New 9/11 documents renew focus on survivors' health

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1:00The 11th hour starts now. It is Friday, September the 11th. It's been 25 years since 19 terrorists hijacked four commercial planes and killed nearly 3,000 people on American soil. As has become the tradition, the families and loved ones of the New York victims gathered once again this morning at the 9-11 Memorial in Lower Manhattan to read out the names of the people who were killed that day. 9-11 was, as you know, the deadliest attack on US soil in the history of the United States had fundamentally changed American life. It was a jolt to the system that forced the country to reckon with how it assessed threats, both foreign and domestic. It led to a major reorganization of the federal government to make sure that an attack like this never happened again and America's National Security apparatus was revamped to ensure that all the different federal agencies that make up the intelligence and law enforcement community could and would easily and readily share information

2:02with one another and connect the dots to understand what it all means. Ultimately, it led to the creation of a new cabinet-level department, the Department of Homeland Security. That's what it was built for. When DHS was first formed by an act of Congress in the fall of 2002, it brought together all or parts of 22 separate agencies. DHS has evolved over the years, but it remains a sprawling department. Today, it oversees 15 different agencies, including ICE, Border Patrol, the Coast Guard, and FEMA. But the legislation that led to the creation of DHS, the Homeland Security Act of 2002, lists these two things as the department's top priorities. Quote, A, prevent terrorist attacks within the United States, B, reduce the vulnerability of the United States to terrorism. Just want to point out that's the whole ballgame. That's what DHS was formed to do. Even then, there were criticisms that the American government was too focused on past attack,

3:02attacks, and not forward thinking enough to prepare for the next one. Well, 25 years later, after 9-11, some experts are warning that the United States has again become too focused on the wrong thing, but this time it's not on the wrong type of terrorist attack. Rather, it's focused instead on carrying out the presidential's, the president's political agenda, including a focus on immigration, instead of shoring up America's national security. Last year, DHS, the Department of Homeland Security, formed in 2002 in the shadows of the attack of 9-11. DHS received $190 billion in new funding from the Republicans, so-called one big beautiful bill. Much of that money is intended to help carry out Donald Trump's sweeping mass deportation program. Trump's decision to tap loyal allies to lead top agencies, even if they don't have relevant experience in national security, hasn't instilled much confidence either. The former South Dakota governor, Kristi Nome, was forced out as DHS Secretary after an embattled tenure that lasted only 14 months.

4:05Tulsi Gabbard left her position as the director of national intelligence to which she was appointed, but she didn't have prior experience in the field. And then their cash betel, who's still hanging onto his job as FBI director. He remains a steadfast Trump ally who's continuing to help push Donald Trump's agenda. Patel is devoted an increasing amount of FBI manpower and resources to Trump's immigration crackdown. Last fall about a quarter of all FBI agents were reassigned to help ICE arrest immigrants, a quarter. On top of that, this summer, Patel ordered hundreds of analysts to prioritize Donald Trump's revived investigation of the 2020 elections in Fulton County, Georgia. And under Patel's leadership, there's been an exodus of agents according to research by one former FBI agent, 1,139 special agents, and 232 intelligence analysts left the force last year. The Trump administration has lost the plot. It's antagonizing many of the same allies

5:05that came to our side in the days and years after 9-11 and who shared intelligence with us to help keep the country safe. There's not much confidence in DHS and some of the agencies it oversees in recent polls about half of Americans have said that ICE should be abolished. And more people have been calling for DHS to be reformed, including those who previously led the agency. Two former DHS secretaries, Jay Johnson and Michael Chertoff have said that the department that they once led has, quote, gotten off track. Joining me now is Ken Nolaney and MS now Justice and Intelligence Reporter and Karen Greenberg, director of the Center on National Security at the Fordham University School of Logitee. Evening to both of you, thank you for being with us. Ken, let me just start with you because Karen and I spent some time together earlier this week in which terrorism experts are really drilling down and trying to figure out where the next attack might come from, what type of attack it is. But there really is a concern that the federal government under the DHS as led by the DHS on the intelligence and law enforcement side is focused elsewhere right now.

6:08Too far elsewhere to be fully focused on America's actual national security. Well, Ali, that's not just a concern. That's a fact. I mean, the Department of Homeland Security is principally now focused on the immigration question on immigration enforcement and Donald Trump's deportation policies. That's what it's largely doing to the extent that it was doing significant counterterrorism work before the Trump administration. A lot of that is not happening anymore. But I would argue, we really expect, it's the FBI is, that's the agency that we that is tasked with preventing a terrorist attack in the United States because it's a law enforcement agency. It's an intelligence agency to a greater extent than the DHS. And that's where you've really seen a profound brain drain. You mentioned that 1100 plus agents who left the force last year, that's 9% of all FBI agents. And then on top of that, there was a 5% cut in the FBI's budget. And then as you mentioned, these reassignments and reallocations

7:09of agent and analyst resources, two immigration and to violent crime patrols. So when I talk to current former FBI officials, they are very concerned that the FBI is not where it should be in terms of hunting for the next attack. And then you've got the fact that there is a multiplicity of threats out there. Absolutely, the huge progress was made. Core Al Qaeda was defeated in Pakistan. The drone campaign was very successful. And Al Qaeda and perhaps Jihadi terrorism writ large is not the threat that it once was. But when you talk to experts, you realize that it's perhaps more dangerous than the headlines would suggest. We've kind of looked away from this issue for a long time now. But if you look at what's happening in the Sahel region of Africa or in Somalia or in other ungoverned spaces in the world, the ideology that attacked us on 9-11 is not dead. It's alive and well. And there are people out there, terrorist groups, that still aspire to attack the West. They may not have the capability at the moment.

8:10But when you talk to military officials, they say, we don't really have good visibility on a lot of these groups, the way we did with Core Al Qaeda in Afghanistan and Pakistan, Ali. Karen, nice to see you again twice this week. This isn't really a debate about immigration and deportation. Folks know where I stand on that. The issue here is, where is the next threat going to come from and are we on top of it? Because the last set of threats writ large were coming from places that were largely failed states that allowed these non-state actors to almost become quasi-state actors and gain the power and the resources they need to attack America. What's your sense of the threat matrix going forward? First of all, thank you so much for focusing on this. I know in the whole conversations about 9-11, we sort of miss the threat of what's the past and what's the future. So thank you for both for focusing on this. So in terms of the new threat matrix, first let me say that whatever I say, what we need is a government that we can trust to be on top of what that new threat matrix is.

9:11And we know some things, but we don't know following up on what Ken was saying, who's paying attention to what we green from open source information, what we hear from some of the officials we might talk to who have left government. So where we see the threat is still, there is a terrorist threat. It is in many of the ungoverned localities, the way Ken mentioned, but we get conflicting records, actually, about what actually is happening with al Qaeda. And it's not just about what the terrorist threat is. It's about where and if those terrorists are mentioning thinking about going after United States entities, either on the homeland or on our embassies or other other American enterprises abroad. So this is one thing to worry about, particularly in the conflict that we're in now in Iran, because that is an entire region that is fraught with non-state actors or seemingly non-state actors and terrorist groups. And they're beginning at times they gel together,

10:13at times whether or not they have the exact same ideology and the exact same founding statements. They often coalesce with one another when they need to. And so that's another one of the threats. There's also the threat of state actors. And this is something that the government has turned to in addition to immigration. You hear often the threat of China in various ways, of course, Iran and in some quarters, Russia. And so we're dealing with state actors and non-state actors. But we've also seen two other very concerning developments. One is the turn towards, and we've seen this at home, youth violence. And that is a concern that is both either radicalized online where people reach out to them whether they're for and terrorist actors or other actors. And we don't get the feeling when you listen to public officials that were on top of that and how to block some of that inspirational, not really coercion, but

11:15inspirational thoughts and things like that. So that's one thing, just different than looking at terrorist plots and terrorist cells. The other thing that's extremely concerning is, and something I think can try to allude to, which is the fast pace in which technology is evolving. And this is something not to take for granted and something that terrorism experts who are out of government now, those who have left the FBI, those who have left the intelligence agencies, those who have left DHS, do talk about in private and sometimes in public. And we're talking about the use of drone warfare, which is easier to mount when it comes to lone players or small groups of players. We're talking about the cyber realm and its entity. And I just want to, and other things, whether it is technology that we are not on top of. It's not just localities, it's not just groups. And you know, something else, a couple of things to talk about here. One is that, you know, it's not just DHS. It's also the vast intelligence network that we have

12:16that's now coalesced in the Directorate of National Intelligence. It's also, as you said, the FBI, but also the Department of Justice writ large. And a couple of things have happened to really compromise and weaken these authorities. One of the things is that we have summarily decapitated many of the agencies around the front lines at turn of understanding overseas threats. For example, the Foreign Maline Influence Center, that would be one. Another one, the National Security Division, at the Department of Justice. Another one that's been crippled that is intensely worrisome, is the cyber and cyber security and infrastructure agency that is located again within DHS. So, and then there's one other thing I just want to mention that is extremely concerning that we're not talking about, which is one of the things that is really important when you want to understand how to assess a terrorist threat, how to know when it's coming, how to be confident in your facts, is relationships with other governments

13:17and other intelligent services. And well, and that has been compromised because of our activities in the world. The earliest signs we heard of this were in the Caribbean, with the attacks on Venezuelan boats and alleged drug traffickers. And a number of our partners and allies, the UK, for example, uttered thoughts about, we don't know if we want to share information on this because this violates international law or may violate international law and we don't want to be a part of that. And we have alienated in the Iran War a number of other very important intelligence partners. And so this is an extra layer of what's worrisome. And so I think what's happening is, yes, we've compromised the authorities that we had in the past. Yes, it's time for a reboot because we need to think about the new circumstances. But the further yes, is that there are new threats that we don't have any confidence

14:17that anybody with any professional knowledge or technical knowledge or foreign affairs knowledge is focused on. Hold that thought for a second. I want to take a quick break and continue that information. Tickly on that last point, Ken, that Karen just made about how much we need to depend on our allies and our alliances in order to face the threats that are to come. Karen, Greenberg and Kendall, any understanding by, we'll be right back. YouTube Premium is like YouTube got some extra gains. Try YouTube Premium for two months free at youtube.com slash premium. Trial eligibility varies, terms apply, cancel anytime. Still waiting in line? Again?

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16:21Back with the Candellating and MSNOW Justice and Intelligence Reporter and Karen Greenberg director of the Center on National Security at Fordham Law. Karen made a really great point there. We have alliances upon which we depend. There's the Five Eyes, Australia, New Zealand, the UK, the United States, Canada. There's military alliances like NORAD and NATO. There's trade alliances like the deal we have with the United States. There's bilateral agreements we have with countries like South Korea where we train and we do things with them that are meant to keep them safe and us safe. These fights that we're getting at all over the world, these things that we're doing unilaterally without our allies, one can get the impression that they ultimately weaken us because we're not working as a team now with the rest of our allies. 100% ally. When I talk to current and former counterterrorism officials, they cite the disintegration of our what they call liaison relationships as a huge factor in why they're very concerned right now.

17:21Because as you said, counterterrorism is an international team sport. Many, many of the plots that were unraveled in the United States and against the United States in the last 25 years were unraveled with the help of foreign intelligence. Allies providing a tip, whether it's our European partners who trust the Trump administration far less than any previous administration or other countries in places like Africa where there have been massive cuts in foreign aid. And that money wasn't just charity, it bought relationships, it bought goodwill, and there's much less of that now. So that is a huge problem. And I also want to double down on something that Karen said about the threat from new technologies because that's another thing I've been hearing a lot from sources, particularly this drone threat. When the airliners were crashing into buildings on 9-11, the military did not even have armed fighter jets to send up to intercept what they thought was other hijackers. They were trying to knock them out of the sky. And similarly, there isn't a good defense system in the United States against drones that could carry bombs or poison gas.

18:28And the story I published a few days ago, I learned that a company is selling a flamethrower attachment that can go on a heavy lift drone. It's a legal product, and there was actually a criminal case where some Americans were trying to mount a coup in the Democratic Republic of Congo, bought this product and imported it to Africa to try to kill people and overthrow the government. So these are the kind of threats that are out there that the US really does not have a good answer for yet. And you know, 9-11 was the product of, in part, a failure of imagination. And some people are worrying that we are similarly failing right now to imagine what the next attack could be. You mentioned the fighter jets that went up. There were two fighter jets deployed to get light 93, which the passengers ultimately took down. They didn't have weaponry to fire that jet down. The one jet pilot said, I'll take the cockpit and the other jet pilot says, I'll take the rear of the plane. They were going to literally ram the plane with their jets to take it down.

19:28Karen, Ken's talking about liaison relationships. But what about America's role as a global leader? Whether you liked the war on Iraq or you didn't, most people didn't, it was a legal war. It was approved by Congress and the president went to the United Nations to convince people. The war in Ukraine has not just NATO, but a couple of dozen other supporting countries. That's not the way this administration's rolling. With Iran, we said, nah, so a whole lot of people didn't participate with us, but we didn't tell them, we didn't include them in planning, we didn't tell them what the objectives were. And so they're not with us. Yeah, this is tremendously disconcerting is this issue of trust. How do you get, how do we regain this trust? What would it take to regain this trust? But it's not just trust. It's our way of interacting with the world in a way that supports the world. So for example, the USAID being defanged and destroyed basically. This is something that says to the rest of the world, the United States does not have the priorities it used to have. The priorities being yes, collaborating with us on what threats face us, but also collaborating on trying to make the world a safer place for humans to live in in a lot of ways, not just within the war framework.

20:47And so we've peeled away a lot of what brought us to the attention of the world as some as a country to look up to as an country to trust. Kendall, I mean, Karen and I, as I said, we were there earlier this week and I will say this, there were a lot of people who are still working on this stuff. They are in some cases, dispirited in some cases. It's not central to what the government does, but I also sort of just want to make sure whether it's the justice department or it's the, or it's DHS or the FBI. It is tonight 25 years later worth remembering there are a lot of people who have devoted their careers to not being in this partisan mess that we're in right now to actually just keep our country safe. I hope as you talk to them, they feel that the country is behind them. They absolutely do. Allie, and it's a great point. I was talking to Brian Driscoll this morning, the former acting director of the FBI who was fired by the Trump administration and he is making that point too. As much as we're all saddened and concerned about the brain drain from the FBI and other agencies and the people who have left, there are a lot of rank and file who remain a lot of veterans of the war on terror counterterrorism experts who are working this problem every day.

21:58And so it's not that nothing is happening. It's not that there are no successes. And certainly over the last 25 years, if you've brought out the lens, this effort, this massive reorganization of the US government largely worked to prevent a similar type of crime. So I'm just going to take a quick look at the latest terrorist attack from happening again, Allie. Thanks to both of you tonight for joining us on such an important memorial, Candidate Lady and his MSNOW's Justice and Intelligence Reporter and Karen Greenberg is a permanent member of the Council on Foreign Relations and the Director of the Center on National Security at Fordham Law. Well, a New Jersey nonprofit called Heartworks created in the wake of 9-11 attacks, the 9-11 attacks to help grieving families create a disrememberance in basking Ridge, New Jersey. A paper heart with the name of every one of the 2,977 people who died in the attacks 25 years ago today, written and hung by community members who wanted to come together to honor them. If you like YouTube, you'll love YouTube Premium. It's destroying, athlete, creator, and YouTube Maxer. YouTube Premium enhances how I use YouTube with awesome features like offline downloads so I can download my favorite training videos before I hit the gym.

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24:26And the soft, and the soft. Something strong so simple. Pick up a pack today. Angel Soft. Something strong so cool. A new front has opened up in Donald Trump's war with Iran. The threatens to destabilize the global economy even further and send oil price spikes yet higher. Today, Iran back hoothy rebels in Yemen seized an island in the Red Sea, giving them strategic control over yet another key oil conduit. This is the Bobel Mendebs straight. You can see it on this map. The straight-up war mooses on the top part. Look at the bottom there, where the Red Sea is. Together, both waterways serve as shipping conduits for one third of the world's oil. Now Saudi Arabia started sending more oil through the Bobel Mendebs when the war with Iran was over. The Saudi Arabia shut down with the straight-up war moose. If it can get its oil to the Red Sea, it can go out around the horn of Africa and Yemen.

25:29Using this east-west pipeline, the Saudis move oil to the Red Sea. The ships load it and they transport it to Asian markets. But today, the Saudis were forced to shut the pipeline down because of drone attacks that are launched from Iraq. There's another sign that despite Trump's insistence that the war is on the verge of ending soon, he's not only not winning the war. The war has spun well out of his control. In fact, the Wall Street Journal reported this week that Trump's own top advisors have informed him that the war could drag out through the remainder of his term, not the midterms that are coming in November, his presidential term. And it doesn't even really matter what Trump says anymore because the political implications of what Trump has done with this war are now inescapable, even in the typically friendly confines of conservative media. If we hadn't done Iran, you would be cruising to midterm victory. 225 years ago. You don't know that, but no. Any regrets? No, I don't believe in the word regret.

26:29It doesn't even like the word we've got. Last 90s told us that his favorite word is once again, tariffs. Like tariffs doesn't like regret. Here's what I ever got. Look at this. A gallon of regular gasoline now costs an average of $4.29 a gallon according to AAA. Before the war started, it was $2.98, the average price of diesel. And again, we don't think about this all of us all that much. It's actually perhaps more important because it powers nearly three quarters of our country's commercial shipping. And it is now at a record $6.05 a gallon. It was $3.75 before the war. I had heard estimates that it would get to $6 by the end of the weekend. It did. And even though most Americans don't use diesel fuel themselves, diesel prices will be passed along to all of us anyway because diesel is referred to as the workhorse fuel. It's used in farming equipment. It's used to harvest crops. It powers most of the trucks and ships, the transport goods all over the world. So ultimately, when diesel costs more, everything that needs to be grown or shipped, which is kind of everything in our lives, costs more.

27:33Joining me now is David Rode, MSNOW, Senior National Security Reporter. David, one of the things I'm just talking to Karen Greenberg and Kendall Aenean about is that war is tough. It takes its toll on people. There is an effort always to try to recruit your citizens into a supportive environment, a rally around the flag. This one continues to be confusing because none of us were told at any point what this is clearly about. And yet we continue to suffer the consequences and no clear end in sight at all to this war. Now, and you got it right on the head here. What is happening with the Hooties are doing are sort of shocking new developments, taking that island, which gives them further control, blocking the Red Sea. And then closing that East West pipeline is amazing. They're choking off the other waterway that's so important in terms of oil exports. Iran is escalating. They do this in the beginning of the war and they're doing it again now. And so I think Trump is going to try to talk his way out of this. But today was a very, very significant day in terms of Iran increasing its reach.

28:35By the way, they've also been attacking American bases in Jordan, Jordan the stalwart US ally. But this is wearing on everyone, right? We're complaining about gas prices as well. We should be in food prices. But in that part of the world, our allies are getting hit by missiles and drones and having their actual livelihoods affected. Yes. And there was reports that several American aircraft were damaged in this attack on these bases in Jordan. And it's the inability of the US. Either the US can't stop these missiles so they don't have enough patriot defending, you know, defender missiles to shoot them down. And what they're doing is getting us to like use up our interceptor stockpiles. So they're innovating. They're being aggressive. I don't, this is a, I'll say it and we've said it every conversation. It's a horrible regime. But they are outmaneuvering the Trump administration. And again, I cannot emphasize how important we were both at a terrorism conference earlier this week. And there was an expert who talked about the Houthis and that said that they have become now.

29:35For years it was Hezbollah. That was the most powerful Iranian proxy. Hezbollah has been weakened. It's now the Houthis. They're actually bringing people in from Africa training them on how to conduct these kind of strikes. And then one last amazing thing, anthropic excuse me, they had someone use Claude in Northern Yemen. He detected it. Wow. The person was using Claude to try to figure out how to build a missile. Oh my god. So it was the Houthis. They disclosed this to their, you know, to their credit. And they blocked this person or people in Northern Yemen who were using Claude to try to make missiles. All of this is the nightmare that you were sort of talking about with Karen and Ken. AI, missiles, drones, all of it's coming together. This is the new threat. I want to put that map up again if we can of the bubble, Mendoff and the, and the straight of Hormuz. Because these were, both of these were not terms that most people knew or used. Right? There were two random straights in the Middle East we didn't think about. What, if you go up from the bubble, Mendoff through the Red Sea, you end up at the Suez Canal.

30:38I remember a few years ago, one ship got stuck in the Suez Canal and how it gummed up global trade for a while. This is a super serious issue. Whether or not Iran, Donald Trump and Peacaggs, they say they're running out of missiles and they don't have, it's almost like they don't need the missiles. The things are doing these days are interesting and you're right. They might be trying to get us to use our patriots and our thads. But the fact is that economic choke point might be more significant than anybody's missiles and drones right now. And if you remember, I don't know, a few weeks ago, which month there was actually an attack on an Egyptian and a ship off the coast of Egypt. And it appeared to be, you know, Iranian drones had flown that far. And what, you know, what there were attacks on the East West. Pipeline. Pipeline and Saudi Arabia, drones again. So all of this is the innovation with drones. And then I'm sort of riffing off of also Ken. What Ken was saying earlier, all this innovation is happening while our national security agencies have been weakened by this brain drain. And we're sitting here sadly recognizing a failure of an imagination. And we just don't seem to be, you know, imagining enough how AI and drones are going to sort of changing warfare.

31:46So it varies times, Donald Trump sounds either bored with this war or says that it's done. Now we have some reporting that his own people are saying this might go on for a very long time. That's obviously bad for him. It's bad for everybody. Is there anything going on that looks like a coming end to this war? Is Whitkopf and Kushner back in the game? No, I mean, they're just the foray last week was to try to end the war in Ukraine on some sort of a pivot there. There's some reports that we haven't, you know, confirmed about JD Vance, you know, that he was re he's been reaching out. It was a Wall Street Journal, I believe, reaching out directly to military commanders to try to get a better sense of what was going on in the war. This has been going on for quite a while. And he was sort of going around Pete Hegseth. You know, I'm throwing out a scenario where JD Vance suddenly confronts the president and says we have to. So he legitimately apparently is not in favor of. And he has never been in favor of it. He was totally opposed to a Tucker Carlson was against all these people told the president no. So there's some small chance that Trump walks away. The Claire's victory. But then you have a much more powerful run.

32:50You have a run controlling in a way both those straights. Right. Because Donald Trump named it after himself the other night. He said it in his speech right or whatever is right of Trump. But that's just not true. The fact is right now the running essentially control it. And now they're controlling. I just can't emphasize is enough a second straight. With their new powerful proxy who's apparently trying to use claw to figure out make for missiles. It's not funny. It's what a face. It's a really sad moment. But this is where we are and it better. We know it now and try and figure it out. Thanks my friend. As always, David Road is MS now senior national security reporter. I think and I hope he's done for the day because it's been a long day for him in New York City's Bryant Park today. 2,750 empty chairs representing each person killed at the World Trade Center on 9-11. They were arranged facing south toward the twin towers that once stood in lower Manhattan visitors were encouraged to contribute by leaving a flower or a note on the chair. Pass memorials for the victims of the 9-11 terrorist attacks included the ringing of six bells followed by a moment of silence after each one.

34:00Now of those six bells to mark the times that the two hijack planes crashed into New York's twin towers. One marked another plane which struck the when another plane struck the Pentagon outside of Washington and one more for the plane that came crashing down that down in shadow. In Weston, Pennsylvania, the final two rings marked the exact moments that each of the two towers collapsed in New York. But this year a seventh tribute was added to seventh bell memorializing the thousands of victims who have died since the attacks by suicide from cancer or from other illnesses. That tribute comes three days after New York City officials released new new documents previously withheld from the public that are renewing focus on the persistent health issues that 9-11 survivors and first responders still face today 25 years after the attacks. On Tuesday, New York mayors Zoraan Mamdani released more than 170,000 pages of city records that detailed the air quality at ground zero in the immediate aftermath of the attacks. According to the New York Times, the documents while limited seem to show that while New Yorkers were being urged to return to Lower Manhattan, it wasn't necessarily safe yet and that they may have been exposed to dangerous toxins as a result.

35:11Hazardous toxins like carcinogenic benzene and asbestos were still being detected months after the attacks. As the fires at ground zero continue to burn, their fumes spread carcinogenic dust and debris through Lower Manhattan into homes and workplaces. 25 years later, the health toll is accelerating. Quote, the number of 9-11 survivors who are receiving aid for cancer has roughly tripled over the last five years according to a Washington Post Analysis of Reports from the World Trade Center Health Program. In June 2021, 8,870 survivors received aid for cancer treatment jumping to 27,300 survivors in 2026. Joining me now is Paul Reikoff, CEO of Interpeted Veterans of America and Host of Interpeted Americans Podcast. Paul, good to see you. Thank you for being with us. You are often on with me and we always appreciate you coming on but you have a very particular attachment to this. You enlisted I think in 1998. You went to Officer Training School and you graduated in the middle of 2001.

36:17Right, before. June 2001. Right. And so after the attacks, you went right down there to start doing what? To start helping. To helping? Yeah. Yeah. I mean, it was kind of a reunion from my OCS class. We didn't expect our first active duty deployment to be in Lower Manhattan. Yeah. And it's been a long day. Yeah. It's been a long 25 years. Yeah. But I think the old saying that the truth is the first casualty of war was also true in 9-11. They told us the air was clear. The air was not clear. They lied. Our friends have died and our friends have been dying for 25 years. So I think it's an important step forward today. 9-11 is always part mourning and part celebration of life. Yeah. But I hope it's more about accountability now. Yeah. And I think we've been going forward, and we've been going forward for a couple of years. So I think we've been going forward. But I think it's important to have accountability. I mean, I would have liked to have the release a couple of years afterward or even immediately. I think it's important to have accountability.

37:18Yeah. That's what we need folks to continue that focus, continue that evenly. And remember that tomorrow more people will be sick and more people will continue to die and the fight goes on. You didn't love the timing of this release. It was this week. 170,000 pages. Why? I mean, I think it's important to have a couple of years afterward or even immediately after. I think it's important to, I don't know, folks to remember. It wasn't just National Guardsmen and firefighters. Sure. Probably would have gone in anyway. Yeah. They reopened Stavis in high school. Yeah. They sent kids back into that. And they could have waited a couple of weeks. They could have waited a couple of months. And they would have saved lives. There's kids who now are still grown adults suffering from cancer. So I do think it's somewhat hijacked the story. And I think that's what's happened almost every year. And maybe part of why this year feels so different and maybe bitter. It always gets hijacked by something. Often by the politics and by the politicians. But I think there's an opportunity from Mamdani and others to go a step further. Okay. Now we know this data is out there. What's the plan going forward? Yeah. What would you like the plan going forward to be? Because this is the unspoken tragedy of 9-11. The one thing is when we look at these images of 9-11, we at least can conceive of.

38:19It's very hard to. But conceive of four planes and the people who died and all of that. This is the unspoken tragedy that really didn't for so many years get a lot of attention. There were people like you and others who were trying to bring this to the fore, particularly at Congress. And it just kind of didn't catch the imagination. In the magnitude of all of it, it's always difficult to describe. I've said it's often like, I remember someone saying, you can't appreciate the magnitude of the Grand Canyon until you're standing on the edge of it. Yeah. And that's what 9-11 felt like being there. But that's also what it felt like to explain that experience and the magnitude of it. But I think now as we go forward, what we really want is accountability. Right? Maum Donney could have named names. He could have launched an investigation. Others can launch a bipartisan investigation. I've said it straight up. If people lied and committed crimes, they should go to jail. No one should be above the law. Whether it's a Democrat or a Republican. And we need that accountability, not just for the victims and the survivors, but for what happens next. So next time there's a toxin exposure or public health emergency, leaders know that if you tell a lie, you will be held accountable by the American people.

39:20Because we've had 25 years of all kinds of forever war ever since. We've never gone back to that initial lie when they told our heroes, they told our kids, they told our citizens the air was safe to breathe. And it wasn't. I have heard arguments that using whatever technology they had, measuring the air, particularly outside, met certain standards. And that's why they didn't do that. I mean, was it a lie where they misinformed, were they measuring the air the wrong way, were they not considering, as John Stuart said this week, that those toxins were now in your house, on your windowsill, in your pets fur. What was, what's the thing that they didn't tell that they should have? I think we should be able to know that with a direct answer. Yeah, frankly, right? We're still sorting through it. I mean, at Independent Veterans America, we've got a data lab where we've tried to display all the data and show people how the fumes changed, how the situation changed, the exposures changed. And it was, came down to leadership decisions, you know? I mean, just like it does on Iran or COVID, leaders decided that they were going to prioritize Wall Street

40:20over high school kids. Yeah. That was a leadership decision in a time of war that was the wrong decision. And I think what we need to see is accountability, especially now. And of course, this year is especially demented because now we're at war, they're on. Yeah. And there's a new forever war. And Congress hasn't approved that either, so it's been a generation without accountability, without guardrails, without the true involvement of the American people. And we shouldn't have had to fight in Begg and in List John Stuart for 25 years, but the fight will go on tomorrow. And hopefully, there are lessons learned. There's another old saying about war that the only victor in war is medicine. We can learn a lot for this. Yes. To keep ourselves and our children and our future safer. Well, you were deployed, I'm just trying to keep track of this, because you went in 2003 to Iraq, right? Right. And you spent about almost a year there? Right. Because there's questions about that too, right? Oh, yeah. The burden, so obviously, I get it. We had this national response. People volunteered. They did what they had to do. And God forbid this happened another time. We do want to know more about the science. Then everybody running down to the thing gets a proper mask or a proper ventilation kit.

41:23There must be ways we can get around this. Yes. But also remember, history is repeating itself even more so. I mean, Agent Orange was a fight for a generation of being non-bestos. Yes. Really, Agent Orange was only fully appreciated and compensated for. When we got burn pit exposure, thanks to John Stuart, when we shamed the government, we shamed leaders into action. So there's a history of this. There's a history of betrayal, especially of the first folks who run in the gym. Yeah. Helpers. And I think that's an opportunity for a leadership reset. And I hope whoever is running for president next will lead with that. Yeah. Because it's about taking care of our own. Yeah. And take care of the people who will naturally go. As you said, some people will go no matter what data they have that says this will hurt them later. Because they are running in to save other people's lives. I don't think fewer people would have gone to help, but they could have been informed. They could have known. They could have protected kids. They could have protected others. And I think, you know, I always think about 9-11 was the worst thing I've ever seen. Yeah. But it was also the most beautiful thing I've ever seen. Yeah. It was unifying. It truly was patriotic.

42:23It was people coming together. Those were born out of that. And it was about loving one another. Yeah. It was about love over hate. It was about coming together. And it's been a long day for everyone. We're ending on a Friday. Yeah. I want people to remember the heroes. Remember the helpers. Remember the people who went in, when others went out and tried to reclaim that spirit now. Yeah. Because we're going to need it going into this fall after 9-11. Paul, you are a little worried about how kids are taught about 9-11. What's your concern there? They're not taught. Here in New York, there's no formal curriculum. There's no federal curriculum. Misinformation is rampant. Now it's been demented by politicians and twisted in so many ways. So there's no baseline for teaching them what actually happened on 9-11 and what it meant for our country. Even the basics of timelines and budgets and heroes. And I think that's another opportunity. It's been an initiative here in New York. I think it's another opportunity for bipartisan support. Yeah. Let's understand and appreciate how we can teach our kids about the facts of what happens. So it can't be manipulated for future generations. Paul, thank you. Not just for being here tonight, but for all the times you've been here and for your service to the country.

43:24We are deeply grateful to you. Paul Wright. Thank you for covering it. Paul Wright, you are an US Army veteran. He's the host of the Independent Americans podcast. He's the CEO of Independent Veterans of America. We'll be right back. . . . 25 years ago today, the sky over lower Manhattan went dark. Two towers fell, 2977 people died that morning. Thousands more have died since from what the wreckage left in their bodies. More will still die that way. Every year on this night, since that first one, New York answers that darkness the same way. Not with words, mostly with silence, with the names of those who perished, and with light. Two beams aimed straight up from the ground where the twin towers stood, climbing four miles into the sky.

44:30You can see them from 60 miles away. You don't need me or anyone else to tell you what they mean. That's the light New York puts up every September 11th. It doesn't make the darkness go away. It just reminds us that the darkness didn't win, and the darkness will never win. Tonight's 11th hour is done. Tomorrow starts right now. This is Angus Maximus. This partner has one part of a pound of hot, juicy cooked to water, Angus speed. It's more face than a quarter pounder. The battle is closed. And for only 599, even regular dudes can afford it. Like that guy. Give me that big old burger. Yes! The whole Angus Maximus only 599 is cold senior. A bill for a limited time of participating restaurants, tax on included, not valid for use within a combo, or in combination with any other offer or discount.