Deep Dive with Karen McKinney and Joseph Herrera on Hard Conversations

When prosecutor Karen McKinney argued for a life sentence against a 19-year-old gang member named Joseph, she never imagined they would one day share laughs over tacos. Twenty years later, their unexpected friendship challenges everything Karen believed about human capacity for change. After witnessing Joseph's profound transformation at his parole hearing, she took the unprecedented step of reaching out to the man she had once condemned. Their story transcends the boundaries of the justice system, proving that authentic connection can flourish in the most unlikely places – and that it's never too late to see someone, or yourself, in a new light. WARNING: This episode continues detailed descriptions of violence.

This episode was made possible by a grant from Templeton Religion Trust. To learn more, go to templetonreligiontrust.org.