My Husband Refuses To Work And Still Lives Off His Parents

0:00Brought to you by the EveryDollar app, start budgeting for free today. Normal is broke and common sense is weird, so we're here to help you transform your life from the Ramsey Network in the Fairwinds Credit Union Studio. This is the Ramsey Show, and I'm Rachel Cruz, hosting this hour with Dr. John Doloney, and we are answering your calls, so give us a call at AAA8255225, we'll be talking about your life and your money. Starting us off, this hour is Hannah in Salt Lake City. Hi, Hannah, welcome to the show. Hi, thanks for having me. Absolutely, how can we help today? Hi, so I have kind of a two-part question, so I got married about two and a half years ago. It's my second marriage. I have a teenage daughter for my first marriage,

1:01but my current husband, we have Toddler about a year and a half old, and he is a welder by trade, so he and he is very physically capable. He's in his late 30s and I'm in my early 40s. He refuses to work. I work for School District, so it's not like I make a ton of money, but I make enough to cover the bill, so the house that we live in is mine. I bought it in 2020, thankfully, but again, we've been married since 2023, and we put our child in daycare, four days a week, and he watches her one day a week, which is really nice because child care is incredibly expensive, but there's a lot of resentment on my end building up because he just absolutely... What's he doing the other four days, Hannah? Where is he going? What's he doing? That's a good question, so he's from a town that's about an hour away, so he'll go back over there

2:07and hang out with friends, and sometimes he picks up odd jobs, I guess. I don't really know, I ask him all the time what he's doing, and he just always kind of has a weird ambi-us answer. His parents also gift him... They gift him money every year, like at Christmas Eve. His parents... Yeah, his parents still give him like $10,000 or $20,000, and that's kind of what is off of, because all he has to pay for his own gas and then substances and whatever. So money's not combined, so he makes $10,000 to $20,000 from his parents once a year, and then some odd jobs, and he's in charge of a certain number of bills. You pay probably the mortgage and other things, and it comes out of your salary. Yeah, I pay the mortgage, all of our utilities. We do now, as of the last couple of months, we do split the child care bill, because I was frustrated that he didn't want to stay home or work, and so I said that was kind of

3:09the deal as we needed. Hannah, do you feel like you have major marriage issues? Yes, I feel like you do. I feel like you do. Well, because what's interesting, Hannah always, and John can get into this, but money's usually a revealing topic on how the marriage is doing. Usually it's not really a money issue. It's more a reflection of what's going on in the marriage. And so when everything you're describing to me is that he doesn't hold a lot of character in who he is as a person, not only is he not being upfront and honest with you with what he's doing on the days that he's like driving back to his old town, which kind of, I don't feel good about that, let alone not working, not wanting to participate as a married couple in the household responsibility, like all of that to me is a breakdown of character, which will be a breakdown in the marriage, because that's who you're married to. So, Hannah, I have a hard thing to say, is that cool? Yeah. Yeah. All right, just for the rest of this call, I don't want to hear about

4:10this guy at all. Okay. Okay. And this is why you, he has no character. He's not, he's speaking on behalf of all men. This is not a man. Okay. It's not somebody that's taking care of their kid. It's not somebody's taking care of their wife. It's not somebody who has enough dignity when they look in the mirror to get up and go to work and be somebody who provides somebody who provides more than they take. Okay. But you can't make him do anything. Right. And so, where that leaves you with is a series of really hard choices. And so, my question for you is, what are you going to do next? Because just sitting at home wanting this to be different and thinking, well, fine, then you have to vent me for all of the iced tea you drink. Like, that's not a solution, right? Yeah. That's just you trying to flick him in the ear back

5:14while he's, you know, I'm saying so it's not a solution. So the ultimate question is, are you going to leave? Or if you're not, then if you are, that's one track. If you're going to stay, then you're saying, okay, I'm choosing to stay here. I'm choosing to, if there is good somewhere in this in this man, I'm choosing to look at that and I'm going to make peace with what I've got. And I've got to go solve this math problem I have financially. I got to solve childcare. I got to go solve these problems. You get what I'm saying, but sitting in the limbo, just waiting for somebody else to be different, he's not going to change. Okay. Let me, I'm asking John this on your behalf, Anna, because as you explain that, I agree. But if she, so say she did part one, right? And she leaves. Yeah. Is there a, is there a reality, though, that she sits down and says, I need X, Y and Z to change. Or I'm leaving. Yeah. But, but that just, if you, if you will tell me, there's no way I'm ever going to leave him. I've been through divorce before. I will not do that

6:16again. Okay. Then that's good for you to know. That's, that's a boundary for you. So now I have to learn to live inside these castle walls that I've built for myself. If that is an option, then yes, I think he deserves as your husband, even though he's failing every way from here to Sunday, he deserves. Here is a path to trust. Here is a path that you can walk that would reestablish you as my co-creator of the life that we want to build together. So Hannah, my question to you is, is option one and two on this table or use someone that, because what you've gone through, you're like, nope, it's just going to be option two, and I'll have to go from there. Do you know, just like as a knee-jerk reaction? Well, sort of. So, and also part of why I called in, and I know this probably sound awful, but it is something that I think about is, so I have retirement through my job, through the school district, plus I have an IRA and a 401K that I put money into. I'm very, very financially responsible. I don't have any debt other than my mortgage. Yeah. And he has,

7:19he has a ton of debt. Like, he racks up credit card debt. Obviously, he doesn't work. So if we divorce, I know he's entitled to half of my retirement for the length of our marriage and half the equity in the home, maybe, maybe, maybe. Okay. Well, that's good to know. And then I would challenge you to not make any of those assumptions without sitting down with an attorney. Okay. Every state's different, every situation's different. Some states have like boilerplate, like, this is just how we do this. And other states take into all sorts of other things into account. So don't make any like, well, since this is true, sit with an attorney and get those answers. Okay. Yeah. He's, I mean, obviously, like, I mean, you guys are correct. Our marriage is not great, because I have resentment because he refuses to provide for his family. And he has resentment towards me because there's, you know, I mean, it's a long story, but there's a significant lack of intimacy in our marriage on my part. Part of that is my resentment towards him. The other part is

8:21I almost died in childbirth. And it's been a series of surgeries and medical things that have happened since then. That sounds, yeah, that's a, that's a lot to unpack. So I would, I would probably sit down with someone. Yeah. Call somebody today. You can call our friends over at better help. You can go find a counselor in your area and you need to sit with an attorney and find out what the truth is, what your answers are and what you need to do next. You know, one of the first things I discovered working in the financial world is how absolutely devastating it is when the breadwinner of a family dies. And there's two little life insurance or none at all. Grieving families are suddenly left behind scrambling to pay bills and trying to make ends meet. I also discovered that there are a lot of ripoffs in the life insurance world like

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10:33Next up we have Francisco in West Palm Beach, Florida. Hi, Francisco. Welcome to the show. Hello, thank you. Thank you for having me. Yes, absolutely. How can we help? Well, my question is because I'm 30 years old and I have about 350 grand in debt. So yeah, I was thinking this day so at least declaring the company's bankrupt or I don't know myself as well, but yeah, but then your videos came up and then I started thinking otherwise. Okay. Gosh, Francisco. Hey, so what kind of debt is the 350,000? 50,000 is on the line of credit that is to the company but is personally guaranteed and about 45,000 is in credit cards and then about 200 are on an SBA loan. It's really two different loans for two different companies like 140 and 60,000 and the one for 60 is already in collections. They

11:37send me a letter yesterday with like 20,000 in administrative fees and decent debt and that's why I started thinking all this and then we have four vehicles, two for the company and two is my wife's and I and one is paid off for the company and in the rest we owe about 54,000 combined or on each. No, combined 54,000 car. Okay. Yes. Okay. For the loans that have already gone into collection, how long has it been since you've been paying on those? I've been paying since COVID because it was this COVID SBA loans, but yeah, I was paying. I don't know what happened. I even turned to collection. I assume not paying enough for you paying the minimum? Yeah, I was paying the minimum on one of the SBA loans, the small one, but that one is already in collection and then

12:45the other one I haven't paid it in over a year. Okay. And then that one is in collections as well. Is your business failing, brother? Well, it is failing. I've been doing a lot of accommodations because it was a franchise and they picked 10%, they had me on an office, an expensive office where now all the machines is in my garage in my house and yeah, all sorts of things. So, you know, in the last year, I've been fixing it to at least I'm saving like 8,000 a month with all the changes with not. Okay. You're saving 8,000 within the business or after your take-home pay? No, in the business. In the business. Okay. Yeah. So you're putting 8,000 away. How much will you make profit at the end of this year? If you keep it going, if you don't file bankruptcy, what do you project? My projection is small. It would be like 30,000, 60,000. Oh gosh. What do you do?

13:46Is the construction company? Okay. And are there multiple companies? Because when you said there was a VA loan out for one company and then I got another loan for another company. Are there multiple companies or just the one? The other one is sort of a consulting company. A consulting company. Okay. And is that still going? Are you still running that company or no? No, really. We're stopping and it's been so slow in the last couple of years. Yeah, we're not running it anymore. Okay. What do you have when I'm thinking of vehicles, I'm thinking of tools, I'm thinking of machines to liquidate? If you wouldn't sold everything today, everything just sold it all. What would you garner? How much money would you have? In one car that's paid off and the machines and everything, I could probably sell it for maybe like 50 grand. I can probably get at least 40 grand. Yeah. What about the second car that you have a

14:47node on? The other cars, I'm upside down in two of them. I would for about like 10,000 or so. Okay. Yeah. Okay. So you're bringing home about 60. Yeah. I mean, yeah. This is a tough spot. Friends, it's coming. I never want to gear someone towards bankruptcy because we always want to look for a solution out. And the only solution I see for you on the horizon is going to be to get to do what you can with the business, to liquidate, you know, take whatever what John was saying. Anything that you can sell to get money back out of it. I would try to negotiate. You're going to have to find the cash. But once you have some cash, if stuff goes into collections, you will be able to negotiate some of those things. I'm not sure about the VA loan and all of that. And that's being administrative fees. I don't know anybody that's whatever that whatever that looks like. But for most, most people that hold a debt that's in collections, whether this is

15:49credit card medical, whatever it looks like, once it gets to collections, they're going to assume that you're not paying it that you don't have the money for it, right? And you don't right now. So what I would say, my hope would be that you can find, you know, multiple jobs. If you're married, having your spouse work, I mean, like whatever you can do to earn some money during this time to start getting a plan to look at these, look at this debt and say, okay, how can we slowly, especially with the ones in collections? How can we start negotiating some of this down? And then the credit cards, I mean, honestly, I'd probably let those go to collections, like I think you don't have the money for them right now, right? So if you look up in 12 months and those are in collections, is there a way you can settle that? So it would take probably through a good three to four years to climb out of this. Forensesco, but that would be the way to avoid bankruptcy. You're going to have to go get two or three jobs. Your wife's going to have to get jobs. You're going to have to go work like crazy. I'm a call. Listen, I want you to call our friends at Guardian litigation. It's a guardianlit.com slash Ramsey. And they're a nationwide law firm that helps

16:53with debt settlements, with collection issues. And they might be able to give you some guidance on, okay, the SBA stuff, don't worry about this or the credit like, they'll be able to give you some sort of guidance like line by line with your various creditors and who's serious and who's not and all that kind of stuff. So check them out at Guardianlit.com slash Ramsey. And they'll give you some support and some help there. Yeah, I'm so sorry. What an absolute mess. All right, let's go to Elizabeth and Honolulu. Hi, Elizabeth. Welcome to the show. Hello, thank you for taking my call. Yes, it's a two-part question. My husband and I are on baby step two and have about $8,000 debt left at zero percent. Okay. I'm returned from the military in about six to eight months. I joined when I was 17. The military has been my entire adult life. We plan to buy a home using a VA loan. We currently have about $21,000 in savings. And we expect to save our own another 50 combined by June. Okay. My first question is should we pause and

17:58start cash for the house or should we pay off the $8,000 now to fully complete baby step number two? Yes, that a ladder. So go ahead and pay off $8,000. And then I want you to have a fully funded emergency fund, Elizabeth, before you purchase the home. Because once you guys get into this home, stuff is going to start to happen. And if you have no cash available to support yourself as you are homeowner, it's going to go bad real quick. Okay. So I want you to so you can use some of this 21,000 in order for that to be part of your emergency fund. And maybe that is your full emergency fund. I'm not sure what your expenses are, but I would get a three to six month emergency fund. And then the fact that you guys can say 50,000, that's amazing. So I would get at least a 5% down payments on a 15 year fixed rate mortgage where your payment is no more than 25% of your take home pay. So when you do all that math, if that's enough, then yes. And that's a great, a great start. And hey, Elizabeth too, I would avoid the VA loans. If you can go just get a traditional, just a traditional mortgage, 15 year fixed, that's a VA loan. They tend to have higher fees.

19:02There's a lot of stuff. And it seems like a really great option. It's about, you know, obviously from being in the military, but as you factor it off mathematically, your best bet is just to go get a traditional mortgage. But again, I would do a 15 versus a 30. Can I throw one other idea, Elizabeth? Sure. Are you going to be staying in Hawaii? Are you going to be moving somewhere off the island? We plan to either California or Texas, but we'll likely text this. Can I throw a second option out there? Sure. Go exhale for the first time and rent for a year. Get to know an area. Get to know what you like. This is the first time you've been in your house and you'll find I want the cat, the kitchens to look like this, the bathrooms to feel like this. If you race out and buy something in a new state that you haven't lived in, it's just a recipe for, we should have. I wish we had of just go rent for a year and keep piling up cash and then by the house that you really, really want.

20:18I love entrepreneurs. Don't forget, guys, I started my company on a card table myself, so I know what it's like to have people counting on you, your team, your family, not to mention your customers. And when you're the one signing the paycheck, you can't afford to fly blind. But I'll be honest, early on, one thing that nearly sunk us was wasting time with spreadsheets that didn't add up because business units didn't talk to each other. I finally told my team, just fix it. And they did. We got NetSuite. That was years ago and we've never looked back. See, NetSuite isn't just for tech giants. It's built for growing businesses like yours. Over 43,000 businesses already run on NetSuite, including a lot that started just like you. And now with built-in AI, NetSuite is helping them even more. It's one system connected every part of your business for real-time insights. Not guesswork. NetSuite AI flags, inventory

21:21issues, cash flow risks, even supplier delays before they become problems. So you can trust the data, stop wasting time and make the right decisions faster. Take a free product tour today at NetSuite.com slash Ramsey. That's NetSuite.com slash Ramsey. I'm next we have Walt in Baton Rouge. Hi Walt, welcome to the show. Yeah, hi. Thank you both for taking my call. Absolutely. How can we help today? So my question is about charging rent to my adult daughter. She's 23 years old. She has been a registered nurse since she was 19 and she's worked full-time since the summer of 22, so almost four years. She still is at home with us and she's going to grad school and in

22:25May of this year she'll actually graduate and be a nurse practitioner. That is good for her. Great. Her tuition reimbursement from her employer pays the lion's share of this and she has no debt and has just been piling up cash. That's awesome. All right, so money wise, she's in good shape there. In back in April of 24, I began charging her rent of $300 a month plus a third of groceries to split those costs with me and my wife. She'd almost been working two years by then. She now likes to say that I'm stealing from her and of course the relationship is tense, but she does not want to move out either. She likes to say that none of her friends have to pay rent to live at home. We did tell her at some point that she could live here as long as she's in school, but we never expected there was going to be, you know, well into grad school like this. My wife and I do not need the money. Our intent was to show her that life has a cost to it. So really the question is, how should we approach this with her to maintain the relationship in a healthy manner? Those are those are two separate ends. Or let me say this. She's

23:36what an absolute mess. Well, she didn't say that you were trying to that you're stealing from her. I feel like I would have a totally different. I was so on her team. Let me see this. That I'm like, what are you doing, girl? You're a good dad and you and your wife for loving your daughter well. Okay. Okay. So well done. I applaud you. You're not doing anything wrong. You're not doing anything wrong. And in fact, you're I'm surprised at that kind of statement, right? Is she saying it seriously or is she playing with you? Is she messing with you? John, she has said this in the last week to us. Okay. I know, but like in a serious, is she playing the wires? No, no, she's dealing with me. It's not playing. Oh, it's not playing. It is with a mean spirit. Okay. Absolutely. I'm not going to have a mean spirit in my home. And especially when I've been trying, there's a history of I've been loving you well for all of this time. And my wife and I have been your chief cheerleader through your whole life. And we've given you such an incredible head start on the real world. Anything other than gratitude.

24:40Then that's a behavior is a language that's her thing. I don't want to be in relationship with you anymore. Or I don't want to be a part of this arrangement anymore. And so when I say it's two different ends, the right thing to do is to sit down and have a hard conversation, which is, hey, we've been trying to love you well. And this is turning. I don't understand where this is coming from. And to let the adult who's about to be a nurse practitioner, right? A lot to be a lot to write scripts and deal directly with people's health and well-being. Allow her to have a hard adult conversation. And if she chooses to end the relationship to sever it, to do what has happened over the country. Yeah, which is like, I'm cutting you off. That will be heartbreaking. And I would grieve the crap out of that. But she's an adult and she gets to make that kind of irrational choice. That kind of heartbreaking choice. Because you know, who says what she's saying? My daughter. And my daughter's nine. My nine-year-old is supposed to say, well other

25:44kids get smartphones. She's supposed to do that. My 15-year-old is supposed to say stuff like that. Because they're nine and 15. That's developmentally appropriate, right? Right. It is disrespectful and it's just hurtful for a grown adult who has been given such an amazing gift. And 300 bucks Walt for rent. Yeah. It's not like $1,300. It should be paying for an apartment that she's probably about to live in, right? I'm like, it's not even like a crazy amount either. No, it's literally the answer is the same answer I would give to my daughter, which is, I know I love you more than clearly your friends' parents love her. Love them. But that won't fly, right? That's not it. Don't say that. Exactly. Well, my question is when did it change? Because you said since 2024. So it's been almost two years. When did the when did the shift happen just in the last week? I can't say that it's happened in the last week. It's been kind of coming for a little while. I will tell you this. Once she started getting involved with young men as well too,

26:46that's kind of been a turn of this. And I will tell you recently, she met a guy back last summer. They got engaged after only about 12 weeks. And it happened when my wife and I were out of town, and they did not tell or involve either set of parents. She's not pregnant or anything. We don't like her choice in men. He has some character defects, dishonesty, laziness, he wants her to pay for his grad school and among other things as well. But she doesn't want to listen to advice. She ignores the red flags. And that mean and spiteful nature comes out whenever there's conversations that come up like that as well too. Well, here's the deal. When she chooses as a 24 year old, she can date and I say this with all due respect. She can date whoever she wants to. She can marry whoever she wants to. But when she accepts your generosity and says, I want to live in your house, then even though she's 24, she is saying, I'm going to live under the

27:49rules of my landlord. Yes. And if I started renting a house from a local guy here in town, I would be subject to that person's landlord rules, right? Absolutely. That's the way that worked. And so if she doesn't like your rules, she doesn't like you saying, I don't like this guy, whatever. Then she has to make a big grown up adult decision and say, then I don't want to live in, I can't have my cake and eat it too, right? Right. I can't do whatever I want. I can't not listen to their right. And you get to set the terms of the landlord. And it sounds like your terms have been incredibly fair. She's still engaged, Walt. She is. Okay. So when have they planned a wedding like, is there a... He wants to rush it up. She's trying to, so she's going on after this spring. She's going on to the extra four semesters to get her doctorate as a nurse practitioner. And she wants to wait. And so there's that tension there as well too. But it's bleeding

28:51over. It definitely is. Yeah. Yeah. Well, I didn't know if the wedding was like an April or something. And all this would just be a move point in three months or what? There is. He would love for it to be as soon as they graduate. He graduates from undergrad in May. She graduates that are masters in May. Yeah. I mean, he sees his meal ticket, man. He wants to lock that thing up as quick as he can. Right. That's what we're trying to tell her. Let me say this too. There is, I worked with college students and grad students my whole career. Okay. Before I came over to do this thing, there is, I don't know a psychological fancy term for it. I'll just call it a phenomenon where when parents and kids, whether they're 18, 17 and 18, or they're 25 and 26, when there is a pending or inevitable separation, sometimes people get super, super, super clingy and sometimes people manufacture conflict. So that the separation is palatable. Like subconsciously? I don't think intentionally. Yeah.

29:54But I think like I need to move. I don't want it's hard to move. I need to move like. And so I'm going to find a bunch of quote unquote reasons why I got to get out of here. Okay. And so let's take the best case scenario and say that's what's actually happening. She knows I've done my time here. I need to get my own place. I'm going to marry a guy that my folks don't like. It's like it's time for me to grow up. And she's had a really good thing for a long time. Here's where you can cut right through all of that. You can take her out to breakfast. You and your wife can take her out. Probably one of y'all would be better. That way doesn't feel like two against one. And you can say, I'm not going to fight you. I love you too much. You will never, ever have a cheerleader as big as me. I'm not going to fight you. Here's what I think is right in my home. I love you enough to keep up to always say what I think is best for you. If you ask me to stop talking to you about it, I will. But here's the rules for if you want to live in my house. Here's here's the situation what's going to be. But it's you cutting through it like I'm not going to fight you. I'm not going

30:57to manufacture fights. I'm not going to go to war with you. I love you too much for that. But I'll always be your cheerleader. I think just cutting through all that nonsense and saying I'm going to stick by my my my which is a healthy balance. It's the day it's still it's still him having integrity within himself. That's right. But yet it's like I'm going to still be your dad. I'm going to always be your dad no matter what. Yeah I used to be that guy who bragged about running on no sleep. And then I realized being tired all the time is not a flex. To show up as the best George camel I can be I need real rest. And that's why I got Casper mattresses in my home. The experts at Casper designed their mattresses to help you sleep deeper, cooler

32:01and more comfortably. And they've been top ranked in both the foam and inner spring mattress categories by consumer reports. You and your entire family deserve great sleep. So go to Casper.com slash Ramsey and use code Ramsey for 25% off mattresses and 10% off everything else. That gives you up to 1200 bucks off the snowmax mattress, which is the exact one I sleep on. That's Casper.com slash Ramsey code Ramsey Bye. Buying or selling your homes a really big deal. So with all the clickbait headlines out there and conflicting data it's hard to know it's really going on in the housing market. So we're here to help you with the latest trends and make them easy to understand. So right now the median home price has dipped to about $400,000 last month, which is pretty typical for this time of year. And mortgage rates have also dipped to 5.48 in December down from 6.27% last

33:08January giving home buyers some breathing room. And since rates are unpredictable the best time to buy is when you are financially ready. And you're not trying to time the markets. But when you are ready to buy a home is when you need to get in. So to learn more about the housing market trends and to get free tools to help you buy or sell with confidence go to ramsey solutions.com slash market or you can click the link in the show notes if you're listening on podcast or YouTube. That's good. See some rates at five. You know, they were holding steady seven eight. Yeah, for a while. So it's good. It's good. Going in the right direction, especially for home buyers out there. All right, let's go to Elizabeth, who is in St. Louis. Hi, Elizabeth. Hi, thank you for taking my call. Absolutely. How can we help today? I'm not so my husband and I we purchased a double wide six years ago and our interest is 10.44%. And 10.44. So what you said? Yes. Yeah,

34:10it's pretty high. I was kind of wanting some insight on what you guys would do in our situation. We want to get out of it out of it as quickly as possible. I just kind of wanted some insight on that. Out of the double wide? Yes. Okay. So how much? We'll just get it or cheaper payments. Oh, should we refund finance? I'm just not sure. Sure. How much is left on the on the loan? Of the 072,676 dollars. Yep. How much do you guys make a year? My husband just got a new job. She is at $26 an hour now. Okay. And I'm a stay at home home. So on average, how much does he bring in home a month? I'll have to do the Matthew handles the finances. So I really, I'm not. I'm not under pressure on that. Okay. So you don't know how much you guys make a month? I can check. I just know I'm supposed to be fast. Okay. Now you're fine.

35:13You're fine. How much is your payment on this? On the house payment is $940 and 31 cents, but it is going to jump up to 9.56 in February or insurance in taxes, which is just an extra $16, right? Yes. Okay. So 9.56. I'm wondering, yeah, is he making? Yeah. That's a way lower house, a living price, I'll say, because this isn't a house, but that's a way lower monthly rent than we hear from anybody or monthly mortgage. Yeah. I think just the main thing, it's just how high the interest is if we stay in this thing and pay just the payment over a course of so many years, how much interest we're paying. It's just, yeah. Well, let's say he makes, you know, I don't know, four, I mean, ideally, hopefully he's making four grand a month at least, because that'll be a fourth year take-home pay, which means that this is in a crazy percentage of your income. That would be very reasonable if he makes around four grand. And so what you guys

36:15would have to do, do you guys have any consumer debt? And we have the only debt we have is on our truck, we owe $23,000, $864, $62. Okay. And then we owe $7,000 in medical. Okay. Then $1100 on our phones. Okay. And $400 for our credit cards. Okay. Okay, perfect. So what I would do, are you guys wanting to stay in the double wider, when you say we want to get out, is it you want a different rate, or you want out of this, because you guys want to go own a home, like what we're, we're eventually we would want to, but you're not in a rush right now. No, I'm not in a rush. I just for right now, just a difference. Do you know what you could, if you were to sell it, I'm not suggesting that, but if you were, do you know how much it's valued at right now? I have no idea. Okay. So I would figure that out Elizabeth, because most, I mean, depending on,

37:16we hear kind of, we hear kind of two different rules of thumb with this number wise on the show. Most of the time, these go down in value. They usually do not hold their value. So I'm just curious from what you, from what it's worth versus what you, you know, could sell it for, because you may be a little bit underwater on it, I don't know. But if I were you all, the first thing Elizabeth, I want you and your husband to sit down, excuse me, bless you, John, to sit down. And I want you guys to look at the, look at all of your numbers Elizabeth, because I want you to know, and this isn't to shame you. This is very common in a marriage. One person kind of just has the money and the other person's like, great, you know, you just tell me. But I want, I want you to know, I want you to know how much he makes. I want you guys to do a written budget to say, okay, here's how much that we spend on groceries. Here's the light bill. Here's the mortgage here. Like here is everything we spend in a month. And I want you both to agree on it, because what's going to happen to, is I want you to slash anything you can out of that budget, because your next goal as a couple

38:17is to pay off debt. And I want the phones and the credit cards. I would make it a goal to pay it off in the next 30 days. What do we have to do in the next 30 days to get rid of that debt? And then we're going to work up to the $7,000 debt. And then we're going to work up for the truck. But for the truck, do you know, do you know what it's worth right now? Are you guys underwater on it at all? I'm here just purchased it. It's $20 to $3,000 to another Tacoma. Okay. So, so depending on what you guys make in a year, Elizabeth, if you guys cannot pay this truck off in a year to 18 months, you need to sell it. You can't afford it. Okay. Okay. Yeah. So you guys just, you guys need, need a game plan. And in the, in the mortgage, I don't think, because I don't know your income, which makes this really difficult, because I'm not able to kind of like extract exactly the numbers. But if he's making around $4,000, this, this payment is not your issue. It's other things happening with debt payments and all of that. If you guys are tight and don't have margin. Okay.

39:18Yeah. And I did check and it's around $1,000 a week. And perfect. Yeah. Okay. Great. Yeah. So that's around $4,000. Is there anything? Sometimes when we're stressed about money and we, sometimes that stress comes from, there's literally not enough to pay the bills, but sometimes that stress comes from, we just don't know. We just don't know. We just don't know. It's easy to fixate on one thing and make it that one thing, the grand, like this, this huge drag in that we have to slay. Right. And could it be that you're lack of, I don't really know how much we make every month. I don't know exactly what all of our bills are. I'm just looking at these debts. It's that your focus just lasers in on that 10%. And it's like, we got to fix it. We got to fix this. We got to fix this. You know what I'm saying? Is that it? Could that be true? It could be yes. My husband, he thinks you need to file bankruptcy, but I don't think no, no, no, no. Not even in the same universe. We just talked to someone with almost like

40:21$400,000 in business debt and he makes $60,000 a year. So do you watch you guys all the time? Yeah, yeah. You're not wearing near bankruptcy. Y'all just has a quick buy and stuff. You'll can't afford like this truck. You can't afford a truck. Yeah. Yeah. Absolutely. But he's pretty attached to it. He, I don't think it does. I don't care. I'll focus on the credit card in love. Well, no, no. Y'all focus on Y'all's future that y'all are building together. Yes. And this might mean you're not going to like me saying this. It might mean that for a season, you go get a job. Right. Because for the next 12 or 18 months, we're both going to do, and he's going to get a second job on the weekends. Yeah. Honestly, I'm all for it. Like, I could do like grocery pick it up or something. Now I have 202. So I've been making homemade soap from home and I've been selling that. But that doesn't bring a lot of income in. But something creative from home, right? That we're doing something. That's, I think that's the key that there's movement happening. And, you know, and here's the thing too, is that this plan to do this kind of stuff, it hits the ego right in the heart.

41:25And what it does is it takes someone that has as used to a certain level of lifestyle, a certain truck or whatever the thing is. And it knocks it down a level or two. Okay. And that's hard for, that's hard for anyone, right? We like progress. We like to see results. We like to be moving forward. And the feeling like we're moving back in lifestyle is emotionally difficult. But mathematically, you guys are going to start to see so much margin open up. Like, even, even as truck payments, you know how much it is a month? On it's around 530. Okay. Around there. So that's a half year mortgage. That's crazy, right? So, so even if you all didn't have that and all these debt payments, like that could be close to like 800, 900 bucks a month coming back to you guys. So, you're looking at the math and understanding this is the advantage that we have is so important. But getting on the same page and communicating to him, your fears, your dreams, Elizabeth is really, really important too. You already know the power of generosity and the best gifts make an impact now and eternally.

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43:45preserved. It's a life changed. That's pre-born.com slash ramsy Welcome back to the ramsy show and the fair winds credit union studio. I'm Rachel Cruz, hosting this hour with bestselling author and host of the Dr. John Deloney show. John Deloney. And so we are here to answer your questions. Give us a call at AAA8255-225. All right, let's go to Amanda in Denver, Colorado. Hi, Amanda. Welcome to the show. Hi, guys. Thank you so much for talking to me today. Absolutely. How can we help? So my husband and I have been married for 17 years. I am 42 and he is 48 and we made people long time ago with not having children. So we haven't been the best stewards of our dual income,

44:47no kids money over the years. Okay. We haven't been the worst. We don't carry any debt other than our mortgage, but we have very little and savings and no retirement. Last August, God surprised us with a baby. Congratulations. Thank you. Yeah, so we are late in life, Karen. Okay. And I caught in the process here. You're going, oh my gosh, we didn't prepare for this. So in hindsight, you know, I know we should have been planning for retirement for ourselves all along, even without a baby. But now with a baby, I feel like I am at ground zero and I have no idea what to prioritize and where to start to give us a heightened chance at not only retirement, but just, you know, follow financial stability while raising this baby and this crazy expensive world. Totally. Are you guys both working? I quit my job in April when I was about halfway through my pregnancy and I am currently a stay at home mom. Okay. Are you going to go back at all? Do you know, or will you wait probably

45:50for a bit and be a stay at home mom? I will wait for a bit. The intention is to not. I'd like to just remain a stay at home mom. Good. Yeah. Yeah. But at least for the first three years, three to five years. No, that's great. Love it. How much does your husband make? He makes 90,000 years. 90,000. Okay. Do you guys have any consumer debt? No. No. Okay. Any savings? Just cash savings? I've got about $30,000 in bank. Okay. That's great. Good emergency fund. Okay. So what's wild is, and I'm just going to run some rough numbers here. We have an investment calculator on ramsysolutions.com. So check it out because that's just always like a, it's kind of a thin thing just to fiddle with and look. But let's say, because we always say to save around 15% of your income. So I'm, I just threw in a thousand bucks a month. Say you and you guys invested a thousand bucks a month and you guys have nothing right now. And we'll say your husband's 48. I'm going to use his numbers since he's the one working. And then let's say he retires at 67 at a 10%

46:53rate of return. That's about $676,000. So that's not as much as I would probably want. So what if we just, again, I'm just messing around with this. Let's just say we, you doubled it. And that would be 1.3 million if you guys saved two grains a month. Because the, because the reality is too, his income's going to go up, right? Throughout his 50s, he'll be making more. So I think you guys, if you start now, I think you will end up being fine. I mean, do you think after all is said and done? I mean, if you, if you guys had 1.3 million at, when he's 67 in order to retire, for instance. And you guys, you know, if it was a 10% rate of return, you know, you'd be making a hundred and 30,000, but you won't want to take all of that. So let's say you took 70,000 of that to live off of it retirement. If everything was paid off, you know, that could probably be a possibility, right? So I'll just say, there's still hope. It's not like you guys are doomed by any means, but yeah, I would start, right? And maybe be a little bit aggressive towards it.

47:57How much you guys owe when you're here? We owe 130. Okay. There's about 300,000 in equity in it. Okay. Great. No, that's awesome. The other, the chefer would be, do we sell the house and take that, you know, money and start kind of moving. No, no, no, no, no. You just robbing Peter to pay Paul. Yeah, y'all are fine. You're good. Yeah. And, and we have our, our mortgages. It's 3.85. So it'd be silly to. Yeah. No, I think you guys are good. I would, I would sit down with a smart vester pro, Amanda, you can go to ramsysolutions.com and find one in your area. But I would map out to say, okay, let's open up. Um, he needs to have a Roth IRA. You can do a spousal Roth IRA. Does he have, does his company have a 401k? I think they do. Okay. Well, I would ask. I'm pretty sure they do that enough. Yeah, and see if they do a match. Yeah, because there's definitely, there's definitely a path for you guys to have retirement, 100%. But again, it will be you guys, yeah, jumping on the train and, you know, moving forward with it. But I would sit down with someone and look over your entire financial picture because you're in a great spot

48:58of me. I mean, honestly, you guys have no debt. You have $30,000 in savings. And then you guys, we're going to just start putting some money away monthly toward this retirement. And with compound interest and all of it, it's great. That's the best time to start is now. So Rachel, one of the things that I hear all the time that haunts couples in the situation is the phrase, I just want to get back to, right? Like, remember when I should have back in the day, we should have been saving money. I just want to get back to, we could just go out to eat whenever we wanted, and we could, the couples that I see do well are the ones that, oh, we have a baby at 42 and 48. Right? Yeah. Who can put a period at the end of that old life and not try to reclaim what was but to rebuild something totally new. And it's saying, we had our fun. We spent it. We went on every vacation. That was, that was awesome. And now inside this new world, we live in with a kid with, oh gosh, we need retirement. This kid might want to go to college, all those things.

49:58We're going to have to create a new kind of awesome inside this new world. And the couples that live in that reality, what they come up with to co-create in their life is amazing. It's awesome. The ones that are trying to live this life but keep their, looking back at the old them, dragging it behind them, man, it just becomes such a weight. And that's a recipe for people who go off and make decisions that they would never make, borrowing, cheating, all these things, because they're carrying around this past. And instead of just saying, dude, all right, this is our new world. And we're going to go fully into it, right? That is so interesting, because I would think if you're carrying what, what you wanted or what you thought would be, then you kind of like your, your creativity, your brain move, it all kind of just stops there. It doesn't allow you to say, okay, if I have this whole forward life, what are we going to do differently? What, what can we do creatively to change up what we want if we want to get to this? We're going to become a hiking couple, right? We're going to, we're going to, you know what, we're going to learn how to camp, because that's what we have money for. And we're going to be the best campers or like, or whatever, right? But we're going to live in this reality. And we're not

51:00going to sit down there thinking about, oh, remember when we're going to fully embrace what we got, and we're going to run forward with it. So good. Yeah. And in this case, especially looking at retirement and numbers, I think living in the present realized, okay, this is our new life. They're going to feel broke for a while. Now, what are we, yeah, how are we going to shift this? They're going to feel broke, because two thousand bucks a month, they used to just blow on whatever is going to go into an account for future them, right? And they're going to feel like they're failing, feel like they're broke. Right. And great. Cool. Feel that feeling. And then just go do the next right thing. That's right. That's right. And what's wild, you guys, is when you're looking at this kind of stuff, like wherever you are financially, if you're in your mid 40s, if you're in your 60s and you haven't started, like the point is to start as soon as possible, right? That's key, because time is on your side. And even with their numbers, what's wild is the contributions they would put in with the example of two grand a month, which is a lot. That's pretty aggressive. A lot of money. And I was just messing with numbers there, right? Probably a thousand is more realistic for 15% for them. But what's wild is their contributions would be around 456,000, but the growth is almost 900,000. Yeah. Like the growth starts to outpace

52:05the principles so quickly, when you realize, okay, if I can just start as early as possible, that that's on your side. It really is. And I can almost guarantee you they're going to go sit down with a 401k, their HR person, and they'll be like, oh, we have an 8% match, and we have it. And it's like, oh, we didn't know any desktop. And there's more, yes, but it's all about creating this new life in the future and these new goals, which is what Amanda and her husband are doing. So we applaud you guys, Amanda. We are cheering you on. We all want peace, peace with our money, our homes, our schedules, but having peace online is important too. Most of the time when you sign up for a coupon, enter a giveaway, or click yes to another email list, your personal info, like your name, your phone number, your address,

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54:10The Ramsey Show question of the day is brought to you by YRIFI. You don't have to stay stuck in defaulted private pseudolones forever. YRIFI helps borrowers take back control with affordable refinancing options that actually work. Learn more at YRIFI.com slash Ramsey. That's the letter Y R-E-F-Y dot com slash Ramsey not available in all states. All right. Today's question comes from Nora in Massachusetts. I've been dating my boyfriend for almost two years and he has about $60,000 in debt, car loan, credit cards, etc. He says he wants to get out of debt and he often complains about money, but I still see him spending on non-essentials. He takes weeks to pay me back even after reminders. I've offered support without wanting to be pushy, but our financial habits and lifestyles don't seem aligned. What I'd be wronged in the

55:13relationship over financial incompatibility, even though he says he's quote unquote working on it. Well, saying one thing and doing another. Yeah, behavior to language is very different. The behavior is a language. You're not crazy. And honestly, no, which I hate this because I feel like money easily can be one of these topics. And I'm like, it's just shallow. Don't worry about it. Love can conquer all. You know, that's what I want to believe in life. But the truth is too, money speaks so much about who we are and how we do life, how we function in life. And when you're not compatible with that, there's going to be a, I'm not going to say a constant conflict happening, but it's going to be an uphill battle. But money to me here is, you said this in earlier show is a revealer. Yes. Because if I'm looking at a guy who says, I want to do this, but then he goes in, behaviors of language, does a bunch of other stuff, says a bunch of other stuff with his actions, is he going to be the kind of guy that's like, I want to be a good husband. Yes. But don't do that. Or I want to show up for our kids, but, right? And so I, especially at a

56:17young age, I'm assuming they're young. I'm just guessing here. I want to see potential. I want to see somebody that keeps their promises to themselves. And I want to see somebody that makes a plan and doesn't stick to it perfectly, but try to stay on a path. Yes. So if he wanted to get out of a debt, he'd sell his car and get rid of the car loan. He would say, hey, we got to start eating at cheaper places. I hope you'll still like me. And it sounds like you'd be like, oh, thank God, I love you, right? Yes. But it is, the money is just the flashing light that this is a guy who says one thing, but he does another thing. That, if you were my sister or my daughter, that would be what I would say. I want you to look out for that thing. The road like, yes. Like, oh, oh, in 60,000 bucks of debt, what I say, don't marry somebody dead. No, right. But if the person is, man, if your guts are telling you, dude, he's not a guy. He's a guy who says one thing and does another. That's enough to make me back up a little bit. Yes. And you saying like, I've offered support without all this stuff. And then in that kind of situation, Nora, it's one of those couples that

57:22you end up being like his mom. You'd be, you're in more of a parental role. Well, you're loaning him money, you're as bank, you're his mother, you're not. You're taking care of him. You're having to help him be responsible, right? And then you end up being in like this like motherly role. And that's weird. And that happens a lot in marriage. We talk to a lot of couples where women, you know, are in that situation or men on the other side. So, um, so yeah, Nora, it's not the fact that he has debt by any means or, you know, that like John was saying, it's the fact that he's not following through is what he said. And that he's living with a set of values around money that you don't agree with. And so whether we like it or not, money fights and money problems are one of the main reasons of divorce in America because it just again, it conflicts with everything of how we do life on a day to day basis. Like you can't ignore that. And so it just will call, I think it will be a stress point. It will be a reason you don't sleep well at night. You know, I mean, it's just all of that is magnified when you're married. So, yeah, if you guys can't get at least moving on the same page again, not perfection, but moving towards the same page. Yeah, maybe it may be a deal breaker, which I hate so much, but

58:28that's the reality. All right, let's go to Susan and Dayton, Ohio. Hi, Susan. Hi, thank you for taking my call. My family started a large home edition project last year in July. The project that we're paying about $313,000 for the project. And it was supposed to be done by Thanksgiving. And it's not anywhere close to being done right now. And so we are new to this kind of project. So initially, we just kind of trusted our contractor. But as the time go went on, it just things didn't seem like it made sense. And the timing that he was giving, and as Thanksgiving went by, he kept on giving us, oh, it'll be done by this other date. And it's not done. It's not done. And I just wanted you guys's advice on how to proceed with just not,

59:29you know, goals not being met on the project. Yeah, is he just not showing up, Susan? Like are there days and days and days that he's not even there? Does he have any crews there? There's not days and days and days, but maybe there's like a couple days that he says there will be there, but they're not there. But then they show up. And so he keeps on communicating with us. And he shows up, but it's not consistent. Okay. Is there any, is he giving you a reason for why this is happening? Is it material? We have what's he saying? What's his reasoning? He's, well, we are using an homage crew in Indiana. And so the Amish, they have butchering days where they can't calm because they all have to butcher. Um, they have a car breakdown that he gives us different reasons throughout the whole thing. Okay. And so he's, at least like the pros of him is that he communicates and he's not giving up on the project, like he hasn't disappeared. And the other contractors.

1:00:32Yeah, that's a low bar though. Yeah. Yeah, I know. He doesn't cheat on me. He's pretty great. It's like, well, that's pretty low. Exactly. Yeah. Um, this is, we also have a local connection. I'm sorry. Go ahead. Go ahead. So he's using contractors locally that we have talked about with other people. Um, and they say, oh, yeah, he's a good guy. And so, um, and we, anyway, so, um, the options that we're thinking about right now to get this project moving faster and putting some pressure on him is do we run a new contract for him and say, we know it's past. We need new deadlines and new commitments. And some people have told us that we need to just hire a lawyer and be done with him and try to get as much money out of it. Have you already paid him the full 313? We have a retainage of just 11,000 left from the budget. So you've given him 300 basically. Basically, yeah. Oh, man. I, I, I, I, I, I think there's a combination. And virtually,

1:01:41this is your world. Y'all do this kind of work. Um, I, I would sit down with him and say, we've given you $300,000. This, this job is now going on three to four months overdue. Um, I'm, I, I'm very close to calling an attorney to get this thing settled and get my money back so that I can go hire somebody to do the work that you agree to do by this date by this contract we have. And, um, and, and I would have a new contract prepared and say, by this date, this is what it's going to be. And if he doesn't sign it, it's cool. Then he might call your bluff. And then we'll need to go get an attorney and figure that out. Yeah, because I mean, with some real estate, you know, especially if you're doing a remodel or something like that, for some people, they say, like, okay, it's going to take twice as long and twice as expensive, right? That's kind of the rule of thumb, which this, which sucks, right? I mean, I think you can do it very much in a tightened up timeline and budget, which is what, you know, I've experienced before. Um, but all

1:02:43that to say, I do wonder for him, have you guys had a level of intense conversation, a very direct and clear conversation with him? Are you just answering him via text and calling it today? Oh, no, we've had some direct conversation. We've talked to him about not dealing at it, but our frustrations with how the projects have been handled. Sure. Um, much more towards like, you know, after the deadline has been passed, or like in December, we have lots of them now, even more so this month, just, you know, the deadline has been passed. They haven't been showing up as much as I think they should be to try to, um, get it done as well. Yeah. So I think, I think the two things are, you need a new deadline that's reasonable and he needs to be able to meet that deadline. And if not, yes, then maybe there is some, some legal, um, you know, processes that you go to. And also, and I'll be honest, too, Susan, I don't know a ton about the Amish community, but you have chosen someone that's in a type of culture that I've never heard this. This is the first time ever that I've heard. Well, but they have days that they have to take off. I mean, I don't

1:03:46know. I don't know. I've never heard of it. I don't know if that's a reality in his world or not that you have to take into consideration because you hired him. If you missed open enrollment, don't panic. Most health plans lock you out for the year if you didn't sign up by December, but Christian health care ministries let you join anytime. CHM offers a simple, flexible and budget-friendly alternative to health insurance. And you can join anytime. That's right. No open enrollment deadlines. CHM is perfect if you're self-employed, starting a business, or in between jobs, because it gives you options without those out of control costs. And CHM is an insurance. It's a community of believers coming together to share medical bills and pray for one another. That's real peace of mind. You're not just sharing costs. You

1:04:48are sharing community. And families have trusted CHM since 1981 with billions of dollars and medical bills shared. You can see any doctor or hospital you want with no network restrictions, and members say that they often save hundreds of dollars a month compared to traditional insurance. So make a change that fits your budget and your values. Check out CHministries.org slash budget to learn more. That CHministries.org slash budget. Open phones at AAA 825-5225. Give us a call and we are answering your questions about life and money. Up next we have Alice and Boise Idaho. Hi, Alice. Welcome to the show. Hi, what's it going? Doing great. How can we help today?

1:05:50Okay, so I'll get right to it. I, me and my husband have been married for a little over two years. We are deaf free and we're looking to have financial planning. My husband's older brother is a financial planner. He's really good at his job. My husband has his retirement account with him and I have my retirement account separate. We are, my husband and I are both on the same page of putting our retirement account into a third party like a smart investor pro so we met with them on Monday. What is something for advice on how to talk to his brother about saying thanks so much for being like willing to look over his account for him, but we're going to, we're going to go with the independent. I can tell you the conversation I have with my uncle who's a CPA. He did my taxes for years. He's like an amazing man of character. He's awesome and it got to a point where I only reached out to him to ask for tax stuff and I remember thinking I want him to have

1:06:56the privilege of just being my uncle and so I told him hey I'm going to get somebody else to do my taxes this year because I want you to just be my uncle now. I want to be a guy I call for life advice for wisdom to check in on like he's one of the funniest guys I've ever met so like I told him I want I want us to just have a regular relationship. I don't want us to have a client customer relationship also and he was cool with it but that's what I used in my house. Yeah. Alice is your reason for wanting to switch which I totally get that may I mean I don't think it's a weird thing to want to switch from your brother and all is it because he's not great or is it because it's going to get awkward as he's looking at your numbers is it more of like a relational move or is it from like a competency standpoint. No he's completely competent it's more of I've just been told you know you don't make finances and money I'm sorry finances and family and then has it been weird or you're scared it's going to get weird. I'm just really in the future like life

1:07:56happens and then it would become an issue. Okay that's my concern. Totally. Yeah I think either way let me give you like another example of one that we stayed and this is different than a brother in law so I do think the family thing you know is fair to have some boundaries there but our smart vester pro literally the guy that we go to that has all of our information was a groom's been in our wedding he's like one of my husband's best friends okay and my smart vester pro two is in my wedding and his wife yeah and his wife was a bridesmaid we actually set them up so like like he said and he says and here's what I appreciate about him number one is like I he says every meeting because we meet every January like once a year we always sit down and look at everything and he almost he starts out every meeting with hey guys if this ever gets weird pull the plug like I am not offended I get it because numbers are so personal and here I am looking at exactly how much you're getting paid like I mean you see it all it's a very vulnerable thing and I think it takes a special person to be able to handle that and see numbers and and I think some people really can so I'm saying all

1:09:00that to say on one end it's your brother in law and it could get really weird and just like John and his uncle and it's like hey I just would rather like yes it didn't even get weird it was just I'm sorry yeah yeah but you just made the call like I just want you to be my uncle or I just want you to be my brother all I don't have to even worry I don't even want to have to even think walking in the door at Christmas if it's a down year and we're like I don't even want you connected to our money just because I just want you to be our brother in law like that is an okay answer and then I will give a little bit of a freedom on the other end that if it's not gotten weird and you think like hey maybe you know we give permission to each other that down the road if we if we just like hey at any reason for any reason we want to switch like we're all good and it's okay and let's just maybe wait and see I don't know right so I think I think it could be I think it could be both it could I took a call on my show on on the John Delaney show this morning in in another studio where a brother had like awful taken advantage of his younger brother in a business okay so that could happen but the other side of it and I would even go with the more

1:10:04common would there be anybody on the planet that would look after you and your husband's money with more intent like scrutiny than his brother no I mean he would do a great job okay and so I think that's worth I think I think trying to project any weird thing that might happen one day into the future and drag that into the present is that's just a definition of anxiety yeah no for sure right so for sure I think I love Rachel's idea of starting every meeting and or y'all sit down and say all right I'm about to move my money over and look at him and say I love you and I'm I can't imagine trusting anybody on the planet more than you and I'm worried that one day this will be weird so I just want to call it out if I ever if we ever decide to go with somebody else want you that we love you and you're our brother like you got him saying put all that on the table right Rachel's totally right I he could if he's not a good guy he could take advantage of you in ways that nobody else can but man if he's for you dude like he would be great

1:11:07in the earth to make sure his brother and his nephews and nieces or whatever y'all decide to do one day like that they're okay yeah right and and that's also else no pressure to keep to stay with it like if you still get off this call and you're like oh yeah maybe I am projecting fear into the future and it hasn't happened yet so maybe we stick with it for another couple of years that's great or if we get off this call and you're like I still don't like it have the conversation then of the I just want you to be our brother-in-law and is nothing about your competence you're amazing I love you I just don't want to even second-guess anything when we see each other about money I just don't I don't want to combine the two and that's what makes you comfortable and your husband comfortable then you can say that and I think and then go get a smart vestor pro right so I think I think either one is okay can I ask you one other quick question while I got you for sure you've I'm assuming you've told your husband this yes and your husband has said I will leave my brother to go where you feel comfortable yep he has you married really well I did that's awesome I just want to shout out your husband a guy that once he once he says

1:12:11till death do me part that does us part that you come first that's awesome so good I love that great question Alice thanks for the call all right let's go to Aaron in Salt Lake City hi Aaron welcome to the show hi Rachel Hedgeon thanks for taking my call absolutely how can we help well I've kind of got some truck issues and I've been told a couple times now that I might be emotionally attached to the truck and so I I'm just kind of looking for some advice so I don't make a stupid I have no idea what what this feels like so yeah I'm gonna say perfect do yeah okay so what what's going on is can you afford the truck yes so the trucks I have a small business I do landscaping so the truck is my livelihood okay how much do I owe on it I owe nothing on it okay that's kind of where I'm sort of attached to the truck I had about okay it's it's a complicated thing because I am capable of fixing this truck myself okay but I can't take the time away from work

1:13:15to keep fixing 100% yeah how much is the truck work and so it's worth about 14,000 okay um what do you have done to it well so it needed some motor work and then I hit an elk and well okay why can't you get an elk did you did you dress it need it gross oh man you killed it in good for you for being a good citizen man okay so so you feel like you're putting too much into it and it's breaking too much and once it's fixed from the elf or the the elk the elk incident is it gonna be okay yeah and I'm in favor of fixing it I'd rather fix it I might be a little attached to it but I I can fix it for like 3,500 bucks I just need well I need something in the meantime it's gonna be down two to three weeks at least and I have to use my truck every day how much does it cost to pay somebody pay somebody I'll have to look into renting yeah it needs to be at least a one ton truck so

1:14:18I know how much how much would it cost for you to take your card to a mechanic and say I need this back in 72 hours so I got to quote for $7,400 okay it would be two weeks okay so it would be two weeks also and that's not including the bodywork so really in the bodywork with 72 go rent go rent a truck for go rent a truck for two weeks and call it a day get the truck fix because you're looking at renting a truck and you're looking at the car repairs let's say 10 grand total you're gonna spend double triple quadruple that on a new truck yeah so keep it I don't know if you love the truck and you hit it you hit an elk like it's different if you're like putting a thousand dollars into it every two weeks because it's falling apart I don't know I don't know much about trucks but an elk is yeah keep it keep it Aaron fix it and rents rent for two weeks if you have to

1:15:31so tax season is upon us so to get free checklists and guides that will help you file go to ramsysolutions.com slash taxes we are here to help all right let's go to Laura in San Antonio Texas hi Laura welcome to the show thank you for taking my call absolutely how can we help I lost my job and now my investment properties in foreclosure oh my goodness I'm so sorry when did you lose your job it's well I lost my job and then I got another job and then I was laid off off that job man so might I lost my second job December these past December okay when's the last time you made a payment on your investment property so the investment property was Airbnb and then we listed it for a long-term rental when the renters moved out I list all right that's when I lost my job

1:16:35and as soon as I lost my job I list the home for sale with no leads I was depleting my savings I had five months of savings and I paid every single month on time I had excellent credit and I wanted ruin it but then I depleted my savings and the realtors couldn't sell the house so I changed realtors hoping that would solve the issues still didn't happen and after four months what they tried to do a short sale that didn't work and after four months that's when they did foreclosure on it so it's now in foreclosure where is it in the process where are you guys at with the bank and everything they the last letters we received were in December when I was laid off and they said that they were going to list it the first of a month okay um to take bids yeah so to be honest I have no idea okay when will they when will they start that the auction process do you know they said a date they said a date for it oh it started in December and when will they

1:17:38December close the bit like when will they close the bidding um I have no idea okay um so I would probably get some some dates I would call the bank and have you communicated with them at all since December or was that letter of communication the last so when I call them they said they can't help me that the loan is no longer with them that it's in foreclosure and they don't give me any information they're saying that the short sale didn't go through yeah and now it's in foreclosure so I have no idea who to call I'll be even called at this FDA or I don't remember what it is right right well it's odd yeah because the because it'll be a bank owned property right at one point but um what you're on the hook for and everything is what I would you know I would want all the facts of their dates and and what their plan is um and for them not to be able to help you is just that's that's crazy okay so when was when was well I guess it doesn't matter it's already in foreclosure I was gonna ask when the last month that you actually made the payment but that would

1:18:40have been back in the fall right yes yeah okay so for income for you Laura what are you what what were you doing for a job in December that you got laid off I was making 75,000 as a project coordinator oh wow so an amazing job how's your current residents right now your primary residents how are you paying your mortgage for that yes so my husband covers all our primary residents bills and mortgage along with the food and gas so that's helpful so the so the the investment property was in your name and he let he let it go into foreclosure you guys catch your money separate because you couldn't pay it it goes into foreclosure it was under both of our names okay but he didn't have money either to be able to help with it no so the only money that he has is to take care of our primary home where we live and all of our bills okay since I don't have a job now and then he's and then he's out his income just does that and then you guys have no other margin yes okay I say this with all due respect because I care about you but you can't wait

1:19:49around for another $75,000 project coordinator job you got to go get a job or two jobs or three jobs right now making anything Starbucks home depot any job because you have two issues one of a math problem you got to solve and the second thing is is you've got to get your feet back underneath you confidence wise and man there's no question about it Rachel and I are sitting here in the in the ash with you getting fired from two different jobs back to back and one's at one at least one of them was a killer great job that's heartbreaking and hard and the solution isn't just sitting on a bunch of resumes on LinkedIn or hoping that another one falls out of the sky I just got a right now I got a math problem I've got to solve and I got to get back on it in a big way right Rachel I don't know where to I would even know who to call for that well I mean I would continue to continue to they'll continue to at least have to communicate with you at some degree so whether it's letters which was you know 20 days ago or whatnot but I would continue until it

1:20:52gets all buttons up until the property sells to know everything like that that's what I would be doing but honestly the saving grace Laura is that it was a investment property it's not your primary home so you're not losing your actual residence which is huge but your credit I mean your credit score is going to be completely dinged I mean that's yeah for not even dinged it's it's cool yeah yeah yeah but again we don't worship at the altar of that either and I think moving forward what John's saying is exactly right for you guys get this all cleaned up which hopefully in the next gosh 30 60 days you know you'll you'll have everything kind of buttoned up with that and then it's the moving forward process that you're going to have to be able to focus on and that's going to be that income Laura hang on the line I'm going to send you every dollar premium app it's a budgeting app and also we're going to send you financial peace university the digital lessons because this may be this is going to be a really painful awful hard process with the foreclosure and all the letters you're going to get and all the threats you're going to get and all that kind of stuff but Rachel you just mentioned it and I'd miss this and I want to call it out

1:21:59this might be your chance for you and your husband to get completely off the credit score the passive income all the nonsense that we're told signifies we have wealth in our in our culture and this might be a moment for you and your husband to completely change how you all do money and we're not going to owe anybody any money as for our house we don't borrow money anymore we're going to get an emergency fund we're going to be our own credit card we're going to be our own support network and we're going to build wealthy old fashioned way which is slowly and over time and hang on the line here we'll hook you up with those resources I know this is a messy hard time yeah for sure but it is like it's a cautionary tale and I'm sorry Laura that you have to be the example of it but guys this is what we talk about with especially all these hacks and the stuff of like oh we can do this and this we can air bnb that and all of it you know for sure sometimes does it work absolutely but there's also a huge reality that it doesn't right and it adds so much stress and not that they were necessarily trying to do a shortcut but there is this I think it's a facade out there of like okay yeah here's some passive income here's an easy way to make money

1:23:03you know all this stuff and people fall for it all the time all the time are they just on one side of the full chrome right they sit on one side of the teeter totter and they're like look it's always going to be like this and the reality crashes down on the other side of it yes and and and and it's like you know and it's the perfect storm I mean Laura seriously you lose the job someone gets sick someone gets pregnant wants to stay home where I mean like anything in life that can happen that's why caring debt carries risk because when life happens it's not if it does but when it does when life happens all the cards are on the table and if it's a house of cards that you've built and three of the bottom you know the foundation get fallen out you know fall out the whole thing crumbles and that's what she's experiencing right now versus if you say okay I am going to take it slow I'm going to if I can't if I can't pay for it in full we're not pioneering you know we are going to take our time building wealth over a proven method what you do is you create a really sturdy foundation so if a couple of those fall your whole thing you know you lose a job well you

1:24:05have an emergency fund you don't have consumer debt you know you you got six months you know saved over here like that's old school say for a rainy day that's old school it's not cool and awesome and so fun in this hack but man when life happens you're not shaken right and and so that's common sense you guys that's biblical like there's so much scripture and proverbs about this about what just slow the diligent prosper continue on the path even though it's not flashy and exciting and you don't get cool Airbnb's and invest in this course that this 28 year old guy's like look I make a billion dollars a month off of this you know and I'm gonna buy my course and everyone goes and buys it thinking they're gonna be that like it's just it's not real it's not real or the number of people who after all the expenses on like their Airbnb they're like I make a thousand dollars a month and I ask them what their mortgage is and they're like well it's 2700 and I think if you had just paid that off you would technically be making 2700 a bus in extra money that's right that's right yes so I'm gonna pay 2700 so I can make a thousand and it's like it's

1:25:09such a weird trade yes 100 percent I know you guys so remember slow and steady the boring way of building wealth it's the safest and the less risky welcome back to the Ramsey show in the Fairwinds credit union studio I am Rachel Cruz hosting this hour with Dr. John Deloney and we are taking your calls at triple eight eight two five five two two five all right let's go to Ann in Seattle Washington hi Ann welcome to the show hi thank you so much for taking my call absolutely how can we help today so I've been engaged for almost two years um about a year ago my fiance suggested

1:26:10we considered getting a prenumped we both have children who are adults now we have our own property and we both are self-employed with our own businesses um I've been a single mom I've never married and he was previously married from almost 23 years um the property that I have is paid off and I don't have any debt um he's paying on a mortgage and he has some other debt called on not sure exactly how much um so I'm trying to figure out how we plan a future together for assets and finances they separate yeah I'm 46 and he's almost 50 so I feel like we still have so many years ahead of us for wealth building and you know just putting a future together and um yeah how much how much are your net worth like how if what what's your net worth what what's his um so after like taxes and expenses with the business um so mine would be oh worth like

1:27:12what I make every year um they can be that or just like what are you worth like if you put all of your your house your business your cars everything yes all your retirement everything oh um so mine is probably five hundred fifty thousand okay almost six hundred thousand and um I I know so what about what's what would he be worth so um I know what his property and well the house and the property combined are worth about seven fifty but he owes um two hundred eighty on the market okay so five hundred does he have a lot of um retirement I don't think he has any retirement you don't think or do you know so in order to sign a pre-knife you kind of have to you don't even mean like before I'd even talk about that I'd have every piece of information financially about each other I almost feel like he's waiting to disclose all that when it comes time to put together the pre-knife because I I'm really open about just everything my finances

1:28:18and just that is any I'm very open I like to talk about well yeah well you're going to get married to the guys I'm curious why he's not so open about here's the thing I I'm going to be honest I've been working on a marriage project for a couple of years and I have had my my firm firm immovable position on pre-knops really challenged in a good way and it's James sexton an attorney out of New York who he's going to challenge me on it and it was this every married couple has a pre-knife and it is whatever the state you live in says this is how we're going to split it up unless you all sit down and write out while you still like each other what would happen if okay we could we could debate that in fact some of my colleagues disagree with me I'm not I'm unsettled in my opinion on it because I do feel like if you make a pre-knife you're already getting into the boat thinking well I just need to have an escape plane if this thing happens and I do think there's

1:29:21wisdom in talking about okay if this many percentage of marriages don't work and you're marrying somebody who already has had one that didn't work let's be honest about what happens if this doesn't and we're going to do everything we can so that's for a different discussion to me my biggest red flag for you is what a pre-knife would serve you to right now is to make sure your kids are protected yes I said the adult kids is a chance for me yeah and not it's not a way to keep secrets from each other or to keep everything separate forever because once y'all get married we're going to have one check in account we're going to put all of our money in this thing together in his business may pay him a salary and your business may pay you a salary but it's going to go into the same account and if it doesn't a pre-knife is not going to solve that a pre-knife is not a a cover for division right it's just a plan so I think his I think it seems like his biggest concern well he almost lost his home during his divorce or going through his divorce and if he had to come

1:30:21up with so much money to keep it that pain is real that pain is real yeah but he can't understand it and respect that I do I know but he can't hand you that center block and say you carry this for me him getting remarried to you is him saying okay here we go again I'm going to put both feet back in the same boat right because otherwise he's going to have a foot hanging out of the boat and the y'all will never get out of the bay yeah he said he would like to leave his property to his daughters yeah and that's okay that's super fairing yeah that's fine yeah so so yeah my thing is yeah and I'm with John I'm not black and white on the issue of pre-knops usually if there's a discrepancy in wealth going into a marriage that's one time that I'm like I get that this is another if you're adult kids with SS yes adult kids and in a second marriage and you know you don't mean all of that and it's like hey the adult kids what I want this to go to them because I've

1:31:23worked hard for this and I mean all of that that's that seems fair to me what I don't like is you not knowing exactly the not you you don't know him fully and you're engaged and you're engaged to him so that that does worry me and I would want to make sure that the language that you have enough representation if you guys do go into this and do some kind of prenup that you have representation on your end because it does sound like you have no debt you have a home you've done very well financially he has a home but he has a debt is what you said you think you don't even I don't even know you don't even know or how much yeah so I so I mean you could be in a better financial just you know situation than he even is but I would just want to make sure you have represent representation on your end as well and but it would not be a that's not that's not the black and white issue to me what worries me though is the secrets yeah how how this is coming about does that bother you and I'm just curious because it would I I wouldn't be able to get close to somebody if they're like hey you can know all of me let's get married but this one part you

1:32:27can't know what's in these accounts yeah just so I'm not like a kind of person I've been almost afraid to ask because I don't want it I don't want to feel like I'm being nosy or you're about listen hun you're about to be his wife yeah you're about to be his wife I didn't want to extend him by like apart you know from all of just like I'm like well it's not like this not that's not that it is you're about to become his when you're about to become his wife what what if he owes 20 million dollars in and back taxes and debt right you want to know and and you're and I get and I get your kindness of spirit I can like feel that from you and it's so wonderful and such a gift but you need to have the strength to push into areas of this marriage that earn comfortable in order for this marriage to thrive it's not sweeping things under the rock and you already begun that habit and that's not a great setup a varying parts of yourself to keep the peace and asking your fiance his money situation is not rude or weird like you know

1:33:28I mean you're not like I don't know it's like you're not asking them be like hey you need to move to a foreign country with me for 18 years or whatever I don't know something but up and big and you're like oh my gosh what this is just like this is pretty basic stuff and like so can I get your opinion on something real quick we got like 10 seconds go okay he has somebody he doesn't have he doesn't want to move from the home that he shared with his previous wife even after I suggested we build a home together I have property we can build on or I can sell my property and pay off his mortgage okay and he is just like those are not options for him he just you know what I'm going to hold you because we'll answer that in the next segment so stay on the line and we'll get right back to you how many of you are ready for a fresh start with money this year maybe you

1:34:29want to pay off debt or start saving for retirement and those are great goals but you're also probably thinking well sure Rachel but with what money my budget is so tight as it is listen I hear you but you can do more with your money this year and our every dollar budget app helps you find margin to make it happen this is such a game changer every dollar digs into your money situation just like we do on the show then it finds extra money you could put toward your goals every month and the average person is finding three thousand and fifteen dollars and just fifteen minutes think about what that could mean for your family think about how much more peace you would have guys you can make this an amazing year with money go download every dollar and start for free today one of our favorite things is hearing people share their stories on how they're winning with money

1:35:29and so we got this one from Claire and Winston great name this is me and my husband's third month of budgeting with the every dollar app and I am amazed at how much money we have found we went from feeling like we're living paycheck to paycheck to finding three thousand five hundred dollars extra in margin each month to put towards our debt three thousand dollars five hundred yes three thousand five hundred we each had four credit cards and have been able to pay them all off and we are never going back it's incredible you guys so if you want that kind of control you want to see your income go as far as possible for you every dollar is the most amazing budgeting apps you can go download it for free at every dollar you can go to the app store or google play and this is where you start to really change your family tree and like we say all the time you live like no one else so later you get to live and give like no one else and it starts with taking control of your income all right we're gonna go back to Ann we were talking to her she is getting married she is engaged her husband this is her his second marriage they both have

1:36:33adult children they both own homes own businesses the question was about a prenup she doesn't fully know all of his financial information and then right before we were going to break she started talking about their home situation so Ann is that a good summary overall yeah yeah okay so your husband I mean your your fiance does not want to move out of the house he shared with his ex-wife for more than two decades and you have said I don't feel comfortable living in that house let's build something new you can move into my house I've got property and he said deal breaker I stay here pretty much yeah okay yeah I but even after I I'm like you know I'm of course I'm willing to make sacrifices and so I I just want to get I don't I want to see him at a debt I want him to you know take a break he's been working so hard all these years to you know you to recover from the divorce and and sorry I've been suggested I could sell my property and we could do that

1:37:33money to pay off his mortgage but he doesn't want to do that either and I'm just kind of not sure where to go from here yeah because that would mess up the prenup I mean that's you putting your assets into the asset that he's been going to give his kids and you're not getting any part of that right so that's where the whole kind of like it starts to be really complicated really good can I tell you what I what I hear and this is going to be really hard for me to say Ann okay I hear a guy that likes you all even goes far to say he loves you and he wants to be with you and he sees like I want to be with her long term but I don't see a guy who wants to get married I did ask him a couple weeks ago just really like I was blunt I'm like are you sure you want to get married and he says he says heck yeah okay but I think he has a picture of what marriages and you have a picture of what marriages and you're both using the same word but your pictures are very different so around here at the office we say clear is kind I think the kindest thing you could do for each

1:38:34other is to in is exquisite details possible y'all detail out what your picture of marriage looks like from how we talk about money to sex and intimacy to inheritance to wills to one checking account whatever your picture of marriages want you to have the courage to write it out and share it with him and ask him to do the same thing and hopefully 80 90% of it it all matches and then you're going to have to compromise negotiate walk away from each other because the other 5 or 10 percent is so big right or maybe it's okay I can do that you can do this but y'all are both have different pictures of what this thing looks like yeah because there is a level of sacrifice and meeting in the middle and it sounds like he's putting up some really hard lines so even where I'm going to live here and you got to deal with it yeah that's a lot yeah I don't care what your values yeah so making sure those values are aligned or huge and so yeah when it comes to

1:39:35the housing situation I mean it's whatever you're comfortable with I mean from the math perspective if you own a home he owns a home he wants you to live in his home and if it's in the prenup that his home then goes not to you if something happens to him it goes to his adult kids you need to make sure that you're home then that you that you have the the equity built in so that you have a place to go to not necessarily the home itself but the funds and the equity that's in your home if you do end up selling it and moving in to his home that that's yours right so it's not fair for you to wash yours clean he keeps all this and then keeps it if something happens in the marriage so yeah but if two people are getting married and they both have houses and they want to sell their house combine that money and go buy a house together and one of them is not pre-napping it away from the other person yeah that's awesome combine everything you want to go all 100 that's usually what you do yeah but he wants to keep this house for his adult kids yeah so it's like okay well then you need to make sure that your house then is in a protection for you yeah and at least the equity in there right um we we're just hearing over and over and you

1:40:38squashing what you're feeling yeah squashing what you think is right you you're molding yourself to fit into this other guy's picture of his life and I want you to have the courage for your sake for your kids for your future to write down here's what I really want here's what I really believe and have the courage to share that with him and he might look at that and walk away and that you're you're worth that risk well said that's great all right let's go to Samuel in Columbia hi Sam you'll welcome to the show hey how you doing we're doing great how can we help awesome yes so um going through some uh for bearing stuff with my mortgage company uh took a pretty big hit last year on my income decreasing due to a family members uh medical problem uh me and my wife we have three kids one on the way um the fund the mortgage company up in my mortgage of $1,500 for the next six months to the square away November December in January

1:41:44I got a car that's about 60 days past due I have a lease that the payment on its cheaper so we're currently trying to keep the lease to vehicle um to get out of the higher payment of the other vehicle um and I don't mind explaining details as we get through this I'm just trying to lay yeah a little bit of a PowerPoint out for you but um that's basically where I was at I was pulling eight to 10k a month um for the past two to three years in income March of 2020 yes in income eight to 10 grand a month um that was what was rotating through my accounts until the the situation that happened with my great aunt um so how much are you making now Samuel so um currently my cash few checks not and I'm in the car business I felt uh used vehicles um I work for I work with a company that sells you vehicles and um I've been I've been racking in somewhere around 35 to 4 grand a month um does your wife work in the slow season I'm sorry does your wife work

1:42:47no not currently she's home with the kids we have uh correct okay oh and she's probably yeah yeah okay gotcha gotcha yeah so you're so you're four grand a month okay so that's during the slow season where do you see yourself March April May June July what do you think you could get that up to I'm well so obviously we're here on the edge of tax season things are going to kick in I'll probably start racking back in eight to 10k okay okay you know the so really it's the month okay perfect so it's the up to mortgage that's usually higher because you guys went to four parents so we were food shelter utilities transportation that's our that's our key so keeping the house current is gonna be your number one priority okay and then these this car that car with the loan are you under water on that I am I am almost 60 days past due on it it's the family vehicle with a suburban okay I okay wait if you sold I don't want I don't want it to be repoted because then you got nothing so what if you sold it well so that's the problem I

1:43:49can't sell it I'm I kind of packed in some negative equity on top of it I have tried to sell it I have tried to reach out to the bank to you know okay how much them on totally how much do you owe on it how much you owe on it uh 52,000 52 62 okay 62 if you were to sell it I'm just wondering what what could you get for it 20 30 maybe 50 50 okay okay all right we're going somewhere I would get rid of it the fact that you already can't make this payment okay so you sell it to an individual get it out because if you keep stop if you're not able to keep making these payments they're gonna just take it and then you're gonna have $62,000 and then they're gonna sell it for nothing on their end and you're gonna oh so much so I would sell that I do that with the bank going in the title well you get well you're gonna have to take a small personal loan probably from a credit union so I would take the 12,000 yes and I'd be a one car family for a season that's

1:44:49going to be so uncomfortable with getting this taking care of so so so see if you can go get a $12,000 loan pay the difference get rid of the suburban and stay current on the mortgage that is priority even if you have to take an extra job that's priority hey guys George Campbell here do you ever feel like insurance companies only care about your money and not what you actually need well there's a better way when you go to Ramsey's insurance resource hub you'll start feeling confident that you're getting the right coverage that's truly best for you you'll find helpful info on everything from life insurance health insurance identity theft protection and more and when you're ready to get the coverage you need you can connect with a Ramsey trusted insurance pro who will only get you what you need at the best price go to ramseysolutions.com slash insurance ramseysolutions.com slash insurance

1:45:57here in Nashville Tennessee we do the show live every day from one to four so you can come in and visit us which people do from all over the country whether they're driving through Nashville or they make it a destination stop so we have we do the show live with some glass and we always have a great audience out there that comes and sits and there's free cookies and coffees teas all of it and then in the lobby we also have the debt free stage so whenever there is anyone standing on the stage we know it is time to celebrate so welcome you guys thank you thank you absolutely we have Nick and Renee from Chicago and they are here and made the big trip down because you are debt free yes free are amazing you guys okay so how much debt did you pay off so we paid a total of $160,000 $160,000 $811 and 63 cents oh my gosh how long does that take you

1:47:00six years six years amazing okay and what kind of debt was it student loans credit card but mostly student loans okay so consumer debt car credit cards do everything everything just the life just the life oh my gosh okay so six years ago what started changing for you guys what made you start checking down at $160,000 in debt well we were on our way to our honeymoon and the drive down to Hilton Head was we were listening to Ramsey so that was that was what a what a way to start the honeymoon guys I know so I started going we were at waterfront church at the time and I they were offering financial peace and so we did that along with our premarital counseling and so I drank the Kool-Aid 100 percent we got married we drove to Hilton Head and so I was like yeah let's listen let's do this and he never said let's take a break from this so we just kept listening to one after

1:48:04the other and and so that's just what we did but we've done financial peace every single year just to make sure we were staying motivated oh my gosh yeah so we've gone through it a lot but it helped us stay motivated one hunt I mean all the way because the majority of this was my student loans and that was really hard so like going through the financial peace every year it just helped us stay on point it helped us stay focused what was your degree in I did a bachelor in psychology and I have a master of education and science amazing yeah so how much how much for you guys making during that time I'm going to ask you that earlier but with that degree and everything yeah so we started at a hundred and six thousand eight hundred twenty nine dollars and then we ended with vote currently we're at about a hundred and thirty one thousand okay okay amazing amazing oh my gosh you guys okay can I can I jump in here yeah I have a question for you yeah I've never asked this I don't think of a couple ever all right bring it on I would love for you to talk to

1:49:10the couples out there where one of the people in that couple feels like the majority of the debt that we're trying to both pay off I brought into this thing yeah and there's some guilt there there's some shame like talk about how that felt knowing four years in this guy married me and we're still not eating out because we're still trying to pay this stupid thing out right right yeah I'm yes you nailed it on in one so it has been super challenging and when emotionally challenging all challenging yes and so when we before we got married we had talked about what does your dad look like you know and he's telling me he's like oh I've got a lot oh yeah oh no and I was like oh gosh because I'm just thinking of mine totally is and he's like about twelve thousand dollars oh and then I thought well this is the end of this you know also then I told

1:50:12them mine and and he was just like okay and it was what was it one twenty one thirty yeah one thirty one thirty yeah okay okay and so he was just like okay all right let's do this and so so he every time I I would get super upset or have a challenge or just like oh my gosh I can't leave I'm the reason we're still in this I'm and he's just like nope this is ours we're doing this together we're in a great man brother he is I've got a really good guy so he's been in it with me from from day one and so what do you tell that person listening who doesn't want to come clean about what they owe is afraid of saddling their their spouse with this with this journey I would say you have to be honest and open about it because that's what made so we've been married six years and that's what's made this marriage so strong we we had a lot of other elements we you know we we had a lot of other things moving forward in this like we were doing IVF through this we were paying cash for that so it was just like to consistently have that that debt loan on top of

1:51:20it it was it was just hard but knowing that he was there with me he was supporting me that we were supporting each other we learned how to say no yes to each other which was amazing yeah you know the the best way I could put it is it trust open mind in this and to love as unconditionally as you can that's beautiful it's a hard it's a hard thing to it's a hard thing to do every day yeah it's making a choice but it's a hard thing to do and it's a hard thing to receive yeah yeah yeah okay so for you guys on this journey who out of the two of you who's more of the spender who's more of the saver who's more of the pre spirit like would you say you had like different personalities through it or we all pretty honed in together sounds like y'all are pretty similar from the way you're talking but I'm curious I think I may have become more of the spender next like I can do this I can spend some yeah yeah he's good at spending good I love it I love it so what would you say was the the hardest part of this journey I mean we kind of talked about some of just like

1:52:25the law you know the marathon and all life that was in there but was there a part that was like who that is tough so after all the the smaller debt and then it became the student loan that and then it was at time when we were going through the IVF that was that was a challenge but we had to break it down into like little victories making this amount this month or this amount every quarter you know whatever it is great and just and you know celebrate those little I love it yeah okay so what would you say the key of getting out of debt is of some more to ask be diligent and just just do it all in all or nothing the budget has to I mean as everyone often says the budget is essential learning how to say no and we're both people pleaser so that was really challenging I think especially in the beginning so yeah that's what I would say to that also it's amazing you guys oh so how does it feel fantastic it's so good it's a huge it's a huge burden

1:53:29off yes and it's just so funny because we have old cars so like Christmas came and both between the two cars we still had over thirty five hundred dollars of car repair we just did so it's like six not over you know just end so you know that that's right life is still so life is still moving yeah we made it down Nashville in eight hours yeah there you go there you go and if you get out of here in time you'll miss the snowpocalypse we will be leaving we will be going up for one time oh well you guys amazing absolutely incredible what an incredible journey you've been on and we so appreciate you sharing your story and just inspiring people right I mean because you hear 160,000 and it isn't a big number but yet people do it yeah people are on their journey so some people may be starting some people may be the very end and they're hearing this and it's the motivation they need so we are so excited so happy to celebrate you all all right so we have Nick and Renee from Chicago Illinois they paid off a hundred and sixty thousand dollars in debt in six years making one oh six to one thirty one thousand dollars a year all right you guys count it

1:54:34down let's hear your big debt free scream all right three two one we're just free love it the intensity you can feel it still it still one of my favorite parts of the show just the relief man that is very few people can do something for six years whoo it's a lot long time it's a long time it's a long time they just kept showing up and chipping away each little bit at a time oh my gosh Nick and Renee absolutely incredible absolutely incredible you

1:55:49if your holiday ham tends to last longer than your new year's resolutions then I got a fresh challenge for you make this the year you take control of your financial future with an actionable plan sound intimidating you don't have to do it alone smart vester pros are financial advisors who can walk you through what you need to know about retirement planning wealth management and anything in between find a pro near you at ramsey solutions dot com slash smart vester ramsey solutions is a paid non client promoter of participating pros learn more at ramsey solutions dot com slash smart vester our scripture of the day comes from Isaiah 263 I will keep in perfect peace those whose minds are said fast because they trust in you my angel has said you may not control all the events

1:56:52that have happened to you but you can decide not to be reduced by them that's good very empowering all right let's go to suzi in charlotte hi suzi welcome to the show hi Rachel and John I'm so excited to speak with you both I appreciate you taking my call absolutely how can we help today I'll ask my question and then I can give you a little more context if you'd like okay um my question is when we're ready to retire is it a good move for my husband and I to move money out of the stock stock market into more conservative funds within our IRA um for withdrawing that money so here's a go ahead well i was going to say um you know depending on who you talk to in the financial planning world some people go super conservative and they will you know they suggest annuities uh CDs like putting your money in but what we i mean but honestly what we who we talk to

1:57:54from the financial planning perspective and who we more tend to lean towards is leaving it in because for retirement let's say you retire at 65 you know you may sell 20 years of your life left and you would miss out on so much growth because a lot of the retirement you may not even touch the actual nest egg you'll just be actually living off of what it's making every year and you're going to make nothing in a CD or annuity like all that even though it feels safe over such a long period of time of retirement you're still going to make so much keeping it in yeah our financial advisor had said that his rule of thumb or his thought process was that you could spend about 4% of your retirement savings each year and he said that um bond markets or money markets and bonds were paying about that and that as we got closer to retirement we could move some of our investments into that right side our IRA not in not annuities or anything but leave it in the IRA just to

1:58:56yeah and a lot of and a lot of financial planners do that because it's such a conservative right like in fact i think Dave even says you could take him to 68 you know percent like so so he so i would say like if Dave Ramsey was sitting here he would be way more on the liberal side of this meaning like leave it in and you can actually probably take out more than 4% but a financial planner is going to be more on the conservative end so the fact that they said that is not shocking but i would not i would leave it in um because yeah because i mean at some point you may not even keep up with inflation you know depending on what these money market accounts they're pretty good right now um but over time we haven't always seen that rate of return and so keeping them in the markets you're going to be making so much money i mean on average you're making you know 10 to 11 percent some years i mean last year was like 20 something percent it was crazy so yeah you would miss out on so much growth pulling your money out okay that's great thank you yeah absolutely thanks for the call all right let's go to is it Angela in Dallas hi Angela welcome to the show

2:00:02hi hello hello i have a quick question yes it's all like like best friends so i'm so excited to talk to you oh my gosh oh no there are bf we're so excited talk to you okay i have a question i wanted some clarity about thinking funds so i was listening to the podcast the other day with date and kin and she had mentioned that thinking funds are intended for expenses that you cannot cover on a monthly basis or at least that's what i understood her to say and it kind of like changed my whole life so i i feel like i'm kind of a free spirit when it comes to spending but i'm also like a budget or like no one's business so i have a sinking fund for cold haircuts all changes like higher changes and Christmas but um i do find that we're kind of giving into the sinking funds on a monthly basis because we kind of need more funds and so i'm thinking i might be creating sinking funds for things i might shouldn't be and should just be

2:01:02calculating for that in my regular checking account and then um it should be like saving for things like Christmas or tar changes let me sense yes it does elaborate on that yeah no it's a great question so yeah usually sinking funds are for a specific per or the way i've looked at it and i think people can use them different ways the George Campbell probably has like 20 sinking funds let's be honest so i'm sure everyone probably tends to do it differently i don't think there's not so like a right or wrong but for me the most effective way that i think in order to keep a monthly budget and have sinking funds is that sinking funds have an end date they're it's almost more like or for me it's like a goal where i'm like okay i know Christmas is coming i need to put x amount away for Christmas or um a sinking fund for a trip coming up hey we we're gonna go to disney next summer whatever thing is let's save up a little bit at a time now what some people will do is they will roll over their amount in their budget for ongoing expenses just like close okay so like

2:02:05i don't know you get a hundred bucks for clothes a month and you're like okay i didn't spend that so i want two hundred for next month because i didn't spend it so i want to roll it over so a great way to track that is using sinking funds within the every dollar app and people will do that but that's more of a discussion of does the budget end with them when when the month is done what i would say is if you're in baby steps one through three and the month is done and you have money you have not spent i would use that cash towards debt or towards saving up for an emergency fund but if you're past baby step three then i would be okay with you rolling that over you know and using it for the next month if you want like out to eat you know your restaurants or your your clothes does that make sense okay yeah no that makes a lot it just sounds like you're using the words sinking fund for like four or five different things that's it sounds it sounds like semantics yeah i kind of feel like if i was to like create a word picture for i feel like a squirrel a little bit like i'm like tucking a little here and a little here and then i'm pulling

2:03:06from this and it's like i feel like we might not be getting the momentum that we should be getting so when she said that i was like i didn't put it my checking count and like you know go okay i know that when the season changes in April i'm going to eat clothes you know like so that's that and then i know we're going to get haircuts of this you know what i mean and so but those are budget line items the like haircut is a line item yeah and what i would challenge you is like if you if you know like when the season changes i'm going to quote unquote need clothes i would challenge you to be specific for a season i'm going to need two pair of long pants and a new jacket not i'm going to need six hundred dollars to just go to the store and see right and so if you quote unquote need clothes then be specific about what you need and then reverse engineer that like that's a sinking fine six hundred bucks so i need fifty bucks a month for the next however many months to get that number because i know i'm going to go buy and that that specificity will force you to say okay this is a budget item or this needs to go to debt or this is a sinking fund

2:04:08i want to buy a car and it's thirty thousand bucks i don't have thirty thousand extra dollars this month or any month so i have to put this much money away every month that's a sinking fund but like i need haircuts i'm gonna need glasses like those aren't sinking funds those are just budget line items okay does that help okay yes yeah thank you all yeah you're so welcome yeah and and again it's it is you know as you need right i mean yeah whatever you whatever you want to do because in the every dollar app we have the funds function in order for singing funds but also if you have the every dollar app oh if you're using desktop over to the left hand side there is actually a goals area like you can click goals and that's what i like i actually like to use that function better than sinking funds because there's for me the end date is big where i'm like okay i know this is happening now then i can to your what you say reverse engineer what i need to put away each month for that specific category but um i like what she said

2:05:11i like to think in my head like you know what um battle the bans is next year i'm gonna need a new guitar so i should probably just put a whole instrument right and then i'm gonna go walk around and i'm gonna buy a bunch there's something about saying okay one nobody needs a new guitar but i want to buy this one it's gonna cost this much dollars yeah and so if i'm gonna do this budget with integrity which i don't always do like if i'm gonna do this right i'm gonna get that dollar amount and go to the store and get that guitar and i'm gonna walk out the door totally yeah that it that it is so specific right otherwise it becomes kind of the shopping process becomes a hobby yeah and that's how i get myself back into old john trouble old john trouble yeah continues on but i like it and i don't like the whole i need two pairs of pants and pair shirt just go chop go enjoy just live live in the moment angel live in the moment it must be nice oh my gosh sure it must be nice all right well thanks to uh everyone in the booth great show john always fun

2:06:12and thank you america for listening and remember there's ultimately only one way to financial peace and that's to walk daily with the prince of peace christ jesus