"Strangers: A Memoir of Marriage" Book Deep Dive

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2:01with your personalized quitting journey. That's quitwithjones.com slash tanks, taking back control starts now. Thanks to quit with Jones for sponsoring this episode. Just a heads up, the mints contain nicotine, which is an addictive chemical. Jones's FDA approved and available for those that are 18 and older. What is up guys, welcome back to the pod. Hope everyone has had a great week. I have been so excited to record this episode. Today I wanna talk about strangers by Bellburden. If you don't know what the book is about, I still hope you'll stick around and listen to this episode because I'm sorry if you haven't read the book, I still hope you'll stick around for this episode because the concept is very easy to understand. It's a memoir and I'm gonna use it as a vehicle to talk about why I think it's so important that women maintain their autonomy and their own life while getting married and then also why it's so important for women to always know how much money they have, where the money is and why it's important to get a prenup. So I guess you could say there will be spoilers,

3:02although you kind of know what has happened after the first couple of pages. So Bellburden is just to give you some background. Her grandmother was Babe Paley, who if you know who that is, it was one of Truman Capote's very wealthy family, very rich family. She grew up very educated. She, you know, she definitely came from like a fancy world. So this memoir is all about her getting a divorce. Essentially in the first couple of pages she describes how in COVID in 2020, they were on her and her husband, they have three kids who are like teenagers at this point. They, one day he is just like I wanted a divorce and they've been married for 20 or 21 years. Out of nowhere, he is having an affair and she is 100% blindsided. I truly thought they were having the happiest marriage. She loved her life, she loved her family. She loved her husband and he said,

4:03and I'm having an affair and I want nothing to do with you. I want nothing to do with the kids. And this book is about their divorce proceedings. And the moment that stood out to me the most in the entire book is there's a part where he leaves on that day like he goes to see the woman he's having an affair with. And he comes back a couple months later to try and get some of his stuff. She later learns that he was actually looking for their prenup. He came back to the Martha's Vineyard not to say hi to their kids or, you know, explain to them what's going on but to try and find their prenup. And there's a part where he said, you know, I'm really hungry. Could you make me a sandwich? And she fucking goes to make him a sandwich. And if I could sum up my purpose in life with this podcast, okay? I would explain it as such. My hope is that if girls listen to me they would laugh in a man's face.

5:05If she, if he asked her to make him a sandwich after having left her for another woman and just starting the most brutal divorce, she fucking made him a sandwich. Now, I wanna back up. I wanna say that I really admire Bell Burton's courage to be honest. It is very hard to write an honest memoir about who you were and the mistakes you made knowing that people are going to poke holes in everything and knowing that people are going to be critical of, you know, the choices that you've made. But I do feel like she's honest. That doesn't mean that I have to be nice about the choices that she made or the things that she decided to do throughout the book because there were so many points of the book where I was actually screaming at her, oh my God, are you fucking kidding me girl? Like you could not have picked a worse decision. So I think one of the other interesting main themes of the book is can you tell, can you really tell what someone's red flags are? And I thought that was a really interesting theme that Bell threaded throughout.

6:07And she again was super honest about, you know, things that her husband had done throughout their life where now in hindsight, we are all thinking, oh girl, you should have known. But at the time, can you ever really know like how honest can you be in the moment? So, for example, they have a very whirlwind romance. She describes him as, you know, kind of impulsive and wanting to get married all of a sudden. And, you know, she got really swept up in it and they were engaged so quickly and he was, you know, swept her off her feet basically. And in the context of him leaving her so quickly, you're kind of thinking, oh, well, you know, we should have known, but, you know, people get swept up in romances all the time. So I don't know, throughout the book, I was really having that conversation with myself thinking how much can you ever really tell if something is a red flag or, you know, if it's just the thing that's happening at the moment? So, a huge part of the book is about pre-nubs.

7:10So, essentially, a few days before they got married, Bell's husband says to her, her fiance at the time, says to her, oh, we need to make a slight modification to the pre-nubs so that anything that we have in the marriage, or anything that we get in the marriage could, is up for grabs for both of us. And she has like a weird feeling in her gut, and she doesn't even tell her family about this change. Like, and I don't know if I'm describing the detail of that change completely, but like, something in her, an alarm bell went off, and she was like, I don't really think this is a good idea to the point where I'm not gonna tell my family, because I know that they'll, you know, they'll definitely have pause about this, but she goes ahead with it anyway, because she's so madly in love with him, and she thinks, oh my God, you know, you know, what could go wrong? Because she comes from a rich family, when they buy their houses, they have one house in New York, I think, and then one in Martha's Vineyard,

8:12she buys them, she uses her trust funds to buy the houses, and here's the kicker, she decides to put her husband's name on both of the deeds. And given that the pre-nup, the modification he made, she still knew, like, oh, if anything were to ever happen, you know, the husband will have claim over these, even though I bought them with my money, but she still puts his fucking name on the deeds. And this was just so maddening to the reader, because you are thinking, why would you do that? It's, okay, yeah, of course you wanna buy a house for your family, it's your money, you can do it with whatever you want, but the fact that you put your husband's name on the deed, when it was 100% your money, is so crazy to me. I felt so sad when she said she had a wave of anxiety after she basically forced her lawyer to amend the pre-nup. So even her lawyer was saying, Belle, this is not a good idea, this is really sketchy that he's doing it only a few days before the wedding and whatnot. And she just felt so anxious because she basically strong armed her lawyer into doing it.

9:13Now, why wouldn't you just have this strength to say, wait, hold on a second, why are we making this amendment so close to the wedding? Why is this so important to you? You know, it was just very frustrating as a reader, because again, she's an educated woman, she's smart, she went, she had a job, she went to the good schools, she comes from a good family. And to me, I was just thinking, man, if this woman doesn't have the strength to stand up against a man, who does? Imagine if you were a woman who did not come from a rich family, or maybe you were not so educated, maybe you, whatever, I'm just imagining these scenarios. And this is why I'm so passionate about women knowing their worth and women thinking ahead and women, I'm not advocating that you should live your life like always looking over your shoulder, thinking something bad is gonna happen. I'm advocating for women to always be prepared. Because guess what, guys, in life, women always get the short end of the stick. Fucking always, especially when it comes to matters like this. So, you know, to me, there is nothing unromantic about a prenup on the contrary.

10:14To me, getting a prenup and knowing your worth and protecting yourself in that way is, it's respectful. And anyone that I ever married, I would absolutely 3,000% get a prenup. When I was talking about this book on Instagram, I was echoing what I just said, saying I'm frustrated that such an educated, wealthy woman didn't have the smarts to a not amend her prenup a few days before her wedding and be put her husband's name in the deed, knowing full well she paid outright for both the houses. And people were writing to me saying, oh, I wouldn't wanna get a prenup, it invites the bad vibes. The bad vibes, girls, 51% of marriages end in divorce. It's just so crazy to me that people think that they are the exception, not the rule. And I'm not saying you need to enter into your marriage, thinking, oh, I'm gonna get a divorce. I am asking you to look at the stats. If you, if I said to you, oh, you have to get a surgery,

11:1449% chance you live, 51% chance you died. Be like, are you fucking mad, are you crazy? So why, why when it comes to prenups, why when it comes to marriages do women feel like that it's not gonna apply to them? I don't think it has anything to do with whether you think your marriage is gonna last or not. I think it has everything to do with, with your self respect, your self esteem, and wanting to protect yourself and what you have. And especially if you have kids, even more reason. Okay, okay, I have this in my notes. So your family wants the best for you. And if you are lying to your family and friends about a guy, you can bet that's a red flag. Yeah, so I was thinking about that because as I mentioned, she doesn't tell her family about this amendment to the prenup. If you are lying to your family and friends about something a guy did, I think that that is a red flag.

12:16And I'm not just talking about prenups, I'm talking about anything. I think that's a really good lesson that I took from the book is, we can't always tell what red flags are, right? But if you are lying about what someone does to the people who love you most in the world, you can bet your sweet ass that's a red flag. No one loves you more in the world than your friends and your family. They want the best for you, okay? So if you are lying to them about something a guy did, something a guy said, something a guy wants, that is not fucking good. And we've all done it, right? We've all protected a guy and said, oh no, he didn't do that or, oh, yeah, he brought me flowers on my birthday telling your mom something or whatever. That is actually a good rule for you guys. If you are lying to your family and friends about a guy, big red fucking flag. For anyone who needs the memo, Stella Rosa has mastered the art of being delicious without taking itself too seriously. It's semi-sweet, has that perfect sparkle and is the one bottle you know will never disappoint

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15:19along with fast shipping and easy assembly options. Guys, I have been making little updates to my apartment and what I need most is organization and there are so many good little organizing pieces from Wayfair that just make putting your stuff away to put it simply so much easier. And I love these cabinets that I got from Wayfair. I have been putting all my extra beauty products in there because quite frankly, it was looking a mess in my bathroom. So it's just good to get a little extra help with organization. I know we all want to keep our spaces calm and clean and Wayfair is the place to go to do that. Find furniture decor and essentials that fit your unique style and budget. Head to Wayfair.com right now to shop all things home. That's w-a-y-f-a-i-r.com. Wayfair, every style, every home. So I think another really interesting theme of the book is the outdated idea that okay, a woman stays home, she takes care of the kids and then the guy goes to work. And she says in the book that they had this unspoken bargain

16:19that he could work all the time and she would take care of the kids. And I want to begin by saying, I have the utmost respect for stay-at-home moms. Like I actually personally believe stay-at-home mom is the hardest job in the world. I think it's insanely difficult and insanely stressful and taxing and emotional, there's a big emotional tool. And I don't think that we have sold an accurate portrayal of what it means to be a stay-at-home mom at all. Like I will admit that when I was growing up, I thought my mom lived the life of Riley. I was like, oh my God, she doesn't work. She just takes care of us and chills all day. No, she doesn't. Taking care of children, running a house, making sure kids have done their homework, they go to the doctor's, preparing food. All of that shit is incredibly, incredibly high-functioning job. And then you layer on the fact that you never get a day off, you don't get acknowledged. No one says to you, oh my God, wow, you work so hard. You just people think, oh, you just drive around and go to Pilates all day.

17:21And I think the reason this bookstark accord so much with me is like, she, as well as just taking care of the kids, she really lost her identity while she was staying at home with them. I think that something that's super important when you enter into a marriage, and this reminds me of like, a freshman is in trouble, is that you have the unsexy conversations and you're aligned on the unsexy thing. So she kept saying in the book like, how it was just this unspoken rule like that she did the kids in the house, he did the work. And that's wrong. When you are entering into a marriage with someone, you, and if you want to stay home with your kids, you have to say, okay, well, I'm staying home. I need this amount of time, like to myself, I need, we are going to do, I'm going to have these days off, we are going to have a housekeeper this day so I can get a rest or whatever. And you need to, you need to make sure that your husband acknowledges that what you're doing is actual work. It's not chilling at home. It is literally a job and it needs to be recognized as such.

18:21Even if that's your dream, if that's your dream, that's great, it still work. And I think, you know, there was also another part of the book when she was like, oh, I kind of want to go back to work and he was like, no, you have to stay home and take care of the kids. Even though the kids were in high school at that point. So like another red flag. But the point is she wasn't recognized for her role in their family and she just like allowed it to happen. And then it's so crazy that you layer on the fact that she bought both their houses. And again, I'm not saying don't spend your money on your family, of course you should, but she just didn't advocate for her position in their family. She just let it all happen and I am warning you against that. You have to have these conversations with your husband, okay, we're going to have two kids. Well, guess what? That's going to cost this amount of money. We're going to need this, we're going to need that. All of those things need to be aligned before you just, you know, jump it. I wrote in my notes, the way I would never put the man on the deed to my, the way I would never fucking put the man on the deed to my house. Another really, really, really crucial part to this book

19:23is that you should never hand over all of your, all of the money, all of the things, you know, to do with your finances to the man of the house, okay? That's a very traditional setup and I've even seen some videos on TikTok being like, like I wrap the kids' presence like he deals with the bills. That's not like cutesy, you guys. That's not like a flex, okay? That's not, that doesn't mean your husband's like all that if he pays the bills. You, he can pay the bills, that's fine, but you need to know how much money you have, what the situation is, what you have access to, where the deeds to all the houses are, all the things you own. That shit is how women get completely wrecked when marriage is end. I saw also this video that was like on TikTok, this girl who was like gearing up to tell my husband that our wedding is also like my retirement party like because she wanted to quit. And again, if you wanna stay at home and be a mom,

20:25that's great, but I just feel there's been this resurgence of this glorification online of like Chad, wife, just oh my god, like my man does everything, like I do nothing. That's all fun and games until you get divorced. Again, if you want one person to be in charge of the bills, that is a okay, but you need to know where your money is and how much you have of it and how to access it. It's also important for things like we've been talking about gambling lately, like the woman who called the show who was like, oh my god, I found out my husband has gambled away all this money. Because she wasn't checking. Because she didn't know how much money they had because she wasn't keeping up with it. And yeah, that stuff is like quote boring, but it's like your life. It's not like cutesy to just let the man do everything. If he wants to make a boatload of money and spoil you, so be it, but know exactly how much money you have. Like it really baffles me how people think that they are the exception and not the rule. And again, you know me guys, I'm an optimistic person.

21:26Like I think things work out. Like I think everything's gonna be okay. All that good stuff. But I do find that like the women who are the smuggists are always the ones who have like the biggest blowups in their marriage. And you know where I learned that? Don't roll your eyes, housewives. If you watch every single franchise of real housewives, there's always someone season one who is so fucking smug who's like my life rocks, my man is so rich. Oh my God, like everything is perfect. Like all I do is get my nails done and chill. Like I'm thinking about Camille Grammer. I'm thinking about Teresa Judeis. Like there are so many. And like their whole thing is like, oh my God, my man is so great. He pays for everything. And then a couple of seasons later, oh well, they're going to jail. Oh well, he left her for a younger woman. I don't want to scare you. I just want you to be prepared. I hope all of your marriages last forever. But like statistically, they're not going to. And it doesn't mean you have to think, oh no, I'm going to get divorced. I really want you to like remove the emotion from it

22:29because I cannot comprehend why anyone would not keep control of their finances, like at least know what's going on and why they would not have a prenup. So another thing that really rubbed me the wrong way about Belle is that she, and I just always need to say this because I'm scared of you guys getting angry with me. I know I've never been married. I understand that, but like I have a brain. So this is my opinion on the situation. So her kids were like in high school when this happened, when he left her, and he was awful. Like truly awful left them in such a bad way, didn't care about the kids. Since he left the first day, the kids have never slept over at night at his house. He got a new apartment and she was like, oh, there's only one bed, there's only one extra bed when we have three kids. And he was like, oh, I don't really plan on having them over. Like dick, like fucking asshole, right? But she really protected her kids from knowing that he cheated. Now I have heard time and time again, you should never speak bad of the other parent, even if they're doing awful stuff.

23:31And I agree with that, like I totally agree with that. But for a long time, she really protected him and lied and said, oh, he's going through something. He didn't talk about the cheating, all this stuff. And I just wouldn't have done that. I would not speak, if I were in her position, I would obviously not speak badly about my children's father to them. But if they were like, oh, is dad cheating? I'd be like, yeah, sorry, they're in high school. That's crazy to me. I know it's easy for me to say this, not being in the situation. But I always tell you guys the longer you try to understand why, the longer you hurt. So in the book, bell just cannot comprehend why. And it's to the point where you want to shake her and you're thinking, babe, he's gone. He has literally been with another woman. He's out the door. Why are you still trying to comprehend why? Again, it was just frustrating because I do feel like she's a really smart person, especially exemplified in how, you know, go to writer she is

24:32and how thoughtful she is and how she's able to look back and reflect and everything. But you just kind of wonder why can she not get it through her head? It doesn't really matter at some point. You know, he's left you. He's cheated on you. And you're still thinking sitting there like going on these walks, being like, oh, man, I wonder why that happened. It definitely triggered me in the sense that, and I've been honest about this before, when women are not strong, it's one of my greatest triggers. And it's for personal reasons that I don't really want to go into, but that is a huge part of why I feel the way I feel about things, why I try to tell you guys to always protect yourselves. And when I feel like women are weak, it's very, very upsetting to me, because I just want to shake her and I want to be like, girl, you've got to move on with your, you've got to get yourself together, you've got to pull yourself up by your bootstraps and move forward, because at some point, it's not helpful to just ask over and over again, why, why, why, why, why, you're not going to get an answer.

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29:40And I understand that she was going through a divorce, but this was like over a year later. It's like if you can't leave the house because you're worried about hearing someone say something positive about their own husband because your husband left you, like that's being too fragile. You, again, I understand I'm sounding really harsh after not having been through a divorce of 20 years. Like I can't imagine the pain. I totally get that. But I think if we're being critical, if we're looking at it as a piece of text that we can analyze and learn from, you kind of have to look around and go, okay, wow. I'm at a point where my husband left me over a year ago and I'm getting upset because someone said something nice about their own husband. That to me is like, again, you've kind of got to get it together. And then she goes to, she calls a friend who is also divorced and she's like, oh my God, why is it so difficult to be around happy people and married people? Like, and I just thought to myself in that moment, how the fuck do you think single people feel? I don't know why that's where my brain went, but she literally calls her friend and they have this whole thing being like, oh my God, it's so difficult to be around married people.

30:43Hello, how do you think single people feel all the time? Just, and I don't even feel that way. But it just, I don't know, there was parts of the book that really of her personality that really frustrated me because I just felt like she was truly felt like she was the first woman to ever been left and to ever go through a divorce. That was the tone of it. Again, I'm sounding super harsh. I hope you guys don't think that you know I have endless sympathy for people. But there was parts where I was just thinking you actually think you're the first person in the world to get divorced. It's bad. It's definitely painful. I completely get that. But it just was so frustrating to me. And I felt really, I felt like I wanted her to be more, you know, I wanted her to be stronger, you know. And eventually she wrote this article for The New York Times Modern Love. It's a column if you don't know what it is. She wrote a condensed version of the book for this, you know, and this is how the book came about. And that's kind of how she ended up getting her mojo back.

31:45But I just, it stresses me out when women can't be like more introspective in the moment. And again, I know that's difficult in the face of deep pain and betrayal and cheating. It's awful. It really is. But that was my personal emotional reaction to it. Okay. The last thing that I want to talk about is friendship. So she doesn't overtly say it, but she kind of alludes to it in a few places that she kind of didn't have any of her own friends when she was in her marriage. And then after she gets divorced or she's getting divorced and her husband leaves her, she's trying to reach out to people and she's like having a hard time being their friend. And I cannot emphasize enough how much I think it's important to maintain your own relationships when you're in a marriage. Oh, my God, there's this other part. Okay. It's connected to this. This is going to be uncomfortable to say. This is going to be, I'm stressed out, but I need to go there.

32:45So there's a part when she is going to the gynecologist and her gynecologist says to her, you know, I've seen a lot of men who leave women who don't work. Now, obviously that's, first of all, so fucking savage for her gynecologist to say that to her. If someone said that to me while they had a speculum or whatever that thing is called up my vage, I'd be like, are you fucking kidding me? I'd be like, get my feet out of the stairs and like walk out like so balzy. But now, obviously that's a generalization. We have no idea why James, her husband left Bell, but I don't, I don't know if that's wrong, you know? Like I don't know if she was doing it to be bitchy. I think she was just saying something that she'd seen. And my honest opinion is I think that some men resent women for staying home because of what I was talking about before. I think men think that staying at home is really easy and then it builds up over time.

33:45Just because this is wrong, it doesn't mean it's untrue. And I'm saying wrong is in like good bad. Just as, you know what I mean? So yeah, that's kind of also the sense that I had gotten based on things that Bell had said in the book about things that her husband James would say to her. He kind of got resentful thinking, oh, she's just digging around at home which couldn't be further from the truth. And then he also left her for this like business woman who had a big job and whatever, whatever. So I mean, it's a cliche, but I just, I don't know that part really stuck with me as well where I was just thinking, oh my God, like that's totally what happened. James felt resentful that Bell just stayed home, didn't really have her own life, didn't really have her own friends and then he ended up going for someone who was completely her opposite, which is also sad because she had a cool job before she, before she, you know, she went when they met and she is an interesting person. And just because you don't work, it doesn't mean that you're not worthy of love.

34:46And I'm not saying you guys, I want to be super clear. I'm not saying you should keep working just so your husband finds you interesting. That's the opposite of what I'm saying. I'm saying you need to make sure that your man values you, whether you work, whether you stay at home, whether you stay at home with kids. The important part is that he values you and respects you whatever you choose to do. That is super crucial. And then separately, I also think not to keep a man, but in general, it is so important to keep your friends. It is so important to keep your female friends. They are the through line. They are, as soon as she gets left, she goes to all her friends and there's even one part where her friend is like, you know, you weren't a great friend to me when we were married or something. I get it, nobody thinks they're gonna get divorced. Nobody thinks their husband is gonna leave them, but it doesn't matter. Even if you have the best marriage in the world, guess what, having friends will make it better. It just will. You have to maintain your identity when you get into a relationship.

35:48It is so crucial like I believe it so, so, so much. Like it really, really do. That was a big rant. All this to say, I would totally recommend the book. It is an absolutely captivating read. And even though I've been really harsh on her in parts, I want to commend Bell for her honesty and her ability to share her, I mean, I don't know what you'd call it, like share who she is and share how devastated she was. Like it's very raw and it's very hard to be honest with the world about mistakes you've made. So I commend her. It's beautifully written. I read it in one day flat. Like I literally couldn't stop. But, you know, for most of the book, I wanted to be like, girl, you gotta get, you know, go get bangs and like go eat prey love and then get back to it. You know, because the last thing I'll say and I don't mean to sound like an annoying like woke person at all, but it was also a very privileged view of divorce.

36:48And that's what I mean when I say she kind of felt like she was the first woman to ever be divorced. And I'm like, you have money. You are smart. You are educated. Do you know how many fucking women out there? And it doesn't mean her story's not valid. It doesn't mean the book shouldn't have been written at all. That's not what I'm saying. I'm just saying, I think that context is important. And when I think about like what scares me, it's that there are so many women out there who get left who don't have a fucking scent. They don't have a dime to their name. They have kids that they have to feed and take care of and they have nothing and they've been out of the workforce and they have nothing to fall back on. Like, you know, obviously I'm super passionate about this. But again, I think it's beautiful. I loved the book. I think she's a great writer, but I do think it's like a cautionary tale. And I just want to play a clip from one of my favorite, from one of my favorite tick tockers, tell the bees with three E's, tell the bees. And this, they did a video on it.

37:50And I just think it's summed up so beautifully. So I'm just going to play it here. There's also a critical examination of the things that women give up in partnership and in marriage. If you follow me, you know that I talk a lot about this. The epidemic of women not having friends or the epidemic of women like choosing their partners over everything else in their lives, right? Belburden acknowledges that she wasn't a great friend, that she wasn't like an amazing person because she was cocooned in the safety of her marriage, right? She sort of thought that she was better than other women and other people because she was like, well, my life is perfect. I have this husband who loves me and we have three kids and we have all this money and nothing can ever hurt me. And then of course it did. This book is an examination of what it took for her to get her agency back, right? Because she acknowledges that by giving up her financial ability to take care of herself, right? It's not even that he was like paying the bills. She did not know how much money she had. She gave him control of every single thing in her life. She stopped working. She didn't really have friends. She had like three friends for when she was a kid because she talks about the slot in the book. She talks about how shy she was. And at one point it was like, we got it. You're the shyest person who ever lived. But by giving up control of every single thing

38:52in her life to a man, it was horrifying and charring how much her life had to change when they got divorced, right? She didn't know anything about her life. She didn't know anything about her finances. So by the way, you need to go follow, tell the bees. Seriously, one of my favorite creators on TikTok, just so smart. And I get book recommendations all the time. So highly recommend. But that was just a more concise way of what I've been rambling about for the better part of half an hour. Anyway, you guys, sorry if I was intense. This is such a really important topic to me. And I believe in love and marriage and all those things. I just always want my girls to be safe and to know their worth and know what's up so that in the off chance something bad happens down the line, you're covered, you know, that's all, that's all. We just want to be covered. We don't even need, we don't even have time for AMA, do we, Steve? We do not. Okay, so that's me done, rant, rant taken.

39:53If anyone has any book recommendations for me, please let me know because I'm just in such a good jug of reading right now and it makes me feel so happy. I'm currently reading Next to Heaven by James Frey. I think it's actually pronounced James Frey, I'm sorry. Highly, highly recommend 10 out of 10 such a fun read, completely opposite to strangers, but also really good. And if you've read any unreal books except for the correspondent, let me know. I will be back on Monday with another live show. Until then, be good, bye. You Security usually means extra steps and complications, but with Apple Pay, secure payments are simple. Your transactions are authenticated with Face ID, Touch ID, or Passcode, so security is built in when you check out. Plus, your name isn't shared with merchants and they don't see your actual card number. Whether you're shopping in store, online, or in F,

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