Survivor Rewind | Survivor 50 Episode 3 Discussion

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1:02It's me, John. And I am joined this week. There's no McKenna, but fantastic replacement this week. I am joined by Kyle. You might know him from RMA's race coverage. You might know him from Matt Chat, his channel, not tag list videos. But I'm so happy to have you, Kyle. How do you feel about 50 so far? Well, I'm thrilled to be here. It seems like I'm just on episode three of the rewind every season, because I was on episode three last season. I'm loving Survivor 50. I think that anybody who had any doubts about like this cast or the theme or anything, I think that that's, to me, all being disproven so far. I think everybody has really come out to play. Everybody's bringing it. And I just am like thrilled. This is the most exciting I've been for like a next episode week to week in a very long time. Yeah, I can agree with that. I think obviously talking about Survivor every week,

2:04watching a lot of Survivor every week, it's been a while since it's been like, OK, can I just press play on the next episode? Yeah. You come to Survivor. And that's how I feel about 50. I just need to know what's going to happen next. And that's exciting. It's exciting to be back at this point in the band. I just not that I disliked the last few seasons of Survivor or anything like that. But I kind of forgot what it was like watching a season like this live that you just feel like you need to binge. And there is that urge to just know what's happening next. I think being able to go and see the fallout of a tribal council right away afterwards. And no, we didn't really get fallout this week because it was just sit down and leave it. I think that's exciting. I think I'm really excited to see how Stephanie reacts to being blindsided with Q going out of here. I'm excited to know what that fallout is. Even though sometimes when I'm going through a random episode of Survivor, I'm like, this is the most pointless aspect of the episode, right?

3:06That recap of what happens before. But I think this will actually be exciting. It is. And it's the first return easy season that we've had in 10 seasons. Bruce is the only returning player that we've had in the new era and he barely counts. So like that is part of it. It's like a breath of fresh air. It's an injection of just like a monumental season. So I think that that is part of it for me at least. Yeah, I agree. So you mentioned that this cast is kind of holding it up. Like this cast is really showing that the doubters like may have been sounding the horn a little too early. I think we got to a point now where we lost someone who everyone was really excited with being cute. And I know we were excited for it. Yeah, I kind of was super excited for General Lewis. And it's gone to the point where I feel like every week we're losing someone who's going to be disappointing to lose whoever we do who is standing out to you in this cast so far. The obvious answer is Christian. This season has really been dominated by Christian in terms of the strategy, the confessionals.

4:08He has gone on, he has gone to every tribal so far. So that is a big part of it. Someone who I didn't expect to be doing as well as they are right now is Genevieve. And Genevieve was one of my favorite players coming into this season. So it really pleased me that she could have been targeted right away for being just a big threat. Like a lot of people talked about her coming into the season that way. But it hasn't been the case. It's really just Aubrey who's talking about Genevieve. So I love where she's at and I'm impressed. Now that being said, Genevieve has lost two of her initial alliance members now in Kyle and Q. Flopped onto another tribe with Aubrey there where we've seen the tension. So I'm excited to see how she navigates this next to the well because eventually these double boots have to start happening, right Kyle? I would think so. And you know, you and I were just talking about this the other day. How are they going to do this? So I am curious. And I know the players got to be curious as well. Because yeah, just one boot episodes can't keep happening.

5:11And you would think that with tribes of three, it's a perfect opportunity to do a double boot. You just have one tribe, one immunity. And that's how it's at. We've seen that before in Survivor. So I am expecting it soon. Maybe it's not next week because we didn't see it in the preview. But now I'm waiting for it because it's got to happen. Yeah, I think we were quite surprised this. I think a lot of people in the fandom were surprised when we got to three tribes this week. And they're sitting there watching the episode and it's like, it's only half an hour left. There's no way we're getting to people as we're entering the immunity challenge, right? And it's like, there's no way we're getting two people who did from this. So what's going on here? And in the preview for next week, Jeff says something like you're playing from a reward or this is a huge reward. So it sounds like there's a reward challenge in the next episode. Yeah, I'm curious. Well, we'll just have to wait and find out. But let's look into this week's episode. So I felt a bit of a total shift this week when it came to Survivor 50. Not so much in like, okay, here are these big players.

6:11They're not as big anymore. We're seeing other edits. We did finally get no Angelina content with who you're missing. We got Mike White strategic content, which just had me so giddy because I love Mike White. Since before he was on Survivor and I've always been a strong advocate for he was the strongest player on David versus Goliath. But it felt like we got a total shift in the season where I felt, I felt it was really brought up with like Christian's analogy that he gives in tribal council this week where he's like interacting Mike and he talks about the every player in this game has to go through like a death and a rebirth in order to like get to the end and win. And it really feels like that's kind of where we're going. And I think that is a good analogy just for Survivor in general because I think we get that swaps. And I think when you look at it here, what is that so really emphasized with this idea of kind of redemption, I feel. And it's really interesting when we compare it to like Australia and Survivor, which has a scene or a season called redemption

7:12and it's like, okay, but what is this redemption you're talking about? But it seems like Survivor 50's really like leaning into this theme organically. So what are you getting out of 50? Like where do you think 50's going at this point? Oh man, that is a good question. Where is 50 going? Well, we've heard a lot of people talk about you know, like past seasons and their experience that they're bringing in from their past season. You could call it trauma or whatever. But we're getting a lot of that. We've heard it from Chrissy, Angelina, Aubrey, Charlie. Joe has mentioned it a couple of times. Genevieve has mentioned it. So I'm looking to see who else is gonna learn something or make a move based on something that happened in their past games because we're seeing a lot of that. And you know, I wouldn't call them like sob stories, but it's like, we've seen a lot of that in the new era of people talking about that.

8:14But it's more interesting or not more interesting, but a different angle with returning players because they're talking about past games. And they've had to go through like the fandom and social media and stuff. And now that they're back out there, they're reliving that. And a lot of these things are coming up. So I'm interested to see who else has like old wounds that reopen. Yeah, yeah. And we'll talk about that a little bit later in the episode. But let's get into our outweighed outplay and outlast this time around. So our outweighed won't be the same. It was a little hard because like strategically there was a bit going on there, but it's more like Q navigating the fact that he has this lost vote, which how do you think he managed to do that? Like obviously he didn't get anywhere to what they're even more he could have done. I don't think so, but the thing is he didn't even tell anybody that he had a lost vote. I think Stephanie was the only one who knew. So I think that that would have just heard him even more. If he had told people, I don't have a vote that it's like then we really can't do anything

9:16to save you and Ozzy's extra vote didn't come up at all in this episode. But actually that being said, Ozzy also knew Q had lost his vote. Oh, yeah, that's right, Ozzy knew. So I think that that perhaps played a factor where it's like we're not going to tie this up for Q and I'm sure I'm not going to use my extra vote right now. So he doesn't have the extra vote though, because he gave it to three. That's right. He gave it to three. No wonder it didn't come up. I was like, how is this guy? I had the same process and then it was the second time I was watching episodes like right here. I don't have it anymore. He gave it to three. Yeah, that makes so much sense. Oh my gosh. But he yeah, I think there's like some strategic things there. I know he was like trying to create a three to one situation. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But it actually makes sense for like a three, three situation to get the votes on Q, because then someone from the David versus Goliath Alliance is losing their vote in a revot and Q doesn't have one. So it's still just a three to then strategically is there.

10:17But rather than talking about like lost votes and you know, manipulating votes and everything, let's talk about ideal swap situations because we have to talk with the other half of this tribe. Yes, because the odds of all three David versus Goliath pulling out the same color bus isn't very high. In fact, yeah, if I'm not mistaken, and I might be, we just have to like do a little math here quickly. Yeah, because you would have to have with these swap drives, there was something interesting I noticed with these swap drives in general, which is because we're swapping with an uneven number of players with 21 players into three tribes, production had to decide. And because of the way that Jeff hands out the votes, right? Because there's a plate for the male contestants and a plate for the female contestants. Because of that, production's decided which tribes are gonna have more men and which tribes are gonna have more women. Yeah, yeah. And so like there's only a certain way that's could possibly break in favor with the odds

11:20that we get Christian, Angelina, and Mike White all on the same track. This is an instance where a season has, I guess they're the only, no, right? 46, because it could have happened with the 46ers as well. Yeah, yeah. It only happens with the David versus Elias. Was there any doubt that these people were ever gonna work together? Oh, no, like no, like they were gonna work together always because, you know, I mean, they both been on the White Lotus. Like these three people are friends and it's been, you know, it's weird to think about it but it's been seven years or eight years now since David versus Elias aired. So it's like, it's been a long time. And so yeah, there was no doubt and I think that's part of why Q's efforts really didn't matter because just about swapped to begin with. And Brian is saying it's a 9% chance

12:22that these guys would have all ended up on the same tribe together. So yeah, fantastic swap for them. And then you have Emily who was with Christian. So it was like just a really, really straight forward dynamic there. Yeah. So if we look back at some past seasons where we've seen these type of swaps really hang out, we're gonna look at a couple of fraternity seasons because I think we could look at for like new V seasons but it doesn't really work the same way because it's just people who like have met each other. We kind of want to take the pregame into the account camp right? So let's take a look at game changers where we get the first swap in the second episode of that season. I have to emphasize like, I know episode three swap felt really, really, and it does because there were 21 people on the season still. And it's more than a regular cast of survivor. Remember, we're just now to a regular season of the survivor when it comes to the cast size. But in that first swap, we see the three people who had played Korong already or together get swapped

13:25onto the same tribe with Aubrey, Caleb, and Ty. Debbie. Debbie. Oh my God. There are four people from Korong on that season. I know, that's great. Yeah. And because of that, there's three of them on this one tribe in game changers and we see like Ty kind of having to wrestle with us back to play, okay, people want Caleb out or like, Caleb's my guy, like, I've got Caleb here. What's going on here? So I think this is one of those situations where it's like, yes, you have this ideal swap where there's the three there. But you get the target on you, kind of like what Q was trying to push on to the David versus Goliath three here in this museum. Yeah, I mean, that is a risky strategy because while it is a huge threat, they are a big target. They make up half the tribe on that season. It was a tribe of six. So it's like, you know, you're trying to flip one of them. It might be easier to just try to work with them, right? And make a group of four and just take your chances with that.

14:28And I think that's what Emily was doing here where it's like, I know that those three are working together but I'm with Christian, I'm in that four. So I'm good, right? If we lose again or to twice then that I'm fine. So I do think that working with that group, it could be tier advantage. It might seem scary, but it kind of, if you're the first one to the punch and they work with you, then you're kind of set for a little bit. You know, I'm thinking about this term that Emily has in this week's episode and how it's kind of praying to us that she goes to Angelina is like, I don't really want to load out Angelina. It seems weird. I mean, obviously we know that Christian and Emily know each other before the game. Yeah, they know these like one of the clock tower games with each other through our happen everything. I'm wondering if Ozzy, after that conversation where like Q Ozzy Stephanie and Emily are talking about like going against that David, I wonder if Ozzy did let it slip that Q didn't have about there and that influence Emily wanting to go

15:29and like make up with Christian and be like, oh man, I made a big mistake. We can just quote Q, right? I made a big mistake because I thought like, maybe we could do something, but we actually can't do anything in the situation. That's a good point. Yeah, I think that it is very likely that at some point Ozzy said that and then they were like, well, you know, there's not really much that we can do for him here. And if so, why didn't they show it on the show? Maybe that makes it too obvious, right? Where it's like, well, Q doesn't have a vote, so that would be a reason why they don't show it, but I think that that is very likely that Ozzy said something. And so in that game changer situation, we do eventually see Ty electing to let go of Caleb not make the fight for it, letting him go there. Now that we're moving forward with a six person tribe on this new... What is the Vatu tribe? Yeah, I got there.

16:30I'm like almost there with these tribe names. I know, huh? Three weeks in, like we're kind of there. But we have this Vatu tribe where we have a three-three split now. And obviously we know Emily's the working with Christian. Ozzy has that Christian relationship as well at this point. Stephanie seems like the odd person out, but is there someone in that David versus Goliath three who you think could be in this Ty situation to let go of one of those other two and move forward with that other group? Oh, man. I kind of feel like it could be Mike White because Mike is really, he loves the drama, right? He likes to mix it up. He is a very dynamic player in David versus Goliath. So I do think that it could be him because he does like to have some fun. What is another interesting thing about the comparison between these two is that this group of David versus Goliath, they played together a lot longer in the game. They all made the merge. They're all three of the final seven

17:32and they've known each other like we said for like eight years, but in co-wrong, that trio, Debbie and Caleb never played together. They had just played a year before. So they were a very disconnected group. Ty and Caleb did, but that third wheel was really not so tight. So I am interested to see if these people are willing to throw each other under the bus or they just, hey, Stephanie's like a super easy boot next time. Yeah, a tough call. Now I think there has to be some concerns about like Boomerang idols and everything. Yeah, who do you think would be most likely to flip in that group? I think the edits trying to make us believe it's Christian, right? Like I think that is kind of what we're looking at here is the edit because especially with like the, there was the mention of Christian's moment of like they voted for me each four times. Last, I think they're really trying to like make it seem that way. I think Angelina could flip on Christian

18:34would never flip on Mark. Probably not. I could see my, I think it's more likely Mike flips on Christian. There's a potential chance that Mike would vote out Angelina. I think you avoided as much as possible. But I think like, if he came down to the brass tacks and that's what Mike White had to do in a situation to gain positioning in the game, he would do it. I just don't think it's beneficial for his game to get rid of someone who's literally saying he's her best friend to be a writer or like, that's, it's too strong. Yeah, I think Christian, the way he's presented as someone who could flip on them, but I also think Christian would rather play the numbers, right? So I don't know. Yeah, I don't know, I don't know either. I think Mike would be very willing to throw a Christian out of the bus, but like right now, mate doesn't probably don't serve him to do that. Yeah. Yeah, I think another season example that really reflects this type of swamp here because now we're kind of getting him

19:35to be like he's pretty humanized, right? Like we're not just talking about the angry people from the same season and the least there who we know kind of has like this bit of a free game relationship with Christian, which probably means she like spoke with Angelina and might get some point before they game and everything, right? There were probably a lot of Zoom calls ever go. Oh my gosh, can only imagine that. However, being like getting such a serendipitous swamp to have you in that majority position at a swamp isn't very common, but one time we did see it was in winners at war when we got the swamp to this new Celia tribe, which after the game, we found out that Michelle, Wendell, Nick and Yule of all people all had this four person free game alliance going in leaving poor poverty on the house. Yeah, that was crazy. Again, what a chance that all four of them would end up on the same tribe. This time of five people. So it's even less of a chance. Yeah, Yule was really getting in the free game because we know him and Sophie were tight and like,

20:36you know, he was, yeah, he was, his whole thing was getting after the poker alliance and all that, but he and so he had his separate group. So this one requires a little bit of like inside knowledge, right, because this, this was not, these were not people who played on the same season. These were just a random group of people. And yeah, parvities on the outs, but Michelle votes with parvity at that tribal council. So I think that that's a lot of just Michelle's social game there, right, is knowing that it's not going to be this massive repercussion on her. Yeah. Knowing that based on her past history with Wendell at the situ or going into the game and everything, he's just, you know, as Wendell said, they kicked it for a little while. Because of that, and I think parv was aware of that, not be aware of that based on what was happening on that beach in general, right? I think they played it up. Obviously, Michelle was lying for parvities

21:37fire tokens at the same time too. And because there was that added aspect of the social game and winners at war. So I think it makes sense as to why Michelle would do that. And with edge of expression, also, there's a chance that someone's coming back or at the very least you know parvities a juror, right? Yeah. So playing to jury manage in the premerge is a lot more important on a season like that, which is why I don't think we would see something like that happen in 50. But some people like doing that jury management, the entire game, just in case. They sure do. But yeah, I agree. That one definitely made a lot of sense. And then once you got down to those four, they lose again the next time. So then that group of four is forced to vote one of them out. And it's a very like, they seem very frustrated in that episode where it's like, damn, you know, we had this great plan and it's just the four of us. And in that one, Wendell, or sorry, you all was pretty clearly a fourth wheel, I think.

22:40Because he was, he did play so much earlier than they did. So you know, just another unfortunate swap. Yeah, I didn't have these connections with like, you know, the Michelle Wendell of it all. Or just Wendell and Nick playing on consecutive seasons. Yeah, exactly. Along with them a lot closer than someone who played. What would that have been 23 seasons before them? Yeah, someone who's not at events very often. Yeah, it just it was not standing a chance. Yeah, unfortunately. Now, I don't think the David versus, I think the thing with swapping at this, I actually almost think it's bad for the David versus Goliath Alliance in the future of the game to have been sure of this way now. Because they're going to just be picking people off, I think. I also think I would be shocked if we don't have another swap at some point. Oh, yeah, I think we will. Just because again, we're at a regular season of survivor

23:41at this point. I wouldn't be surprised if we get two tribes at some point. I wouldn't be surprised if we like stick with three at like 15 or something like that. I think based on what I'm assuming will happen with double boots for the next couple of weeks, that we would see. That we would see like a situation where they get swapped to two tribes, both tribes are going to tribal council with like individual unity on the line or something like that. I think the David versus Goliath people are in trouble because of that. Because now people are looking at them as a trio immediately as they're like picking people off on their side. Whereas with this new cell, they like you said, they had to cannibalize their own Alliance because they got to that point. There's no danger of that happening with this David versus Goliath group. It, even if, here's that like, I'm throwing real big hypotheticals out here. If I don't think we are getting to a point where we're merging before, I think I could see us merging at 14

24:43because it's the biggest season of survivor, right? The biggest merge possible. I could see a 14 person merge, even if we eliminated two people each week for the next three weeks that would take us there. And watch who loses every single one of those. That's Stephanie gone, that's Ozzy gone, that's Emily gone. They don't even, they aren't even forced to cannibalize themselves. I am wondering what would happen though if they lost two times. So the next time they lose, right? No vote out Stephanie. The time after that Ozzy's got an idol. So I was trying to think about this. Does anyone, I don't think Ozzy told anything about that. I don't think you did either. But Stephanie knows about the fact that Ozzy has an idol. Could you leverage that in another vote? Next time, perhaps. Yeah, I actually think it condemned Stephanie though to be like, you know, Ozzy has an idol. Oh, it would be like, oh great, now we're definitely voting for you because there is a chance maybe that they vote for Ozzy next time before Stephanie. So there is an idol in the mix here

25:44and that could shake things up. I do think that this tribe is very likely to lose again, especially if we are doing, you know, two tribes go to travel council, then I think it's for sure. So one of those three could be taken out that way. And that would actually be beneficial for the other two members of that group, right? Like if Mike White gets idoled out next week, Christian Angelina, I would be kind of like, now that target is taken off. Yeah, I agree. It is very interesting to see. I'm excited to see this. Like, like you were saying earlier, excited for each episode. I'm really excited for this boxy tribe. I think the boxy tribe might have been my favorite tribe for both of these like pre-swap and post-op considerations for different reasons. But I'm really excited. I think where this swap has me excited because also we're seeing something great this episode. We have a blindfold challenge, Kyle. And this isn't just a blindfold challenge, right? Like this is the classic retreat puzzle pieces type of,

26:45in this case it was raised inside of puzzle pieces, but whatever. Yeah. And, but this is going back to a different variation of this one, where at the end of it, you have to have someone directing the blindfolded people to solve something. It's in fact, it's almost the exact same thing that we see in Ghost Island, where after the second swap in Ghost Island, where they're finally swapped into three tribes, and you have our leaders, our color story in Desiree, Dominic, and Wendell, leading their respective tribes, and they have to, you know, people are in pairs, they have to go out and get it, and then they have to lead them back all the way across the field afterwards who, and then instruct them to solve the puzzle, much like we saw today. Yeah. I love that style of challenge. I love where they have to direct the blindfolded

27:47people because you see in that challenge, Desiree gets her tribe off to a really big lead, like they collect the pieces the fastest, they get to the puzzle way before either of the other tribes do, but she could be good at that part, but she might not be so good at directing someone to solve a puzzle, and that is where that tribe runs into a problem. So I like that if you're the color, you have to be very good at managing the field, right, you have to call out to people and distribute your directions properly, but then you have to do the puzzle. So you also have to be good at puzzles. So I love this type of challenge, and Camilla was absolutely the right person, like she's the perfect person for this type of challenge because she called out, that tribe never lost their lead, that was the opposite of Desiree. So yeah, one of the things that I didn't notice the first time I watched, but I didn't notice that. Did you notice Camilla was standing up there

28:48with her like figures out for like directional things? Like she had her like, I already like, she knew which was left and right, and she's probably out in front of her the entire time she was calling that challenge. Yeah, that's extremely helpful because Desiree is saying, you know, go right, go left, and then like Michael walks right into a thing, and she says, oh, I'm sorry, go left. James hits the next obstacle, right? So it's like, yeah, that would be confusing in the moment. So just those little things, you know, those that can really, really help you out. One of the big things I think is very different from this ghost island. I actually think I like the ghost island puzzle more than I like this puzzle that they use for 50. I thought this puzzle for 50 was rather simplistic. And yes, like there was rotations involved, and obviously if anyone doesn't know, puzzles per survivor have two different sides. One that is like the camera side and one that's the player side that they're slightly different colors or sometimes completely different colors.

29:49So they, that's how they know which way to set the puzzle up. And this puzzle was like, what, six pieces? It wasn't that tough. Wasn't that tough. The ghost island one definitely looked more difficult. I also think round puzzles a little harder than a, just like rectangular, here's a fire puzzle. I was, yeah, I'd rather chalk it how simplistic this puzzle was on 50. I guess is what I'm trying. Yeah, I agree. It didn't feel like the craziest thing in the world, like the puzzle in this case was not the great equalizer, right? It was like, if you got there first, you're probably going to solve it first. Whereas the circle one clearly mess them up. And you got some, so one of my favorite things in the blindfold challenge, and sorry for all the players out there are the injuries, right? When people are getting bumped, it is good entertainment. The ghost island one has some gnarly ones. You have Libby who gets a fat lip for the rest of the season. Chelsea runs right into the pole, like a full speed.

30:50Colby gets a concussion in this one, but like, he does about it. So, yeah, the blindfold challenge is it provides such good entertainment. They do, but I wasn't entertained when Colby hit his head. Most of you did. No, yeah. Because I'm like, I'm not a head injury, anything, but a head injury. Give me any other part of the body, that's fine. But the head, oh, that's a little worried now. Yeah, that was, that looks like it hurt. I think the other impressive thing is there was no panic. Like, I think we saw Christian panic a little bit at the end in 50, but that was more with the directions with solving the puzzle. And we saw Desray getting there in Ghost Island as well. Desray's instructions in the puzzle were too vague. You'll notice that when everyone else is calling, both in Ghost Island and in 50 this week, they always direct one person at a time where Christian was like, Q, rotate 180 degrees, right?

31:51Like, was like his instructions with the puzzle and everything. Desray stopped naming people, but it came to the puzzle for some reason. Also was like still using her very yummy voice. She ever was cracking a lot like, yeah. And she was a lot closer to them. I don't think that was necessary. And I think it was leading to a lot of confusion in Ghost Island. But the panic that we saw in Ghost Island when they'll forget his puzzle pieces. Yes, he does. And has to run back and get them after bringing his entire tribe back and still manages to win the challenge. Yeah, outright. I love the addition of bringing your tribe to the puzzle because it's just one more time, get them through the obstacles, right? Like now you're leading them. So now you have to watch every single person as they come in with their hands on the shoulder and all that. I also think that this is a good challenge to do right after a swap. Because this is one where Jeff says, if you're the caller, you're either the hero or the goat.

32:53That's your role. So if you win it, you win it all. If you lose, it's all on you. So it puts the pressure on people where it's like, are we basing this off challenge performance or have the relationships that I've made throughout this season, or perhaps that I have from a previous season? Or is that going to save me? And Christian really takes it hard in this episode, even though he's on a tribe with two of his past season castmates and he's got Emily there, but he doesn't take it lightly, right? He's not like, I'm going to be good no matter what. He definitely takes it all upon himself. I feel like because of this, because of the function of building the puzzle and having the caller direct the puzzle, it puts a lot more owners on the caller than I think we see in other blindfold challenges where it's like, okay, take your blindfolds off and blinding Guatemala, right? Where they be blindfolded and then they take their blindfolds off and build an archeological camp, right? So I think that's a little different and because there is a tribal aspect to it too, or like, oh, here's two people solving the puzzle afterwards

33:55or whatever, in this instance, it really does kind of fall on that one person. And I think another time that we see that is, can we see it in some of it? We kind of don't really see it in some of it because that challenge never finishes. So we actually see it in here as this is villains and that's roll with it. That is the challenge where one tribe member is put into the giant ball strapped up and they have to direct their tribe mates to push them through a course and then get to a table maze which they also have to direct their tribe mates in. What do you think about that challenge in comparison to this one we saw in Jistiga? I love that challenge. I think that it is so great and it's really, really hard. It's awesome that you put the collar in the ball. So they're rolling, they have to, first of all, direct the people who are pushing them. All right, so as they're spinning, they have to keep aware of where their surroundings are. Now you're getting dizzy, right?

34:56You're going, you're rolling, and now you have to guide a group of people to do a table maze which is crazy, right? Because you could say put a piece there, right? Okay, they'll put the piece there but you have to guide them with how much, you know, how much force to do. And then you have everybody on a table maze kind of has to go at once, right? Like everyone, you can't fling it. Even if it's on the other side, you can't just flip it up because you're going to mess it up. So I love this and do it directing the table maze. I think it's awesome. Yeah, I think it's just such a unique challenge that we see in something. We only see it a couple of times. I'm actually kind of surprised they haven't brought something like this back, but in the new era, but they do kind of like avoid these more physical challenges. Also, some of them did almost die one of the times they did this challenge. So I understand that I'm going to get back. However, that was completely unrelated to the challenge itself. So Jeff, come on. Give us, give us something like this because I do think the disorienting of the caller

35:56is the interesting thing here. I think they've seen some really interesting things with the colors. I mean, when I'm thinking like blindfold challenges, I always go to Fiji and Michelle, he's stepping off the pedestal, right? I think that's one of the most hilarious blindfold moments we have out there. But I like these ones where like you have off directing this village tribe, like nothing else to get the win in the challenge. Yeah, Rob is insanely impressive, right? Like he's just, he knows what he's doing. But yeah, the disorienting thing, there's no reason why they can't do this challenge, right? Because like you said, it's not, it had nothing to do with the challenge, why Russell passed out. They have big open fields. They do table mazes. They use the big ball in season 43, I believe it was. The final six reward challenge. So they have the props, right? They have, they have the space. There's no reason why they can't do it. And I'll take what we can get, right? I'll take this blindfold challenge for sure. Honestly, just like a classic blindfold challenge,

36:57I'm finding that it is, it is kind of one of those stages of survivor, right? I think it is one of those moments where it's like, yes, this is a staple survivor challenge. Yeah, I'd be like, I made it to the blindfold challenge, guys. Like, yeah. Yeah, right? So I have to ask that, like while we're in this instance, we'll throw it back to your amazing race coverage days. Would you be a blindfolded person or a caller in this type of challenge? I'm so glad that you asked. I would definitely be a blindfolded person. Let me take that back. On the amazing race, I'd be the caller. Because you're working with your partner, right? So I'd be the caller. I think that I could do a pretty good job at that. On survivor, I'd want to be a blindfolded person. Now I will say, I have played an online game in the past where we had such a challenge. And I specifically did not want to be the caller because I was like, that's the person. If we lose this, that's the person who's going to take all the blame. We lost that challenge. We voted out the caller. So I think that in survivor, this is not the role

37:58that I would want. And I think it's completely different situations. So my answer would change based off of which show I was on. Pursue, I totally get that. I've been a caller at a challenge like this in an online game too. And let me tell you, it's one of the most frustrating things in the entire world. Oh, I bet. When things go wrong, they go really wrong with a caller. That was actually a lot more. I think that challenge was actually a lot more complicated than the challenge was though for a caller perspective. So yeah. I'll take like, you know, a little bit of solos in that. Let's move on to our outlast moment. And obviously, guys, Jeff wraps in this. So we have to talk about song notices. All right, we have to go back to chicken and waltz. No, we're not doing that. We don't worry. We'll give you a reprieve from Jeff wrapping. Also, that being said, I don't care as much as everyone else does. I thought it was crazy as all else. But like, I'm like, sick. I'm watching my B-movie Jeff Broves here. That's fine. I liked it better than the survivor 50 song that he made. I have to say. I think I think this wrap was. The survivor 50 song. He did. He performed it on the tonight show. No, I didn't see that. Oh, oh, yeah.

38:58Might have put that back, it was. No, but we're going to go, we're going to talk about. We kind of mentioned at the beginning, right? Like this idea of like the redemption and everything. But we're just going to look at returning player seasons. People bring him baggage. I think this moment that we get up Charlie was fascinating. Let's see when Charlie is talking to Rizzo. We get the flashback to the night before. And Rizzo is explaining how he's, like, his best friend in the game was Sophie Belairty. And, but he didn't vote for her at the end. And you just see like Charlie maulting there on the ground. And it like editing wise, fantastic. Like what? Editing editors, you've got a fantastic job with that. It was so good. Just the look on Charlie's face that entire time. Charlie with like the voice over of Charlie explaining how, like, there's no way he wants Rizzo anywhere near the jury. And that's how he's voting. Fan, fantastic, wonderful. But it also really comes to show Charlie's coming into this with a lot of vision. That's kind of to be expected based on what happened to him

39:59at the end of season 46, right? With his presumably number one not voting for him to win and costing him a million dollars. But it's so fantastic to see that coming out and Charlie acknowledging it. Because I feel like there are a lot of times we don't see that acknowledging. But one time we do see that acknowledging Brown Scared Crew just mentioned what we were going to talk about. It reminds me a lot of Stephen Fishback in second chances. And his hunt for the Golden Boy, his idea that like, no, I have to get Joe out because I've seen this play out before. And it does him head well for me. Yeah, and he was right. I think, right? Like the Stephen got burned badly. He talks about it still on the know-it-alls. Like that with his plan, if he could just get JT out, right? If he could just win one challenge at the end of the game. So it sucks to know what you need to do and not be able to pull it off for one reason or another or in Charlie's case.

41:01He did everything that he could have possibly done. And his number one didn't vote for him. I'm going to be honest, I don't know why. So that can leave you confused and just frustrated. It's like, with Stephen, it's like, why isn't anybody else seeing what I'm seeing? Or you're just like, we need to vote out Joe. We need to throw a challenge and vote out Joe like now. And he's talking about it to the point he's so passionate about it that he cries, right? And in that episode, he gets really emotional because a lot of people take this very seriously, right? It's like, you're out there. You're putting so much into this. And so you want to your way. It's like, I want you to see it my way. So I think that this is a great comparison, right? It's two guys who were both runner-ups and they are burned by the way they lost before. And I think we can compare Stephen's reaction to another runner-up on Survivor 50, who also had this similar reaction to what Stephen did back then.

42:01And that's Chrissy. The way Chrissy is responding to coach just telling her, hey, just chill out, like a little chill out. Although I will say this, coach said that no worse possible way possible. Yeah, I agree. I don't know what coach was thinking of just like, giving her the hand and being like, no, it's just coach. What else did you expect him to do? Yeah, of course I handled it this way. And of course, Chrissy's reacting in like the most Chrissy way possible. And like, oh, I should go talk to them. It's like, no, no. I should be opposite of what you should do. You should chill out and not talk to them that much because you were talking too much people. But seeing her return to the camp and getting emotional and just like pulling aside Genevieve and Aubrey and being like, hey, can we just have a girl shut down on the beach and like talk about this, talk about this fact that like, I know I wasn't like the last time I played this game and like, I'm feeling that again now and it's really coming back to me. And then it does feel like this emotional connection to what Stephen was showing. And like this, I don't want to use like the big T word, but I'm going to like, it feels like this trauma

43:02coming from their first game that they held this entire time, right? Like, I guess Chrissy was 15 seasons ago. Stephen was 13 seasons between. So like, it's similar dip time and like they both still are holding on to that so much coming into this game. And then like seeing it come to fruition in front of them just like takes them into a state where Chrissy's even saying like, I never cried, the survivor. But here I am, like I'm crying. Yeah, and it's really, it's really fascinating to see these people open up this way. It's shocking that like Chrissy's gap between seasons was longer than Stevens. Like that's just kind of mind blowing when you think about it, but it really has been that long. And she has been holding this in for that period of time. And you know, she lost, as she says in this episode because she wasn't well liked. And she lost to someone who I think also wasn't really well liked by that jury. So it's like that has to hurt even a little bit more. You know, it's like just how unlike was I,

44:03and with the age of social media that we're in, you see this for nine years now. And you've been holding it in. And now you come out and people are telling you again that you're not liked. It's like this insecurity that you had that you've been holding onto. I don't think it's unreasonable to call it trauma because it does bleed into real life when you have the online forums that we have now. And you're seeing it and hearing it all the time that I think it's totally reasonable to call it that. And it bubbles up here for Chrissy. Because it's like the thing, the one thing that she probably didn't want to happen coming into the season, she's now learning is happening again. And that's really, really hard, I would imagine. It is absolutely. And to know that there are so many people out there who I think within the like really entrenched survivor fandom a lot of people are really hoping to see Chrissy again. We're really feeling like she could go really far in the game

45:07and show really strong. And after last week's episode, it was just like, oh, maybe this isn't going so well for Chrissy. I think I actually think of like all the players on the season that we saw. I think Chrissy really embodies what Chrissy was saying at the end of the episode with that like that in-game party rebirth. I think like it almost feels like we're setting Chrissy up that way from an end of perspective. But you don't really see it because it seems like two completely unconnected things. But I was thinking about that, thinking about like Charlie. Thinking about, and like the Charlie thing might actually be relating to like Rizzo and just how Rizzo again is like not really fitting in with a new try once again. Like see how he works his way through it and everything. I want to comment on that too. Yeah. Rizzo, why did he say that Sophie Belerdi was his number one? Is that true? So in post game, in post game coverage, both Rizzo and Sophie and Savannah, all admitted like Sophie and Rizzo were super dead. They're like still best friends.

46:07Yeah, I know they are. But I just would have expected him to say Savannah. I think there's, I know on Digging Deeper last night, Phil, Will and Joe Menner were kind of speculating, okay, well maybe it's because like Savannah was there and there's not really sure. And maybe they were trying to like downplay how much they knew each other. So like how much they work together on their season is like people didn't know Savannah had one going in, but they didn't know, you know, Savannah and Rizzo were on the same beach the entire game and working together like in step and locked up the entire time. So I think like potentially they went in with this plan to say that like Sophie was the first and they were closest to so that they could kind of hide that. And then at this point in the game, you're seven days in when this swap happens. Like yes, Savannah's gone now, but you don't know how much he's already told like three in Devons who she was on a tribe with. So you kind of with the plan, just in case like there's conflicting information and it doesn't work. But from my understanding based on post game stuff

47:10and Rizzo will probably watch this video eventually and can put in the comments. My understanding is that Sophie and Rizzo were very close on the island. Yeah. And like we didn't see that in the edit because they're kind of like hyping up the 50 of it all and showing that Rizzo and Savannah were both there. But from my understanding Rizzo and Sophie were incredibly close on the island. Yeah. I believe that and I just found that an interesting scene but it makes sense. I certainly would have if I was Rizzo, I would not expect that it would have set off this, you know, chain of events. You know what the one thing you could have done though is say he voted for Sophie. Like nobody needs to know who Rizzo was. Yeah, no one needs to know. Yeah. But alas, that's where we are. If someone else who I think came in with a lot of baggage and terror training season, and we're going to go backwards or work here. And because I think it is one of the more powerful moments we see in awareness at war. And it's kind of similar to I think what we get from like Aubrey and Tiffany in this episode where Aubrey, where Tiffany's like, hey, by the way, they're all planning on voting you out. And I was like, this has happened to me before when I returned.

48:10What's going on? But that's not the example going on. One of those layers of war. And it actually is very closely related to Aubrey because it's the person who beat Aubrey. And it's Michelle is coming back in awareness at war and having this conversation with Rob just about like her perception from the fandom. And you mentioned it last earlier, Kyle. These people are living in a world of social media where people are so he set it on the power of a position great, like people are like messaging you during season, like giving you like death threats and stuff. That's ridiculous. Don't turn that a stupid. Don't wish that upon anyone. Don't correct these sort of people who are giving us our entertainment. Like that's not necessary. Yeah, but Michelle in awareness at war is being told like she was undeserving winner. We shouldn't have bought in the game. She got lucky winning it. She's one of the worst winners of all time. And obviously we don't think that you're on the specials. We're not allowed to think that you're on the specials. She's one of the best winners of all time.

49:11But it's that conversation she has with Rob. And it really felt a lot like this conversation Aubrey and Tiffany were having of like, no, I have to come to terms with this. Like Aubrey being like, I'm not gonna cry. And it's kind of like contrast to what we saw with Chrissy. Yeah, I honestly love when they show these moments on the show. I like when the show gets a little meta, right? Where it's and they talk about this kind of stuff because with Michelle, you know, it's cheap. Yeah, this debate still rages on to this day, right? The Michelle and the Aubrey thing. And that has to be incredibly hard to have your win diminished time after time. And you know, you have obviously hurt supporters, like Phil, but those supporters are so loud to try and like drown out, I would say, the majority of people who think that Aubrey should have won in Boston Rob is married to someone who I think also gets disrespected

50:15as a winner. And they say he should have beat her in all stars. So he probably knows what that is like. And here's it from her too. So I think that that's a great conversation, or a great person to have that conversation with Michelle and sort of, you know, help her out there. And Michelle's like, I'm going to use this to my advantage. Like it's going to fuel me. And I think it helps with the perception while you're out there. But with Aubrey, she doesn't really have that person to turn to like Tiffany comes to her, but Tiffany doesn't obviously have the pedigree that Boston Rob does. So and Aubrey is different. It's like, I got I continue to be targeted because people think I'm a huge threat, right? Like I don't know how good she is like socially. So it's it's two different situations, but it's fascinating to see it either way. And it's like you said, the two people who were in that tribal together, you know, they're both dealing with their own versions of their experience there.

51:15Yeah, yeah, I think it's fascinating. And this is why I like returning to various seasons. I think like going now that we're into 50 for three weeks and I think it's very clear. Like we need more returning player seasons, but we don't either make as frequently as we were getting them in the 30s. I think that was a little overkill just because like we had that, you know, I end the 20s, the 20s. And 20s the captains like, yeah, yeah. But Kyle, this has been fantastic. Thanks for joining me this week. Absolutely. It's supposed to blast. Thank you for having wonderful. You guys don't haven't had enough of Kyle. You can check out his channel, the matchup. I have put the link in the description of the video. Thank you. So check that out. He has some great analysis of survivor over there. Yeah. I got a new video probably like next weekend or something like that. Just upload them whenever. Excellent. And if you want more specialist coverage from Kyle, he'll be joining me on the page around this week where we are going to be talking about Ghost Island Episode 5, Fade of the Home means that is the episode with the blindfold challenge we mentioned earlier and the swap. It's a fun episode. Really makes you reflect on that Ghost Island cast, though.

52:17We'll get into that. We'll get to you on what's going on with the specialist? Well, on Wednesday, Phil, and we'll recap the episode. It was not a long one. So go check that out if you haven't already. I mean this with like every ounce of my being. If you have not checked out the digging deeper with Joe Menon last night, make sure you do it. It has a moment in it where I burst out laughing on my walk home. And people were looking at me weird because of how hard I was laughing. It was one of the funniest things in the entire world. So make sure you go back, watch that one if you haven't. Phil is going to be joined by Kelly Wentworth on Sunday for the Power Rankings. That'll be fantastic. And then on Monday, Teguith is being joined by Sabaya for Matt Chat, which will also be fantastic. We'd love what Sabaya brings. And she has such fantastic analysis of the game. That'll be a lot of fun. Phil will be back on Tuesday for his predictions episode

53:19with another guest. I'm not sure who's there this week, but make sure you stay tuned to find out. Like the video, subscribe to the channel. Become a patron because that's where you get more stuff. Like Kyle and I talking about Ghost Island this week. Every season matters going through San Juan del Sur right now. There is a ton of like casting perspectives and everything over there. Please check it all out. Thanks for tuning in. I'll be back next week. McKenna will be back here. We'll see you next Friday. If you're a podcast host, listen up this once for you. My name is Ally Jackson. I'm the host of Finding Mr. Height, a dating and relationship podcast that I've been doing for four years now, sharing my positive and practical approach to dating that's built on my own life experience. And I wanted to share another experience that I've had. My secret behind monetizing my show. It's called Red Circle. And I was just telling my colleague about how much I love their platform with Red Circle. Not only am I getting a seamless hosting experience, but I also love the support I receive in ad sales.

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