we go in fashion I say wake for me. You know what I did? I went to the beach. There was no police no detail I went to the beach you know and I consider

1:37:00it still a privilege because they vote for you just how they vote for you they can vote against you and I took it that way because and I said that in my my speech where I announced that I would have been stepping down because that's where I'm minister anyway the approach. I didn't take it personal I had absolutely no regrets you know I was not depressed or down I reclaimed my life and I think that was that was easier for me because my mom didn't want me to go on politics anyway um frontline and then she came along with it and then the people were so nasty they were I mean they got so personal with stuff about you know they got personal and nasty and I never want to be seen as someone who quit. Right so I would have never walked away. So when the people said look here we had enough of your voice we don't think you have any more to offer and I say thank you very much I had two good terms I feel like I led a lot of groundwork

1:38:01because a lot of the stuff that we left is what the government continued with except my tree at school which I will always pop on right and I said good luck and I moved on and I can't tell anybody anybody one day that I've been said about that election itself I'll be telling a sad lie right now I'm going back to what I actually love I love I love working with young people I use this to say boy I wish somebody would pay the to-do youth work you know coming out of that I was able to secure a pension these ministers pension will be higher than mine soon right but I was able and I do quite a bit of work through an NGO that I've called impact right investing motivating and positioning and affirming citizens for tomorrow so I do quite a bit of work with young people and I'm quite fulfilled yes as you spoke it reminds me and I often say that to the current set of politicians some who hardly answer people's phone calls and think they are there forever the song says

1:39:11the same folks who put you here are today tomorrow just might take it away I hope they're listening you know but everybody in politicians have to understand that maybe because I wasn't like a politician that wasn't something I set out to do right you got to work while you're there because you want borrowed time I was on that four years so I used to drill civil servants yes when I can get this when I can get that when I can get this because I know my club and I know my people you know let me acknowledge a few of the comments persons coming in as we were getting down to I'm already on part of my reclaiming time at this person says good morning all I'm all Robinson after listening to your side of the story I didn't realize that under your tenure so much was done in your first year said to say that Mother Nature and World Crisis derailed what could have been a great success story what is your stance then or even now on the topic of independence rather you took the you must have read my script on written script that is

1:40:16will you resume writing about papers again and do you see yourself return to active politics oh my questions after your defeat what conclusion did your party came for the loss thanks and forever grateful for your contribution to our beautiful by nature tricks and cables look at that's loaded you know amazingly yes local now but I always give this person credit this is an individual all right at Jamaican who got married to a turkson kakasala and believe you me this man exudes more pride in turks and cables I can tell you many of them I can tell you many of us heritage turks I will I can tell you I'm so proud of the contribution this man makes yes there there are people if I were to call names um it listed to me they they they're able to string in

1:41:17burial but let me tell you something they love they have for this country is the second to to not no turkson kakasala could have loved the more than what I see and what they're prepared to do but to start tackling those questions one um the party should have done is post-mortem but when a leader loses at the end of the day you are on every ballot right um and when you lose your own seat then you know that vision is no longer what the people are by so the party then have to take it self in a different direction right and the party is as you can see they're regaining public trust and confidence and they're working what I return to act the politics and oh no no no no no I think um we give the wrong impression in this country that once you serve in in the political arena that that's the only way you can contribute no I've found another way

1:42:19that I think I can be impactful um especially for the future of turkson kakasala no have absolutely zero intentions of returning to frontline politics um where the party politics or government um what's the next question well let me go back independence yes so I wrote um a position paper for my party our collective position um and the first step for us has always been the creation of an independence commission that will do what Bermuda did go and look and see how ready are you what things need to be put in place I saw several interviews I didn't watch all of them so let me be clear I didn't watch all of the any of the interviews where people are saying we're ready for independence no no independence isn't a light thing that you can do whatever and then run back right it's a permanent position it's more a head matter than a heart matter

1:43:24you have if you do it wrong you start wrong you got problems stuck you stuck right um right now while we enjoy the the US dollar or the political stability the UK we can question with how many prime ministers they have had right they still offer some political stability that help us in every sector and a lot of people don't appreciate that that helps our economy right and it helps a lot of them but you have to stand position yourself with your people and key roles key agencies key institutions to be able to start even to speak about independence if you can't stop your own police force how you can start your defense force I hear you stick stick again of course in any conversation that I'll log interview what have you there are those complimentary comments that will come in and they will always be a few that may not be as complimentary here is one

1:44:27where someone says I'm not sure she wanted me to call her name so please don't and she says Mr. Hall is she trying to rewrite history because honestly I don't recall her government doing many of the things she's taking credit for on your show today so that and I find that amusing because no one is as blind as the man who doesn't want to see my government has been very was very visible we had town halls we put I mean we had press conferences everything we did was made public everything we did was made public I chuckled the other day because I read this long piece under so key with told so key water crisis and he said and there's this thing that people say successive governments when they don't want to talk about the current government successive governments um so key needs a water plan let me tell you about successive governments and that I was George Leibon under the roof of the administration board that our own plant

1:45:29my administration supported that by purchasing parts and maintaining it and and repairing systems that's what successive governments do build on and if that person will be honest and go back just google a lot of that stuff because it's good enough you could go on the premieres page and you'll find there's nothing nothing I would have said that I did and I didn't do and the truth about it is a lot of people had turned their hair ears off it was such a critical period that people were so busy criticizing then appreciating and you hear that one little voice and says yeah she bought back my talk alone I can stay in my house or yes my child actually got a scholarship you know people were just so blocked to positive it was such a rough period and I I know it made women even more scared I won't say that way to to go in that position because it went from personal attacks to not even hearing anything that you were doing I know so that I understand here's another

1:46:36comment this time positive the animal cart rider has always melted my heart wow a voice and her demeanor thank her for her presence person says his listing didn't want his name to be called but I think and I think I think I can I can say too that we when we leave public office a lot of the times we don't stay connected and I I started it when when like they open the South kickers airport I'd say hey work continued you know I let them know like this was something we started and you don't want to keep doing that because it looks petty yeah right but I I would dare that person to say one thing that I said to the and go and find out if I actually did it you know I I had a long list I have a long list of every project that we've done every piece of legislation that

1:47:42we passed every department we've set up sports housing that's a disappointment for Leica's housing should have been much further with providing you know that that service I mean every policy I have a documented and one single document right have another comment good morning brother all God blessing upon the government opposition the government and all the people the beautiful by nature tricks and cakers islands I'm enjoying your show as always keep up the awesome job what you're doing and believe it happy birthday to the first madam premier God may God continue to bless you one last as long as you say happy birthday step down I'll take it it's never belated in the entire month thank you very much for that all right and and um and this person says I'm will car ride Robinson I also believe your time on the consultative forum highlighted your leadership qualities and abilities and many including myself and my family cross party lines and supported you I believe that I believe I believe the consultative forum

1:48:47I think that's one of the reasons I got fired right I had no political ambitions it is honest honestly a day when um Lynn on RTC was playing Jake speech on the ninth of May and I said I'm going to apply to the party to run because I had done it nine years before and I was not going to do it again but I I believe that had a serious role and people getting to know me yes it is of a comment I believe you my advance at this already but first I'll read it anyway for the person to hear and they said oxenable Robinson she has any regrets about during the interim administration I regret them coming but do I regret serving no because if I stood for something I believed over the all my heart I I didn't take a position on part in fact I was chairman of the the pdm when I was oxen serve and I asked my past and I asked my party leader at the time was I was

1:49:48semen then of course chief and I I said to them should I take this and I was like yes and I said if I take it I'm going to take off my blue hat so I actually resigned as chairman of the pdm to serve on the consultative forum so everything I did was from a nationalist point of view right yeah have another comment and I guess this person doesn't mind me calling his name Valentino Selva he says good morning mr. Hall tell the honorable Charlene I love her I love her response to the police question I agree with her 100 percent what he said people like him I I love the fact that he's always engaged you know I mean small things people don't appreciate like we put an handicap legislation you know that matters for for particular class of citizens sure well we're getting right down to the end of expressions I must say for me I was looking forward to this and certainly

1:50:53no disappointment on my part it's a it's a long time since we sit in this manner and like you said from the beginning obviously the conversation is much different from that time I said to somebody the last time from the opening statement after that was like bring it down down to hell but anyway let me personally say to you again I am indeed thankful for the contribution that you have been have made your inspiration to many and like I said although I'm not playing the songs today for obvious reasons you may not fit the bill as a national hero but you are a hero in the mind of many persons and I want us to be careful with the national heroes status too thank you very much I took some heat from some folks about I don't know if you saw the article I wrote when I felt

1:51:53certain I saw I think I would be careful with generations to come what message we're sending I would not I'm not as much concerned about the Israelites who's not going to make it into the promised land because even God had to kill off some generations to get the God of Ones right and we have to be careful you know what we say our our conversations our stands despite how disconnected many people are with the young people the young people are listening and they are watching all right you know and it's so important that we we keep the bar high yes do we keep the bar high as we conclude this show on whence we came 50 years since the introduction of ministerial system what are your closing comments in that context we've accomplished quite a bit I I wrote something when it was our 45th year since elected government last but clear I actually was a part of the committee

1:52:55when we celebrated 25 years right so when we came on the 45th year I I wrote something about how every every leader even positioned this country according to what Jake's position and dream was I mean people big James dream of being convoluted something but James dream was just simple for unity between the cake is islands and and to position in about as people right I think a lot has lagged because we got political right stop in the swoops it's not politics I mean it's fine and then for the person who's opposing my government right but that affects every government that affects our our our our country and so many different ways and planning as the minister finance and so everything right the constitution is not political I'm Dr. Michael Mr. Kim and he built on with direct Taylor on the direct Taylor was doing right I had the unfortunate situation I

1:54:00think what the current premier told me he has the week for the leader the the PMP to be elected right I mean I was devastated because we were gotten so far and then you know he said the pandemic he don't want to travel to England English they will do it online and then he say it's too important to do online you know so I that that's something that will stay with me because I worked on the constitution under the PM and under the PMP so for me it's never been a political topic never right crime is another one um oh remember who's elected now um said I sat down and I allowed three two people to die from COVID and to be murdered and I watched that same number double for their mother young man that were killed in one year you know and they're in the position that I was right and have to face that you know I mean the crime expose as a whole lot of social issues and I would like to see more concentration on individuals social issues so that's why you see a lot

1:55:09of what I did was like a mothering approach I think I talked right so there are big topics that just transcend political lines and for us to even consider independence I'm pro independence make no mistake about it I think nobody wants to live in their parents house all the days of their life let's let's be real but you got to be ready when I move out of virtual memories guard right house I knew how I was gonna pay my bills I knew if this happened this what I will do and that it's core planning right and you can't just say five years ten years nope you have certain I don't want to say milestones with more mill students right but you got to have certain things right so for me the next 50 years should the law tell you could look different if we get the young people we seem to dismiss as the leaders of tomorrow to be co-leaders today to pass them the the heritage of integrity and transparency and accountability to give them a chance even after they make

1:56:13crazy mistakes because we all do right give them a chance to be kids give them a chance to benefit from the village right not rob them I think we could achieve so much more I think we could achieve so much more we just go back in the 50 years I can tell you we're back to square one in many ways every time I look at an allegation of a young man who was beaten by a police or you know it's just locked up and he I think of my African Jigs I'm like we're back to this whole thing of foreign police and young men right so I think we we have to keep looking back and making sure we push ourselves forward but not to stay there but to say where we need to go we are right out of time I want to thank you for being my guest today and I certainly want to thank you for the contribution that you've made to Turks and Kekers Islands may God continue to bless you I want to conclude

1:57:20this series with our former chief minister and premieres I'm waiting on a response from our little little skippings some more message about three times I hope because he has a story to tell an interesting one too and then culminate with the current premier honorable Charles Washington music told my viewers again a politician dies that we didn't have the telephone calls and because of the distance the monitor I see you have several comments I've not been able to read them but thank you very much it's the weekend I hope that everybody will have an enjoyable weekend and time with their family God bless Turks and Kekers Islands