A musician defends using AI in his music (Part 2)

0:00I'm Mani, I'm Noah. This is Devon, and this is No Such Thing. The show we set are our dumb arguments and yours by actually doing research. On today's episode, this talent actually matters. I've known that there's no such thing. This is an I Heart Podcast. Guaranteed Human. What up this J. Valentine co-host of the R&B Money Podcast alongside my brother, R&B legend, Hank, together we've built a space for artists, executives, and fans of R&B music to reminisce and tell the real stories behind the music. I have no money, I was hood famous.

1:01They think you're gonna get everybody out. We lived in a project, and real love came out. They hear the music, and we had nothing. From Smokey Robinson to Mary J. Blige, B2K to Jill Scott. If you're a super dedicated R&B fan, this is where you belong. Listen to R&B Money from the Black Effect Podcast Network on the I Heart Radio app Apple Podcast or wherever you get your podcast. Hey, it's Alec Baldwin. This season on my podcast, here's the thing I talk to actor, Stephen Root. I'm a people watcher. You see that guy going down the drain though? Yeah, I can use that. And open igloo co-founder, Alia Muhammad. I love staying on top of what is going on in our city, what is on renter's minds. And taking all of that knowledge to build a platform that hopefully is gonna make New York City better in the long run. Listen to Here's the thing on the I Heart Radio app Apple Podcast or wherever you get your podcasts. The World Cup is over, but if you caught the soccer bug and aren't sure what to do now, check out our podcast Big Kick Energy. I'm Cameron Dicker, the kicker from the Los Angeles Chargers, and I'm here with Timmy

2:02Tillman, current L.A.F.C. star player. So, we know a little something about kicking balls. Each week we'll tackle things like, who's winning the Premier League this year? What do you think is harder? We're scoring a penalty kick or scoring a field goal. Join us each week for a quick chat with your soccer loving girls about the best sport in the world. Soccer, just don't tell my coaches I said that. Listen to Big Kick Energy on the I Heart Radio app Apple Podcast or wherever you listen to podcasts. Alright, so this is part two on our episodes on AI Music. In part one, we talked to Charlie Harding from Switched On Pop, who was not a fan of musicians using AI and music. In part two, we're going to hear a very different point of view. So as a reminder in part one, I talked about coming across this artist who was new to me called Ten Ten Benja. And later learning that on his new EP, he is using AI.

3:04So just quickly, some background on Ten Ten. He's a singer and producer from Kansas City. He makes music that's kind of hard to put into one genre. In a 2020 profile from pitchfork, Ryan Dumball writes, on some of his songs, he sounds like the weekend covering Elliott Smith. Wow. So over the last couple of months, I've been listening to a lot of Ten Ten Benja. A lot of the older stuff, maybe regrettably the new AI stuff. He's been one of my top artists on App Music over the last couple of months.

4:08So we're going to see him appear in the end of your ad. I think he's going to be eating for the year endless for sure. So we recorded part one a few weeks ago. And it's really bugged me that as I get further and further into listening to this guy, I'm like, why is he using AI? It just feels a little unnecessary. But the great thing about this podcast is it's a good excuse to confront people about things. So I was like, I should reach out to this guy and try to talk to him and just get a better understanding of why he feels compelled to use AI in his music. I DM him on Instagram and ask him to talk. Oh, what do you go by? You go by Ten Ten, you go by Benja? Ten Ten Benja. Ten Ten or Benja. And people call me Ten Ten. Some people think that's like pretentious. So I walked Ten Ten through my journey of finding his music and then later finding out

5:09that he was using AI on his new EP. You came out and you said, yeah, I am using AI. And my immediate reaction was like, oh, fuck, this sucks. You know, it's like this new guy. I like it. That's how a lot of people seem to have felt. Yeah, it felt kind of like a lot of things. I feel like in 2026 when it's like, you know, anything that you like, then people will come out and like, well, you know, the thing that you like, here's actually why it sucks. Yeah, exactly. So my real reaction was like, damn, you know, like I don't want to be out here listening to AI music, but this music is good. And like I said, I went and listened to the older stuff. And I'm like, that stuff is good too. And it felt to me about knowing about your process at all. It felt a little bit like, why is this guy using AI? Number one is, is he like being lazy and using it in some way? Because that's what we're seeing with a lot of the artists that, you know, like Tyga or Kanye or like Kanye is not recording his verses right using AI or Tyga.

6:13I don't know whatever that last project is. Or my second thought was like, oh, is he doing this as a way to like get attention in some way? Um, neither. I just, I'm interested in music. I love music and I'm alive now. What appeal to you about the thought of using AI initially human, initially, okay, humor getting it to do funny stuff, the hallucinations, the thing that's wrong with AI is, is the thing that like with people, the weaknesses of AI could be its greatest strengths. And people say AI is not imaginative. It has a sick imagination, a disgusting and haunting imagination. But one that's capable of intense beauty, if you know how to look at it, if you know how to move it, you know, or move with it, converse with it, these various models.

7:18So he initially started using AI under the side project that he has. So not under his, you know, 10, 10 persona, but under the side project called penis angel. Hmm. Very comedic. Sounds right. I had started experimenting with different tools primarily, Suno, leading up to this, this kind of joky Christmas album that we put out. We used generative AI and kind of with itself and just made uncanny, ridiculous, hauntingly hallucinating, gnashing brain rot songs. Santa, you're overworkin' your elves. Tomorrow's Christmas day, Christmas day. You, Santa know it's Christmas Eve. Tomorrow's Christmas day, Christmas day. And somewhere in there, as I started to advance that project and it became more of an AI

8:24leaning project, I started making music that was really deep to me. And I made a couple records with my friends. It ain't dry enough, it ain't dry enough. The whole damn world. But he ran into some issues trying to distribute this newer music. I started to want to have it distributed more widely, but because of the stigmas of right now and maybe, you know, however justified stigmas of right now about this technology, people weren't wanting to put it out. I think because there's a certain viewpoint about AI where they couldn't see that it was like a distinct piece of artwork. When you say people who you're talking about like labels or... Yeah, a couple of different distributors that I was talking to to try to put the record out and get it pushed.

9:25So he decided to release these AI songs under his 1010 project. He thought they would be overlooked and he was actually working on another 1010 record that didn't use AI. But then semi-ramas came out and it was infectious to people and they were surprised by it in the same way I was when I heard, you know, that final master bat. I figured when people started realizing that it was AI because it's so obvious or that it used AI, that then we could have the conversation actually. And I could say, hey, listen, I'm doing the art that I'm doing for art reasons. And it's that simple. It's not a lack of talent, but I don't feel that talent is important. I don't think talent is what constitutes good art. And I think a lot of times the talent and the display of talent conversation in our field

10:26as musical artists has really cheapened the conversation over the decades. It becomes this circus of musical talent. And a lot of that is not really important to what's good in my opinion. And I feel that music comes from somewhere else. You know, it's just like, you know, it is different in terms of, I like the experience of making music just straight up head to heart better. It's healthier. It's healthier on the mind and body, you know. But in terms of what I view to be the merit of what makes good art art, I don't think there's anything about AI usage that makes art less art. It's just about what tools you can use for a given concept that's coming through the ether. What do you think of the idea that, yeah, now, you know, reading some of your interviews when it was first coming out, right, you're talking about, like, not being able to make

11:30rent, right? Like, you're not being a real thing. And then suddenly, I don't have a place. But you've gotten all this attention now. Do you think this is like, is it? Is attention worth anything now? I have a lot of deals now on the table, but I still don't have any money. That's what I was going to ask. Like, does, does attention matter now in a way that it maybe used to at some point? Yes, probably. But you haven't seen. Maybe I don't, maybe in the scheme of things, I don't have that much attention yet. Yeah. But yeah, it's helped not really fiscally yet, but it's helped the flow. It's helped the connections to people, other artists, to have some, you know, a moment of a little bit more visibility. All right. So there's a few things there that I want to talk about. First this idea of talents and like, it does talent matter, right?

12:33To me, I think it depends on what your definition of talent is. I definitely hear this in terms of like, I think sometimes there's this obsession over like, how many, you know, instruments can the artist play and that sort of thing. But like, you know, there's a reason someone like Jacob Collier, who's like, there's really talented musician is not my favorite artist. Yeah. You know, like, I don't care to know what you listen to is music hard. You know, even though he's, you know, if we just talk about talent in a traditional sense, very talented, can play many different instruments, a lot of different genres. Yeah. Probably has perfect pitch, you know, Charlie Pooves. Someone else also in this, you know, sort of world about like, their music doesn't connect to me in that way. And when I'm going to listen to artists, I'm not like, I'm not picking the music I'm listening to based on like, who's the best piano player or who's the best singer? Yeah. And the equation of what would make an artist relatable to you or connect to you somehow, is just one part of it. Yeah. And look, I think someone can be, that's why I'm like, I'm like, how do you define talent,

13:36right? Because I think obviously the artist that listen to art talented, I think they make good music. But there's this idea of talent being tied to like how well you can play an instrument or how well you can sing a song. Yeah. Like, it's for quote, unquote, correct way, you know, like Bob Dylan, not a lot of people would say not a talented vocalist. Yeah. Right. But that's not what makes Bob Dylan a good artist. Yeah. I think this goes back to what we're saying in the first episode of like these like American idol type musicians, yeah. Yeah. Who are really great at singing the songs on key and they're hitting all the notes. But they lack the sort of emotion of a lot of these songs that they're covering, right? And there's some people who are great at both, right? There's, you know, someone like a Fantasia or whatever who's like, or Kelly Carson who has like great voice hits the notes, but also has the emotion. But to me, I would much rather have someone who, you know, like Dijon or someone like

14:40that who has like maybe not, you know, quote unquote, doing it the right way, but they're bringing something new to it. The personality to it. Yes. At the very least. Exactly. I think people use this as a dig for someone like Taylor Swift all the time. Yeah. Where they say like, oh, you know, like she's not a great singer or she doesn't dance that well. It's like obviously Taylor Swift is not Taylor Swift because she's the best dancer or singer. Yeah. And like whatever she's doing may not connect with you, but it's connecting obviously but lots and lots of different people. Yeah. I do think there is this, you know, it comes out with the Beyonce conversation all the time. Oh, I do need all these people in the room to write all these songs for you. Yeah. I think part of some of the genius of some artists is knowing they're like shortcomings and bringing in people to round that out like Beyonce with songwriters. Yeah. Yeah. She's an incredible vocalist, if not one of the best. Yep.

15:41And also knows, hey, what like someone else can write this because, you know, they're more experienced sort of the things that I write just don't hit the same and that that's why we have those incredible Beyonce songs. We just wouldn't have them if she didn't know that about herself. Yeah. And then I thought it was curious that he said basically, even though he's using AI, he does like the experience of making music without AI. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Right. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Well, it's interesting. I feel like his points were to me, the argument against using AI in a lot of ways where it's like, yeah, like I agree with what we're just saying about talent, not being kind of the only thing that makes something good. Yeah. So then it's like, well, why do you need the AI then? Like, why not just do it that way? If you wanted to do a, you know, whatever guitar part or something, like you can play a bad

16:41guitar part and, you know, or get someone who, you know, it's not going to be the best guitar. Like, you know, obviously there's an, it's easier to do AI. So, yeah. Yeah. You know, I can answer it right there. But like, you know, it's like, obviously a creative guy. I'm sure if he grabbed a couple instruments and played around for a couple hours, he could get something passable, you know. Yeah. Yeah. You know, so it's just, it was interesting. Like I feel like everything he was saying could be reversed to argue against. Yeah, it could be true. It could be true. And even the things he was saying where it's like he prefers like the head to heart sort of thing. Yeah. Organic. Yeah. So it's like, well, there you go. So you know, you know, I mean, he doesn't seem so conflicted about it. So I guess, you know. Okay. We're going to take a quick break. I want to get back. We're going to go deeper on how 1010 uses AI. Hey, everyone. It's the Jonas Brothers with the Hey Jonas podcast. We've been catching up with some great friends Paul Rod, Michael Bubley, Seth Meyers,

17:44Nile Horan, Jake Shane, and making some new friends while getting into what's really like to have sisters like Alex National. She likes to control everyone and tell everyone to do that. Okay. Well, control is a harsh word. I would say that's a harsh word. I am more outspoken, growing up a lot of the times because she was so quiet. I would speak for like the both of us. Now I'm working on like thinking of mom. I'm really not thinking before I speak. And Joey King. You know, if your like mom is yelling at your sibling and even if you're annoyed with your sibling, you just like won't let that slide. It's like, you only can yell at your sibling. I'm like, you can't do that here. That is not what I want about her like that. I just want to talk about her like that. Plus we've been taking your calls, listening to your voice mails and giving advice or at least trying to. So if you've got catching up to do now is the perfect time. Listen to Hey Jonas on the I Heart Radio app Apple podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. If you're bookshelf and you're for you page are equally important to your personality, welcome home.

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19:46The improvised character comedy podcast were each week a new panel of artists discuss their craft. Join us for a panel of wellness influencers. What I try to do is faux journal. I don't know. I think you guys heard of faux journaling. Yeah, it's reading. It's called reading. So you're so we don't like to use that word anymore. Okay. A panel of New Yorker cartoonists. Have you guys done Terry Gross's Peloton class? No. I've been dying too. I'm so sorry. I'm seeing a reading of Sudako in the thousand paper cranes by Auderman Donald at the Wonderland bookstore. That's crazy. I went to the Wonderland bookstore yesterday and I heard Nora Jones do a reading of zero, Dr. 30. No way. I have to come to the last bookstore though. Kim Kattroll is reading the guitar tabs of yesterday. A panel of Eurovision participants and we do a little Halloween sometimes. Does the Pope dress up? He winks on Halloween. It's right up next to the microphone. I hear you get the elbows here. The eyelashes hate each other. You never seen Italy so quiet as when the Pope gets up to wink on Halloween.

20:51Listen to artists on artists on artists on artists on the I heard radio app Apple podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. So I want to go a bit deeper into how he actually uses AI. So he says it really runs the game. I have just prompted entire songs, especially in the comedy of the PA stuff. There's an intro to the members only record, the PA record. That's these two. It's like a fanfare, like a herald of two comedians who are bringing in this being that I've created. Pina Sangele doesn't produce songs, he breeds them. You think you're playing a chord? No. No, you're playing a PA song. A little rascal is playing his music through you. I didn't like feed it, me doing comedy. I just, I wrote it and prompted it. Totally agnostic about it. And then he says, you know, what he's doing with the newer stuff is he'll sometimes feed

21:54it. You know, demos. A lot of this music has been demos that I haven't been able to get picked up or used. And then I just fed them into Sino and started a cross talk going back and forth for a day or so. And that comes with a certain amount of schizophrenia, but it taught me a lot about my music. You can hear the ways I'm evoking some of the things I wanted the track to do. Drop out and stuff like that. And it helps give it, you know, it doesn't, it's not magic and you can feed it a whole

22:58song and the lyrics and it'll start rearranging them. And so then the artist is presented with a choice. Like is that the type of hallucination that augments this, that is that the type of, you know, uncanniness that adds to this or is it killing the vibe? And you, just like in any process in the studio, you close your eyes and listen to how you feel. So let me play now the AI assisted, assisted track. So yeah, I wanted to prompt him on sort of the criticism he's gotten about this of

24:02people being like, basically you're only using AI because you can't do it yourself. He used AI on this song because he couldn't do it himself. Probably not. I'm not going to sit there and do all those micro edits. So you don't see that as an insult? No. To you because that's, you know, that's what the response, you know, I've been seeing on my tears. Well, artists can pretend like they can do everything to the cows come home. I've been stressed out enough by that bullshit. I'm happy with myself and I'm happy with what I do with just a guitar or just a keyboard. And that's different and that's special and a lot of that music is going to be coming out. Continue to come out, you know, and that's, that's, and I've gotten to a deeper place with it. In many ways, the three by ten record that I did was very influenced by my work with AI because I would put my music in and I'd get these hyper produced versions and I started to mathematically kind of understand some of what it was doing.

25:05You know what I mean? Like in terms of certain parts of the song, contracting and expanding and stuff that's been kind of tough for me with pop music because I came in through punk. But what's interesting with, you know, the, your latest project is like, it's not straight forward pop music. You know, it's like, no, no, no, the AI is, you know, that's the joke though. Yeah, beauty is that you can get the big budget version of this psychotic shit you want to make. And it's like, you know, you only get to see this on SNL. So I thought that was really interesting because that was part of the criticism we heard from Charlie was that AI takes everything and sort of like, kind of makes it sound like the mean, you know, like, yeah, but Ten's on it saying like, actually, oh, this is helpful for me because my music is a little bit more outside of music. Yeah. So by feeding it into this AI, I'm actually learning how to commercialize my music in

26:07the way and make it a little bit more palatable or pop. Yeah. And that's influencing, obviously, you know, the music that he's reading into AI, but also the music that he's making outside of AI because it's like an example of, he's seen more examples of what AI would like, how to commercialize his music in some way. Yeah. And it's, it's also, maybe it's not as cool, but it's the soon-o version of his song is way more like radio friendly. Yes. And the demo. That doesn't necessarily mean it's better, but it, you know, it appeals to like a broader audience. But I thought it was interesting what he was saying about, I mean, being very transparent about not wanting to do all the micro edits. Yeah. Yeah. We're like, and I know I feel like my opinion on this is going to end up being the boomer opinion in 20 years, but it's like what I was watching this really old video of MGMT making a beat for one of their songs. Yeah. And you see them doing these little tiny, minuscule changes to like a synth or something

27:10that, and they're working on it forever, and then finally they get to some very unique noise that ends up being the one you recognize. We found the sound on a keyboard that sounded kind of like a, like a, like a, an ink and we wanted to be like a flute sound. We wanted to be like brothers, John's and needs per root, circuit, 17, 76. I just thought that was so incredible, all the little things they were doing to make the song sound unique. And I think it's kind of a shame to just be like, yeah, I'm not doing all that little shit. Like it's okay. He's okay for the, for soon to do it. And I think that's probably going to become more and more acceptable and fine. But yeah, I think it's kind of sad to lose those like tiny little changes that you might inflect on a song.

28:11But then it's like you could do a feedback loop with the AI. There's probably a version of the micro edits within that. It's different form. Oh yeah. You're just doing that in a different way. You take this and then you prompt, okay, remove that and do this and you'll find something you wouldn't have gotten by yourself either. So. And that's kind of what he was saying. I guess about the hallucinations where it is built in happy accidents. It's like the thing is just going to fuck up eventually. Different flavor of maybe a similar thing. So a lot has been made about how much better AI music has gotten in a short period of time. But 1010 has a slightly different read on it. He thinks it has to do less with just how good the tech has gotten and more about how the music industry makes music. A big reason why some of the sounds that we're generating with AI are able to pass is because music has been becoming more AI steadily for decades in its entire construction

29:15and meaning. It has become less human as we would call human. We're based on systematic work, you know, huge writing camps. And a product that's essentially often been bleached and stripped of the initial magic of the idea. And this has become the status quo and what we consider to be good. So yes, of course, AI can make good music. Now I realize in my own work with it that I run into these walls of frustration where there are levels of a natural spiritual thing that they cannot be thought about. They cannot be talked about. And that was one of my biggest problems. Has been one of my biggest problems in my engagements with the music industry. Everything was being prompted. The whole time I've engaged with it, it's been prompted. You know, it's been, are you, what kind of song are you doing? Oh, it's a little R&B with a little jazz and it's got like some garage and and our

30:20whole relationship to art in general has become so referential. And so you know, it became too much conversation already. And so this was the natural progression progression. You need things perfect. You need things generic. You need things done like they've been done before. Why wouldn't you do this? In this conception, sometimes I think of myself as that vicious label director. You know, they're not all vicious. Many of them are not. But you understand some of them, a couple of them throughout history, surely one or two have been. So and I put myself in that position, I have the artist make a thousand versions of a song for me. Ten Ten walked me through a version of this dynamic of stripping an idea of its initial magic, even before AI music was even a thing. In 2020, he released this song called Dobby. She really loved me and she really gave it to me.

31:26She took care of me and she let me hit her. I don't know how I fell into this opportunity. I stayed alive. I had to do what I was doing. And then he released a more produced version of the song called Dobby 21 after getting some notes from his label. That was some industry AI effication. Okay. That was me trying to meet a mandate and misinterpreting really what made this song special. I don't want a bad mouth at too much because some people told me they really liked that version. I personally don't. Yeah, I personally don't. It's like one, it's something I've tried to have taken down. 21 was a lot of stress. It was a lot of sitting in a room and trying to get sounds.

32:27And for me, it ends up coming off stiff and overproduced and it's lost a lot of the feeling and magic of the original. But what, so let me ask you this, right? In that case, if you like the more sort of raw, stripped down version, why not, you're saying you made these demos and... AI does mega pop better than me. So that's fine. I'm not worried about being talented. So you think that your demo versions are worse than what's, you know, I don't feed it, pitches out. Not at all. But it's about uses. So if I feel that the song is of a certain type, you know, there's certain types that are, I don't have the scientific knowledge by myself. Like I do almost everything by myself in the box. I have friends that contribute, but it's usually like them sending me files.

33:28So, you know, I have limitations in that capacity. I think he's saying that the industry has become just a process for like AI. Yes. Like how do we make this type of song? Like, you know, they speak in terms of prompts or things that have already been done in the past versus what can be new. And I think about in terms of streaming too, right? Like streaming is I think changed music in a way of like if you want your song to be playlisted, you want it to blend in with all the other music, right? Like so much of streaming is like, how do I make a song that does not make the person click next on that song? You almost want it to be indesernable from the thing that just played. Yes. And then he's saying like, oh, like, you know, this does, you know, mega pop way better than I could. Yeah. It's like, yeah, that's true. But we'll always do that better if you don't try. And like he doesn't need to try to do anything. But kind of to the point that MGMT thing where it's like, well, if you just totally, quote

34:35unquote, give up on trying to do anything, then what are you, you're not going to, you're obviously never going to learn to do anything. Yeah. I think the thing I really, you can hear me struggle with in this interview is that I think so much of what is cool about making art is that you have limitations. And you may have a thing in your head, but you also have limitations and your art becomes this sort of compromise of the thing that you have in your head versus the thing that you can actually make, whether that's, and that limitation could be a budget. It could be time like there are things that make the thing that's in your head slightly different when you're done with it. And the thing that he talks about so often during his interview is he has all these concepts and he said, and he doesn't like the idea of limitations based on his skill set or budgets. And AI allows him to get closer to the thing in his head because he may not know how to

35:36play a particular guitar part. Yeah. And he's not all that interested in learning, spending all this time learning that guitar part. He's interested in getting his concept out into the world and getting closer to that versus doing the work, you know, these things that, you know, that we traditionally, like if you want to do that thing, you either get good at it or you find someone else who is good at it to play that thing. For him, it's like, well, I would rather prompt it. Yeah. And to get it too closer to what is in my head, even if that removes just human labor from the process or me learning a thing from the process because I don't think his ideas, like I'm not in this to learn how to, you know, play a particular part of blah, blah, blah, blah. I'm here to, I make music because I want to make the stuff that's in my head. Yeah. And AI allows. Yeah. And it's just, you know, I don't think he, he's emitting as a shortcut. Yeah. But that doesn't bother him that it's a shortcut. I remember playing violin when I was growing up and they, you don't start with the string,

36:40right? And everyone in the class is pissed off. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I just want to fucking let's go. I want to be playing Beethoven immediately. Plucking the strings on the violin. You've ran the little metal pieces on your fingers because they're so delicate as a kid. Yeah. But then you realize why you had to do that before you get to the string part. It's because you need to understand how this instrument makes noise. Yeah. Before you start getting on the string. And it feels like that's an important process that could be lost as AI assisted, generative music progresses. Interesting this line in marketing and like the ads industry right now, you'll see Apple, for example, will come out with a really cool looking commercial. And then five minutes later, they upload the behind the scenes. Like here's how we made this. To show you that they did it. Yeah, because the end result or like the work they did is almost as cool as the finished product. So I think recently they did like a stop motion, really cool like animation.

37:42And then they showed you how they did it. And it's like, wow, look at all the work that went into this. It's so cool. Then some like AI bro, quote, tweeted it and was like, I just remade this in for $40 on whatever the fuck app. And yeah, like it's doing a lot of the same thing that the Apple commercial was doing. But knowing that there was none of that hard, tedious work that went into it totally cheapens the value. I don't give a shit about the AI or created one. Yeah. Yeah. The what makes the thing interesting is that it was the work that you put into it. Yeah. But this is a good transition. He has 10 times that he doesn't really like this idea of this like demystification of the art and this like, you know, all these artists doing. Here's how I made this thing and like showing the process. He thinks that takes away from some of the magic of it. So let me play this. Interesting. The music to demystify the process. I think I get really disappointed even when I'm listening to a song and I hear certain lyrics.

38:47Like there's this song by Halla notes. It's like you're out of touch. I'm out of time going out of my head when you're not. I love those type of lyrics. It's like, it's like deeply longing, you know. But in my head, it was always, you're out of touch. I'm out of touch. Reiterating that. My friend had the nerve to tell me it was out of time. It ruined the whole fucking thing. It ruined the whole view of the tension and the poetry that I felt for the song. So yeah, I think that's what that does. Like, hey, this is how I make a beat. Like, whatever. Do you feel like that's what I was going to ask? Because this is when I found out that like, you know, there's AI involved in your project, I felt a bit of this. I've just sort of like, I didn't want to know.

39:48Artists should be able to tell the story if that's what they're into. But this compulsory like artists and accountability, that's not a thing. That's bullshit. Are we going to hold clowns accountable next? What position do we hold as gestures in this society that gives us any authority or accountability? Half the time artists these days are taking accountability for decisions that were made for them. So the fact is that no, I don't think all AI music is bad. Yes, it has harsh limitations. And you really have to have a diverse kind of pool of education and a pretty wide lexicon and a pretty literary mind to ride the bull. It'll be interesting people leaning more and more on these models if they stay paid a play in this way. How that influences art. And I think there could be a lot of negative influences. And so I don't know what to do with the world.

40:51I don't understand enough. I'm very creative and I have very vivid dreams. So the best thing I feel that I can do is engage with what's going on in an honest way as an honest artist. And if the tools end up being abolished, well, I'll just go back to what I was doing. I'm still doing it. I don't want to lean on being a great singer. I don't want to lean on any of that stuff. I want the spirit to be able to speak. So I'm totally agnostic about it in terms of the process, in terms of whatever affects that the technology itself has on the planet. I care about everything and we live in hell. And there's more holes now to plug than we have fingers for. So I guess we're going to have to start using our dicks or something.

41:54She really loved me and she really gave it to me. She took care of me and she let me hit her. I don't know how I fell into this opportunity. Stay alive. I had to do what I was doing. She really loved me. Thank you. She's a 10-10 bandjeah for throwing this interview. This music is available on streaming anywhere you listen to music. You can also check out his website, themetriusproduction.com. We'll link to it in the show notes where you have some videos and some other cool stuff that he's working on. Stick around after this break. We're going to do the credits and we're going to tease what's coming up next week on those such things. Hey everyone, it's the Jonas Brothers with the Hey Jonas Podcast. We've been catching up with some great friends Paul Rod, Michael Bubley, Seth Meyers, Nile Horan, Jake Shane, and making some new friends while getting into what's really

42:56like to have sisters, like Alex and Ashton Earl. She likes to control everyone and tell everyone to do that. Okay, well control is a hard word. I would say that's a hard word. I am more outspoken. Growing up a lot of the times because she was so quiet, I would speak for the both of us. Now I'm working on thinking about it. I'm not continuing before I speak. And Joey King. You know if your mom is yelling at your sibling and even if you're annoyed with your sibling, you just won't let that slide. It's like, you can only yell at your sibling. I'm like, you can't do that here. That is not what I'm talking about. I'm like, I don't know about it. Plus we've been taking your calls, listening to your voice mails and giving advice or at least trying to. So if you've got catching up to do now is the perfect time. Listen to Hey Jonas on the I Heart Radio app Apple Podcast or wherever you get your podcasts. If you're bookshelf and you're for you page are equally important to your personality, welcome home. This is pros society, the weekly podcast that's part book club, part group chat for thought

43:58daughters, pop culture obsessives and anyone who thinks pride and prejudice and love island deserve the same level of discourse. I'm Eli Rallo and every week we're connecting the dots between books, the internet and the conversations everyone can't stop having. I'm going to have to look up this story. I'm obsessed. So obsessed. From bestselling authors and your favorite book talk creators to the latest pop culture moments, nothing is off the table. It's like if you can hide some real messages inside compelling characters and that is of Trojan horse, whether you're looking for literary deep dives, smart pop culture conversations or a community of readers who love to think a little too much, you're in the right place. Listen to pros society on the I Heart Radio app, Apple podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. See you between the pages. Hi, this is highly breakman, Angel Jaretana, Jeremy Colhane, Cash McDonald and we're the hosts of the artists on artists on artists on artists podcast. We improvise character comedy podcasts where each week a new panel of artists discuss

44:59their craft. Join us for a panel of wellness influencers. What I try to do is faux journal. I don't know, I think I sort of faux journaling. Yeah, it's reading. It's called reading. So we don't like to use that word anymore. Okay. A panel of New Yorker cartoonists. Have you guys done Terry Gross's Peloton class? No! I've been dying too. I'm so sorry. I'm seeing a reading of Sadako in the Thousand Paper Cranes by Audrement Donald at the Wonderland Bookstore. 14. That's crazy. I went to the Wonderland Bookstore yesterday and I heard Nora Jones do a reading of Zero Dark Thirty. No way. We'll have to come to the last bookstore though. Kim Kertroll is reading the guitar tabs of yesterday. A panel of Eurovision participants. And we do a little Halloween sometimes. Does the Pope dress up? He winks on Halloween. It's right up next to the microphone. I hear you get the elbows here. The eyelashes hit each other. You never seen Italy so quiet as when the Pope gets up to wink on Halloween. Listen to artists on artists on artists on the I heard radio app Apple podcasts or wherever

46:05you get your podcasts. Wow, you stuck around. For next week's episode, the question that we're going to be tackling should ugly people beat a protected class. Stay tuned. Next one's that. No such thing is a production of Colliders Code content. Our executive producer is Mangesh Hattikader. The show is created by Manifidel, Noah Friedman and me, Devon Joseph. The theme and credits song are by Manifidel. The show is mixed by Steve Bone. If you have a question, comment, critique, reach us at the number of our show notes. Or at Manifidel, know what Devon at gmail.com. All right. See you guys next week. No such thing. No such thing. No such thing. Thank you. What up, this Jay Valentine co-host of the R&B Money Podcast alongside my brother, R&B

47:09legend, tank. Together we've built a space for artists, executives and fans of R&B music to reminisce and tell the real stories behind the music. I have no money. I was hood famous. They think you're going to get everybody out. We lived in a project. And real love came out. They hear an im music and we had nothing. I'm Smokey Robinson to Mary J. Blodge, V2K to Jill Scott. If you're a super dedicated R&B fan, this is where you belong. Listen to R&B money from the Black Effect Podcast Network on the iHeartRadio app Apple Podcast or wherever you get your podcast. Hey, it's Alec Baldwin. This season on my podcast, here's the thing I talk to actor, Stephen Root. I'm a people watcher. You see that guy going down the drain though? Yeah, I can use that. And open igloo co-founder, Alia Muhammad. I love staying on top of what is going on in our city, what is on renter's minds. And taking all of that knowledge to build a platform that hopefully is going to make New York City better in the long run. Listen to here's the thing on the iHeartRadio app Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your

48:09podcasts. The World Cup is over. But if you caught the soccer bug and aren't sure what to do now, check out our podcast Big Kick Energy. I'm Cameron Dicker, the kicker from the Los Angeles Chargers. And I'm here with Timmy Tillman, current LFC star player. So we know a little something about kicking balls. Each week we'll tackle things like, who's winning the Premier League this year? What do you think is harder? Scoring a penalty kick or scoring a field goal? Join us each week for a quick chat with your soccer loving bros about the best sport in the world. Soccer. Just don't tell my coaches I said that. Listen to Big Kick Energy on the iHeartRadio app Apple Podcasts or wherever you listen to podcasts. Hey, it's Bobby Beones. Join me and former NFL quarterback Matt Castle every Wednesday on our podcast, lots to say with me, Bobby Beones and Matt Castle. You're in training camp and the rookie quarterback has one good throwing session in front of the media. Suddenly everybody online says he should start over a week one. How do you handle this? You just go back out to practice the next day and wait for him to mess up.

49:09Listen to lots to say with Bobby Beones and Matt Castle on the iHeartRadio app Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an iHeart Podcast. Guaranteed Human.