Mailbag! Our thoughts on the David Montgomery trade, plus more on Lions

0:00America leads the world in medicine development. It matters. We get new medicines first, nearly three years faster. Five million Americans go to work because we make medicines here at home, and not relying on other countries keeps us safe. But China is racing to overtake us. Will we let them? Or will we choose to stay ahead? When America leads, America cures. Let's tell Washington to keep us in the lead. Learn how at americacures.com. Pay for by Farma. Welcome back to M Live's Dungeon to Doom Podcast. It feels good to be home after spending the

1:16week in Indianapolis. I'm Ben Raven. He is Corey Woods. We are M Live's Detroit Lion's Corey. How you doing, my friend? I am doing somewhat okay. As you know, I am about $175 in the hole because I left my microphone in the hotel and just so we're clear, it was the personal one, not the company one. It was the first question of our dear friend producer Patrick Ast. And just a shout out, courtyard capital, Maria. We know you're lying. That's the only place we used it. I checked everywhere. I checked my bags. I checked everywhere. I said I know for a fact. I did not take that microphone outside of that room. We only used them in the room. We used them in our hotel. They're lying. They know they're lying. So enjoy your microphone for your Marriott Indianapolis podcast or whatever the hell you got in mind for that. Yeah. So it's already been a kind of we teased a busy week last Thursday on our kind of

2:23combine rack wrap up. We get home. Obviously Dave Montgomery gets traded. Gram glass, cow gets released. Stuff's moving. Kind of still expecting some restructures in the coming day because they got to get out of the red. By next Wednesday, today is Thursday, March 5th. Next Wednesday's the start of the new year, the new league year, which is when deals can get announced, trades can become official. When all the reports you see over Monday through Wednesday morning, get reported, you'll see those start to be announced and all that. So it's a busy week. We've got we're doing a mail bag podcast today. I wasn't planning on a full mail bag, but the responses on X, the responses on blue sky and the handful of responses to the Dungeon of Doom at nly.com email address have called on us to do a mail bag. So shout out to those guys. And if you guys really love Cory and I, I'm begging for at least one recorded voice memo sent to the email the next time we do a mail bag pod, it probably won't be next week because the NFL world will be spitting topics and all that stuff at us. So yeah, we're going to have our show set for us next week, but we're

3:28going to kind of use this to excuse me. We're going to use this week's episode. Any lingering thoughts from the combine? Obviously, David Montgomery trade is going to be our main topic of the day. Also got some questions about juice, scroogs, the offensive lineman that came back in the deal for my Montgomery. Let's just start Dave Montgomery. I know we got questions on it, but let's just get some thoughts out of the way. Cory, just initial reactions. We are surprised how quick it got done and what do you think about the return? Well, first off, yes, I am definitely surprised at how quick it got done, not the fact that it happened because when we were talking to Brad Holmes last with the combine, you know, at first we kind of thought that things were pointing in the right direction based on what David Montgomery said during Super Bowl media week, then you get to what Brad Holmes said. And even we talked about like, that seems kind of different than what we've been kind of hearing. And then you see the follow the report. And then again, I've been trying to,

4:30I said it on in on our M live YouTube page. Jeremy follow just said David Montgomery wants out. He never said that he specifically heard that from David Montgomery. And again, you know, this kind of not be too long when it just by initial reaction was I was shocked at how quickly it got done, not the fact that it got done just and I was just based off of Brad Holmes comments recently. I'm like, when he said what he said, I'm like, okay, things don't appear to be the way we thought they were leaning. Yeah. And I think it does show that Brad Holmes, Dan Campbell, they're men of their word. I mean, after the season, they said we obviously we love David, but he's a player deserves to be utilized the way he wants to be utilized and all that stuff. And then what Brad said last week and then kind of the player wants to be here to type stuff. Yeah, D most tweet after the fall of reports hilarious. I mean, getting these reports community noted on Twitter only to be traded about 18 hours later. That's great PR marketing work by old David Montgomery, but it's

5:30funny just talking with the combines great for just catching up with people. And the one thing that really stuck out to me was a reporter friend that covers another team was just like, don't the Lions hold all the cards in this David Montgomery situation? And I'm just like, yes, they do his extension hasn't even kicked in yet. They do not have to move him. They could say, hey, man, you're here. You're either here or you're not playing, but they didn't do that. They didn't do that. And there's a part of me that respects the hell out of that. There's also a part of me that's like, you are a better team with David Montgomery on it. I mean, full stop, no matter the value and all that. We got questions about the value. We'll talk about that in a minute, but just like, they didn't have to do this. The cap savings did not move the needle. The cap savings didn't move the needle as much as Graham Glasgow's cut. Well, this was not a move that they had to do, but they just, I just go back to the Dan Campbell about the buy-in in the locker room, the locker room chemistry, it matters. And those guys love David. You saw St. Brown's podcast. You wrote that up yesterday.

6:33I mean, they love David. David's a leader. David's been here, 2023, 24, 25, the rise, but hey, the lion's still. I mean, got great value on him. I said, we'll talk about that later, but they also did right by the player. I guess, I guess, you know, I guess he's going to a Texan's online that's got just as many, if not more, questions than the lions do. That was the interesting thing for me is that, okay, first off, I didn't really understand why, okay, we see reports, you know, Colton from the athletics said that in a paraphrasing here that the lions were kind of maybe taking a back of why Montgomery wanted to want it out. Let me obviously, you know, let things last year didn't go the way that everyone expected. I think that was just more so due to John Morton's inability to really get a finger on the pulse of the offense. And then, you know, Dan Campbell taking over, it wasn't, it wasn't great, but

7:34it had to be done given the situation. So I was kind of really thinking that we've drew pets in coming in and their initial conversation. Yeah. And then, and then Brad Holmes, he's repeatedly said this while also stating, while also stating that David Montgomery has wants to be here, Brad Holmes has continuously said they want to put what happened last year in the rear view. And one thing that did stick out during the indices of press conferences, they said they were not only going to do right by them, but they put him where he wants it to go. And I'm unsure of why he wants it to go to a Texans team with, like you said, more offensive line holes than what the Lions have. But hey, they did right by him. They, they got more than what was initially, what they were initially, you see, in return, according to reports. So it doesn't make the Lions better. That's not, that's not true. So it doesn't make the Lions better. But I will

8:38say optic wise, it does not make them look worse off the simple fact that they did right by the player, they sent them where they want, where he wants to go. And you probably got the best compensation that you could get for a 29 year old running bet. Yeah, exactly. And we're going to use that segue right in the mail back. And we're going to start with our doomer of the week. Daniel McKiernan, good morning, Ben and Corey. I'm sure 90% of your questions will be about David Montgomery. And so, well, this one, but bear with me. My question is about motivation. If my Montgomery liked it here in Detroit, respects the coaches, likes his teammates, including Gives, and most importantly, he still had a solid contract. All true. Why does it sound like he wanted out so bad? Surely you could see the step back. The online took last year was the biggest issue. Is it just a pride thing? How many rushes he got? Or is there any reason to believe he thought the Lions would ask for a pay cut or let him go? Why not just keep planning it out? Make it make sense. Thank you. Great question. Great email, Dan. That's kind of what I just got to too. They

9:38didn't have to. And that is my question for David Montgomery is, dude, yes, you were not the superstar no doubt lead back. Yes, your snaps dropped to 30, 33% per ESPN research. And the final eight games of the season didn't have a game with more than 10 carries in any of those final eight games. Yes, but this is still, this is still an offense sharing a backfield, which will be your Gives, 158 carries, 716 yards, eight touchdowns. That is good work. You are on a great offense. You are on a team dedicated to improving the offensive line. You are paired up with one of the biggest growing superstar players in this game. And you still got 158 carries and you still got 30 targets in the past game. Wouldn't that is not your specialty at all? He was still a part of the plan. Yes, it dropped, but it was always going to drop if Gibbs was going to hit as much as we thought he was going to hit after seeing him. So it's just like, like, dang, man, I don't know. Your extension

10:44hadn't even kicked in. Everybody, if you, if he wanted to be back, he would be back. There would be no questions asked. Maybe a pick up. I don't, I don't even, because his contract wasn't that big. I think the extension was like two years for 18 million within. That's correct. Yep, 18 million. That's just off the, that's off the dome. I do this too much. Oh my god. This was a good situation. And even if his carries remained what they were last year, man, you still found a way to get 700 yards, eight touchdowns. The best running back due in the NFL. And now you're going to a Houston team that's got a woody marks. That's, I mean, Dave Montgomery is clearly the best back in that backfield right now, but the offensive line is she's, Houston is always stuck in an offensive line. Houston has a problem. Yeah, exactly. So I just, uh, man, I don't know, man, Detroit, he should have, I personally speaking, he should have been, it's okay to express frustration. You're at a great situation to express frustration. Hey,

11:49I want the ball more. I need more chances. Yeah, you're right. You do. And I know the line, set all those things and it never happened. And even with Dan took overplay calling Montgomery's role shrunk from those 41% snaps to down to the 30 level. So I get it frustration. Maybe he saw the writing on the wall. I'm just like, damn, man, you still had a meeting role on, like, potentially like NFL's most loaded offense. I will say this. And you know, David Montgomery has said all of the right things about, you know, the backfield tandem with with the previous backfield tandem of him and Jameera Gibbs, the whole Sonic and Knuckles bed. It was all of that sounds good. You need to set it. And I don't, you've never seen anything or heard anything about Montgomery being less than an ideal teammate again. Right. You heard it again from Marassem Brown on his podcast. It's just interesting that after one year of being RB2, he's like, you know what, I'm on it here. And I think it may be. And again, maybe he was okay with the split carries,

12:56as long as he was the quote unquote feature bet. I don't know. It's just, it's just odd that after one year that was a less than likely ideal offense for everybody involved. He's the one guy that is just like, hey, you know what? I'm going to go take my chances elsewhere. And I mean, you know, again, it's his right, more power to him. The lines didn't have to do it. They, they, he signed the two-year extension. They could've been like, hey, sit tight, buddy, you're here or you're not going to report. We'll, we'll, whatever you decide. Hey, we got you for two more years. So, I mean, I, I'm curious to see how this is going to pan out for him. You know, don't wish bad on anybody or anything like that. But I just personally feel like given what we, we think it's about to happen with this lion's offense, this would have been an ideal fit for him. Yeah, the hiring of Drew Petson kind of made everyone think, oh, my god, we're probably back.

14:01Like, he's probably looking at his chops about that hire. We thought he was. He kind of said, made us think that way with his comp at the Super Bowl week. And it's interesting because now, I mean, hey, you got Jemeer Gibbs. People are freaking out a little too much about RB2. But like, at the same time, RB2 in Detroit still had 158 carries last year, which I believe was top 30 in the NFL or right on the cost of top 30 in the NFL. And that's nothing to scoff at. It's just interesting. I, yeah, my company never really showed his frustration with like teammates and stuff like that. It was more kind of like with us, so disinterested in talking with us, role in the eyes whenever you'd come up to him in the locker room and to a point where it's just like, all right, this guy's, this guy don't want me standing in the, in the running back corner, which is already the most terrifying corner in the lion's locker room because you're going to get made fun of. There's going to be guys recording your interview. But hey, that's part of the game. But yeah, there was definitely a tone shift in Montgomery there. But just, yeah, more power to you. Thatting on yourself, I just think you made the wrong bet. I think him making it work here,

15:05getting on the same page with everyone would have been best because like, it's tough for me to see in my mind the lions making this move unless they felt that they truly had to. And that seems to be consensus as I felt like they truly had to. So I think, uh, Montgomery's playing the social media and public speaking game well. But I think, that's exactly what I would, that what I would say. So I think right now where people or, you know, fans like, you see he wanted to be, he wanted to be here. I'm like, I'm like, hey, look, I'm like, look, I'm going to be honest with you guys. I don't know this for sure with Montgomery, but we have seen so many examples of athletes saying and doing one thing in public. But behind the scenes, moving a little bit different type of way. So as you said, so they can lessen that PR blowback, but the end of the day, from what we've seen under Brad Holmes and Dan Campbell, they've valued that one two punch at running back. And again, I do not see them wanting

16:09to move on from David Montgomery unless they felt like, you know what? This is a situation that we do not want to carry over into the new season. If it's going to affect him, going to bring any type turmoil or angst to the offense, let's just go get him in the best position possible and go and move forward. Because why would the Lions want to do this? They had them under contract for two years now. As you said, they doesn't move the needle on the salary cap. And you're creating another need because you're going to have to get a RB2 to split some of those carries up and take some of the blowback, or we'll take some of the load off of Jamir Gibbs. So it's, I don't think they wanted to create another need when they're already trying to restrict your money to fill up everything else. Exactly. I mean, hey, it's a chance to get younger behind the position. Maybe it's a chance to learn what the Hexioan Valky the running back actually looks like. They need something. And I do think that like the running back for aging class is strong. The Lions will not be in the top

17:11of the market for there. No chance. No way. But like, there's a couple of questions about veteran guys. Like if I'm a James Conner, if I'm a veteran back, and I look at Detroit and the world at Montgomery was still getting behind Gibbs and think, okay, I'm probably not going to get 160 carries like he did, that's still a damn good offense for me to be in. And that's a dang good situation for me to be in. You might see a team friendly deal come down on a veteran and for agency, nothing major. I do think they'll add something in the draft just because we don't know what Valky is. Sailors want a spot in camp last year, but then served as the primary kick returner. We don't know what him the NFL running back looks like. There are some questions behind Gibbs, but kind of just to put it forward with Gibbs as your RB1. Yeah, yeah. We got a question from our saddle. If I said that wrong, please hit me up. How are the Lions going to fill eight potential starting holes between edge lineback or defensive line safety cornerback, center left guard with only a bit of cash and two high picks. Corey, what do you think? Hey, good thing, good thing, Brad,

18:13got a fourth and a seventh because I mean, you got to go ahead and fill out this roster somehow. I think the real tale is going to be what these restructures look like over the next couple days. Yeah. Yeah. And you know, I think that's going to be real key. I think I just, I have no idea because again, now they have another needed run again. No, it's interesting. It's really interesting to see how they're about to do the situation because I'm just thinking of the top of my head. First off, you got I think golf number one has to be a restructure. Then then you're looking at either satin brown and stool. If not both of those guys. So I know it's there. I mean, they're going to have to get cute. They're going to get have to get cute. We'll see what happens there. But the two high pixie mentions of I mean, the Lions only have two top 50 picks and they only have two top 100 picks. They're at 17 and 50 and then it goes 118, 128, 156 potential comp pick 188, 205,

19:1721. That's a lot of late round picks. Obviously, I did the 2027. Seventh got a pick one 28 back from Montgomery, Andrew Scruggs. But yeah, I mean, need another ad rusher because we don't know what's going to happen with Elkwood, Dean Muhammad and even if they splurged an Elkwood, Dean Muhammad, I would argue that's still a need. Linebacker, Alexan's aloneies. Alexan's aloneie has earned himself one final payday. I don't know if it's going to happen here in Detroit. He wants it to be in here in Detroit. I think it should be here in Detroit, but they're going to have to get real cute to make that happen with all the other stuff. D line, yeah, that's more edge, you know, tie leak and McNeilier guys on the inside. Obviously, bring back Roy Lopez would be a smart move. I think the DJ reader experiences over. Cornerback, yeah, we'll see. We'll see. Obviously, no questions about the Terry and Arnold situation, but that is one worth monitoring. And I'm just going to say this for anyone he going at my dear friend and trusted colleague Nolan beyond she on Twitter, chill out. Let me just quick media literacy lesson here. When a though, what Nolan reported

20:22was what a judge wrote in official court documents. It is a reporter's duty to write that. A judge wrote those words in official court documents. Nolan didn't get anonymous sources or tip-offs or anything like that. He found what a judge wrote. So that is a situation with monitoring. Arnold's camp denies everything that's going to play out over the. We'll just see how that plays out. That's that's all I'm going to touch there center. Yeah, need a center left guard. Yeah, I've said it a million times. Mahogany can't not be your here's the starting role guy. Like if he's going to be the starter at left guard, he's got to go in and earn it. So good question there. Place perfectly into Chris Cole's question. Chris, appreciate the question. What contracts do you think the lines or your structure? You said it. Goff. Goff has got to be the one because you see what the chiefs did with. I'm just trying to find it. You see what the chiefs did recently with patching the homes. They converted as near $45 million base salary and a 10 million roster bonus into a guaranteed roster bonus, which created nearly 45 million in immediate cap space.

21:25That allows teams to push calorie hips down into the future, creating an issue down the road, but finding relief in the short term. And for guys like my homes, for guys like Goff, you're okay doing it with those big contracts and those guys that you're fine tying yourself to for the future. So my mind goes to St. Brown, my mind goes to Soule. Those three big ones would create a lot of cap space because the chiefs created 40 plus million. Guess what? Mahomes' base salary was $44 million. Goff's jumps to $55 million per over the cap next season. So that, yes, Goff is where my mind goes. Just wanted to touch on that good question there. Also worth mentioning that that press got CD-LAM and I believe it had one more player to the Cowboys had a lot of restrictions yesterday as well. And I believe what everybody got excited about was that tweet a couple of weeks ago was just that the Cowboys and Lions were the teams that could create the most most cap space with basic restructures. So we'll see. Brad says he's open to it. That is a discussion

22:28because you got to have a lot of cash on hand to be doing that stuff. So we'll see it's got to get done. So it has to. I don't think I don't see a pathway to filling all of those holes without doing some restructuring. No, yeah, it's it's undoable. Do we got a question? Sorry, I'm doing my own sequit music. Shobby with a question. Give a real cost benefit analysis of everything for the Montgomery trade. Yes, they will save money about how much will they save to spend for a replacement. Yeah, the yes, they received a pick, but will they have to spend it to replace them and can they even get an equal replacement? So I'll handle the business and I'll let you go. The trade frees up about 3.5 million in space. So essentially nothing based on what you said about spending for a replacement, then they say 5.5 million by releasing glass gal. So yeah, I mean, they're going to have to spend what they save to get a replacement, right, Corey? Basically, yeah, they are. And I mean, there's a couple of guys out there. I believe you

23:29miniature one Connor kid of the game. Well, he's he's been the name I've been seeing floated around. I personally believe the pathway for them would be to go ahead and draft the replacement. Just somebody that you can get on there on a real cheap deal because I think we can I'm not going to sit up here and say David Montgomery is replaceable because you're talking you're not just about what he gave for the offense, but what he provided to the locker room and the camaraderie that he had with those guys. I'm not going to say that he's replaceable, but I will say that you can find a back that will be able to split carries with swift and be able to add some value and production to this offense. And I believe that this year's class, there are some guys that they could probably get, you know, and in those in those later rounds and in the fourth, fifth or the sixth round. I mean, I mean, the the Bears got a guy that I wanted the lines to get last year. And the Bears got Kalmanan guy last year in the seventh round. So as long as they've

24:31repaired an offensive line, you got Gibbs, you got a running, you got a great running back coach into charge choice. And you still got a guy like Scotty Montgomery in the building who will probably put his two cents in whenever whenever asked. I mean, I believe the lines are going to be in good shape if they draft the running back. I don't think they need to, you know, invest resources, financial resources, you know, sort of free agency to go grab one. And I'll just say this to close the cost, the cost, ask, if you would have told me Montgomery got traded for just a fourth round pick, I would have said the lines did great. They add in a 20, 20, 27, seventh, sure, whatever, still got something more. And then they add in a recent 20, 23 second round pick and Drew Scruggs. It hasn't been able to carve out a role in Houston's terrible offensive line, but maybe he's been playing out of position. It's got center experience, it's got guard experience. So good job on value. They are a worse team today than they were with David Montgomery, but they still did what they had to do. And they still got better than expected value. The next question comes from John, John,

25:3716 kind of loops in with that. He wants to know if it's better to draft a demo replacement or sign a reasonable veteran. So it's James Connor, if he's willing to play RB 2, I think the answer is a little column A, a little column B. I think you sign a veteran, see how it looks in camp, and you spend one of those six round picks or a fifth from pick on a running back. And you guys probably don't want to hear that with all the other needs elsewhere. But I think that's kind of where they are. And I mean, I think even a Tyler L. Geer, he's going to be out of market for the Lions. Do you think he really wants to go from behind Bichon Robinson to behind Jermir Gibbs when he's got a payday? Probably not, but my mind goes to maybe Rashad White doesn't have the marketing things. Maybe Brian Robinson, you know, someone who was kind of didn't play much as much as he was used to in San Fran last year. And then there are other guys like a Jerome Ford. And then there's obviously we mentioned Connor. I mean, what Connor did in the first two seasons under Drew Petzing, Arizona. I mean, it was a seventh eighth year pro with his first 2000 yard season. So he knows the offense. He knows the coach. He knows that it's been successful for him in the past.

26:37And I will just say, I like James Connor. I think that'd be a good value pickup right there. But there are a couple of guys in the draft. I'll throw a couple of names at you. Washington's Jonah Coleman would probably be the priciest pick on a running back. And I probably have to get lucky to get him. I like him big, big back, open to growing his passing game more. And there's Penn State's Nick Singleton Arkansas's Mike Washington Jr. Wake Forest is DeMond Clayborne and Toledo's Chip Trainam, which felt like a parks and rack character name. But I just like his bill. Those are just a couple guys to keep eyes on. That's kind of where I'm at with the Montgomery stuff. I think it's a little column A, little column B, John, John, signing a sign of veteran, you know, somebody in that one to whatever, the cheap range, the David Montgomery seller cap hit range. That's fascinating. But yeah, I think it's going to take one of both because I think it would be great to count on seeing on Valkyrie for a larger role. But we just haven't seen him at running back much. So I don't know. I think I personally don't think that they run it with

27:42Cionia's. No, I just if he wins any wins it, but yeah. All right, we got chirpy, sores racks with a question I'll let you lead off with. What's the topic storyline? You're least looking forward to this offseason. The one topic that will get repeated over and over that you'll get asked about every week that you know you'll be exhausted talking about. What are they going to do with adressure? That's my answer too. I just I that's adressure. I mean, I mean, I would say this, I would say the David, I would say what are they going to do behind for adding a David Montgomery replacement might be my one B, but because you know, I didn't even have to think about that one until this week, but yeah, adressure just it's going to be it's going to be up there. Who know, you know what, take that back since you already get there. So I'm gonna go I'm gonna go what what are they going to do with the David Montgomery replacement because I'm getting that's fine. I'm I'm getting so

28:45many questions about that right now. What are they going to do? They're going to run Kim's until the ground. He's going to be done by he's going to be done about the biweek. Bran is fire. I'm like, oh my god. Why did you guys do this? It's that time of year. It's overreaction season. My answer and the answer is ed rushers. It's been three years of this talk justified. We still have to do it, but just it's such a persistent topic. It's such a point of contention when we ask Brad about it. And I'm sure you guys are tired of talking and hearing about it too. Like so that's why ed rushers is the answer there. Yes, they need another ed rusher, but I have been paying in the freaking table for ed rushers for three years. And it's kind of where they're just stubborn. They know what they like. They know what they don't want to reach on. They know what they don't want to take chances on. And they know what fits their scheme and what they want. So they're going to continue. I think they're going to continue doing this to us. So we'll see you there. And then on the flip side, chirpy source, Rex wants to know what's the story you're looking forward

29:48to the most. Minds the draft. I love the draft. I love the draft experience. I love talking to rookies on a great night in their life. I love being in the media room, watching the draft, reacting and real time to everything. The Phoenix, the Michael Phoenix pick was an all-timer. We like didn't believe the tweets until we saw it on TV. It's like a binge eating junk food fast because we work and live in Allen Park for three days of hurry up and wait, but it's the draft. The combine's fun, but it's draft. It's the whole draft experience and just everything. It's exhausting. But it's kind of what drew me to this field anyway was like when the draft stuff started taking off in the early 2000s and Mel Kuiper became a rock star and all that stuff. I love the draft. I love the mystery. I love the months of will they won't they hypothetical situations coming to an end. And just getting to talk to those guys with their families and friends all around them, such a morale boost most of the time. I love the draft. That's my answer. My answer is coming up next week. Free agency. I love free agency. I just love, I just because

30:58I just love seeing like, okay, what are teams doing around the league to improve their roster? How are they addressing it? Why did they go sign the player that they signed and give him? Why did he earn that X, Y and Z contract? I'll just and I'm also curious for another reason to see is I'm really curious to see what the lines do because this is a season where even though the reports are they're not going to be major players and they don't have them. They still got to free up a lot of money to even do anything. I'm just really curious to see if Brad is going in Brad homes and the Lions of Brass are going to not necessarily go away from their ethos but show some flexibility in their approach to roster building because you know, this is going into year six. Yeah. They've been wow. Yeah. Yeah. And they've had two, let's just say they've had four

32:04winning seasons, but I would say two quote-unquote successful ones. And didn't you have the, did he fall off a little bit when you don't go into the playoffs? I'm curious to see what are they going to do to make themselves a playoff team again? What are they going to do to keep this Super Bowl window? I don't want to say Super Bowl window open. Where are they going to make themselves a playoff team again? And what are they going to do to insert themselves back into the Super Bowl conversation that they were one seeing? Because somebody said, you know, it talked to me other day, they said that the Lions are, I don't know why they made this move with David Montgomery because they're a Super Bowl ready team. No. There are a team that can be a playoff contender. I don't think they're a Super Bowl ready team. So I'm going to see what they're going to do to get into that conversation because you see and you see all of these other teams in the NFC, heck, even in the division, making moves reportedly preparing to make splashes to get their

33:04teams ready for, you know, a potential run. And yes, the Lions are trying to build for the long term. But at some point, don't you try, don't you try to go for it? I'm going to see when are they going to finally go for it. Yeah. Yeah. And I think Dan Campbell is speaking with the urgency, the speaking that we need to be aggressive, more aggressive. Like I get that sense from Dan Campbell big time. And I think Brad Holmes is here in it too because I remember sitting at the owners meetings last year and we're asking Brad about another kind of, I mean, the DJ Reed deal was the biggest external free agent deal that Brad had handed out. So we were talking to him like two weeks after that. And he just kind of talked about all the extensions they still had to do. All the extensions they already made. And you know, sometimes you can't go on vacation. He got from, he got presented with that analogy at the combine last week and was kind of like, oh, we're open to everything. So I, I think if the restructures go through that we think are going to

34:04go through, they're going to have money to play with. I wouldn't be surprised to see them fill the center void in free agency and then maybe take someone that they like in the draft. We'll see there because as noted two top 100 picks, the fourth rounder helps, but they're not working with the crop of picks they have been in previous years. But yeah, I do think I don't think they'll be handing out a deal that's bigger than DJ Reed's deal. But I could see a handful of moves that adds up to a more aggressive approach. So we'll see what happens there. Alliance are always talked about as a team that's not going to be aggressive in free agency. And right now where we're sitting Thursday morning, March 5th, it's hard to see how they will be aggressive and less multiple things happen. And just a breaking news note, breaking news inside the NFS North, I saw you looking at your phone. So I found it mine. The Chicago Bears just cleared a lot of cap space, traded a wide receiver DJ more to the bills for what is being reported as a mid-round pick. So bears get younger at receiver free up some cap space and the bills land a receiver. So there you go. Good stuff.

35:12There Charles Brian, I see your question. We did kind of note that. Oh, he's got a second part of his question. Favorite combine prospects. We'd love to see him Detroit. I don't know if you want to see Jake slaughtering Detroit because you might be double taken if it's me or Dan Campbell. That was probably the most hilarious thing. I just looked up a light. All right, this profile, he looks like Dan Campbell with glasses. But if he go on this side, he looks a little bit like Ben with the shape. I know of me with a go T and high school teacher glasses. Once he said that, I was like, holy crap, I can't not see this in this one picture. He looks exactly like me. This picture looks exactly like Dan. And I sent it to my girlfriend anyway. And she's like, he looks more like Dan, but I definitely see what he's talking about. Then our good friends that are over at the Lions collective podcast. I got this clip sent to me about 40 times as

36:12Colton Poundsy holding up the photo with Slotter and Will Birchfield talking about how much he looks like me. He goes, Hey, Ben Raven and Dan Campbell, that's a thoroughbred beer drinker right there. It's easy. Easy. I'm 37. That ain't me no more. But that was funny. But Jake Slotter would be a great prospect. I know we were getting somewhere with that. I know the safety stuff is weird and this would take a high pick. I already talked about a manual McNeil Warren out of Toledo love him. And I've mentioned Spencer for no multiple times. I just dropped my second mock draft, the post combine mock draft today. I didn't think there would be a world where Feno would fall. But he's kind of fall and consensiously right now. There are people don't know what position he's going to play. His arms are shorter. Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. He can play guard. He can play tackle. They even worked him out at center at the combine. And I'm just saying for anybody who scoffs at that and Detroit, guess who's got as much experience at center as Spencer for no take so that is a clear cut top 15 talent. A real special athlete at that size. One of my favorite

37:17lines right about Feno was whenever Utah needed a yard or a conversion, they ran his way. If he plays interior, he's better than Mahogany. If Ratlich moves to center, he's a great right guard. If somehow he clicks at center, that's a dark horse thing to watch. Or if he's just a tackle in waiting, guess what? That is clear cut first round talent. I loved him coming in, loved him coming out. And now I see a reality to where it happens because the rise of Monroe Freeling is freaking real. That is, that's got staying power. Someone explained it to me. And it just feels true. That Monroe Freeling really feels like he's in the mix for OT 1 or 2. That's who I kind of came out of the combine thinking I'm mocked to the lines. But then it was like, oh, everybody's higher on this guy. It's just skyrocketing up. It feels like it's going to stay. There's a couple of names for you. I mentioned Jonah Coleman as a running back. Casey Concepcion was great. Then he had to send out a statement for his speech impediment. I just loved the way he handled that. That was awesome. Yeah, he feels comfortable on skin. I already loved him anyway. So there's some guys. Omar

38:18Cooper from Indiana is the darling of mine. Lions don't need receivers, but those guys are good talkers. And the offensive linemen are great. Like all the offensive linemen. Those are the best stories. I know you guys probably saw the tweet of the low attended media attendance on Saturday. We were there. That picture was extremely misleading. It fills in. That's what last day of the combine, 15 minutes from podium availability. Let me tell you where I am. I'm getting a coffee. I'm charging my computer. I'm sprinting downstairs in those final 15 minutes. So like that was misleading. We were there. The Detroit beat was there. The offensive linemen are the best storytellers. We'll continue to have a stuff out of that. Another guy I'll just mention is the Arizona state tackle that just is rising and rising might be a first-room guy. I love the stories of the guys. They're like, yep, didn't play high school football. So I'm how God into it at the Juco level and ended up being a multi-year starter at a D1 program. So there's a couple guys from me. Anybody I missed that you liked, Cory? Two guys that I liked. One is probably going to be a day-two guy.

39:20Miami's Kionte Scott. There's been talk about the Lions getting a cornerback. I like him as a versatile defender. He kind of reminds me of a Brian Branch type. A guy that could play deep, but he can also, but he's probably really, you know, he's playing a slide. He could play in a box. And he seems like he's a pretty violent guy. And I think that they just need that type of versatility when you really don't know what's going to be happening with material on Arnold and your safety rumors and flux. So I think that he would provide some versatility that the Lions could desperately need in that area. Another guy that I really like too is, and I stuck around for him, I asked him a lot of questions. I thought he would have had a bigger table, because he didn't, he wasn't in the podium. I was K and in Weijen. I'm really been on this. I've really been hanging on this return thing. I know a few Lions fans have asked me, well, what about Dominic Loveett?

40:24We didn't really see enough from him to really get a good grade on Loveett. I mean, I know the thought processes there are getting, but with Weijen, the past two years of Iowa, he's been the nation's best returner. Yeah, he knows where he's best suited at. He's comfortable with it. He feels that he has more to offer in the passing game. And I believe that the Shrine Bro was a good chance, was a good chance when he did show that show that he had a more developed route tree than what he got a chance to show at Iowa. But this is a guy that wants to come in there and be a dynamic returner. And when you don't know what you have in Loveett, you do have sailors, but I mean, you got to make sure that's still going on. I like it. Khalif Raymond. He's never known. We don't know. It's 32. Getting up there. I think this is an opportunity where we're after you take care of everything you can take care of. If Weijen is still

41:28there in round seven, I think you got to grab him. And I like it too, just because the emphasis put on kick returnerings with the new rules, and you know, we don't know what's going to happen with Raymond. I'll say this about Raymond. It's hard to imagine him not in Alliance uniform. He's one of those guys that like I refuse to rule out. I know people are moving on, blah, blah, blah, adding going to break the bank. They love him. That's a lot of them leader. Like I'll see what happens there. But if he does go somewhere else or if they do not bring him back, I love that thinking because we were doing the drive down to Indy and we're like, oh crap, what receivers are we're going to talk to? And then we both said the Iowa kids name at the same time. It's like, yep, there you go. We just made that Alliance story. Beautiful. We got we got three questions left, but two are both about Drew's Scruggs. Love that. March 5th, baby. The first one is from Justin Daniels with the email subject line. You're doing great. Just a friendly reminder that fans are crazy. Just a, this is the quote, I'm quoting the question. Just a friendly reminder that fans are

42:30crazy. I would never talk about you guys like that. And you can't talk about how Drew's Scruggs played his best football at Center in college and up until 2024 with the Texans. Oh, and given the state of the Texans office of Atlanta for the last two years, maybe it's less about the players. More about putting those players in position to succeed. And we got Will Rainey. Does juice have the juice to be our center of the future? Any reason for optimism. Here's the thing. And it's the thing that I go back to. It was a second round pick in 2023. Brad Holmes and Dan Campbell scouted this guy. They talked about this guy. They know of this guy. So they see something there. And I think maybe the position you're talking about plays into that factor because maybe they were like, hey, at the worst, this is center depth. He's got experience all over the interior line, struggle to carve out a role on a truly bad Texans offensive line. But the optimism is in the addition that he was a recent second round pick, meaning that Holmes has got to read on him. Campbell and him have probably talked about him as a previous option in the college stuff. He played a thousand plus snaps at Center at Penn State, played all over the line. I don't know about starter,

43:31but he's 26 years old. And the lines clearly see enough to give him a chance. I like the versatility. I like the depth, the cost control depth. You know, take a chance on a guy that you previously might have been high on. I like it. And I'll just add on to that. If Frank, if Hank Frailius, who we believe he'd be. Frank Hayley. Oh, I've done that. You know what? I've done that twice this week with writing. And I went back and I'm like, what is wrong with me? He's done that out of the forever for two. Yeah. I believe that he'll be able to do some magic with with them. Scruggs again, not saying he's a starter, but I think that he will be better than the options. They've had that depth across the line in the past couple of years because I mean pulling guys off practice squads, guys that have just been floating all around the rig and not ideal. I think that with the great offensive. I don't think any, you know, this will just be real.

44:34I believe that Scruggs is going to be around a more talented offensive coaching staff in general. So I think that would just go ahead and aid in his development as well. So I think that for deaf, great starter, maybe a stopgap in the emergency situation. Yeah. Let me just say this. If his ceiling is Evan Brown, there's nothing wrong with being an Evan Brown. The lines have needed an Evan Brown. So yeah, I like it. Reason second round pick who hasn't worked out, who hasn't carved out a consistent role, but maybe someone they see the light on. But looking at him as a potential starter, it feels like a stretch, but like we don't know. Maybe he clicks. Maybe he takes off. Maybe they unlock what they see. There is reason for optimism, but at the end of the day, these were tack-ons to the trade to get it done. And I already said, the lines just got a fourth round pick for Montgomery. I would have been like, you know what? They're a worse team than they are today, but they did their best with something they felt they

45:36had to do. So adding on a 26 year old former second round pick, good job adding on a seventh round pick to maybe turn into a mid-round pick. And this year's draft with some of those other late round picks, good job, more toys to play with, more versatility, more options. They need all that in the offensive line. And last question from John Annette and Roseville, who was nice enough to send a second question after the Lions answered his grand glass-out question really in the week. He says, hi guys, what do you think about 97.1? Good. You're lucky I included this question. Saying that Holmes is more of a scouting a general manager. I have to say I did agree with a lot of what they said. Now actually, I did catch some of this. I think it came after the Trent McDuffy trade to the Rams and how the Rams outside of taking Jared Versa shipped their first round pick off in recent years. And I think there's some frustration like, why doesn't Holmes have this gene? Well, let's just put it this way. And I believe Jeremy Reissman said it first, but he also said it best. The Lions were not in position to trade first round picks up until what three years ago. They needed, they needed all those. They really needed all those. They needed that youth infusion.

46:40That's how they got the cornerstones they got now. But I do think about this because I do think like, I love that he wants to do everything to the draft, draft, develop, retain, and pay. You know, that's great. It's got on him this far. But I do think what they were getting at and what John is asking about is like, what's the next evolution? All right. Your way built this thing. How do you sustain it? How do you grow it from where it is? So I think maybe that's where the questions are coming from. I still think he's GM. He's a general manager who is a scout. I don't think he's a scout and not a general manager. Like I just think he's still bigger in that out as the thing evolves and injuries happen and challenges come out of left field and red flags pop up and all of a sudden you go from having two first round picks and back to back drafts to having two top 50 picks. Like it's going to take some evolution. But just like, we always wondered if Holmes would tap into his F them picks mantra that the Rams organization is embraced. I just don't see that happening with him. I think he cherishes those first

47:43round picks, whether it's 32 or it's one, he cherishes those things. And I think that's an okay thing. Yeah. I'm just doing it. I had to go ahead to go double check on something. You know, it took and if correct me from wrong, I believe it took like how he rose men like eight years before he went ahead and got his first Superbow as an executive. I think that with Brad, and it just let me just double check one thing because it's just to make sure I'm correct. Yeah. So with Brad, with how we had more so of a business type of background acumen to to his approach, whereas Brad, yeah, Brad was basically a scout. So I think that both of them had been successful in leaning on their ethos. But now you're hoping with the fact of Brad, okay, can you tap into that? We got to make these type of X, Y and Z deals to go ahead and get who

48:44we need to get. And I think Brad is a good GM. I'm the verdict is out of whether he's going to be a great one. The great one is going to be what he can do to elevate this scene from where they are. And I'm not sure that it will be done this season just to be quite honest with this offseason. I'm just, I see him as more of a, he's a general manager. I just feel that he has more scout to him than business. Then, then, then God trying to make a business deal. He's never kind of been shy about his background either. I will say, if you want to nitpick anything, I think you could make an argument that they could have been more aggressive the last two years. Yeah. When all those guys were on rookie contracts, when they had that window to kick the Salar cat problems down the road a little bit, instead of where they are now, you know, you know, you know, you get too late, mid to late 21st round picks and back to back years. You see what the, what the Rams just turned the 29th pick into in Trent McDuffy is starting quarterback who's got the chance to fix their main

49:47problem. I'm fine with that frustration because I don't think they had to go either way, you know, Terry on was a great pick at the time. We'll see you and see what happens there. I'd like the tie league pick. You know, I get why people were like, what the hell another interior defender, when you got DJ reader on contract for another year, but hey, look at them now. That's a whole that people should not be worried about. Thanks to that tie league pick. We're going back to a healthy McNeil. But I do think if you wanted to get frustrated with anything, not that you need my permission to do so that you could have, you could have the last two years probably could have been a little more aggressive as their acquisition outside of the draft. But hey, he's built him this far, still deserves all the praise in the world because if that dude for some reason became available, I think he'd be the top option and teams would be rushing and getting guys out of the way to go get him. And I think people do need a reality check there. But this is a crucial offseason. I mean, this is going to take some evolution. It's going to take kind of like Dan with all the external

50:47candidates for offensive coordinator. It's going to take a new approach. That doesn't mean you tear it down or go away from what you believe in and what you love. But I think it just requires a different lens. I think he's capable of it. I think we might see it a touch like I said in free agency next week. Like I don't think they'll be breaking the bank on $50 million deals. I don't think they'll have the, I don't think the lender bump sweet stakes are going to be for them. So we'll see what happens there. But good questions this week. That is what we got for you. Yep. Go ahead. Closing the sound early. Oh, my bad. I do think that Dan is just based off of what Dan has said in the season at the combine. I just have a feeling that he might be putting some pressure on Brad to make sure that he does his job and bringing that talent because I think Dan, like you said earlier this podcast, Dan's sense of urgency that's going on right now. He knows

51:48that there's a window and it can close. We got to go ahead and add talent now. So I think he's probably putting a little bit more pressure on Brad these days than normal. If I'm just assuming. No, I think so too. I think the pressure inside that building is real. They realized what happened this year was real and that it can't happen again when you've got the players and the coaches that they've got. So that's it. Thank you for the questions. That was great. Thank you. Please. Like I said, it probably won't be next week for the next time I open up the mailbag. I want to see some voice memos. You know, if you're watching free agency and you fire off a voice memo, the dungeon of doom, we'll probably still play it on next week's episode. So just get us one of those. I love the voice memos. I love hearing your guys' voices. I love reacting in real time to that stuff. It's a little risky sometimes as we found out last year a couple of times. Oh, yeah. I can't remember what that one dude said, but it stuck with you like, oh, maybe I should listen to these before I play them on the air. No, that's what we got Patrick for. He's the best in the game. No. But that's it for us. Please mail back questions any time,

52:52any place, dungeon of doom at mlive.com. My mock draft went live at mlive.com such lines. This morning, 2.0. Corries will be up tomorrow. I had Spencer Fino go into the lines at 17th and we're going to make it click the story to find out Corey's pick because I'm sure he's still working through it. But hey, we'll be back next week. Well, probably target Thursday seems like a good bet 24 hours after the new league year opens, let some dust settle. Give us some time to gather everything we need to gather. We'll be busy around the clock. Corey's looking forward to it. I'm ready for the draft. Oh, yeah. Until next time, I'm Ben Raven. He is Corey Woods. We are mlive, dungeon of doom destroy lines by this key. So you

53:53two teams. One cup. The prime time stage is set for the TGL presented by Sophie Finals, Los Angeles Golf Club versus Tiger's Jupiter links. Keep up. It's playoffs. Tune in Monday, March 23rd, 9 p.m. Eastern on ESPN 2 and Tuesday, March 24th, 7 p.m. Eastern on ESPN and on the ESPN app.