Mercyful Fate - "Evil"

0:00Yamavap Resortant Casino at Sandman Well is bringing the biggest laughs to the stage. Break Taboos with Ali Wang on August 28th and 29th. Enjoy Ralph Barbosa's Dry Humor on September 18th and 19th. And don't miss Nikki Glazers on Apologetic Comedy November 19th. Tickets on sale now at Yamavap Theatre dot com. Only at Yamavap Resortant Casino celebrating its 40th anniversary. You in must be 21 to enter. At Zock Doc, we know you care about your health. You wouldn't do that early morning cardio if you didn't. So the fact that your annual physical is overdue just shows how hard it can be to get seen by a doctor. Sorry, that doctor's not a network. Press one for more options. You've reached us outside your whole business hours. The next availability is in three months. But Zock Doc makes finding the right doctor easy. Download the app and search by specialty, insurance, and availability. Read real patient reviews. Then book instantly. Zock Doc, ready to be seen.

1:00Did you know that mosquitoes have killed almost half of all people who have ever lived? Today, people are fighting back. With support from the Gates Foundation, American scientists and partners around the world have developed a new generation of bed nets that can kill up to 90% of mosquitoes exposed to them, helping cut malaria rates in half. The result? A safer, healthier future for everyone. The Gates Foundation, partners of human potential. Search Gatesfoundation.org slash mosquito to learn more. Hey! Hey! Hey! 100% of the time, help me answer!

2:09100% of the time, help me answer! 100% of the time, help me answer! Welcome to 100 Songs that Define Heavy Metal. I'm your host Brian Slagel, I'm the CEO of Metal Blade Records. The next time you're in Las Vegas, or if you currently live in Las Vegas, or the Las Vegas area, you need to visit the Metal Blade Museum. Not only are there artifacts from Metal Blade artists like Metallica, Slayer, Cannibal Corpse, Guar, Lizzy Borden, there's also artifacts from bands that we had something to do with, as well, like Guns and Roses, Megadeff, Alice and Chains, Deep Purple, Thin Lizzy, Alice Cooper, all sorts of stuff. It's a really great Metal Museum.

3:11It's located right near the strip in Las Vegas. Also our retail store is also now in the museum, so you can go pick up your Metal Blade vinyl, CDs, collectables, shirts, all sorts of cool stuff. Just go to metalblade.com slash museum for all the details. Very excited by this episode, it's an artist that is currently on Metal Blade and has been on Metal Blade for a long time and they're their entire catalog is available via Metal Blade. One of the most influential bands in Metal of All Time ask anybody that knows something and they will mention to you that Merceville Fade, of course, anything that comes from post Merceville Fade when they came out in the late 70s, early 80s. Everybody, Metallica Slayer, you name it, all massively influenced by Merceville Fade. It's going to be fun to talk about them, talking about some of the early stuff this time, and it's going to be a fun episode. We've always got our friend Mark Lois who's always fun to talk to about the production, and then my good buddy who's also a massive fan of this band and has a connection to this specific song, Kerry King, so it's me, fun to talk to him, but let's begin it all.

4:12All right, love it. Merceville Fade Evil 445, the first track on any Merceville Fade album. This is on Melissa. They follow it up with Don't Break the Oath, Kingo Solo. They come back later. By the way, I can still supply my Merceville Fade book, Dangerous Meeting at martinpopoff.com. There's easy PayPal buttons there. I signed them, send them out from the office. So yeah, my Merceville Fade books, to go on through a couple incarnations. It's also available in about four or five languages in Europe, including Russia. In Russian. But anyways, love Merceville Fade. Just a really cool catalog. The King catalog is awesome as well. But first track on any Merceville Fade album, like I say, this album comes out October, 1983. It was recorded July 18th to 29th, 1983 at Easy Sound and Copen Hegan. I remember getting this album, and I remember thinking this is the first album that sounded like they had sold their soul to the devil to be this amazing for a baby band, a baby band, no less from Denmark. So I remember feeling the exact same sentiments I felt when I heard sad wings of destiny,

5:15that there's a baby band that no one's ever heard of with no money has no business being this good right away on their on their first album. Of course, sad wings was a pre second album. But yeah, so this album just sounded and then you get the, you know, unearthly Howell of King Diamond with his various, you know, gears, but mainly his falsetto, which is a love that are hated kind of thing. What I love about this song is it's almost a microcosm, you know, Satan's Fall at 11 minutes gets all the sort of credit on the album for being, oh, no riffs repeated kind of thing. It's just all over the place all the time. It's just a masterpiece of complexity. This song is a masterpiece of complexity at 445. What's incredible about this is the very, very best part of the song, the whole music and accompanying it and, you know, accompanied by the memorable lyric, I was born in the cemetery. That whole thing there, which sounds like the verse is like, okay, we found the verse. Never returns. We get like there's one brief little thing at the beginning and it never, ever, ever comes back, which is hilarious.

6:16And yeah, this song just grows in variation and intention as it moves on. We've even got a like a melodic chordal part in there. You got some cool twin leads later, but very steely of production. The production, this album is great period. But you've got that bass guitar part, like just going along and then the chords stabbing in. And double bass part pretty much to the end. So at the end, it's kind of a thrash song and you don't think it's going to be that at the beginning. It sounds like just this amazing groovy song, probably going to be the groovyest song they ever did. I kind of wish it would have had my favorite part three or four times, but yeah, it's got one verse to this song. It's basically it. King Diamond of Vocals, of course, guitars. We've got Hank Sherman and the great Michael Danner on guitars. Timmy Hansen on bass, Kim Rosundrums. It's kind of the classic lineup, so to speak. And an amazing, amazing record. But what a way to open up the career. Obviously, we have the nuns have no fun. EP before this, but this is the first full length album. Came out on Roadrunner and like I said, they only made the two and then King

7:17Go Solo and then they come back later on. And thanks to Metal Blade for a lot of that music. Pretty much all of it later on. So that's really cool that Brian had a great, great hand in putting all of that stuff together. But yeah, what an absolute barnstormer of a classic debut. Creepy as all hell. Evil as all hell. It's got King Diamond with his early days corpse paint on there as well, which is, you know, he looked absolutely incredible. Yeah, this album just freaked us out as kids. But like I say, one of the main reasons it freaked us out is highly, highly, highly, professional sounding. So there you go. Great choice. Merciful fate, evil. Thanks for the shout out, Martin. Appreciate that. As always, well, almost always, I won't say always, but he's he's spot on with his description of these songs and interesting history and, and yeah, it's always interesting to hear different people's perspectives on different songs and, you know, Martin, being maybe the most knowledgeable metal guy that I know. I mean, he's written all those books and he's written a book on Merciful Fate as well. So a lot of good stuff there. Thanks again, Martin.

8:27One of five winners of a Rolex watch. Plus, all winners will advance to the finale at Palm's Casino Resort Las Vegas for a chance to take home a rarity. The second Mustang Dark Horse ever produced on September 26th. Two properties. Six winners. Only at Yamaha Resort and Casino. Your California to Vegas connection. Details at Yamaha.com must be 21 or older to enter participate. Please gamble responsibly. There is so much NFL on ESPN right now. Monday night football. Plus pregame and postgame. NFL live. NFL prime time. Everything you need to stay on top of every game every week. Unbelievable. And now NFL Network is on the ESPN app. More football. More coverage. More ways to watch. Football's on. All season long on ESPN and streaming on the ESPN app. At ZockDock, we know you care about your health. You wouldn't do that early morning cardio if you didn't. So the fact that your annual physical is overdue just shows how hard it can be to get seen by a doctor.

9:29Sorry, that doctor's not in network. Press one for more options. You've reached us outside your whole business hours. The next availability is in three months. But ZockDock makes finding the right doctor easy. Download the app and search by specialty, insurance, and availability. Read real patient reviews. Then book instantly. ZockDock. Ready to be seen. All right, we welcome back again to the show. You know him well. He's produced hundreds and hundreds of records. So he knows what he's talking about when talking about production and engineering. The great Mr. Mark Lewis. How are you, sir? Thanks for having me, dude. Always, always good to have you. And a fun record to talk about. One of the most influential albums. Heavy Metal albums of all time probably. Merciful Fiction. And of course, we're talking about the opening track, Evil, which is amazing. And it's an interesting album production wise because as influential as it is, it's a good sounding record. But it was produced by this guy, Hendrik Lahn, who's never produced a metal band before. And the band guided him through it. So it doesn't have that classic sound, but it still works.

10:29I love how it sounds. Honestly, I think it's a bit more timeless than some of the other stuff for me. You know, we've talked about the big gated reverb thing. And the 80s daided reverb sound. And it's a pretty dry record, especially for that time. You know, like even Finn Lizzy was on that over reverb. Be kind of cloudy thing, you know, with thunder and lightning. I think it was Kimball also came out in 83. And I hate the way that that 10 Lizzy record sounds, even though I love the songs. And this one doesn't really have that epidemic of reverb to it, which I really like. And I think it's super clear. I wouldn't, it's not super wady. It's not a very wady production, but man, it's like it's so clear and good. And I think it's an achievement, especially for the time. Well, yeah, and as always, you know, bands who sound good live will always sound good in the studio. And that's clearly the case with Marcel Fait, you know, seeing them. I can't really ever ever ask these guys this, but it sounds to me. And you know, you will no matter the life. It sounds like they're using fenders to play the rhythm guitars on this record.

11:30Is that sound right? Because they used to do like the earlier demo stuff with much heavier, because they were playing the flying V's and stuff. But this seems to me to have that tone of fender. I know, I know Hank played a lot of fender back then too. It very well could be, you mean a bit more of a clacky attack instead of like the aggressive thing to it? It's just not as run she may be, but it does, but it does make it like, clearer, I guess. Yeah, I mean, it could be a fender. I'm sure that they use humbuckers, you know, humbucking pickups, you know, because I just, they would never get that, that sort of sound out of single coils. It's more of a richy black, more in-veh thing. It's kind of like unmistakable, but they could be using strats with humbuckers. Because I mean, I do hear it. It's not particularly saturated crunchy, you know, because by that time it was, you know, kill them all, you know, and stuff like that existed, you know, with that really over-the-top crunch. And this is definitely more of a mild older generation guitar sound too. Yeah, and in comparison to, you know, the demos and the stuff they recorded before, which you know, are on those, the beginning album and all that sort of stuff is,

12:30that, I mean, that stuff's like super crunchy and heavy. So that to me feels like they're using, you know, the classic Gibson's through 100-Watt Marshall lamps and all that stuff. Sounds a little bit different to me, which is interesting, but I think it also might have been the fact that they're working with a producer that never produced a metal band before. So yeah, it just gives a different vibe, I think, too. Yeah, he could have urged him to turn the gain down a little too much, you know, it's got guys like that, especially if they're not familiar. It's like, oh, this is, you know, it's going to cover up too much. We need more clarity, and people will do that by turning back the gain, or making people use a guitar that has a bit more of a percussiveness to it, instead of like a real saturation on the top end. Yeah, and I know there's been a whole lot of versions of all these early MRSOL records, different masterings and different versions of them, and when we, you know, we bought all the catalogs, so we owned it again, and we had to kind of re-put it up on all those streaming services as ours, and we were talking to King, like, you know, which versions do you want? Because I think there's like probably two or three different versions of these things, and he said, I want the original versions, the original sound,

13:32when it first came out, I don't want any of the remasters or any of that, just that. So we're like, all right, well, that's what you want, and Hank was all for it too, and that's what we'll do, and that's what's currently out there on the streaming stuff, you know, Apple Music and Spotify, it's just basically the original album, the way it was intended, I guess. Yeah, that's awesome. So you guys had the master tapes? Yeah, we have everything. We have all the master tapes, all the reels, everything that was in existence on them, we have all of that stuff, and that's why we're able to kind of put it up however, and we have multiple versions of them too, like I said, the remasterings, and all that, we have all that stuff. It's a lot of tape to go through, but we got all of them. That's really cool. I mean, did some of that stuff, did Monty have hand in some of the later ones? Was it like, was there Road Runner crossover and some of that stuff? Yeah, absolutely. I mean, they were signed to Road Runner. Eventually, Road Runner was doing different versions of things, but King was definitely, and we did the same thing pretty much with the King Diamond solo band too, is, you know, he wanted the original stuff, no remasterings, none of that. So he's interesting, because I haven't listened to that record for a minute,

14:33and the last few times I had, I was listening to one of the remaster versions of it. So going back to, again, do my research for this, which, you know, I do research, believe it or not, sometimes, to go back and listen to it again, especially in headphones, was like, oh, okay, I remember this being like the original, original version. Yeah, no, that's really cool. Yeah, I mean, I like how it sounds. I do. Yeah, I mean, it's not as like, Viby is the demo, I guess, but it's really, yeah, it's got a clarity that I really like, and it's just a really, I really respect the mix and the clarity of it. It's like, ah, you know, this was captured really well. It sounds, it's just got a thing. I kind of can like almost put, you know, certain productions, like I can almost associate them with colors and stuff, and like, I feel like that. Like, it's cool, like when a record kind of matches the colors of the cover, like it's a dark aesthetic to the record, you know, but it's very clear, and like, it's the cover really suits the music to me, and you know what I mean? Yeah, whatever it's like, look, I think it sounds great, especially for a independent record, especially for a bands, you know, first real, real record. And the one thing that they did get,

15:37and I know even the band has talked about this is, King's vocals are incredible on this record. Yeah, I like them. I mean, I would consider them maybe a little less theatrical in some ways on this record, and I don't mean theatrical in a bad way. I mean, he obviously went full bore in the King Diamond era, whereas this is just kind of like, there's something about maybe it was the way it was tracked. Maybe it was the mic. Maybe it was just where King's voice was at the time, but yeah, I love this record. And there's just like so many riffs. I mean, it's crazy. And this was the beginning. I mean, they were really the ones that this is like setting the table for all the extreme music that came after, whether it was the big four, the thrash metal stuff, the black metal stuff, and kind of everything in the heavier world kind of emanated from, really, from this band and these first two records. And you can't talk to anybody in any metal band of any recourse that doesn't go back. And basically worshiped merciful fate and what they did and how well they did it. Yeah, I don't understand how they're not bigger. I mean, I don't know if it's a business thing or if it's really just a population opinion thing or what, but it's

16:40something to me they're right up there with Sabbath. You know, like they they were the next. You know, and I'm not cutting out priests because I mean, but priests to me really started as a rock band. And that's not a discount or a knock at all. But you know, like Sabbath was like just so influential. And then merciful fate was like they just took that. It's almost like they cross Sabbath and deep purple. But like, I don't know how to describe it. I mean, they took that that style of riffing, especially having melody to the riffs. You know, they were just such a big thing, you know, where, you know, Tony's all about size and these big riffs and things like that. But Tony wasn't always writing these things. You know, it's like at the gates, like it's just to me, like they so, they seem so influenced by merciful fate. You know, you kind of get I would have guitar player friends that would say, oh, you know, like at the gates is just

17:40in vain on the low strings, you know, because it's so scalar and it's so it's so it's so by the book, like they follow the scales. There's not really a lot of chromatic notes. But merciful fate, like really had a lot of melody on the low strings, but they still had that cool chromatic thing. They had a, you know, like that slayer really capitalized on. It's so influential. Well, that's why we had Kerry King talking about this song because he's such a massive fan and such a huge influence on them. I think what they did was they took all the, I mean, I know all their influences and, you know, clearly, like you mentioned, you know, Sabbath and purple and, you know, you're right, he's another big one and especially for King and, you know, they all love all those all that 70 stuff, but they just took all of that and kind of jumbled together and gave it a fresh look. And that's what kind of set the table for all the extreme stuff because there's some fast stuff and some different stuff and different types of riffs and just things that nobody really at that point had really done before. And that's, I think, why I was such a unique thing. I remember when I first heard the, the EP, I was like, whoa, what is this? This is something I've never heard before.

18:45Not just not vocally. Yeah, I agree. I mean, it's, it's, it always comes down to one or two guys, you know, like Eomi and then I don't know if Hank or if Sherman and Denner were writing equally in those early days. I feel like it was maybe more Hank. I don't know. Definitely more Hank. It's always a lot of those songs are credited to Hank and King. So that's more so Hank, but Michael definitely had a big part of it too, of course. Yeah. Yeah. And, and my point is, is like, you have these guys that have this very characteristic note choice, you know, like Tony's instantly recognizable, you know, then you have Hetfield, you have Mistaine, and you have Kerry and Jeff and they, they just don't miss. Like they have this thing, they each have their own instantly recognizable thing, but they, you can almost like after a while, like you could get AI on it to be able to kind of predict where these guys are going to go, but that's what makes them so special is because they have this thing that makes their riffs and their note choice so perfect and so

19:47influential. And then you have other bands that kind of emulate it, you know, and, and they're all really good. There might be some great songs, but like those guys that I mentioned are kind of like the ones that really just took this riffing to another level and were so influential. And it just really comes down to how your, how different brains work, you know, to, I mean, I'm way off the production topic now, but it's just part of why they're so influential, you know, like, like, like, like, like, like, you look at them, like they, they're kind of like slayer with a bit more of the blues note mixed in, you know, and, and, and you know, it's them, like, you hear, you can, you're a couple notes and you're like, oh, this is art, I know this is lamb a god. I already know this is slayer. I already know this is merciful fate. It's so critical and so cool, you know, like, as a guitar player to hear that stuff and like, that's what makes them who they are. Yeah, 100%. Yeah, it's, it's interesting. It's hard for me to really kind of understand on, on any sort of logical level because I don't play an instrument, but I always been fascinated by all of these bands, all of the bands you mentioned, specifically, the merciful fate, where you can

20:48take all these influences that, you know, same influences as I have for the most part pretty much, obviously, the more European skewed because they're European, but how you, how you take all that stuff in your brain and then this music comes out of it. It's pretty amazing how you can do that. And then on top of that, which is, I think, the other impressive thing about this record is to get that captured in the studio, you know, with a band that, you know, they recorded some demos and some EPs and stuff before that, but they had never really made a full record with a guy that had never worked in a metal band before and how you could magically make it all appear in work is, I think, it's almost going to my mind or miracle sometimes. I totally agree. I mean, to have these bands come together the way they did and obviously everybody has access to publishing their own music now, but back then it was like it really took something special to, to get the bands together and to rehearse and to make these ideas come to life was a lot more work, you know, and a lot more things had to align. Everybody had to show up, you know, there was no drug programming and base programming

21:52and all that shit back then. So it is a miracle. I agree. Yeah, it's one of those, you know, things that happened and then, I mean, I knew that we're going to, it was going to be good because I guess that I was a huge fan of the EP and even the earlier demos too, they put out we're all really great, but I don't think I was prepared as much for, you know, just how, what a wow factor the record was for me and then it's just interesting over the years, we're just talking to people and seeing how much of a massive influence there were like a quick example was I went to go see Metallica play the Osteress, I think it was like 89 and they were in Frisco, Texas, which is where King lived. So they had King come up and do their Marshall Faith Medley with him, which was amazing. I was lucky enough, they let me go in on the rehearsal beforehand and they were like rehearsing and doing that and then kind of when rehearsal ended, Kirk was just in there kind of messing around and he was just playing, I don't know, 15 different Marshall Faith riffs and I go, well, I had no idea you were such a big fan of Marshall Faith. I knew you liked him. He said, oh, no, man, one of the biggest influence

22:52of it, he went off on a five minutes hallelujah about how important they were. I knew James and Lentz obviously Lars were massive fans, but I didn't realize how, how much of a fan Kirk was, even before he got into Metallica. Yeah, yeah, no, it's kind of undeniable, I think, you know, influence on them and it's awesome. I mean, I love that. And to get on the Metallica thing, like I always hear the Marshall Faith Medley and I'm like, I wish he would have just covered the whole fucking album, like just make that Grav's day three or whatever or four at this point. They do it so well and it's just like, I just so many riffs on that album, you know, I like the best cover band ever. Yeah, yeah, they are the best cover band ever. And it's really cool to see how they how they treated the whole thing. But yeah, like what an undertaking too. I wonder how long it took him to stream that 10 minutes together however long that is. They're pretty good at that's kind of what they do. They did the same thing when they did the the Ron ETO, you know, Rainbow one too, which is all equally as brilliant. Yeah, which I don't think it's enough love is kind of kind of buried compared to the Marshall Faith one, you know.

23:55Little bit a little bit because it's like a the B side to Hardware and pretty much it wasn't on like a full album. It's still great. But well, we could talk about this record all day long, but we do have time constraints here. So as always, thank you so much for doing this. And I'm sure we'll squeeze you in. We're getting to the end of the podcast, but we'll probably squeeze you in hopefully one more time to talk about something. Wow, getting to get in the number 100. I would you I'd love to be there, man. Yeah, yeah. We'll make it happen. All right, dude. Thanks again. Thanks. Hey, everyone, Brian Slagel here, founder of Metal Blade Records. You know, I spent my whole entire life trying to make metal history and make metal better and promote metal as much as I can. And now there's a brand new way for you to test your metal knowledge and relive those iconic moments. It's called Metal Mondays, the official metal trivia game from Metal Blade and Pantheon media. And it's free to play right now every Monday, a new game drops from Slayer, supremacy, death metal 101, 80s metal blade classics and tons more. You'll battle it out on the leaderboards when killer prizes and even score some exclusive metal blade merch. So if you think you know your

25:00riffs, your legends and your deep cuts, prove it. Download hit replay on the app store or Google play or head to metal blade records dot com slash metal Mondays and start playing today because in metal, there's no off days only metal Mondays, metal Mondays play loud, play true and play to win. ZockDock At ZockDock, we know you care about your health. You wouldn't do that early morning cardio if you didn't. So the fact that your annual physical is overdue just shows how hard it can be to get seen by a doctor.

26:03Sorry, that doctor's not a network. Press one for more options. You've reached us outside the next availability is in three months. But ZockDock makes finding the right doctor easy. Download the app and search by specialty insurance and availability. Read real patient reviews. Then book instantly. ZockDock, ready to be seen. Did you know that mosquitoes have killed almost half of all people who have ever lived? Today, people are fighting back. With support from the Gates Foundation, American scientists and partners around the world have developed a new generation of bed nets that can kill up to 90% of mosquitoes exposed to them, helping cut malaria rates in half. The result, a safer, healthier future for everyone. The Gates Foundation, partners of human potential, search gatesfoundation.org slash mosquito to learn more. All right, this man really needs no introduction, but I'm going to give him one anyway. You know him as the guitar player, main songwriter for the legendary band Slayer, he currently has a new group out

27:03with one incredible album under the name of Kerry King and he's got a new one on the way as well. Of course, it's my good friend Mr. Kerry King. How are you, sir? I'm good man, Harry. I'm good. I'm good. I'm always good when I get to talk to you and again to talk to you about merciful fate, which we're talking evil today. Mercil fate, one of the most influential bands of all time, everybody from, you know, you guys to Metallica, anybody that came after the early 80s, sites them as a big influence. When did merciful fate first come across your landscape? Well, back then, and let me address it. Yeah, you and I usually see each other a lot more than this, but I haven't been to Vegas in the fucking long time. I haven't been in New York either. So my problem, I fall too, but yeah, it's been a minute, but you know, we got football season coming up, so I will see you for the home opener. Yes, sir. Mercil fate and back to that. It would have been it's so funny to talk about this because you're my age. Yeah. And people today, you know, they're like, if I can download it, what the fuck? And for us, it was like, well, let's go to the

28:05mom and pop store, see what came in from Europe and just roll the dice really. And that's what I did with merciful fate. Yeah, the EP. I don't even know what the EP was called, but I got the EP. I think it's been different to titles. I want to say that it ended up being called NUNS can be that had that had C-O-N-T. I can't remember the other two. It's been a long time. It's I heard that. Yeah, do them by the living dead maybe some like that, but yeah, the legendary EP I Jeff would do that. You know, we would kind of take turns on buying this week or buying next week because you know, we didn't have any money and records weren't expensive, but we had no money. Where did you get where did you get it at? Did you get it at what's it says back then? Where did you go to get it? Man, the mom and pop was not Likers Pizza, but Likers Pizza was somewhat near me. And I can't remember the mom and pop back then. It might have been Zips. You know, yes, since you mentioned that, I'm like, man, it might have been Zip. That's because I'm trying to think back then there weren't too many places that had that stuff. I know Zets did. And I still got all my vinyl from, I don't know, the first five, ten years or career and all the

29:10ones I bought, good or bad. And yeah, I got some stinkers, but you know, Merceville Fade was definitely not one of them. No, no, it was amazing. My favorite Merceville Fade memory, though, was the first time I went to England, which was 1982. I went over there and I was, you know, I was with my buddy John Cornerex and we were running around going to meet all these people we had poor pen pals with and, you know, I'm going up to neat records and all these different places. And one of my buddies gave me the Merceville Fade demo. It's like four songs. And we got to London and we ran out of money because we bought so many records. So we stayed at like a bed and breakfast basically. And there's nothing in that room. There's no TV and no nothing, but we did have a portable tape recorder. The only tape we have was the Merceville Fade demo. I just listened to it over and over again. But it's so heavy. It's like so unbelievably heavy. And then it goes into your point and your story. London, even to this day, it ain't cheap. So yeah, you had no money. And we didn't have any credit cards. I think I think I had to borrow like like 15 bucks from one of my friends. I just be able to eat the last few days, but it was a fun trip. And man, that demo tape, like I said,

30:13we just the last few days were there. We just pretty much just listened to that over and over again. It was just so incredible. And then of course, you know, they got signed and they put out Melissa. And you know, I guess, you know, evil, I picked evil because that's pretty much the main track that they're known for. And I wanted to talk to you about it because, well, let's first talk about the song and what your thoughts are on the song. And then I'll bring up your connection to that song. Melissa is just a magical record for me, evil being part of it, of course. But when you put that on, it's one of those ones like for me, I can't play a song. I gotta play a top to bottom. And when you get to Melissa, it's just like, I know we're not talking about Melissa, but I have to. Yeah, please. When you get to that, and in the intro, I've never heard a sadder passage in metal in my life, just the intro, it's so sad. And the lead comes in and it's so fucking sad. It's like nothing I've heard to this day given I haven't heard everything. I'm not attempting to say I had, but what Melissa's God, there's so much vibe in the beginning of that song.

31:15Anyway, that's my Melissa bit, but evil, evil is, that's a great song. Then yes, I have history with that. But even before I had history with it, I loved it. And like if I'm driving, I live in New York now, so I have a car anymore, but when I go to the West Coast to rehearse or record whatever, and I'm on serious, and any martial fade song comes up, I just, I can't leave the car until it's over. I love it. Yeah, the interesting thing about Melissa's fate to me was, I think, you know, when you kind of break it down a little bit, what they did, at least in my opinion, what they did was they were one of the first bands to really take like all that 70s metal, the priest, and the Sabbath, and deep from all that sort of stuff. And they rolled it into something, but rolled it into something that became much heavier and much like you said, much darker and more evil, like the song says. And they were kind of the first man I remember, they kind of put all of those things all into one. And you know, some of that stuff, even like the evil, I mean, that's when you look at when it came out, that song is super heavy. That entire record, dude, you know, and do you have the year on that?

32:17I don't have it. I know it's early 80s. I think it was 81, I do believe. Because I remember when the martial fade had its influence on me and Jeff was on Hello Wates. Then that was 84. So we did our first album, you know, influenced by priest and maiden and Sabbath. And then you definitely hear the difference going into Hello Wates because me and Jeff were super influenced by Marisal Fate, hence the super long song for Slayer, which are very rare as you will. Yeah, we had what seven seven songs on that album. And that's all, you know, Marisal Fate influence, you know, we're jamming as many riffs into a song as we could. Not that they did, it just I don't know, tell me and Jeff interpreted it, but yeah, that's how that was. Yeah, they didn't really do a whole lot of super long. So it's the, but you know, the second version, the Mach 2 version, if you will, when they saw in the metal plate, they did a bit longer stuff, but the first couple of records, nothing was like super, super long because I know you're not up.

33:18You're not a big fan of the epics. I'm not an epictune. Every guitar play seems like from that time period. That was a massive, massive, fat, a merciful fate. Is there something special those guys were doing that was different in the guitar play? Well, there was two guitars and, you know, for all Tony I only is godliness and awesomeness, you know, two guitar players can make more sounds. And yeah, Tony overdubbed himself. I get it. For me, that's not reproducible live unless you, I don't even know if you had pedals, you could do that back then. You do now, but you know, the, the the merciful fate dudes are the harmonic minor. They were heavy in the harmonic minor and make no mistake. I don't know guitar terms. I can just play. So if I say something incorrect, sorry, but the way they approach their riding and it just had an edgyness that I can't describe. I don't mean edgy in a fast way. I mean, the way they approach their leads was edgy and kind of unique to the time, I think. Obviously, very unique to the time. You go back now. That's, you know, kind of the,

34:20I talked a lot about on this podcast about how, you know, we talked about a lot of the earlier stuff because that's really the foundation of metal. And this is now we're talking about the, the real heavy metal started coming in in the early 80s with, you know, merciful fate. And of course, you guys and everybody else that came after that. But merciful fate was one of the early ones that kind of created that, that sound, that tone, that aura, the whole thing that was just a little bit different than, you know, what, what priest was doing, for example. And King, Love and Marhidem, he's unique. And my whole thing about any band that's remotely popular, if you don't have a singer that's unique and, you know, it's not about him charisma, you know, for instance, I think the uniqueness is more important because you don't have to be a virtue also to get the respect of the masses. You got to be unique and believe in what you're doing. And King was definitely all that. Yeah, definitely very much so on, on many different levels. So your involvement with evil was, so you guys were doing one of the mayhem tours and it was Slayer was headlining and King Diamond was opening up. And I remember I was, I forget what show was early in the tour and I

35:26was out hanging all you guys and I was talking with King and Andy. I said, Hey, because they do, they were playing evil every night. I said, Hey, would you guys, would you guys like it or mind if Carrie King maybe played up and played a lead or did something like, Oh my God, that'd be amazing. So I went to you and said, Hey, these guys wouldn't mind if you wanted to do that. If you're up to it, you said absolutely. So I go, Okay, cool. Well, you guys get together and figure it out. So that's not exactly what I said. Well, I'm paraphrasing it was, it was a years ago. I'm always of the opinion and, you know, I don't think of myself and, you know, a lot of people don't either. I don't think of myself as an up there at your long guitar player. You know, I'm like, you got Andy LaRocque, what do you need me? It's like when guy in Tantara asked me to do a lead, I'm like, you don't need me to play a fucking lead dime. You're doing it. But, you know, there's, there's something about me playing on it, which I don't realize. And then I remember you bringing that up. I'm like, well, why does King want me to play, you know, he's got Andy and the other guy. I didn't even know the other guy's name back then. I remember who it is, but at that point, I didn't like, like weed. Yeah. I'm like, you guys got it. You don't need me. And I asked

36:30you, why does King want me? And I think he said, so I'm like, well, it's a cool idea. I'm like, huh. I never thought of it like that. But yeah, it is a cool idea. And then they never brought it up to me. And I never brought it up to them. Because I didn't think it was my deal to bring it up to them. So it just sat for weeks. I think it was because, you know, like you said, it wasn't really your deal to talk about it. And King was into it. But King, oddly enough, you would not ever think that King's a fairly shy guy sometimes. And he's such a huge slayer fan, such a huge fan of yours. He didn't want to bother you or anything about that. So so I come back four, five weeks later and I go, Hey, you guys doing that thing? And you're like, no, I'm like, no, let's get everything together here and make this thing happen. And then it didn't. And it was, and it was phenomenal. It was like so, so great. The fans loved it. The band loved it after that first night. Like, I think both you guys are texting me separately. Like that was really fun. And King was just like, we were so honored to have Kerry do that. So, uh, so that was really fun to have a little moment there with you playing, uh, playing evil with King Diamond. Well, I wound up doing it eight times. And everyone got better. Yeah. You know, I'm not going to say I fucked it up, but I played it

37:34less than perfect. Then every day got better. And the last day the eighth show was in Dallas. It was in King's hometown. And I went up there and I crushed that motherfucker. And I felt so fucking rad that I did that for him in his home city that, you know, it was awesome. Yeah. It was a lot of fun. That was then, like I said, both sides were really into it. And I, I, so, so funny for me, because I don't, I can't play an instrument, but I do know when something's good or bad. And I think I saw you do that. That maybe three or four of the times I can't remember, but, uh, but I always thought it was great. So, but I know as guitar players and musicians, there was like, oh, I missed one note. I didn't play it perfectly. And I think 90% of the fans could care less, but, but I get it. Yeah, especially the man, you know, they've had a few cool aids before then. Yes. And the funny thing about evil dude when I was getting it down, you know, and I went with Andy and I'm like, okay, I've known this forever. I know this riff and the riff that I thought I knew forever was incorrect. Yeah, that, that happens a lot. So, this is how you play it. I'm like, how do you know that's how you play it? He's like, well, that's how Hank

38:35showed me. I'm like, motherfucker. In a million years, I would not have picked it out like that. Same thing happened when, uh, you know, Metallic that 30th anniversary thing, they had all the bestful fake guys come up and they're going to play that medley and they were rehearsing it. And the way James is playing one part was wrong. And Hank was like, you're, I've been it the same way I played. Yeah, he said you're playing that wrong. And he's like, what, he's like, what? No, he said you play it this way. And James, like, oh, should you probably write it? Probably was to say, I bet you, I bet you. I'm pretty sure it was because I mean, honestly, I mean, as somebody writes something, yes, I played it wrong, but it's tough because there's so many ways to play the same thing on the guitar. But I, I wound up playing it right. I, I, I didn't winging on what I thought it was. I played it right. And exactly. And it's your interpretation of it. And they, they, like I said, that last Dallas show, which I have video of is sick as fuck. Yeah, that was a great, that was a fun, that was a great show at a fun night too for, for sure. That was awesome. So you've got Kerry King, the first album, which is incredible. Absolutely love it. I know you're working on album number two, which I know you're excited about. Of course, I'm excited

39:38about it. There's so many, so many fun things going around about this record in my camp. Yeah, Josh Wilbur's doing it again. And my publicist would knock me the fuck out if I gave up too much, but just tease it just a little bit. I think it's a wonderful extension of the first album. I think everyone that's been a fan of mine throughout history is going to like it entirely. The intro to me is one of the best intros I ever made up. So I'm looking forward to hearing what people say about it once it comes out. So slam down, it's fucking crushing. Nice. Yeah, the first one was was truly a non-believer record. I still listen to it today. In fact, I have this ritual now. I know I'm not nervous when I fly. I've never noticed about every other aspect of flying these days, including being delayed, which is every flight amount. But I have trouble with my ears sometimes. So I always listen to the first three songs there. And then once I'm in the then my ears are fine. I figured that Kerry is not going to let my ears get fucked up. So you're helping me, you're helping me get through that on flights.

40:42But yeah, I still love that record. I still listen to it all the time. It's super cool. And by the way, thank you personally for playing the two shows at the forum because I've yet to see Slayer on the on the net on these newer shows because you're only playing gigantic arenas and festivals. And I hate those. I'm happy there's a forum. There are two forum gigs now. Well, the funny thing about that is because there's two forum shows I have to learn more songs. Oh, yeah. So for us me the last because my band played their only show July 4th of the year. So since then, I've just been, you know, diving into rain and blood and it's been a minute since I played some of these songs and speed wise, 22 year old king. Yeah, we're going to play it close, but ain't going to be money. Yeah, no, that's that that's the way it is for everything. I mean, any of these older metal bands you listen to the way they play it out still sounds amazing, but you listen to something older. Dude, raining rain is inhumanly fast. Yes. I'm playing to it. I'm going,

41:44what the fuck, man? Yeah, that was, I mean, that's why it's such a legendary record. Reviews it some of the early stuff, too, please. That's just my request. I'm pretty well, dude, when you when you get married to a record, it really throws a wrench into to the set. So I'm like, man, I have to at least dedicate a half hour to rain and blood, which isn't much for an album, but still it Greeks have it on your set. Well, you've got the longer set. So you can throw in a couple of couple of fun ones. Well, you know, I'm doing my best. I think I've landed on what will be playing for everything except the second forum show, which I have to rehearse other songs for that and I got to figure out what it is and make the set make sense with different songs in it. So, you know, luckily my band isn't playing this year. So I can dedicate all my thoughts into what Slayer's doing for the 40th anniversary. Good. That's that'll be fun. I'm definitely looking forward to that. I was going to ask you so Melissa is your of the of the early, merciful fate stuff because that's really, you know, as much as I love all the secondary stuff,

42:45the early stuff is clearly the best and most legendary. So Melissa, over, don't break the oath for you. Without question. Oh, without question. That's a very definite answer. And I ain't let me tell you one of my favorite songs is Gypsy. Interesting. Why so much more Melissa than don't break the oath? It's just a vibe of the album. One's not better than the other one to me, but Melissa just the vibe of I don't know. Maybe it's the first time I heard them in an entire album situation. Then I mean, the songwriting and performance is just sick as fuck. I mean, don't break the oaths. It's killer too, but for me, Melissa's a little bit better. Yeah, I lean a little bit that way too. I love both records, but I also like some of the earlier stuff, some of the stuff before live. I do them by the living dead and one of my favorite merciful fate songs. I've begged King to play this over the years, but he'll never play it because number one, it's long to song burning the cross, which I absolutely love. But don't ever play it because it's the only song that King and Hank or Michael didn't write. It was written by

43:46somebody that I think was guitar playing the band for like a brief minute. It's on the earlier, all those earlier, uh, merciful fate records that, you know, the beginning or whatever they're called. Yeah, that's not burning the cross. It's great. It's you might not like it. It's like eight and a half minutes long. So it might be too long for you, but it's such a heavy song, but yeah, they'll never play it live unfortunately. But yeah, I think, I think I definitely lean, lean towards Melissa, but it's interesting because you talked to different people like we had Elliot Fullamon, who's, as you know, is in Terrafire, which you were the one you and I showed, well, the ones that first turned me on to that movie, but Elliot's in Terrafire 2 and Terrafire 3. So I hand him on, and we talked about that record because, you know, obviously he's a much, much younger than we are, but that was by far his favorite record. And he was really like, we have to talk about that, this record. And I'm sorry, okay, let's find with me. I'm always down for that. Yeah, he was firmly in the dope break the oath camp. But I think, as I've noticed in talking, there's nothing wrong with that camp. Yeah, I agree. There is no wrong answer. Yeah, it's just on my camp. I mean, that being said, that's a stupid thing to say because yes, I love dope break the oath, but

44:50if I had to pick one, it's Melissa. Yeah, I didn't want to mention because I was debating about, you know, I wanted to talk to you about this and also we're going to talk about about some, the, so we're in the last 10 of versions of this podcast. So to, uh, still let people know the second to last podcast is going to be a rainbow stargaze or like the black, which you're a big fan of. I remember seeing, uh, one is, I don't know what it was. One of those viral videos that goes on took talking to everything else where they asked somebody, okay, this album versus this album, and they asked you a whole bunch of records and rainbow rising was, I think it went all the way. I can't remember. It was a champion of it, but you, it defeated a whole lot of other really good records. I was something I did in South America when I did press from a first KK album. I knew you were a big fan of that record. I didn't realize how big a fan you were that record and what's your thoughts on that? You know, sometime in the last five, 10 years, I went through a gigantic, richy black more Renaissance. And I knew he was awesome forever, but you know, you kind of lose touch when

45:51you're not paying attention. And then days off on tour and I go YouTube trolling and find shit like burn live from 1974. And they're like, man, I gotta look at more of this because at a certain point, I'm like, why did I stop listening to this guy? And there's no reason because he's a genius. He's a fucking genius. And there's so much great shit. In that particular instance, like that would come up. And I remember there was some heavy hit in albums coming up against it, even, I think even priest at one point. Yes, that's what that's why I was like, whoa. Did I not choose priest? You know, I think you choose, but it wasn't it wasn't staying class or anything. It was, uh, I forget which one it was, but yeah, it's it's difficult because, you know, Rainbow, Jesus Christ. It's hard for me to say, but, you know, you throw deep purple in there. And it's, it's a super group. It's it's it's a band. It's deep purple bit. Fucking Ian Pays, fucking John Lord, fucking Ian Gillan, my god, Richie Blackmore of course. Oh, yeah.

46:54But then you get to Rainbow. And you got running James Dio, one of my top two singers all time. And that was a great band too. So just just the, the, the musicianship of Rainbow, just, yes. That's probably what I was leaning on when I was picking Rainbow. It's just a musician ship because yeah, because some of some of those leads that he does, I don't know that he gets enough credit how complicated those leads are. Normal leads, the sea boards, which I don't give a shit about the keyboard leads. Holy shit. Those are good too, especially the purple stuff. That was what got me into metal was I heard machine head by D purple. I'm like, oh, what is this? This is, this is something different. Uh, yeah, it's amazing. Yeah, it's incredible. Yeah, right. Rising is my second favorite album of all time as well. Of course, number of the pieces my favorite, but rising my second favorite always loved that record. I'm okay with number of the beast. Me number one. Yeah. That's before they became too maiden for maiden. I know. I know you're you're definitely not in the maiden 2.0 camp. I understand the long epicky song. But I love that stuff. But yeah, and your favorite freestyle been staying class, right?

47:58Oh, yeah. You know, that's something that could easily change day to day, but I think historically, that's the one. Really? What others would you mix in? Well, I mean, saying classes killer. The time that came out, it's amazing that that heaviness came out, but yeah, that's my favorite. There's something to be said for painkiller. I still think same classes better because painkiller was kind of priest reinventing themselves for, I think, what thrash was bringing to the party. Yeah, 100%. I mean, I'm just even excited. That was really, if you, I mean, there's a, some people go with like speed king or a couple early songs of the first real speed metal. That's the first big metal song. But I think it was really excited by, by priest. So if you, if you forensically go back and look at it, that's, yeah, that's very hard to say because you have cider at the double bass, but they're not, you know, there's, there's plenty metal risk before that. Yeah, absolutely. All right, my friend. Well, thank you so much for doing this greatly appreciate it. Look for the second carry king album coming sometime in 2027. Check out the

48:58Slayer shows while you can. And yeah, Matt, thanks for doing it. Cheers, man. I will see you shortly. There you have it, evil by a merciful fate. That was super cool. Always funded Todd to carry king. He's such a good dude and a very good friend of mine. So I'll see him shortly. As I always do, thanks again to Mark Lewis for always talking good stuff about us. I think that's, might be the last time we hear from Mark on this podcast. So thank him, but he will be part of the next one, which I'll talk about. Second, thanks to Lizzy Borden for our theme song, Martin pop off, of course, for his stuff, our producer Christian Blatt. And again, starting next year, first Monday in January, my new podcast, the metal blade records 45th anniversary podcast will air every Monday on the same platforms that this one is, same social medias, same everything. And these episodes will all live on that same spot as well. So you can go back and listen to them again or listen to ones that you haven't heard. But that all starts early January. We're going to dissect an entire album every week of a different metal blade album for the 52 weeks that we talk about. So there's 52 metal blade

50:00records. If you have any suggestions, please let us know because we haven't figured them all out yet. So we're still looking, but it's going to be a lot of fun. Thanks everybody and I'll see you guys next episode. For the first time ever, Yamavar Resort and Casino at San Manuel is giving away a new Rolex watch

51:02for every club Serrano card deer. Play with your club Serrano card and on September 20th, you could be one of five winners of a Rolex watch. Plus, all winners will advance to the finale at Palm's Casino Resort Las Vegas for a chance to take home a rarity. The second must-dang dark horse ever produced on September 26th. Two properties, six winners, only at Yamavar Resort and Casino, your California to Vegas connection. Details at Yamavar.com must be 21 or older to enter participate. Please gamble responsibly. At ZockDock, we know you care about your health. You wouldn't do that early morning cardio if you didn't. So the fact that your annual physical is overdue just shows how hard it can be to get seen by a doctor. Sorry, that doctor's not a network. Press one for more options. You've reached us outside your whole business hours. The next availability is in three months. But ZockDock makes finding the right doctor easy. Download the app and search by special team, insurance and availability. Read real patient reviews, then book instantly. ZockDock, ready to be seen. Did you know that mosquitoes have killed almost half of all people who have ever lived? Today, people are fighting back. With support from the Gates Foundation,

52:06American scientists and partners around the world have developed a new generation of bed nets that can kill up to 90% of mosquitoes exposed to them, helping cut malaria rates in half. The result? A safer, healthier future for everyone. The Gates Foundation, partners of human potential, search Gatesfoundation.org slash mosquito to learn more.