The Firing of Kristi Noem

0:00From the New York Times, I'm Michael Bobarro. This is The Daily. On Thursday afternoon, President Trump fired his Secretary of Homeland Security, Kristi No, ousting the leader of an agency at the center of his second term agenda. Today, my colleague, Ahmed Ali Aziz, on how to know who did everything possible to ingratiate herself with Trump, ended up losing his trust. It's Friday, March 6th. I'm a good evening. Good evening. I just want to be candid. This was not our plan for Friday's episode of The Daily, but it is a seismic development for this administration, and we felt we had to cover it.

1:03Yeah, definitely. I mean, Kristi No was the face of President Trump's aggressive crackdown on immigrants across the United States. She was unapologetic. And President Trump backed her over and over again after all the controversy she faced over the last six months. And then, really abruptly, President Trump notifies her just moments before she gives a speech to folks on law enforcement. She's fired. Right. And the other reason why this felt so enormous is that the entire premise of the second term Trump cabinet was that it was kind of unfirable in theory. In Trump's first term, he fired people left and right because he had picked in his mind all the wrong people. But the second term was this huge corrective. And he was only going to pick ideologically aligned cabinet members who were not going to push back or were going to do exactly what

2:04he wanted. And he wouldn't fire people even if they got into pretty serious trouble. That was really the case until no one becomes the very first cabinet secretary to be fired in the second term. Yeah. I mean, it became pretty clear that Trump was trying to give off this appearance of stability and the fact that they had everything under control. And Kristi No really was among the most loyal of his cabinet secretaries. I mean, she really put President Trump at the center of whatever she did. She was always talking about President Trump and fulfilling President Trump's promises. And ultimately it felt like that almost made her someone invincible to a firing. Right. Until now. So let's tell the story of how she became no longer invincible, despite doing what seemed month after month, like exactly

3:06what it was Trump wanted her to do and celebrating Trump the whole way. It was surprising that President Trump selected her. The DHS secretary role really is perhaps the biggest role for his biggest promise, right? The promise of mass deportations. You need somebody in place to carry through a really ambitious and difficult operation. And the selection of Kristi No was a surprise because on the national level, she was primarily known for writing a memoir in which she admitted to shooting her own dog that she felt like was misbehaving. Right. And of course, she was the governor of South Dakota. She'd been a Congresswoman as well. But President Trump, he decides that she is the right person to run this massive agency. And in many ways takes her from political relevance to the biggest

4:08story of 2025. And first of all, I want to thank El Salvador and their president for their partnership with the United States of America. In right away, she embraces this idea of being out there. Here at sea cat today and visiting this facility. Going to El Salvador, where she's filming a spot in front of shirtless prisoners. First of all, do not come to our country illegally. You will be removed and you will be prosecuted. Saying to undocumented immigrants that you could end up here if we catch you. But no, that this facility is one of the tools in our toolkit that we will use if you commit crimes against the American people. And we should say she's standing in front of a prison that we've reported on where people, including those who were in the United States, claim to have been tortured and sexually abused. Yeah, exactly. And this comes right at that time last spring as the Trump administration is

5:11really unleashing DHS on immigrant communities across this country. There's Kristina. She's standing alongside these ICE officers and she's got the tactical ice vest on. She's at times holding weaponry. You know, she is not a law enforcement officer. Going inside up to the homes where people are being arrested as if she's part of the operation. Right, she wants it to be known that she is at the tip of the spear of these enforcement actions. She's on the front line. She is becoming, it seems like quite proudly synonymous with them. Yeah, I felt like she wanted to be at the center of this story. You know, she wanted to be

6:13on Fox News, on these conservative news outlets day after day, spreading this message that I'm the one that's going to carry through President Trump's biggest promise. But really her effort to put herself at the center of the Trump administration's deportation campaign put her down a path that ultimately haunted her. And really the thing that you can point to is that she stars in these ads. I'm Kristina from the Cowboys who tame the West to the Titans who built our cities in which she's riding on horseback. She's wearing a cowboy hat. America has always rewarded vision and grit. Our greatness calls people to us for a chance to prosper. She's almost giving a speech about the greatness of America. Anyone who searches for freedom

7:19can always find a home here, but that freedom's a precious thing and we defend it vigorously. And then a warning individuals who are in the country illegally. You cross the border illegally will find you. That DHS will come and find them. But if you come here the right way, your American dream can be as big as these endless guys. From President Trump and me, welcome home. And it's not just that, Ed. If you are here illegally, you're next. Or other ads as well. President Trump has a clear message for those that are in our country illegally. Leave now. Leave now. Where she's encouraging immigrants to self-deport. The choice is yours. America welcomes those who respect our laws because a strong nation is a safe nation. And these ads which are playing on TV, they're everywhere. ProPublica late last year reports that they cost the American taxpayer $200 million. I think that

8:22really started to concern some lawmakers and some folks that perhaps this whole effort of her being DHS secretary was really just to further her own political ambitions. And of course, as that's happening, the enforcement actions of the agents she's overseeing at the Department of Homeland Security become themselves deeply polarizing. How does that start to factor into what will come to haunt her? Yeah, you know, you see over the last half year, DHS agents chasing people in deep up parking lots in car washes, allegations of racial profiling, US citizens swept up, and even all throughout this bad imagery that even some of the president Trump supporters, including Joe Rogan call out repeatedly. Trump stands by her, right? And then you get to Minneapolis. And Minneapolis really is where things start to fall apart for her.

9:27There's the shooting of Alex Freddie in which agents tackle him to the ground and then shoot him. Good evening, everyone. Thank you for being here. There are two different things that I've Christy known hours after the shooting. I do want to address the tragic situation that we saw in Minneapolis today that unfolded on the streets. She goes further than even the agents he had in their own statement, which had raised some questions. This individual who came with weapons and ammunition to stop a law enforcement operation of federal law enforcement officers committed an act of domestic terrorism. That's the facts. She starts saying that, you know, he's a domestic terrorist. He attacked the officers at the scene. It says things that turn out not to be true. Exactly. And, you know, in many ways, people question her credibility at this really key juncture where Minneapolis is teetering where two American citizens at this point have been shot

10:29dead. Protests are raging. There are hundreds of DHS agents on the streets of Minneapolis. It's a critical moment. And Nome is just not able to handle it without saying something that is pretty clearly inaccurate at that time. And President Trump doesn't fire her. It doesn't get rid of her. But it is an acknowledgement that she did not handle it well when he brings in Tom Homan. Right. His borders are to take over Minneapolis and tells them to calm the situation down. That is something that never happens where a DHS secretary, the person in charge of these immigration operations is put to the side for a White House official untold. You don't need to take care of this anymore. Right. She's getting layered, which when you're a cabinet secretary, there really shouldn't be any layers between you and the president. And then things get

11:35worse for Secretary Nome, courtesy, as I recall it, of our colleagues at the Wall Street Journal. Yeah, really just as Tom Homan is starting to quiet the situation down in Minneapolis, this story lands from the journal, which gets into some of the sorted details of Christie Nome and her relationship to her senior advisor, Cory Lewandowski, a former Trump campaign official, a controversial figure in his own right. And Lewandowski is a special government employee. And he's this kind of shadowy figure who is everywhere with Christie Nome. He is the person who is yelling at ICE officials for not doing enough on arrests and deportations. He is really in many ways this incredibly powerful figure across DHS in particular at ICE. And ultimately, again, he is not a DHS employee. He is a special government employee just like

12:42Elon Musk was when he started Doge last year. So he really, and theory should not have the authority that this journal reporting suggests that he has inside the Department of Homeland Security. Yeah, exactly. And he's essentially running this agency alongside Nome, having unlimited power to do whatever they wanted to do, firing pilots, issuing polygraphs. Wow. The idea of polygraphing people left and right really concerned a lot of people who are working pretty hard to carry through on this really difficult task of deportations and arrests. So this story really got the heart of the kind of drama and the the situation at the top of the agency. And I think crucially also really kind of heavily insinuated that Lewandowski and Nome, both of whom are married, were having an affair, which obviously has some major complications

13:46given the fact that they were essentially running the agency together. And yet despite this journal reporting, Trump does not act. He doesn't, but Nome ultimately has to go to Capitol Hill for pair of hearings in which congressional officials bring up all of these allegations, all of these exploits and her response, her reaction, and how she handled that situation. It was a disaster and really seal their fate. We'll be right back. Obviously, there's a lot of interest in this hearing. I think the secretary for coming.

14:50So how to tell us about this disastrous testimony that Christy Nome delivers before Congress that really does become her undoing. Yeah, it feels like the culmination of everything that's happened over this past year where all of her potential embarrassments come to Capitol Hill. Secretary Nome, we're glad to meet you even though it's been 13 months since you took office in more than five weeks since two American citizens were shot dead in Minneapolis. And Democrats are incredibly aggressive. Can you explain why you decided to brand these victims who are not protesting the activities of your agency and were killed as a result of it? How did you think that calling them domestic terrorists was somehow going to calm the situation? Bringing up all of her previous comments in Minneapolis is so hard to say you were wrong.

15:52Is it so hard to say you were wrong? And even beyond that, they get quite personal. There are some pretty notable exchanges with Congresswoman Kamil Gradov. So Secretary Nome, at any time during your tenure as Director of Department of Homeland Security, have you had sexual relations with Cory Lewandowski? Who really directly asks her about her relationship with Lewandowski? Mr. Chairman, I am shocked that we're going down in peddling tabloid garbage in this committee today. And she doesn't really answer the question. And you should be able to answer what we do at the Department of Homeland Security. And without any hasn't every single day is to protect it. If someone is asked to make decisions, you or any federal official is sleeping with their subordinate. That should be easiest. You should be wanting to answer that question as garbage. But the real surprise with these hearings was that Republicans like Tom Tillis,

16:58like Senator Kennedy from Louisiana, they're starting to point some really intense questioning of Christy Nome. I don't know that we'll have time for you to respond because I've given you a performance evaluation here. I'm not looking for a response. He is incredibly frustrated and angry. What we've seen is innocent people getting detained that turn out our American citizens. He feels unencumbered. We just want numbers. We want 1,000 a day, 6,000 a day, 9,000 a day because numbers matter, right? No, they don't matter. Quality matters, not quantity, quality. He's almost getting off this really intense disappointment of her tenure at the Department of Security. What we've seen is a disaster. Under your leadership, Ms. Nome, a disaster. Right, even disgust. Yeah, he is just pissed off. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. And then thank you, Madam Secretary, for being here.

18:00Here comes Kennedy, somebody who is a starch supporter of the Trump administration. Properly vetting people at the southern border is not racist, is it? No. Somebody who you would expect easier questions to come from. Could you answer for the record? No, it is not racist. But right as he starts going, I believe you have a policy, Madam Secretary, that you have to approve all contracts at your department. He is really getting into detailed questions about what was happening at her department. How do you square that concern for waste, which I share? With the fact that you have spent $220 million running television advertisements that feature you prominently. He is questioning her about this ad campaign.

19:03Can all the money that's spent there? We went through the legal processes. Did it correct me? Did it correct you working on the OMB? Yes, he did. Yes, okay. And pushing her on whether or not the president was approving this type of massive expenditure. To me, it puts the president in a terribly awkward spot. And I'm not saying you're not telling the truth. It's just hard for me to believe. You know, I mean, President, that he would have agreed to that. And again, this is a moment where Nome, somewhat like Minneapolis, starts to dig her own grave by saying, yes, the president did approve this. And one thing, Senator, I think, would be helpful to know is how effective that communications has been. Well, by overwhelmingly. Well, by overwhelmingly. Well, by overwhelmingly. Well, by overwhelmingly. And ultimately, his line of questioning is really quite effective because President Trump gets

20:11wind of her comment and is asked on the record by Reuters whether or not he did, in fact, approve this spending like President Nome said he did. And he says, no, I didn't approve that. The Kennedy himself says that when he spoke with President Trump, he was, I believe he said mad as a hornet. Right. I mean, basically, the president is calling his DHS secretary a liar. Yeah. And a few hours later, she's fired from her job as secretary and Trump announces that he's given her this previously non-existent job as the special envoy for the shield of America's the job that nobody had ever heard of before and something that is really mocked as it gets announced. You know, that sequence of events certainly suggests to me that while Trump's dismay with Nome

21:17has perhaps been building for some time for a variety of reasons, in the end, what really cost her her job was invoking Trump's name as she sought to defend something that people in both parties regard as kind of wasteful and self-promotional, these $200 million ads. And I wonder if that's the way you see it, that she kind of violated the president's golden rule, which is don't throw me under the bus. Yeah. It's really this moment where Kennedy is asking this question of Nome and what Trump knew, where Nome connects Trump to this idea of wasteful spending. And he doesn't want to be connected to this and he doesn't want to be used as the justification and the excuse for this massive amount of money spent on her ad campaign.

22:18This aggressive immigration approach is ultimately not what got Christine Nome fired. It's really what happened with some of these stories connecting her to the spending and her performance on the hill. I mean, the president wants people to be good on TV. And in this moment, it was I think really seen as an embarrassment and a joke. I don't think President Trump wanted to deal with that anymore. Well, if this is not a larger change of course for the Department of Homeland Security and its approach to immigration, I think we should talk about the person Trump has picked to replace Nome and run the department. Senator Mark Wayne Mullin of Oklahoma, what should we know about him and how much is he basically just going to keep the existing approach that Nome did with perhaps more restraint in his testimony before Congress?

23:20Mullin is somebody like many Republican politicians. He is somebody who supports President Trump's deportation agenda. He has been very vocal about backing the ideas of a more aggressive DHS. But I think, you know, somewhat more to the point, he's this big guy, an X MMA fighter. And for many Americans, their first experience with him was when he challenged the head of the Teamsters Union to a fight in this incredibly viral video. So, this is a time, this is a place if you want to run your mouth, we can be to consenting adults, we can finish it here. Okay, that's fine. Perfect. You want to do it now? I'd love to do it right now. We'll stain your butt up then. You stand your butt up. Oh, hold it. Oh, stop it. Is that your solution, everybody pull it? No, no, sit down. During a hearing before Congress? Yeah, during a hearing before Congress. No, I have the money. I'm sorry. This is hold it. Can I respond? No, you can't.

24:21This is a hearing. And God knows the American people have enough contempt for Congress. Let's stop. I don't like drugs and you. And I don't like you. He's somebody who doesn't shy away from a fight. He's willing to go back and forth with reporters with other politicians. And I think Trump likes that. And he perhaps wants that from someone who's leading this massive law enforcement agency. Right. So overall, Mullin is a stick to your guns kind of appointment over at THS. And rather than this being a referendum on the ways in which immigration enforcement undernome has worked, this really at the end of the day is only a referendum on Christy Nome herself. Yeah, I think so. And I think perhaps there is some expectation that without some of this drama, without some of these scandals, that maybe Mullin can be more effective

25:27in following through with this deportation agenda, really in the face of all this pulling that shows that Americans are starting to get disgusted by what they're seeing on the streets. Trump hasn't backed away from any of that. Right. So it's going to be on Mullin to pick this up and see this aggressive and at times unpopular campaign through for its next chapter. Well, Ahmed, thank you very much. Appreciate it. Thank you for having me. On Thursday afternoon, Democrats in Congress said that Nome's firing would not change their plans to keep the Homeland Security Department defunded until they see major reforms across the agency.

26:34Meanwhile, hey, Christy Nome, don't let the door hit you on the way out. Several of the party's leaders openly celebrated Nome's ouster, Governor JB Pritzker of Illinois, allowed critic of Nome's immigration tactics in his state. Warns Nome that leaving the job would not absolve her from blame. Here's your legacy, corruption and chaos, parents and children, tear gas, moms and nurses, US citizens getting shot in the face. Now that you're gone, don't think you get to just walk away. I guarantee you, you will still be held accountable. We'll be right back. Here's what else you need to know today. On Thursday afternoon, the US House of Representatives blocked a bipartisan measure that sought to rein in President Trump's ability to continue the war

27:38in Iran without congressional approval. Because the US Senate had blocked a similar measure a day earlier, Trump now faces no constraints on his ability to wage the war. In Europe, Britain and Italy accelerated their deployment of military equipment and personnel to protect their citizens and infrastructure in the Middle East as the war continued to spill out beyond the region. For many European governments, the deployments are occurring despite their skepticism of the war. While the region has been plunged into chaos, my focus is providing calm, level-headed leadership in the national interest. During a news conference on Thursday, British Prime Minister Keir Starmer reaffirmed his decision not to participate in the attack against Iran, even if it upsets the United States.

28:49Meanwhile, the fighting raged on. The US military said it was finding and destroying Iran's mobile missile launchers, while Iran struck pro-American Kurdish forces in Iraq, who are seen as allies and America's plan to overthrow the Iranian regime. Finally, Iran's foreign minister accused the US of committing a, quote, atrocity at war by sinking an Iranian warship off the coast of Sri Lanka on Wednesday, and killing many of the sailors on board. The ship was thousands of miles away from the conflict when it was struck. Today's episode was produced by Olivia Nat, Carlos Prieto and Caitlin O'Keefe. It was edited by Rachel Quester and Maria Bern. Contains music by Mary and Luzano, Elishaba YouTube, Roemi Bestow, and Diane Wong.

29:54Our theme music is by Wonderly. This episode was engineered by Alyssa Moxley. That's it for the Daily. I'm Michael Barbar. See you on Sunday.