Ep.29 – Boks battle bruised Blacks in Baltimore with Jamie Wall

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1:065G network, with no contract holding you back. And for a limited time, you can get visible for just $19 a month for 12 months when you use promo code Save6. All the features of Big Wireless Service for half the cost. Tap the banner to switch today. Terms apply, standard rate applies at month 13, see visible.com for plan features and network management details. I'll wait 9 rugby back for another week. The Wallaby is the one of series in Argentina for the first time ever. And I'm still not sure whether to be totally satisfied about it or not. The greatest rivalry series has headed state site for the fourth testing in Baltimore and from where it is wonderful to welcome back on to 890 rugby. From the DSPN Network in New Zealand, Jamie Wall, Hollow Mates. How are you doing? Good thinking mate.

2:06Yeah, you're doing great. It's great to be here in the US again. But I have to say it's a pretty sharp contrast to where I've just been. Yeah, I can imagine. You were in Santa Fe for six weeks. So is this a funny little add-on? This one? Yeah, I think for us, maybe not so much because we're here last year for a similar fixture and it's something the old blacksmith been doing for a while now. So it feels weird in terms of the series itself and the fact that a lot of people have considered the series to be finished last weekend. Yeah, yeah. Is this a series within a series of the T-Series matches playing south Africa? Yeah, it's a funny side of that. And it feels strange. I had to concede only a few weeks before the series that I didn't actually realise that

3:11the fourth test in the state. I knew there was a fourth test in the states, but I didn't realise it was immediately after. I thought it was a month or two down the track. No, no, no, they actually flew out. All of these moves flew out in the same plane. Yes, I did see that. I did see that. And something caught my eye on your socials, mate. The watergate hotel? Yeah, yeah, it's just... We're across the road for a little bit. That's with the old hotel name. Yeah, right. There you go. There you go. What a nice hotel. It looks nice. Very good. It looks nice. Very, very good. There's so much to get into from this tour and from the Springboks third test win, but I wanted to ask first, what has this tour been like? You've been there on the ground in South Africa for six or seven weeks. They're in the states now. Tell me about the experience. What's it been like? What have you enjoyed? What have you not enjoyed? Oh, I mean, South Africa was incredible.

4:13It's mainly because we didn't think we'd ever get to do this. Yeah. And the only way that we'd able to spend this much time in South Africa for work would be if they host another World Cup, which is obviously pretty unlikely. And so to be able to do this is DreamCov true, really? Yeah. For New Zealand journalists, because it's something that has been the 96 tour or something. I mean, pass down a folklore to us. Touring with the all blacks is generally seen as a sort of highest gig you can get in sports journalism in New Zealand. And South Africa is the ultimate destination in terms of rugby. So to both of those things together, it does feel really, really special. It's really awesome to just simply be there and do it. And be able to sort of come back and just go like, yeah, we're at the summit.

5:14We achieved something really, really important this year. It's the main reason why it's so fulfilling is because it's a challenging place to go. South Africa has problems. Pretty well known ones. I don't think I'm going to be sort of, I think anyone out there is going to be surprised to know what you tell them. But working in that environment as a foreigner, someone who's on deadlines, as someone who's on, you know, being paid to be there, some of the challenges are pretty stressful. Yeah. So it's been probably the most full on tour that I've done just in terms of getting work done on time and getting it out and getting it back. You know, it's just simple things that we take for granted in Australia. Like the internet, for example, like the fact that you just don't even think about the

6:15internet working or not. But then in South Africa, it's like she's rolling the dice wherever you go. Yeah, that's made life pretty stressful. Yeah, no doubt. No doubt. What about the teams themselves? Like it's obviously a sizable media contingent, commentators, writers, radio, TV over there as well. So have the teams made life easy for you guys over there? The all-ex certainly have. They always do when you tour with them. They take the time difference into account, obviously. Wherever you go with the all-black, you're immediately behind the New Zealand time zone. So having stuff given to us under embargo, having things done so that you get the most possible time to do it for the either the morning or the evening in New Zealand, that's kind of a given. That's happy for ever.

7:17But this time round, we've definitely had more access to the team. More access to the coach. We're done, sit down one-on-one, interview with the players every week of the tour. Oh, wow. We're not so much so that I had to turn one down because we kind of had other stuff on. So yeah, it's been really good. The media relationship with the teams has been really good. It helps that it's a much happier camp. And don't worry about that, man. To be fair, you're only going for six weeks and there you've just crossed the notion in several more times zones. So I have done a lot of things. Yeah, that was a 27-hour train from Jansby to Washington DC. Yeah. So yeah, it's been a lot of travel to some between cities.

8:18There was the altitude to enjoy in Johannesburg and Pretoria. And yeah, just like I said, the dealing with the all those things has been really good. The spring box, it's probably not seen as much of them as I would have liked to do. Yeah, because they have, she joked a lot of their stuff at the same time as your life. Yeah, right. Ressie's done us a bit of a favour by naming us team on Monday, two weeks out of the four. Whether it stays that way, you know, but. I do like it's been referred to as the first draft. And certainly, yeah, it certainly has given us something to talk about, to ask the likes about. But it certainly had the desired effect, especially after the first test of moving the conversation

9:19on from how on earth could you lose a game like that at Last Park to look at all these changes, Ressie's made. So yeah, he did it last year. I mean, it worked. I don't know if you know, I don't know if he doesn't change his team, but he did that on the second test. And I just kind of like to put a sour taste in my mouth, like it's just like had the roles being reversed, would anyone have been, would everyone have been so charitable towards them? I don't think so. I mean, it's not just spring box fans either. So no, and particularly when it does feel a bit pre planned, I saw somewhere on the socials that for the Cape Town test when there was, you know, changes made an hour before kick off and it seemed like a late change yet you find out that Oxygen Shared has his name embroidered on the number seven angels.

10:19So, you know, that's not a, that's not a late decision. So yeah, more from Jamie in just a second. But first of all, it is a will be a massive help if you can all with the red subscribe button down there in the bottom corner. Come and join more than 11,500 subs on YouTube now. We've had a massive boost through this series. So, so thank you and welcome to everyone who's who's jumped on board. Hit whatever you need to do to hit the notifications and get them turned on in the same applies for all the pod platforms as well. This message is brought to you by Apple Card. With Apple Card, you earn unlimited daily cashback on everyday purchases like groceries, merch or tickets to the game. Plus, it can be used anywhere. MasterCard is accepted. No matter your team, no matter where you shop, Apple Card is here to help you tackle game day. Apply in the wallet app on your iPhone today. Subject to credit approval. Apple Card is issued by Goldman Sachs Bank USA Salt Lake City branch, terms and more at applecard.com. Visible puts unlimited 5G data and hotspot in the palm of your hand, powered by Verizon's

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12:24So I made the third test. Really, really enjoyable games as they all have been South Africa winning 29-24 in the end. Was that your, at the FNB Stadium in Johannesburg, Soweto, Johannesburg, depending on which map you're looking at? It's an impressive looking stadium. The soccer city was the first time you've been there. And what's it like being surrounded by, or was it really 86,000 streaming box fans? Yeah, it was actually pretty much everyone's first time there from the New Zealand side. Anyway, I think the only, I think a couple of management from the all-way. So it hadn't been still around from the last time I played there in 2012. Certainly none of the players had. And I don't think any of the spring box had either. Yeah, that's a favorite. So it was kind of a new experience for everybody. Obviously it's a football stadium, so the engalls were quite short. Yes, I did know that.

13:26Other than that, it was a pretty nice pitch. But the standard stadium was the crowd that rolled in, hot crowd, man. There was a really, really enjoyable thing to be a part of because the atmosphere was really, really good in there. Also, there's a significance of the spring box playing in Sweden, as well. It was kind of cool to be a part of the wrestling knowledge after the game. And I think that if they can possibly get out of their, what is it, like, controversial obligations, two places like Yars Park or Loftus or whatever, you can see more games there. That was a really good advertisement as to why they should play games there. Interesting thing about that though, I feel like, because this game this weekend's copped a lot of criticism for being a bit of a money grab and why you play a game that's not a tradition going back.

14:29Well, you could kind of say the same about the 30s as well. Like, that is, it's literally called Socker City. Yes. Obviously, I think we can football. And I mean, their main reason for it is they can put more people in it and that's cool. But if you're gonna sort of have a go at Baltimore for not being like legit. I feel like you can make the same argument with it. I mean, at least it is in South Africa. Yeah, it's a fair point. How much else park holds what 65 is? Yeah, right. Okay. So, you know, 20, 25, 26,000 extra fans is nothing to be said about it. Yeah, makes sense. Yeah, absolutely right. The game felt like it had a different post match feel. A lot less nastiness, certainly, you know, online, obviously, where I'm seeing it. Was it a similar feeling there in the Republic and there in Johannesburg?

15:29Yeah, yeah, I think most people, I think, you know, I actually game could tell that had it been for the bounce of the ball here and there. Had it not been for like one mistake or had not been for one shot at goal. Could be a very different game. I'm not saying spring was wouldn't a one. Yeah, but it would be very, very different game because I think the spring was definitely deserved. That one, the way that they kind of ran away, like push themselves out to an insuminable lead was really impressive. Probably the best regular played on the whole tour so far, the whole series rather. Whereas the old legs just kind of did the opposite to be honest, they slipped out of. The the high speed and the high gear they were playing at in as soon as they were kind of bigger them out, slowed the play down a little bit. Started playing for scrums, had the crowd absolutely boring even to him to the scrum going down.

16:30It does feel very much like a game that was taken away from the old legs rather than the other team. Well, I mean, you know, the other team had to work hard for it, but that doesn't happen to the old legs very often. If they can kind of iron that out and stop theirs, late tries or late puny goals, then they're in really good shape for next year. It felt like when Malcolm Marks called his try mate, there was a real hammer blow, I suppose. It felt like that was the moment. So I think you they were fine because it had been a patient game to that point, but that was the point they knew they were on top. Yeah, yeah, was I mean, that that was one where I think that was probably the final now in the coffin, but the first one, definitely GC Creel's. Yes, yes, the way pushed off the record. Yeah, yeah, yeah, and it exposed quite a significant flaw in the old legs defensive plan. Well, exposed even more because that did happen in the first test with Josh Mubu shooting up over there alone.

17:37And I haven't twice in that test was literally a card doing the same thing. I would actually question why this evening, the small sky on the backline out there to tackle the biggest. That doesn't sound right and I asked every any afterwards and he said, no, no, he's supposed to be there and everything. So it's kind of like, okay, well, that's the first clear evidence that a coach has made a call. That's this new coaching group has got it wrong on that. I'm not saying that the logic doesn't work, but they certainly weren't sending the right guy off our line. Yeah, yeah, so intimidate the opposition there's a job for a wall satiti or a, you know, buddy, yeah, Arty Savir. You know, Quinterpire even. Yeah, yeah, yeah. How much how much how much do also how do how to box fans in South Africa compare leading a series to one to when it was, you know, only one all or one meal down even after the first test is there is a difference in feeling everything around.

18:46Yeah, I mean, you're never going to be hard priest if you haven't actually watched a game to find out what happened. Especially the school one. But yeah, they obviously don't join it and rightfully so, you know, it's it's it's a it's not called rugby's greatest robbery for no reason. Like there are people that I mean, I think that probably could have been a little more creative in the name of the, you know, the tour and everything. But you kind of can't argue with that key logic from them. Yeah, sure. Like this is this is the one team that beats the old legs. You know, it has the best win ratio. And it's your own selves and there's been a long history of playing each other on each other's turf. And so now hopefully even going forward they're going to. Just keep that going. Yeah, it'll be just you see how it does progress from here because there's there's no doubt it will it will carry on no no doubt at all.

19:47What happens from here in in in Baltimore, mate? I'm I mentioned in the in the post-mortem that I'm sort of not sure how New Zealand bounce back from that because it felt like that third test was one they had to win. The series and now that now they're down. It's sort of it feels like it's going to be a challenge for them now. What's the what's the feeling like there in the in the States? It's it's it's definitely a lot more pessimistic now that I severe. Luke Jacobson and. Quinty boy. Antipyre are all muscle. Yeah, yeah, that's three really important players, including the captain. So it's hard to kind of get your hopes up too much around the legs. So hopefully they can pull off one and kind of surprising. We're on back in the season because there's going to be nice in a wake up to. Yes, absolutely. Obviously the box have got injury concerns as well, Chaz and Colby's not made this this trip, but I think.

20:49I think Rassy talked about five or six others that were sort of in the squatter on the edge of the score. Yeah, I mean, who knows. Yeah. There has been I mean, one thing I would say is that Rassy has selected a pretty consistent team throughout the whole series. And so you know, he hasn't done that for a while with any other teams. I saw I'll be interested to know what those guys workload is going to be during the nation's cup. Yeah, I can I can imagine it will be fairly light. I can I can imagine a lot of the big guns. Maybe don't even make that make that trip. So I can certainly believe that. Two changes for the box then as I said there, Rassy, Rassy named his name is team early on Monday. It was awfully awfully convenient. Only two changes in the end, I mean, villains that comes in for Chaz and Colby and Morning, fundamental starting for the Cabus right out who's gone back to the bench.

21:54I saw a sort of stat and I'm going to say John Cardinalia, but I'll stand corrected if it wasn't John made mentioned that through the nation's championship. The box used something like forty four or 45 players and they've only used 30 in this series. So which goes to your point about selecting a pretty strong call all the way through. Yeah, yeah, I think we all expected. Rassy did just throw out some funky selections and try and you know, keep the old legs on the back floor. I mean, he's he's at least done one part of the trip, which is not team early in the week. But for him to, yes, like the same amount of guys. The all this way through is kind of speaks to the challenge of the old legs opposing them. Yeah, and that he can't really miss around with us. So yeah, I mean, I guess if I was the old legs right now, I'd be feeling pretty kind of vindicated that he's had to keep to his.

23:01Yeah, his top side who most of those guys are going to be playing in the World Cup, called final win this two, two, two, two, two next year. No, it's a fair point. It is a fair point. Tell me about this game, how's it being seen? Is it being seen in the States? The NFL season's obviously about to kick off with a game in Melbourne here on Friday, Friday morning, Australian time. So how much visibility is there of this massive international rugby game? Yeah, I mean, it's kind of ironic. Plain or rugby game at a football field, a football game at a cricket ground. Oh, yeah. And the truth. Yeah, are they playing one in Ireland as well? Do I see the NFL playing the bigger? I think so. Yeah, they play four or four games a year. Yeah, it's just kind of funny that it's worked out this way. In terms of like visibility, I couldn't tell you because I'm still a Washington.

24:02Yeah, I think that's what it's like to be a game. Yeah, if it's anything like last year, though, you know, you'll be hard pressed to find anyone who knows anything about it. And then on the Thursday, all the Irish fans roll down or the Oblac fans roll down. They. Dicked out the whole area around the stadium in Chicago with flags and everything. And the. The kind of knowledge of what was, I guess, like reasonably decent, you know, there wasn't hard to find anyone who was going to not go the rugby or at least kind of knew what knew that it was on. You know, but then again, that's me. We're asking within my own bubble. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So, yeah, I don't know. I definitely doesn't have the same kind of way to touch when in terms of, because I mean, the thing about the Irish game last year was it was very much the,

25:04the welcoming Gallagher insurance is a major sponsor and of course Chicago is the, of course, the home base. So a lot of what the Oblac stood in terms of media or commercial gauge last year was base rate Gallagher. They're not involved in this one this time because it's all being run through the rugby's grass rivalry, like that all events team and everything. So, yeah, I don't know. I'm asking you know on Friday and I'll be able to give you a better answer, because at least you play in the city with a fantastic implied. Yeah, fair, fair point. Could we, could we see a drawn series, but I'm not going to ask you who, who wins and because like because you're obviously going to say New Zealand, but what's the, what's the feeling like that we could actually get up with the draw series now? Oh, I think it's on the cards. I mean, if it wasn't for the bounce of a ball or a, you know, referees decision either way, this, this series could easily be three no to either team. That's how it's true.

26:05It's true. And that's how fine the margins have been. Yeah, and sitting on like your last haven't been scoring, haven't been finding points. That's good. I think it's a good thing tries to know something. Yeah, which has got to be some sort of easily easily has to be a weakness, this spring ball term over that same period of test matches. So that's the bit that's working well. It's stopping it is the tricky part. Yeah. And especially if it's set pace. So I don't know what the old works need to do. If I had to guess it's probably just get a bit more straight smart around. What you should be doing with referee and. Yeah, what you should be doing with referee and how that can be influenced and things. So it's. It's been a probably a bit of a learning curve, some of the younger more experienced players. I mean, I was chatting with Camberu again today.

27:05This is actually his first time in the was his first time in South Africa. And that would be the case for a lot of them because obviously they. Yeah, we don't we don't get that exposure through. So we have to look at the. Look at the team and realize like actually it's been a while since South African teams were in super good Pacific and therefore these teams would hit over there and experience South African. Culture and ways of life and be inside the stadiums and given New Zealand's history of success over there. If you went back in the old days over the last park and you played the Lions and you gave them hiding. And you were back there that later that year you'd walk in there going as this place is great. Yeah, we did really well. Just a rugby ground. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, exactly. So it helped it helped take away some of the mistake about playing the South African. Which is. Again, like one of the criticisms of modern taste rugby is that you know they made each other so often. Yeah, this was nice to kind of just be like it's four weeks, four teeth.

28:08And the one who really is the best player of this because this is a piece we're doing because really like it. It should be like this. You know, I'm not promoting the walk up or anything. But at the same time, like this feels like four World Cup finals are right. Yeah, yeah. And it's been it has been really interesting to see the the reaction. And the. The receptionist pose of the tour and some sort of said so many Australian fans just saying like this is this is why we need to. Bring rugby to us back. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, the way that you're fixing rugby is to. Go back to an idea that you've got kind of wiped out on the late 90s. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Why do you think Marginwise might might might gut feel. Yeah, it's essentially isn't it? What are you thinking Marginwise might might might gut feeling is that this could be like like it always is between. South African New Zealand. I get the feeling this could be less than a converted try or it actually could blow out.

29:11It could be, you know, 15 plus. Yeah, I'm. And either way. I'm very more towards the first option. I think it's going to be close. You always have to make some changes, but they are fighting. If they find themselves down, hitting into the last quarter of the game, it definitely is a lot more for them to play for. The air so it's possible we're going to see them. Leave all the series again. But it's going to take a pretty big effort. I can certainly guys are missing. Yeah, no doubt, no doubt. Have you just had the best time, mate? It's been a long tour. We've certainly seen the effects of that just in just what we've been recording, but have you just had the best time? Yeah, yeah, it's been awesome. It's been something that I think a lot of people in the media probably dream about and to be able to. You know, stepping off the plane and being like, oh my god, this is actually happening because we never thought this would happen again until.

30:11You know, we started hearing the rumors about 18 months ago and going wow, OK. Yeah, this could be this could be something we have to get on this trip. Yeah, yeah, that's been great. So, you know, I think it's great to see all your work. The DSPN coverage, but you know, even even before Martin got over there in South Africa has been has been really good catch. Catch Jamie's work with Martin Devon on the DSPN network in New Zealand, where you can also find the eight and only greatest rivalry post mortems as well. So thanks very much, mate, to you and you and Marty for hosting that. It's been great to have you guys spread our word. Yeah, mate. Thanks so much for giving me some some time on a on a on a so late evening over there in the States. Get some sleep. I'm real and real well keeping on you later with the week. Cheers mate. Yeah, Jit Lakes. It's a real thing for people. It very nearly kicked in mid episode. So I'm glad you're glad you've such a good only mate. We'll see you soon.

31:12Cheers mate. This message is brought to you by Apple card with Apple card. You earn unlimited daily cash back on everyday purchases like groceries, merch or tickets to the game. Plus it can be used anywhere. Mastercard is accepted no matter your team, no matter where you shop. Apple card is here to help you tackle game day. Apply in the wallet app on your iPhone today. Subject to credit approval. Apple card is issued by Goldman Sachs Bank USA Salt Lake City branch terms and more at applecard.com. Visible puts unlimited 5G data in hotspot in the palm of your hand. Powered by Verizon's 5G network with no contract holding you back. And for a limited time, you can get visible for just $19 a month for 12 months when you use promo code Save6. All the features of Big Wireless Service for half the cost. Tap the banner to switch today. Terms apply. Standard rate applies at month 13. See visible.com for plan features and network management details.

32:12AI is moving fast across the enterprise. But without visibility, it's just chaos. Different tools, different models. Different teams using AI in completely different ways. ServiceNow turns that chaos into control. With the AI control tower, you see all your AI across the business in one place. What it's doing, what it's done, and what it's about to do. So you stay in control. To put AI to work for people, visit serviceNow.com. Have Jamie Wall back on 899 Rugby. He's been having a great time in South Africa and now in the States covering this series. And it's been a battle for him. We very nearly lost him, lost him midway through this recording. So we're great to be able to catch up with him. Great that he's been able to give us that insight from what has been a man of two of these.

33:12Has been very, very enjoyable for him quite, quite clearly. And 899 Rugby is still all in on the greatest rivalry series as well, where I've been joined by Irish Rugby right at Pat McAry for live. And I think that's the greatest rivalry post mortems following each of the test matches. The third test post mortem very quickly became the most watched YouTube video in 899 history this week, which is just huge. So thank you all so much for finding us and watching and sharing and all that as well. And wherever you've found us, be on our channel via DSPN in New Zealand or all megaphone rugby in South Africa as well, which has been wonderful to be able to see. And we're going to collaborate with those with those guys. So make sure you are following 899 rugby to catch the live post match after the fall test in Baltimore as well. And you'll be able to catch the replays elsewhere on those networks as well. Here locally in Australia, super rugby all starts this weekend. And it's a much needed series dividing extra game time for our domestic players outside the Wallamies.

34:20Yes, it needs to be longer. There's no argument about that. But the most important part of service before the most important part of this about this series is that it's being played at all. It was since the demise of the NRC that missing tier of rugby has had an impact on on the local game as well. So the fact that this has been played is just the biggest advantage of all of it. And I'm certainly not going to be critical of all that. It's been desperately needed since the NRC became a COVID casualty essentially in 2020. So I'm fighting on stand sport as you'd expect. But it's also on the rugby.com.au YouTube channel. That's of course the next three weeks. So it kicks off there on Saturday, the Queensland, the Western force at Ballymor. And then the the Brumbies and the Newsewars Waritas in the little village of Bunga Dool to the east of the camera on Sunday afternoon as well. Don't miss as well. Our great coverage from a bunch of great riders meaningful engaged discussion every day at eight nine rugby on sub stack.

35:23Find us there and subscribe to the exclusive home of Jeff Parks column, hard regard a column, the rap every Monday plus more right writing through the rest of the rugby week as well. That then is another eight nine rugby behind us for another week. My sincere thanks to Jamie all for tuning in and for battling through is a very obvious jet lag once again. It was great to catch up with him. Tell us what you think and what you've thought about the greatest robbery series so far by finding eight nine rugby on the socials. You have your say right here on the eight on YouTube channel and on Spotify as well. If that's where you get tuning in from. And you can find the other socials as well at BMC sport. This is eight nine rugby we will be back in your ears this weekend following the last grads robbery test in Baltimore.

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