#134 - IRRISketch Software Might Be The Next Disruptor

In this episode, Andy shares a live recorded Demo of the IRRISketch design software and the potential that it may have to disrupt the industry.

Learn more here: IRRISketch

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Andy: When I see something new, I like to check it out. I like to learn about it. And I, I'm a strong believer that every irrigation system proposal should have a drawing. I just, that's what I believe. And using a lot of the design software, it's not that particularly great. Now there's some software like LandFX that is really actually fantastic, but it offers sort of a level that is a lot more, I would say, than the average irrigation or the average landscape contractor needs.

It's really, in my opinion, designed more for that architect engineer because it can provide you with some really, really It's just above and beyond what the average design build contractor needs. So I had a web meeting, sort of training overview, actually not training demonstration, let's call it a demo of the Erisketch software and I'm playing, I'm going to play that for you today.

We, we probably spoke for about an hour and a half and this episode's only. Maybe 35 minutes. So I did my best to cut it down, not to bore you since you can't see the screen. So you can't really see the demo, but I wanted you to hear the conversation and some of the things that we were talking about and what's really fascinating or what, what.

What makes me inspired and excited about this company is where we started when we started the conversation was about iris sketch irrigation design, but when we ended this conversation, it was actually more about building a stack of software that could help you. If you're the contractor, from beginning to end, and what I mean by that is, it can help you from the design of the system, to the materialist, to the pricing, to the proposal, to the ordering of supplies.

And this is something that I have been, I have been waiting for. I feel like we play in separate buckets right now, we play in the buckets of irrigation design software, we play in the [00:02:00] buckets of um, Business management software like ServiceTitan, then we play in the buckets of, of distribution. And there really isn't anything as of today that can tie things end to end.

And Errorsketch does not do that today, but I, I just have this hunch that what they're building and what you'll hear in this episode is the first attempt to try to tie a lot of this together. And it really does start with you. You're the one out there meeting with the client, residential or commercial.

You're the one out there designing the system, determining what the materials are going to be. And then you're the one that has to place the order, install the material, and then deliver that customer with the final project. And so what, what you'll hear today is Iris sketch sort of combining all of these things together in a potentially very disruptive way, which is why I played that clip in the beginning, because I think our industry needs more disruption.

If you look at the consumer goods industry, like Instacart. Instacart is filing for their IPO right now at the time of this recording, and it's disrupting the, the grocery business. There is a good chance that era, uh, not era sketch. Instacart is driving down the price of the goods and they're going to roll an advertising platform on top and offer upsells, offer brand manufacturers, a direct channel to the consumer through their software layered.

Uh, layered on top of the grocery store. And I think that that could happen right here in our industry. So a couple of pointers, a couple of quick, um, want to see this a little bit so that you do listen. And if it, if it by any means starts to bore you, just hit that 30 second skip ahead because there is a lot of good, interesting meat in here.

And this was not recorded as a podcast. So I should preface that this was recorded. I just recorded my demo. And then I asked for their permission to use some of it on today's episode. So I [00:04:00] want to have these guys back to have a real sort of more legitimate actual podcast discussion because this was just sort of a behind the scenes look at the demonstration.

So a couple, a couple things you're going to learn today. You're going to learn how Erisketch, their main goal is quick and easy. They want to provide design software that is quick, easy. Of course it has to be accurate. But what I noticed the most, it was actually a beautiful presentation and a lot of irrigation design software that's out there.

The goal of the software isn't to be beautiful. And the goal of the software is not, not necessarily to be quick or easy. It's mostly to be accurate. But I'm a strong believer that you got to sell the project. You can kind of figure out some of the details later. So I really liked the idea of having to be quick, easy, and a beautiful presentation so that you can use it to sell.

Then they have an integration with Mosher. So I went ahead just this morning, ordered myself a Mosher. On the stick, because I want to start playing with this. I want to use Mosier to do a full site, take off, load it into the era sketch software and learn how to design with it. And then you're going to learn how you can.

Potentially use it to build your bill of materials. So you can load in your own pricing libraries, your own parts lists, and you can make changes on the fly. So let's say you design it one way, the customer wants some changes. When you change it live in Erisketch, it is going to automatically update that bill of material and potentially that proposal.

In real time, you don't have to do all those, those three steps separately. You can add five heads. You can move material right on the drawing with the customer if you would like to, and it will update the rest of it for you. So I just think that there's, man, there's just so much good [00:06:00] opportunity with this, with this software.

I can't wait to try it out. I haven't used it myself. So please don't necessarily consider this to be any kind of an endorsement. I'm just excited about. The possibility. I'm excited about what these guys, how these guys think, how they are thinking longterm and what it could bring to what it could bring to the industry as far as efficiency value innovation.

And when those three things come in, there's going to be some people that their cheese gets moved. And if that's you, that's okay. You got it. Everybody's cheese is often always moving and you got to be looking in new places for new opportunities. So I guess, I guess that's all I have for this intro. Let's, uh, let's just jump right in and roll the episode with my conversation with the founders of Eerie Sketch and Eerie Cellar.

Theo: Uh, as you mentioned that I introduce, invite also my colleague, my partner, Philip, he's the, uh, inventor of Erie sketch, the design software. And I think, uh, the right conversation should only. With both 

Andy: of us sure together. Yeah. Thank 

Philiph: you. Yeah. Okay, how to proceed? I want 

Theo: I want Philip maybe to explain what's the idea?

For Iris sketch for our program. So he's the inventor. I only came up with him two years after the first launch of every sketch and Yes, 

Philiph: Philip. Let's go. Yeah, so let's start with the proper pronunciation. It's Erie sketch. I am I think that it's not properly, uh, trans, uh, transposed to English. Yes, 

Andy: it's. Oh, no, it's good.

Yeah. You're a sketch. I get it. Absolutely. 

Philiph: Okay. So it's about irrigation and sketch. It means that, uh, you make a sketch of irrigation design without any effort and, uh, you can start, [00:08:00] uh, as fast as you can with, uh, Making a proposal to the customer that started when I started doing irrigation. Actually, I'm from the ground.

Uh, I was mounting the systems and I understood that there is a big problem with the projects and making them is takes a lot of time from my life and from my personal life. And, uh, I Couldn't find any, uh, good, uh, software for this. So I, uh, searched the rain card, tested it, but it was too complicated for me.

And, uh, I thought that, uh, with my knowledge of basics of web development and, um, so on, I can, uh, make for me, for myself, the proper. tool that will be fast and easy and, you know, in the cloud. So that was my, uh, um, I wanted it very much, so it will be available through all devices and, uh, everything will be stored there.

So, uh, that's why I started with this. It was three or four years ago already. Uh, and the idea is to make it fast so, uh, I can show you, I can show my screen and what it can do. So, yeah. That would be 

Andy: great. Yeah. Everything. Wow. So what were you doing? You said you were doing irrigation before you started this.

Um, I 

Philiph: was working from 2012 at irrigation and, uh, it's like six or five or six years. I, I was in the field, um, and in the winter we had no occupation, so I tested out my skills and the development. So, yeah, no, I 

Andy: think it's really important because I shouldn't say, I don't know the number, but I would say most contractors don't deliver the homeowner a, or the client, commercial or residential, a drawing.

You know, some places they have to because it's mandatory. Other places they may add another fee or maybe it was done by a designer, but just for like the average home. You know, they might sketch [00:10:00] something on a piece of paper perhaps and leave it with the client, but there's nothing that's a true kind of record drawing.

And, um, you know, a brand new system doesn't really matter. But then as time goes on and somebody wants to make some modifications or something's not working, that's when having a drawing. Really helps 

Philiph: the maintenance and support for the project. Yeah, it's crucial to have something where our pipes laid at least.

So, uh, that was also my idea because I'm, uh, was making, yeah, 50% on my knee with the paper and, uh, I said, I tried to deliver the customer, uh, belief that I can do it, uh, in a good way. So, and, uh, I thought that. So this will be really professional if I can do it fast and with some present, uh, presentation that is good looking, uh, like an output from the ear sketch now.

So, uh, then you start, uh, the basic drawing when you create new projects. So you can, uh, measure the field or you can use the new tool, the Mosher, uh, that is used, um, Oh, 

Andy: in U. S. I know. Yeah. Yeah. I've seen that. You can actually tell me, tell me how that works. 

Philiph: Uh, that works very simple. You have your Mosher measurements, and when you start drawing a new polygon, you can import, I don't know where I have, uh, some Mosher.

Yeah. 

Andy: Okay. So you use your Mosher, and you get your exported file, and then you can import it into here? Yeah, definitely. Ah, 

Philiph: exactly. So, uh, for example, this is a measurement from the Mosher. Uh, ported to the Iriscage, uh, drawing with a one to one scale. So, uh, when you measure, uh, measure this, you can export as CSV file and there is all data and you just need to start drawing a polygon and 

Andy: say, yeah.

So now you just gave me a reason to go buy the Mosier. I'm going to buy the Mosier. I'm going to test this out and make it work because I think that combining those together. That is, what a great 

Philiph: [00:12:00] idea. Yes, that's really, uh, making, improving the speed, uh, of the delivery. Oh, maybe it's 

Theo: always, uh, possibility, possible to, to add some underlayers.

So we can add 

Philiph: photos of 

Andy: drawings. Okay, cool. I was going to ask you that. Could I screen capture something out of Google Earth, maybe? And then just put it in here and then take the Mosier and put it on there. 

Philiph: Yeah, actually, I don't know some, uh, I don't have some, uh, images here on the computer, but, uh, you can, uh, input anything that is in raster or in PDF file.

So it will be, uh, in the Erie sketch. Also you can, uh, for example, export from, uh, AutoCAD or more, uh, sustainable software, more, 

Andy: more big. And I love the trees because typically an irrigation drawing is very flat. It is, you know, an engineered file. There's no pizzazz, there's no like sexiness to it. It doesn't sell, but this is giving you the ability to, you know, add some sales appeal to the drawing.

Yes. 

Philiph: Yes. That was made especially for Iris Cage by the, uh, the artist. So he will, he's drawing, uh, actually the nature and I asked him to make some stuff like this so you can then make some, for example, the flowers. I'm not so big 

Andy: designer. Hey, it's all good. Even just dropping a couple specimen trees around the property could make it, could enhance the drawing, you know?

Yeah, 

Philiph: definitely. Yeah. So it can be curved as you want. So you can, um. Use it as a simple sketch tool for a landscape also to deliver the concept of the garden, for example, uh, it's why not when you switch to irrigation tab, everything is more, uh, a pack. Yeah. And, uh, uh, so you can now, uh, focus on your irrigation.

You set up your, uh, water source, you set up your. Uh, manifolds or [00:14:00] you don't start with the manifolds, of course, you now, uh, need to understand which nozzle you need to draw. Yeah. There is a wide range of the nozzles. If 

Andy: you could, maybe we just, um, remove those layers, you know, start with that polygon and then let's just, you know, let me just give you, could I just give you some parameters?

Like here's how many gallons a minute we have, uh, here's what our pressure is. And then we can kind of go from there. Uh, 

Philiph: no, actually, there is the, uh, the other, uh, way of thinking for us. So you'd first you need to cover this area at any, uh, you know, with your, uh, with your, uh, sprinklers. So you need to cover to deliver the precipitation.

And, uh, by knowing the precipitation, uh, by knowing the amount of flow, uh, then you make zoning, uh, uh, based on your, um, pump, you know, your pump, or for example, the wood designer, uh, knows every time what is the water source, uh, so he can calculate it in, uh, in mind how much of the water flow he. He will have for one, uh, zone, yes, for one, uh, great zone.

So when he starts to make in the, uh, drawing the nozzles, we, uh, we focus mostly on the covering area with the nozzles. It's very handy tool here that automatically fits, uh, your, uh, 

Andy: Now, the nozzle though is subject to the pressure. So how are you getting a coverage if you don't necessarily know your pressure?

Philiph: Uh, the, uh, currently when you start drawing the standard pressure is applied. So it's, uh, for example, for MP rotator, it's 45 PCI. Yeah. So, uh, and then of course, uh, when you realize that, um, we have. Flow, for example, uh, 87, uh, gallons per hour, and it's not enough for [00:16:00] us. Uh, our pump won't, uh, 

Andy: Can we switch that?

Cause in the U S we don't think in gallons per hour, it's gallons per minute, gallons 

Philiph: per minute. Okay. Just a second. Because we also don't think even in gallons, that's just my attempt 

Andy: here. Like an emitter is gallons per hour on micro, but otherwise it's yeah. Gallons per 

Philiph: minute. So, yeah, we have the, for example, 1.

5 gallons per minute. Let's 

Andy: go ahead and put the other ones in there. You know, let's fill that in. 

Philiph: Let's do it. So you select the type of nozzle, not actually the, you can select the proper nozzle that you know, but I have also auto drawing system that you can choose. Uh, in, uh, in a whole range of that class of nozzles.

So for example, MP Rotator provides you with MP3 5000, uh, so it's very easy to draw the nozzles with this tool. You can, you 

Andy: need to try it on your own. And it's, um, how is it determining the distance? And the spacing, or you? 

Philiph: First, you start with placing the nozzle, then you set the needed radius that you can see on the drawing.

And when you click, Then, uh, by the, uh, based on the angle you said, and based on availability of nozzles, you can see that, uh, the proper nozzle is chosen. Okay. So that's how it works. Okay. Okay. Now you can see the whole, uh, consumption and it's five gallon per minute. So it's a tool that is meant for designers.

For advanced designers, not for like customers who want to design their garden irrigation or something. So they should know how it will behave on which pressure it will work with this, with this consumption. And, uh, When you start to make zoning for, uh, for example, [00:18:00] if our pump can do, uh, needed pressure only for two gallons per minute, we need, we know that we need at least three zones here.

Uh, yeah, two zones. Yeah, 

Andy: let's just say we want to do two zones for this instance. For example, 

Philiph: yeah, we, we're making two zones and we see how to properly cut, uh, uh, the, into two pieces of this. So for example, we have. Almost five, uh, gallon per minute. Uh, no, I didn't select 5. 15. And when you start to take off one side, you can see it's decreasing up to three.

And if we remove also this, it will have a 2. 5. So this will be definitely one zone, this line and the center. So, and then you just, uh, can draw the pipe. And then if we know the, uh, the source of water will be here, the next pipe would of course go. Something from here. Maybe in this direction and to offload that one side, maybe it will go like this.

So, uh, when you have your, uh, piping, you set up the manifold, the better place, I think near the source or somewhere near, so now you're attached to the manifold. You can do it in many ways, but I think the schematic way is better because you don't care. You understand where you will dig also. 

Andy: Yeah. And it sounds like the idea for this is a quick sketch.

That's a great presentation. That also shows the crew, which sprinklers are going together on the same zone, where approximately the pipes are going, but it's not meant to give you. Like all the exact materials and the exact pipe and the friction loss from this point to that point and all of that. It's a, it's a quick sketch, which is actually really helpful because most of the like engineered software out there, although it can be easy to use, there's a lot [00:20:00] more involved, so it doesn't become quick and easy.

You may get potentially better engineering results. But it's not quick and easy for this purpose. 

Philiph: Definitely. Yes. It, uh, will automate something, but not everything that, uh, that we want, but we are moving into this direction. Maybe the one day we have more, uh, You know, past and more precise, uh, system, but, uh, currently it works like this 

Andy: and you should But this is actually okay.

I mean, really you could take this and generate a pretty accurate, um, not full materialist, but bid based on some other input. So somebody wanted to take this and then generate a price quote. You know, this would be enough, I think, to get that started. 

Theo: Yes, we are able, we are able to create a complete, uh, material list out of these, and we are now in a, uh, an area for private people, for private lawn, for private yards.

Philiph: Residential, yeah, 

Theo: residential area. And the friction losses during the pipe, it's not so necessary in the smaller cases of gardens. If you are going on golf courses, friction losses are definitely important, but on small private yards, it's not so not so important. 

Andy: And it just depends because it can be if somebody uses the wrong size pipe, right?

If they use three quarter inch pipe everywhere and they don't realize what the friction loss is. And because a lot of homes in the U S don't all. could have low pressure to start. So somebody has low pressure to start and they don't want to purchase a pump, then they need to carefully consider pipe size because they're trying to, you know, conserve pressure, I guess.

Philiph: I will show you this a little bit later, but what I want to show you now is the, how we calculate the pipe diameter. So, uh, here is now Get some information about the diameter the direction of the flow and velocity of the of your flow so for [00:22:00] example It calculated that we need These diameters of pipe and this will be the speed inside and this will be the flow.

Andy: Okay. So it says four inch, then we need to go to two inch, three inch, two inch, an inch and a half. Yeah. If you want. Yes. Or, or you could just stay at two inch cause a bigger pipe is fine. You don't have to go down, but sometimes, sometimes contractors don't downsize cause then they need a whole bunch of other fittings.

So they'll just use whatever the largest pipe is all the way to the end, even though it costs more money, it's just easier. 

Philiph: Now we have, uh, the basic system set up here. So let's continue with, uh, the basic, uh, controller with the wiring. You of course, making the wiring, uh, here in the Erisk Edge. So it, Yeah, 

Andy: wiring is not something that's typically included on an irrigation drawing.

Yeah. 

Philiph: Um, on a drawing, you can, uh, save everything you need because this is like design, uh, step. And when, uh, then you finish with this. For example, we've made a basic design, then we switch to layouts. Layouts will hold as many, uh, 

Andy: Oh, layout is like your, your, uh, planned, uh, page. 

Philiph: Yes, like, uh, viewports of your, uh, draw.

So you can... Uh, choose what you want to show on viewport, uh, Will that put a scale 

Andy: in there? Um, yes. 

Philiph: Okay. Yeah. The scale, of course, we can set, uh, for example, uh, one inch or it's one foot or, uh, Yeah, like one inch in 10, five. Let it be five for our scale. It will be good. Okay. And then you choose your, uh, sizes of everything of texts.

And, uh, you say, 

Andy: Gosh, I'm really thinking that, um, if you could, first of all, this is fantastic for the purpose of quick and easy presentation, you know, a drawing, it's good enough for the guys to know what they're going to [00:24:00] do and for the client to know what they're going to get. Uh, if there was a way to layer this on top of Google Earth or bring it in where you could just type in the address of the client.

Do this remotely. You don't even need to visit the site. You could have a couple conditions and you could probably sell the system without visiting the site. At, at the end 

Theo: you could, yes. Um, depends on the quality of the mapping service, of course, uh, Google, Google maps. It's in Germany. It's not so nice. So we have, it depends on 

Andy: the tree cover and stuff.

And again, this is like, you could say, Hey, here's what it could. Here's what it looks like it's going to be. Here's a couple unknowns, you know, Hey, we don't know if you have an extra flower bed. So you could ask a few questions to help clarify at least get it in the ballpark. And you could probably double the amount of quotes that a contractor could put out there if they don't have to travel to each site to wow the customer, get them to buy in.

And then you have a. kickoff meeting with the client, go over it, see how close it is, then find out if there's anything that might be missing and how that might change the scope, if at all. 

Theo: Definitely. You can work in this way. Yeah. For a first quote, you can do it in exactly this way. At the end, we also implement a service that the homeowner can prepare the planning for yourself.

So you have the, we have the ErieSketch design studio. That's a smaller version of the ErieSketch professional tool that homeowners can upload their own satellite photo or their own sketch or their own drawing. And Uh, send it to you to, uh, asking for, for, for, or for, for 

Philiph: irrigation. Yeah. You create the design, uh, link that anyone can access even without having some, uh, Eurosketch account.

And, uh, this link. We'll open the Erisk edge, uh, with another tabs. It [00:26:00] will only be the drawer where you place your loan, your irrigated zone, not irrigated zone, whereas your controller will be located sensor, location of water source. And then you. Uh, make a quick survey with a project name, with your bucket test, for example, or with your climate conditions, or you cannot.

And you can 

Andy: even say like, upload a picture of your water source. I want to see the pipe where it comes in, in your basement. You need to upload that picture, right? I want so that it's like you're being there and people with their phone can just snap a picture. 

Philiph: That's fair. Yeah. Well, but it's in development 

Andy: now.

Yeah. Well, I'm just saying I can make my own form, you know, that I could get the project information from clients. That's great. 

Philiph: Yes. That's, uh, you, you inspiring us to speed up the development of this feature. Yeah. 

Andy: So yeah. Now, uh, would this be, so it's interesting too, is because it's web based, it means there's a lot you can do with it or cloud with, is this something that, um, like, could I embed this?

I guess I could just do like, um, A window, like a frame, iframe. Could I embed this in my website? So customers coming to sprinkler supply store could design their own system and not even necessarily, well, maybe they would know it's Errorsketch, but just beyond all on my domain. 

Philiph: No, we, we are not restricting from this.

So you can embed these in, uh, iframe of course on your website. So that's not a problem. You just provide this link and it's, uh, embeddable. You don't need to do anything but just type a code that's iframe and it will open. 

Andy: So anyone could come to Sprinkler Supply Store and design their own system. Why 

Philiph: not?

That's great. And, uh, you create as many links as you want and, uh, for example, track there, uh, from the other, uh, places of your website or from other platforms, uh, that you need. So, for example, you place it on Instagram, this link, or in your, on your website within, within an iframe and, uh, you [00:28:00] can, uh, Uh, you, then you get the requests that's on up to you, up to the contractor who's using this design.

Yeah. 

Andy: So you've got rotors and sprays and different nozzles. How does this software handle drip irrigation? 

Philiph: Uh, drip irrigation is all, uh, also handed, handled, and, uh, you can choose between the 16 and 17 millimeter drip. Uh, you have, uh, every, uh, drip line we had on the market, but not maybe everything, but from main, uh, uh.

Andy: And sometimes it really, you know, it doesn't even need the brand because if somebody knows they're going to use a 0. 6 by 18 inch spacing. You know, it doesn't matter what the brand is because it's 0. 6 by 18. The math is the same regardless of the brand. 

Philiph: So, uh, we, we also have the feature with, uh, to cover some drip area dripped.

Uh, for example, you check the, your preferred, uh, drip line here, and then you draw up something, some area, some perimeter. And before you finish, you can, uh, set the step of the, of your, uh, future, future. Lines. And the angle? And then when you finish, uh, your drip line will be, uh, created and you can see the water flow.

So it's 3. 5 GPM, the length, total length of the pipes. Uh, and then you connect it to the water source with the same type, but with a special drip start, uh, drip start, uh, node. It's it can contain anything you want, like the tap, the, 

Andy: yeah, I just think, uh, for And for contractors that are. Involved in the sales process, this is a fantastic tool.

I mean, talk about a differentiator. No, no one's using it yet. Clients, they may not expect this, but they want a higher level of [00:30:00] technology to be used in the sales process. They don't want a back of the napkin sketch on a carbon copy quote form. You know, this is, this is amazing. And you could produce this in, you know, less than one hour.

Philiph: Yes, we are. We produce in this online. So, uh, also you can. Create some sprinkler, uh, coloring and To show the zones where the zones are belonging, the drip line, everything, some information about this, so length and flow, precipitation, what is on the zone, so, uh, the covered area and so on. So you, you have your, even you can calculate the timing of the controller.

Uh, because you have all the information needed, 

Andy: uh, Oh, I see like a runtime to produce one inch of 

Philiph: water. Yeah. Based on the water demand, based on the infiltration rate of the soil, you can set it up in the special windows. 

Andy: So you also have a scheduling engine then it sounds like, 

Philiph: yes, that's a calculated.

Yeah. By, uh, so it gives out your time per run and daily consumption for the, for all your cycles 

Andy: and runs. Wow. Yeah. Yeah. This is really what, um, This is really what our industry needs because we're still doing it more or less the way it's been done for the last 20 or 30 years, basically. 

Philiph: Same, same in Europe and 

Theo: the same in Europe.

So most of the, uh, contractors don't plan by itself. They leave planning for big companies, which also provide parts and 

Andy: they go to their distributor. And then they say, I need this. And then, and then not only does the contractor have to make multiple visits to the site, right? One visit to make the measurements, the second visit to produce, you know, to sell the proposal, if you will, then they have to go to their distributor and the distributor draws it with no guaranteeing that the contractor is even going to get the sale.

So all this work is being done for no. no purpose. Um, and I've always been under the belief that a contractor should do their [00:32:00] own work, not use a supplier for anything other than purchasing parts because it's their drawing. They should be responsible for it. And this really does put the power into the hands of the contractor 

Theo: and quality of drawing.

It's much better if contractor is on the same location. Because when you, uh, discussing with your disproducer is also over email, over phone. So he's sitting maybe a hundred kilometers or a hundred miles away from you and he never sees the garden at itself. And it's always a better design if somebody was really there.

Philiph: I don't 

Andy: know. This is so great. My mind is, my mind has so many other things here because I'm looking at you take this list down. So let's say we're done. Boom. Now my question would be, how could I feed my pricing in here to generate a quote? Because I could give you a feed, you know, with all the exact pricing or, or different libraries.

And then the user could say, no, no, no, show me, is there another option that would automatically change these parts to, to be 10% less? 

Philiph: That's what we deliver. Of course, the, we were thinking on this and we are, uh, created the, another piece of software that is named Iris Seller. And, uh. IrisCache is drawing, and IrisSeller is for selling.

So, uh, when you have your setup in IrisCache, you can, uh, easily, uh, create it into your outlay with only your, uh, real life, uh, goods and, uh, stock. So that's, uh, I will show you how it work. I, I see that you are interested in this, so that's why I will, uh, take time. Yeah, 

Andy: no, and I'm, uh, and it's interesting because I think people are afraid This so they're not, no one's doing it, but this is what needs to be done.

And it basically becomes a marketplace, right? Where a, if a contractor uses your tool, number one, they can get a price for a Rainbird or Hunter or whatever dynamically they want right at [00:34:00] that moment. And then they could say. So, show me the price from site one, show me the price from Ewing, show me the price from Horizon, show me the price from sprinklersupplystore.

com. Let me get a real live marketplace, you know, pricing on this material. Yeah. 

Philiph: To compare and choose the best options. 

Andy: Yeah. And again, if it's just showing up in your doorstep and it's delivered, the supplier becomes less relevant because you're doing the work. You're doing the value, you know, and they're just buying it and it ships in a box.

Philiph: Of course. You are free to 

Theo: choose what you want, where you 

Andy: get it from. Yeah, and then the, and then the client, you know, if they say, Hey, is there any way, you know, we could, or how could we take like 10% off this price? You know, I had a budget of 4, 500, but this came in at 5, 000. Then the contractor can say, you know what, let me go through and see if there's any parts we could swap out that wouldn't affect the integrity of the system.

And then rerun the quote, like in real time, not have to go back to the supplier, make five phone calls, right? 

Philiph: Welcome to E Risk Etch. Yeah, that's cool that we are trying to do the same that you're saying. And, uh, yeah, I'm really proud now of it. 

Andy: Because yeah, because somebody's got to poke the bear. There's too many big bears in this industry controlling the entire supply chain.

From a couple of big distributors and a couple of big manufacturers. And it's time that somebody, you know, shook up the snow globe 

Philiph: should come into the deal. Yeah. So, uh, for a manifold, uh, you can set up the valves there. 

Andy: Yeah, and I mean really, sorry to interrupt you, really if you had, um, one way of, um, providing labor is to do a like per sprinkler, let's say it's 15 minutes per sprinkler and it, you know, how long is it per foot of one inch pipe, inch and a half, two inch pipe.

If you could get your labor factors, which is, which are known. You can get your labor factors per [00:36:00] piece. Then you just put it on that quote and you can calculate out the installed price that like, and I have some of this data, you know, and then you got the installed price. 

Theo: We have, 

Philiph: we have. Well, why do, uh, why he knows how Eriskitch works?

Yeah. Did you 

Andy: tell him? Interesting. No, I've just been, it's what, what happens when you. I mean, basically 20 years ago, my buddy and I had an Excel sheet that did all this and every part had a price. And at the end you get your costs and then you can figure out what kind of margin you want to cover your overhead, but it's just.

Database info. Super. 

Philiph: That's what we really created. And this irrigation equipment configuration is just the beginning. Uh, here you set the, uh, most, uh, crucial parts of your system. It's like nozzles, uh, the drip pipe connections and valve manifolds, automation. Uh, you also have here the main pipe, a lateral pipe with, uh, they are fittings, uh, elbows, tees, crosses, whatever you need, uh, that, uh, end caps, if they are, they are here.

Also the wiring, wiring calculation is, uh, another thing that, uh, you need to understand how you calculate, uh, your wiring because someone used cables, uh, multi cord cables. Someone used wires. And, 

Andy: uh, the reason we used to do, but it was like half the number of zones times the length of the main line or something like that.

It was 

Philiph: just like, uh, yeah, multiplicative outlay, but here you, whether you can calculate it, uh, on your own or you can, uh, give every sketch opportunity to do this. So, uh, if you get used to it, you will be, uh, more, uh, more free to make any kind of assumptions. So. Yeah. Thank you. Uh, this step is finished. So here you have two options, whether you want to give a list to someone to calculate you the stock, uh, and [00:38:00] to give the, um, proposal for the materials list and, uh, to pay for, or you can go a way that we call iris seller.

And when you have your stock or when you have, um, Your distributor that you are bound to and he has his stock in the Erie sketch system You can easily turn this everything out in the in your outlay. That is very configured with your own elements and Okay, let's switch to it and I will 

Andy: show you how yeah.

Yeah. I mean again, I think if even just If it didn't, you don't even have to put the price of the labor, just having labor hours in here would be helpful so that a contractor that's using it could look and say, okay, I see here that's 30 labor hours, you know, so if I bring a four man crew, I can do that in one day.

Right? Or, or they can just break it down by, by labor hours and then if they know what they pay their laborers and they know what kind of margin they need on the labor, they can calculate their own, you know, labor price, but the labor time would be really valuable. 

Philiph: I think, um, that labor, uh, times can be calculated based on amount of work, yes.

Amount of sprinklers. Yeah. 

Andy: And then you could have to say, okay, are we pulling this pipe? Are we trenching? Is this sand? Is this clay? There are things that affect. that, but, but it's nothing that you can't, you know, uh, build around. So, 

Philiph: uh, here we, uh, uh, went this way. We provide this, um, feature is adding the price list and you can create your personal price list, or you can share your prices, price list, and, uh, become a like kind of distributor in terms of Erisk Edge, for example, we have on the.

Hold on, 

Andy: let me stop you. So I could take a price list, put it on Eurosketch and make it public? Yes. Oh, 

Philiph: badass. That's what I'm talking about. Okay. So you can create your own price and share it. Yes. And ideally, 

Andy: I could tie [00:40:00] you in on API and it could generate the order on my website. Why not? And then you can make a commission, you know, like Instacart 10% commission.

Philiph: Things are increasing. Yeah. This speed. And yeah, we will think on this, everything step by step. I would just want you to show that, um, what we've developed by the moment and, um, how it, how it give you the ability to, um, output your data and how it's connected with the 

Andy: project. That's why I'm just happy that you're thinking bigger.

You know, you, you've, obviously as an entrepreneur, sometimes you just keep thinking, right? You're like, Oh, and if we did this, then we could do that. And if we did that, then we could do this other thing. And it just keeps going. And that's important because the schedule by itself that has some value, but if you can tie it all the way through the supply chain and the market and the end user and get them all together, now you've really.

Got something. 

Philiph: So, yes, I agree with you totally. So that's, that's our idea. And so, uh, it's, uh, I showed you how fast and how easy the changes are made to the outlay. So you just change something in the project and when you set up everything, you have a freedom to make fast recalculation of this stuff. And when you have everything, everything prepared for this, like pricelist from your beloved distributor, who are you working with and your calculations of labors, you are very fast with this outlay.

So it takes how money, how much time till it takes for you to make this kind of cycle. The standard small one 

Theo: 30 minutes. Yeah. 

Andy: Once it's all, once you do the work and you enter it all in it, it's all gonna be done at the time you do the drawing ? Yes. Yeah, 

Philiph: that's fair. But you will take time to attach proper prices, uh, select them from your list, and that's all.

I think it's like five minutes for the outlay. Yeah. [00:42:00] So, yeah. That's what we showed in short story. 

Andy: Very cool. Well, uh, this is great. I think I want to, I want to experiment with it, run, you know, do some, do some real live drawing with it and then, uh, see how to embed it on, on the website. So if we have any customers at sprinkler supply store that want to design their own system, then we can direct them there.

Maybe I could like, um, make a little video that shows them how to use it and, um, see how we can use it to support our customers. Yeah. I 

Philiph: think the first thing is what we need to make all internals work, internal work, preparing the price list from your stock, uh, creating them in Erisk Edge. Uh, and then when you have a request, we have to be very fast by, uh, processing it with your price list and your labor's work, but, uh, we, of course we don't show to the customer, everything that is internal and we can show just, uh, Amount of, uh, the price for the, uh, equipment and one price for the labors, for example, how much it will be cost.

But you know that this price is very precise because you took time to calculate, to prepare all these prices and you can rely on it. That's the case when you risk it. Yeah. 

Andy: Yeah. Fantastic. Cool. All right. Well, I will, uh, you know, right now we just got some other things happening, but I want, I'm very excited by this.

And like I said, I, I mostly excited because you guys thought you thought further than just the design and, and I don't know why, uh, other existing companies aren't, aren't Doing this because it's something that, um, I, I, in a weird way predicted like many years ago that why doesn't the irrigation design software, they know all the parts and pieces, they're just missing the pricing and then they're just missing the labor and they could take more of a bite out of the service that they're the value that they're adding and [00:44:00] therefore charge additional fees.

Okay. Do you want to include pricing that has another plan? Do you want to include labor that has another plan? ? 

Philiph: Yes. That's what we are working, uh, with because, uh, we are in one person, the developer, and uh, the user. Uh, that's, 

Andy: uh, the main thing. That's amazing. You guys have built all this. It's a lot. I, I know how much work this is and it you, this is a lot of work.

Philiph: Yes. And we are making this, uh, very live and. We are continuing with this work, improving the Erie sketch almost every day. We are adding some equipment and we have also the future plans for the second version and so many, uh, so many things. And I'm 

Andy: going to buy the Mosier. Um, and I also have, uh, I can't remember the name of it.

It's the, it's the wheel that you can put your iPhone on and you can, so it's got a GPS file. Oh, that was my question. What file are you looking for to import? What type of a file? 

Philiph: Uh, for Mosher, it's CSV file. It's a standard export of the Mosher, uh, layered export. It's, uh, previously it named CSV plus plus.

So it's 

Andy: not a GPX or a GPS file. 

Philiph: No, uh, actually it's just a set of coordinates, it's like X, Y, Z coordinates, columns, and the points of that, uh, as a rows, you just, uh, input, uh, uh, you can see that, uh, you can generate. From any type of software, uh, 

Andy: yeah, I'm going to, um, get a Mosier and to do a real life demo, like, uh, measure out a house, put it in here and, and use the software.

I think that'd be fantastic. Um, it also would be some good content. If I can figure out how to turn that into a YouTube video, you know, how to design, you know, an irrigation system in less than 30 minutes. 

Philiph: Yes, that's the point. We also have this, uh, like promo or maybe you saw this on the website. [00:46:00] It's, uh, do you see this?

Do you hear the sound or not? No, it's okay though. Oh, then I will share you in the chat and you can see it when you have time. So it's like a small explanation of what we have here. I don't know. I don't see the chat actually. 

Andy: That's okay. I can look, I can look at it on your website. 

Philiph: Yeah. Okay. Okay. It's on the main page.

So, uh, that's what, what I was talking about is, uh, I don't remember what I was talking about. I don't know, 

Theo: but I have some other question, maybe directly to Andy for us. It's interesting. I think so. As you know, as you recognize the set, uh, Philip come from Russia. At the moment, he's located in Germany. He's, uh, come, uh, one year ago to Germany.

Now we are both at the same place in Germany and, uh, we develop Irisketch and, uh, wanted to start, of course, uh, to spread Irisketch over the whole world. So we are now at the moment strong in Russia, of course, and we are strong in Germany. With distribution of our software. And of course, US market is the main goal of us to reach, um, all, uh, contractors from your market.

But what we are missing is a partner at the US market at the moment. And especially somebody which really knows how the market works in the US. 

Philiph: So, um, 

Theo: we think we know, but it's better if you can explain what to say. U. S. irrigation market on who is contractor, what did contractor actually do? You just told us that mostly nobody tried to design their own.

Uh, when we look on websites of contractors, we only see something like renovation and retrofit systems, but 

Philiph: nobody offers 

Andy: new systems. Oh, [00:48:00] no, no, no, no. New is, um. Yeah. So let's see. Uh, I'd be happy to tell you everything I know about the U S market. Um, we would need, we need a little bit more time, but, um, there are generally two types of contractors install and service some do.

And then each of those do a little crossover. So some contractors do only new install. and a little bit of service, and that's commercial. And some contractors do a lot of residential service and some install. And it's different on the West, the Western United States versus, let me take you off spotlight here, versus the Eastern United States.

So the Western United States, most irrigation systems are drawn by a professional engineer. Or a 

Theo: garden architect. 

Andy: Uh huh. Uh, commercial, anyway. Commercial. Okay, yeah. And, uh, on the eastern United States, it's mostly contractor design build. And so contractors go to the distributor, the distributor draws it, uh, and maybe 20% of the time it's an engineer.

So there's a difference between the East Coast and the West Coast. And then you have your distributors where there's like four or five really, really big distributors. And then there's a handful of smaller, you know, family owned businesses and the family owned businesses are now selling to larger businesses and the market is consolidating.

Um, because it's maturing and, uh, from the contractor's perspective, there really aren't any national franchises. There's one growing called Conserva and they're probably, they're really like the only franchise. And this could be a good tool for a franchise, you know, because it would differentiate the franchise.

So that is the thought that I have is, hey, that's a great opportunity because you sell it to a [00:50:00] franchise and then the franchise owner requires all of the franchisees to use the software and then they have access to it. Then they see all the like it's all It's all tied in. Um, and after that you 

Philiph: have a small franchise.

Yeah. Yeah. 

Andy: You have small contractors all over the United States. Um, and that's part of the, the problem and the opportunity with irrigation. You don't need any education. You don't need any formal licenses other than whatever is required in your town or your state. Yet at the same time, that just means any old guy can throw some stuff in his truck and now he's an irrigation contractor and he comes in at a lower price.

And a lot of the times, these contractors don't know how to compete against somebody who has a low price because they're not any, any, any value themselves. And so I try to really educate contractors to don't worry about price. Make sure you're the most professional. You show up on time. You, Like do everything right.

And then you should be able to have a higher price system, right? It's obvious if it's one guy in a truck, his price should be less. So you don't have to compete against that. Um, and then you've got some landscapers that do irrigation. Right. So you have some landscape companies that also do irrigation and some landscape companies have landscape architects that could use this software and include it in their drawing.

And in the U. S. we only have one company called Land FX. Land FX. Yes. They own the market now outside of people just using AutoCAD and 

Philiph: some templates and what about Pro Contractor, uh, isn't used it in the terms of irrigation, uh, Pro Contractor Or you mean Land FX is a, uh, uh, uh, 

Andy: complete. That's the largest irrigation software provider of, of, uh, irrigation drawing Land FX.

Philiph: Land FX and Kamatsu Studio Pro Contractor is, uh, 

Andy: [00:52:00] And their software is used by the largest engineers in the world. Great company. Very nice guys. I know Jeremiah, the owner pretty well. Um, but it's not something that you can just, uh, design in 30 minutes. It's not quick and easy. 

Philiph: It's complicated and very precise.

Andy: And it, yeah, it's very precise. And it sounds expensive. And it is expensive. Yep. Yes. But if you are working with engineers and architects and drawing big CAD drawings, that is the software to use. Yeah, so it's just land fx. com. Yeah, 

Philiph: I've been there. I also Investigated about all the software 

Andy: and they don't do anything that you're doing.

There's no seller They really just stick in their wheelhouse because I think business is pretty good for them And they don't have the need necessarily to upset the applecart like to chase something new but in my opinion what you're building is really the direction that they They should be going. Um, you know, and then you have, you have some contenders like, uh, that are coming in from the business software, the business management software side of things like service Titan and aspire where contractors are using their software to run their business schedule, service calls, um, prepare quotes, you know, do invoicing and this stuff doesn't.

Like land effects doesn't integrate but it could like yours is built for that because it's all it's all tied together So there's no reason that once the customer signs that Agreement that that design should flow right in to the business management software. They have all the parts and pieces and material Um, 

Philiph: yeah.

Really that's what we are thinking about is integration of the, uh, of the whole process of, uh, irrigation contractor, uh, starting from the [00:54:00] design and, uh, up to the main tenants. And, uh, also we are thinking on the how, uh, we can, uh, the, for the whole lifetime of the project, Uh, be helpful, be handy for the contractor because sometime you need to go to the site and check what's happening and you should know where it's all located.

So it's like the working documentation on the project and the risk edge. 

Andy: Yeah, yeah. And then my business, um, sprinkler supply store is, um, also I have a, uh, partnership with site one landscape supply. So they're an investor in Sprinkler Supply Store and I, let me see how to describe this. I think of Sprinkler Supply Store as a digital layer on top of wholesale distribution, really on top of site one.

So they're sending me, um. Data every 15 minutes from 10 of their stores all over the United States. So when somebody places an order, if they're in Texas, I will have that fulfilled from the location in Texas. If they're in Florida, I'll have that filled from Florida. And then what we can do is also split orders in group order.

So if not one single location has all the parts, we'll split it up to get it to the customer fast. But I could, I could drop ship out of like 50 of their locations. And so there's this real opportunity for like, for me to vend you the product data. And if somebody wants it, we can get it to them quickly because we built the stack, you know, the integration stack where site one directly.

They're not set up for this yet. And 

Philiph: interested, uh, how do you, uh, proceed the prices because you are providing the prices for a special, your customers and, uh, who should know these prices? Because if you put some price in the E Risk Edge, it becomes, uh, public. The 

Andy: whole world. I'm, I'm kind of a believer in pricing transparency, right?

We're kind of moving past the [00:56:00] days of this guy's price and this guy's price and this guy's price. I mean, maybe you could say like, Hey, here's a 10% discount or something, but I think that it really just needs to be. And right now the prices are somebody out there on the Internet is already selling that part for less.

Of course. Somebody wants to take the time and search. They'll find it for less. 

Philiph: Don't fancy it. But the question is how he delivers it, which services he provide and so on. 

Andy: Yeah, and the bigger distributors, they still believe in pricing tiers. They don't want. That pricing transparency, because what it really means is everything has to drop a bit.

Um, but that also means their overhead might have to drop a bit, but that's where the efficiency of what you're providing comes into play. Because if that contractor no longer knocks on their door for a design every week, then they don't need to provide that. So they should lower their price because they're not doing as much work.

Philiph: Yeah, 

Andy: so that's kind of why I think some of this could be done, not grassroots, but going to the biggest players, they're not going to be interested because it's too, it's a bit too disruptive for them yet. They don't even know how to like sell their own parts on the internet. Yeah. That's why we But because I ship through SiteOne, SiteOne just wants business, right?

They, they know that orders land in their system automatically. There's no effort on them. So I get, I have really, really good pricing. So we have a doorway basically into, you know, I would love to figure out how I could sell 50 million of parts and, you know, just flows through the system, right? It's like, that's why you could take a transaction fee.

Added on there service value added transaction fee or commission from me and I could do the same It's like we can be really competitive if if the system works and the user comes in and then it just flows through with little Input [00:58:00] then everything can be, you know streamlined 

Philiph: Mm hmm without any intentions 

Andy: Super 

Philiph: anyway.

Yeah, I just will Impressed how progressive your vision and uh, yeah, I think we met the wrong, the right guy we need. 

Andy: Well, there's, you know, I'm only doing this cause no one else is cause there's not very many other people like you, there's really only, uh, you know, a handful of people I come across once in a while that, um, have any type of a vision other than like what's Just right in front of them.

That's cool. 

Philiph: Yeah. But we are at the start, we 

Theo: all was with the same problem that we need a proper way to make design for irrigation. So, uh, we also do many time, many years irrigation. And, uh, from the start, I thought that we have to do design by ourself, not by this polluters. And, uh, in this case, I met Philip three years ago and start with.

together with him to develop a resketch. And here we are. So our main goal is to bring irrigation design to contractors, not to the big players. Uh, we also had some discussions with the big players in Europe, also with big manufacturers like Hunter and Rainbird. And all what they're asking for was, okay, make a ErieSketch version of our products.

So they want an ErieSketch version only with Hunter products. They want 

Andy: exclusive, only put Rainbird on your stuff. I know. Exactly. That's part of the problem is that those guys want to control everything end to end. And they're not wrong, they used to be able to do that, but that's not what the future looks like.

The future might not even look like making any money on their parts. It's like, it's a, the value is, is always, you know, moving and if guys want to use Rainbird, they should pick [01:00:00] Rainbird because not because they have to, not because it's the only one in this software. But 

Philiph: because it's working the best way and the proper way.

Yes. Yeah. Yeah. The best way. 

Theo: And we don't agree with them and we kick them out. Uh, we had many offers or we had offers of these big players and we, no, we don't want this. We want to bring irrigation design. To people to constructors, 

Andy: especially if you're building a marketplace, which I think at the end of the day, you're kind of building, you know, that marketplace and the marketplace needs lots of suppliers, you know, and you need, of course, it's 

Philiph: not every time that's that's centralized sources.

Yeah, yeah, 

Andy: yeah, um, on the supply. Yeah. And we're working on some, uh, since you guys are in Europe, there's, there's, you guys might know about the Laura technology, 

Philiph: Laura. We have a solar solution from France. It uses Laura, uh, communication from in the field. 

Andy: Yeah. So we're building, I've got a couple other partners on a startup that, um, basically building a Laura, uh, analytics, uh, platform so that contractors can add wireless sensors out into the landscape or the building and then control the irrigation system, you know, with, with that.

And we've got some wireless valve equipment, but I think 

Philiph: that. Valves. Do you have output relays for, to connect this 

Andy: valves? Yeah. So wireless adapters, it can go right in the valve and you can go a mile or more. So I, we kind of see the future is actually, the future of irrigation is here. It's just not built and distributed yet, but there's no need for wires and there's no need for a controller.

Yeah. 

Philiph: Future will be no, 

Theo: no need for water.

Philiph: Yeah. The water. Yeah. 

Andy: Can you tell me about your pricing fees? How do you guys charge for the system? Uh, 

Philiph: for the [01:02:00] EuroSketch, it's a subscription type. Uh, we charge for the period of subscription. Uh, in Europe, it's 450, uh, in net, uh, Euros. So, and 

Andy: that Euro is kind of one to one now for the U. S., almost, right?

Almost. 

Philiph: Yeah, it's almost the same, yeah. Four, 450 for the year? For 50s for the year and a bit more if you purchase by the monthly subscription. 

Andy: Okay, and is that per company per user? How does 

Philiph: that work? Uh, it now working for a user, so if this is a company and it has Uh, two or more, three seats, they can use it, uh, in, uh, but they will have the same workshop where, uh, the place where the projects are stored.

So if they, uh, open one project simultaneously make changes, there will be an, uh, conflict in the saving. So, uh, I'm not, uh, restricting by the number of seats. Currently, but, uh, in future versions, I plan to do the licensing per seat, but now it's not needed because we need to grow now and to catch the market, uh, with our, 

Andy: Yeah.

You need people coming in. Right. And it's like, you know, I could even see there being like, um, yeah, it's 4. 50 a year, but maybe your first five sketches are free. So it's like you have a trial, but it never ends. You just can make five. Like if it takes you a month, or a year, or whatever the number is, two, one, ten, you know.

Philiph: Our system is, works like this. We have a trial period of two weeks. It's almost full featured trial period. So you can every time renew your account or, uh, remove and create new one. So the guys are, uh, someone using this feature because they are creating and for 12, uh, two weeks, they have almost full functionality.

But, uh, then they see that it was very handy tool and they are just buying it most of the time. So, uh, we have a very good conversion out of our old [01:04:00] registration. It's like, uh, 10 to 15% of. Purchases. So, uh, it's, it's normal conversion rate. So we have in Russia, we have now it's like 6, 000 accounts of contractors.

So it's very big amount in Europe. It's, we are starting now to grow. It's almost thousand. We caught, I think I need to see the statistics. Yeah. I'm just 

Andy: thinking too. It's like if, um, It's one thing if a contractor uses it and likes it. It's another thing if it helps them sell a project. So it's like, all right, how can we.

And I'm thinking of what would it be like if I was trying to sell this? You're like, here it is. Go use this. And once you sell your first system, you'll be like, Oh shit, I got to pay for that. And add 10% to your price when you use this software and see what happens. So 

Philiph: our, our, 

Theo: um, way to market ErieSketch is that we are searching for represent each country in the world, or maybe each language area in the world.

So at the moment in Europe, we have the, the German speaking. Uh, area, what I cover, we have some guys from Croatia, we have some guys for the Netherland, we have some guys from Lithuania and these guys helping us to develop EruSketch in case of languages, especially. So do translation, do, uh, tutorial videos and do the support after.

Um, and for this work, they get a discount on the annual subscription for customers. So they sell it one time to the customer, so to the contractor, and they get discount on the, uh, subscription price and they get it each year, year by year by year. 

Philiph: Yeah. So that's how we market. You're risking our, uh, 

Andy: country.

Yeah. How difficult is it to control the features that people have? Buy like, you know what they've paid for like is there is there [01:06:00] some super light version you could give to somebody that's great And it's just always free to just keep people coming in um 

Philiph: We have the free version fully free version and it's perpetual.

So you have you will have every time you're um, features like drawing, like drawing landscape, like drawing irrigation on top of it and even layouts. You will have one list of layout, but you don't have access to the outlay to the iris seller. That's the case of the easy version of free version, but every time you can.

It's for a short period of time, switch on the paid version for a month, make everything needed with your project that you created on a free version. And then, uh, stop with the subscription. For example, when the season comes to the, some countries, they have a season for like three or four months. Yeah.

That's what 

Andy: it's like here too. And that's why I like the annual plan because the first question someone's going to say is, do I still have to pay in the winter? But when it's yearly, it's like, this is what it is. 

Philiph: It's yearly. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. It's cheaper than if you purchase it by month or by, uh, so contractor will think, okay, well, maybe I will have some projects in the winter to work on and to create some designs or requests or, 

Andy: uh, you know, do some marketing, you know, and kick out some designs and some proposals all winter 

Philiph: long.

Maybe you can provide to your customer and customer and say in the winter, your project will be cheaper and less. 

Andy: And there's nothing wrong with it. I'm good. I'm thinking out loud with, um, The contractor doesn't have to give this away for free, right? To me, the drawing's worth a minimum 100. So either they charge, either using it to maintain the highest price in the market or, you know, they're being competitive, but then right away they say, would you like a drawing like this upon completion?

And they're, Oh, I absolutely want that. Okay, cool. It's just a hundred bucks for that drawing that they make their money, you know, easily. [01:08:00] 

Philiph: Yes. And it depends on what kind of information they share with in this project, because they can, uh, for example, uh, hide every pipe and just show the sprinklers or hide, uh, I don't know, uh, the, how the wiring manifolds and say, this is the free.

project, just see, uh, and decide if you want more, uh, detailed project, pay for it. And that's how it works in Russia because, uh, we have a bunch of contractors that provide free, uh, designs and that's, uh, the very big sheet in this case, because they are first, they dumped the price to the almost the lowest price for the project.

And now they are providing them for free. And, um, that's the big case when the big players now. Also have to lower the prices for the design. So it's like a chain reaction. I don't know how it's, how it's named. So now we are thinking in Russia about association and they are created some, uh, two associations of irrigators that are now.

We'll take it into control or something. I don't know. I heard that in the U. S. there's an irrigation association that is licensing everyone. 

Andy: Well, they don't have any licensing, right? I mean, they have certifications, but it doesn't mean anything to anyone. Uh 

Philiph: huh. So it's not really a licensing, so you 

Andy: can work without it.

doesn't, they might care, they might not. It's just a way, it's important, don't get me wrong, and it's the education and the training, but It's not required by any state. Uh, I shouldn't say that there might be a couple jurisdictions where they use that, but, but not, not really. And that's part of the problem is it's more like just saying, well, I'm smarter than you because I'm certified in this and you're not.

And that guy's like, well, my business is twice as big as yours and I don't have that certification. So 

Philiph: yeah, I thought it's more strict there [01:10:00] than, than we 

Andy: have, but no, it's more strict on a backflow. Some places where the plumbing union is, uh, strong, you know, the irrigation contractors can't put in backflows.

Or the contractor has to have a certified plumber at their company. So we fall under the plumbing code. But not, they're not our own 

Philiph: code, but that's good for community. Yes. Not to make the pipes, uh, contaminated the main pipe. And 

Andy: actually the state of Texas has their own licensing. So in Texas you do have to be a licensed irrigator, but 

Philiph: that's if you work without it, you will have problem.

Yep. Okay. Nice. It's really nice to speak with you to know everything about this. 

Theo: Very nice. Okay. Andy, do you visit the irrigation show in San Antonio? I 

Andy: will be. Yeah. In December? Mm hmm. Are you guys going to come? 

Philiph: We are heading to them. Uh, only problem for me is to get a visa because I'm, uh, of Russian nationality.

And, uh, I, 

Andy: I've attempt, what do you need? Do you wanna put down that you're coming to visit my business and I'll write you a letter? , 

Philiph: maybe this will be great. I al 

Andy: I already, I know places like China, sometimes you need a letter from the business, right? And 

Philiph: so, yeah, that's how I get into Germany. Tale made this.

It's a kind of invitation for me and, uh, uh, he also hired me as a, uh, employer, irrigation designer. So that's the only way 

Andy: I can go. So let me know. Happy to help you out. If you need something like that. Oh, thank you. So, and I'm, I'm, I might be, um, trying to organize like, uh, you know, a little meet up kind of event, like at a bar or something like that.

So, um, which would not be for like Rainboer, Toro, and Hunter, I really believe in trying to help the incumbent companies that are trying to do something of real value, you know, like yourself. But a lot of times contractors [01:12:00] don't know about what you're building. Because the industry only talks about the same thing over and over again, and they're very protective of the market.

Yeah. 

Philiph: They don't, uh, new things to come fast. Yeah, they don't make it. Yeah. It needs time to everyone understand how it's, how it's perfect. Yeah. To work with the cycle. 

Andy: Okay. Cool. All right. Well, let's keep in touch. We'd love to meet you both. And, um, 

Philiph: Yeah, every time you feel free to contact us and, uh, we can, uh, discuss, uh, more detailed, uh, on how it works and how to improve all this.

Andy: Hey guys, Andy here for, for an ask. I should ask in the beginning instead of the end. And I love to sell, but it's hard to sell yourself. So I don't always sell myself, but here I go. Please, if you like The Sprinkler Nerd Show, like, subscribe, and share with a friend. I actually probably prefer if you share with a friend.

So that way, more people can join the Sprinkler Nerd movement. And, let's just say, disrupt the industry. Sprinkler Nerds, we're here. Revenge of the nerds. Revenge of the nerds!