‘Trainwreck’ - Minister grilled over land claim explosion 💥

0:00Dave Roberts here. There you are surrounded by fans, sharing wings, sharing drinks, high-fiving random strangers. Everybody remembers the game. Nobody remembers the guy coughing behind you until a few days later. At 2 a.m., you wake up with a fever and your throats on fire. Now what? Urgent care, clothes, ER, slam, telehealth, maybe, but the pharmacy's clothes. You needed a medical emergency kit. These aren't first aid kits. They contain essential prescriptions used for over 30 common conditions. Sinus and ear infection, UTI, stomach bug, travelers diarrhea, and more. On hand before you need them. Use your doctor-developed guidebook to select the right prescription or call their telemedicine doctor standing by. It's like an urgent care and drugstore at home. When you're sick, traveling, or stranded, you'll wish you ordered a medical emergency kit. Order online in minutes and it's shipped to your door and say $45 with my promo code blue at urgentcarekit.com-slashblue. That's promo code blue at urgentcarekit.com-slashblue.

1:01Sydney's best breakfast. Two G.V. With the shining a light on the explosion of Aboriginal land claims in New South Wales, the list of famous Sydney addresses and New South Wales addresses subject to a claim is continuing to grow. Swimming pools, bowling clubs, tennis centres, golf courses, sailing clubs, even five star hospitality venues like Bondi Icebergs and club rows bay. The Minister for Crown Lands is on a mission to clean up the system and we're told that the New South Wales government is seeking to urgently close a legal loophole. It'll make it harder for land councils to take control of community facilities that are being used. But questions are being asked about why it's taken so long. In 2023 there were 40,000 unresolved Aboriginal land claims in New South Wales. Three years later that number has grown to 44,000. It works out to be an average of three new land claims per day. Steve Kampa is the New South Wales Minister for Lands and

2:04Property and he's live in the studio. Minister, thanks so much for coming in. Good morning, Ben and thanks for having me. Is it fair to say that this is out of control? Look, I think it's important to appreciate that a land claim is a one-line email and essentially it's pretty easy to log out a land claim. But then to process that land claim can take months and months and months. So yeah, we work hard at that. But importantly, land claims are there and for a successful land claim to proceed to land transfer, it requires a crown land site under the Act in 1983. It requires it to be unused. And what we're focusing on is legislation that will protect against certain legal outcomes that have brought about. Transverse, unexpected

3:05transfers of land. It might be really easy for someone to put in an application and just a one line in the email, but it is it also becoming easier for people to successfully lodge these claims because we're told that land councils have figured out they only need to find one glitch for these sites to become fair game. If the piece of crown land was at any time unused or unlawfully used, their chances of success go up. And we're talking about in some cases, technical breaches. And this is what I've been told you tell me whether I'm wrong or right. For example, if there were delays in the execution of documents, that could mean that technically the land was unused. Or if the tenant sublet any of the land, even a key ask in a surf club, that could amount to unlawful use. And that's that's that's correct. And that's why we've brought legislation to the house. I don't think it was ever intended. You know, will used valuable community, community assets, community facilities, community services were basically, you know, ceased because of glitch within within a leasing document or a minor breach within an lease.

4:09Shouldn't these land councils be more realistic and look at somewhere like Bondi icebergs or club rows by or all of these tennis clubs and sailing clubs and say that looks like it's being used. We won't put in a land claim. Yeah, look, look, Ben, the land, land rights have been around for 43 years and respective governments have been managing these things. The way the system works, as I said, it's simple to lodge a land claim, but it's not a fader completely. I think we need to appreciate that, but we also need to identify where there's risk of, you know, really important valuable community assets being lost. Because once you lose them, you never get them back, you know, surf clubs, you know, but if you've got four to four thousand applications sitting on your desk, shouldn't you be sending a message to the land councils to say, hey, guys and girls, ease up here a little bit. Don't put in applications on land that's being used. Look, in many respects, the system was designed that way 43 years ago, your logic claim in the event of after claims being lodged in the event there has been this use for sight. Well, then it's eligible for it's

5:14eligible to be processed. Well, it's so it's that's why the system has been designed and we managed it that way. What we're really focused on here, Ben, is making sure that there's really important valuable highly used community assets are protected. You were speculating three years ago that the value of the 40,000 claims could be more than one billion dollars. And now that list is expanded to 44,000 and there are three new land claims being lodged every day on average. What could the value be now? Well, look, look, that's based on the assumption that every single one of those claims is a factor completely that it's going to be processed and granted. That's not the case. Do we know roughly what the percentage is of those that are accepted versus those that are rejected? There's that that's varied over time. Over the last, over the our term of administration, we've processed. We've been quite proficient in processing claims and we've done a

6:15minister. How can you say that you guys have been processing claims? Because three years ago, let me just play this for you. This is the boss of the local metropolitan Aboriginal Land Council Nathan Moran in this studio in the seat you're sitting in in 2023 and he told us how many land claims are waiting to be determined. Yes, so we're in excess of about two and a half thousand closer to three. That's under term and claims, total claims. Two and a half to three thousand. That's just your group. Yes. What about across all groups? It's broken to near 40,000 claims across New South Wales are under term and have not been assessed and sitting files. There are 40,000 Aboriginal land claims at the moment in New South Wales. Yes, I'm glad we have this discussion, Ben. So why have you allowed the 40,000 claims to grow to 44? Well, as I said, Ben, it's a moving first. It's been, you know, there's claims processed. Then there's new claims that come on board and it is easy. It is easy to lodge a land claim. So, but it, as I also said, it's not a

7:17a complete, but that's an ideal system having 44,000 unresolved anything. Regardless of what it is, I mean, surely government needs to work smarter and better and smoother than that. The end of the day, if the crown facility, if the crown land site has been operated and been used, it's safe. It shouldn't, it, you know, it wouldn't bring about a successful land claim. And if it's been, the only problem has been, have been those glitches that we're looking to address. That's why we're bringing it forward. Why haven't they been rejected? If they're sitting there and they're not worthy, why don't you just reject them instead of them sitting there gathering dust on your desk? Well, to reject, to process a claim, takes months and months and work. So, you know, that process, we're stepping up, we're staffing, we're starting to handle this stuff. And this has been going on for 43 years and we're processing claims as they come in. But we're also, we're identifying where there is potential, there is potential because of those,

8:23you know, certain legal outcomes in the past where a precedent has been set, which could potentially, could potentially bring about the loss of a particular site based on that prison. We're looking to tidy that up. We're looking to validate those, those, those, those leases or those land management arrangements that, that at risk based on those prisons by validating them through this legislation. That's why we've brought it to the house, Ben, so we can actually get on top of that. We're joining the studio by Steve Kampa. He's talking to us right now, the Minister for Lands and Property in New South Wales. So I'm just trying to work out, is the long-term objective here to clear the backlog or are you going to be sitting in this studio in a few years, if I'm still here and you're still here, and we're going to be saying okay, it's now 50,000, 52,000 unresolved claims. No, look, Ben, I think it's important to appreciate that land claims are basically that they're not, they're not, as I said, I've got all, it's not a fight against police. Let me go

9:24back to the question. Is the long-term objective just to leave them there unresolved and to have 50,000, 60,000 or is there a plan to clear that backlog? That's the question. There is definitely a plan to clear the backlog, but we needed to clear, clear these technical issues so we can make sure that when we, when we actually process a land claim that, you know, it's, all right, let me ask you this, let me ask you this because I'm trying to get my head around it, I think most people are as well. So when you reject a land claim, does that then make it easier for the land council to have success? In other words, is it safer from the state of New South Wales point of view to leave them there unresolved until you sort out this loophole issue? The loophole, look, it's important that we tidy up these small indiscretions because once it goes to a bill, then it's exposed to been transferred through that through those proceedings. So we need to make sure that these really valuable

10:26important community assets. Why can't we say to the Aboriginal land councils, keep your hands off surf clubs? Why can't we just say that to them and say, please stop putting in applications on surf clubs because they're not going to be granted? Yeah, look and look my discusses, I've spent three months consulting with the land council communities and, you know, there's been some difficult conversations within that, but overwhelmingly, the Aboriginal communities don't want to see very important community assets shut down, so to speak. So I think it's, you know, I think there are, you know, you're really going to look at people, elders like Roy, Roy, I see that came in the other day, and they invited me to orange to have a look at their operation and what they do. All right, just on your legislation, is it going to pass if you've got the numbers you need? Well, I think Kelly's expressed her support. That was great yesterday. I mean, we've had issues

11:32in the outskirts of recently, and we hope to get people want to know now, of course, is it going to pass? Is it going to be resolved? That's the objective. It'll be there on Tuesday, and we're looking to pass it through the house. So if you've got Kelly's support, then you've got the numbers you need? We're confident of that. Yeah. Well, Kelly said she's supporting it, right? And the land councils, are they on board? I'm guessing not. Look, we've, as I said, I've spent three and a half months with the land council. And they've been constructive conversations, very professional right through, and I've appreciated that process, gotten to understand, understand, understand, understand, understand, understand, understand much, much better. And we've made some amendments in the corner with the language in and around the amendment, but I we've got to get this done. It's too important. It's too important to get it right, for our community. It also has it, I guess, that the cost associated with considering all of these claims, processing all of these claims would be sky high, and at the moment we need to be looking at how much we're spending on this issue. I appreciate you coming in. I've got to get to the news,

12:37but let's talk again. Thank you, Ben. Steve Canberr, the NSW Minister of the Lands and Property, and while the Minister won't say this, I'm more than happy to say it, to the land councils out there, can we just be sensible about the locations that we're selecting and putting in claims on? Because if they're being used, you know that that goes against the spirit of the legislation and the act. So keep your hands off land that's being used. Now, Steve Canberr was with us in the studio, the Minister in charge of Aboriginal land claims. It's fair to say based on the feedback on the text line, he has not filled you with confidence. Steve says the Minister has no answers. Phil says, what a complete fast. Brad says he's avoiding your question. Alistair says, I had low confidence before this interview. Now I've got none. Mark Levy's with me. Were you listening to the Steve Canberr interview? I was. Look, I don't need to tell you how to put things on the website, Ben, but I can see the headline, land claim on train wreck. It was terrible.

13:40I really, really like Steve Canberr. He's the Minister for everything these days, but you've got to get on the front foot. You've got to be able to answer some pretty straightforward questions that you put to him. He just sort of stumbled his way through. I think you've also got to send a message to the land council, don't you? Do you say now, listen, can you ease up, please? Take a chill, Phil. You're putting in three of these requests a day. We're not going to be granting them all and stop making claims on land that's being used by community members, including Indigenous community members. Exactly right, Ben. There was an opportunity for the Minister this morning to make that clear to a very, very big audience on your program. And I just think he missed the bite and he missed a real opportunity to send that very clear message to the land council. To listen to the full show, listen live weekdays from 530-9am on 2GB.com. Dave Roberts here, there you are surrounded by fans, sharing wings, sharing drinks, high-fiving random strangers. Everybody remembers the game. Nobody

14:40remembers the guy coughing behind you until a few days later at 2am, you wake up with the fever and your throats on fire. Now what, urgent care, close, ER, slam, telehealth, maybe, but the pharmacy's closed. You needed a medical emergency kit. These aren't first aid kits, they contain essential prescriptions, used for over 30 common conditions, sinus and ear infection, UTI, stomach bug, travelers diarrhea and more. On hand before you need them. Use your doctor-developed guidebook to select the right prescription or call their telemedicine doctor standing by. It's like an urgent care and drugstore at home. When you're sick, traveling or stranded, you'll wish you ordered a medical emergency kit. Order online in minutes and it's shipped to your door and say $45 with my promo code blue at urgentcarekit.com slash blue. That's promo code blue at urgentcarekit.com slash blue.