What It Actually Takes to Reinvent Yourself with Kevin Clavier | Episode 71

You're listening to the endless pursuit podcast hosted by Mackenzie Smith and Laurence Brown,

where we bring you practical and sustainable advice to help you elevate your health, fitness,

and lifestyle from our combined 40 years of experience and hundreds of clients served.

If you're ready to take your life to the next level, you're in the right place.

Let's dive into today's episode.

All right, I'm pumped for this. We've been talking about this for a while,

and today we are bringing on someone who's played such a massive role in my life,

or the last few years. It's one of my best friends, Kevin McCovier. Kevin is someone I've

grown alongside in so many areas, and faith, business, discipline, health, and mindset,

and a lot of the conversations we've had off-camera are the kind of conversations that

really change you and shape you, and I feel like they're really great podcasts episodes in general.

And he's someone who doesn't just talk about growth. He lives it. He thinks deeply. He pushes the

people around him, and he's had a massive transformation of his own over the last few years,

and a lot of that I've been able to witness firsthand. So today we're going to talk through his

journey, what shaped him, what he believes about growth, faith, identity, and recreating yourself.

So Kevin, welcome to the show. Hey, that was impressive. I love that.

Yeah, I'm excited to be here. McKenzie's like one of the best personal height machines, right?

Exactly. That's why I keep around on my circle.

All right. This isn't about me though. I talked a little bit about your transformation,

and I think it'd be fun to think about it. We always talk a lot about the version of you

a couple years ago, so vastly different. I know you'll do a little bit about to the version of you,

even before I met you, but what would that version of you at 18-year-old be most surprised by today?

Yeah, that's a crazy question. And thinking about the transformation,

I think about it all the time. 18-year-old me can't recognize this person. 18-year-old me

depended on alcohol heavily. Didn't know what personal development was, to be honest,

which is pretty crazy, because my whole life is revolved around personal development now,

helping other people break out of their lack of awareness. And I would say the greatest thing

for me has just becoming conscious, becoming aware, understanding who I am. And understand,

there is this world that you don't have to just follow the patterns of your past life, right?

You can create your new future. You can do whatever you want. And that is something I wasn't aware of.

So being able to build a self-esteem, the confidence to grow, the start of business,

and find out what those limiting beliefs were and take them out of my life to where I am now,

it's just, I can't really describe what that feeling is from 18 to where I am at now.

Kevin, would you say that your confidence has grown since your 18-year-old self, or tell me about

the mental psyche at that age compared to now? Yeah, so I think there's a big difference between

confidence and self-esteem. I always was confident. I was confident that I could do something,

I think confidence is confidence, right? I was confident that I was good at baseball. I was confident

that I could show up and do things for people, right? But I didn't have the self-esteem, right?

And I built that over the years, and that's really what's transformed me. And I think a lot of

people that I've worked with in the past, too, they say they're confident, but they have no self-esteem.

And a lot of times we confuse the two. And when you don't have self-esteem, you don't have the

self-worth. You don't believe that you're worthy of something. It destroys, it's noisy, right?

Because you're trying to do this thing and you don't realize, okay, why am I sabotaging?

Why do I keep going into these same loops and sabotaging myself over and over again?

It's not because you're not confident a lot of the times. It's because you have no self-esteem,

you don't believe you're worthy. So if I got into a relationship, I would destroy it because I

didn't think I was worthy of it, right? Or I would start something, I would destroy it because I

didn't think I was worthy. And it's that story that you've been telling in your head over and

over again that really affects everything that you do. And that's where your self-esteem comes

from, right? So it's like breaking that pattern. So to answer your question, like confidence is

something that has grown, but it's really grown off the back of understanding what self-esteem is

and then building that. So how do you get to that level? Because I think a lot of people, I mean,

I relate to that very well. I was kind of the same type of way. I feel like I was very confident

myself in a lot of things, but my self-esteem sucked. And it's taken me a long time to grow that

self-esteem. And so how would you tell someone who's kind of in that same boat, whether they're

the 18 or 45 or how old are they? Hey, you know what? I get the confidence thing, but my self-esteem

is just not where I want it to be. How do I grow that? Well, self-esteem comes from the story

that you're telling yourself, the identity that you believe, right? So it's looking back at your

patterns. I always knew I wanted to be a business owner. I literally went to business school,

but I talked to myself out of that switch to a different major because I didn't think I was

worthy. I did a meditation, a childhood meditation, went back to my 10 year old self,

and I realized it was because I got made fun of for reading in school at the time.

So we did the popcorn reading out loud, and I got made fun of. They pulled me out of the class

and put me in another class. So I always just thought I wasn't smart. That was a lie. That was

the story that I adopted and the story that I lived with. So when I wanted to start a business,

it always was, you're not smart enough, right? Because I never was in school. But the school system

doesn't translate to real world. The school system doesn't necessarily mean you're smart or you're

not. It's just a grade on a piece of paper. So understanding that was huge for me. So breaking

yourself a steam is going back and seeing your patterns and understanding, okay, why am I like this?

Why do I believe this? If you don't question the belief, you can't change it. So most people don't

want to question their beliefs because it's scary, right? So instead of questioning their belief,

they just keep on reinforcing that. But if you go back and you look at a belief that you have

and then you question it, then you can ask, okay, is that true? No, that's not true.

Actually, I am pretty smart. I've done X, Y and Z. And I can do this. And I'm good at that.

And now you start to understand, okay, that belief isn't even true. So now I created a new story

which trades new patterns in my life. And now I can take the step to go do something. And that's how

you build self-esteem. It's breaking down the old stories, the old identity, the old beliefs,

I no longer serve you and building new ones that are going to support you and push you forward.

So it's really just looking at the past because everything that you believe today is from the past.

Someone taught you that. Someone taught you that in school. A kid said it to you on the playground.

Your parents told it to you. And then you go back and you look at that and you go, okay,

I don't have to believe that actually. And I have evidence now. And that's what the habits and

routines are so important for because now you start to build these evidence up and stack

this evidence. And that's what you guys do is so powerful, right? You help people to go through

transformations in their body. So if I can show up for the gym every day and now I'm starting to

build that confidence in that self-esteem, but it has to be breaking the old patterns too, right?

Because if you don't know why you do what you do, you don't know why you go eat the foods that

you eat. You don't know why you keep sabotaging their relationships. You're just going to find

another one is going to keep happening. You'll do good for a little bit, you'll cycle back,

you'll do the yo-yo diet where you'll find a different relationship and you'll keep blaming

everybody else in the world around you. But just go back, look at your past beliefs,

look at the circumstances, look at the events that happened, and then separate the emotion from

that and figure out, okay, this doesn't make sense. What makes sense to make question to belief

and then you can change? And that's really where that lasting change comes from.

You know, I mean, I know you do as well. We'll use a lot of data, right, to make decisions for

ourselves, for our clients. And I feel like it's similar to like with the stories, like you just said,

we have to go back, we look at these stories that we create for ourselves and we say, is that

really true? I go, those things that are really backing that up. And I think too often we don't look

at all the data behind that. Okay, this is where I film myself. Is that true? We don't look at all the

things that that don't line up for that story. And like, where are you coming up with this story?

Because there is no evidence to back your story. You're just totally going to that negative side of

things and there's no evidence for it. Yeah, if you question somebody enough, they'll start to realize

their story that they have doesn't make any sense, right? And yeah, I mean, that's the biggest

thing. People are scared to look at themselves. So what do we do? We use avoidance, which is it's

overeating, it's watching porn, it's watching television, it's always being plugged into something,

scrolling on social media. That's a good distraction. Because if you're distracted, you can't look at

those lies, right? And then you don't have to worry about making a change in your life because

you're constantly consuming something else. It's just an avoidance technique. Most people,

most Americans live in doubt, they live in anxiety, they live in fear, and they live in avoidance.

That's so awesome. We talked about that last week, right? I mean, because we were talking about

when we avoid things, avoid things, and it goes away for a short period, right? And then the

mind's like, oh, hey, remember last time when we just kind of avoided this a little bit, we felt

pretty good. And then do that again. And we felt good. And you just keep doing that. And it gets

worse and worse. It's just kind of piles on top like you're saying. Yeah, for sure.

And yeah, like, that's something that I, I used all the things to avoid in my past. Like we've

talked about too. I guess for Kevin, what, what's one of the biggest habits that you've had to

break that changed your life? Mine was this past year I gave up drinking for a year. And I think

when you want to quit something, a lot of times we have the idea, but we don't change, we don't

change our identity. So it never happens. So I've said my whole life, I want to quit drinking,

I want to stop every hanging over, you know, I'm done drinking this time and it never happened.

But I always said, because I would go for a couple weeks, I was like, yeah, sorry guys, I can't drink

tonight. Can't go out. And I kept saying I can't. So I didn't have any power. As soon as I started

saying, I don't, but the most important part was actually making that commitment for a year.

I finally committed. And there's a difference between trying to do something. And I hear clients say

this all the time, I need to do this. I'm trying to do this. I want to do that. Okay, cool. Now you're

in a lack state and you're trying to, trying to in wanting and needing all the time. And it never

happens. I say, why don't you just say you're committed to it? Why don't you commit to it for once?

As soon as you commit, that's when you start changing. So for me, drinking was when I finally

committed. And I said, I'm doing a year. I'm like a month away. And it's been easy because I actually

committed this time. So that was one of the biggest habits that I changed. I mean, a small habit

that's really helped me a lot. It's just getting more organized. Same thing going back to limiting

beliefs of saying, I'm just not an organized person. And also just being in solitude as well. I

always said I was a people person. I had to be around people. That was really just a cop out

because I was in avoidance, right? I was avoiding being with my thoughts, being by myself. So

actually sitting in the room by myself, meditating every morning. First thing I do every single

day is take a 45 minute walk with no phone. And yeah, so I love being by myself. So I'd say,

those three were really big for me. So it's like you said, it's creating that new identity.

Not just trying to change like a habit or trying to do something different. It's actually

changing because this is the person that I'm becoming or I want to become.

Yeah. I mean, if you don't change your identity, you go back. And I think that's like

everyone does the short term fixes. And it's not sustainable. It's got to be who you are.

And that's why I like in my coaching program in the last phase, we talk about the rewire.

Rewire that identity, rewire that nervous system, rewire your standards. And you have to change

it with the language too. And a lot of people don't even realize the language that they're using.

Everything I can talk to somebody in the first five minutes. I know if they're low self-esteem. I

know if they're committed. I know if they're going to follow through. I know everything. I

can just tell by the words that they've said. And people don't realize how powerful the words are.

And even some words that we just used to avoid saying what we really mean. And it's just crazy.

But yeah, if you don't shift your identity, you're always going to go back because you go back to

what you believe you're worth. And that's why self-esteem at the end of the day is so important.

Even though men don't want to talk about it, it is important.

What are some of the things that you just said? You can you notice right away when you meet somebody

you talk to them. What are some of the words that you hear? What are some of the actions that tell

you, oh, you know what? They need to change. Yes, I already alluded to a couple of them when they're

saying I'm trying to do this or I need to do that. I know they're in a lack state. If they're saying

kind of all the time, which most Americans do, or they're saying, I don't know, or I guess,

between words, I know they're very unsure and they're not committed. It's a way to avoid.

If I ask you a tough question and you say, I guess, or kind of, or I don't know before you answer,

I know you're avoiding it, right? You just won't say it straight on. So if you avoid the truth and

you won't state the facts, you'll never make a change. And most people just hop around what they're

trying to say with these little filler words that halfway commit themselves. So those words,

if you can just look at those and see those and be like, okay, yeah, because I'll have a client,

I'll say, okay, and I'll say that without saying that word. And they'll be like choking, right?

Because it hurts so bad to actually admit that without using that head. So taking those words

out are so powerful. Because now you're just getting cleaner and clearer on what you're talking

about and where you're going. And I mean, I've done this too. I've worked on these. I used to be

the kind of person, right? So taking those words out just makes you so much more powerful.

And people listen to you more. I always say to like every client, hey, before you worked with me,

if I were to told you, hey, I kind of got this coaching program, I think it will kind of help you

get to where you want to go. Or I say, hey, I got this coaching program. We're going to follow

these steps and I never going to get results. Like the second one sounds so much cleaner and more

sure. But everyone's saying kind of, and I guess, and I don't know because they're nervous or they

have anxiety and they hold that anxiety in their body and just comes out in words. So I can tell

when someone just for some people, I just got off the film with a client the other day. I was like,

you're so clean. Everything you're saying is like so direct. And that's what his biggest goal was

to work on his confidence in a self esteem. But the first call he was just peppering me with,

I guess, kind of, and I don't know. He couldn't say one sentence without saying that. And it's just

so cool to see how much more, I believe him, right? I believe what he's saying. And that's why he's

getting results each week because he's actually doing and following through. But I can tell with the

language that he's actually committed, he's not just saying it.

What would you say? I was thinking, obviously, if someone's working with you, they have you.

They're, you're the support system. If they're wanting to change and whether it's

that they're like, you know, you very outgoing person or someone like me, who's just very

introverted, would you say community is a very strong thing to have for them to be able to change?

Yeah, I think communities huge, you can say everyone that comes in, they have relationships.

And a lot of times people are living in codependency where they're people pleasing,

they're overdoing and extending and doing more for other people than they would do for themselves.

And if you don't have boundaries in those relationships, it's going to be very hard because that's

an addiction in itself. And a lot of people are trying to recover from addiction, whether it's

codependency, whether it's avoidance, whatever those are. If you don't have the right people around

you, it's going to be a lot more challenging. And the sad part is, which most people don't want to

hear, when you do start to make these changes, other people will not be able to tolerate you and

you won't be able to tolerate that. And it's just part of growing is because you go from one level

of consciousness to another and you vibrate at each level. And when you're on one vibration,

you're going to attract certain people, there's going to feel right being around them. But as you

grow, you sort of vibrate on a higher level and you guys aren't, you're not attracted to each other

anymore. And that's just the sad reality. And that's why a lot of times when personal development

and people start growing businesses and they start going through different phases of life,

they start out growing the people that they were with. And so yeah, finding the community

that you love and supports you. And honestly, you don't have to be like, everyone doesn't have to

be in personal development. It's just mutual respect and understanding and having strong boundaries.

And I think a lot of people really lack the boundaries in their relationships. They don't have

the boundaries. They can't walk away. They want to do everything for everyone. And that's just

an insecurity in themselves trying to prove their worth to everyone that they talk to and making

sure that everyone's okay with them. And it's not being mean. Boundaries aren't, you don't

need to say anything to hold a boundary. You just don't have to respond. And sometimes that's

all you need to do. But yeah, getting around the right people and there's going to be people

I was talking to a client earlier today. I told her it was the crab in the bucket phenomenon. You're

trying to get up and that crab is going to try to pull you back down. The crab never gets out.

You don't have to put a lid on the top. They're always going to pull you back down down there

with them. A lot of the people that you're associated with when they see you climbing, they're going

to say, hey, take it easy. Now you don't, you don't have to push hard. You know, you work out too

much like start telling you all these things. Not because they want what's best for you, but because

they feel very uncomfortable. So it's making sure you're surrounding yourself by the people that

support you, that love you, that are there for you. And they don't need you for anything,

except for they just enjoy spending time with you. Attachments are very dangerous as well,

where we become attached to other people. And we think that it's love, but it's really just

attachment. And letting go of that, that's where true love is, is where you can be happy for

someone with or without them, right? And I mean, it's easier said than done. But once you get there,

you just have really high quality relationships. What was your experience with quitting drinking

in your friends? Did you experience both sides of things where people were completely supportive

of you? And then also the other side where they're like, come on, man, let's go out. What are you doing?

Things like that? Yeah. I mean, I really don't have many of the same friends when I was drinking

to where I am now. Actually, I don't know if I have any. I mean, there was a couple that I had met.

So when I went through a lot of changes in my life, through my business, through my own

transformation, I moved to Florida within like a year after that. So I had to make new friends

anyway, which was awesome. And I was able to curate the group that I wanted. But yeah, there was

definitely people that were like, hey, let's just go out. Hey, like, you don't drink anymore. Like,

what are you doing? Like, what do you do? What do you do every night? And I was like, I just

enjoyed myself. You're not going to sleep at night. But yeah, you're definitely going to I did

I did have those experiences. But honestly, it wasn't really that bad. I have a great community

not around like I have a amazing community and none of it's around drinking. We do things

all the time, not around drinking. So you can definitely find it. It's just a limiting belief

that you need to break. I remember I told myself that I couldn't have fun without it for most of my

life. Yeah. That's all right. People were like, well, what do you do? You know, you come out to the

bars, you know, going to clubs or drink like, what do you do? Like, well, I mean, I enjoy life.

I feel great. I get high energy. I go to sleep on time and wake up. Yeah, whatever. I think

it's pretty funny. Yeah, there's a lot to do. There's a lot more you find that you get to discover

yourself a little more too. You actually get to understand who you are. Because when you're

drinking all the time, you're just numbing out. You don't you just do the same thing every night.

Now I have to get more creative to have fun, right? So if I do want to go out, it's going to be

stepping out the comfort zone, having more conversations. It's really just a crutch at the

end of the day. And that's what I realized I was using it as a social crutch. And as you work on

yourself a steam, you don't really need it. It's just, yeah, if you want to have a couple, it's fine.

You just you feel good and you don't have to go over do it. But a lot of times it is just a way

that we feel more comfortable in a group. But if you go a year without it, you realize,

doesn't don't really need it loses its power over you. Well, like we said to where you're like,

you have to you have to sit with yourself. And a lot of people don't want to sit with themselves

because then they have to deal with that situation. And then it's they have to make some changes.

And then it becomes really uncomfortable. Oh, man, it's probably the most uncomfortable thing you

do is sitting with yourself. And especially for men when you've been told your whole life,

don't express your emotions. Avoid them. Don't talk about them. When you let those come up,

you've been suppressing them for so long. It's literally physical pain in the body. Like you'll feel

it. And but it's the only way to let them go, right? You cannot release the emotions that you're

holding. Unless you let them surface and release because a lot of times we'll just suppress for

the rest of our life. And that's where every bad habit, that's where every vice comes from. It

comes from the suppressed emotions that we're avoiding. And that energy is coming out in a different

way. So it's just avoidance or we're neutralizing it with food or a porn or gambling, whatever the

choice is to to deal with that emotion that we don't want to look at. And so when you notice those

emotions coming up, I guess, how did you work through that? How do you say it with that? I know

you mentioned to me a lot of those experiences in church when you're like, you feel your temples

burning. I know that was probably part of it. But how else did you navigate that or what's the

best way to start unpacking all those emotions, especially for men who haven't suppressed that for

so long? Yeah. So I think a dopamine detox is super important. And everyone should do that. I have

a three day dopamine detox is a great starter. But I did a whole entire month where I didn't

have any social media. This was very early in my personal development journey. And I didn't have

a business at the time. So it was fine. And I just deleted it. And I just sat with myself. And then I

had rules where I wouldn't have phone in my room. So at night, I was feeling those emotions because

I had no way to run. And then I remember I used to tell myself this thing like I would not stay

in on a Friday and Saturday night. That's why I went out every weekend because I wasn't working.

And I would have to sit with my thoughts. So once I quit doing the Netflix, I quit scrolling on

the phone. Then I had to sit there. And then I implemented meditating and journaling as well.

That was like, that was a lot. That's a lot for a lot of people to get into. But that's why I say

just do it for three days. And you'll learn a lot. You'll learn a lot about yourself in three days.

You'll see these emotions come up. You'll hear these thoughts come up. And then you'll start

to recognize them and then journal about it. Write it down. Start logging it. But that's the

best way. It's just getting away from whatever your distractions are. And man, some people is just

arguing with their family, right? That's a way. That's a way to get some dopamine. That's a way to

avoid those emotions, right? So just allow them to service, get by yourself, go for a walk,

journal. Yeah, I highly recommend if you're really serious about it, just delete all social media

for a month, especially if you don't use it for work. But know this day and age, a lot of people

are using it for work. And it's funny. I get majority of my clients from social media, but it's

like the first thing I say to get rid of. And honestly, I barely been using it. I got a two phone

technique where I have one phone for just my day to day and then one for social media. So it's

strictly, I'm getting on there in the post and do work, you know? Yeah, people ask me a lot how I

navigate social media. I'm like, I literally don't even go on anymore. I have no desire for it,

partly for that reason. If someone's doing their dopamine detox, do you recommend just starting with

social media? Is there like a main basic list of things that you want people to start by cutting

out or what's going to be most beneficial? Yeah, so I got a list and I just like a little link

that just walked you through it. But the first thing is social media, it's sugary foods,

it's television. So you unplug the TVs, all of them in your house, online shopping. I mean,

gambling. None of the all these things that you would get dopamine from. It's just three days,

you're getting rid of all of it. And then I have prompts in there like your journal each day,

do 100 pushups, do 100 setups. It's not all at once. It's like throughout the day. Give

yourself a little challenge, go for a walk where you can clear your, clear your head. But that's

a great way to start just because some people, like I don't know what yours is. Most people is

going to be three hours of social media a day. And you'll find out how much you can get done.

I had a woman, one of my new clients, she finished two paintings, the first dopamine detox. It was

amazing. They were amazing. She showed me them. But that's what happens when you step away from

your phone. Her creativity came back into her. And then a couple of days later, she messaged me,

found her purpose again. So it's just like stepping away from social media can give you so much.

And all the we're doing is consuming there. You're not creating anything. You're draining your

dopamine. It's flooding you every single day. That's why you're tired. That's why you're not

motivated. Like, dopamine is your motivation drug. If you have no dopamine all day, how are you

going to be motivated to do the work that you need to get done? It's just destroying you. So

yeah, three days, I mean, if you can't commit to three days, you're not going to make any change in

your life. So when you're talking about the dopamine hit too, you know, and the more you do

something, right, the less it's going to affect you. So like, you get rid of a lot of those things.

You hop on and watch like a 30 minute, you know, sitcom or something. All of a sudden, it's way

better. A way more entertaining than if you're just sitting there watching TV every single day.

Yeah, I mean, I like my dark chocolate, but if you read it all day, every day, it's not the same.

And so going back to your 18 year old self when you said the version of you now is completely

unrecognizable, even the version of you that I met two years ago is unrecognizable. I guess what

prompted you to start making those changes? Because it's such a massive transformation. It's been so

fast too. So it's like, what prompted that? What was that initial spark for you?

Yeah, that's a good question. I don't know. Just one day I woke up and I looked in the mirror and I was

like tired of living the life that I was living. I was tired of being hung over. I was working at

a job. I didn't like I quit the job. I was a teacher. I quit the job and I didn't know what I was

going to do. And I just started figuring things out. I started I tried day trading. I tried real

estate. I tried all these different things. I was trying to figure out what I what I was going to do

with my life. And my grandfather called and told me about this free seminar online to get

your life back on track. And I just chuckled and I put it on the calendar and I went and checked

it out. And I was like, whoa, what is this personal development stuff? This is a mate. So mind you,

this is 28 years old. Never heard of the word personal development in my life until 28 years old.

And now I'm helping people go through transformations. But I just got addicted to it. I was like, this is

this is so cool. This is amazing. Like there are so many cool things you can do.

I started reading the books, started doing the seminar, started doing all the work that I could

get my hands on. And yeah, that was a spark. I just got introduced. So I think like for any

way you're listening to, if you can just introduce one person, give them one idea, bring them to

my church one day, whatever you want to help them do, just have them show up and do something and

give them a book maybe. Like that could be the life transformation, right? One book. Because I didn't

think I could read before this, right? Because I told you back in middle school, high school, I got

made fun of for it. So I didn't pick up a book ever. And then I was like, you know what? Let me try

this. Picked up a book and now I, my whole, my whole room filled with books and I read them all

at time. But yeah, it was just, it was just one of those moments where I knew that I could do more,

I knew I didn't like the life. I knew this wasn't sustainable and I didn't want to live like this

anymore. And I just think God works, looks out for you and my grandfather called me and told me

about that. He was watching the news and called me and saw, he saw a commercial and called me and

told me so that's how that happened. Love that. I feel like my story is so, I can relate in so

many ways to that too. Like I didn't have a big aha moment or like a, like a necessarily a rock bottom

moment where I had this big wake up call. I just woke up like, what am I doing with my life? I'm

tired of feeling miserable. And I also looking back at it now, like it was for sure God guiding

me in the right direction. I just had that one person who gave me a little nudge showed me what a

podcast was. I didn't know what a podcast was about the time that opened my door to self-development

too. And it becomes a dick thing. You even said you became addicted to self-improvement. You feel like

one or all addictions bad or like how did you translate, you know, the addictions you had to

alcohol or other devices to something good and something that's going to propel you forward.

Yeah, I guess I was a bad choice of words. I don't think I'm addicted. I would say I was heavily

consuming though. And at this point now, I don't nearly consume as much because out of the end of

the day, you need to give yourself time to think and process. And if you're always consuming,

I mean, I know people that listen to personal development 247 in avoidance, right? We're still

avoiding our thoughts in just a healthier way. And I think a lot of people do this and you'll see

people quit drinking and then they go seven days a week in the gym. And we see these all the time

where they just trade a toxic habit for a new addiction that's healthier. Not still bad though,

because you're still you're still avoiding you're still punishing your body. You're working out six

seven days a week. You're still punishing your body, right? You're still not feeling that worth

in yours. It's just a different way of doing it. Yeah, I mean, I think I think was about addiction,

but yeah, I mean, there's definitely I don't really think there are healthy addictions like you

if you're addicted to something, you need it, right? And if you need something, you have a severe

attachment and that severe attachment is going to control your life, right? Even if it is healthy,

it's going to ruin your relationships. If you're going to the gym and you can't take a day off,

that's not healthy. So every addiction, there is there's a line that you need to be like,

okay, I can live without this because if you can't live without it, it owns you and it doesn't really

matter what it is. Well, it's like creating those idols, right? So maybe your idol is alcohol.

And then you're like, I need to get rid of this idol. I'm going to start working out all the time

and you're, you know, you said it. Working out is amazing thing. It's super healthy for you,

but then that becomes your idol. Then you just swapped out one out for another, even though,

you know, on the surface, it seems like it's really healthy. I'd love to hear about your faith

and how that's grown from where you started and where you are now. Yeah, absolutely. I was just

about to say, Lawrence, that trigger something in my mind there. So in personal development,

I think it's really easy to start worshiping idols, right? There's these personal development

people that we look up to and in a personal development world, that's really what happened a lot

of times. We like get these people, we go to their seminars, we do all their things, we read all

their books. And when you're not God centered, a lot of times that takes over and that's who

you're worshiping and that's throughout the whole Bible. They're warning us about these idols.

And I think personal development can be one where people think they're doing the right thing.

They go all in. But yeah, my faith has grown over the last couple of years. Tremendously,

I just got invited to church one day and I walked in and believe it or not, it was a bigger church

round here. They have a whole bunch of locations and I walked in. It's like, this is just like

personal development. I can do this, right? But it was a great gateway for me to get in there

because I was already in personal development. I didn't really have much of a faith at the time.

And yeah, so I just continue showing up and just learning more and more about God. It's really

transformed my life and become the center point of my life, which has just released so much stress

and so much burden from my life when you're not the center of it anymore. You can let that ego

dissolve and surrender to that. It's a game changer. Well, like we said, too, is you just kept

showing up. I don't think anyone expects us to go to church or anywhere for the first time and be

all said, no, I'm, you know, this is amazing. I get everything I'm totally in. You may show it

first time and not know anything or be confused or whatever, but you just got to keep going and

sooner or later, guys are going to use that time to reach you and talk to you and then get you

going. Yeah, absolutely. And I think Mackenzie mentioned it earlier. The first few times I

go to church, I just felt like this compressing on my temples. I felt like someone was just

like pressing my head in and it was like the craziest feeling ever. And I think it was just spiritual

warfare just like getting in there and just not being familiar. It was just a lot, a lot of energy

that need to burn off until I finally got to that point of peace. But each time I left, I just

felt good and I was like, all right, I'm going to keep coming back. I'm just feeling good. And as

you continue to show up, yeah, you just build that relationship. And I mean, get around the right

people, get in a community, it's life changing, getting around those people too. Like anyone that's

a true believer, they just got the values of the people that you really want to be around. And

I think it is really important to get those communities, get it in those communities and help

other people step into their faith because the woman that invited me, she probably didn't know

what she was going to do. And now I lead a Bible study and have all these people coming. And I still

don't feel like I'm the strongest one knowing the Bible or anything like that, but just still taking

leap so faith and just doing what I feel called the dough. Yeah. And actually funny enough, last

episode we talked about our faith journey. And we talked about how I got into it. And it was

literally you by the same story. So everyone listening, he was the one that did it.

Well, that's awesome. I love it. Yeah, I'm glad. I'm glad. Yeah, I think this Christmas Eve,

right? Yeah. Well, I think, and I've done this before as well. Sometimes I think as a Christian,

you think, well, I need to be a better Christian or I need to have a better knowledge of the Bible,

or I need to be able to be better myself, to be able to reach out to other people. And God's always

like, look, dude, I don't need you. I want you to do this. You just show up and I'll take care of

the rest. Yeah, honestly, that's exactly how it happens. I was living out in Columbia for the summer.

I didn't know how long I was going to stay there. Just got a one way. And I just felt called to come

back to the St. Petersburg and build this community. And I just knew I wanted faith to be part of it.

I just wanted to bring great people together. And I went to an event here, a local event here.

And one of the women at the event came up to me, asked her and tapped me on her shoulders,

like, hey, we need to start a Bible study. I was like, I was like answering my prayers, right?

These people just kept showing up. And I swear if you just have an intention and you ask for something,

it will show up in the craziest ways. The similar thing when I came back, I was in Columbia,

and I was, I went on this, we were hiking these mountains in this beautiful town called Guadapet.

And I was like, I'm going to have my first treat here. And literally got back. And a week later,

I went on a walk with one of my friends and she introduced me to this woman from Columbia

that who's for treats in Columbia. It was just like, how, how, how could that happen, right?

There's no way, but I was praying for it, right? And when you start praying for it to have that

intention, it's unbelievable the things that will happen. Yeah, praying for it and you got to have

that faith too. You know, if you just pray for something, be like, I'm praying for this guy,

but I don't think it's really going to happen or I don't know if it's going to happen.

It probably won't, but like I'm imagining you had like that strong faith. I'm praying for this guy,

because it's, it's going to happen. You just show me when and where. Yeah. Yeah. And that's,

I mean, that just comes back to you. Just living in that abundance too, right? Just knowing

that God's working, knowing that things are coming and not having to try to figure it all out,

just asking for it and knowing. It's so hard for people to get there a lot of times because they

live in that lack state and they always need and they want and they think that they need to know

all the answers before they get started. But if you just get moving, things will start working for

you like business, right? Nobody knows where we're going. You just get started and things will

happen. People will show up and if you just get started, it's the hardest thing to do, right?

Is get started. Most people cannot invest in themselves, right? They just don't, they've never done

it before and they will probably never do it. But once they finally do, they get the right person

to talk them into it. I mean, you guys do it all the time. I'm sure transforming people and

they're hesitant at first, but they finally invest in themselves and they're like, okay, I got started.

Now they're starting. Now that's a ripple effect for the rest of their life and everybody else

in their life. Yeah, I don't know if it's the hesitancy that comes from just like a lack of

confident self-confidence or self-esteem like you're talking about or just a lack of like, okay,

I don't know if I really want to do this because like we've said, this is going to change a lot of

things. It's going to have to change me and it might get a little bit comfortable. I'm really used

to even though I'm saying I want to change, even though I say there's a lot of things, I don't know if

I really want to. Yeah, I mean, if you're a commitment, if you're a failure or some of the

biggest challenges for people, it's not really the money at the end of the day. It's normally,

what am I going to have to do? Will I be successful? And what if I'm not, right? And getting

uncomfortable doing things that you've never done before, but it's so worth it. And that's the only

way to create a breakthrough. You're going to have to do something different. You've got to interrupt

your current patterns. You have to do something different. You have to take a chance. You have to

say something different. You have to go do just do one thing to end. If you can do that and just

show up and consistently build, you can really change anything. And someone that I was telling someone

this the other day, my biggest pains in my life, the things that I struggled with the most,

where I was hurting the most, where I felt the most insecure are my purpose now. It's where I'm

helping people. So just because you haven't done it before doesn't mean that you can't do it and

it might be your gift, right? So it's pretty cool how God works like that as well.

Yeah, we're always most equipped to help the person that we once were the place that we were in

before. The thing we were struggling with the most, especially because you've gone through

it. You've experienced it. You've seen both sides of it. And so it gives us the purpose of

you able to go and help serve other people. And so I guess if someone is stuck in that place or

they're stuck where you were 10 years ago, what would be one of the best first steps that they

can take if they want to break a destructive pattern? If they want to recreate their identity,

if they want to break these bad habits, what's like one first step that they can take?

First thing I would say is just get consistent on 30 minutes to an hour, first 30 minutes of the day,

no cell phone, take a walk. Just get outside and move your body. I don't care how cold it is and

just keep showing up. I'll go home for Delaware. And I love when it's cold because cold and raining

actually, because I know nobody else is going to be out there. But for me, it's like that first

30 minutes. If I can just get out there and do it, it feels so good. And you'll just start to

build confidence. And even here in Florida, it's been like 30s in the morning for some reason.

But I've still been going on my walks every morning. And it's just like how bundle up and do it

because I know how important that is. And just it's not challenging. It's just something you have to

commit to. It's a 30 minute to walk. We're not asking anything too hard. And if you could just be

out there with your thoughts, with no distractions, with no phone, you're going to you're going to

start to hear some things that you haven't heard before and start to feel some things you haven't

felt before. And you're going to get some answers that you've been looking for. So that's where I

would start. 30 minute walk, no phone in the morning. And just get moving.

Is there anything else that we haven't talked about today that you think is important to

discuss or that you want people to know or start thinking about?

Now, I would just say if you're thinking about making a change, if there's something that you want,

go get it. And don't talk to yourself out of it. Don't go after the things that you think you

can get. So many of us go after what we think we can get. And when I first started my business,

I want to I built a business that I thought I could build, right? Not the one that I actually

wanted. And I had to break more limiting beliefs to get there. But whatever it is that you want,

you don't need to figure out how. And most of us will think, okay, well, I want this, but I don't

have X, Y and Z. So I can't do it. So I'm just going to do this instead. That's the wrong answer.

Because now you're going your whole life and you're creating a life that you don't even want.

And the other thing I would say that's attached to that is say what you believe to. Just tell

people what you believe because otherwise you're going to create a whole life that you don't want

as well. Because if I'm telling you what I think you want me to say, I'm attracting the wrong

people. And if I keep saying that over and over again, I'm creating a life that I don't want.

I'm doing things because other people, I think other people want me to do it. And if I keep

people pleasing and I keep trying to make everybody else happy, you're going to end up building this

life that you hate. So it's better just to be honest. You will push the people away from you that

you don't need in your life. You'll attract the people into things into your life that you want.

But you got to ask for it. Just say what you want. I think that's the biggest thing in life. It's

like find your purpose. And your purpose is whatever you just like desire, whatever it is that you

want, whatever you get excited about. And you're probably not going to know how to do it. I didn't

know how the retreat was going to happen. I didn't know how I was going to do this coaching now

because I didn't have any prior experience to it, right? The experience was my own personal

development journey, right? And what I wanted it. So I just figured out a way. And another thing I

would say too, if you're getting started on your journey, the coolest thing you can do is make a

video and just say like where you're at and where you want to go and what you're battling with.

And next time you have a hard day, pull out your phone and just start recording and just

and just talk about how you're feeling, what your challenges are. And if you do that like every

six months and do a little check in like what your challenges are, where you're headed, you won't

even be able to recognize yourself. It's going to be so cool looking back because you're going to

look different. You're going to feel different. You're going to be talking different. Everything's

going to be different. And I think that's one of the coolest things because if I look back three

years ago, like thinking about it, I can't really, I knew a little bit, but like watching the video,

like dang, like you just feel so bad for me. It's like, it's so cool. And I think that's one of

the coolest experiences. If you can just document a little bit of it. Don't share it. I haven't

shared it with anybody. It's just on my phone. And I just check in and look at it every once in a while.

Well, you showed me one of them for sure. And even though I was like, who is that guy? You can

just tell by the energy, everything is completely different. I love that idea. What do you think is

the biggest thing that you've learned since doing those recordings and looking back at those old

videos and those old versions of yourself? Biggest thing is, it's a good question.

I guess the biggest thing I learned was, that's a good, I don't know. I feel like we covered a lot

of it. I think it's just going after what you want at the end of the day and not trying to figure

out what, what's going to make you money, right? Because I got in the day trading, trying to make

money. And that's when I made the video. I was day trading every day. And then I tried to do

real estate because I thought I was going to make money. And the money is, it's cool, but it's

not everything. Like, when I get off the calls, my coaching calls, like, this is almost every night,

I have a gratitude journal, one of the ones that I gave you. At the end of the night, I write down

my highlights of the day. And a lot of times, this is a coaching call. So what I'm doing for work

and who I get to work with and who I get to help is one of the things I'm grateful for is like

the highlight of my day. So if you can find something and everyone's not going to find it, but just

find your purpose. And I think that's the most important thing is to find your purpose in life.

And it doesn't have to be a job. I always say like, you might be the person that hosted

dinner parties in the community, right? You're not making money on it, but you're getting people

together. You're serving a purpose or you get the bonfire and the volleyball group together.

Like, what are you doing? Like, what is your purpose? How are you showing up? Or maybe it's just

your philanthropy? Like, find something that is your purpose that's going to drive you. And if it can

be your job, even better. But I think that's the most important thing that I learned just looking

back at those videos. I was just doing what I thought I was supposed to do. I was doing what

go to school, you know, you come out and you get a job, right? And then you can drink on the weekends

with your buddies and you go back and you work. But you're not looking for anything because you're

not living in purpose. So if you can get clear on what that is and then start building a plan

from there, start letting go and releasing everything that's in the way, you'll get to where you want.

It's really just a battle against yourself. You're releasing the old version of you,

letting that version that you die. So there's new you can come through and build the life that you

want. And it's so much more fun. You don't need the alcohol. You don't need any of the toxic stuff

because you're having so fun living in your purpose that you're excited to do it. And that's

your fulfillment. It's not running and distracting you from your life and avoiding it. It's just

building a life that you thoroughly enjoy, which is so so rewarding.

Yeah, I love that. Even what you said previously is just start. That's all you got to do is take

that first step. You don't need to know how you, I Lawrence, everyone who started anything

meaningful. We had no clue. We're doing we still could argue that we have no clue. Maybe I

don't speak for myself. But it's like we're just taking that first step and then that next one.

And God's going to reveal the next one that your doors are going to open. But a lot of people

like you were saying to you to the avoiding point is even gathering info trying to prep and prepare

and wait for the right time. Like it's all avoidance. It's like just take that first step.

The rest is going to reveal itself. Yeah, and I'll tell you one more story that for anyone that

is on the fence about getting started of how this happened for me. So I told you I quit my

teaching job. I was bartending at the time just to pay bills. And I went and I hired my first coach

and it was a lot of money for me at the time. And I quit my bartending job at the same time.

So I had no income coming in and I was going to start a business, right? And most people don't

do that. They'll like hold it on to a job. But I knew my personality. And I was like if I have an

option, I won't be all in. So I just went all in literally. And I didn't know how it was going to

happen. And I just made a first post and I got a first client and I was like, why that was cool.

And yeah, it was it was a struggle in the mind. It was up and down. But it was like going all in and

just committing and getting rid of my other options. Now that's extreme and you can work your way

into it. But it's just committing to it, right? And at the end of the day, I'd never make massive

changes unless I commit, unless like I put it on the calendar, unless I say it's going to happen

and tell a friend too, right? When I quit drinking, I told like three of my best friends. I told you

I was like, I am, I'm done. I'm done for this year. Like, and once I told Dan, there was no way

I was going back because I looked like an idiot if I was drinking two weeks later.

Yeah, so K Clavier, my Instagram is a great way to connect with me. Kevin Clavier.com

would be a great way to connect as well. And then, I mean, all the platforms Facebook, TikTok.

But the best way to reach me would be on Instagram and shoot me an email at Kevin Clavier 13 at gmail.com

as well.

Yeah, absolutely. Thanks for having me. It was a great time. Yeah, thanks, Kevin. Appreciate it.

Yeah, nice meeting you, Lawrence. You too. Let's see it.