The Patrick Madrid Show: September 17, 2026 - Hour 3

0:00Hi Patrick Madrid here. Thanks for listening. Check out charity mobile and prayerfully consider making them your wireless carrier. Mention offer code Patrick and get a free phone. Go to charitymobile.com Love it, love it, love it, love it, love it, love it all the time. Compelling insights, unpredictable conversations, encouragement for your day, it's the Patrick Madrid show on row of the radio. That's life. That's true. 88 914 9149 and so begins the third hour of our three hour extravigants and known as the Patrick Madrid show. I sure appreciate you listening. Thank you. And we're going to go back to the phones in a moment. If you'd like to be on the air with your comment or question, please call 88 914 9149 and I'll look for your emails. My address is Patrick at relevantradio.com. Rosa in South Texas, thank you for holding over the

1:00break and I realize that you may have some more you want to talk about. The question you asked me before we had to go to the break was should we pray for the souls in hell and I gave you a quick answer but that probably wasn't enough. Right, I was thinking that could God possibly change his mind and save them later and during the second judgment could he possibly forgive them? Well, God of course can do anything that is consonant or consistent with his nature. So this is not a limitation on God's part. It is the nature of let's take a step back here and notice how we are in time and space and the nature of time for us is that we can learn things. We make mistakes, we repent, we forgive and we can go back and forth where you fall, you get up again and then you fall again and you get up again and that's because we live in

2:07time. So we're capable of doing that but when the body and the soul separate in death and the soul continues on into eternity, for all eternity, it's the soul you I we are no longer in time as we know it now. So the opportunity to change our minds to repent, etc. it ceases with death and entrance into eternity. And so we become in a way similar to how the angels are, we don't become angels but we become similar to how the angels experience eternity in that when they were created by God, they were given that test to serve God or serve yourself to love God or love yourself. And the angels took the test. It was an instantaneous thing for them. And as soon as they made their decision, either for God or against God, that was it. There's no way to change it because their

3:10decision is permanent, irrevocable. And so the good angels were good angels. They see God face to face in that moment forward. The bad angels, the demons, Satan, himself were cast down. And so this analogy of the angels, I think, can be helpful where there's no point in praying for the devil. There's no point in praying for demons that God would forgive them because it's permanent now. It's like cement that is wet at first. You can put your handprints in it. But when it dries, you could press your hands against it all you want, but you can't put any handprints in anymore because the concrete has now set. It's similar to that in an allegous way. So for the souls that send themselves to hell, their decision is now permanent. And it's not that God can't forgive them, but he already gave them the opportunity for forgiveness and they refused it. So for that reason, now that there is an eternity, there is no due over.

4:13There's no second chance. There's no opportunity. And you'll notice what's interesting is that when Jesus describes or refers to hell or a Gehenna, which is the term that he uses more than any other term to refer to hell, he always talks about it as everlasting. The everlasting fire that never goes out, the worm that die of not, you know, the permanence of this state, which is a corollary to the permanence of eternal life. Just as God would not change his mind about the souls in hell, nor would he change his mind about the blessed in heaven and say, you know what? I'm kind of tired of you. You're getting kicked out of heaven. No, it's a permanent eternal reality. You see, so that's another dimension to think about how at least I think about this is what a horrifying thought to imagine going to hell because there is no turning around. There's no

5:18getting out, no getting back and to have that eternity of the loss of God who loves you and who made you for love. I can't imagine anything worse than that. So for me, at least it's an incentive to loving God and to seeking to be happy with heaven. What do you think, Rosa? Yes, I understand. Just one more question. Please go. People always say, oh, when someone dies, they're going to see you down from heaven, you know. But I don't believe that. I believe that once you're in heaven, that it should be painless and happiness because that's what we're told, right? There's no more pain. But if someone is looking out from heaven down at their family and they see their suffering, they see what they're

6:19going through, that would be painful to them. So I don't believe that they see from up there. What do you think? I can understand why you'd say that. I would offer a few thoughts in Hebrews 12 verse 1. There is an interesting statement here about them in heaven. It says, therefore, since we are surrounded by so great a cloud of witnesses, let us also lay aside every weight and sin, which clings so closely and let us run with perseverance, the race that is set before us. Verse 2 says, looking to Jesus, the pioneer and perfector of our faith, who for the joy that was said before, endured the cross, despising the shame and is seated at the right hand of the throne of God. My thought is that the Bible here at least in other places too, like in Revelation 6, for example, but here it's very pronounced that they are witnessing us. It says, we are surrounded by so great a cloud of witnesses. Now that word witness from the Greek word, martyrs, meaning martyr,

7:21means not just somebody who witnesses to the faith, not somebody who bears witness to Jesus in the truth of the faith by shedding his blood, but also is a witness to the event, seeing the events playing out. It has that connotation as well. So here we see that in some sense, they are aware and they are seeing it. We know that Jesus said in the gospels that there is great rejoicing in heaven when even one sinner repents. He doesn't, of course, explain how that works. He just tells us that it happens. So that would suggest them that in some sense, they are aware of what is going on in this life by God's permission. So with passages like that, I wouldn't personally be so quick to say that they can't know anything about what's going on here. The Bible seems to suggest otherwise.

8:22But that leads to the next point, and it's a good point that you raise, because if you were looking down from heaven and seeing war and misery and all the problems and pains of life, in your current state, as I would be in my current state here, we would be sad. But in heaven, they're not sad. Every tear is wiped away. Jesus says, and blessed are those who grieve for they will be comforted. So in heaven, there is no sadness. There's no fear or sadness or darkness or anything. It's all light and glory and good. So I think the answer to that part of the question is when they get to heaven, they see everything in the light of God's truth. Everything that they're permitted to see, it's perfectly illuminated in the light of God's truth. So that they won't be sad. They would glorify God. They would praise God for his mercy, but also for his justice. We don't have that capacity so much now because we have our emotions. And we also don't know the full picture. And we also

9:28are not seeing everything or anything for that matter most of the time in the pure light of God's truth. So we make decisions and assumptions and we think about things in a way that's almost always obscured by the darkness of our minds and are not knowing. So that's why I would simply say that in heaven, there's no room for sadness. And if they are looking down on us as the Bible seems to say that they are, it doesn't cause them sadness or anything like that because of the reasons that I just mentioned. So that's something else to think about. I see. Yes. That makes perfect sense. Yeah. Thank you so much for the clarity to me. I'm happy to do so, Rosa. And I appreciate your call and your patience. Thank you for that. Let's go to Cal now in Southern Arizona. Hi, Cal. Hi, Patrick. How are you doing? I'm doing well. Thank you. So I grew up in a mixed marriage. My father was raised Jewish. My mother was Catholic.

10:36And as a kid, we all went, we would go to services, wedding or whatever type of service it from synagogue and other family members that might probably most likely would have been Catholic, like weddings or services like that. I remember that very clearly as a kid. Is there anything wrong with that? And by that specifically, are you referring to what specifically? Well, I'm going like as a kid, but the reason I'm telling you this is, is there anything wrong with us going to those weddings, maybe for midst of the whatever event they may have at a synagogue when I was younger? Yeah. For relatives that I had. Like Jewish relatives, cousins, for example, right? Yeah. Yeah. No, nothing wrong to go in a tent, something like that.

11:39There would be a problem if let's say somebody was Catholic and baptized and received his sacraments and then decided he wanted to become Jewish. That would be a problem. But in the case of those who were raised Jewish or whatever, and you want to go attend the Bar Mitzvah or you want to be present for their weddings, things like that. There is no problem in doing that. Do I have it right? Am I understanding your question? Yes. I mean, I sort of interpret it, well, maybe we shouldn't have done that. And I was just saying, you know, I've spoken my wife about this and I told her, if my mom rejected all that stuff at that time, my dad eventually converted, he became a Catholic. He would have never done that. It would have caused so much friction that it just wouldn't have happened. That he never would have become Catholic or he never would have attended one of those Bar Mitzvahs. Now, yeah, if we would have never attended those things

12:44because of the church saying, well, we shouldn't attend those things or that type of thing, he would have never became Catholic. Right. I think I understand. If so, in other words, God's Providence was working through those situations. That's what you're saying, right? Pretty much. Yeah. Yeah. So, I mean, if I'm, again, if I'm understanding, let's say that your Jewish cousins having a Bar Mitzvah and your family's invited, even though you're a Catholic, you can still go to that. You wouldn't be doing anything wrong by going to that. Am I answering the question? I want to make sure I'm not missing the point of making. I mean, I guess that conversation is not just today, but in prior conversation, I got the impression that, well, maybe my mom shouldn't have taken us to a Jewish wedding for a Bar Mitzvah or a Bar Mitzvah. I'm glad you're giving me the chance to clarify it. So, let's say your Jewish cousin is getting married

13:52in a Jewish ceremony with a rabbi and your family is invited to go. Absolutely go. Go and celebrate because marriage is a primordial institution established by God that predates all religions. So, as Jesus said, in the beginning, God made the male and female talking about Adam and Eve, you know, the first marriage. So, marriage as a natural institution is always good. And we are always free to go and celebrate marriages between two Hindus or two atheists or a Hindu and an atheist or Protestant folk, Jewish folk, whatever. The only, and this is where there's a distinction that should be made just for clarity sake, if a Catholic is involved, either one or the other or both is Catholic. That's when there's an issue because for a Catholic to be validly

14:52married, the church requires what's called canonical form. You get married in the church, there's a priest there, he blesses the marriage. I'm giving you shorthand for it. But outside of that, if there's no Catholic involved, there is no hesitation whatsoever in going to the justice of the peace to see two people get married. Where to go to, you know, let's say the Jewish synagogue or temple to see two Jews getting married. No problem whatsoever. Yeah, I just want to understand that better and I appreciate you answering that for me very clearly. Oh, you're welcome. I hope that helps other people that may be. Yeah, me too. It's a topic worthy of clarity. No doubt. Well, Cal, I appreciate that. Thank you. Sounds like you're on the road. So drive safe. Let's go next to Stella and Hartford, Connecticut. Hello, Stella. Hi, Patrick. I'm calling mostly as a what will Patrick do type of question. Okay.

15:56I had a teacher for adult learners. They are nursing students. So we focus a lot. We try to emphasize professionalism accountability all that a lot. This is the beginning of the semester. This is week three. My students had an assignment to turn in the first and second week and the instructions were clearly posted on their website. But I saw that students were submitting incorrect reports. So I couldn't grade them correctly based on the group or I could, but they would have gotten very low scores. So I made an announcement for the entire group and I gave them a second chance to resubmit without any penalties. And even after that resubmission opportunity, I still had a handful of students who missed that deadline on the criteria. And so they ended up getting bad grades. And now after the fact, they are reaching out to me individually and saying they didn't see the announcement or they

16:57did the work. They just turned in the wrong report, things like that. So ultimately, they did the work, but they didn't follow instructions. And now I'm at a crossroads on whether I should give them another chance or a little hesitant because I feel like that's not fair to the students who follow directions the first and second time. But at the same time, I understand that these students did the work. They just didn't submit it correctly. And I have flipped on this and I have asked, I have asked co-pilot, what would Jesus do, what will Pope Leo do. And then I figured I can talk to a real person. So I figured what will Patrick do. So I'm reaching out because I feel like both ways are merciful and like, I don't know, I don't know what the right thing to do is or if there is anything. I think there's a way through this that will satisfy your concern on that.

17:58And I was a college professor, university professor for many years myself. And I know exactly the scenario where you have pity on these students who are maybe in some cases a bit hapless and they don't really have the discipline or the experience. And there could be any number of reasons why they're just not getting it. So I know what it's like to say, all right, I'm going to give you a grace period or I'm going to give you a do over or I'm going to, you know, this time allow you to, you know, I'll let it slide. In other words, but at the same time, and this is, I think, addressing your concern about justice for the sake of the students who are doing it the right way. Why not something like this? Now you're at the beginning of this semester, right? Okay. So maybe one thing you can do or could have done earlier in the semester would be to say, all right, I want to address an issue right up front so that everybody's on the same page.

18:59When I give you an assignment, a paper, a test, whatever it is that you're asking of them to do, you are responsible for doing it according to how I want it done and you give them the, you know, whatever the protocols are that they need to do, turn it in this way, turn it by email, turn it in by paper, whatever. And the first week or two of the semester, for some reasons, some of the students did not do it the way they were supposed to do it. And I'm going to give a little bit of leeway, a little bit of latitude and not give an F, but you're not going to get an A. And that's how to respect for the students who did the work the right way and did it on time, et cetera. I'm giving a little bit of grace here, a little bit of latitude rather. And it stops now. So I'm just putting everybody on notice that from this point forward, if you don't do the

20:02assignment the way it's supposed to be done, you will get whatever the grade is that you get or you'll get an F because it didn't get turned in on time. I want everybody to know that so that nobody feels like you're being singled out for special treatment. And if you were to do that, I think you could accomplish both goals in the interim. You could show a little bit of mercy, even though it's not deserved. Or and that's usually what mercy is all about, you know, not getting what you actually deserve. And then going forward, you've got a firm policy and you don't deviate from it. Now, if you had done that at the very beginning, then there would be no quandary because you wouldn't have to say, well, I'll make an exception for you because you would have told them on day one, this is what happens. So for future classes, and certainly if you were to do it like, if let's say you have a class tonight, you tell them tonight, henceforth, this is how it's going

21:04to be. Now you've resolved that problem, but I would say in the future for other classes, tell them right up front what's expected. So that nobody can claim, you know, go ahead, Stella. I did a version of that. I told them you have to, I don't accept assignments by email, you have to submit it into the right assignment page. I told them how to get maximum points by using the rubric. We talked about expectations. And then that announcement that I posted where I gave everybody a second chance, I gave them an example of what is expected, like which report to upload. I told them that it's it's closing at this time. So turn it in by this gate at this time. I think you've been over backwards about as far and probably more than the average professor would. So, I mean, you've done so much to try to help these people. I would, if I were in your position, maybe this is what you're asking me, would I have any compunction about slamming the door shut and

22:06saying, that's it, you got enough. I gave you a chance, you didn't take it and you get enough. Live with it. All right. Otherwise, you enable, you enable your responsibility. And even though it's painful for the student by enabling the student, as you say, it's not fair to the good students who are doing it the right way. And it's also really not helping the person who's just getting by because Professor Stella is a nice lady. I think a little bit too. They're starting off the semester with a really low grade. And I guess if I think about the entire semester and if they do end up failing the class, I don't, I want to be able to say that I did everything I could do to help them. I think you did. It sounds to me like you did. It sounds to me like you went way beyond what a lot of professors would do. Good for you. All right. And they got to grow up, right? They're adult learners, but maybe some of them

23:11haven't grown up all the way. This will help them. Thanks, Stella. All right. I don't have anything to add to recess for two minutes. Class resumes right after that. Hi, Patrick Madrid here. Thanks for listening to my podcast. In today's crazy world, finding companies that align with your Catholic values is a challenge. Your choice of cell phone provider matters. Cyrus, and I switched to charity mobile and you should too. Enjoy excellent coverage on America's most reliable network while supporting a pro life pro family company. Use offer code Patrick for a free phone. Don't miss out. Act now at charity mobile.com. Ave Maria Mutual Funds are show sponsor offers investments with your moral values and financial goals in mind. They do not invest in companies engaged in abortion, embryonic stem cell research and other immoral issues info at Ave Maria Funds.com. That's Ave Maria Funds.com.

24:15Compelling insights, unpredictable conversations, encouragement for your day. It's the Patrick Madrid show on relevant radio. Continuing, let's go now to Dave and Chicago. Hi, Dave. Hey, Patrick, how are you? I'm doing well. Thanks. What's on your mind? Can you hear me? Yeah, here you just fine. Okay. Sorry about that. My wife and I, we started a pro like ministry at our parish. And I feel that I'm pretty good at defending the pro life view on why parents should not murder their child in the womb. But Illinois has just passed the bill as you know about. We have assisted suicide now. And they, um, I brought it up at the meeting and how I think I could defend

25:16the pro life view with another Christian, you know, because we talk about God and we don't want to play God. But my question is, how would you go about defending the pro life view when it comes to assisted suicide to a non-Christian, someone that doesn't believe in God? Because they're promoting this on some big radio stations here. And now there's going to be a talk at a library in a suburb near us. And I'd be interested to go and listen to this talk and raise some questions that would make people think. But I really don't know how to do that. Fair enough. This is a matter of ethics and ethics dovetails with our understanding of morality as Catholics. But even, even atheists would or at least should in their better moments understand and adhere to some code of ethics.

26:17So if you wanted to speak at that level and avoid the God talk, that's one way to go about it. Another way to go about is to say, I don't care if you don't believe in God. God exists even though you don't believe in Him. There are people who believe the earth is flat. That doesn't mean it's flat just because they don't believe it's spherical. And so proceeding from the standpoint that life is sacred and it is enshrined in law that we protect life. And the laws that we have in this country are not theocratic, their secular laws. But even secular laws recognize and take into account the importance of safeguarding human life. So to move in a direction that permits people to off themselves, to croak themselves because life doesn't seem fair to them or life is difficult or what have you. Fundamentally is no different than seeing somebody standing on a

27:1910th story window sill outside of a building and people on the ground saying, jump, jump, jump. Or Robin Williams who's suffering from depression and somebody saying, yeah, hang yourself. Get it over with. Put yourself out of your misery. Hang yourself. People would recoil at that. The very idea of egging somebody on to jump or to hang himself or something. We recoil from it because we recognize at a deep level that doesn't require the word God or the Bible or anything like that. We know instinctively there's something really wrong with that. And the better thing to do is to try to help that person find some relief. And you might use the Robin Williams example. He was feeling poorly. He was suffering from depression. There may have been Louis bodies also complicating his clarity of mind in an organic sense. In his mind, apparently that was part of the physiological problem that he was suffering from. But ask that

28:22person, would you have encouraged Robin Williams to hang himself? The answer is probably going to be no. And then say, why? Why or why not? Why wouldn't you do that? Why wouldn't you urge somebody standing on the 10th story ledge to jump? Why wouldn't you do that? And that's usually where I think people can move beyond their hangups about God or religion or all that stuff and just be human. And at a human level, recognize that there is immense importance in people's lives. And we instinctively seek to help them and save them and prevent them from dying because living is better than dying. And if their living is painful to them and it's a burden to them, then we seek to help alleviate the burden, not kill them. What do you think, Dave?

29:23That is a great Patrick. I know you would have a great answer. I love those analogies at this very whole plot. I'm glad. Thank you for that. I hope you can put those into practice in a powerful way. And if you do, please call and let me know how it went. I will. Thank you so much. Godspeed. Thank you. Let's go next to John in South New Jersey. Good morning, John. Hey, good morning. Yeah, my question is, we thank God when good things happen, but we're not supposed to find fault with him when bad things happen. They're like accidents, like that helicopter crash to kill that young lady in the pilot yesterday. And so you know, you hear people when they have a disease or cancer, they say, oh, thank God that you know, that he cured the disease or at least put it in remission. But yet when we pray and those things don't happen, he don't get any blame for it. And you know, he's supposed to be

30:28know everything, see everything, see into the future. And I know it's supposed to be a, you know, God tells us that anything could happen at any time. I mean, you had mentioned this yesterday with the virgins with the with the lamps that the husband, he could come at any time and we have to be ready. And even it says in the, I think it's in Luke about the tower that collapsed on these 18 people. Right. And why they were praying and they asked them, well, was something to these people do something wrong? And Jesus said, no, they didn't do anything wrong. But they have to be ready, you know, to die. You have to repent. He says, repent. So these things seem to be random or they're in, you know, I don't know if they're in God's will or they just seem to be random, but you know, we don't, we don't, we thank them one good thing, but we don't assign him any blame and day it sinks and it seems you know one verse that I, one verse that I like that kind of speaks to what you're talking about here is that's in Job 1. It's a famous passage everybody's

31:30heard it. The Lord gives and the Lord takes away. Blessed be the name of the Lord. And that's spoken by Job, you know, and everything was taken away from him. His wife, his kids, his house, his land, his possessions, his health, he's reduced to object misery. And you're sitting on the pile and done. Yeah. Can you imagine? I mean, come on man. It's all stories. Yeah, he's picking at the scabs and I mean, it doesn't get any worse than what were he was in the very beginning of all this. This is in verse in chapter one. He says, the Lord gives and the Lord takes away. Blessed be the name of the Lord. Now I don't know if in your view, this is scratching the itch or answering the question, but I think there is an answer here for us. And that is yes, we do thank God for the things that we like. But shouldn't we also thank God for the things that we don't like

32:31because in some way in his loving providence, it's for our benefit even though we don't understand it in the moment. Yeah, well, that would be if God has a plan for our lives. And I don't know if he has a plan for every individual. His plan is basically our redemption and our forgiveness. And you know, to follow his word and the asking for salvation and to get into eternal life. But I don't know if he has like a deep, you know, we think he has a detailed plan for each and every one of us. But you know, like our day to day and when we're going to die or what, whether we're going to get this new job or so. But we have to whatever happens, whatever adversity that we have to face, we have to have faith in him and constantly pray. And his goal is to get us into eternal life. But I don't think he has, you know, he's here. God has a plan for his plan is already laid out for everyone that, you know, we have to have to have his salvation.

33:34We have to follow his word and get into eternal life. But day to day things, I'm not so sure about that. Well, the mundane things like are you going to have a chicken or beef? And God is not decreeing that you do one or the other. If that's what you mean, sure, I can agree with you on that because we have free will. Yeah, even like, you know, accidents that happen every day to, you know, helicopter, helicopter, crash, traffic, you know, eight to three hundred people die from car accidents every day. I don't think God, you know, ordains that it's just something that happens and we have to be ready to meet him. Yes, I would say, I would propose it's both and not either or. And as it says in Romans 828, all things work together for the good, for those who love God. So the Catholic Church, strictly speaking here, does teach that God's eternal plan for our salvation and happiness. We call it his providence that it's always unfolding

34:38and it encompasses everything, including things that seem happenstance in random. There is randomness and there is happenstance. But none of it escapes the larger context of God's God's providence because if that were true, that would mean there are some things that God doesn't know. But that can't be true. Yeah. Right. So, well, Paul describes this life as a race almost. I mean, he basically does describe the race and plus all the bad things that happen to him, you know, he leaves them out like being shipwrecked and, you know, and they're going beatings and stuff. And, you know, he's kind of kind of saying it, you know, it wasn't too easy. But, you know, I finished the race and I kept the faith. That seems to be the most important thing to finish the race, no matter the adversity and to keep that faith. And sometimes it's hard. Yeah, I don't disagree. All I'm saying in a reaction to your point, John, is I don't see these as two mutually exclusive

35:40things. I think they're, it's both and God does have a plan, I would say, and what you're saying is certainly true. Salvation is the end goal. The final cause of our being created by God is to be happy with him for all eternity. Well, what's the difference? You know, we always hear we have that faith, hope and love. What's the difference between faith and hope? I never get that fine. Must be a very fine point. Yeah. I mean, it's interesting because St. Paul talks about the three in context in 1 Corinthians chapter three. And so we have, you know, we have that to go on. He says that love is the greatest. Yeah. But, you know, the way the Bible describes it in the case of faith is that it's the assurance of the things that are unseen. So you have an assurance for something that you don't see and you don't have proof for. And in the same way, we have that assurance because God is the one who tells us these things are true. And we know that God does not deceive nor can

36:45you be deceived. That's where in a prayer. Yeah. I mean, it's certainly from the Bible. Well, we could know it's okay. And I'm out of time. So I've got to take a break. But anyway, I hope our conversation was helpful to you. And I appreciate your phone call. Thanks. We're going to just step aside for a minute. We'll come right back to more phone calls. And yes, there is time for you to call not a lot of time. But there is time. 888 914 9149. Ave Maria Mutual Funds are show sponsor offers investments with your moral values and financial goals in mind. They do not invest in companies engaged in abortion, embryonic stem cell research and other immoral issues info at Ave Maria Funds.com. That's Ave Maria Funds.com. Welcome back to the Patrick Medrich show on relevant radio. Have a question. Give Patrick a call. 888 914 9149. That's 888 914 914 9149. The Patrick Medrich show on relevant radio.

37:58All right. Base player for the talking heads. He's the one playing base here. If I'm not mistaken. And if I am mistaken, somebody somewhere is going to send me an email to correct me. And I appreciate it. Thank you. 888 914 9149. How about Michael now in Phoenix? Good morning, Michael. Hey, good morning, Patrick. A real quick question. It's about revelation two where our Lord says, I know that you live where I forget the specific verse, but I know where you live where Satan's throne is and that you've held fast. I'm butchering it held fast to the maintain the faith. Like, is that a physical place? Is that a real? Oh, and also not not flyer just to compliment. It's for me when I'm looking to like read like or listen to somebody, it's I check out the audience and you have a beautiful audience. And that's what has drawn me really to a relative radio. So but yeah, that was the thing about revel how many where is that Satan's throne? Are these speaking poetically that a physical thing? What is that? That's a great question. So we're in

39:04revelation chapter. Let's see, we're in revelation chapter two. Yep. And this is his the Lord's message to Pergamum, which brings it begins in verse 12. So what why don't I just read it for the sake of people who want to know? Okay. So into the angel of the church in Pergamum, right? The words of him who has the sharp two-edged sword, I know where you dwell where Satan's throne is. You hold fast my name and you did not deny my faith even in the days of Antipas, my witness, my faithful one who was killed among you were Satan dwells. That's that's what you're wondering about, right? Yeah, yeah. It's so striking. I mean, all the revelation. It's so striking. Yeah. So here's what the Catholic study Bible says, the Ignatius study Bible. It says so in Pergamum, by the way, is a I mean, it's an ancient city, but it exists in present day Turkey. So if you were to look at a map of Turkey, you would see Pergamum as one of those, it's in Anatolia, if you know that area,

40:10but it is one of those ancient cities that's mentioned in the Bible and then it sort of goes into obscurity because it's no longer a prominent place like Ephesus, no longer a prominent place the way it once was. Some of these other ones were like that. Okay. So here's what it says in the notes. It says 45 miles northeast of Smirna, Pergamum distinguished itself as the earliest and most enthusiastic center of emperor worship in the region. This is the Roman Empire. This and other forms of pagan religion made it the seat of Satan's throne. That's in verse 13. Got it. Yeah. Okay. Wonderful. Perfect. That's it. That's all. Yeah. Yeah. It was great. I think I'm gonna go right to the soil and look that up because you can get it 100 there. And that gentleman that called before. What a great caller. I just remember here in some time. I'm sure she's a friend of yours. Sister Miriam James, she says like, you know, all the stuff we're done in life, we get to heaven and

41:13reveal to us and we'll just say, oh, okay. I see. Yeah. Now I see. I once was blind, but now I see as the song goes. There is Saint Paul says in 1 Corinthians 13, he says, now we see through a glass darkly. But then we shall see him as he is. We'll seek God face to face and the truth of God will illuminate everything. And there will be no more ambiguity, no more guesswork. And I can't even imagine what that will be like for the blessed in heaven, but it is definitely an incentive to want to be there with them. Thank you, Michael. I appreciate that. Let's go next to Deborah and Albuquerque. Good morning, Deborah. Good morning. How are you? I'm well. Thank you. Good. Good. So what's on your mind today, Deborah? Okay. So the man that is the gentleman before this, this last call, he said that we only we always just thank God for the good.

42:16Uh-huh. When I pray, when I pray, I always thank God for the good and the bad, because from the bad, I think we learn a lot and we learn how to get closer to God and still. Yeah. Do you agree with that passage in Job? Chapter one where he says, the Lord give us and the Lord take it the way. Blessed be the name of the Lord. Yes. And I'm going to keep in mind that so I can pass it on because some people don't know, they don't understand and they don't, they don't get it. Yeah. Easier said than done, but it can't be done. Yeah. But you can keep trying though. Yeah. Yeah. And my other question was, you're always talking about the Catechism book. I was what I was wanting to buy one, but I want to know which is the one that I should should buy. There's an official version and there are a couple of different publishers of the Catechism in the United States.

43:17And if you were to go to your local Catholic bookstore, you'll find them on the shelf. So maybe the size of the text will be a factor. I don't know. But the Ignatius press one is quite good. I mean, the other ones are quite good too because the content is the same. But the presentation on the page is particularly good. So you might want to check that one out. Look for the Ignatius press edition of the Catechism of the Catholic Church. Thanks for the call. Let's go to Cathie Nome, Massachusetts. Hi, Kathy. Oh, Kathy dropped. Oh, Kathy, you were next up. You waited quite a while too. All right, let's go to Kathleen in San Francisco. Good morning, Kathleen. Good morning, Patrick. Question. Patrick Clancy, divorced Lindsey Clancy and remarried. Is that morally correct for him to do that? I can't address all the issues at play here, but as a general principle, the Bible says God

44:19hates divorce. And so to divorce your wife, even in the midst of this horrible, horrible situation, I would say objectively speaking is wrong. Now, I understand I haven't done any like due diligence. So I don't know if this is the case, but I've heard that she was Catholic or is Catholic. Now, I don't know whether that means he is too. I don't know whether we're practicing Catholics or if they got married in the church. I don't know those answers. But as a general principle, the idea of getting a divorce because you're going through a bad time is not a good thing. And God says he hates divorce. So on that basis alone, without knowing anything more about it, I would say that's my initial approach to the question. Okay, I don't need to put you on the spot, but if something this horrific happened to you, what would you do? Well, I would ask the Lord to give me the grace and the strength and the courage

45:23to live out my vocation as a married man in sickness and in health for better, for worse, et cetera. This is about as worse as it can possibly get. And that, yeah. So I mean, that everybody hopes you never go anywhere near anything like that. But if those words mean anything, then they include this too, don't they? Yeah, it's too horrible to even think about it. It's understandable why one would want to leave that situation. But from the Catholic point of view, for this is a tough thing. Yeah, very tough. Very tough. Yeah. Thank you, Patrick. Thank you, Kathleen. Yeah, interesting question. Let's go to Trisha now in Corona, California. Hi, Trisha. Hi, how are you? He's. Well, thank you. Yes. Good. Thank you, Patrick. Are you father Patrick? I don't want to just play Patrick. No. Well, I'm a dad. I have 11 kids, but I'm married. So I'm not a priest if that's what you mean. Oh, okay. So Patrick, yeah, I'm Trisha and myself and my co-worker

46:27were both Catholic and we share that familiar place in our lives. And she goes to her church. I go to my church. We both live in different areas. We work together. And we talk about our relationships of our children. Children's relationships who both have adult kids. My daughter's 20, my son's 23, they're in relationships. Not always the best relationships that they pick. And they don't choose wisely sometimes. And we feel that sometimes we just wish that we can talk to them and tell them, hey, you know, this person isn't good for you. He's not giving you virtue. He's not allowing to grow in life and prosper. And that's what we look for in a relationship. Myself and my husband, we've been married for 27 years. We've got married in the Catholic church. Congratulations. Thank you. And I was married at 23. I'm 51. We've been married for 27 years. And I want to show them, hey, you know, it's possible to have a healthy relationship. Someone that's going to guide you and and take you from, you know, being in school, graduating. However your life

47:32is going to, you know, a Catholic way to pray, but I have the prayer. And I want to share. Let me ask you a question. So this, this is a prayer that an exorcist or somebody who claims to be an exorcist says, if you pray this prayer, then what, what is the purpose of praying a prayer? The purpose of the prayer is that it eliminates the relationship in three to four weeks. If the person is not meant for that person, it's called a binding prayer and Jesus name by Father Chad. Yeah. Well, a few, a few things I would say is, you ever heard of that, that anti-walt removal medicines called compound W. And if you put the drop on the wort a few times a day every day, eventually the wort will disappear. Yes, I think so.

48:33Yeah, compound W. I personally don't view prayer that way. I don't think the church means prayer that way. It's not a mechanical thing where if you, if you put your quarter in the gumball will come out. Rather, I would say, well, there are a lot of things I'd like to say. One thing is that there is a, something of a cottage industry right now in this country of people who influencing wide groups of people with this notion that you can bind demons or you can rebuke demons or engage in spiritual warfare in ways that are not appropriate for lay people. Now, of course, we are called to pray. We are called to do, you know, to renounce Satan and all of those things. I don't, I don't in any way suggest that we're not part of that as laypeople

49:35because we certainly are. But when it becomes something more systematic and if you do this, this way, standing on your left leg or, you know, and something where you do it this way every day, it's guaranteed to happen a certain way. That's where I get a little bit, you know, I hesitate to see that as something that's genuine, regardless of the source. So my thought would be, rather than getting your prayer ideas from YouTube channels, the better thing to do, the tried and true thing to do is the wisdom and teaching of the church, the Holy Bible, the prayers that have come from time immemorial, the novena prayers to our lady, St Joseph, et cetera, you can never go wrong if you make use of those tried and true approved

50:35authentic biblical prayers that the church proposes to us. When somebody pops up and says, well, I've got a new way of doing it and if you do it this way for this many days and I get a little bit antsy about that kind of thing. So that's what I would recommend would be to disregard those kinds of things because a lot of people out there, maybe even those people who have, you know, some sort of authority. And in some cases, it's not even necessarily a real authority, but somebody who has risen to a level of prominence and people listen doesn't necessarily mean that whoever the person may be is an authority. You can't go wrong if you stick with the tried and true prayers of the church. That would be my recommendation, Trisha. Thank you for that. All right, look how fast those three hours went by. Why don't we do it again tomorrow, same pat times,

51:36same pat channel. And until then, I'll pray for you. Please pray for me. God bless.