Doc Malik | A Thousand Words (Part 1 of 3)

0:00The threat is if you leave the cult, God will come down and smite you. Just everything shattered. Like, you know, there's no democracy. There's no media. There's no true journalism. Well, I grew up in a cult and then I missed them cult. Cult within a cult. Amy, arrive at the studio, I need a pee. So I quickly go to the toilet. David Hike, this is the far right corner. Exactly as I envisioned him in the blue sky jumper. No way. Taking a piss. I'm a little bit lost in this cell. Doc Malak, are you ready to be painted? Absolutely. This is very different. Yeah, well, you were surprised, weren't you? Because you thought you were going to interview me. Yeah. I'm such an idiot. Honestly, I just wasn't, I thought I was going to interview you and you're just going

1:04to be busy painting. And then you can have a nice chat. It's essentially that. It's essentially that. I think you're very talented. Seriously talented. Thanks. I love your time lapse videos and showing them with the kids and the paint's all dripping and part of me is like, paint's dripping and it's like, no, there's method to the bad. Trust the plan. Trust the plan. Yeah. And the kids are like, but there's no eyes, I'm like, yeah, just wait, wait, wait, you'll come. Yeah. And the eyes are difficult. I know, because whenever I try and draw something, I always mess up by the time I get to the eye. Okay. Do you do a bit of drawing? No, I've been color that. You know what it's like, when you just, yeah, one of the things I like doing with the kids is like, it's draw things we've seen. So we've just watched Pacific Rim and there's a big robot called Yeager and my son loves them. So we do competitions to draw the best Yeager.

2:05What I like about your art is that you're literally creating something from nothing and capture a lot. You capture like a bit sadness sometimes, bit of a pensive, then no one's ever smiling. That's for sure. No, I don't like that. Can't have that. Yeah. You're smiling. Yeah. It doesn't work in it. You see, you see people paint and they paint people with big T.C. Grins. No, I don't like it. It has to look, even if you work from a photograph, it has to look like you'd be able to hold that pose over a long time. Otherwise, it looks like a snapshot, isn't it, like a painting, really. And it looks, I don't know, because it is a bit more serious, it's more dignified. My wife would be great for this because she's got a resting bitch face. I just got a resting mic, okay? I can't smile quite a lot. Yeah, your resting face is sort of mildly amused.

3:08Is it kind of mildly amused, look? Which is not. I'm mildly amused at the world. Yeah. Just mildly amused. Yeah. Mildly. I've accepted things for what they are. Yeah. Yeah. Is that been a process of acceptance? Have you struggled with acceptance? And what do we mean by acceptance, exactly? That the world is completely not what I thought it was up until even two years ago. So not even the beginning of COVID. Even two years ago, okay. Just everything shattered, like, you know, there's no democracy. There is no real NHS there to help you and make you healthy. There's no media, there's no true journalism.

4:08TV is telling a vision and propagandizing everything, everything, religion, religion's not what I thought it was, religions. What did you think religion was? Well, I grew up in a cult. Okay. Catholic or Islam or? In a Muslim cult. Cult with an occult. Oh, a cult with an occult. Yeah. Okay. But you know when you're in a cult, you don't think you're in a cult. Well, this is... No one who's in a cult thinks they're in a cult. Isn't that the case of it, really? I got... I once got contacted by someone from the Church of Scientology. This is when my ex-account blew up after I spoke out against COVID vaccines. And they were trying to recruit me to the Church of Scientology. And I said, isn't the Church of Scientology a cult? What do you mean by that? What is a cult? I was like, wow, charismatic leadership that you can't question.

5:11Blindly obedient followers who police other cult members and make sure they obey, total control of your lives, social, professional. It's always an element of money involved, sometimes even sexual, things going on. And you can't question. And if you disobey or are bad, the biggest threat is excommunication. Uh-huh. You get bashed from the cult. And the reality is, there's a lot of those around. I think there's more than people really at first realize, isn't there? Many of them aren't even religious. No. Vaccine cult. Yeah. Climate cult. Yeah. Going on. Yeah, Hollywood cult, fine cult. So yeah, I was in this cult within the slam and I didn't realize it was a cult. I just thought it was a bit weird. It took a long time for me to extricate out of that. I think it was about 30 by the time I thought I've had enough of this.

6:14Oh, okay. But it's difficult when you're in that your whole life is that your community, your friends, your family. Yeah. And, you know, the threat is if you leave the cult, God will come down and smite you. Yeah. You know, you're bad. You're in a postate. You know, and then you start looking into history. History is all a lie. First world war, second world war, all the revolutions, everything. Everything's just been landing. Did that actually happen? 9-11. Well, that was not what we were talking about. So you just start thinking, everything you know about the world around you isn't actually as it seems. That can be quite unsettling and scary. Yeah. I think that's why a lot of people don't make that leap, isn't it? It is very unsettling. Do you think it's to do with our response to trauma? And, you know, if we were all traumatized on with some extent by our relationship with

7:19our family and predominantly our parents, and then we sort of become adults and think we've got some kind of normality in our lives, maybe. And then someone comes along and says, oh, well, not only do parents not really love you and properly in the way that they should have done, could have done, would have done. The government certainly don't love you in the way that you think they might be out for you. And I think just for some people, I don't know if you agree, but it's just too much, like surely someone loves me, you know, like surely not over. I think you're so right. So did you have trauma from your childhood? I did a great normal childhood, but at the same time, without being indulgent, I do recognize the trauma, you know. I think some people still have a kind of stiff upper lip kind of mentality, you know. And it's not to be indulgent to say, but because I think everyone really in this society

8:19is, you know, unless you've got very, very rare parents, you know, society and your parents will eff you up, won't they? You know, is it Philip Larkin? Yeah. So what is it that your parents did that could like cause that in you and how do that manifest itself? It was for a chiever, under a chiever, wow, just too laid back hippie on some respects and then too distant, perhaps in other respects, just dealing with their own stuff, not really knowing how to, my mom did, to some extent, communicate with me and teach me how to be open and I think there's a residual effect to that, but it's funny I was listening to your chat with Danny and you talked about some of the things your mom was saying to you. And still ongoing, yeah, of course, yeah, sure, but it reminded me of something, I remember

9:23being on holiday with my mom and we were walking on the beach and Van Morrison came on the radio. I can't, I don't know what tune it was and I just remember my mom turning into my dad and saying, it's funny, isn't it, it got a great vibe, I really like Van Morrison, but it's funny how it became so popular being such a little funny looking bloke like that, you know, and some reason I remember that, throw away comment, I mean it was a throw away comment, but some, I was 13, I was around that age, I was like, this is my role model, this is my female role model and she's giving me this message that if you look a bit funny, you don't deserve to be successful or you can't express art or anything. She didn't even think she was saying anything. Is this such a good point? You know, and when you're saying about how your mom was talking to you, you know, and her stuff, you know, you said it very philosophically and forgiving, you know, you understand that

10:27your mom's got her stuff and they still have consequences, aren't they, these? They have consequences. Things that happen, you know. May 100%. It's the tiniest, littlest things that, as a little child, you just walk away with and so, one day I realized it's not all sexual abuse, it's just psychological, just a lot of it is in your head and most of it is before the age of seven and then the way it manifests is you either feel that you're not good enough, that you're rejected, that you're abandoned. And then, yeah, and then that plays out as you get older, but I think individuals can be traumatized and families can be traumatized, communities, countries, nations, we can see that around the world.

11:28Yeah, I mean, you just go back a couple of generations, you think what they went, you know, because Nan, she just died recently, she was 101, she'd tell the stories about it, we're from Birmingham and tell the stories about how she was running from the planes coming over and bombing, she was diving on the ground and like the films, classic films, you know, as she lost her house, her husband came back, I think they gave him a lobotomy because of his PTSD from the, you know, just like a couple of generations down. And how? She was, that's the funny thing about trauma in the sense that I've been through a lot of trauma and it's made me quite tough and resilient. Yeah. So in some respects, I'm really grateful I went through that and I worry about my kids because their life is so easy and soft, are they getting the training to cope when they get older?

12:28So trauma's not good, but at the same time, not having it makes you soft and weak and not resilient. It's really funny. Yeah, was that saying, isn't there, good, was it strong men, breed, good times, good times, bring, weak men, weak men, breed bad times, what, what, it's a kind of cycle, I suppose. I feel the same sometimes with, with my son, but I don't want him to go through. I don't, you just need to see around him next time. Look at that funny looking man, it's funny how he got success with, I find to see Doc Malik, he's this bold, funny looking man, it's got quite a good podcast goes, really strange. And that's it. You done that. Yeah. Yeah. He's, he's grown up really through COVID, a lot of the development is before seven, isn't it? He was seven when COVID came, but he's quite grounded, you know, because we just talk about, I mean, I'm, I'm quite positive, like, I know this real shit stuff going on in the world, but my overall, I believe we live in a benevolent universe.

13:31So I, I suppose he has that kind of ground to, what makes you positive? Um, I suppose stuff that I've gone through and my own, uh, break down and rebuilding and, and, and taking things right back to basics and, you had a big done. Yeah, big, big break day. What happened then? Oh, I got no, should be talking about you, because I was just like, we can share our big done. Okay. But I need to hear your big done vote. Uh, um, well, I just left university and I'd done quite well and everything was sort of rosy, nice girlfriend, playing music in a band. It was all good. And I just read David Ike a few months before my friend had given me truth, I'll set you free.

14:32So my brain was all, like, just whizzing. And then I graduated and then there's just a point where, um, I was, actually, I was actually in Birmingham on the bus and some woman put a curse on me. And at the time, it felt like the worst thing. She put a curse on me. Yeah, she put a curse on me. How do you know she put a curse on you? Because she showed me a tarot card and mumbled something on her face. You are kidding. Yeah. Sorry. I've never had anyone curse me. All right. Well, what I felt slightly agreed because there were some kids at the back of the bus who were taking the piss out of her. Yeah. And she sort of turned around and thought it was me and I was with Vicki. We went together then, but we would. And she sort of did this and it, she did nothing. I had no power what she did, but it, it was a mirror to my rudderlessness, my, my not knowing. It was like, you know, fuck all there.

15:33And it was bang. And I was like, shit, and I was panicked. So I had panic attack. And I had to get off the bus to go and find her so that I could, of course, I was completely confused. I thought it was an external thing. It wasn't an external thing. So that whole process, yeah, I was very intense for about a year. But I suppose that what I kind of learnt through that gives me a sense of what's beyond all this crap, you know, what's really underneath it, which I do believe is truth, beauty, love. You know? What was it like painting Davidike after reading his books so many years earlier? Yeah, it was quite interesting. It must have been a bit surreal. It was a, it was a bit surreal, but at the same time, it was like, what, I'm painting Davidike. It was more surreal in my head. The idea seemed, wow, you know, like, had that read in 30 years later or whatever it

16:38was. This is insane. Can you imagine going back 30 years earlier and going, no, by the way, in 30 years time, you'll be painting this one. No. You'd be like, what the fuck? Get away from me. Yeah, yeah, totally, totally. But in actual reality, it was very normal and... You're drawing here something really funny, so I went up to the studios in Derby to interview him because Dad was like, yeah, come up here, come up here, it will just be easier for Dad. I was like, alright, okay. And I've never done that. Every podcast. Yeah. In the studio. I was like, to know what, for you guys, I'll drive up, so I'm driving up. I'm on this M1 and I suddenly have this vision that I'm going to arrive. I'm going to go in the studio, go to the toilets, you know, as you do, go to the toilets, first thing you do is go to the Wii. And as I walk into the toilets, I'll see David in a light blue sky jumper at the urinal

17:40taking a piss. Right. And I was like, I was like, fuck am I thinking about this for a while? I'm driving. It's such a weird thought. So, Amy, arrive at the studio, I need a pee, so I quickly go to the toilet. David, like, isn't the far right corner exactly as I envisioned him in a blue sky jumper. No, I wait. Taking a piss. And I'm like, I go, and I said, in my vision, I said, oh, this is very embarrassing. And I said out loud, this is very embarrassing, right? Not really. I was like, okay, yeah, it's funny, I had a vision that we were going to do this, but well, there you go then. And then he reached out to shake my hand. And I was like, no, you haven't washed your hands. Haram. And he still don't wash his hands. He just walked out. Right. Right. I don't know. Oh, God bless him. But yeah, it's a bit surreal. Yeah, yeah. And literally saw that whole exchange. That is really strange, isn't it? But 40 minutes before it actually happened. Yeah. Well, recently I've been listening to a lot of religious sort of critique, I suppose you

18:44could call it, a lot of the debates between Christians and Bible scholars. And one of the things that comes up, of course, is prophecy. I mean, it's debatable whether these prophecies really were prophecies, you know. Oh, whether they just wrote the men. Oh, just wrote them after. Yeah, literally. Yeah, exactly. Literally wrote them back in. Yeah, yeah. No, I agree. But even if they were prophecies, it's no proof that the Bible is anything other than... I mean, you just saw the prophecy. You know, we're going to start a religious cult around Doc, because he's been... Oh, no. I've already... I've already researched himself. Started early. Yeah, next to take a dive. Exactly. But the thing is, so my cult, the Amadea cult, was all based on prophecy as well. It's prophesied. And, you know, it was the promised Messiah, the second coming of Jesus, and the prophecies of John, the lunar eclipse, and the this and the that, and all these prophecies to convert and it's like, yeah, whatever.

19:45Right. So this is within Islam. Yeah, yeah. No, no. The funny thing is, other Muslims don't deem this cult to be Islamic. Muslims. There is a heresy. Yeah. So, I'm like... So, yeah, I grew up thinking I was... So, yeah, I grew up thinking I was a Muslim, and then I went to university and met other Muslims, and then they said, what kind of Muslim are you? You're like, you know, Sunni Shia, and you go, I'm an Amadea Muslims. So, you're not a Muslim? I'm like, what? All right. It was bizarre. It's so bizarre. Yeah. Because Jesus is kind of respected, but he's not seen as a Messiah, is he? No, no. In Islam, he's seen as the Messiah. Are we seeing? Yeah. Virgin, birth, maybe he's holy, he died on the cross, he was resurrected, and he's going to come back again. In Islam. Yeah. People don't... So, this is the funny thing. I thought the Islam thing was he died on the cre... He couldn't die on the cross because that was unworthy. The only difference is that they don't think of him as a Godhead figure, the Trinity. That's a difference.

20:45Really? That's it. So, you know when people... So, you know when people like Douglas Michael, they don't need to uphold Judeo-Christian values against the Muslim Horde, I'm like, hold on one second, let's just... Let's get, you know, three columns, Judeism, Christianity, and Islam, right? Right. Do you believe in the virgin birth? Judeism. No. Christianity. Yes. Do you believe that Mary is like, you know, this virgin Mary, and she's like this holy figure, Jude, no, Christians, Muslims, yeah. Like do you believe that he was a Messiah, Jude, no, Christians, and Muslims, yes. Yeah, yeah. Do you think he died on the cross, Jude, yeah, you know, whatever, Christians and Muslims were, yes, and he was resurrected and came back to life, and then he went straight up to heaven. Is he going to come back, Jude's, no, Christians and Muslims, yes. And I'm like, where's Judeo-Christian, because there's a, yeah, yeah, totally, I never really thought of it quite like that.

21:46It's the biggest load of nonsense out there, this is what I mean, it's like, it's just so garbage. And this is me saying as an ex-Muslim by the way, I've given up with all of the Abrahamic religions, because I don't subscribe to an angry, raffle god that insists on you shall worship me, and if you don't, you will go to hell. Like, what can I God do that? Yeah, it's insane. It's insane. It's insane. It's insane. But I mean, I talk about this a bit now and get on the podcast. I think the Old Testament is a story of colonization of earth by some, you know, entities, and your way was, it's a story of your ways, your way was just some angry warlord, essentially, or petty god. Yeah, I don't know if I even believe in that. I think all of these are just human constructs. I think it's all strong. Yeah, maybe, maybe. Like, you know, I don't subscribe to the chosen people, I mean, that's fucking great one. That's just a great one.

22:47You write a book and say, I'm the special one. Yeah. And then you go around telling everybody, look, I'm the special one. It's written in this book that I'm special, like, no, no, sorry, I'm not going along with that one. No. And it's insane. I think what happens is people experience something. So they might be going along on a certain path. And then they have some kind of experience, which is probably a genuine experience of the soul, some kind of connection with God with the divine. And then they frame it within this weird cult framework. And there's some truth in the Bible, there's some words of wisdom in the Bible, you know, some amazing stuff. But there's also a whole lot of absolute crap in the Bible. Same with the Quran and the Old Testament. Same with that. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But like, it's just too much. I mean, like, I haven't got the exact stories on it now, but like, isn't it, like, there's so many stories, like, we're like, some guy, like, likes another woman.

23:49She's married. So he sends the guy, the husband off to die in a water, he can marry, and like, why is that in the Bible? How's that a religious figure that, like, should we respect the thing? And then like, Islam has got one of the earliest forms of channeling. So apparently the Prophet Muhammad couldn't read or write. Yeah. But he's up in a cave, right, hanging out in a cave as you do with him, you know, his man cave, literally man cave, he's in his man cave. And then apparently an angel comes down and says, right, you're going to, you're going to write all this stuff down. And he doesn't know how to write, but he manages to write it. Yeah. Like, no, like, no, it just doesn't happen. Like, I don't believe that. No, I mean, so just me, don't. Yeah. I, I, I, I suppose I'm slightly less cynical, like, I, I do always say maybe, but, but does it matter? That's the, yeah, that's the point, isn't it, in a way, really? Because otherwise you, you, you can argue with people about whether these things are, you

24:52know, people get so hung up on, you know, the, the, the truth of, of the gospels or whatever or the, or the resurrection or essentially, what does it matter? Because do we need, why do we need anything external anyway? And that's, that's, that's sort of the crux of it, isn't it, really? Yeah. Yeah. I don't know. I think there's a lot of good in these religions, but, and I'm, and I'm conflicted because in one respect, I don't want to criticize them too much because I actually see that the, the evil controllers are trying to do their best to destroy religion and Christianity and God, which I don't think is a good thing. And I think they would love to have a one-world religion, which would be quite scary. Uh-huh. So you don't want to bash all these religions too much because then you're actually playing into that globalist agenda, but at the same time, I just don't subscribe to any of these religions. Yeah. I don't believe in their God. It's all based on guilt, shame and control. And like, you know, like take the virgin birth, like it just doesn't happen and then people

25:55say, well, it's a miracle. And it's like, no, no, like, no, and then he died for our sins. When does that make sense? So yeah, you do something wrong. But it's okay. I'm going to, I'm going to take your punishment because like, what, not, what, it doesn't make sense. It doesn't make sense. It doesn't make sense. It doesn't make sense. It doesn't make how you square it and how high up the theological person I've gone to. I've spoken with bishops about it. It cannot give me a good, fucking straight answer. No. And then we start going to Trinity and to explain that they all will do the same thing. Well, as a matter of faith, like, well, the, the, or the Bible said this. And I'm like, don't use your own book to justify that doesn't, it's just circular arguments. It's like, it doesn't make sense. None of this makes sense. All of them, all three of them. Yeah, I'm sure we're going to have to set love of the listeners now. Just had a go at Judea's and Christianity and Islam. Good. Now I, I, there is offered different choices and just because we reject one doesn't mean

27:01we, we embrace the other. This is the kind of dualistic thing, isn't it, that they offer us. And yeah, they might, they might be trying to destroy religion. But I think it's, I think it's very dangerous to think just because they're trying to destroy it. It's a value because I think they destroy everything and they just watch the chaos. Yeah, I've heard so many different things now, like Jews actually doesn't even exist. He was, it's just complete sigh up, written in, Jesus might have been the complete opposite to what they're saying. He was a rebel fighter and he was actually arguing after having been maybe, it took a way in India. Yeah. More like the Nostics that God is within all of us. That's what he's trying to tell us all that actually he wasn't this son. We're all the children. Yeah. We've all got God within us. I think that. And the thing is like, because where did all those missing years go? Because yeah. Like, you know, he's born and then it doesn't come back to the world.

28:02He's there to do something. 32. It's like three or something. And yes, I think the end of the end of record the last year of his business. That's what I'm saying. The whole Bible is like what the last year or two or whatever. I think so. Yeah. So I really, we're hold on. What about the middle track? And even the things like, like people never, like, you know, it's nativity season, right? But they never talk about the back story. Even as a kid, I was like, why is this young girl walking around in a strange time with this older guy who's not a husband and about to have a baby? Yeah. Like, where's her mum and dad? Yeah. Why should you give him birth in a stable? Yeah. Like, I'm sure mum and dad would want to be around. You know, what is the back story? Uh-huh. Who is maybe mum and dad? Do we know? Do you know? No, I don't think. You ever heard anything about maybe mum and dad? No. You think that's a bit weird? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I don't know. I don't know about it. It just starts from, and the three kings came, and they were in the stable, and then the baby came out. Yeah.

29:03Yeah, yeah. And then fast forward 32 years or whatever. Yeah. It was like, hold on. What's the back story? What about the big, big middle chunk? Yeah. And you just don't hear any of that. It's just a bit strange. A lot of the stories around Jesus had quite clearly lifted from other traditions. Yeah, yeah. You know, there were, I think there were lots of other Christs before Christ and- And anointed one. Yeah. And Virgin birth was a, you know, a common trope. So I think- The reason why I'm just talking about this is, I think anyone, everyone, everyone should question everything. And whether it's climate or even religion, question everything. And if you're in a religion, the danger is you stop questioning everything. You just start, no, it's a belief. Beliefs are very difficult to deal with. And I like to deal with objective truth and reality.

30:05Yeah, yeah. Same. And actually, when I don't know, I just say I don't know, and I'm open to everything. So you talk about, yeah, away or whatever, I'm like being some external, maybe. But you know what? Whatever it is to see it or prove it. So something that's just parked there is, yeah, maybe. Yeah. But I'm not going to be like, yeah, this is it. Yeah. I don't know. I don't know. Maybe I could be alien, could be. We could be an alien thing. It could be a simulation room. It could be a disc, it could be a that. Do you know what? I don't know. No, it's just. No, it's been out and come back, like out of this existence, it's like, for example, imagine we're in a massive snowball. You know, like a massive snowball. Mm-hmm. I think there's a massive snowball, snow globe thing. Massive snow globe sitting on my desk. And in that snow globe is this fantastic planet and little tiny people and cities and cars and airplanes. Now, all those little things in that snow globe,

31:06they have no appreciation of even this office. Never mind London, the UK, but that is their universe. And no amount of experimentation within that snow globe will tell them of what is outside. Sure. Yeah. Raw Living is a great company. I've used them for many years. Cape Magic has spent the last 23 providing the finest quality raw and organic foods at great prices. Their mission is to bring the finest raw vegan foods and superfoods to as many people as they can. I personally came to shot with them after diving into the wild works of Argentas funder planets and Western prices research on traditional diets. Raw Living is one of the few places to provide sprouted and activated grains and seeds. Whether you are vegan or not, raw living are such a huge range of quality products that you'll definitely find some great additions to any kind of diet. Be pollen, cacao, raw honey, chillajit, all the good stuff, nutrient dense and storeable, always a bonus in these uncertain times. Stock up and you get five pound off your first order over 70 pounds. Go to rawliving.co.uk. I think that humility is really important.

32:08I think it's lacking as well with quite a lot of so-called truth seekers. That ability to sit and sit with it, I don't know. I think it's one of the things that people find hardest to admit because they will lose face. I used to have this poem of junior doctors all the time. Okay, I go and operate on this patient. Have you done this operation? Yeah, yeah, have me have you done, I've done 40. Oh wow, that's quite a lot. You sure you're happy going ahead of doing it? Yeah, yeah. So off he goes to do Fixus Broken Hip while I do a ward round. It's like a Saturday morning, yeah. And again, a phone call from an assistant after an hour saying, where are you? I'm like, I'm just finishing up the ward round. Is everything all right? Yeah, I needed to come down this hip. I'm like, that should be off the table by now, what are you talking about? Like, are we sending for the tibiana? They're like, he's not even inside the joint. Yeah, he's struggling. I'm like, what? Why didn't he call me? He's like, I suggested to him and he said,

33:09no, no, he's fine. All right, gone. So come down, scrub off. And like, it's just a complete butchery. Like any of you know, and like, the operation hasn't barely started. Some decisions in the wrong place. Can't dislocate the hip to cut the neck. And I'm like, after you said you did 40 of these and it's just very defensive, you know. And it's all bullshit. And then after I have a ward round and say, like, you've not really done any of these into it. Well, I've seen 40 and I've assisted with a couple. And how many of you done on your own none? That's like, why do you? And it's not, that's not unique by the way that a lot of people do that. They'll just say, yeah, yeah, I can do this. Yeah, yeah. Hang on there. It's like someone who's not works in the NHS. That seems so. You're saying, you're talking about someone doing an operation on the hip. Yeah. And the decision of who does that operation is just quite a casual thing like,

34:11but yeah, I can do it. You're on a team. So you got a registrar. The registrar's may not be quite senior. And the problem is you're no longer working in team structures. So you don't get to see that other person operate on a regular basis. There's like 12 registrars. And you'll get allocated randomly on a weekend, a registrar that's on call that week, who you may never have operated with. So you say to them, are you at the meeting in the morning, are you comfortable doing this operation? And most people would, you would hope would be honest and say, no, I need some help with this. And most people do, but sometimes a junior doctor would just maybe not be honest with you. All right. I find that sort of quite disturbing. Well, disturbing, yeah, because you'd think it would be a very clear case. This person is capable, like, you know, four or five people to sat around and come, is this guy? Well, the thing is you're on, on your own in that weekend. It's only you, the registrar, the junior doctor below that.

35:15Yeah. And, you know, some wardener season, that's it. All right. And like, you know, week one after they've started their jobs, you've never met this person. They're working for a different concern. You know, you just don't know. Yeah. And you know what, when they give you a job as a surgeon, no matter what grade, at no point is anyone actually observing and checking how good you are at surgery. The interview and the whole process is based on, yeah, whether you've published any paper, research, what jobs you've done, extracurricular activities, references, no one actually, even as at the consultant level, we'll say, come and do an operation and let us examine you and watch you operate and see if you're skilled enough and competent enough. No, none of that is done for me. Really? Of course. Which I don't know if I'm just naive, but it just seems, it's insane to me. It isn't saying because there's so many people

36:17that are very good and have polished CVs. And are very good at bullshitting. Bullshitting. And then when it comes to surgery, they're, they've got two left hands. Yeah, of course, yeah. And I'll give you another example, a lot of the professors and famous people, treating people in Harley's street and all the celebrities, they're often the worst. All right. Just the ones they can talk about. The ones they can talk and market and just bullshit. The people who are really good, for example, at operating are somewhere in the middle of a DGH, in the middle of the countryside, just quietly getting on with their craft, doing a good job. And haven't got time to be writing papers and bullshitting. And even the papers, it's not like they're writing the papers. They've got monkeys doing the research for them and they just put their name on it. I mean, that whole, the problems with academia is just another conversation. Yeah. Yeah.

37:19Yeah, sorry, so for bursting the bubble. Oh, no, there's no bubble to buy. There's so many stories I could tell you that horrific. Tell us a couple. Tell us a couple, because this trainee, Dr. Once, instead of paying the rod, you know, when you break a leg, your femur, your tibia, there's rods for them. And the tibia has a different shaped rod to the femur. She wants to put a tibia rod down the femur. Now, so this is not like the checks and the checks. There's no one, there's no like double safety kind of. It depends hospital to hospital, supervision to supervision, whether the consultant's going to come in and supervise and operate, whether the red star is just bullshitting and lying and saying like they're better than they are. Yeah. And because again, asking for help means sometimes for some people losing face. Yeah. And that to them, if you're insecure in yourself, you will not. But if you're, look, if you're confident

38:19and comfortable in yourself, you happily say, oh, my second opinion, with my insurer, I suppose financial, there's financial incentive as well to bullshit. Is that like in the sense that, yeah, I can do that. I mean, presumably you progress further, you get a better salary and rather than someone who says, oh, I'm not sure how I can do that. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Sure, it's like even like in the private sector, you'll have someone who's like a hip surgeon, who does nothing but hips and then a chest. And then the person will be like, oh, I've got a bunion, can you recommend a bunion surgeon? And then the hip surgeon will be like, oh, I can do bunions too. They haven't done a bunion in like 10 years. And then they'll be like, they're operating on this patient, the private sector, and doing a really shit job. I know this because I would see all these really bad foot and ankle operations. I'd be like, who did your operation? I was like, spinal surgeon, a shoulder surgeon. I was like, what the fuck are they doing

39:20operating on your feet? But the patient doesn't know any better because they think, well, he's a surgeon. He's the Northpeak surgeon and he said, yeah, I can do it. And I'm like, awful. Whereas I would get people all the time saying, oh, can you do my carpal tunnel? Oh, can you do my knee as well? I've got a minuscule tear, can you do it? And I'd be like, no, I'm just foot and ankle. Yes, I've done hundreds of knee operations and I was a brilliant knee surgeon at one point, but I haven't done it for eight years. And to be honest, you want someone who's doing it regularly because if something like the chance is, I will do an okay job and you'll be happy. But God forbid, if something goes wrong or if there's a complication and you need something afterwards, you want to be seeing someone who does it regularly and they go, all right, that's a good point, dog. But the temptation for a lot of doctors is like, well, that's another private case, a little bit of money. Yeah, I can do that, wing it. Yeah. I mean, you get that in the middle of the media world, which probably the repercussions aren't quite so serious, but can you do Photoshop? Wow, you know, I know Lightroom, but I can do that. Yeah.

40:21But it's everywhere. It's like, you know, plumbers. Oh, I can do that, but I've got to work for you. Yeah, yeah. I can do a bit of that. I mean, it's like, yeah. And don't be wrong, there are some people who do are, like, really gifted all rounders. But when it comes to medicine, they're dying breed. Like, there was a generation that was trained and they could do literally spinal surgery and knee surgery and foot and ankle surgery. Right. But those days are really well and truly over because everyone's so super specialized, you know? I will only operate on the right little toe kind of thing. Oh, okay. Why is that? Why is that coming about? It's just the way this specialism is. And I think, I don't know, it's a deliberate ploy. It's just, it's a stupid thing. It's so disjointed because the thing is, doctors actually don't treat the whole patient.

41:22They don't look at stress. Your sleep, your diet, your metabolic health, your mitochondria health, your anatomy, your joints. It's now like, I'm just a shoulder surgeon. Or take for example, my friend, I was asking him, he's a surgeon, orthopedic surgeon, he was like, how's your mom and dad? And he was like, oh yeah, mom's had some chest problems. And, but, you know, she's just had her, you know, heart cardioverted for some irregular heart rhythm. But she's got this breathing difficulty. And I said, oh, you should have asked the cardiologist about it, you know? And the old days, the cardiologist had a stethoscope, listened to the heart, listened to the lungs. And he goes, yeah, I didn't ask him. He didn't have stethoscopes. And he goes, no, all I do is the heart. If you want the lungs, you need to go and see a pulmonary physician. And it's like, do you see what I mean? Like, we've just gone away from like, I mean, it's not even asking that heart doctor

42:23to listen, you know, look at the brain or the kidneys. We're talking about literally the lungs that are right next to the heart. And he's like, no, no, I don't, I don't deal with that anymore, it's like, yeah. It's not good. Because the reality is like, when it comes to health, everything's connected, yeah. Like, everything. And if you've got a very tunnel vision, you don't see the big picture and you can't really make people better. I mean, that's probably the fundamental floor in the kind of Western, well, not any medicine, but I think just the Western mind, isn't it? Is separation? Yeah, it's a, yeah, not a bit of a cliche, but the kind of Eastern philosophy tends to be more holistic. And all these words are a bit loaded, aren't they? And a bit corny, but I think there's a lot to be said for that. Yeah, well, I've had some Chinese medicine this year. I'm acupuncture, and I really like it.

43:25Yeah. And they look at the whole body system. Yeah. I think our son wouldn't, I've made it through to this realm, if it hadn't been for acupuncture. Really? Yeah, because Ricky had endometriosis and had an ectopic. And top guy, Dr. English, top guy in the country to do with endometriosis, diagnosed her and at Sussex. And she said, is there anything I can do diet-wise, anything like that? No, no, no, just eat what you want. There's nothing you can do, just come in for the surgery and throw it back to us in three months' time. Vicki just knew she was going to get pregnant. She was like, fuck that. I'm not listening to that. She researched it, she did a diet. Had acupuncture, she thinks acupuncture was probably one of the biggest things. Yeah. She felt it moving.

44:27She went back for the surgery. They went in, nothing there. No lesions, nothing, this grapefruit-sized cysts that they'd seen with this camera, just gone. And she said to him, what, what, how come? And he said, oh, you must have been misdiagnosed. He just, how, is it, how can you learn if that's your approach? Yeah, well, that's the problem. Doctors are highly educated and indoctrinated. And ignorant. All these cults, even religions, some people say those are just bigger cults, they will always have some good stuff going for them. Sure. So point, the benefit system. But the problem is, what is, what does it come with? Viral ligy is yet another pseudoscience,

45:27waky, waky numb nuts. Like, oh, that's not true. I've had a couple of podcasts that I've ended like that, like abruptly, like, right, okay, I'm done now, I need to, like, and it's just not cool. I was literally thinking about driving a noob, or, like, really? You're, what do you do? Like, how are you going to make money? How are you going to pay the bills? How are you going to pay the bills? How are you going to pay the bills? How are you going to make money? How are you going to pay the bills? How are you going to make money? How are you going to pay the bills? How are you going to make money? How are you going to pay the bills?