Cricket Collective - Will India Dominate White-Ball Cricket & Can England Evolve Under Brendon McCullum?!

0:00Okay, Seven stops to write this best man's speech. Hi, I'm Liam. And I've got nothing. Stop funny. When he's good. I beat her. He'd never forgive me. What about friendship? Is a journey. Ugh, cringed. Come on. That's it. In year five, Dan had the bright idea to cracking the best best man's speech on the train. Can. Traffic may be locked. But savings isn't. Unlike the savings that boost mobile with unlimited wireless for just $25 a month, forever. No contracts, no hikes, and you keep your phone. Unlike the savings at boostmobile.com slash unlock. $25 for every requires customers to remain active on boost unlimited wireless plan. For full offer details visit boostmobile.com.

1:00You're listening to following on with me, Neil Mantable, along with former England fastballer, Steve Harmason, for another collection of news views and weekly interviews. So India are T-20 world champions, as harmy and I predicted a month ago, along with a couple of hundred million other people. After their dominant 96 run win over New Zealand in Sunday's final, we'll discuss if they are the greatest T-20 side of all time, and whether they can continue to dominate the white ball game in the years to come. We'll also discuss Brendan McCullum's future as England head coach, and we'll be joined by Durham's head coach Ryan Campbell, after their preseason tour was cancelled and catch up with how preseason is going up north. Harmy, let's talk about the world T-20 world cup, particularly the final. As I said, it doesn't make us great predictors. It makes us experts in the bleeding obvious when it was India's tournament to lose. Boy oh boy, the top three all made 50, Sanju Sampson matched his 89 against England,

2:01off just 46 balls. That really was an exhibition of T-20 batting that, Nishankishan 54 off 25, Abishak Sharma came good, fastest 50 in the tournament off 18 balls, 255 for 5, and that included a 16th over, which brought Jimmy Neet from three wickets in just one run. I thought they were going to make 280. It was remarkable. It was interesting, Michael Vaughn amongst several people saying that pitches shouldn't be that flat, and there's no contest between bat and ball. But if that's what the market wants, Harmy, if that's what the people want, then watch Coronation Street if you don't like it. I mean, a test match should be a good contest between bat and ball over five years, disintegration of pitches with all your elements that go in. I've always believed T-20 cricket should be entertainment, from a baller's point of view, if you're hung up on going for ten and over or more, you've bowed well if you go for

3:03ten and over or less in the modern day game. And I think that, for me, I think is, it's about the entertainment. This is what T-20's brought, this is what the hundreds brought. It's about a new audience from 2002 onwards. And I think the audience of cricket has been, I mean, double-traveled, maybe more since the invention of 2020 cricket. So to see Sixers and Fores hit, it's just now, I stay in the obvious that it's probably gone too far in that last game, but at the end of the day, I'd much rather watch a game of T-20 cricket with entertainment, 180 to 220, rather than 110 or 130 on a sticky dog pitch. I think I want to be entertained. When I go and watch a T-20 cricket, I want to see batters hit the ball out of the park for one reason and one reason alone. That's what I've come for. I've come to be entertained. And I think if you haven't been entertained in this tournament, you've got a pretty high bar because it's been some good moments. I don't think it's been a brilliant, brilliant tournament.

4:04I think it's been, it was an excellent tournament as the matches went on. We've seen a good game between the West Indies and India, which was more or less a court final. We've seen two semi-finals, which were, you know, a highly score in runs and the final was a mismatch, but still we went and turned from a runs point of view, but you'll always have world-class bowlers and the world-class bowlers will stand up and show why they're world-class when you've got a pitch which is completely flat and the ball's going to wall parts and you will have that world-class bowler who stands apart and that was just a bummer. He was amazing in the semi-final, he was amazing in the final. And if you've got that quality, you shouldn't lose many games on flat, flat pitches because he's four overs will, I'll not arguably win you the game to think the Abhishek Sharma, Sanyo Samson partnership was the one that largely won the game for India, but I'd much rather be entertained when the ball's going out of the park than a down wicket where 130's

5:07of a good score were 20 overs. It's very interesting, just a brief word about South Africa, who of course beat New Zealand by seven wickets with 17 balls to spare in the group games and then walloped India by 76 runs in the Super 8 stages and then got absolutely in the words of their coach, Snot Club, which is a particular South Africanism in the semi-final. But that can happen between these two teams, I mean there's, you know, South Africa beat the two finalists and then got absolutely drummed in the semi-final. And the final was all similarly one sided. I mean, when the ball starts to roll downhill in this format, it gathers speed pretty quickly. Oh, it does. I mean, when you gather in snow, you'd be like me going downhill, I tell you. I mean, it was ridiculous, but it showed you the great run chase England had, the credit that must go to the likes of Jacob Bethel and England, given it a good goal to get it as close as England got it. You either win them games, chasing 220 or both by, I think England didn't

6:102016 by, I think, just two wickets down, three wickets down. So it is one of them ones where one you got on a roll. It is difficult to stop. But I think it was always Morgan said, India would be the best team in this tournament. I disagree with that. I think South Africa or the best team in this tournament. I think England, India with the best moment team, the one the best moments. I don't think there were that convincing in the group, group stages. And then as they went on, they won the moments. I mean, that was an effective court final. They were out if they got beat off the West Indies, or I struggled against the West Indies. So they did well, like all good sides do. Like England did. You know, England's not as good a side as what India are. But if you can find a way to win when you're not playing well, you've always got a great chance. If you've got big moment players, that's what India, that's what India did. That's what England did to get to the semi-final. And I think South Africa are probably the more consistent throughout the tournament, apart from that one game, where Fin Allen just had a day out and that can happen into 20 cricket. But I think

7:12within the big moments, handle in the pressure and deliver and win the utmost pressure is on. At home, I thought India did that better than anybody else. Okay, two more points to ask you. But first of all, let's hear a little sound bite from Suriyakuma, Yada of the Captain and Coach Gautam Gambier. Obviously, very excited. The way things have gone. Since 2024, the way we've played, we won three ICC trophies in a row. I think that brought ended in 2024 after a real long time. And from there, we never looked back. We knew how we wanted to play going forward. Everything was changed post 2024. We played a different brand of cricket in 2024. And from there, we understood how this team needs to work forward, play forward. And it's been a wonderful journey since then. He won the ICC Champions trophy in 2025, played completely different brand of cricket. And now in 2026, we wanted to do something special in front of Home crowd. So we want to continue doing that, 27, 28, 29, whenever stopped. Milestones don't matter. It's the trophies that matter.

8:17For too long in Indian cricket, we've spoken about milestones. And I hope, till I'm there, we're not going to talk about milestones. You can see it very easily as well. You can see it in the last three games, what Sanju did, 97, not out, 18, 98. Imagine if you would have been playing for a milestone, probably we wouldn't have got 250. So I think this is for you guys as well. Stop celebrating milestones, celebrate trophies. That is going to be important because the bigger purpose of a team sport is to be winning trophies, not scoring individual runs. It has never mattered to me and it will never matter to me. And I think actually, I've been very fortunate that Surya and me were on the same page, especially on this front. That's Indian captain Surya Kama Yadav and coach Gautam Gambia. Gambia, of course, became the first man to win the T20 World Cup as a player and a coach. He was top scorer in the inaugural edition for India in 27, 27 in South Africa. So changing the mindset, Surya Kuma Yadav talks about there with Virat and Rohit Sharma retiring. They certainly, you know,

9:18picking guys like Abhishek Sharma, I mean, it's a really caution to the wind kind of approach Harmi. And it's very difficult to see. I mean, you know, we used to the cyclical nature of sport, there are ups and downs and you know, it can be a rollercoaster ride, but it is very quite difficult given the IPL and everything and seeing India not continuing to have this convey about a brilliant T20 cricket as I mean, that could be the end of the contest as we know it for the next couple of decades. It is of the keep the gears of the keep having it in India as well. So, not only do the not only of the best teams in the world and the best talent pool in the world, they've actually having it in their own back garden. So it was not much that going for India at this at this stage of the BCCI as powerful if not more powerful than what the ICC is. It was interesting now. I enjoyed that from Gambia. I did that as well as it's gig. Now, there was a little dig it, it wrote it in it. Evira talking about not interested in milestones about team winning.

10:18Sometimes I sometimes struggle with Gautam. I did struggle with Gautam as a player and I sometimes struggle with him as a coach, but I like that. We might have everything going in our favour, but it's about the team, it's about the dressing room and it's not about individual milestones. And that I thought that was a little bit of a dig it, Robert Sharmer and Ferrat Colley. So, we're interested when they walk back into the 50-year-old dressing room in the not too distant future here and that. So, seeing that, he's got some kudos because he's just one of trophy. But, yeah, down itself matters. I think when you look at it, that's why it's so important that we get our house in order as in our domestic structure in order. What Anthony McGraw said last week to us was brilliant. Got a lot of traction, a lot of people from around the world enjoyed what Anthony said and all he wanted was a symbol, it was a symbol thing. It was let's stop fighting with each other, let's stop having to go at counter-cricket and let's work with each other because you know what, the IPL come around in 2008, the best tournament

11:19in the world, the richest tournament in the world and now India are the best team in the world at 50 over, more or less the best team in the world at 50 over competition. They're definitely the best team in the world at 20 over competition. If we can get that 100 and the next five to 10 years, when it eventually goes to a T20 competition, so we have the blast, we have the 100 and that talent pool there, if we work together, we will have a very, very strong pool of players to pick from if we are singing from the same hip-same sheet, like what Anthony McGraw said last week and I think that's what India have done and that's why they're brilliant at this format of the game. We get that right, we'll have a very, very good international T20 and 50 over side for years to come to keep fighting with each other and we don't think it's very good then all of a sudden we'll keep getting to semi-finals, keep not being that team that just not quite gets there and I think that I think is what I would take away from India being the best white ball team in the world at this moment in time because their competition is to and it's shown that the pool of players now

12:26since that IPL has started is ridiculous and I think that's something the ECB have got to get it brighter. You made England sound like they're bridesmaids there which is a bit harsh because you're stealing the thunder from New Zealand and South Africa who are world champion bridesmaids and they just can't get the job done. New Zealand have reached 12 semi-finals in 19 ICC global events since 2007 that's a phenomenal record, yeah so Africa not not so good. Do you know that so I think we've had 15 knockout games since the infamous 92 World Cup and they returned to international cricket, 15 knockout games, they've won three of them and one was a quarter final against Sri Lanka and Australia and Sydney in 2015. They it's evidently a problem for them but let's talk about New Zealand. But would you say that the SA-20s in its infancy it's only a couple years old. Are you seeing in domestic cricket you're in South Africa? Are you seeing in domestic

13:30cricket and then in the SA-20 that there are players coming out of nowhere to make and push South African white ball cricket to a better level? I think so. I think that'll happen I think it's almost inevitable. I mean the point is that they didn't freeze they you know they very often they lose that they they they're brave and bold and incisive and and do everything right in group games and then you know freeze. Well two left-handers Quentin de Cock and Ryan Rickleton got out to the good part time off spin at Colmer Conkey in the second over but they got out attacking you know the old South Africa would have patted six balls into the covers you know for fear of getting out to him but at least it took him on. Yeah that's right but yeah so congratulations to India it's just a shame that you know the great I think it's a great team and I've written and said I think it's probably the best T-20 team of all time as a squad the 15 this 15 man squad in Indian

14:35conditions but it's just a shame isn't it that the game has been so politicised and we forget about the millions the hundreds of millions of Indians for whom this is life changing it provides an almost endless source of joy in what is a difficult difficult life in a difficult country for for many of them and it should be about them you know you know it's not about the money and not about J.S.R. and the PCCI and the politics and the the the relationship with Pakistan and all those things that we get distracted by I think we should just remember how many hundreds of millions of people and you know we've met you've met a few million yourself signed autographs for them you remember absolutely 100 percent agree with your manners in pushing it towards another podcast but our great friend Hasha Bogler who we've worked with the last two last couple of of Indian tours I think he sums it up best exactly what you've just been saying when he talked to Michael Vaughan

15:38on on his podcast you know this is this is their way out of poverty single parent families like Jasper Mummers like Virat Colies he said I'm not sure who else he said but you we've all heard the story of the disasterage as well this is their way out of poverty he basically said without saying it that English cricket has stopped England cricked some of English cricket is soft it's too entitled it's too much on a plate it's too much getting locked after it's too much pampered in these Indian players it's their way out of poverty so to finish off from the tournament point of view there was a record number from people went to the games there's a record number people watched the games the amount of money that it's probably generated 20 teams in the tournament I think worked but I think it's only going to work for T20 cricket and I think it's important that it steers with T20 cricket and the money that this tournament's made hopefully it goes to all four corners of the world to increase the the participation of the game if that does and it reaches

16:41and it's great then I'm all for you know India basically ruling the world because we want the game of cricket to be watched and loved by everybody but the political side of it at this moment in time I think is teacher and what's happened between India and Bangladesh and Pakistan I think it needs somebody to stand up and like we said before adults in a room to take control in that stick to make sure that this doesn't happen again because I think we've had a positive outcome in this T20 World Cup where I'm not so sure four weeks ago that we thought it was going to end quite positively did we and what hasn't been a positive outcome let's wait and see but I think the numbers the financial reward that's been pushed back into the game hopefully will help you know India, Pakistan and Bangladesh have a conversation and try and get to a good situation yeah there were some a cervic lines from Harser Berglie in that when when Michael Vaughan said so you think England cricket is a softy you and he says when when they fail they can go to Noosa for a beer

17:43that's there come down yeah I mean I'm so talk I don't know where to go with Brendan anymore it's it's such a difficult one because I don't want to see anybody lose their job I don't want to see Brendan lose his job I think he's a brilliant person yeah I think he's a good coach I just think I think it's the right time and I say that with all respect for the man for what he's brought to English cricket and I say it with great teeth and a lot of reluctance when I think what happened in Australia from a minute they landed in New Zealand so the minute the game finished in Sydney I think if you look at that in isolation alone I don't see how anybody keeps their job and that's my only gripe with Brendan McCullough the preparation side of it's before in different tours that I've got no problem with that this is the where they want to go about their job this is where they want to prepare this whether where they want to get it right I mean everybody does it differently and I've got no problem with that they talked about this in the series so after

18:45the third test when England lost the owned up that they might have made the mistakes of possibly preparation do I see them changing do I see what they got wrong putting right I'm not so sure I listen to what he said afterwards and I would have said exactly the same thing if I was Brendan this is the way he is this is the way he builds his team this is the way his teams this is where he's in dressing room environment is when he says people think it's a cozy club and it's relaxed and it doesn't do the work I think to do the work I've got no problem I think we've seen the manners we were in New Zealand mean you were in India we've seen them do the work the work very very hard for this group and I don't mind the relaxed environment I really don't try and take pressure off your place but there was so much went wrong in that Asher's trip whether it's preparation whether it was selection whether it was behavior on the field off the field these are the coaches demand in for that very reason I'm not looking at Asher at home I'm not looking at

19:45India or home or aware I'm making my decision and making my call and making my judgment off this one Asher series and when people say we always got Australia we always get beat and we always change things this time it's different I think it's very very different and I think that unfortunately like I said before with great teeth I would make a call and say I'd change I'd definitely change a red bull side of it possibly change the whole thing and I might not be a popular opinion but I'm not there's no there's no personal things to me here I see this as somebody who has a huge amount of affection and respect for what Brenda McCollum has done for English cricket I just think in that big moment I think they've got it so badly wrong and unfortunately somebody has to carry the accountability side of it and that would be the coach okay let's hear one of the more predictable quotes from England's white ball captain Harry Brooke I've said plenty of times he's the best coach I've ever had best head coach I've ever had the way that he he speaks to everybody

20:49the way that he has he's got an aura in the dressing room everybody looks up to him and the things that he did in the game as a player was unbelievable and and he just carried that into his coaching the the things that he's done over the four years that he's he's took over has been has changed English cricket for hopefully the for the best and yeah he like I said he's the best head coach I've ever had in England white ball captain Harry Brooke very often when a captain or a senior player has asked about a coach who he doesn't support he says well it's not up to me it's not my decision you kind of know then but but Harry Brooke very very much backing Brenda McCullum to stay on it's very sometimes unkind and misleading to read a quote because you missed the nuance of the expression but we haven't got this one recorded but you just listen to to that quote that you were alluding to this is from McCullum there's probably a perception that we run a casual operation it couldn't be further from the truth we run an informal operation but the work is done the

21:55preparation is put in place there's an environment which operates in a certain way and because you are relaxed around that doesn't mean that the work is not being done see there's a few things that stick in the mind I want to say harmy like you when I first encountered Brenda McCullum and New England I was absolutely blown away I'd never seen team more enjoying enjoying themselves more at training at practice you know there was absolutely no sense of going through the motions and you know they have music playing and that they were enjoying their work and it was refreshing and it was invigorating and it's something I hadn't seen before in almost 30 years of of covering cricket but there's still a few things that stick in the throat there in the middle of that we run an informal operation this is England it's the England cricket team you paid a lot of money which is one thing but you're also representing a lot of people who pay a lot of money to come and

22:55watch you and it's a it's a multi million pound business why are you running an informal operation yeah I couldn't agree more I couldn't agree more what you're saying there we're elite I mean this is should be an elite we are an elite sports team a very good friend of mine one of one of my sort of close mates he's a football agent and he and he has a keeps up to go at me and go and yeah but you you should be elite English cricket is not elite and when I dial down deep into that and I like I try and shake me head and go well cricket has never been like that it's always had not a drinking culture but there's always been an enjoyable element at the end of a game he kept hip-hoping going why I mean Simon Jordan did it throughout the ashes exactly the same as what we met was trying this morning best minutes was trying to say it's like this is England cricket team you're getting paid a whole lot of money there's a lot of money and cricket now you should be elite so when you talk about the drinking culture and alcohol that comes in like I said before I went on that podcast a few weeks ago and said talked about Mark Wood and I used

24:01the wrong choice of words and I should apologize for using the neglect word and I shouldn't have said that but what I meant was that this the medical side of the England cricket team I mean it's an elite sports team Jopra Archer has played minimal amount of cricket in five years Mark Wood's played minimal amount of cricket in four or five years even Ben Stokes when he was injured didn't quite get that right they're an elite sports team you know this is this is you know from a financial point of view there's a lot of money involved with test match one day in T20 cricket and you know I could keep using the same terminology you know with Pep Guardiola be without Eldon Holland and have him play minimal games in five years no because they're their Premier League the Premier League's elite there's a lot of money involved you get your players back you you too and I understand the franchise world has changed in the landscape of cricket but if you could have contracted player you make sure that contracted player is doing things properly you make sure that contract is player is making you know making your team better

25:05now this minute in time I'll look at the England cricket team and McCollum say any he runs an informal ship I mean these guys are getting paid a lot of money for an informal ship and I understand what he's trying to say and he's it's not a poor choice of words or anything he's trying to he's trying to he's basically trying to say a lot it's your career we want you to enjoy what you're doing but I think the informal bit when he first came in worked brilliantly and it worked brilliantly because he had the likes of best though he had the likes of Anderson he had broad he had wokes he had players who knew their game and it was post-COVID and it was post-COVID yeah and you know you were picking the pieces up of what happened before COVID but he had players who knew their game couple of the fact he had Root and he had bad I mean he had Stokes now he's got six say a say top seven you know Jimmy Smith's numbers are going going downhill as well it's got three of them average in 34 or less you can't just throw a team together and say right there's an informal ship and I think all that coming together is why I think I'd make a change you know would you would

26:11you want somebody like a Justin Langer coming in and suffocate the team probably not would you want Andy Flower coming in Andy Flower in the test job when I was involved as Kevin Peterson famously said you know would suffocate the group so but there has to be a middle ground and a middle balance because at this moment in time this informal ship can't put two balls in the right place together can't get your Premier League fast bowlers on the park for long enough and you've got three batters in the top six average in 34 or less so if that's an informal group something needs to change strong words homie I think you chose them wisely this time though you're listening to following on with me Neil Mansfield along with former England fastballer Steve Harmas and next up we'll continue our previews to the start of the new county championship season and we'll speak live with Durham head coach Ryan Campbell okay seven stops to write this best man's speech hi I'm Liam and I've got nothing

27:17stop funny and he's good I beat her he'd never forgive me what about friendship is a journey cringe come on that's it in year five Dan had the bright idea tracking the best best man's speech on the train you can AI is transforming customer service it's real and it works and with Finn we've built the number one AI agent for customer service we're seeing lots of cases where it's solving up to 90% of real queries for real businesses this includes the real world complex stuff like issuing a refund or canceling an order and we also see it when Finn goes up against competitors it's top of all the performance benchmarks top of the G2 leaderboard and if you're not happy we'll refund you up to a million dollars which I think says it all check it out for yourself at fan.ai Ryan Reynolds here for Mint Mobile I don't know if you knew this but anyone can get the same premium wireless for $15 a month plan than I've been enjoying it's not just for celebrities

28:18so do like I did and have one of your assistance assistance switch you to Mint Mobile today I'm told it's super easy to do at mintmobile.com slash switch upfront payment of $45 for three month plan equivalent to $15 per month required intro rate first three months only then full price plan options available taxes and fees extra default terms at mintmobile.com you're listening to following on with me Neil Mantholpe alongside former England fast baller steve harmerson and if you have missed the show where you want to catch up you can download the podcast from all good podcast providers or watch the show on talksports cricket youtube channel right as promised at the top of the show we're joined by a Durham head coach Ryan Campbell he was looking well wrapped up he wouldn't have been dressed like that if he'd been in Abu Dhabi which is where he was supposed to have been a harm he was just telling me off air that you know you always feel like you're you're at least two weeks behind the rest of the country early season so that's got to hurt that missing the trip to Abu Dhabi yeah frustrating

29:23that's a short you know you build up your whole preseason your plan everything basically building to a point where the the bowlers overs for instance are exactly where you want them to be as you're about to go outside and but you know end of the day it is totally out of our hands our our old mate Trump he decided to do something different look the end of the day we we need to you know find a different way you know there's no point just sitting here and moping and groaning we're pretty good at problem solving up here and you know myself and Marcus North and Vic you know the ground manager and you know we've all put our heads together trying to come up with tactics to try and get guys outdoors and well hopefully we'll all be okay well you've got plans then then Campbell because I mean you talk about having plans and players and Vic normally has the the ground in such a you know pristine condition but even put the marquee up he wouldn't have he wouldn't have the pictures in a position for you to use at this moment time so if you go

30:24anything in plan are you gonna try and use somebody else's marquee you're gonna try and send the bowlers away somewhere well that's the thing you know what you know Marcus is working through an option for us to send just our bowling staff over to Spain but again when you do that you know desert springs they're not they're not ready for having so many counties suddenly giving him a call and saying oh we need to come we need to come so you know the wickets from all reports are in pretty bad shape so to get the guys outdoors and bowling is great but then we have to weigh out well they're not even gonna bowl to batters is it worth sending him and paying all that cash but if we can get something out the back here you know I know that the nursery ground you mark who's who looks after the nursery ground is working hours and weekends to try and get something for us you know because I think at this stage we just got to get bowlers running on grass and bowling on turf you know if there's no batter that's fine the batters all you know catch

31:27up when we can but at this stage we'll you know we're trying to do either of those options you know obviously we got games planned against we got Sussex in the two day game and we're trying to have good conversations with them to maybe extend that and now that neither of the teams are going away and then obviously we have Durham Union as well so to throw other bits into the mix you know we've got four kids in Australia who can't quite get back at the minute and three of them are all our three of them are fast bowlers so we're working through all different ways to try and get our squad you know we got Colin Ackerman who was at the World Cup he's in South Africa you know trying to get back here as well so yeah there's a bit going on to be fair Campbell if I was in Australia if I was in South Africa the thought of going to Abu Dhabi would have got me back very very quickly the thought of bowling on the nursery ground in March Durham not quite nice as nice the proposition my friends Ryan a couple of months ago we spoke to Tim Bostock about the financial ramifications

32:32of being in division two and he said and actually not significant as long as it's only one year he basically said you know we've got all our best players on contract and that kind of thing but we don't want to be spending a couple of years in division two but when you look at division two you you half wonder whether it might be as hard to win that is it is to win division one I mean do you feel that the pressure of an immediate return oh man there's good cricket teams everywhere in county cricket and that's the beauty of the county game they're a tough opposition you know I've been watching obviously Darvyshire have been rebuilding their list you've got Lancashire throwing in guys you know you've got Worcester who come down who really although they got you know relegated with us they had a really good season at home and their bowlers are outstanding so mate there's so many good teams North Ants you know that Bufleem is not just sitting on his hands you know thinking what's going on you know every team is going to be tough and we do not think

33:33we're just going to you know Worcester League and go straight back up we're not going to hide behind what happened last year I'm not that sort of guy to go oh you know what we'll bounce back and hit hit the old coach's playable we have to earn every little thing we've got to get back to playing our very best cricket I think we've got an awfully talented squad and list but the facts are we didn't play to our optimum last year and you know you can say yes we got relegated only by one point but it doesn't matter one point or hundred points you still get relegated so you know we've gone back to basics we've worked really hard this offseason we've tried to break a couple of them all on the way just you know in the toughness of it all and I think we're in a really good position to be honest we're going to come back and we're going to play our brand of cricket we're going to be you know the Durham that people have got used to now Mo we had we had Anthony McGraw on last week you talked air about the teams around you in division two man has talked about how difficult it is you know our first and second divisions are strong

34:37I mean English cricket is in a decent spot when it comes to the talent pool we've seen a debacle of what happened in the winter is it important now that England players start playing as if there's a window now for them to play they don't play a test match till June I think Carson's going to the OPL but you know would you expect Stokes and one or two waters around the country from an England players point of view to play some county cricket yeah a hundred percent you know I you know since I've moved here I always knew that the ashes is everything if you're an astrayer and you lose the ashes the Sheffield shield is crap the Cookeborough balls crap everything's crap we've got to change everything and it's exactly the same when you're here and you know the one thing I will say is when I hear people talk about the county game is where you can't really blame the county game for this one because let's be honest they don't really look at the county game very often and that but that's their prerogative and that's fine and you know we we know that they respect this game but I now see that there is a massive opportunity for blocs

35:43to get back and you know what if you're a batter hundreds are your currency and there's a few let's say and you know Pope Crawley these sort of guys even Ben Stokes out like you know he was probably disappointed with his ashes to it you know so they all have to get back to work and the only way you get better is playing games I don't care what anyone says you know that's what they have to do and that means it strengthens the competition and if the competition is tough that hardens the next people to go forward and I'm really excited about those that period up till June to see which ones do play and which ones don't and you know that you got to obviously have one eye on the schedules and and loads and all that sort of stuff but you know I would expect that Ben will play for us in those first six weeks I know that you know obviously what happened the accident with his eye he's got to go through the right tests and stuff and and get released from that but you know he's very keen and very ready to go to play good cricket for himself and you know for Durham and

36:46then obviously to lead the single time again yeah your sound isn't too just as ever Campbell you signed an extension a couple of years you've got Kim R. Roach you've always had David Bettingham how important was the Kim R. Roach signing because from a boldest part of you start the season if you can bowl with two jumpers on coming from Barbados I mean what a sign and that is for wickets which do a little bit yeah look at what you thought it was really really important that well we've still got if you if you take Ben Reign out of our attack and you know Matthew Pots has obviously been dipping his toe in the England world and you know back with us we've got a very young bowling attack and and we need some experience heads to get us through you know last year and again I'm sorry if I keep banging on about but I don't hide behind excuses but we had so many injuries to the point where one game I had to borrow three players from other clubs just you know I've been in the game for 35 years and I've never actually met three blocs the day of the

37:50night before a game in a first class game of cricket so that was new for me but that's that's how desperate we were and the carry on from that was all our youngsters were thrown in too early because they were carrying injuries and they were having to brought back and then your rotations are out sink and by the end of it we just had nothing left and so to get a guy like of Kimo Roaches standing and you know he's played this game before here in England I think it's going to be really really exciting you know we throw into the mix Casey Oldridge who I believe and again without pumping the kid up too much he could be anything how we've got our hands on him is just amazing and we're bloody happy we got him let me tell you but this kid bowls fast can bat in the top six and I will say behind Jacob Bethel is probably the second best fielder in the country so to get a kid like that who's what six foot six or something as well you know we're excited to see what he's going to bring to the table so you know it's going to give us a few more options

38:54and what we've had in the past and you know that that's what I'm excited to see to get our fastballing group up and running and you know see where it can go talking of senior bowlers Campbell there were a couple of times last season when Woody Mark Wood said how keen he was to play a couple of games for Durham and I'm not setting a trap for you I promise but you know he for some reason he wasn't allowed to or you know is it frustrating centrally contracted players when they are sort of I mean we talk about overplayed they can be overrested it seems sometimes and and Woody is you know he's desperate to play for Durham you know there's obviously massive amounts of frustration that you know how you handle your fastballed and everyone's different but let's get that straight out you know Mark Wood is a unique character who bowls 150 kilometers an hour and they don't fall off trees very often so England are obviously very careful with him and look do I agree that he went to to Australia without playing a game he bowled what in one

39:56warm-up match and then he's expected to play a test I think that's really setting yourself up for failure I know he's done it before so that's the problem he's done it before and I think that's that works but you know that can be frustrating but again all we can do is have those conversations at the minute I'm not sure where Woody is or you know I know that he's you know waiting to he's still having knee troubles and you know our fingers across for him that hopefully everything's going to go well and you know if he does come back you know I would expect him to be you know first in our lineup to you know to try and get through some some cricket which would be really really exciting for everyone here and Campbell just find me from me I mean wherever you go whether you know the lads just sort of mucky and all in together and we you steer in in the cold chest listry and then eventually get to Sussex how much pun and then what goals have you set for them first sort of six or seven games that come before what the first test match are the are the first block because there there have to be the sort of not just a mere focus but that's how

40:57you're going to get promoted from them six games seven games. Yeah the history of second division cricket shows that it's a bloody tough competition to get out of and the teams that have done it like ourselves and Sussex and then you know less the last year you have to blow teams away early you have to get a lead and you have to just go for it and you know that's what we're going to do those first six games you know we are going to bring what we believe is our A game and we're going to be ruthless and the one thing that I will say about our game last year we had a number of opportunities where we were in a dominating position and let the opposition off the canvas and we just cannot afford to do that and hopefully you know guys have learnt they're going to spot those crucial moments and go you know what no not now this is me and you we're going to seek together we're going to do this we're going to push on push on push on so if we can do that and if we play our best cricket I'd note out we can win a lot of games of cricket but especially early on and

41:58like I say you know you get in the Ben Stokes in the team with Kumar Roach with pots with rain with old rich you know we've got to try and fit a spinner in there then we've got to fit in all our batters you know they all want to play but there's going to be a real battle on Clark Rhodes Ackerman all battling it out with Robinson and buddy McKinney wants to open the batting but Amelia Gay wants to open the batting and he got Alex Lee's as well so there's plenty fighting for spot so everyone plays as a team but let's be honest we play an individual game inside of a team so everyone's looking out you know trying to put their best foot forward so you know we're going to concentrate on us winning games of cricket nothing else no England selection no nothing no anything and that's what we're going to do and if we do that well and again now I am sound like a coach we're going to be bloody hard to beat and we're going to come and we're going to come all guns blazing and finally how's your own health Campbell you how's the ticker all good the cold skill in me but yeah the ticker is going really well to be honest look I'm actually

43:03allowed to exercise and do all sorts now I just went on my first scheme trip as if I'm not old enough my wife decided to take me skiing which was incredible because you know I know it sounds silly but I'm a Perth boy mate I brought up on the beaches there's no mountains there's no nothing and suddenly I'm sitting there looking at three different countries in one spot in Switzerland it was just magnificent so yeah I'm rejuvenated ready to go after a long preseason but yeah the Abu Dhabi some would have been nice but we'll have to do with the Chesterly Street some it keeps going it reminds me it keeps reminding always reminds me when when Australians talk about that and David Boone 38 years old seems to know on the first day of a championship match of the season against Worcester and he was like what an earth is this some 38 years old and I have never seen snow before in my life so it was bad enough seeing this now he couldn't drive on it either so it will be cold but it's another unique thing that keeps it not it's different and that's why we love the the southerners coming up here mate so they get nice and frosty and Kent will be getting a knife

44:08the heaters won't be going on in the body away change rooms let me tell you that for free we'll make it not as cold and frosty as we can for them right camera but an absolute pleasure as always talking to you very very best of luck care with continuing preseason and we'll talk to you during the summer thanks guys look forward to it right let's talk about the 150th anniversary test between England and Australia the Barmi army want to turn it into an Ashes test well to tell us more is Chris Millard managing director of the Barmi army Harmi had a huge smile on his face when he heard about this Chris oh go on then Harmi asking what he's on about I mean an Ashes test I mean for somebody who's playing for Ashes series I don't know I think Pinkball needs to be thrown out because I think they've gotten that right and I think the Ashes part of it is the endurance the two and for all the back and forward of two teams going hard seven and a half weeks so when I seen it I was like well they're on the back an Ashes test

45:13but tell us more because I was I was a little bit I was a little bit taking back and thinking right I'm going to I was actually going to ring in think we got it right here I mean Ashes Ashes is Ashes is where you make all your money over seven and a half weeks but do you really want it to be an Ashes test especially if it's a Pinkball game where the game's going to be won about 15 minutes before the game starts you make a very valid point Harmi but I think we sit here at Barmi Army Towers and we think about how to make the game more engaging in how to bring more people to an event like the 150th and whilst it provides great narrative being 150th anniversary of England versus Australia you're right it is a Pinkball test in March in Melbourne and we obviously want to take as many people as we can to support the lads and get the win over the line and we thought what better way than to start a campaign saying right the Ashes is the holders of the Ashes unfortunately and we think there's one test match it's a few weeks before we'll play the Ashes again

46:13back in the UK why not stick it all on the line for one test how the big slog over three days where you never know we might come out on top win the Ashes in Australia come back to England it's a bigger occasion when it's back in the UK it just means more to everyone then yeah I mean does it not make more sense for Australia to have a dear game with the amount of people that the Barmi Army are going to going to bring over because if the if the game finishes at seven o'clock surely the tourism of Melbourne will want to maximize the nighttime and not have people streaming out of the ground at half night 10 o'clock at night yeah I think the thinking behind it is that they want it to be better for the UK audience as well in terms of that the day night viewership over in the UK but you are right for the traveling fan I'd say 85% of people that travel prefer day cricket you enjoy going out you know what it's like on tour that the nightlife is part of what makes it also special you see the hustle and bustle of the cities and so many fans back and forth but we know it might only last two or three days would it be in a day night test as well so there's

47:17still plenty of time to take in the sites of Melbourne there might even be a Grand Prix the week after as well Chris we might come back to that but in case we run out of time if you like me and Harmi you know we ask what we think about Brendan McCulloughman his future and whether he should carry on and sometimes often actually the people who have their finger closest to the pulse are people like you because you deal a lot more with people who pay real money to follow the England team so I'm desperate to know what you as managing director of the Barmi Army spokesman for the people think about Brendan McCulloughman's future and whether you know I know everybody was very disappointed that's putting it mildly in Australia but your thoughts? It's a really tricky one because we were so excited about this actual series because of him and because of Ben Stokes so it's very it's very easy to forget how excited we were preaches because of how

48:19how good in theory the England testing were and how they always took it to the opposition and I think we saw a little bit of admittance from Brendan McCulloughman saying that they didn't think they played the style of cricket that they had been playing in Australia and I think that was the most frustrating thing for everyone the England fans to to go down the way they did without the character that we've seen on all of the previous series when it's been Brendan and Ben so I think from an English fans perspective it was incredibly disappointing we worked towards Ash's four year cycles away Ash's that's the big one Harmony knows more than anyone and to go down the way we did was shocking but you know what I think there'd be a lot of England fans disappointed to see him go in the short term especially with I guess the foundations of how healthily like that the boys really look up to him and think about how he Brooks comments you know what Ben Stokes thinks to him as well and that that feeling is definitely shared in dressing room and the England fans we support the players first and foremost and whilst they're all on board and singing to the tune of Brendan then then we will be right behind them.

49:23Yeah I get that I get that I'm I must admit I've said he should go because of what happened with Australia but I'm saying it with grit and teeth because of how positive he's been for English cricket over the course of the four year period and not just a sort of eight week debacle have you had much Chris I've had much interesting this ping ball test match I would imagine you know 100,000 people in Melbourne there'll be a lot of English fans going over nicely especially if there is a Grand Prix tagged under the back of it yeah yeah exactly that extra character of the Grand Prix will make it very special indeed but there is a lot of interest obviously it comes at a time where England knows his cricket is really good for the travelling fans so we've just been to South Africa hopefully beat the world test champions in their own backyard and then spinning out into a 150th anniversary ashes on the line test match it would be yeah it'd be a pretty pretty special few months for the England fan that likes to travel but ultimately it is at a tricky time that in between period so what will happen there will be a lot of people there

50:25but we're still yet to see to see it coming through flights aren't in range yet so that'll be happening in the next few weeks actually I just want to ask you how did the ashes go from I mean above me army point of view and the wider range of the other touring groups as well because there's a lot of touring groups now go follow this England cricket team was it as good as you thought it was going to be yeah it was the I think it's the biggest overseas England cricket tour of all time terms of data what we've got that certainly suggests that there's over 500 million Australian dollars put in circulation during the seven weeks which is incredible the only people to shift to shift interest in Australia before it is Taylor Swift and the Barmy Army so it'd be reported in the press that inflation has increased because of the ashes tour so you know what in terms of how it went for everyone who traveled over there they had amazing time we want to test much let's not forget that we want to test much in Australia which is never easy so we take the wins in the three and a half thousand people we had to travel in with us had a very special time right moving

51:28on to any other business harmy hamcher assigned jade and seals as a replacement for Michael Nisa who's at hamcher was cancelled by cricket Australia that's not the first time that's happened it's actually quite a hazardous business isn't it it's a bit risky signing an Australian with a central contract it is very surprised at the age of Michael Nisa that they've done that because how many more games is Michael Nisa going to play it for for Australia I think when hamcher signed Michael Nisa I think they might have thought his dares of playing international cricket for Australia might have been closer to the end and the start so if it was a young fast parlor then no chance but we heard mountain immigrants talk about it last week about the importance of a good overseas player well Michael Nisa is a very very good overseas player like we've seen great character that's a big body blow but jade and seals like we've seen at Sussex he's all in he's all singing old Hanson he will give everything he possibly can for that first half so they've got a good

52:31bowler but I think the Michael Nisa all rounder that I think when hamcher members seen that who I think they've been looking to lips and thinking we've got a good one here so I'm very very surprised that cricket Australia and Michael Nisa has cut ties with that with that deal because do you know what I mean if I was Michael Nisa I'd be thinking how many how many more Australian caps and we're going to get I'm going to get only get them when the when the lights are on so you might get a chance to play in the 150th test match you know and oh and finally before the final word Mick Hunt passing away harmy I think he fell just a couple of months short of 50 years on the lords ground staff I mean anybody in that period of time that covered a test match at lords eventually got to meet him I thought he was the epitome of everything good about that grounds when I head a head grounds when he could be gruff and grumpy but always with the kindness of hearts I mean you must have you must have met him lords yeah Mick great man Mick so sad

53:33what I've seen and he was actually quite surprised you know quite took back when I I've seen the the home home of cricket tweet he was what he was a one-off was Mick he was a one-off you know him in the engulfed their cockney accent cockney slang they did not care a jot about the establishment which I thought was brilliant you know we talk about chief executive pitches all over the country and trying to get them into fourth and fifth years Mick produced the best pitch he possibly covered and he was going to be dictated to by nobody a great man who had lords I mean lords looking a picture every single yeah every single yeah lords looked a picture postcard every time you see in the postcards in the souvenir shop and they're looked amazed and that's what lords looked like and it was largely down to Mick and he was a he was a good man he was a he was a friend of the cricket is and not of the establishments was what I loved even better because he could not care about anything other than producing the best pitch the best looking outfield and having

54:34you know the best game of cricket that he possibly could and he'd be a big mess he was sadly missed when he stepped away from being head groundsman at lords and it's it's so sad he's passing so he's when I seen I seen that in the day I was it was a it was a real tear jerker because he's a good man Mick on lords between 1969 and 2018 right harmy central stags bowl a Brent Randall has been something of an internet sensation this week after becoming the first player in the 254-year history of first-class cricket to take five wickets in five balls against northern districts he took seven for 25 but five in five I assume that you've seen the clip because you would have been sent to you but he he didn't have any in court at third man they were good balls now they were good balls in good areas but I questioned some of the batting especially some of the leaving I mean no way you're of stump is you taught me to very very early in your career to

55:38know where you're of stumpism as a batter and I think two of things or two of the slip catches to the the the next the other forward press was with I know where my off stump is and I'm covering as much as I possibly can so I'm going to come out even further and he managed to drag his lens back and get the next now fantastic bowling it was he he literally bowled you know the way you you'd want to bowl in first first-class cricket you're teaching a young kid to bowl you bowl in and around the top of off stump full stump six inches higher six inches wider six inches you know inside and you you work in that little square and if you can get the ball to go over the stumps creative you can get the ball to hit the top of off stump even better and if a batter is a little bit indecisive you'll nick it basically what he did for five balls the battered nick them the battered left them and Brent picked up five and five so fantastic well done brilliant and with a footnote the Curtis camphor and Kellis and Lovall who also took five with it's in five balls

56:38camphor did it in a domestic island t20 game in july 2025 and Zimbabwe all round the Kellis and Lovall doing it in a women's under 19 t20 game in 2024 but it wasn't first class so Brent Randell keep an eye on him you've been listening to following on with me Neil Mantle alongside former England pass baller Steve Hormison and we'll be back at a similar time next week to continue building up to the start of the new county championship season and so much more but for now this has been another edition of following on okay seven stops to write this best man's speech oh I'm Liam and I've got nothing stop funny funny is good I beat her he'd never forgive me what about friendship is a journey uh crained come on that's it in year five Dan had the bright idea tracking the best best man's speech

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