Power Play #2170: Ottawa, Alberta reach agreement to streamline major projects

0:00When life gets unpredictable, preparation matters. In medicine, it's all about staying alert, ready for whatever comes through the door. On the road, it's no different. That's why Volvo designs vehicles to help anticipate risk, reduce harm and protect lives. The Volvo XC90's advanced safety systems inspire confident decisions wherever the road takes you. The Volvo XC90 for life. Proud sponsor of the Pit Podcast. Learn more at VolvoCars.ca-safety. Hi and welcome to Powerplay. I'm Mike Lucoutur. Tonight, closing in on one week of the conflict in the Middle East. The achievable objectives of Operation Epic Fury. We expect to last about four to six weeks and we are well on our way to achieving those objectives. Waves of U.S. and Israeli strikes continue to hit Iran as President Donald Trump demands Iran's unconditional surrender.

1:04We'll talk to former CIA Director General David Petraeus and ask him what victory looks like in the region. Then progress towards the pipeline. What I'm very encouraged by with our MOU is that the federal government agreed to address most of our grievances. The federal and Alberta governments have reached a deal that gives the province a greater say in a major project. We've got Premier Daniel Smith standing by and I'll ask her if there's any progress on carbon pricing with Ottawa. Plus, Carnie's Week abroad. My minister is set to return to Canada after a whirlwind international trade mission. So how does our front bench rate his week? We'll ask them. So we're going to grow over a millennial peridzee, Carl Belange and Marie Vestel will all be here just a little later on in the show. First though.

2:04Of course, it's in the best interest of the United States of America for Iran to no longer be led by a radical terrorist regime that chance death to America and is lying to the United States in the world about their secret ambitions to possess a nuclear bomb. President Trump does not want to see that. He wants to take an interest in pursuing who the next leader of the Iranian country is going to be. And that has yet to be seen and the president is discussing it and deliberating it. That is the latest messaging from the White House on the U.S. objectives in the Middle East. It's been nearly a week since the U.S. and Iran started airstrikes and the Trump administration says the military campaign could last four to six weeks. The U.S. President Donald Trump says the conflict will continue until Iran's government is fundamentally changed. He's also been vocal about wanting to be part of the selection of its new leader. Trump also appeared to rule out negotiations with Iran writing on social media today in part.

3:07There will be no deal with Iran except unconditional surrender. Earlier today, we spoke to the former CIA director General David Petraeus. The general also led the U.S. military operations in both Iraq and Afghanistan. He gave his assessment of the conflict so far and the road ahead. Have a listen. Hi, General Petraeus. Welcome back to Powerplay. Thanks for joining us. Good to be with you, Mike. Thanks. So we're coming up on a week of this war and you said the short-term challenge will be to find and destroy Iran's missile stocks and manufacturing facilities. The U.S. and Israel are also targeting the Revolutionary Guard Corps and every single headquarters. How would you assess the progress on those fronts? Well, I think it's very impressive, but also add in there, by the way, the drone program. You have to go after that as well. That's proved to be problematic. The missile numbers have come down very substantially. If you look at the statistics, the drone number is not so much so. And obviously they have a much smaller warhead, but they are equally challenging.

4:10And in some cases, the challenge has been so much that we or Gulf states have shot missile interceptors at them, which is not a good exchange. In fact, I have an article in foreign policy dot com published yesterday that's titled the drone attrition trap. And it lays out that you're on the wrong end of the calculation. If you spend a $2 million missile interceptor to knock down a $20 or $30,000 Iranian drone. So that would be part of it as well. The Iranian Navy is a big element here. We want to get shipping going back again in the Gulf and the straight of her moves as quickly as can possibly be done. And while the military campaign is going very, very impressively. I mean, we're probably approaching 6,000 individual targets now that have been engaged by either sea launch or air launch cruise missiles. The munitions from the stealth bombers and stealth fighters, the B-2 and F-35 respectively. And now because we've taken down the air and ballistic missile defense is so substantially.

5:14We're flying the unstealthy aircraft directly over. Now we're talking about the really heavy hitters, the B-52 and B-1 bombers as well. So you look at each category of the military missions. And I think we're doing very impressively against them. The problem is that there is not a military mission, which is bring about regime change. President Trump, I think, has been very clear that the military's mission is to in a way set conditions. In which political transition might take place. But that's going to depend on what is done inside Iran, either by disaffected units of their military. Perhaps some of the minorities we've seen the Iranian Kurds apparently being enabled to take out some operation. There are also as areas there are Turkmen, there's Baluch and Sunnis. So all of this again is possible. But I don't think the base case is that there is regime change in this particular campaign.

6:19How concerned are you about that specifically because I know you've said in previous interviews that you can lay the groundwork for this. But if there isn't someone on the ground there or a group of people on the ground there who are willing to fill that vacuum. And we know that US President Donald Trump had said he started this campaign saying that he was hoping Iranians would pick a new leader and that they would rise up and do that. Or that they would somebody else would step forward. Now he's saying that he would like to be in the process of picking a new leader. Do you think that that is a miscalculation here by the President? Well, I think it's a wonderful aspiration. I hope to see him inserted into the assembly of experts processes. They pick the next leader. But by the way, they tried to meet the other day and the Israelis actually bombed the location where they were going to carry out their sessions. This is essentially the concave that chooses the next supreme leader. Keep in mind that they are essentially hard-line clerics and presumably they will pick someone who is similar to their orientations.

7:24It's impossible that a more pragmatic figure could assume the leadership. It's possible the revolutionary guards corps could shoulder the cleric's aside in some way and say, you know what this is brought us is driving our country into poverty at home and isolation abroad. We're squandering the incredible blessings we have of the number two largest natural gas reserves in the world. Three crude oil reserves and educated population and ancient civilization, all of this. They should be the UAE on steroids and 92 million population. So a big market at home, even. And instead what they have done is bring this on to them. You're talking about a million men under arms who have demonstrated a willingness to kill their own citizen in the tens of thousands in January alone while imprisoning tens of thousands more. So who is going to stand up against that? It's not clear that that particular organization is yet identified itself. It will require a great leader really staff's headquarters hierarchy elements organization, et cetera.

8:32And again, I'm not sure where that comes from. There is a possibility of some kind of civil war ongoing, but I don't know that you see a force that's large enough to defeat the regime protection forces. And the other ancillary elements that typically support them. I wanted to ask you about some of the reaction from US allies Canadian Prime Minister Mark Carney had supported at the beginning of all this. The US acting to prevent Iran from obtaining a nuclear weapon. Then he did say that Canada arrived that that position with quote regret. What is your assessment of how Canada and other allies are supporting it or lack thereof? Well, it's been interesting this time that some of the very traditional allies have not fully supported this from the beginning. But many have been drawn into it. The UK is an example where the Prime Minister did not really want to get involved. Didn't immediately let us use the bases that they have available.

9:33Some of which can be very valuable Diego Garcia in the Indian Ocean is a great recovery location. And actually a great location from which to fly for the long range bombers. And yet was drawn into it when his bullets sent to drone after the airfield that they have in Cyprus. The Germans have been a good bit more forward leaning. So as the NATO Secretary general, the French more like the Brits up front, but now their base was attacked in the UAE. So they're going to have to get more involved. They'll allow us to use their bases. Even the countries in the region, the Gulf States had sought to take a knee during this particular effort, denied us the right to use the bases that we often have been able to use. But then we're drawn into it when Iran engaged in what's turned horizontal escalation. In other words, they just didn't retaliate against US bases and facilities. And Israeli targets, they went after the Gulf States. They hit a hotel. I hit seaport, airport, energy loading facilities and on and on.

10:38And those countries now are getting drawn more into this. In fact, it's the opposite of what Iran hoped would happen, which is I think they hope that the Gulf States would then put pressure on the United States to bring this to a close. And in fact, that is not what they're doing. They are extending more assistance to us to enable us as we are also very much helping them by integrating all of the ballistic missile defenses and now also the counter drone defenses. I've only got a short amount of time left with you. So I wanted to ask you on this last question. You've become famous for a phrase during the Iraq war. Tell me how this ends because you've been asked that nearly about every nearly every conflict since then. I'm going to ask it in a different way to you. What does victory look like in your mind? First of all, for those watching, this is when I was a two star general during the fight to Baghdad and it was obvious to me that all the assumptions would have been given were being invalidated one by one.

11:41And I turned to my embedded reporter for getting that I was on the record and quizzically or rhetorically asked tell me how this ends. In this case, victory, I think, is what President Trump declares it to be, frankly. I think we will have achieved the military objectives of this campaign, but I'm not at all confident that we're going to see the conditions for regime change being taken advantage of by an element that has the sufficient power to indeed challenge that regime. So I think at a certain point in time and number of different factors will be considered among those will be economic factors. What is the price of Brent crude at that time? What is that doing to the price of West Texas intermediate? What that's doing to the economies in Asia, Europe and even at home noting that we lost 90,000 jobs over the last last month and so forth. So it will be a whole what's this sentiment in the country about this this war? What is the sentiment within the base of the president's party?

12:47A lot of these different factors, if there is an opposition that starts to emerge, should we continue a bit longer to help enable them? What is the missile map? That is, I think, one of the factors that led to the end of the 12-day campaign at 12 days was that the Israelis in particular, I was just in a few weeks ago, and validated this, they were getting concerned that the Iranians had more launchers and more missiles than perhaps they had missile interceptors. And given that five to seven percent of the missiles were getting through anyway, the last thing you want to do is not be able to deal with those given the enormous destructive power that they have. So all of these different factors, I think, will be considered and determination will be made. Okay, here we are. We're under budget and ahead of time and we're declaring victory at that point in time. But then the question is, what is the character of the new Supreme Leader or the new leadership? Is it more pragmatic than it has been in the past when it has undertaken these ruinous decisions?

13:52And it considers victory just mere survival of the regime, no matter how much damage and destruction they have brought onto their own country. So those are the dynamics, I think, that will be in play. And I think they'll start to really be seriously considered within a week or so. And then you will see what it is that the president decides about the duration of this particular effort. Okay, we're going to leave it on that note, retired General David Petrez. Thank you so much for joining us today. We appreciate it. Good to be with you Mike. Thank you. Turning now to Canada's response to the conflict for an affairs minister Anita Anon said she's briefing liberal MPs today about the government's position on the war. Now some caucus members have publicly said that they're uneasy with Prime Minister Mark Carney's support for the strikes on Iran. Iran was asked or a non was asked by reporters about that this morning. I have great respect for my caucus colleagues across the board.

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15:53And very much look forward to hearing their viewpoints as I know the Prime Minister does as well. And we will continue to engage and ensure that together we're charting the strongest and the right path for Canada. While keeping Canadians safe throughout the region and ensuring that they can return home through viable and safe means. The minister also provided an update for Canadians were stranded in the Middle East. Non says 108,000 Canadians in the region have registered with global affairs. But 3,500 of those are seeking help to leave the region. The feds have also reserved hundreds of seats for Canadians on commercial flights. And a chartered airline is set to take 180 Canadians fleeing the Middle East from Dubai to Istanbul this weekend.

16:53Time for a short break. When we return the conflict in the Middle East continues to shock global markets with the price of oil spiking to over $90 a barrel. It also has some allies looking for other places to buy oil. In moments Alberta Premier Daniel Smith will join me to talk about the progress in the MOU between Alberta and Ottawa which could see a pipeline being built. We'll have that after a short break. And yesterday my administration announced a size of action to help keep down the oil prices including offering political risk insurance for tankers transiting into the Gulf as you know, pretty dangerous territory. Further action to reduce pressure on oil is imminent and the oil seems to have pretty much stabilized. We had it very low.

17:58U.S. President Donald Trump commenting on how the conflict in the Middle East has affected the global market and driven up the cost of oil. He's been shrugging off concerns over spiking gas prices claiming they'll drop very rapidly after the war is over. But with tankers remaining unable to pass through the Strait of Hormuz and his new demand for an unconditional surrender from Iran the markets are reacting. Today oil prices reached their highest level in nearly two years. Brent Crude which is the global benchmark for oil prices and West Texas intermediate the U.S. benchmark both topped $90 per barrel this afternoon. Now as the conflict in the Middle East disrupts oil and gas exports from the Gulf region many are looking for other supplies. Canada has been looking to expand exports with a new pipeline from Alberta to the BC coast and today another box was checked on that memorandum of understanding between Ottawa and Alberta.

18:59The two sides reached an agreement that will allow major projects to be approved more efficiently essentially allowing the province to front its own reviews. Here to talk more about that is Alberta Premier Daniel Smith. Premier Smith welcome back to Powerplay thanks for being here. Yeah my pleasure. Today you announced the completion of an agreement on the impact assessments with the federal government. It was one of the hurdles that you needed to hit by April 1st. So I wanted to know does this agreement today mean that your government is dropping the court challenge of the amended federal impact assessment act which was launched in late February? We are not but let me explain a little bit why because what I'm very encouraged by with our MOU is that the federal government agreed to address most of our grievances. I called them the nine bad laws that agreement dealt with seven of them and one of them was addressing the issue of the impact assessment act. We called it C69 the no more pipelines bill and there was a reason for that because under the convoluted policies they had there wasn't really a pathway to get anything approved and we saw that bear out over the last number of years.

20:06And so the fact that this now restores what I think the Supreme Court intended was that major projects within our boundaries are going to be governed by Alberta processes that I think restores the original intention of how our country is supposed to work. That being said when the we need to have the legislation changed at the at the federal level we're grateful for this car vote but I think that that's another stage of the process. And we also just want to make sure that we're asserting that resource development really is an area of provincial jurisdiction. And so there's some more work to do over the coming years but I think that this is going to be very positive for us in the immediate term. So you don't think that today's announcement supersedes anything that the court could say and sort of clears the path for this type of agreement going forward? Well I would say that we I mean we have a couple of bad laws that are still on the books I mean when you look at the net zero power rights we're glad to have a car vote there too. However if you look at the constitution electricity systems are meant to be provincially determined and so we always are frustrated when the federal government does end up legislating in areas of our provincial jurisdiction.

21:14At the moment we have a good understanding about why it is we need to get these major projects built but we want to make sure that that sustains over time and with changes of government and that's going to require a little bit more legislative change. So today's announcement does as you said have to do with the MOU and it's one of those things that had to be met by April 1st. Another one is carbon pricing and the equivalency agreement on Monday on this show minister Hodgson said that if the deadline is missed by a few days it's not the end of the world. So I want to ask you is that an indication in your mind that you're having trouble coming to an agreement. There are a few things that we have to work through I mean I think you saw CNRL just said that they're uncertain to your round carbon pricing has caused them to pause on one of their major developments which I think we all have to be mindful of is that there's urgency on this and so I think that the fact that the energy minister said a matter of a couple of days that's very positive. He wasn't talking about it taking extra weeks or extra months but there is some complicated discussions that are going on including with all of the companies in that oil sends alliance when it comes to the pathways project and carbon pricing and so we're all very committed to getting to an agreement very quickly.

22:25I think that this tells you how serious we are we had five agreements we needed to come to a conclusion on this is one of them and the other four will be very quick to follow over the coming next few weeks. I take your point on CNRL but isn't the whole viability of the pathways project based on that carbon price going up to $130 a ton. Not necessarily I mean I think that they certainly want support from investment tax credits to on the construction side of things. There are discussions as well about the ongoing operating costs but I think that the carbon price is something that is important to the prime minister. We have always had carbon pricing in Alberta going back to 2007 on the industrial price. We just have a bit of a different of agreement on how high that price needs to go and how quickly it needs to get there and what the benchmarks need to be for how quickly we would expect our large industry emitters to get to that point. So those are conversations that are going well but it does take a little bit of time because there's quite a bit of technical detail associated with it.

23:29And I also understand that your government had frozen the carbon the industrial carbon pricing in your province and it's not in line right now with the federal government. Is that one of the hiccups as well as you continue to negotiate this? I don't think so. I mean the MOU talked about $130 carbon price and the question is how quickly do we get there. I think that when we're looking at the turmoil that's happening in the world you're looking at countries like Italy saying is now the right time to be pricing carbon at all. Our closest trading partner in the United States has a very different approach for how they're addressing issues of industrial emissions. And we have to be mindful that we want to be consistent with what we're seeing other major players in the world doing but we also have to be competitive with the United States. And so there's a that's trying to find that that that that exact right spot is is taking some a little bit of time but we don't want to be in a position where we're so uncompetitive relative to the United States that it just causes investment dollars to go sell. So that's why we have to make sure that the escalation is happening at a reasonable period of time keeping in mind what is happening in the in the world economy which of course just changed in the last week once once more and I think creates an additional need to recalibrate on that.

24:40I certainly take your point about what you're seeing around the world but I guess my question is so is your issue here with the escalation and the rate at which it goes because the MOU clearly said $130 per ton. You're not disagreeing with that now, are you? No, but I remember the status quo that we have right now was supposed to be 170 by 2030. So here we find ourselves in 2026 that's four years that the former government was expecting us to essentially double the carbon price. So I think we we all agree that that's not going to be practical and not going to be achievable without causing massive damage to our industries. And so we're working on what that time scale should be. I mean when you look at China, China doesn't have a plan to get to carbon neutrality till 2060. I think India is talking about 2070 and so we have to be mindful of whether the world has changed to a point where we have to slow down that level of increase. And I think we're all an agreement that the original plan was not one that was achievable, but as the world changes and as people are looking for a secure supplier of these crucial energy products.

25:50They're looking to Canada and with good reason because as much as the many of the Middle East providers have been reliable in the past and the past when the state of harm moves closes, that is causing devastation potentially to many of those economies and they need to have alternative sources. Canada has a lot of things going for it. We are secure, we are reliable, we're an ally, we're friendly, we want to produce more and we want to make sure that we don't have any artificial barriers to preventing these projects from being constructed at a pace that is going to meet the world demand. On that, when you were here in Ottawa back in January for the First Minister's meeting, I had asked you about different routes for a pipeline and you had ruled out that route to Kitimat. But what about South to Burnaby? Is that still on the table for you? I believe the Roberts Bank proposal is one of the five ports that we're looking at. I haven't received a recent briefing. I think we've got that plan for another week or two because I think the various ports are narrowing down to a couple that are going to be more viable than others, but everybody will be able to see what that looks like in June.

26:57That's the deadline we've set for ourselves of getting that project into the major projects office and then we'll be able to scope it out. But our number one was how do we get to a deep water port that requires minimal navigation that would allow us to be able to address some of the issues of marine safety and marine response a little bit easier. And Kitimat was one of those complicated ones because of 140 kilometers of channel that we were able to look at that pretty quickly and say there's just too much we'd have to mitigate too much concern that the local nation and the local community had raised. And so we wanted to look at a more appropriate port so that we could address some of those issues. Just in closing, I wanted to talk to you about the issue of separation in your province or sovereignty. You've been very clear and I don't think there's any ambiguity there that you believe in a sovereign Alberta within a united Canada if I've quoted you properly there. A recent poll by Albertans though of Albertans by advocates data says that 53% of them believe that you would vote in favor of separatism. Now instead of asking you to comment on that poll, I wanted to know in the event of a referendum on separation in your province.

28:03Would you lead the side that says to stay within Canada? I'm already leading that side and I'm doing it with my actions by working constructively with the federal government by signing an MOU, by getting rid of the net zero power rags, the emissions cap, by taking an approach that essentially undoes the damage of C69 and various other things. And that's what I think is the constructive way of addressing the real grievances of Alberta. Albertans have real grievances. Ignoring them is not going to make them go away. Identifying them and addressing them as the Prime Minister and I are doing is the way that we're going to get people hope that Canada could work again. So I'm hoping that we're able to convince people one by one that this is a genuine change of heart and this is a genuine change of direction. We're getting back to the way the country was always meant to work. So my work doesn't get delayed by months. It started several months ago and it's going to continue day after day. So does that mean you're hoping that we don't get to a place where there is that question put to the people, whether or not they want to stay in Canada?

29:08My trust, Albertans, and it'll be up to Albertans to decide that there's a petition campaign going on right now. They've got two more months to collect signatures and I don't want to prejudge it. Nor do I want to underestimate how seriously harmed Albertans aren't and how disappointed they've been in the way they've been treated by the Canadian government. So that's why I'm not demonizing anyone who is expressing legitimate grievances. My view is to my job is to identify them and to resolve them so that we can give people hope. The package of proposals that we have in the MOU is only one thing we have to address. We've got to address issues that emerge because of out of control immigration policy at the federal level. The gun grab is another area of grievance. So as I say, I'm glad that we're making some progress with the federal government in this area. I think it's important, but there's still a lot more things that we have to do to address some of the legitimate concerns that Albertans have. We'll come back to that question, though, because in the event that there is a referendum, there will be people that will be leading the nose, the side to leave, and there'll be people who will be leading the side to stay.

30:13Are you saying that you would not want to lead that side in favor of staying within Canada? Mike, I said I'm already leading it. And those who want to wait for another few months to do what I'm doing, I would say to get off their duffs and start making those positions known now. That my opposition leader, who's NDP, he should be calling me off. He should be calling the NDP leader in British Columbia, saying don't stand in the way of getting a pipeline bill. He should be calling Abby Lewis, who keeps on talking about leaving oil gas in the ground and phasing it all all together. I'm telling you, those are the kind of things that are destructive to national unity. And so if anybody wants to help with the cause of national unity, then we should all get on board. Let's find a way to work together. Let's find a way to get new, get our products to market. Stop talking down our most important and vital industry in the country that not only benefits us, but benefits all of Canada. So that's what I would say is that I've already been advocating for Canada in which some of those voices would too. Okay, Premier Smith, we're going to leave it there for now. Thank you so much for joining us. We appreciate it.

31:14You bet. Thank you. Still to come on power play. Prime Minister Mark Carney is set to return to Canada after a whirlwind international trip. Our front bench is standing by to rate his week. We've got Sabrina Grover, Nanny Paredzi, Karl Belange, and Marie Bastel. They're all right there, and they'll be right here after this. Because Canada is taking the world as it is, not passively waiting for a world we wish to be. We do, however, take this position with regret because the current conflict is another example of the failure of the international order. One can never categorically rule out participation. We will stand by our allies, but it makes sense. But we will always defend Canadians. We will always stand by and defend our allies.

32:19Well, it was a whirlwind of a week for Prime Minister Mark Carney. He is about to head home to Canada after a nine-day international trade trip meant to show up new export destinations. Now, he started in India, then he went to Australia, and it's all ending right now with a quick stop in Japan. Carney has been making the case in those countries that middle powers must unite to grow critical sectors in energy, technology, and defense. And that's been reflected in the partnerships and agreements that he's reached this week in those sectors. But as you heard in that clip off the top there, he's also faced questions from reporters on foreign policy. First, on whether or not there is still a concern that India is involved in foreign interference, and then on the shifting message about the war in the Middle East. Here to rate the week that was from the Prime Minister is our front bench. Sabrina Grover was a federal liberal candidate in the 2021 election. She's now a senior adviser at North Star Public Affairs.

33:22Melanie Baratzi is former communications director to Aaron O'Toole. She's now the president of texture communications. Former interim NDP national director Carl Belange is here. He's now the president of traction strategies. And with me in studio, Mary Bastel, an editorial writer with Lodovlo. Melanie, I want to start with you on this one. Do you think that the Prime Minister had a good week or a bad week, or was it somewhere in between? I think that he and his team had such great plans for a good week that they had grand ideas about all the announcements that they were going to make. And then as it said, events, dear boy, events. He just got railroaded by everything that happened in Iran. You know, I had to think it's a bit inside baseball. But when you're thinking about who, which staff you put on the plane with the Prime Minister to go on a big trip like this, because they're going to have been gone for like over a week. So you take a bunch of your staff with you. You probably didn't think to take your caucus manager. And in this circumstances, that's the one person that they really needed on the Iran message.

34:25The Prime Minister put out what I thought, honestly, was a really good balanced message the first time. And that was probably his actual position. And then, you know, at some point at six or seven in the morning when everybody woke up in Ottawa and they saw the message. People started to freak out in liberal caucus. And you have to remember, there's people in liberal caucus who came up with like the war in Iraq and occupy Wall Street as a movement and have like a very set point of view on US military intervention and don't want to see the Canadian government involved at all. And so I think that in that set of circumstances, it would have been really helpful for them to check in with their caucus manager first before putting out that statement to see if they would need to change it three more times afterwards. Sabrina, how much of that will you have to clean up once it gets back to Ottawa, even though, as we had heard, the Foreign Affairs Minister Anita Nahn was seemingly briefing members of caucus today. Yeah, I think there was that caucus call today. I do think that it's really challenging when you have so much going on and every day is a day where we don't know what Donald Trump is going to do.

35:28Case in point Saturday. I don't know that we would have necessarily pinpointed the Iran war to to this past weekend. I think for the Prime Minister, it's about being able to not just communicate that message caucus, which I do think is critically important. But what was the message out of the trip this week to Canadians? And I think that that is the more critically important message, right? A lot of it was overshadowed by small things. And I think the small things are the kinds of things that hurt a Prime Minister or hurt a government. You know, the fact that they didn't take a press conference for several days. I think those are the kinds of things that negle at you and become the kinds of things that blow up and like vital. When life gets unpredictable, preparation matters. In medicine, it's all about staying alert. Ready for whatever comes through the door. On the road, it's no different. That's why Volvo designs vehicles to help anticipate risk, reduce harm and protect lives. The Volvo XC90's advanced safety systems inspire confident decisions wherever the road takes you.

36:32The Volvo XC90 for life. Proud sponsor of the pit podcast. Learn more at VolvoCars.ca-safety. Unmistakably Canadian. It's the music that raised you. The artist raising the bar. Hi, this is Ryan Adams. Hey, my name is Brett Evans. I'm from the glorious Suns. Hi, I'm Nelly Fattata. Made in Canada. The station that champions Canadian music. Loud, proud, and all yours. No passports required. Just press play. Tap into Maiden Canada now on iHerRadio.ca or the free iHeartRadio app. Way at your success. So I think that those pieces of management, as Mal say, are the more important pieces that they need to get under control. Overall, I think he otherwise had a really good week. I think that he managed to get a lot of good conversations, a lot of good MOUs, Mocs signed across the board with India with Australia. We'll see what comes out of Japan. And so from that perspective, it does look like the Prime Minister is doing a good job.

37:35But how do you manage those pieces that actually, you know, become the small things that eat away your, your, your polling or your strength? And Carl, I want to sort of go back to something that I know, you know, was spoken about a lot at the beginning of the week. But there was that briefing from an official before going on this trip where they talked about how, you know, whether or not India was a threat anymore to foreign interference in Canada. And they basically said we wouldn't be going on this trip if that was the case. And then the Prime Minister had to try and explain that. In fact, nearly his whole press conference was overtaken by that. Do you think that Canadians, you know, will remember the MOUs and everything that Sabrina was talking about, or is this trip going to be more remembered for something else? Well, depends what happens next when it comes to foreign interference, really. Because frankly, most Canadians don't pay a lot of attention to this. They are having trouble to, you know, figure out what the Prime Minister's position is on this. But it's a different Prime Minister than the one who was calling the Indian government for murdering Canadians, it's an alternative sort.

38:41Different era for sure. And, you know, we are in a different world with Donald Trump's straight war. That again comes into play. But, you know, the problem with what Mark Ernie's weak is that the position has been shifting ever so slightly every day. And it all stems back to the speech in Davos. It was really, at this point, you can say grandstanding about how we need to stand up to those who decide for their own interests what the rule of law is, that the middle power needs to stand for themselves and alive with others. Well, frankly, at first, when there was a first test, that was the urine test, the Prime Minister failed. He backed up the power and decided to take the matter into their own hands. Then he decided, well, the policy needs to prevail. We need to, you know, look at international law. And then the next day, more so, it's like, well, maybe we'll send troops. Maybe not. We don't know, but we're open to it. So, for Canadian, it's hard to follow. At the end of the day, though, I'm not sure it's going to hurt him because people are on the side of angels when it comes to what's happening in Iraq.

39:47Yeah, and Maria, I mean, you know, there's two sort of sides to this. Is it a shifting message or is it a sifting situation? Wow, easy for me to say. Or is it a shifting situation that he has to change his message for? Perhaps it's a shifting situation, but perhaps if he hadn't rushed to come out with a reaction, he would have let it settle a tiny bit and come out with a more nuanced position. I don't think that it's completely backtracking. I think his message in Davos was that the world order has been for a while in illusion and no longer stands. And we have to rearrange our alliances and how we respond to it, which is sort of what he was saying about Iran. The reason that we, with regret, support it, he says is because the world order has not been able to stop Iran. The problem is all that nuance should have been in it from the get-go, as my colleagues have said. When you start having to nuance it over four days, then you look like you're backtracking a little bit.

40:50And you also look a little wishy-washy to the U.S., which in the first place you were trying to manage the relationship with by quote-unquote supporting their military operation. And now you look like you're backtracking to them. So it's kind of both counterproductive. I think it also suggested a bit of arrogance from the part of the Prime Minister, where he sometimes seemed to believe that he doesn't have the need to explain himself. Whether it is on foreign interference on India, like Karl mentioned, or whether it's on this on the Iran file. And I don't think that's necessarily a good look. And what happened this week is he overshadowed his own international trip and his agreements. He also eclipsed the fact that he was overshadowing Pierre-Poliève's first international trip, which coincidentally happened on the same week. And we ended up not really talking about Pierre-Poliève's trip and his ideas. Also partly because Pierre-Poliève was talking about deepening ties with Australia and New Zealand and Great Britain.

41:51Mark Carney was signing agreements with Australia and Canberra. So that was also a missed opportunity on his part. So it was a bit of, in French, you say, shopping for trouble or self-inflicted rooms on the part of the Prime Minister. And I think it's actually his first tough kind of bad week since he's been in power. Yeah. Okay. Unfortunately, we got to leave it on that because we have so much to get to in this show. Thanks to the front bench. So we're going to grover. Coming up, though, in just three weeks, the federal NDP, we're going to select their next leader. And one of the five candidates, Avi Lewis, joined me in studio to talk about why he believes he should be at the helm of the party. That one-on-one with him is coming up after a short break. We're not going to win it tomorrow, but we are going to shift what's politically possible.

42:52And we are going to build the excitement and the energy that we need to win. Just a little sample there of Avi Lewis' rally last night is he addressed a pack crowd at a campaign to a event in Ottawa. The federal NDP has been without a permanent leader since jug meet sings stepped down after April's election loss. We're weeks away from choosing who will officially replace him. Five contenders are in the running, including Avi Lewis, who has emerged as a clear front runner in fundraising, beating out the only sitting MP who's also vying for the job Heather McPherson. Now we have Rob Ashton, Taneel Johnston, and Tony McQuale, also with their hats in the ring right now for leadership. The new leader will be announced at the end of the month following a vote during the party's national convention in Winnipeg. Avi Lewis joined me in studio earlier today to talk about his platform and his vision for the party.

43:54Avi Lewis, thank you so much for being here. Appreciate it. You're here in person for once. Thank you. So according to Elections Canada, you have raised your campaign as raised $780,000 since the beginning of this race in September. That's more than double your second closest competitor Heather McPherson, not only donors, but also in dollars, but also in donors. Yes. Is this your race to lose? Well, I think we're striking a chord. It's clear that the campaign culture and style and energy and ideas are resonating. And the front runner status is unwelcome. We are all underdogs until the finish line, so we don't intend to let up. I wanted to ask you specifically about Quebec, because that is where the biggest wave had come, the orange wave in 2011. Right now, you're having some difficulties there. Your one MP from that province is considering jumping to provincial politics. What are you doing to reach out to Alexander Bouliris to try and keep him in the fold and to keep the NDP relevant in that province?

44:54I mean, when I heard the rumors, I called them immediately, and I think he hasn't made his final decision yet, but yeah, it is what it is. I mean, the party has to come back all over the country, but to lose our last MP in Quebec would be a blow. At the same time, I feel that there is, it's been a long time since 2011, and the orange wave, which was strongest in Quebec, I think there's been a sense within the party that we need to recapture it. Lightning doesn't strike twice. We have to rebuild from the bottom up, from the base, everywhere in the country, and that begins in Quebec. And we have more, we've signed up more members in Quebec, we have more donors in Quebec. It's still a relatively small number, but we believe we can grow in Quebec by taking our lead from our Quebec members and organizers and having them shape the policy and the offer and the messaging and the political culture, because Quebec has a distinct culture in every way. I can't help but know that the language is an issue as well. I mean, of all of the candidates, I think most would say that your French is probably the best with Heather McPherson as a close second, and your French debate was barely French, so how do you make those inroads in Quebec if the communication is an issue?

46:10It's much more than just speaking French, but I just didn't interview with Lidouard this morning in French, and I'm coming along, I'm excited to get some time to get more immersion. But no, I think a functional in French, and I'm ready to work a lot more. But it's not just about speaking French. Quebec has a distinct culture, a distinct politics, the strongest trade union movement in the country, the clearest climate consensus in the country against pipelines and fossil fuels. There's so much that we can connect with in Quebec, and I think understanding Quebec's complex and specific political culture is important as well as just the language, and so it's more than that. I want to dig a little bit into your platform, because of course that's what you're running on right now. One of your biggest proposals, especially to generate the money to pay for a lot of your promises, is a wealth tax. Yes. And about 1% of net wealth, over 10 million, 2% over 50 million, and 3% over 100 million. This is the exact same proposal that Jugneyt Singh had in his platform in 2025, and it was rejected by Canadians when you consider the fact that they did get them 1.2 million votes, but it lost them 17 seats.

47:21Why do you think it'll be different from you? I mean, I think that's a bit much to pin on one policy. In fact, taxing the rich is extremely popular in Canada. Pull after pull has shown that a vast majority of Canadians support a wealth tax, and that's because we have the most unequal economy we've ever had. Six Canadian banks made $70 billion in profit last year alone, and the government is declaring austerity, slashing public services, cut its housing plan, which is one of our many crises in half, and Canadians know that the country is a wash and wealth, and at the same time working class people across this land are working harder and harder, two jobs, three jobs, can't pay for groceries, can't pay rent in the mortgage, everything is too expensive, there's like a disconnect here, people know we need to get at some of that wealth that is frankly being hoarded by the billionaire class, and actually reinvest it in universal public services that everybody needs. I'll just challenge you on how many Canadians are supportive of it, A, because of the electoral success that did or didn't come with it with the NDP, but also on your own website, you say that 88% of Canadians are supportive of it, but you are actually citing on that a 2021 Advocates data survey, which was in the context of the pandemic, and it was also asking Canadians coming out of the pandemic whether or not they support a wealth tax.

48:40In the breakdown, it was actually roughly 50% that they said that they would support it, and then 30% said that it was a nice to have. So is it really, do you have more current data for 2026 to say that Canadians still support that? I haven't seen all of the polling, my sense is very strong that people feel that the priorities of our society are out of whack, and I will point out gently, Mike, that there appear to be gigantic resources available when a political crisis is declared, and the Prime Minister proposes half a trillion dollars of public spending in the defense industrial strategy released a couple of weeks ago in the next decade to purchase arms. And to make Canada an arms or major arms exporter on the world stage, there is wealth in this country, and Canadians are suffering the everyday crisis of just trying to get by, and we are proposing reallocating public resources to directly solve the crisis of the cost of living, and that is an extremely popular idea.

49:43And the various proposals are landing, as we've seen in the momentum of our campaign, we had more than 800 people packed into a church in Ottawa last night for a race that is supposed to be off the radar for a party that's supposed to be on life support. So something is happening under the surface of Canadian politics. I believe the NDP is at the beginning of a historic comeback, and we could argue about poll numbers, but politics is also about momentum, energy, feeling, and sensing the moment, and we're striking a chord right now. Okay, we're going to have to leave it there. I promise to have you back, because I've got a lot more questions for you. Let's do it. Avie Lewis, candid for NDP leadership. Appreciate you being here. Thanks, Mike. Time for one more break on Powerplay. Our takeaway is right after this. And that is your week, your Powerplay week in politics. I'm Mike Lucritor. Thank you so much for sharing your time with us. Have yourselves a great weekend.

50:46But stay tuned, because your top stories are just ahead. I'll see you in the next one. Now available on the free iHeartRadio app. Or ask your smart speaker to play Brian Adams Radio on iHeartRadio. Who's ready to rock?