Ep 859: The Vibe Coding Boom: Why Vibe Coding isn't Going Away and How it's Both Good and Bad (Start Here Series Ep 18)

0:00Welcome to the Everyday AI podcast. My name is Jordan Wilson and for the past three and a half years, we've put out more than 800 episodes. Yet, one of the most common questions I get, I didn't really have an answer for. Where do I start on the Everyday AI podcast? And that's why we started the Start Here series. And with the fall now back in full swing, the Everyday AI podcast is going back to school and playing back the entire Start Here series from front to back. We've hit pause on our normal Monday to Friday programming to run back our most popular series ever for the next 30 days. We made the Start Here series for beginners and AI champions alike. So whether you're just trying to get a grasp on large language models or grappling with the best coding harness for multi-agentic workflows, the Start Here series covers it all. Any language, no jargon, and easy to follow along each day. So make sure to subscribe to the podcast and check back each day for new insights day

1:03by day. The series is a culmination of spending more than 10,000 hours covering generative AI over the past three and a half years. So you don't want to miss a single episode of the Start Here series. Let's get into it. Each in that you can describe your dream house out loud and poof, a building appears in front of your eyes in minutes. It looks incredible. It's exactly what you asked for. And you move in. It's awesome. You tell everyone how easy it was. But then almost instantly you want to make some changes. You want to add a second floor hack, maybe even an outlet here or there. Or just maybe you want to hang a towel rack. But then you run into some problems instantly. You realize that no one knows which walls are load bearing or if the electricity works and turns out that those floors look sturdy. But when you plopped your couch down on those marble looking floors, turn that, that they were kind of paper thin and they started to sink.

2:03And it turns out the whole structure was great in theory, but it was held together with duct tape, hopes and dreams, and there definitely wasn't a permit. And now you're in trouble. And this scenario is exactly what's happening right now across the enterprise and the software industry at a scale that we haven't seen before because of vibe coding. But is all vibe coding bad? Is it all smoking mirrors and hallucinated code that's held together by strong models and agentic loops? Or can you actually vibe code a production ready app without much coding knowledge? Today, we're going to be giving you those answers and breaking down the vibe coding boom, the opportunity, the potential crisis and why none of this is going away. All right, let's jump into it. Here is the big picture of what we're going to be covering on today's show. Because you can't escape the reality right now that AI has completely collapsed the cost of building software, but it's not all good.

3:03Right now it's estimated that about 41 to 46% of all new code written globally is now generated by AI. And right now, the latest update that we've seen, which is actually a pretty old one, is that 92% of US developers use AI coding tools at work every single day. But even Andre Capati, who coined the term vibe coding, has now declared it passé after only one year. It's because we realize that it's not always all good. So on today's show, here's what we're going to be diving into and what you'll learn if you stick with us for the next 20-ish minutes. You'll learn the top 10 vibe coding platforms that you should be paying attention to and their main benefits. You're going to learn what happens inside AI built applications at the 90-day mark that triggers a billion dollar rebuilds. And you're going to know the specific strategies that separate vibe coding winners from the casualties. Let's get into it. Welcome to every day AI and our start here series.

4:04Yeah. 700 plus episodes. I legit had no answer when new listeners would come in and be like, Jordan, you have a lot of podcasts where do I start? Well, you start here, preferably in order. But the start here series is the essential podcast series to both learn the AI basics and to double down on your AI knowledge. So if that's what you're trying to do, make sure to go to start here series.com. That's going to give you exclusive free access to our inner circle community. It's the only way that you can get in right now. And that's going to pop you right in the middle of our start here series space there. And you can go back, read, watch and listen every single episode in order all the way from volume one to today's episode, volume 18. And if you missed our last episode, like I said, it's best if you listen to them all in order. And volume 17, we talked about the responsible AI playbook and what it means in five moves to ensure your AI strategy survives. And that leads us straight to today because if I'm being honest, one of the things that

5:06when you talk about AI strategies, so many enterprises, new AI strategy is essentially vibe coding, right? Whether it's creating software for themselves or for their consumers or just vibe coding completely new ways to work internally, it's pretty easy. So if you are like, wait, can you hit rewind here Jordan? I'm brand new. I got you like vibe coding is this you describe something in plain English or whatever language that you speak and in AI builds software, right? So it handles all the database, the deployment, the coding, even certain platforms, handle the authentication payment platforms, all of that, right? So this is a term that open AI co founder, Andre Capathe coined in February 2025, which is crazy to think about because it seems like we've been talking about vibe coding for like five years, but it's been like 15 months, right? And I kind of called this out a month before, you know, kind of the vibe coding terminology

6:09even existed in our 2025 AI predictions and roadmap series. And I talked about at the time that non technical people would be building themselves software by the year end. And I think that definitely came to fruition. Now fast forward into 2026 in the vibe coding platform has exploded in the scene. And there's that handful of even different types or categories of vibe coding. And like I said, this is an exploding sector. So you know, as an example cursor, right there in AI powered code editor and they've already hit two billion dollars annual recurring revenue in just a few months after, you know, their last earnings report. But most of the people fueling all of this growth are not even software engineers as well or at all. So yes, you can have traditional software engineers or developers who are vibe coding. And you've seen this as well, you know, some interesting, but kind of, I don't know,

7:14heart wrenching is the right word, right? But talking, you know, reading these articles about, you know, software engineers with 20 plus years of experience and they're like, wait, these AI platforms do all of this now at a much higher level better than I ever can. Right. So it's almost got to the point now where, you know, if people know what they're doing, a lot of times experience software developers aren't even writing code anymore, right? If you look at Anthropic, which you could say is potentially the leading software dev agency of the world, right? Because their products, cloud code, cloud code work are some of the best out there, right? They say they don't even write code anymore themselves. So first, before we get into kind of the good, the bad, the ugly and why I don't think vibe coding is go away, let's very quickly now that you have a basic definition of vibe coding. I want to talk about some of the 10, maybe of the most popular kind of vibe coding tools. And they are in different kind of categories. And these categories, well, I define them. There's no exact definitions at the industry adheres to.

8:17There's definitely a lot of crossover and you can make a lot of arguments, but I'm trying to simplify it for our audience. That's beginning. So first, I'll say that we have the terminal or command line coding agents. So if you don't know what a terminal is, computers have a terminal and you can control your computer through the terminal, right? And it's becoming more and more impactful now as we see, you know, platforms very popular like cloud code work that you can literally run things on your terminal, right? So as an example, I always tell people, oh, I always have, you know, codex and cloud code work running and people are like, tell me what you have doing, right? So as an example, I have cloud code going right now. It's going through my 750 plus transcripts. And I'm thinking about starting a new kind of episode series where I piece together multiple interviews that I've done. I've interviewed hundreds of people over the years. And I've always thought, man, it'd be cool to kind of combine, you know, have three different people older interviews, splice them together. You know, I can go in there and, you know, narrate between.

9:17So I have cloud code work as an example, going through all of those local files on my computer right now, doing some research for me at the same time and putting together some ideas that I'm going to go through and, you know, work with. So that's an example of a vibe coding platform, right? Cloud code, cloud code work using the terminal. So runs in your terminal, it can read your whole code base and make autonomous, multi-biol changes. This is also important to talk about before we get into these categories in the 10 most talk of their apps is it's not just for coders. It's not just for software development, right? And I think that we'll start to see this probably in the second half or the very end of 2026. And I think it's not really going to become apparent until we get the new super app from chat, GBT where they're essentially going to be combining chat, GPT, their browser and codex because I've been saying codex is not really, well, it is a coding platform, but it's so much more than that. So keep this in mind as we go through these, even if you're not a software developer, a coder, right? I think it's important to pay attention not just to the rest of this episode, but to these

10:2110 different platforms as well. So first, cloud code, I'd say it's probably the most popular and one of the most widely used kind of vibe coding platforms, although yes, it is much more than traditional vibe coding. So there's a lot of great new features that have been added. And again, depending on when you're listening to this, you know, so if you're listening to this in December 2026, you know, some of these new features aren't going to be very new, right? But if you're listening in April, right, things like computer use, auto mode, clawed, or sorry, cloud, autofix for PRs, a lot of new things that have been released in cloud code. And I think this is kind of the terminal agent that just reads and rewrites your entire code base, right? The other thing that I've liked recently is the new 1 million context window by default in cloud code. So by far, it is broadly considered the current leader in a jet-coding quality and code base reasoning, but our second on the list here is catching up. So open AI's codex, you know, they recently announced that they have 2 million weekly active

11:25users in codex, which is pretty impressive for a product that's only been out for like less than two months, at least the desktop version. So this is kind of your multi service, multi surface agent system across the app, command line, the IDE and the web. So you can use, you know, codex in a lot of places. And kind of what's new or what's worth it is, well, the model, GVD 54. I'm always in codex using extra high reasoning. Yes, it takes a little bit longer, but in my opinion, right, if I'm running the exact same task in cloud code versus codex, cloud code is going to be way faster and it's going to look way better, but usually codex is going to have way fewer issues, right? And that's the thing too with these coding, vibe coding platforms, you can work a lot of them in tandem, right? When I'm working, I usually have cloud code and codex working on the same thing. Not at the same time, you know, I may have one with kind of read only audit access, passing

12:27things over to the builder agents, but codex, like I said, the desktop app just launched in February. And one of the cool things that they've announced recently is the ability to run multiple sub agents in parallel. All right, there's a lot of other that might fit in that category of the terminal or command line interface coding agents, but I'd say those are the two big ones. Now let's move on to the AI native code editors. So these are essentially full editors that are rebuilt around your AI. So these are for developers, probably a little bit more than even cloud code and codex who want AI inside of their existing workflow. So the big one here probably is cursor. And this is kind of an AI first VS fork code with background agents in multi model support. That's the big thing right there, right? Multi model support, whereas obviously, you know, codex by open AI and cloud code by in traffic, run those respective models. So like I mentioned, cursor did hit 2 billion ARR in February of this year with over 1 million

13:30paying customers. And then you can use the best models, right? So you can use open AI's GPT 5.4. You can use cloud opus 4.6, Gemini 3.1, or cursor's own composer model. Next, wind surf. So wind surf went through kind of a weird middle of 2025. There's a bunch of these rumors, right? So who's going to, you know, who's going to acquire them? You know, open AI was going to acquire them, but then they didn't, but then Google essentially acquired their CEO and some of their co-founders and then cognition acquired the rest of the company. But it is a great, agentic IDE, right? And right now that wild 2.4 billion acquisition saga. And sorry, I may be skipped over a couple of definitions. I don't want to leave you all here with Alphabet soup, especially in our start here series. But what I'm talking about, you know, I already defined vibe coding, you know, command line interface CLI, right? So that's essentially interacting with a vibe coding tool through a terminal kind of

14:33a different way to use the terminal. And then when I say an IDE, that's an integrated development environment. So that's essentially like a toolbox for writing computer software. Right? So it's a single application that combines all the essential tools that a programmer might need into one place. So they don't have to switch between a bunch of different programs to get their work done. Right? So to simplify it, that's what an IDE is. Right. So Windsorck is definitely one of the more popular ones, but probably the most widely used one, even more so than Curse, Curse, because of its parents is GitHub co-pilot. So that's Microsoft's, you know, kind of AI powered co-pilot coding tool. And this definitely is the broadest IDE support at the lowest premium price point, because it's only $10 a month, and they also have free tiers that give you 2000 completions across all major IDEs. And this kind of functions more as in-line code completion versus the full kind of vibe coding experience. And then you do have the option to have the enterprise version.

15:37However, we can't even talk about vibe coding. Well, number one, just because GitHub, right? GitHub is kind of like the, I say it's like the online Dropbox, right? How a long time ago, like Dropbox was kind of the big category for online storage. So GitHub is kind of like the online storage for, well, a lot of coding, but vibe coding platforms as well. And then Microsoft's GitHub co-pilot, right? Kind of their AI tool of choice there. And then last but not least, the biggest category here might be browser-based app builders. And these are probably your more traditional fully vibe coding platforms, although the first two categories, you know, you can vibe code anything, right? From zero all the way to app in those other platforms. But I'd say the browser-based app builders are maybe a little bit more popular. This is kind of your prompt to app platforms. You describe what you want in English, and you get a working deployed application. So I'd say probably in this category, lovable might be one of the more better-known, and this is essentially prompt to deployed full stack web app for non-developers.

16:41They have a new plan mode, which thing has been pretty popular. That previews what the AI will build before writing any code, right? A lot of the other platforms have that, Cloud Code has it, Codex has it, etc. But that's really helpful, especially, you know, if you are using or paying for these platforms via an API, right? If you're plugging in your own, you know, especially these multimodal, or sorry, multimodal vibe coding tools, if you're using your API keys, right? Some of them you just get a, you know, a monthly plan and different models that are more powerful, use more credits, but sometimes you're just plugging in your API keys so they can get expensive. So it is helpful to have something like the plan mode. Lovable also added recently built-in penetration testing, which is super important, and we're going to get to that later on, and that was kind of a first among vibe coding tools. Next, both that new. I'd say this is probably one of the fastest kind of paths from prompt to working prototype in your browser. And I also know there's so many other vibe coding tools out there.

17:42A lot of them even have become more popular late 2025 or early 2026. That was kind of hard once they got to like number eight, you know, I probably had like six of them that could have been, you know, number eight, nine, ten. So a couple of good ones were left off the list, right? But both that new definitely was probably one of the more popular ones in 2024. So this runs entirely in your browser using web container technology with nothing to install locally. They also have a great free tier plan. And I think this is best for speed demos and quick MVP's, although a lot of users say that overall it's maybe weaker code quality than some of their competitors. Big name in this space, obviously, replete. So that's their, you know, a cloud IDE, combining an editor database hosting in AI agents. So they just launched the agent launch with 10 times more autonomy, building apps across 50 plus programming languages. I'm a big fan of the, the replete agent. They also have effort based pricing that scales with actual compute and real time multi

18:44player editing makes it probably one of the stronger platform for learning and collaboration. Next V zero from Versaille, probably one of the cleanest react and next JS code from any AI builder. So this generates production ready components, you know, using tailwind CSS by default. And this is kind of involved more into a full stack JS builder over time. And this is maybe the least lock in of any platform because you can export standard react code that then you can fully own and use. All right. And then last, but definitely not least one of my favorites that I use probably the most right between codex. Cloud code. And then Google say I studio, right? I do use Google's anti gravity. That's another one that didn't make the list. But I probably use Google's AI studio a little bit more than anti gravity just because I've been using it for longer and a little more familiar. And in March, Google did add anti gravity agent supports inside Google AI studio, Firebase

19:45integration and multi player support there as well. And the cool thing and the simplest way to explain this, well, it's the free, right? They have a great free plan, probably a better free plan than any of the others that I mentioned. Free full stack, bivocating platform, power by everything Gemini. So you can literally in like five minutes, you can create a, you know, your own version of something like Nando Banana, right? And then make it, you know, specialized for your niche, right? But obviously if you're in your app, if you're using any of Google's AI, you do have to, you know, provide an API key to power that, right? It's not like you can just use Nando Banana for free, but you can literally create your own version of any of Google's, you know, AI. And like I said, they do have a generous free tier and the team over there at Google AI studio, probably of all of them aside from maybe Cloud Code and codex kind of, you know, those two and then Google AI studio are just getting so many updates so quickly.

20:46All right. So now you know the big tools. You just need to know that this is a growing industry and it is not going anywhere. If you thought vibe coding was going to come and go and it was just going to be some trend no, because vibe coding is turning into vibe working. And that's where everyone's going. I mean, even just look at Microsoft, right? Look at some of the things that they've introduced recently, like their Microsoft, cloud, or sorry, their Microsoft co-pilot, co-work, which is powered by cloud code work, right? Essentially a vibe coding platform, you know, Microsoft actually has a couple of others, but you know, it's coming to the common knowledge worker, right? And these platforms are growing quickly. So but there's an issue because right now, a study shows that 63% of vibe coders have never even written a line of code, right, themselves, which is it makes sense, right? Because yes, you do have experienced developers and you know, people maybe with a little bit

21:48of a crossover background in software development using these, right? And maybe it's allowing them to work in a language that they've never written before. But you know, it kind of started with, okay, people, you know, using this maybe they're, you know, more commonly web developers and then they're using it to, you know, launch React apps or something like that. But eventually it's turned into well, you have people who don't know what code is using these. These are builders that are just making quick prototypes. They're literally trying to replace enterprise software entirely. And it's actually happened, right? So you have all these stories of like, okay, yeah, you can go vibe code something and use it. That's cute, right? But you're never going to, you know, replace an enterprise piece of software. Well, companies have, right? I mean, we'll check in with them and see if that's successful. But, you know, one kind of famous example is hopefully I get this company, right? A ton of them. Their head of finance built a full CRM on Lovable, reportedly in three hours that they

22:51used to replace their $40,000 sales force contract, right? Zendask's product team cut prototype timelines from six weeks to three hours, right? So obviously you have a lot of vibe coding platforms where product teams or software development teams have gone from, you know, timelines that were multiple months to well, less than a day because of vibe coding. So I do think it's a, it's a very powerful tool when used by people who absolutely know what they're doing. But just as the market is reaching this everyone's vibe coding developer trust in AI code is just collapsing, right? And that's why there's a huge downside to just vibes, right? And going back to that, you know, my little analogy at the beginning of the show, right? If you could just talk your dream home into existence, but you walk in and oh my gosh, the floors are sagging. That's the risk that you run because it's not all good.

23:55Yes, if you know what you're doing, vibe coding obviously is a not just a game changer in terms of what companies can produce, right? Companies that already had software development teams, but companies that didn't right now will suddenly they can offer new products, new services, new revenue streams to their current clients and customers, right? But it doesn't always work out well because if you don't know what you're doing and you still push something to production, it's obviously extremely problematic. And that's one of the reasons why trust has gone well down. So a stack overflow study show that confidence in AI generate code actually dropped from 43 percent to 29 percent in two years. And one of the top frustrations for developers was that AI solutions are almost right, but not quite, right? It's almost like there's more than one way to write a specific piece of code, right? There's more than one way to design a certain website.

24:55And sometimes what we've seen and maybe this is with some of the companies trying to get more token efficient and not necessarily get things right again, that's why at least for me, sometimes I personally prefer using codex GPT-54 extra high. Yes, it's way slower, but it seemingly gets more things right with few things. Fewer issues, right? But that's one of the biggest problems right now is sometimes it might seem like an AI coding app will, you know, the floor. Hey, visually, it looks right if we make a cardboard floor or paper thin floor, but it's not going to function correctly, right? And I think the industry realized that it was hopelessly hooked on a tool set that it did not actually trust. AI doesn't really care too much, at least by default, about security. That has changed a little bit in 2026, but 2025 was a straight up security nightmare, right?

25:57From AppSec Santa 2026 study showed that out of 534 AI code samples, about 25% had confirmed security flaws, right? That's a very high percentage. But if you don't know as an example, if you don't know how commercial plumbing works in your, you know, Videcoded house, you're not going to know that those AI bill pipes were paper, right? A good example of this, which is notebook, right? So that was an AI-built social network for AI agents. Well, accidentally exposed 1.5 million API tokens from one database misconfiguration. So this is just examples of what can happen. If, well, especially as we talk about agentic coding and agents coding in loop with sub agents autonomously, right? It's a little different when you have an experienced human kind of launching the code and testing this out. But when we go straight up agentic, I think that's where we start to run into issues.

26:59And when it starts to get, you know, a little bit different, you know, kind of the prospect of demos over memos, I don't think anyone will necessarily complain about. And I do think that's where we're headed. And I think that's why if you're even a non-technical builder, I think in the future, it's like, no one's going to want to deck. No one's going to want to an email. They're like, just, just build me a demo of this now, right? Because you can do this, right? I've actually done this before on calls, right? Someone will be talking about something to be like here. I just built this. Is this what you're talking about? But if you don't know what you're doing, maybe it's just a demo, right? Maybe it's not something for production because that's where you will run into issues. And another thing is, well, it just generates code so fast, right? Newer models. Once you get over the thinking, the chain of thought, and it wants to start spitting out code, it goes so quick. So studies show that fewer and fewer experienced developers are actually reading the code that

28:02AI outputs, right? Some of the more famous developers of the recent, of the last couple months or quarters have said that they don't even review the code. You know, it was Peter Seinberger, so the open claw creator who was hired on by opening eyes. So yeah, if you don't know, open claw, it is the most popular piece of open software, open source software, literally ever. And he famously said, or maybe infamously said, I ship code, I don't read. And he's not alone, right? Most, you know, you've seen these stories from some of the head devs and theropic. People are just saying, yeah, I don't read the code, right? Maybe it's they have a lot of confidence in whatever product that they're using because they're also building it. But it's kind of like if a conveyor belt was crate to 10x speed, and you still just had one quality inspector that's just holding a clipboard, right?

29:03There's it seemingly as the AI tools get better and smarter, more efficient. Well, it seems like, well, we just trust them more. And when engineering teams can't keep up with the amount of code that spit out, you know, frustrating employees just start building software entirely on their own, right? And I'm talking about that manually, right? For more people as we start wanting AI and we know what's easy, some engineering teams that are still, you know, doing AI kind of maybe just code AI assistant and not totally vibe coding, well, they're backed up, right? Because now all of a sudden, companies software stacks have doubled or tripled, right? And what's this led to? Well, it's also IT sprawl, right? It's AI sprawl. So now you have code going into production made by people who maybe shouldn't be deploying code live, but this is also an issue, right? Because engineering teams that are still maybe doing things the quote unquote older school way or just using AI code assist or AI code completion and not straight up vibe coding,

30:08right? The demands on them are way more in, you know, non-technical people are just taking this into their own hands. So I always want to talk about this because I think it's important. I do think that vibe coding will quote unquote destroy traditional software engineering jobs, but I think overall, this is going to be a eventually a growing feel because there's going to be a whole new category of work that did not exist before. And I'm talking about rescue engineering. So here's this kind of this 90 day, this three month kind of realization. So engineers are calling this the three month black box effect. This is essentially when an AI built architecture becomes untouchable, right? This is when the house, right, that you went in and built after 90 days, you're like, wait, I forgot everything about this. No one knows which walls are low bearing the AI forgets how it built the foundation, everything stalls, right? So this is what we're seeing from developers.

31:11They number one, everyone's creating exponentially more code. And then we have things like humans are forgetting things. I don't know if you've realized this pre AI, I think I was smarter, right? I'm not saying that I'm dumber now. I just feel I'm less able to retain information because I am now with AI, right, with a gentick AI. I'm consuming way more information than I was previously, which means I'm forgetting things faster. And seemingly this is a kind of turning into a global problem where after 90 or so days, right, software teams are just kind of forgetting, not just that, but then also, yes, over the last couple of weeks, month or so, context windows in these programs have gotten better, yes, but still some of the apps that were built, you know, six months ago and it took a while

32:12to get it approved, but it's been live and now people want updates. Okay, well, we're way past the context window. The human forgot the AI forgot, infrastructures changed, right? And maybe the code was shotty to begin with. So this has led to a completely new category of work, which is rescue engineering. And I think this is one of the hottest new disciplines in tech. So studies have shown an estimated 8,000 startups now need full or partial rebuilds or refactors of their entire code base or apps. And those can go anywhere from, you know, 50,000 to 500,000 to a couple million dollars, right? You have a lot of AI startups that essentially buy coded a very popular platform. They just started stacking duct tape on top of paper clips, on type of glue. And then they just realized, oh my gosh, we just realized that our app, it's wildly popular. It's exploding and it's built on popsicle sticks, right? And they're having to go through and completely redo it.

33:14So how do you avoid kind of the fake dream house and build a solid foundation with vibe coding? Here is how you can do it correctly. I think first you have to kind of the realization that this is permanent, right? And even if your team may not be vibe coding right now, you will be vibe working, right? Using something like cloud code or sorry, cloud code work using something like Microsoft co-pilot, code work, something like the, you know, whatever the code acts, chat, chupy, tea, super app becomes this is going to become very common where we are going to be using natural language to build little apps, right? Maybe it's to build apps to finish our work faster. Maybe it's to build apps for consumers. Maybe it's replacing little pieces of software, updating pieces of software. Not technically, but they're going to be doing it. So you need to follow these rules, but also you need to understand the companies riding the waves without governance are going to pay for the rescue engineering and the brief in the breach costs. But the company's treating AI coding as a rigorous engineering kind of problem with human oversight

34:23are going to capture the real value. Because like I said, this technology is not optional, but how your organization governs it is entirely your choice. All right. I hope this one was helpful taking a quick-ish look at the vibe coding boom and why vibe coding isn't going away and how it's both good and bad. All right. Should we do more vibe coding? All right. Let me know. I'm always on the fence about this, right? Especially from a podcast perspective. I'd like to have something for you all that you can just kind of listen to in your car. You know, listen to when you're on the treadmill, walk in your dog, whatever it is. And not necessarily have to be watching something on the screen at all times. So if we should be covering more on vibe coding, let me know. But if this is helpful, you're definitely going to love the rest of our start here series. Remember, this is kind of made to listen to an order. They're shorter episodes. All right. So make sure you go to starthereseries.com. That's going to give you free access to our inner circle community.

35:23And you can go listen to all of the episodes in order. So thank you for tuning in. Hope to see you back tomorrow and every day for more everyday AI. Thank you.