Digging Into the Word: The Kingdom Was Never About Getting to Heaven │ BardsFM

0:00[" zzy bumpy cymbal theme play oup vídeos chimes s beat the Quran emphasizes the music playing the free sky. reciting Presented by snowflakes tenim Hey, good afternoon all and welcome to digging into the word with Brad Cummings and myself. Today is the 6th of September in the year 2026. Before we get going today, I want to highlight a really amazing specialist going on over at EMP Shield. That's EMP Shield.com. They have a Labor Day special right now and so normally when you use your Bard's Code BARDS, you get $50 off and just looking as an example of here for a vehicle device which is retail prices $399, $399 when you

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2:09veteran owned company and they've all been tested by the highest level of agency in the nation, including the highest standards set out by DHS. So this is a great time to pick up one of these devices. Again, this is like 72 hour sale. That's what I just got noticed on. So it's a very short sale, but take advantage of it for this weekend. So again, use your barge promo code and then if it doesn't automatically load the second code, which it did for me, the second code is Labor Day, L-A-B-O-R-D-A-Y Labor Day as one word. And you can do all of that at checkout. So check it out, EMP Shield dot com. The link is below your promo code is Bards and your special Labor Day code is Labor Day. All right, let's jump into digging into the word with Brad Cummings of myself. Well, everybody, we're back. Brad Cummings and I, with digging into the word. And Brad is now officially 60 years old. This one appoints us out. So that was the previous weekend when I was down there. And it was a wonderful gathering of friends of Brad. And I'm very honest, very honest for myself, since in the

3:14scope of Brad's life, I'm kind of the newbie on the block. And it was a really wonderful experience just listening to the testimonies of the different ways that Brad has affected people's life in such a positive way. So just, it, there's a lot about Brad that we don't know and I don't, I don't think it's Brad's responsibility to have to detail his life. But just from a person who has not heard a lot of that and to be able to sit and listen to a sizable group just randomly just come up and give testimony. It just really speaks to the Brad's faith and the way he's walked in his life. And it was just a really wonderful experience. So happy birthday belated by the wife for the whole audience. Thank you, my friend. It was a, it was a sweet time. Yeah, it really was. Man, I left with a heart rather full. Well, and it was really well put together. I mean, it compliments to you and Kelly and, and the family. I mean, it was, even just a very nice event. It was,

4:17it was not overdone when I say that, but it was just so comfortable and you created a great environment. And just for people to feel comfortable, it was nice. I mean, that was evident because just some people understand like the way it was set up in the backyard is that people can just come up at a certain point and just grab them. There was a mic and just a simple PA and you could just talk. There's about 50 people there, roughly, I think, right? Yeah, about 50, 70 people. Yeah, I mean, I think that's, that in itself is a pretty significant indication of your walk. People flew in from a whole bunch of places. I'm going like, wow, I just, I just wanted to do to know that you were invited. The fact that you showed up was pretty amazing. Yeah, I think it was really nice. It was nice event. And just a very casual, which was nice too, wasn't, you know, no, it's stuffiness. When I say that because those things can get, they can get out of hand. And it was just very relaxed. It was really nice and opened up your whole house to everybody, which was great. It was just really nice. So anyway, my favorite was that Jesus showed up. Yeah, you did for sure, man.

5:19You know, we had a beautiful time of worship. And then at the very end, my daughter had this desire to sing a song. So she was trying to talk with, you know, the guy who led worship was the very first worship leader I worked with. And it was just, it was so much history and fun. And it was, he kind of said, that's all you want me to do is just got way too many chords. You better just do it yourself. And so she sang it, acapella. And man, the atmosphere in that moment just absolutely changed. Yeah. And I just went, wow, Jesus, thank you. That was a special gift. Yeah, it was, it was a really nice time. So thanks for having me down. It was great. Just so it's, yeah, it was nice. Thank you for being there, my friend. Yeah. It was, my longest trip back was getting to LAX and getting out of LAX. Yeah, escape from LA does take greater supernatural power. Wow. I'm telling you know, that flight is own. I thought it was two and a half. It's only an hour and 45 from Eugene. And the drive, you said this to me too. It's like, you're going to feel like you need to pull it. The drive is longer to the airport than it

6:20is flying wherever you're going. Yeah. Depending on traffic, absolutely. It's just crazy. So yeah, anyway, it was really, really wonderful. So you wanted to kind of touch in today, I think, on faith in a different way. And then I'm just going to kind of let you open that up. Well, just kind of picking up from, you know, it's been a couple of weeks, but we looked at Jesus as very first sermon, which was kind of crazy because it's like he talks about out of Isaiah. He says, you know, the spirit of the Lord was upon me. He's anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor. He sent me to proclaim release to the captives and recovery of sight to the blind to set free those who are downtrodden. And then here's the big punch and to proclaim the favorable year of the Lord, like the very first thing he's doing is saying the Jubilee. And it's awesome. The response, he even closes the book, gives it back to the attendant and then sits down. So today, these words are fulfilled in, you know, in your story, like, whoa, and everyone, wow, that's

7:21so amazing. And they just have amazing thoughts of he's, you know, this rabbi, he's saying great things and isn't this Joseph's boy. And then he talks about Naaman and this widow woman from, you know, bail country. And they're so pissed off that he goes right to that that they want to kill him. I'm going like, my first sermon was better than that. It's like, yeah, they wouldn't want to kill me. They at least like, oh, good job. But I thought it was so amazing that those are Jesus first words as a missile shot over the bow. And you're going like he's confronting their racial superiority lens through which they've heard and expected what God's about to do. There's a, there's an interesting piece I just want to throw in here. And this seems like there's a journey that I don't know that I've heard this talk about, but it just appears to me that part of this whole just following of

8:22Christ is also a journey of unraveling the old covenant. Is that a fair assessment? Yeah, I mean, I think it's interesting. If here's homework assignment for everybody, I think we'll touch on this a little bit. But if you looked at each one of the gospels and you just paid attention, what are the first red letters that show up? You know, these are the very first most important things that the disciples are trying to convey of what Jesus' message was. I think those would be stunning for people to realize out of each one of the gospels, where do they start with the most important message to convey? It's good. No, it's good. I'm going to dig into it. It's good homework for people. What's amazing to me is Luke is basically going right for the whole bit of this is about the favorable year of the Lord. This is the old testament expectations that the kingdom is about to happen. And you know, in Mark, the very

9:26first things that go on is repent for the kingdom of God as at hand. And it's like, what would the old testament people have thought the kingdom was going to be? That's good question. That's good. Yeah. Yeah. Do you have any thoughts? I mean, it's not not testing you. No, no, no, I'm actually just saying I'm kind of thinking because if you're living under this principle, which is like, we have to prove God our worthiness, which is essentially old covenant, right? I mean, we have to prove that we're worthiness. I don't I think that there's a big question mark. Wouldn't there be a big question mark of if I can even get to heaven? It wouldn't that be in there? Well, you know, it's interesting. No where in the old testament. Do they talk about our going to heaven? That's interesting. Isn't that a mind-blower? Yeah, it is. It is, absolutely. I mean, nowhere in all the Torah, do they talk about quote the afterlife? Hmm. So everything is heaven to earth, basically. Everything is about marrying heaven and earth now. And our life is not trying to so much prove ourselves

10:33worthy. So we get the reward to go to heaven. It's the how do we walk in the ways of God now? Well, that's good. What is that supposed to look like? Yeah, that's huge. And I'm going to like, how have we so lost that basic foundation? It's a great question. And I think that too often, and I'm even speaking to myself the way I used to call this, it was very simply put like 501c the commercialization of the church, but it's a it's a deeper legacy than that. It's a drift. It's not just the commercialization of the business of religion. That's a problem in and of itself. They were having that in Jesus' day. Right. They had turned the sacrificial system into a money-making thing for the priests. The more that people send, the more they had the sacrifice, the more they had the sacrifice, the more they had to come and exchange. And that's how the priests made boatloads of money. Pretty good drift. It's it's it's it's perfect now. They're doing the same thing. That's kind of why I kind of hung up my my cloth and sort of said,

11:37not I'm not going to do the professional paycheck thing. Right. Yeah, that makes perfect sense. Because when should you do that? There's going to be a follower of Jesus. Right. And I love his church. It's just I don't think it's the building that we go to. It's the who we are as we gather around him. Absolutely. So what's I mean, it's expanding on the because I don't know that I have an answer of what they thought heaven was like and that was because I kind of framed it because to me, there was a conditional in there with the old covenant. Like, am I going to be able to get there? Do I have enough money to pay for or enough offerings to pay for my my sins? But but but again, that wasn't their expectation. They weren't thinking of the afterlife. Okay. So then so what was that framing then that they were all focused on the kingdom that they were thinking of is that God is here ruling and raining in our midst and he'll do that through a guy called the Messiah. And it's going to be after like like into King David. So like the promise was there would always

12:37be a king on the throne like David from his lineage. So there. So when all of a sudden they're subjected to Rome and they're under the tyranny of somebody else, their expectation is that the Messiah that shows up is going to kick Rome's ass and overthrow things and he's going to set them back up as the people of God and they're going to rule over all the nations in his stead. And so they're expecting you know the Messiah to come like Magaman. Right. Right. Honestly, he's going to he's going to remove the deep state and everyone that's ruling over us and he's going to put us back in power, which is an interesting way of looking at it because that's ultimately setting a condition for even how that whole sia was built. I would argue. Yeah. And I think the question is is we're so focused on the difference between heaven and hell. We threaten people with hell in order to get them to want to go to heaven. And I kind of go like we're looking at a destination. We're not

13:43looking at a relationship. Right. Right. And I'm sitting going like well at that fundamental flaw number one, do you know that nowhere in the book of Acts, which is like this is the birth of the church. And this is the quintessential understanding of how the message gets started. Nowhere do they ever mention the threat of hell anywhere in the book of Acts? It's fascinating. So much of that imagery too actually in more of the modern trend though derives itself from things like Dante's Inferno. There's a whole bunch of that imagery that comes out in the kind of post church when I'm talking about like the rise of the Catholic Church era, which so much of that is it became standardized when jugglery. It emerges in the fourth century. And Augustine is this incredible church father that everyone reveres. But he didn't even know Greek or Hebrew. All he knew was Latin. And so the problem that we have is the message as opposed to the kingdom of God that Jesus was talking about. We're now looking at an imperial kingdom

14:50post-constantine when he merged you know church and state together. Wow. And then because they they were so like furious with the Jewish people at the time, they wanted to remove any and all connection to anything of Jewish heritage. So instead of following the feasts, we then followed the other pagan festivals and Passover became Easter. And you're just going like, wow, we have messed up and we've lost our foundations. And then we have a gospel that's declared from the empire. So we have a language of empire that takes over an understanding of what kingdom was. And we're still under that rule and reign today. When Daniel outlines the beast nations, the fourth one is the iron beast. And that's Rome. And then it's the little horn and that's religious Rome. And the only next empire that comes is the stone kingdom that God sets up that

15:55takes over everything. So arguably we're still under religious Rome and its empire thoughts of the kingdom. So expand on the, you and I have had a lot of conversations about this just for everybody's sake though, expand on what the stone kingdom, it sounds like an interesting way of framing God's world. Yeah, well, the whole idea is you get this statue that Nebuchadnezzar sees in a dream and you got the golden head, you got the silver arms and the bus and then it goes down to bronze, which is the torso, and then you got the iron legs. And at the very end, you have this feet of mixed clay and iron that don't it here to each other. And then this stone comes out of nowhere and hits the feet and it pulverizes everything. And the interpretation of that is that these are the empires that God's allowing to rule over the world. And the reason it does is he takes dominion

16:58away from the people of God in the time of Jeremiah because they forsaken the kingdom, they forsaken the covenant and they forsaken God and they're going after other gods. So what does God do? He says, okay, if you're going to worship those guys, let's let you have it. So God's not up there like I'm pissed and I'm going to get you, it's more like I'm going to let you experience the fruit of what you're worshiping. And it's the desire to bring us to a place of repentance because when we are experienced the fruit of what we're doing and we don't like it, that's supposed to invite us to a place of repentance and changing our mind, changing our thoughts and changing our legions. Well, you would think there's plenty of that going on today. I think most people just aren't a shick, they're a fistic god, they're mad at him going like, wait, I expected blessing and provision and all this wonderful stuff. And when I don't get what I want, I throw a fit. It's like, you know, a little two year old throw themselves down on the ground and just scream. Yeah, it's good analogy. Yeah. And I think God kind of says, well, you know,

18:01I'm not here to hurt you. I'd love you to come. I want you to, I want you to worship me, but I'm not going to force you to. I want this to be a love relationship that's voluntary and done in agreement. So whatever you want to worship, go after, but I'm going to let you experience the fruit of what you're doing. Right. That's called reality. Yes, it is. I mean, God is the best parent there ever is. And I don't think we recognize that that he's not trying to punish me. He's trying to grow me. Right. And when I'm off track, the best way to grow me is for me to experience the fruit of what I'm doing. And if I don't like that, that's meant to be a moment for pause and then go, hmm, maybe I should shift things. It's good. Absolutely. No, I'm expert. That's the, that's the God who is. That's not Brad's friendly version of God. But you know, when we have framed this whole

19:03thing through the fear of hell and the one day I'll go to heaven, I lose the dynamic of what I'm doing right now. And I think that God's trying to punish me, or I think I'm in trouble all the time. And one of the things we looked at is that that widow woman from Zarafath, here miraculously God has provided for her, her son and for Elijah for a whole year at a time of famine. And then all of a sudden her son gets sick and she's thinking, oh, the prophets here to expose my sin. That's why this is happening. And one of the things I just stopped to point out, that's our religious impulse. That when things are not going well, the first thought we have is, oh, I've messed up. I'm in trouble. God's mad at me. I think that's unfortunate because I don't know that God's the one who's doing that to us. I think that's the outcome of where we've been

20:04and what we've been. And if I think God's mad at me, he's not the guy I turned to. Well, it seems like that is at the root of the fall because there's a we just were kind of like self-inflicting guilt upon ourselves that goes back to the misperception of what God has done all along. I don't know. Yeah. Shame causes us to hide. And we also have become too aware of our nakedness and yet God's not the one who's surprised or confused. He knows exactly the condition we're in and he's coming near to help us. If that was your perspective of God, he'd be the first person you turn into in a time of trouble as opposed to the guy you run from and hide from. Right. But isn't that ironic because that's almost the story about him and he. Oh, it totally is. Right. That's pretty. And the two questions that come out of the garden is, where are you and whose voice are you listening to? Right. Right. Well, if you want to help life happen,

21:10start with those two questions related to everything. It's like, where are you and who are you listening to? That's good. You know, it is like we talked about that that widow woman on the righteous, the unrighteous judge and how the posture that we're supposed to be in that Jesus is wondering when I return will I find faith on the earth? He's looking for people who understand right and wrong and who are immovable in demanding that right be done on the earth and justice be established. So I want to add this a little bit because that was actually really impactive in that discussion for me just in my own prayers and meditations. And really where I have looked at that as a deeper layer was not just in the sense of right and wrong, but in every single aspect of my life because there's things that sometimes we're all stressed with or whatever that is. And you're you're pushed to that limit. And the question is, are you constantly in faith with God

22:13and trusting in Him to deliver or are you trying to take the reins your own question, doubt, fear, anger, whatever those things are? And that to me is the kind of the nugget on all of that is how it applies to every single thing we do in every bit of action, relationship in the world and how we're bringing God into our lives. Yeah, you know, this whole gospel of the kingdom, the kingdom is what the gospel is about. It's not the gospel of salvation. It isn't the gospel of going to church and it isn't the gospel of your afterlife. How crazy is that? Well, it's significant. I mean, even had someone sending me a question over the weekend, which is interesting, but more of a just a thing to look at. But it's we pose Jesus as the one who releases us from our sin. So it becomes a whole process of salvation, not a process of

23:18relationship and yet the thief on the cross to me is a relationship of truth in the heart right there. Yeah, but salvation, what it means to us, the one the definition that I think we've imbibed and inherited is the idea of one day I go to an everlasting destination. That's everywhere. That's exactly how I would say most Christians see the world right there. But we looked at the definition, John 17, I think verse seven. This is eternal life that you might know him. Right. That's not infinity of days. That's a quality and a character of a relationship of God's life. Yeah, it's pretty amazing. That's my having intimacy with the life of the eternal one. And salvation is not something I one day get. It's the entrance of God's life into me now.

24:19And it's my walking that out and reflecting that to the world. Well, that's good. I mean, it's like if we it's like, you know, earth is not my you know, earth is not my home. It's like, yeah, it is. Emily tells me or I can't wait till I get out of here. That's a great. Well, it seems like everybody that has been inculcated with the gospel of the modern day church can't doesn't want to be here. They all want to go to heaven. And I'm going like, yeah, but do you understand the entire Bible is focused on heaven coming here? And if you just go to the end and read about it, that's exactly what it says. We'll no longer have need for the sun or the moon because God's coming to dwell with us on the earth. It's a new earth and it's like new earth new heavens. God isn't destroying the old one. He's making everything new.

25:23He's renewing it. He isn't roasting it and then giving you a brand new one that created out of nothing. It's we're here to establish God's kingdom here on the earth in how we live and how we relate to one another. It's good. I mean, the entire old Old Testament, the 10 commandments, it's all about how we relate to God and how we relate to one another. Welcome to the kingdom. Hey, man, it's good. Yeah. It's like, why did why did none of the prophets talk about, hey, I can't wait till you one day go to heaven. I mean, find me that verse in the Old Testament. It's not there. No, I mean, and if someone could find it, please do because I'm pretty sure I'm under this impression. That's not the focus. Right. So when Jesus shows up, he's kind of run encounter to everyone's expectations.

26:24But if we're really paying attention to the stories, Brad, I mean, in fairness from Old Testament through, which is all those stories are in the life that we're living and the relationship that God is trying to build ultimately. That's that's really what it's about, but that's really not the dominant perspective of the people. They're kind of like they have, they're expecting something else. Well, and I'm thinking of like Abraham sacrificing his son, right? Like to that point, like right to that point. And then suddenly God intervenes and says, no, I mean, that's there is such immense faith. That even to that last moment, but, but, but we talked about this briefly. It's worth reminding for anyone who wasn't there to hear it. Why in the world did God ever ask that of Abraham? Well, and I, I don't remember our whole discussion. I mean, when I get out of that is just like, it's the obedience in what he said to, and you, there's, you added much more to this.

27:25I'm my perspective is always that it's the obedience to God's word and being willing to go that ultimate line because your faith is so strong. Yes, that's there, but I think it's God trying to say, hey, I'm about to change your whole approach to religion. Okay. Child sacrifice was common. Fair enough. And the whole notion of relating to deities was through the lens of appeasement. I somehow have to take away their wrath by offering them something. That's good. So sacrifice is seen through the gift of a bribe. I must appease the angry gods. Well, and it's all that. I sacrifice the way that it's framed is that consistent across all histories, all religions. And I'm pretty sure everyone still has that as the main understanding of sacrifice. Mm hmm. Do you know that the Old Testament sacrifices had no such connotation at all? Would that be a shocking statement for me to make?

28:28No, but I think it's worth expanding on. I think it's pretty interesting because you've already promised it pretty well. Like we're not, we've drifted so far away from the core, right? See, we think the sacrifice is somebody has to pay a debt or something. That's how we've had the gospel proclaim to us. So our focus is on the death and the cost. As opposed to what God's center of message was, I am here to give you life. And the sacrifice is a way in which life is given to you. The death does not save you. It's the gift of that life in the laying down of that life that says, okay, I'm now transmitting this life to you because you need life. This is how this happens. And Jesus is the sacrifice once for all the blood of bulls and goats could never take away sin.

29:31It only covered it for a year. It's like we're only, we're only covering it. And everyone back then they did know this isn't about appeasing an angry God. This is what God has given to us as a way in which we receive his life. That was the heart of the sacrificial system. Now ask a hundred Christians and I'm going to guarantee you a hundred of them don't know that. There's a problem with which we've proclaimed the gospel. Yes. Because we're no longer talking about a life that we live now. According to his strength and power by his spirit, we talk about getting something that will secure my eternal destiny as the most important thing. And I'm going like everything is about how we live and experience God's life now and reflect it to everyone around.

30:31Why? Because God is trying to draw everyone to him. He's wanting to save every single person ever. And he's vowed to do that. Pretty sure most of us go like, well, I can't be true. I mean, I again ask a hundred Christians, is God going to save everybody who's ever existed? And what do you think their answer is going to be? No. Well, they don't think that God actually has that as a desire. And then it's like, well, if God actually set this whole thing up and he asked no one about how he was great things and the rules and the ground game of how it's all going to happen. If God thought all of this up as a parent, what single child would you bring into the world that you're going like, well, I don't want them. I'm agreeing with you. I there's an interesting I just put this out for you to comment on.

31:35We're seeing a real heightened attack on Islam right now. And it's sort of in it's within the pastoral circles, it's really becoming like these are the evil hordes. They're going to go to hell basically. They're falling a false gospel, etc, etc. The question that no one's asking, at least I've not heard anyone challenge is if you grow up in Islamic culture, how are you supposed to know Jesus if you're not introduced to Christ? In a Christian setting, people grow up in the church and then it becomes the we're going to go to heaven. Same principle we're talking here. And then those others are going to go to hell. It's a black and white evil good sort of relationship. But it would seem to me that if you really look at the gospels of spread the good news in a principle forum, that the onus of sharing Christ and burden of that does not fall on

32:37example Muslims to suddenly discover it, it falls on Christians to introduce it. So that's the real question there that I think the whole argument is inverted is that if you really go if if you're going to follow kind of an old covenant model of saying you didn't accept Christ, you didn't perform for God, you're going to go to hell. Then the onus would actually fall on the Christian side, not on the Muslim side. Does that make sense? Yeah, in a childhood game, you know, a freeze tag. Oh yeah. Well, if you're frozen, can you unfreeze yourself? Nope. Yeah, what do you need? You need someone who's free to crawl under your legs and free you. Right. Well, welcome to the kingdom and the gospel. There it is. It's my job to help demonstrate through God's life in me that the message is true. How? I'm going to love people. I mean, it isn't more complicated than that.

33:40Well, and so it's interesting because the one person you and I've you've met him, I've stayed in touch with him. I'm just going to leave it there because there's but Jamie Walden, which is an interesting one. He literally went right into the heart of the beast and said, I'm going to be here as a warrior of Christ and ended up converting the entire army to follow Christ, not because he was beaten over the head of the Bible, it's because he was being there as a warrior demonstrating what it was like to walk in that authority. That's fairly significant. Well, you know, it's so crazy. When Jesus shows up, he all of a sudden starts proclaiming the gospel of the kingdom. And then what does he do? He casts out demons and he heals the sick as demonstration of the message. Yes, that's the key part. Do you know not until Jesus cast out a demon, had any demon ever in all of the Bible up until that point

34:49that had never happened before? Isn't that extraordinary? Yeah, it's pretty amazing. We talked about the the widow Zerapheth in Elijah raising her son from the dead. That's the first resurrection or better said resuscitation of a dead body that's ever happened in history. And who did God do that for? A widow who is in bail worship country. There's your demonstration, right? And that's that demonstrates two things. One, Jesus is talking about the life overcoming death message that he is. And it's for everybody, not just this little group of accepted special ones. That's what made them so mad that they were going to throw him off a cliff.

35:50Now think about this. What would have happened if they did that? What if they were successful in their rage? They picked Jesus up and they threw him off the cliff and he fell down to his death. What would have happened? I don't think it would have been any different outcome. I mean, he still would have been resurrected from the dead. I don't know. I mean, I'm really glad it didn't happen because it wasn't. That wouldn't have been the sacrifice that is once for all. True. And that's God in Christ. And all of a sudden they just killed him. Oops. Bad day for humanity. Salvation for nobody. No soup for you or anyone else. Which I mean, I think that's so amazing that in the midst of that, they're trying to kill him. And all of a sudden, Jesus does the first vanishing miracle act. He just walks through the crowd and they're not successful in killing him. That's good. I go like, whoa,

36:55that's how committed to our salvation God is. He's going to make sure it happens. Right. Absolutely. So, when we look at faith, here's our transition. When we look at faith and what God is looking for, I think a lot of us have really kind of funky ideas. Like it's something I'm supposed to get strong in and have big muscles of faith so that I can perform things. I mean, it's kind of the way we've been taught it. Yeah. Oh, yeah. I'm just agreeing at all. And I have a simple understanding of faith comes by hearing, hearing the voice of God. Amen. The rama, the word of God. And I think a lot of evangelical goes, we'll see, that's you get faith by reading your Bible. I'm going to like, you get faith by reading your Bible with the Holy Spirit and listening for him to go, hey, this one, this one, look at this one,

37:56listen, it's at that moment that faith is born in me if I receive it. That piece you just said, I just want to put another layer to it's like pointing like the the highlighting of moments and as you read the Bible with Holy scripture with Holy Spirit. There a lot of that is not you call it your magic Bible. I think a lot of it is the where our heart position is and are we ready to receive that. And that's the beauty of it is that different people can have different experiences and it's all leading in the end to the same direction. Hopefully. Hopefully. Yeah. I mean, if it's if it's God who's drawing that's what I'm assuming that piece. Yeah. I think what's amazing is I think Islam was invented in the seventh century. And I think there was a human mission behind it and it was kind of concocted by the Catholic church to be honest. My research is suggested the same. Yes. Which means we, you and I just got

38:59a thought to I'll put on us. But let's enjoy that. Awesome. At least I'm doing something in the world. Exactly. Get noticed. But I also think it's God allowing a measure of chastisement to come upon an errant church. Yes. I think it's God allowing a group of people to raise up as a discipline unto an errant beast worshiping church. It's good. And I think if we saw it as such, when God allows another group on the earth to quote have dominion and power such that they can exact their tyranny over us. You know what Daniels, the whole message of Daniel is we're supposed to look at that and go like, Oh, that's because we have kind of forsaken God and we're worshiping wrong things. Yeah. So God allows that to happen on the earth as a chastisement, as a discipline,

40:04as an invitation to repentance for us. Because that wasn't his design. No, not at all. I think it's it's interesting. I've brought this up so many times when I think it's an interesting modern example and there's so many ironies in this example here. During the summer Olympics in Paris, when they did that whole skit and really blasphemous mockery of the last supper, remember that there's only one world leader that stood up in defense of Christians and it was the Ayatollah and it was only one country that I bought who we bombed and decapitated this leadership. And even that, they even had banners across the main roads in Tehran in protest. I mean, support of Christians and in protest. The other you look at that and you're like, okay, that's not evil. I'm just saying. I mean, you can say whatever you want about it,

41:06but that sure is like it's not the incarnate of evil. Yeah. Do you know, I mean, you know the whole story of Daniel and the lion's den. Mm-hmm. Go ahead. I think it's worth reading. And the king that that issued was sort of like he was kind of seduced into making a declaration that would cause Daniel to then be guilty and have to be thrown into the lion's den. And it was the immutable law of the needs and Persians. It's like, once the king declared the law, you couldn't change it. Right. And so the king was like, Oh, no, because Daniel was his buddy. He loved Daniel. And so when Daniel's just thrown into the lion's den, because Daniel refused to not pray to God, Daniel was going to do his job day in day out regardless of the consequences. And he wasn't going to violate his relationship with God. Regardless of the cost, was he aware of the law that had been declared that would forbid him to pray? Yeah, he was. And so he didn't close his shutters and do

42:11it in private. He opened it like his windows like he did every day and he kept doing. I'm going to cry out to the living God. That's what he did. And that got him thrown into the lion's den. That's supposed to be so that they eat you and devour you. And the the king at that day, he's waiting at the top of the pit that Daniel's been thrown into. He waited throughout the night. And it's like he cries out, Daniel has your God been able to save you. Daniel said, Yep. So the king is like totally jazzed because he couldn't change the law. So then they take Daniel up and he's out of the lion's den. And then the people that had tricked him into giving that law. Guess what? He threw all of them and their families into the same pit and the lions instantly devoured them. And then what does the king do? He makes an eternal decree that they

43:12will shall forever worship the true living God whom Daniel is a representative of. Do you know that law is still in effect today? Wow. That's amazing. That makes Iran truly an eternal kingdom, Christian nation. Right. We're fighting against them. Why? Well, and there's something else. It's I mean, when you look at the numbers of their population, which is very revealing, because we, you and I've had so many conversations about this, we're proclaiming them as a Muslim state. They're a Persian state, which is very different led by a Muslim government. It's extremely different. But the numbers are stunning because the the Muslim population is I'm giving rough numbers here. I know because I it's been a while since I've looked at specifics, but roughly 20% and Christian numbers are about three to five percent in the but it's the fastest growing segment in the Middle East. Everyone else is agnostic or atheist.

44:14That's what's so amazing. And it's like you don't have a Muslim state that tolerates atheism or agnostic views. And who were the wise men that showed up at Jesus' birth? They were the Magi, which came from under Canezer. Yeah, Daniels. He's leader of the Magi. He's going, no flipping away. Right. I mean, you look at that. That's where I go. Do you want to have evidence that God on his own, even without us, is going to save the whole planet? He's at work in those nations, whether we are or not. Agreed. 100%. What's happening in Muslim countries? Jesus is showing up in their dreams and shaking their whole belief system and they're responding to him. And we've talked about this. I think you've seen them. It's back in 2017-2018. The testimonies of

45:15ISIS fighters that were literally like experiencing exact what you're saying. And to such a powerful moment that like one of the things they would say is I got introduced to this word forgiveness. And they would just break down in tears. It's like I've never known forgiveness. Because in Islam, forgiveness is only based on your merits in the world. And then it's a kind of a crapshoot. And that's where you get into the five pillars and you get into the need to go to the hodge. And there's just so much to this. There's a structural very much of the Pharisees model that you basically have to do certain things that very few people have the money to do. And then with that, you hope that you can do enough good deeds to outweigh your bad. That's basically it. Yep. And tragic. And if you look at the four Gospels and you just go like, okay, if I'm going to understand the importance of what they start with, what they reveal to me,

46:15this is honestly something that everyone listening to this needs to do. This is a homework assignment. We'll cover it maybe a couple of weeks from now. But I first want to let them discover some of this on their own. Because I think that has a more impactful, long-lasting understanding. If you know, once you have your own revelation, it is extraordinary what God starts with and what each one of Matthew, Mark, Luke and John reveal as the central core of the very first thing that they're proclaiming as the gospel. And it's going to be totally different than what we thought. Yeah, that's good. And I just go like, oh, it's mind-blowing. It is so, I mean, I am a great work's happening because I'm restraining myself from telling you. I mean, it's that exciting to me. Okay. For those of you who are still begun, just today, I am withholding something I think is extraordinary because I want you to learn it for yourself.

47:17For those of you to realize how big a hand it got has just happened, it's, Brad just proclaimed it. It's a greater work. Yeah, it's a greater work. It's a beginning. Can we jump and look at something that I think will be fun? Matthew 8? Sure. Verses 13 to 15 or 5 to 13. So Jesus is showing up. And the first thing is he encounters, this is in verse one and two. He encounters a leper. And the Lord and the leper comes in front of him and bows down and says, if you're willing, you can make me clean. Now, we looked at Jesus's first sermon, reference, you know, reference Naaman. And he's the only guy that God cleansed of leprosy. There was tons of leprosy in the world. And it was Naaman,

48:19an enemy general from where? Persia. And then amazing. And that keeps coming up. Oh, interesting. Yeah. We just might have the idea of who's the good guys and who the bad guys. We might have them wrong and reversed right now. Just say it. It's a hard realization when you have to step back and ask yourself if you're playing for the, if you're on the right side of the field, right on the right team. Yeah. I wanted to make this t-shirt and say, I'm with him. As opposed to, you know, saying to the elites and how they shake the ant jar and they get its fight night with each other, I'm not, I'm not saying it's God on my side or is he on your side? I'm going to say, I want to be on his side. So I'm with him. So whichever side he's on, that's the side I want to be on. And I look at this, the very first thing that's been revealed is leprosy is a picture of sin that enters our life and starts to decay and destroy us from within because it takes away

49:21our sensitivity to what's going on. It's a picture of how sin destroys us. So the healing of leprosy is a big deal. If you were a leper, it was your job to basically isolate yourself from all of society because you would make everyone else unclean. And they were supposed to do it. They were walking by. They were supposed to shout out unclean, unclean, and it's like, who would want to do that? I've never looked at the leprosy in that. That's incredibly good right there as a representation of sin because it's the rotting and the transmission. Right? Yeah, it's death. It's a slow death that causes a desensitizing to the presence of death taking over. Yeah. And it's the analogy in another way of looking at it is in a basket of fruit, the one piece that has mold on it. The rotten one is going to mess with everyone else. And quickly. Yeah. Yeah. And so

50:26he's incredible red letters. Lord, if you're willing, you can make me clean. Jesus's response he stretched out his hand and touched him saying, I am willing. Be cleansed. How profound is that? To a world infected with leprosy? Stuck in sin, dying a slow death because of who we've turned away from. And the kingdom solution right there is, hey, God need help. I can't solve this. You can if you're willing. And what is the message of heaven? A heart that's willing. I am willing. Be cleansed. That's that simple place. And I'm just going to put this out there and kind of an encouragement.

51:31When you sort out where God wants you to be, whatever that is, it might be a little thing like, what is my career? It might be a big thing of, or that's not a little thing. It's a big thing. It might be a little thing in some struggling decision or fear. The heart that's willing is a translation to yes, say yes. And acknowledge it in parents say yes. And not just like a word, but like put your whole self into it. And then just let God move because every time I do that, Brad, and I know you're the same as like mountains move. And you're like, why didn't I see that before? Because I didn't say yes. I was I was sitting here maturing over this and like, okay, am I going to am I not going to this God want me to or not want me to. And finally, when you just commit and say yes, it's like the world shifts. If you seek to save your life, you're going to lose it. If you seek to lose your life for his sake, therein you will find it. Yes.

52:34The two words that will get you to the finish line. Yes, Lord. Yes, Lord. Amen. It's good. God's God's not going to force you. This is what I don't think people understand. God isn't going to force you. He's going to love your resistance away until you finally yield voluntarily with joy and excitement. What he's after. So anything that tries to advance the kingdom through some other means ain't him. It's true. Guilt fear manipulation ain't him or material gain. And and and frightening people ain't him. Well, and in the other words, I'm adding material gain is we're seeing so much of this right now in just people you would assume it had strong values that are so easily persuaded by the dollar. And the prosperity gospel. Yeah.

53:36You know, God and this is the means of great gain. You're going like, yeah, but that's the wrong motive. Right. I mean, it just it just is. You're looking for material stuff. And God's kingdom is primarily the marriage of his life into this world. Well, I want to go back to your birth hero quickly because I think there's a real reflection here of wealth that we didn't mention here, but it ties in beautifully. There is wealth in the material world, whatever you are, whatever you have is what it is. But what was represented at your birthday was true kingdom wealth. And it was the testimonies that would people were talking about you and how you're walk affected them. And that was that's there's no greater wealth than that. You can be I mean, I don't mean to be I'm not trying to be flippant about this, but you can be living in a trailer and and have a beat up car. But you see that sort of testimony and realize like, wow, I mean, that's that's the true

54:39impact that transforms kingdom to earth. It's not it's not your status of the material world. And that's where I think things, especially in this day, there's so much inversion on that level and it's there's so many traps that if you are not walking in that sort of authoritative faith, it's easy to get tripped up. I find myself more compassionate in the sense of people that are compromising themselves, not anymore in in in a sense of empathy that you and sorrow because you're not walking in the right in the strength of faith. You're walking maybe you believe it like that's the prosperity gospel piece, but you're missing the greater gift of what could be. And I I'm just use a relevant example because it just came out today. And and that is it. There's now been revealed that the Pentagon has has actually contracted with a ton of influencers. And they're keeping it classified so they don't people don't know who they are. But suddenly these people have

55:40become echo chambers for Pentagon messages, the department of quote war. That's everything antithetical to King by principle. So what you've done is you've built a relationship with your audience. You've received an opportunity to make money, which guarantee is well paid. And you're agreeing to that and your message no longer has integrity, but it's okay because there's a prosperity that's come from what you're doing. And that's where the self delusion comes in. It's like oh, what I'm saying is actually been and and you've completely undermined your gift for the purpose of promoting not only a state, but you're promoted to state of war. The department of propaganda. Correct. Yeah. Yeah. And there's going okay. Well, the kingdom of God is evidenced in righteousness, peace and joy. Hmm. It's good. And the life that we're called to live is one that is pursuing

56:41justice. Yeah. That means wrong things are set right. And we're dealing fairly and honestly with each other and honestly and humbly before God. Amen. That's good. I mean, this isn't complex. It's just it requires a life that is not centered on self, but is caring about others. Oh, yes. Isn't that just an amazing concept? Yeah, I know. I mean, it's like, I hate to make it that simple, but how do I know that God is at work in you? To the immediate fruits, you I will see that you know that he loves you. That's evidence that he's there and it's real. You know, you're loved by God. And when that's true, it's very easy to reflect that to others. Yes.

57:49So the Bible kind of makes it super simple. It says, you can't say you love God and hate your brother. You can't. No, you can't. You're absolutely right. Because if you're hating your brother, you're not really aware of the love that God has bestowed upon you, your fruit of hatred is exposing that. And then if you really did know that you were loved by God, the world around you is going to feel overflow of that being true. Well, and that gets to the same principle of be careful how you judge for the same measure will be used back on you. That's God's way of establishing justice. If you if you're going to sit in the seat of being the judge and you're going to set the standards, great. I'm going to apply them to you as well. So as we kind of wrap up today's show today, I want to pivot to one. I think it's visually portrays everything you're talking about here very well.

58:54And it's at the end of the movie, the shack. And it's in the field when he's overlooking the field. And there's all of these lights. Just talk a little bit about that because I think there's so much in that because when you look at that, all you see is light in its different hues, but you don't see difference. You see beauty. Well, what it was meant to reflect is for a moment, Papa was giving Mac an ability to see truly see because our earthly vision, frankly, is very limited. We don't see the glory of God reflected in everything around us. We could, but we don't. And it's usually because there's a measure of choice in that. I choose a filter. If I believe God is good and that he is doing things in the world, chances are I'm going to be able to see them a lot better. But most of us are

59:57looking through the not whole of our pain. And we're evaluating that world through those circumstances. And that really dims and damages our vision. So for a moment, God opens Mac's eyes and allows him to see a full field of lit up illuminated beings. And that's God's children from every tongue, tribe, and nation. And it's an absolute smorgasbord of color and rainbow. And their love and their emotions being reflected to one another are arcing like little beings of light back and forth. And that's kind of a whole picture of us as the images of God and the reflected glory. And so, and he has a chance to see his very poor, didn't love Mac well, damaged

1:00:58picture of his father. And he sees him with fresh eyes. And he recognizes that even though they had a rotten relationship on the earth, the truth is you can't give what you don't have. Right. And on his days on the earth, his dad was simply a product of the damage that had been passed along. The broken image of God that was then poorly reflected. And the way they related it with each other. And he had a chance to see his dad through the eyes of God that despite of all of the bad stuff, there still is the created glory that God had invested in there. And it led to a moment of transacting needed forgiveness that allowed freedom for both. That's powerful right there. You know, it was a picture outside of, you know, earth time because it's a melting of the spiritual realm and the earth realm together, which throughout the whole issue of the shack, that's the kingdom.

1:02:03The manifesting of the spiritual realm here in the earthly realm. That's the kingdom. It's not going to heaven one day and everything's wonderful in heaven and can't wait to get there one day. The whole focus of this is that's meant to be manifest here on the earth, primarily in how we love and relate with one another. That's how you know the kingdom is being established. The kingdom is within you. It's at hand. And it's meant to be advanced through the images of God. Those who have been touched by the life and the love of God and how they relate in the world is how this thing gets changed. Amen. That's good. I mean, St. Francis of Assisi said, go forth proclaim the gospel and if necessary, use words. That's one of my favorite things. It's like no way. It's about how you live and how you relate with people. It's like St. Patrick.

1:03:04I mean, he articulated essentially the St. Patrick lived. So it's good. Can you give me five minutes? Of course. Just tell you about this great century, dude. So immediately after he cleanses the leper, we're in Matthew 8, he says to the leper, see to it that you don't tell anybody, but go and show yourself to the priest and present the offering that Moses commanded for a testimony to them. What? Jesus doesn't hear the miracle and he says, don't tell nobody. Is that what you expected? Yeah, but I mean, I understand. I mean, I, because I'm looking at it from different lenses. Yes, because it's it's humility at the core of this. Let the presence of the work show itself. Don't go up boasting. And it's not that he doesn't want the clink came to be declared, but it's go forth proclaim the gospel and if necessary, use words. How many lepers had been cleansed and that up to this point? No. Naman is it. Okay. So now we have the first healing

1:04:08of a leper. And what is he doing? He's asking him to follow what was transcribed in the Torah. Go show yourself to the priest. Show him that you've been cleansed. And then offer the sacrifice. Again, it's not to atone for sin and it's not to appease an angry God. It's to worship. And let that be a testimony to who? To the priestly system. The guys right now. Guess what? Something news happened. A leper has been cleansed for the first time in ages. It's pretty amazing. Why? Because he's trying to reach the religious guys too. We kind of hate them because we see them as the bad guys. Jesus doesn't. He's they haven't made the priestly classed his enemies. Even though they're always trying to kill him, he's still trying to reach them. He's doing the same

1:05:14Francis of the Seas. He go forth, proclaim the gospel. And if necessary, use words. I just healed a leper guy. Now go show yourself to the religious crowd. They won't be able to believe it. I just go like, that's that's crazy. Wow. Way to go, Jesus. And then when he entered cappernium, a centurion, this is a Roman dude comes to him and treating him. He's in that just kind of bizarre that you got a Roman centurion coming up to a rabbi. Again, not something you would have expected. No. And here's how he responds. First word, Lord. My servant is lying paralyzed at home, suffering and great pain. Couple of amazing things right there. How is a Roman centurion calling this rabbi, Lord? We don't know that a miracle happened. Some outside of the covenant identified chosen people

1:06:26is the first to call him Lord. That's huge. What? And what's he bringing before him? He has a servant who is likely his servant, some Jewish person. And he's caring about the condition that that guy's in. And Jesus said to him, I will come and heal him. Again, we have echoed for us. Lord, if you're willing, you can do this is first response to lepers. I'm willing and he cleanses him. And then it's Lord, I got a servant who's paralyzed and suffering and great pain. And Jesus's first response is he wasn't even asked to come, but he said, I'll come and heal him. So here you have reflected the very heart of God is his response to those who are in suffering and great pain is,

1:07:27I will come and heal him. Is that who you worship and understand? Is that your image of God right now? Myself, yes, but I don't know how everybody else is. I don't know that a lot of people have that as their default thought of God. Right. I hope that you can see this and change the lens through which you see the world. Because if your first thought is, oh, I want to, God doesn't care. He doesn't do nothing. What we have in Jesus is I will come and heal him. I'm willing. And the centurion answered, Lord, I'm not worthy for you to come under my roof. Bummer, that's their religious response. Why is that his response? He's a soldier. I'm going to just put it like that. And he's I don't think that he sees himself as that person is worthy of Christ because of all he has done. Yeah, but sadly, I think it's religion that has taught us that response. No, I agree with

1:08:33that. And so he's kind of giving the standard response of, you know, I'm not worthy. And I'm going like, do you have any idea how amazed and excited God is about humanity that he created something to reflect his image? I mean, he became one of us, not because he didn't think we had value. It's because we have such incredible value. He decided to come and be one of us. Oh my gosh. Do you have that understanding of God that that's how much he's in love with humanity? That is the truth, whether we understand it or not. But here's he says, but just say the word in my servant will be healed for I too am a man under authority with soldiers under me and I say to this one go and he goes into another come and he comes into my slave, do this and he does it. Now when Jesus heard this he marveled. Do you think that's a fake emotion? Not at all. He's sitting here going like

1:09:39no way. I just said I'm going to come and heal this guy's servant and his response is you don't need to come just speak the word. And Jesus goes, Glory be truly. I say to you, I have not found such great faith with anyone in Israel. And I say to you that many shall come from east and west and recline at the table with Abraham, Isaac, Jacob in the kingdom of heaven. But the sons of the kingdom shall be cast out into outer darkness into that place. There shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth. What do we think outer darkness is? Well, I think it's translated to hell. I think it's more about the absence of God. But anyway, well, if Jesus's kingdom is the kingdom of light and life, if you're not entering into that kingdom, it's death and darkness. That's outer darkness.

1:10:44So this is probably suited for the next show because it's a big discussion. But I think that tees up a very big discussion, which is of how we understand these words. Right. Because the enemy can start there because you've already kind of pretext this that the idea of heaven and like burning in the like of fire, heaven and hell, kingdom to earth, what does that mean then in that context? Because there seems to be, like if we go back to the kind of the paradigms of what we've already touched on, like you don't follow Christ, you're going into darkness. That translation goes in results in the modern day of Dante's in Fernham. Yeah, sadly, because they use that as the threat of, you know, it's like they invented the idea of eternal conscious torment. Nowhere in the Bible is that notion reflected. It sadly, been the definitions of words that have

1:11:45been mistranslated and poorly understood and don't reflect the heart of God. And up until the 4th century, nobody ever had those ideas ever. They were introduced by that Augustine guy. And then they were later reflected by in the 16th century, this Calvin dude. And that's been the standard idea ever since. And I'm going like, it is so absolutely foreign from the Bible. If you understand the Bible as one continuous story. Mm hmm. It's good. So yeah, we'll look into that. But here's what is great faith if you look at this story. It is obedience to Christ's word. And it's in that and it still translates. I love that passage. It was one of my favorite passages in scripture because it has a personal meaning to me too. But it's just so incredible what he's saying because he's accepting Christ as he is,

1:12:48not trying to say, well, I need you to do the work for me. Help me. Help me. He's just like, just tell me. I got it. And that's all throughout the gospels. He's telling you what to do. Great faith that causes Jesus to marvel is believing that whatever God says is true. There it is. I mean, you added the word obedience and I'm going like, sure, you can add that in, but the simplicity of it is taking God at His word. True. It's good. He said it. It's like, okay, I'm in. I believe it. That's great faith that causes Jesus to marvel. I'm going like, what's our problem with that? It sounds too simple. That's the truth right there. Right? Yeah. Why? Because religion has complicated this into a cationess of tangled string. And we can't understand it. And it's too much. And most people

1:13:52feel inadequate. Like, I don't know enough. And we're like, did this Roman Sanctuaryan have a Bible? No. Did he know that Jesus Christ was standing in front of him? Was God very God in the flesh? No. He did not. He, he understand that the cross is what brings salvation into your life? No, because it hadn't happened. He didn't know anything. All he knows is that, oh, he responded. And it's like, there's something about this, dude. And I got a surre of an in pain. This guy walks with authority and he has the goods. And I want him to help someone I care about. And Jesus, okay, I'll do it. I'll come and do it. And he goes like, you don't need to come because I don't, I'm not worthy. So he still has religious, weird thinking in this head.

1:14:53That's contrary to what Jesus just said. I will come and heal him. And the guy's like, no, no, don't do that. Just, just say the word. And I'm going like, wow, I mean, we need to park it and kind of understand a whole ton right there. But the simplicity of the takeaway for today is whatever God says, the heart of faith goes, yes. Amen. And it's like put a period on it. Don't keep speaking. Just say yes. That's exactly right. Period. Yeah. That's good. So Lord, would you help strip away all the religious confusion and the complexity that we have whipped ourselves up into a kind of tortured frenzy where we don't see you as love manifest.

1:15:55We don't see you as willing. We don't see you as available to us. And we don't really trust in the promise of your desire to save everything and cause everything to be conformed to the purpose of your creation. We're so filled with unbelief and unworthiness and a whole bunch of other things that blind us from the simplicity of truth. We've postponed your kingdom to a future day as opposed to entering into it now. And Lord, I ask that you'd cut through all the religious crap. And you would cause your life to enter into people today, regardless of what they've ever done before that today life would enter in, hope would enter in, love would manifest inside. And God, it would change everything. We say yes to that. And then we've put a hand

1:17:05over our mouth so we don't talk ourselves out of it. Lord, it is that simple, but we have somehow made it so much more complex than it need be. And so we humble ourselves and we repent of all the confused thinking that has dictated how we walk and live. And we return to you this morning or whenever they're listening. We return to you now and we want to sit at your table and dine with you and experience your life. And then would you allow us to reflect that to the world in which I live today? And would you extend your kingdom through me in touching the lives of others who are racked with the kind of leprosy thing that we see? We ask that in Jesus name. Amen.

1:18:10Good discussion, Amen. It's awesome. Yeah, that's what happens when you kind of talk to Jesus. All right, we'll pick it up next week. God bless you. All right.