Dennis Prager on God, Evil, and Charlie

0:00My name is Charlie Kirk. I run the largest pro-American student organization in the country fighting for the future of our republic. My call is to fight evil and to proclaim truth. If the most important thing for you is just feeling good, you're going to end up miserable. But if the most important thing is doing good, you will end up purposeful. College is a scam everybody. You've got to stop sending your kids to college. You should get married as young as possible and have as many kids as possible. Go start a turning point USA college chapter. Go start a turning point USA high school chapter. Go find out how your church can get involved. Sign up and become an activist. I gave my life to the Lord in fifth grade. Most important decision I ever made in my life. And I encourage you to do the same. Here I am. Lord, use me. Buckle up everybody. Here we go. The Charlie Kirk show is proudly sponsored by preserve gold, the leading gold and silver experts,

1:02and the only precious metals company I recommend to my family, friends and viewers. All right, welcome back to the Charlie Kirk show. We are joined by Oscar Ramirez. He's a real America's voice border correspondent with everything that happened over the weekend with a mencho. We wanted to have on the ground reporting. So Oscar, welcome to the show. Tell us where are you or if you can tell us roundabouts where you are and where is some of the worst violence happening? And is it still happening? Well, after the assassination and the execution of a namestial segera el mencho, the violence started escalating in the parts of the tourist areas in the part of Puerto Vallarta. And escalating to the parts that they have enormous control that is Michoacán in the parts of Guerrero, and also in Halisco, but this perplex and it just caused a domino effect. And it started happening in the north borders in cities like the one of the we are located. What, you know, they started doing narco blockades, burning cars, burning businesses to send a message to the government

2:04and to tell them that we have presence on these particular neighborhoods or tourist areas, and that we are going to terrorize the citizens and to let them know that they are critically hurt because the head of the snake was completely eliminated at this particular moment. And they started doing this in the part of the Guana, you know, burning cars, burning businesses. Until now yesterday we were reporting on the ground more than 22 incidents happen. What it means incidents between vehicles and also businesses that they were burned, sending a message strongly to the government of Mexico to tell them we have a lot of presence on these particular estates in the whole country and the whole territory. Now, a thing that is extremely important, just today, breaking news, the head of the military and the head of the Department of Defense in Mexico just made out of statement and an interview said that this was a clear collaboration with the United States of America in regards to the United States providing the intelligence to do the execution by the federal government

3:04of Nemesio Oseguera El Mencho. The violence right now, it was increasing last night and here in the city of Guana that is connected to San Diego, there was a still burning of vehicles continuously and several areas. But until now, schools have been off limits. Now they close the schools, they close the educational systems of an elementary junior high school, high schools and colleges, businesses are closed for security reasons off. The citizens, there has been multiple threats on social media groups by, you know, these, you know, particularly pages that they are incahudes with the organized crime telling the population that they're going to start shooting civilians after 10 o'clock at night, these days still walking. It is a huge national security threat. I, you know, I did a video on a report on a vehicle that it was burned just steps away from the border from the border wall. This tells you the level of audacity of the cartel and they burned that vehicle in front of a post on the territory in the American territory. This post that it has a huge camera from the US customs that basically tells you that they did it on purpose just to tell the American government.

4:08We know that you provided the information for our leader to be executed. So on this moment, the federal government has released statements that they will provide the security that it needs to be provided for tourists and also deployment of more military to the whole content to the whole country of Mexico. I have a bunch of questions here. As far as where the CJ GN cartel, the cartel, Haldisco, new generation, where does it rank in terms of the most violent, most powerful cartels in Mexico? That is the number one right now. And the Mexico Seguera El Mencho was one of the most violent ones and atrocious ones that clearly he sent a message to the population and to the world of the decapitations, this member embodies and he's the one that is basically pointed out to the multiple hundreds of thousands of mass graves that they have been found in our country of Mexico, missing people, extraction of organs, you know, in all this atrocious acts towards women in the country. Oscar, I think that's really baffling me. So 25 members of the National Guard killed, obvious mayhem throughout the country.

5:13I'm reading the LA Times this morning, Mexican president, Claudi Shimbam, insists country is at peace and remains calm after what's going on. What's her attitude towards all of this? It seems like she strikes a very strange tone with her remarks. And I guess the follow-up is what's next is this a spasm of violence or is this going to turn into a wider, I don't know what else to say besides war? Well, the Mexican people that we have common sense and there's millions of us. We know who perpetrated and who did this mission and who initiated this mission. And it was the American intelligence. If it wasn't for the Trump administration, this that just happened would have been done. And all of this that it's happened happening in the country of Mexico, this mantle in laboratories, the extraction of criminal leaders and leaders of cartels have been extracted to the United States of America. You know, the execution of Nameshosegueda and Manjo, all of this wouldn't be happening. Now, the Mexican president, she has an agenda and is a leftist socialist agenda and she needs to pander to her audience to say, we are not letting the gringo.

6:17We're not letting the white man to come and invade and intervene in our country, but we are collaborating so and so and so and quote unquote, we're collaborating with the American government for them to provide information for us to execute. That is how she's maneuvering this. And of course, she's saying that this all this mission was executed by the federal government, but now she's obligated to say that the American government are providing the information. This is history, guys. Nobody in history in the United States of America has had the more extraction of information that the Trump administration has right now. And why do I say that they have in Chappell's mouth and they have in May, they had Nicolás Maduro, all the extraction of information of how Mexico works and how corrupt all these dirty politicians that they're located in the Senate and Congress and Mexico. So the Trump administration basically knows the ins and outs of the government and they need to bend the knee when the Trump administration says we're going in as we're going in. Yeah, so my question is Oscar, is does this signal a change of policy in Mexico? Is this is this a turning point or is Claudia Scheinbaum doing this kicking and screaming and this is kind of going to be a one and done? What's your prediction?

7:24Well, the Mexican people are going to demand more now. If they have the capacity to execute, and the mess, you'll say, yeah, I'll mention why you're not going through several states and controlling these days that they're violently and critically controlled by the organized crime in the car. So basically what what the pressure of the American government, it is doing right now to Mexico is for the Mexican people to demand more from the Mexican government for them to execute this mission. If you were precise, and if you, you know, we lost some good ones, we lost a military man on this mission. But if you went over there and you executed the mission, why you're not doing that on every state. So it's going to have an effect on the senators on the opposition and the conservatives on the Christians on the Christian, you know, senators and Christian, you know, Congressmen that they are in our country to demand more from the opposition. Yeah, so Oscar, that's my question because the cartel is so interwoven with just basic businesses and the hotels and there's this. It's hard to draw a line between official government business and cartels, right?

8:25And will the people demand this? Will the, you know, is there popular support for more action against the cartels? And will is there enough will within the official government structure of Mexico? Absolutely, absolutely. And it is happening right now. And also what the Trump administration has done is that they have given the courage to senators on the opposition and on the right of Mexico to go and basically on Congress and on the Senate and expose the left wing political party and say, your corrupt, you're involved with the organized crime in the cartel. You know, one of the things that got viciously exposed is how this criminal organization had so much control over states and how they have the audacity to terrorize the citizens and they're still doing it until this point. So it's basically exposing the, you know, the weaknesses of our government and the Mexican people know that right now at this moment. So do you predict more violence in the days and weeks to come? I will not recommend American citizens to travel right now to several spots and several tourist spots. You know, it is, it's kind of agitated and let just sink in for the next couple of days over the federal government to have more control over really rural and difficult and in tough neighborhoods.

9:34I believe that is going to escalate a little bit in rewards are going to happen unless he who takes charge of this criminal organization that that is going to be the next step of how they're going to fight among each other for territory. Oscar Ramirez, Rabs, Border Correspondent in Mexico right now. Thank you so much, Oscar. Appreciate it. We'll have you back on as the story develops. Thank you so much. Thank you so much for the invitation, guys. Absolutely. Blake, you had one final thought and I just really important. I just want to close the book on the cartel thing. What was so insane is just the visual of literal cartel members. They're standing and they're wearing uniforms with their car cars. They have armored cars, armed vehicles, rocket launcher heavy heavy machinery, heavy weaponry and all I can think is this is a country that borders the United States and we've had 30 years plus of lots of adventures in the Middle East where we're often chasing people armed up just like that. But they're on at least the other side of the planet. They can't send rocket launchers super easily to the United States.

10:36You know who can the cartels and we see with them launching this for lack of a better terms insurgency where they're taking over huge chunks of central Mexico in demonstration of their leader being killed killing dozens of Mexican National Guard. It just almost actually strikes me as insane that we've had so many wars on the other side of the planet. And yet we haven't just said, okay, actually we're going to drone strike anyone like every armored vehicle that belongs to a cartel blow it up. It's just going to get total period. We're trying to play nice with Mexico wants to help us. That's great. But if they don't want to help us, we're going to do it anyway because it's not acceptable for there to be a total agree gangster actor in a neighboring country that has armored personnel carriers. Totally agree. All right. Well said, needed to be said. So then Charlie, by the way, totally agree with that. If we're going to use military force, that's the one place we should. For a lot of Americans, the healthcare system is reactive. You get sick first and then you wait for an appointment. Then insurance decides what you're allowed to have and suddenly the medication you need is delayed or it's not available.

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12:51I got to play a couple clips for you. 339. Young black kids growing up in the Bronx who don't even know what the word a computer is. They don't know. They don't know these things. 346. The other thing we should do is we should challenge these students. We should challenge students in these schools to have advanced placement programs in these schools. We have this notion that somehow if you're poor, you cannot do it. Poor kids are just as bright and just as tall as white kids. 250. The new one. I'm not, you know, I'm not trying to impress you. I'm just trying to impress upon you. I'm like you. I'm no better than you. You know, I'm a 960 SAT guy. You know, and I'm not trying to offend anyone, you know, trying to act all there if you got 940. But literally a 960 SAT guy. I cannot you you've never seen me read a speech because I cannot read a speech.

13:58Alright, so Gavin Newsom is trying to buddy up to the black community by saying, I'm dumb too. I can't read. This is okay. This man is going to run for president in 2028. And I want them to run this this moment on repeat on the ad. This is the bigotry of low expectations in living color. I've never seen such a clear example of that other than the two other clips that I played before. I mean, there's so many more. I remember Hillary Clinton when she was running for president. She didn't appearance in New York and then she should have played. No, it's the one she showed and she said she was on CPT. And then they said it was cautious politician time, but that's obviously it's like it's very wild. And all I can think of is this is a real study from 2019. Do you know about this? The Yale study. Yale did a study of how like the vocabulary that white liberals use and what they found is white liberals when they're talking to black people, they will actually deliberately down the code switch their vocabulary.

15:02They will basically act like they're talking to children and they'll get an accent. And they notice that white conservatives did not do this. They just did not change. Nope. And we expect the same out of everybody. It is literally the most racist comment and then you add on top of all of this that they don't think black people are smart enough to get ID. It is quite literally the most racist crap that you will ever hear coming out of the mouths of Democrats and they're pandering to them to win their votes by telling them they're dumb. And yet most of them will still vote for Democrats. And that's the baffling part of all of this. Here's Charlie reflecting on his time with Gavin Newsom. Remember Charlie went on Gavin Newsom's podcast was the first guest made lots of news 353. He is he is the fakest person. I think I've ever met my entire life so synthet and honestly that's very dangerous like incredibly dangerous like he's the type of person that could just like stare like oh yeah I voted for Trump and just like pass a lie detector test that that is very very

16:05damn you know just composed stone cold just like he's no no inhibitions whatsoever when it comes the deceit or lying or misleading. So Blake you and I were with Charlie when he went to that podcast when you interview or when he went on Gavin Newsom's podcast and I'll never forget we're driving away. And I go what was your impression he goes man that guy wants to be president. Yeah he always has it's really it's really glaring and it's it's really disturbing because I've got to say as much as we make fun of him here as much as we made fun and other times you and he deserves it. I don't think you can escape that feeling like it could happen. This is the dark future of America is 100% that Gavin Newsom could run beast slick enough have the right look say the right things and everyone will just sort of get behind it. It's like he's the politician utterly without qualities. He hasn't been a great governor of his state by any objective measure. It's been a catastrophe. He has big headline disasters like burning down a big chunk of Los Angeles and then he has the data driven disasters businesses leave people leave his state is entirely dependent on endless immigration inflow to not complete from foreign countries to not completely implode.

17:16And they're having you know they're driving out every billionaire because they have this wealth confiscation. He found Newsom says he's going to be to that but yeah but they can't break well that was I think it's a vote amendment. I don't think you can block it if they he's promised to veto it. We'll see what he does but on top and on top of that they have every other problem in the world and so yeah it's like he could win. Well it's interesting I got asked to write a piece and I forgot to tweet it out actually but I got asked to write a piece for the California post which is like the New York Post but for the West Coast. It was about Charlie what he thought about California and Charlie loved California loved how beautiful it was but he would always when you land there he goes man what a beautiful state to shame what they've done to it. Every time that was his first first thought his first comment and you know Gavin Newsom is just the living embodiment of what incompetent leadership looks like. The Democrat plan in 2028 is to run on making America California and it's it's going to be very shameful if we can't beat that pitch.

18:18I am so excited for our next guest. He's a man that needs no introduction to this audience but I will say it anyway. Dennis Prager is one of the most respected and influential thinkers writers and speakers in America. He's a nationally syndicated talk show host. He is the founder of Prager University and is a New York Times best selling author of nine books and he's a man who's been through a lot but most importantly to this audience as you all know he was a dear friend and mentor to Charlie Kirk and Dennis welcome back to the Charlie Kirk show it is an indescribable honor to have you. I'm delighted to be with you I'm delighted to be with you because you're you because it's TP USA and because I'm delighted to be able to speak perfectly honest for those who don't know I had a catastrophic fall in my home on November 12th of 2024.

19:27Which left me paralyzed from the shoulders down and not breathing without a ventilator and not speaking. I'm here I am having an interview with you so you can imagine for all those reasons and finally I just might note when I watch the funeral service and other memorial service. Other memorial services for Charlie and I heard all these people describe themselves as Charlie's closest friends I thought it was a great credit to Charlie like kids who think you know they are five kids and each one thinks that they are the parents favorite the parents did a good job. Charlie did a good job but I would just like to remind everybody or maybe they didn't even know it so remind might not be the actual verb and that is that his last book on Shabbat on taking a day in the name of God.

20:49And up there to stop in the name of God by honoring the Sabbath will transform your life was dedicated to me Charlie wrote a beautiful dedication Charlie called me I would say almost every week or at least five or eight years and he he would call. After listening to another tape of mine on on the Torah first five books of the Bible with questions and the whole idea of Shabbat came from our interactions. So you know i'm supposed to promote my book but here I am promoting Charlie's book well it's a beautiful beautiful testament to your guys is friendship you shared a deep deep bond and I and we are going to get to your book which is titled if there is no God the battle over who defines good and evil.

22:03And the fact that you're even coming out with a book Dennis is a miracle in a testament to your character and your fortitude and your strength of will but I want to read Erica Kirk's endorsement of the book I think it's just so beautiful and it's a bit long but I'm going to do it. This book is a treasure to me Dennis was more than a mentor to my husband Charlie he was a dear friend and one of the few voices who played a role in encouraging Charlie's moral courage the two of them shared a rare bond blessed by countless conversations about faith morality and what it means to live with conviction in a world that has lost its compass reading if there is no God feels like sitting at the table with both of them again. It carries forward the very message that both Dennis and Charlie lived and Charlie died believing that without God there can be no good and without truth there can be no freedom. She's beautiful yeah it meant a great deal to me that she would write such a thing in the midst of her grief.

23:13And her battling people who want to destroy the USA I have never encountered something like this effort to hurt a beautiful institution from people who supposedly are on our side it's I don't know if it's unprecedented but I can't think of a precedent. Yeah well you know I always tell people what God is unleashed man cannot stop and so we walk in great faith and great courage and the movement is expanding it's growing Charlie's legacy looms large I can tell you here at HQ but at all the chapters Dennis that are exploding it's not just you know we're opening 50 new chapters a day but it's they're not just two or three kids we're talking 10 15 20 50 kids 100 kids some of these chapters are thousands of students large now. Because of the life and the legacy that Charlie left behind and and you are a huge part of that Dennis and one of your most famous questions which relates to your book of course is the it's a famous one from from your days on the radio if your beloved if your beloved dog and a stranger drowning who do you say first this became a incredibly famous question.

24:37It's also sort of a starting point for this book please explain. That's right I've actually been asking this question for 50 years 50 years and the results are I have been the same throughout those 50 years I would ask high school students or college students. If they love their dogs which everybody who has one does and a stranger we're drowning in their dog we're drowning who would they try to say first I know that they would all love to save both and so on but they have to try to save one first. And virtually every instance come across economic racial religious lines in virtually every instance one third of the of the group said they would save the stranger one third said the dog and one third didn't know what they would do.

25:48Two thirds of Americans over half a century I would not save would not save what would not save that they would save the stranger and that led me to the whole supposition of the book that what that what they were doing is substituting emotions for values. I love my dog is an emotion humans are created in God's image is a value that's why I would save a stranger before my beloved dogs. My wife really loves our dogs I only love them she really loves them and she would save a stranger first because she believes that people are creating God's image animals are not.

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27:54I really want to drive home for anyone who is a more recent listener just and or just didn't know how important your moral guidance was to Charlie when he would think about moral questions Andrew you know he would mention this in private you know Dennis says this this is how Dennis used this problem he really looked up to you for moral reasoning like that and for framing things so many things that you would say and we would hear him repeat on campuses because you have that great way of distilling like that difference. You know using emotions instead of values and the cell differences between them I want us to play one of those clips just to illustrate that we have Charlie citing you for a moral question 487 I learned this from the great Dennis Prager says stop focusing on intentions focus on the actions so much better way to judge whether or not something is right or wrong intentions. As I've said before and there's a video that went viral the Nazis thought they were doing good they convinced themselves that they were doing good when in reality they were doing some of the greatest evil in the history of the species.

29:01That's very moving to me obviously I don't know if either of you know this Charlie visited me in my hospital room and he brought a copy of the trends of the. Of the transcript of his of his book little did I know little it never occurred to me of course that I would not see Charlie again and it broke my heart on on every grounds. Well Dennis even in the aftermath of Charlie's assassination you're your subtitle the battle over who defines good and evil and you think about I would say the vast majority of people reacted as you would expect and hope and try to the tragedy and sadness and horror and shock but there was some voices that reacted in glee in celebration and I can't help but think of your subtitle in that book.

30:10As the perfect distillation of why who the battle of who gets to find good and evil matters so much well if if man determines humans determine what is good and evil then you can have moral inversions where the Nazis are good are good guys and the Jews and others are bad guys you have that now in the Middle East. Where all of a sudden the Nazis of our time the true Nazis of our time Hamas are the good guys they're battling colonialism and Israel a democracy with one fifth of its citizens are Arab Muslims who thrive there. And who supported Israel by enlarge in this war. Israel is the bad guy. We are living in a morally inverted universe.

31:22Dennis I want to ask you a question that you address in the book it's called the problem of pain as he has said you know how does your book answer the question of why a supposedly good God allows for so much suffering and evil in the world. I have dealt with that all of my life and I have so much to say on it I'll try to be a concise alright first of all people need to deal with that issue before tragedy strikes in their life. If you start thinking about that question what only once you've been hurt it's too late I I for whatever reason was preoccupied with the problem of evil from my high school days.

32:27So I have I dealt with it before I was personally hit by the tragedy that I am currently living. Alright and therefore I already have answers people I give you a great example a woman called my radio show many years ago said you know I just want you to know Dennis that I always vehemently disagree with you on capital punishment I was opposed to capital punishment and you were arguably for it well I've come around now to your point of view I'm for capital punishment and I said why said because my brother was murdered. So, of course, I offered condolences, but then I said what needed to be said, that I said

33:34to her, wait a minute, so when millions of other people's brothers were murdered, you never asked the question. And she agreed she had never asked the question before. This is a common flaw in the human species. We deal with issues only when we are confronted by them. You've got to deal with these issues way before you're hit by them. I did, why may have dealing with it, is through reason and religion. The greatest combination there is Judeo-Christian religions and reason. And that is that God allows evil to take place because we would be robots otherwise. Life would lose its

34:46meaning. People would no longer be a free species. So, that has to happen. And as regards, a natural evil, if you will, cancer of the undeserving, you're right, that's, we don't have an answer to that. I've read book after book by theologian, after theologian. There's no great answer to the question. And therefore, we have only Job's, the answer at the end of Job where God says, where were you when I created the world? Do you know why eagles make nests? In other words, we're like puppies

35:57as compared to human beings in our ability to understand life. When we compare ourselves to God, we don't know the answer. But I will say I do believe that there's bad luck. Most religious people differ with me. But I think God, in my case, God allowed gravity to elect a friction to take its course. Well, what was he supposed to do? Stop it from happening to me. And I wrote this stuff decades before what happened to me. It's remarkable. And I know one thing I think about, I know Charlie had wanted to do his Sabbath book, even before your accident. I know he was planning it. But I also recall after it occurred, I know that really motivated him to make sure that

37:01was his next book that he would work on. And he moved him to complete it quickly. I don't know if that offers some solace to you or not. But I think I know Charlie drew some inspiration. He really wanted to get this Dennis inspired book because he knew maybe he wouldn't recover and he wanted to make sure that he would have be able to carry on your legacy as well with his own work. And now, I know none of us expected this, but we're glad that I guess you could return the favor. You are continuing Charlie's legacy. We're trying to continue Charlie's legacy. That's right. What happened? And I dedicated to my book, which is coming out now, if there is no God, to Charlie as it happens, which I would have done anyway. But now it was to Charlie's memory, which I still to this day, I find that almost as unbelievable as my my paralysis. Charlie Kirk is dead.

38:09It's this vibrant and incredibly young man. I know. Yeah. It's a it's a reality that we confront every day. And we still have a seat open here in the studio. Dennis and we'll never fill it. And but it's it's a comfort. I didn't realize how comforting it was going to be to for me personally to talk to you, Dennis and to see you doing so well. I didn't know what to expect when I saw you. And your mind is as vibrant and as alive as ever, even if your body is rebelling against you. And this has been truly wonderful. I wish we could have more time. And in fact, maybe we'll try for that. But thank you so much, Dennis Prager, for talking about your book and talking about Charlie with us today. I would love another opportunity to talk to you. And you really you may not be in that chair, but

39:11you're filling the seat beautifully. Thank you, Dennis. And finally, I just ask your listeners and viewers to order a copy of if there is no God. It will change lives. Everybody, please go get a copy today of Dennis's incredibly important new book. If there is no God, the battle over who defines good and evil. Get it today. Everywhere books are sold. Dennis Prager, God bless you and we'll talk with you soon. You too. Thank you. For more on many of these stories and news, you can trust go to CharlieKirk.com.