The Commentators’ View: Cheese ice cream & Champagne on ice

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2:04and around the world, which is relevant. Ali Bruce Ball, because you are back from around the world. Yes, I have been John, I mean, I couldn't quite believe it when I said it out loud on air, but last week's visit to Augusta National Golf Club in Georgia was my 20th visit to the Masters, which is just, I can't believe where that time's gone. And just feel so incredibly lucky to have been to that many Masters tournaments, which is, which is an event, you know, I watched as a kid with my dad growing up and never ever dreamed I would ever get there and now go in their time and time again. But I'm also joining that in that weird, so we're recording this on Friday morning. And you will remember this well from your trips to the Masters. It's that odd thing where I'm sitting here on a Friday doing my prep for Leeds Against Wolves. Knowing that I'm going to be at Elham Road tomorrow, but knowing that seven days before, I was in the peace and quiet and beauty of Amen Corner. And then it's all going to kick off at Elham Road tomorrow.

3:04And I'm going to be updating scores from League 2 and promotion and relegation issues. And they couldn't be further apart those two things. Well, more on all of that in a moment, but we have to say good day to Vicki Sparks, who is joining us from a mystery European location. Vicki Sparks, where are you? Good morning from Rekuvic in Iceland. This is Vicki Sparks here. Oh, we were just working out. Off air, weren't we? My Icelandic surname, which is where you take the father's name and our daughter. So I would be Vicki Kenton's daughter in Iceland. Yeah, and how is it in Iceland? I must say that I think I've only been there once. I went and covered a Scotland match there. And it was one of the favourite ventures that I've been on to go to Iceland. Do you know what? I've been so excited about this trip. I mean, it's a historic one, firstly, for England women. It's going to be their 500th game in their history when they play Iceland on Saturday here in Rekuvic.

4:06But, you know, just on a personal level and a little similarly to you, Ali, thinking about all those times, you've been at Augusta and almost pinching yourself. You know, the fact that as part of my job, I get to come on these trips and visit these wonderful places and see football played in them. You know, we're just looking out of the hotel window here. We're off on the 10th floor, so it's quite high. And there are snow-capped mountains that surround all of Rekuvic. And it's a beautiful country. I've never been. And yeah, just so excited to be here because the landscape is so different to anything that you would experience in England. We've actually seen in the distance these plumes of either steam or smoke shooting up from between two of the snow-capped mountains. And it is the reality of trying to work out, you know, is it a volcano? Is it a geyser? Is it a geothermal plume of a power station that's shooting up? And, you know, you just don't really ask those questions in England, do you? Just on Iceland. And I've never been. I'm very envious, Vicky Edge. That is why I would love to go.

5:07You've been to the farols. Yes, that's true, John. That is true, which is beautiful and remote in its own right. But I've had some fantastic correspondence from our engineer, Phil Zentner, on the Icelandic language, which fits in perfectly with Vicky's trip. And obviously our discussions about language and football commentary. So please remind me when we get to the glossary, I need to read that out. There's some excellent stuff in there, really good. Well, Mr. Ian Dennis is not with us this week. He is also in his travels. He's on assignment, as they say, in American media. He's actually on holidays, taking a few days off. So Ian's not with us this week. And it feels like this is the first one of these that I've done for a while, because I was on a BBC course last week with a view to the World Cup. So I was being, so it's effectively a bit of safety training. But while I was doing that, Vicky, you went with Aston Villa to Belonia and had quite an eventful trip. I understand.

6:07Indeed. And again, it was fantastic to go. Great performance from Villa, which obviously they followed up at Villa Park last night. But what did you eat? What did you eat? Oh, do you know what? This was one of the, as well as Ollie Watkins' performance, getting that race. The highlight of the trip was a meal that Pat and Evelyn and I managed to have, because Belonia, of course, home of the spaghetti bolognese. So we found a restaurant that did this wonderful regu. And I also had, as a starter, cheese ice cream. Either of you ever had cheese ice cream? I don't think I had ever had this sort of foot on cheese ice cream. It was, I think, a gorgon zola, something else, and they served it with this beautiful basket of puffed bread that you could put it on, and there was jam as well. But ahead of all of that, one of these trips where you just feel like if something can go wrong, it's going to go wrong, which started with me for the first time ever, I should say, losing my phone at Heathrow just before I was about to board.

7:10And there was that horrible moment where the gate was called and I've been doing some work and finishing off some notes. And so I gathered everything up, went to the Lou, went to fill up the water bottle, went to the gate, I thought I'd gathered everything up. And when I got to the gate, I realised that I didn't have my phone. And it's that moment of panic where your flight, you know, is about to board. And you think, do I get on a flight to Italy with no phone? We now know, and this is, this is the horror of how horrifying it was that we're so reliant on them because I thought, I don't have an alarm clock, I don't have Google maps, I don't know where my hotel is, unless I can borrow somebody's phone on this plane and an email work and say, I've lost my phone, you're going to need to email me and I'm going to need to try and get on the wifi. So yes, abandoned the phone, luckily somebody had handed it in, so managed to pick it up on the way back. But yes, as the villa fans had to navigate, there was an Italian air strike the day after the game. Did you have your boarding pass on your phone? Do you know what I, I, I am so in many ways and my brother teases me remorciously about this.

8:11I am so anti-technology in many ways, I always print it out because I don't trust. I always print it out because I don't trust. What if my phone runs out of battery? So that, that was the saving grace in terms of being actually able to get on the plane as I'd printed it out. But you know, ran, ran, he threw for 10 minutes and then decided I had to get on the plane. But, but yes, so we had flights cancelled, which we were still trying to sort out 45 minutes before kickoff. And so needed to get back to Heathrow before lost and found close anyway, it was, it was one of these had problems with the lines. Our producer wasn't feeling super well and yes, it was, if you look back on it, I would say the highlights were Ollie Watkins' brace and the cheese ice cream that Pat never and I ate on the lunch before the game. Oh yes, and so Pat and I had to get up at 6am, get a train to Milan and this was again everything that could go wrong potentially would. We got to the train station and thought okay, at least we've managed to re-book, we can get to Milan and of course all the villa fans were having to do this as well and try and get out of Italy by other means before this air traffic control strike

9:15happened. And we got to the station and there was a little message running along the information board in Italian and then translated to English and it said there's been a landslide. So there may be delays on the trains and Pat and I thought oh gosh this is literally going to be the last draw but luckily our train arrived and it was to Milan and via Scotland we managed or I managed to get back to Heathrow and pick up the phone and breathe again. It's incredible isn't it, have sometimes there are trips that are just, as you say, if it's going to go wrong it does go wrong. So anyway you've made it to Iceland which is very good. I have and that was very smooth so good. Thank you for being here. And Ali what was the commentary highlight for you of the Masters? Well you know what John, I'm really glad you asked me that question because it was a slightly unusual one so you know our commentary positions very well on that golf course and actually I think one of the great things about commentating there is you know that a lot of our listeners

10:21know exactly what you're talking about. I mean sometimes they're watching the pictures with the sound down listening to us but people know that golf course so well that actually you probably don't have to work quite as hard in describing what you're seeing because people have already got a picture in their minds but quite often in those commentary positions our view can be limited. I mean for example our grandstand to the left, our position at the 15th green to the left of the 15th green when you commentating on the 16th the 16th is a way in the distance in the shadows and sometimes you know you're struggling to see a little bit with the naked eye and we don't have to tell me about it. So you're guessing a little bit at times and I think our listeners are aware of that but occasionally it just absolutely falls into your lap and on the Friday night when Rory McAroy was hitting the ball all over the place with his driver and his long game what was producing magical recoveries from Hither and Vither. He came up the 17th and I was stationed in the in our commentary position at the 17th which I would argue is probably the quietest spot you can be in for a day's commentary. So you do the players as they come through the last ones

11:24but you're not that busy and suddenly you're busy you know for a very sort of intense period of time but McAroy missed the fairway off the tee, punched out right and then he was chipping directly. I mean I couldn't have been he was at 12 o'clock to me with no spectators nothing in my way and Mark Chapman threw it to me nice and early so I had plenty of time to describe him walking up onto the green surveying the scene describing the shot what I could see, dah dah dah dah all of that and then as he hit the chip as soon as it landed on the green A you could see it was dead online and B it looked really good for pace and so straight away you could say this one's this one's got a chance and you could hear the crowd thinking this one's got a chance and sure enough and given the the round he was having you sort of felt it was going to it was going to go in but it doesn't all as you know it doesn't always fall like that for you in golf commentary but it just couldn't have been more perfect and also it was just such a thrill because it was almost the culmination of that round the story of his round was so up and down

12:28on all over the place but but you know magical short game and that was like that was it in a nutshell so that was my that was my favorite moment of the Masters. I ended up watching it in a pub in London with Connor on the Sunday night so I didn't listen I listened to I listened to Thursday Friday Saturday but I didn't listen on Sunday and if anybody wants to go back and have a listen to what it sounds like you know we always say this on BBC sounds you can do that look for stations and schedules find the date find the time of the program and you can go back and listen to that again which are very much encouraged people to do and I must do that myself and actually we have had a message from David who has got in touch tcv at bbc.co.uk David says I really want to know why John was not at the Masters he loves going to the Masters he's always at the Masters also I lost a bet with my son because of John I had backed him to say Buddha or Bodo at Augusta brackets he mentions Buddha all the time brackets and he let me down by not even being

13:30there I hope the excuse is a good one well David I've not done the last two have I alley because in the in the style of various other people in golf I've stepped away from the Masters because I just reached the point where I found it with wearing glasses and not contact lenses it I mean it is incredibly as alley is indicated there it is very very difficult because you're either commentating on things that are near to you or a far away from you and I just found the the juggle of wearing glasses using binoculars and using the microphone was just too difficult I completely agree John I mean I wear glasses as well and I've tried because I know you will always take glasses and kind of use them to look at you know warm-ups and stuff particularly if we're high up in in a stadium and I I find it too hard to adjust them and and actually look through the glasses but would you never consider commentating in contact lenses then because I do wear them but I find it to well there's something about glasses I think it keeps me a bit of a benefit when you reach

14:32a certain age you then struggle to see close up and and I tried for quite a while to get contact lenses that I could use as sort of very focus I just couldn't get away with them and so I had to rely on my glasses we have particularly felt for you over the last couple of years because having covered so many for macaroni then to go back to back on the first two that you don't attend it was you know our hearts went out to you because I think but I mean this year this year was with special but I don't think you know last year was it was incredible that that's one of the greatest sporting events that was one of the yeah I agree I think that is one of the greatest sporting events of my time watching sport that masters of 2025 talking about another item about your person so not your glasses or your contact lenses or your binoculars but Rashid in Kuhln or Klohn Germany says high TCV off the back of you talking about John being photographed wearing his so-called shabby shoes while speaking to Thomas Tuchel I'm wondering if any of you spotted

15:36the antithesis sported by hair Chapman during the recent FA Cup TV coverage I've attached photographic evidence so this is the first time I've actually seen these shoes and they are what are they are they cherry red or are they a sort of really rich sort of leathery brand they're incredibly shiny they're a sort of they're an ankle boot I would describe them as quite high fashion Rashid says I suggest all BBC Radio 5 live commentators consider an upgrade to a pair of these bobby dazzlers ahead of the world cup this summer and Rashid's use of the term bobby dazzler I've really enjoyed there because that's something my dad would say we bobby dazzler love a bobby dazzler very well that I'm afraid Rashid is the difference between radio and television one other one very quickly on my dad and going back to Vicki's experiences in Bologna he puts peas in his spag bowl my dad I grew up whenever we had spaghetti bowling eggs I was going to say I'm not

16:36controversial I know I know and not not cooked in the sauce so they are they are they are prepared separately and then sprinkled on top these little juicy green bullets which sort of freshen up the spag bowl and I don't eat it like that now but as a child my spag bowl would would I mean I could have said no thank you but this is a very big weekend of football commentaries on five live so shall we run through what we've got and as you've mentioned already Ali big game for Leeds United for the three o'clock commentary on Saturday yes so leads home to walls after that brilliant win at old Trafford on Monday and I think the general feeling is I was speaking to a couple of Leeds fans yesterday if we can beat walls you know at home this weekend then I think we're going to be okay you're going to love this one John I saw on the BBC sport website this morning the opta super no don't don't now you're going to love that you're going to love this one

17:37it gives wolves a one hundred city it gives wolves a one hundred percent chance of being relegated so even though mathematically they're not down yet they might as well not turn up because the computer says it's over a hundred percent is done last week or last week or a couple of weeks ago the super computer was giving Arsenal a 90-odd percent chance of winning the league now it's about 80-odd percent chance so what the saying is that they were wrong it was wrong when it said it was a 90-odd percent chance they know the saying it's not a 90-odd percent chance yeah because it doesn't not cause that and what caused that well who would have thought it results results changed it is the biggest waste of time ever people look can I just say I'm not a fan of the super computer I cannot believe we're talking about it I hate giving it airtime and oxygen but that's how

18:38percentages work isn't it now the Arsenal have had some badges like they're now okay if you were leaving it we're not talking about it so anyway Ali your lead wolves three o'clock sat at the afternoon also a big game for Newcastle which is also a commentary on sports extra new castle against Bournemouth given recent events for Newcastle United and of course Bournemouth they'll be then playing for the first time since Irola announced that he's going to be leaving at the end of the season as well so that's a big one that's sports extra for that on BBC sounds that's where you'll find sports extra on your digital radio then also Tottenham Brighton 530 Ailey Barber and Andy Reed are going to be commentating on that that's on five live I mean there are some big games around this weekend there aren't too many bigger than that are there no I mean everyone four spurs I mean you know Brighton are obviously playing for their own goals this season and looking up you know higher at the table but every single game four spurs obviously

19:44we had commentary on the Sunderland game last weekend and I managed to tune into that away in a gustor and and they lost that one and second half in particular didn't create very much I mean the pressure on every single game for spurs now because well John what were you saying to not I'm not going Premier League history here I'm going you know I thought you could ask me a percentage chance there from it super computer top flight in terms of a relegation were spurs to go down what what what would be the it would be the biggest since dot dot dot what what would you say on that would be when Manchester United were relegated in the early seventies and I mean spurs helping relegated since then spurs were relegated in late seventies but I think probably that Manchester United relegation from the early seventies I think particularly at this stage of the season where as a commentator where there are so many narratives and because of where spurs are on of course deserving facing Brighton again his former club it just adds another little strand to that but because Tottenham are in the position that they're in any result any performance anything

20:47that happens on that pitch is a story and I don't know about YouTube but I love this stage of the season and of course Tottenham fans it's agonising for them but I think our job as storytellers and as commentators to reflect the narrative that's probably the thing that I enjoy most about commentary at this stage of a league season it's so different to the start where you're relying on the game itself to kind of give you that story and give you that narrative right now we've got everything set up for us and and anything can happen it will it will be fascinating with Godless of what it is so at the same time Vicki as Tottenham Brighton is being played you will be contacting in far away right Reykjavik I will I will again and another huge narrative in so many ways for England women as I mentioned earlier it is their 500th game in their history which in and of itself I think it's is such a moment for for those of us who love football and love women's football just to reflect on how far the women's game has come and I'm going to be

21:49interviewing Serena Vigman in in a couple of hours here in Reykjavik at the the matchday minus one press conference and was just going back through her story because I think everybody who's been involved in women's football has their tail particularly those who who started playing you know 10 20 30 years ago of how women at at many times have had to really fight to be able to play football and Serena Vigman spoken in the past that when she began playing football as a young six year old girl in the Netherlands you couldn't play if you were a girl so she pretended she was a boy she had short hair and she just went along and and nobody questioned whether she was a boy and she let everybody assume that she was and you know so I think I'm fascinated to to hear for her you know what this moment because she now is so intertwined with with England women's football history what this moment means for her and how you know she reflects on on her journey and the journey of the the player she's played with the players that she now coaches and yeah so I think that there is a lot of emotion around it as well in terms of the World Cup qualifying

22:55campaign it's huge because England beats Spain the reigning world champions at Wembley in front of a crowd of over 60,000 which again is just another reflection of how far women's football has come and if they can now win this game against Iceland who they've already beaten in this qualifying campaign back in in Nottingham last month they're three points clear currently of Spain at the top of the group if they can win this and we presume that Spain will beat Ukraine in their match this weekend that they're overwhelming favorites for that but only one team qualifies automatically for the women's World Cup in Brazil in these qualifying groups so either Spain the reigning world champions or England the reigning European champions are going to have to go through the playoffs so they've still got to go to Spain in June but having won at Wembley it is so important that they they get the job done against Iceland again in which they are big favorites they maintain what we think will be that three-point gap presuming that Spain beat Ukraine and then it all comes down to that trip to Mallorca in June. So it can be heard on sports extra

23:59530 Saturday when you will have the great Rachel Brown finish alongside you she and issue with you in Reykjavik already is she keeping you right she is arriving today she is arriving today so yeah cannot wait to see her and then on Sunday all of the Premier League games you will be able to hear radio commentary on various platforms and there is Everton Liverpool at two o'clock on five live with Mike Mine and Pat Nevin at the same time Aston Villa against Sunderland on sports extra and Nottingham Forest against Burnley is on sports extra two on BBC sounds and then at 430 the small matter of Manchester City against Arsenal when Rob Green will be with me again for a second consecutive Sunday Rob Green will be my summariser and Manchester City Arsenal I see that on the Wayne Rooney show Ali Wayne Rooney himself says City will have the edge

25:04psychologically they know how to win the title and have a manager who knows how to do it they will be able to stay a little calmer than the Arsenal players says Wayne Rooney yeah well they they've obviously won the title plenty of times in recent years and Arsenal keep coming runners up don't they and Manchester City won the league up final as well I mean Chris Sutton on the FPL podcast from BBC Sport says it's going to be Neil Nill but even that John if it was Neil Nill will bring its own tension and drama what what have you started your notes John in terms of what as anything is there anything particularly your obviously you know the players inside out the stories inside of anything particularly sort of there's caught your attention I have reached this day Charlie if you can see that that's a blank piece of paper John yeah I've got I've got all my I've got my grid drawn up with all of the places for the players to go in but as we speak now I've still got two days to prepare for that yes you do yeah can I throw a started and I need to I need to clear this with John first because it's not the Optus super computer but it

26:08is Optus are we allowed to use just general Optus stats as long as it's not the super computer generating a percentage it depends it depends if this is a premier league only that proceed with okay well it's a Guadiala Rteta stat that I thought was quite interesting I'll tell you what I'll throw it out there the statistics show according to Optus not the super computer that April is Guadiala's most fruitful month and Rteta's worst a 44% win percentage for Rteta in April and I think it's interesting isn't it because of course we know that Arsenal have you know capitulated in these sort of situations and so much is made of mentality but actually to see backs up in terms of actually when that happens it's just the worst timing isn't it for Arsenal and I think those mentality questions they are never going to get away from it until they they finally see it out but I I'd love your opinion on this John and Ali how brave our arsenal going to be in terms of getting the result and what result do they feel they're going to need to get going

27:09into this game well the John Murray computer can tell you that up to the point where they lost to Manchester United in January so you know they've lost only three matches all season at that point lost to Liverpool away back in August they won the next match three Nell against Nottingham Forest next defeat was against Aston Villa two on away next match after that they won three Nell away against Club Bruges their next defeat was at home to Manchester United the next match they won against Kyrat and the Champions League so they bounced immediately back with good wins after those first three defeats and and up until the Carabout Cup final those were their only defeats so it's after that defeat and we'd asked on the day will that have a psychological effect it's after that that they have really faulted and stumbled but they've also had the injuries that they have to cope with and as we speak now we don't know how many of those injured players are going to be available for for Sunday and that's significant I think that Julian Timber has been a

28:14huge miss at right back is he going to be fit is Sakka going to be fit is Sakka going to be back to somewhere near his best older guard as well as another one Calafiori has also been out and of course any team that you know wherever you play it has to cope with injuries and the thing I would say and it is true and I've seen that about the way that our tetas Arsenal have fallen off in the last three seasons you know that that is a fact that is there we know that but this is the biggest and deepest squad that Arsenal have had and that's the question now for Arsenal is are you capable now after the little run that they've had are they capable of coming again that's that's the question and there's there's different ways of showing that bravery isn't there Vicki because unless Michaela Teta really surprises us I mean I think I think people would associate that with let's get on the front foot and take it to Manchester City there's no chance I don't think that Arsenal will do that because the draw suits them better than Manchester City and actually almost

29:16being the underdogs in the game even though they're top of the table given recent form and they're away from home kind of suits them in a way and their main strength this season has been their defensive solidity so I think we're going to see from Arsenal what we've seen in a lot of the big games under Michaela Teta is the more cautious approach and trying to strike on the break Manchester City have got to come out Arsenal which could offer opportunities can they take those opportunities can it deliver something special can Yoko res do something special in a big game or Madaway if Saka doesn't start I think I think that might be the question I I can see a ending a draw I think maybe a nil nil or a one one but you know we'll see and the other thing as well is I'm interested to see what the City approach is they've had the week off Pep Guardiola said at Stanford Bridge last Sunday said it over and over again we've got the week off we've got the whole week to prepare I'll be I'll be setting back well Arsenal playing in the Champions League will they

30:17feel that right from the outset this is a point where they try and unleash hell on Arsenal and and get this game won and and try and really capitalize on what might be some Arsenal vulnerabilities it's I can't wait for it so anyway five five four thirty Sunday afternoon is the place to listen to it with us on the radio five lights folks so here's the first ball of it soon all the cricket a ball by ball coverage of the biggest competitions on the domestic and international circuits it's a ball cricket and it's the huge one cricket on five life sport listen on BBC sounds

31:19the commentators view on the football daily listen on BBC sounds unintended pulled names we've got a couple of unintended pulled names from sports commentary last time we had the leaping bassi and it's surely bassi karaoke nights we also had the horrible little fly the bothered Paul Robinson and Ian Dennis during a commentary we've got a great film name coming up but let's first have this unintended pulled name from Peter in Stark's borough vermont in the United States while watching Arsenal lose to Bournemouth the commentator Peter Durery described as the match was winding down how the Emirates was and I now quote bathed in sunshine and pain indeed sunshine and pain would be a dandy name for a pub providing both kinds of emotional nourishment depending on a customer's mood dandy name yeah like it the sunshine and pain yeah to get short no wouldn't it locals would just say I'm off down the sunshine they wouldn't use

32:21the full title would they I think or the sun and pain yeah that's true yeah um now then this one is quite a lengthy read it's beautifully written so I will endeavor to do my very best with this this is from history Mike in Sydney he says hello tcv after listening to the champions league debrief podcast on the football daily I was inspired by Ian Dennis's report to write a script summary for an unintended film that penalty was not awarded but before that Gravenburg had a rising whistling drive off target Gomez has seen his head at the rising whistling drive would feature John Murray and Ian Dennis driving back to London after commentating on Liverpool's lost to PSG when they divert it from the motorway to a quiet country road strangely the road is straight and rises slightly with each passing mile after about 10 minutes and a passionate discussion about the rules of clash of the commentators both spy a ghostly figure standing in the middle of the road unsettlingly the figure suggests the shape of Alistair Bruce Ball John jumps on the break and beckons Ian to investigate suppressing his

33:27fear Ian emerges from the car and takes a few hesitant steps towards the ghostly Bruce Ball as he moves closer all he can hear is a whistled version of Una Paloma Flanker but in the minor key Ian is transfixed by the song and loses all sense of reality John sensing something is wrong quickly exits and brings Ian back to the relative safety of the car John hits the accelerator maneuvers around Bruce Ball and speeds down the road but Bruce Ball rises into the air and pursues the car with menacing intent Ian who by now has regained his sense he says there is only one person we can call John gives a knowing smile and replies yes hair Chapman and his supersonic helicopter Ian makes the call and hair Chapman who always tracks his colleagues by their phone signal is soon in the air and approaching the car he sees the ghostly Bruce Ball pursuing the car and expertly lands upon him trapping Bruce Ball beneath the struts Ian and John abandon the

34:31car and scramble into the helicopter as they fly to safety hair Chapman quips I told you that song would bring you doom that is out there Mike thank you history Mike for your imagination your flight wow fancy yes so if you spot an unintended pub or film name in any sports commentary it doesn't have to be us any sports commentary do let us know tcv at bbc.co.uk whatsapps to 08289369 and further correspondence here from Mike in Salt Lake City very much enjoyed deno's commentary Brentford versus Everton and thought he opened up a whole new fertile seam of wordplay around nicknames for football clubs I loved his Brentford risking coming unstuck at the hands of the toffee's is this is this something we could develop and could for example we say that the gunners have been pipped by the cherries thanks very much

35:32Mike sounds like he's actually walking on the salt flats there didn't he yeah yeah or crunch underfoot sweeping up leaves yeah um stung by the bees or stung by the hornets is definitely one of those isn't it yeah yeah I see that I think I did one the other day bright and we're at sundlands oh do you know what it was there was there was actually a real seagull in the flesh all the feathers other swooping around the stadium of light just as bright and we're preparing to take a corner and I think I I can't remember what I said and it's always that in in your mind you're like is this string into Alan portrait territory or not but something about the seagull swooping around the stadium of light and the seagulls will look to pounce from this corner and then I think they did actually score from that corner so they made it into the edit and at that point you're like well it's gone now let's hope it let's hope I actually find it funny when I watch it back as it sounded in my head at the time when I was saying it I think we might have strayed into Alan portrait territory with history might actually but also produce a naith and

36:33a suggested mold by the tigers is a popular one in the championship with horse city which is a very good one and we did get this from robin kawin on match of the day Tiago sauce at home the perfect start the bees applying an early sing in this match up for Europe that's exactly what I was saying yeah great sound effects there with the ball hitting the net that's a real match of it that's a real TV sound effect isn't it yeah so anyway unintended tub names always welcome we've got the glossary to come but first clash of the commentators yes here we go clash of the commentators here is how it works two of us take turns to answer a question and give as many correct answers as we can in 30 seconds now last week might might a beat Connor McNamara in an exhibition match but this week we are going to make a long awaited return to league action it is John versus Ali

37:36John is on a two match winning streak which has lifted him off the bottom of the table so who wants to go first by the way I must mention at this juncture Jacob Steinberg of the guardian you will both know Jacob tells me that he listens to the commentators view with his seven-year-old son razil and I say seven because he has turned seven this week and razil enjoys clash of the commentators so a specific dedication to razil happy birthday was he was going for it yeah who's up John who's up who's up well how do you like going do you want to go first or second okay I'll go first yeah I'll go first yes please thank you okay so John is going to disconnect headphones are off so we are ready to go so here we go Ali after beating Real Madrid to reach the Champions League semifinals by and manager Vincent Cumpoli said this in his post match press conference where does

38:38this sit in terms of nights in your managerial career I remember we beat Blackburn twice in Burnley for nobody in this room you will actually want to compare it with the game today but it was amazing it was like something I was like I've experienced so much as a player and this was incredible Vincent Company comparing beating Real Madrid in the Champions League to beating Blackburn in the championship so this one will test you I want you to name any player to feature in the Burnley Blackburn Games in the 22 23 season when Vincent Company's Burnley did the double over their Lancashire rivals Blackburn Burnley players from the East Lancashire Darby's 22 23 Ali your time starts now I mean that is a shocker James Trafford maybe in Goal who was

39:39Muric in Goary Muric Ashley Barnes Daro Shae can't think of the Blackburn players who else from that Burnley team that came up under company playmakers in that team I'm not going to get anywhere here no honestly my mind is complete but on jet lag I've got no chance with that one no chance I've got to say that is a stinker of a question so that is Ali's efforts John headphones back on the Jack is plugged in John I sensed to to John Marie can you yes I ask I can hear you and actually I was just looking at the top of the leaderboard or the leaderboard and I was thinking this is quite an important one because if I win this and then also win the appeal to the court of arbitration for sport that would take me to that would actually take me to eight and Ian back to nine so this

40:42is actually pivotal in this season's clash of the commentator pending they as we said when it comes to this stage of the campaign the storylines the narratives I wonder if you know is this two-metre to have commentary on the clash of the commentators maybe that's something we should look into okay so John are you ready I am ready John we're going to hear something that Vincent Company said after his buying side knocked Real Madrid out of the Champions League this week where does this sit in terms of nights in your managerial career I remember we beat Blackburn twice in Burnley for nobody in this room you will actually want to compare it with the game today but it was amazing it was like something I was like I've experienced so much as a player and this was incredible yeah so there we go beating Real Madrid in the Champions League is up there with beating Blackburn in the championship for Vincent Company so John I want you to name any player to feature in the Burnley Blackburn games in the 2022-23 season when Vincent Company's Burnley

41:50did the double over their Lancashire rivals Blackburn Burnley players in your face is just the same as Ali as well so I read it Blackburn Burnley players from the East Lancashire Darby's 22-23 your time starts now crikey is that James Trafford's time or is he not there at the time anyway James Trafford a stave who would be in that field crikey I'm really going to struggle with this Cullen um what about Blackburn Barrett and Diaz 22-23 oh god I'm not going to lie John that was pretty similar to Ali's reaction and agony how do we feel we did how confident are we feeling badly yeah terribly well I can reveal that in this crucial game as as John has has rightly said at this

42:56stage of the season it's a draw two two you both yeah a low scoring thriller so Ali you're interestingly you both started with James Trafford who is actually incorrect but Ali you then got Murich yeah and Barnes was the other one for you and John a late equalizer with Breratin Diaz pulled that one out of the bag and Cullen was the other correct one that you got that's tough though I mean I was trying to think of the Burnley team that came up and then you know must have commented on them but yeah but then I think the changed everyone didn't they the changed that's right the whole street yeah that is difficult anyway well I'll tell you I'll tell you John what happens now is that we have our hastily added to our document tiebreaker our mics at the ready our headphones on our headphone jacks plugged in the first one to shout out the correct

43:58answer to this tiebreaker wins who was the black burn manager for those garbage Johnny Maurey asking a shout incorrect no oh poor Lambert no in correct 2223 black burn manager black burn oh no Oh John Dahle Thomas and Yes the wing goes to Ali Busebell that was terrible that's that's a win way you feel slightly dirty afterwards John I don't know what take take it taking it back to the Arsenal sporting Lisbon conversation sometimes Ali at this stage of the season when you're jet lagged and it's the big build up to the end of the campaign you've just got to find to wait a win and that's exactly what you've done with the 95th minute extra time header at the far post. Just as early as you didn't ask us who is in goal for Blackburn, Thomas Kaminsky. Do you know the one that I did think before I saw this this and it might be because I am in Iceland for Burnley, Johan

45:01Bergmanson. Oh yeah. I've done quite a lot of Burnley over the years so it's thinking of the ones that have been there for a while. So Jay Rodriguez, Connor Roberts, Jack Cork as well, Josh Brownhill. Brownhill, yeah. Yeah, Charlie Taylor, Ian Matson as well. Was there at the time and then Blackburn as you said, Johan, you've got Thomas Kaminsky, Lewis Travis, Bradley Dac, John Buckley, Tyler Morton, Sam Gallagher, Ainsley Pairs, Hayden Carter, Adam Morton, Sammy Smodex. Yeah, so. I think that is one of the toughest yeah, I'd agree with you. And I would say let's move on from that one and consign it to history. Before we do the glossary, Reese in East London, writes in first, I wanted to say thank you so much for reading out my unintended pub name two episodes ago. The pod went out the day before my birthday and I still don't think I've stopped smiling. I was even more delighted when one

46:02episode later, a fellow Reese from London, a different one left a voice message. I chuckled as my imagination pictured an entire football league's worth of Reese wandering around London, listening to TCV. It got me wondering what commentators do when two players have genuinely identical names in sport, both first and last name. And what is the etiquette for that? Is it something you've ever experienced in your career from Reese in East London, strangely enough, last week in Lisbon, when I was commentating on Ruey Silver, I did say during the commentary, I feel like I've commentated on 25 different Ruey Silver's over the years. And it's that it's that thing with Portuguese names and Spanish names. And sometimes I think Barcelona and Real Madrid are teams that churn out players with very similar names. And you think I've seen him before or not. And of course, I commentated on Louis Suarez as well, the sporting Louis Suarez. That's it isn't you get to a squad and without

47:03looking at the details, you see a name and you think that can't that can't be the Fabinho from Liverpool. That must be another Fabinho. And then it does turn out to be another. I'm looking at my walls notes for the weekend. This is slightly different because they've all got different first names, but they've got Schwau Gomez, Rodrigo Gomez, Totti Gomez, and then signed Agile Gomez as well. So you have to use the first name every single time with the Gomez, but they've also got the Buenos as well. They've got the point. Oh, brothers. Yeah. Winning off brothers. So I've had a couple. There are two Sam Curs in women's football. There is the Sam Curs who plays for Chelsea, the Australia captain, the leading scorer and then Sam Curs, the Scottish midfielder as well. So sometimes you have to be very careful about making sure you're being clear about which one you're you're commentating on. But also, I think the most challenging one I've had is I have actually come across identical twins, Sarah and Karen Hongard. And of course, we've had this in the past as well. Haven't we at Manchester United with Fabio and Raphael as well? But when you're

48:06when you're commentating on identical twins, just getting that in your head, even though the names are different, the fact that obviously they look exactly the same is it's rather challenging as a commentator. Remember one of those young Manchester United twins married very young to a woman called Barbara for some reason that stuck in my mind. Let us move on to the great glossary of football commentary before we go. This is where we add commentary terms and phrases to our collection. And you can find our entire glossary in the episode description on BBC Sound. So we put football exclusive terms into division one. And for terms used in football commentary, but also used in other sports, they go into division two. Last week, we did not put anything new into division one, but we did put pile driver on the beach and sent into raptures all into division two. However, Joe in Seattle says, I must cripple with demoting the term pile driver. Yes, it is used in professional

49:10wrestling, but that is not a sport says Joe. It is theatre, good theatre, but not a sport says Joe. Therefore, I request a re promotion for pile driver. We can't allow terms to be demoted because they are found in a theatre production can we? Also, we've already suffered the injustices to John Murray in clash of the commentators, well said, Joe. So let's adjust this error to pile driver. And Ben who's a villa supporter, John gets in touch on a similar theme and says a pile driver is not a permissible move in the sport of Olympic wrestling and is not used in the commentary for those sports. So obviously that distinction between Olympic wrestling and the WWE, WWE as we knew it before, a pile driver is permissible in the entertainment that is WWE says Ben. As such, pile driver should correctly be replaced in division one, not division two, I rest my case.

50:13Ben, so I mean, that is a topsy-turvy ride for pile driver, isn't it? It is. I think we should wait for further correspondence on that. Okay. I would agree. I think the case is strong. Yeah, I think the case is strong. But I'm happy to be outvoted. But can a boxer hit you with a pile driver? A pile driver, yeah. I would have said yes. Yeah. That's a pile driver. Okay, so more deliberations required. For the moment, it's got an asterisk against its entry, I would say. We also left needing snookers for listener verdict. Ash says, love the show. Needing snookers is surely when your destiny is out of your own hands. For example, you rely on another team losing to escape relegation. Chris from Brentford says, surely wolves are the perfect example of a team needing snookers, not according to opto, they're not yet relegated. And they're all points still available.

51:13So has Ash got it right there? Is it did one or did two? Well, it's obvious that it should be in division one, isn't it? Well, it can't be, can it? Because if we're using it football, it's snooker. Yeah, so it's a div two, isn't it? Well, I think so. I love needing snookers because people understand exactly what you mean. Well, not everyone does, but most people will like. I was just going to say, so he's not the biggest snooker. I don't know if I could wangle that into a football commentary. All right. Okay. But maybe that's, maybe that's just me. Um, this from Paddy in Indonesia, these are new suggestions, a term which we added a long-term goal, but haven't yet sorted into either division one or division two. I think it's fair to say that Iliman and Jai's goal versus Chelsea was postage stamp stuff. This was said by Skysports commentator Seb Hutchinson at the time. This refers to when the ball is perfectly placed into the top right hand corner with the goalkeeper having absolutely no chance of saving it. Also, John, I'd highly recommend visiting Barley because you'll see lots of palm trees.

52:21I bet, I bet I would. What a good suggestion that is. Yeah. I saw a lot of palm trees in Lisbon actually. The top, the top right thing's interesting, isn't it? Because stamp on a letter goes top right. So are we now drawing a distinction between a goal that goes in the top left? Well, it can't be postage stamp. No, exactly. It's not division one postage stamp. Probably is, isn't it? Uh, yes. Yeah. Uh, this applies well to Manchester City and Arsenal, and it's from Millwall fan Kerry in Bromley. By the suggestion for the great glossary, which I believe would be a solid division two entry, as I'm sure it's likely to be used in other sports, points on the board. It's a term that increases in relevance and use at this stage of the season. It does, of course, also re-ignite the age-old debate, as to whether it's better to have points on the board as opposed to games in hand. Thank you very much, Terry. Yes, I think division two for that, isn't it? Yeah, I like that. Yeah, that's very much a cricket one for me. I know points and runs are different things,

53:22but it's that thing, isn't it, about being in that position, runs on the board, sets the pressure. So I think, yeah, I think Div two, John. John, do the next one. Yeah, how about this from James in Taunton? Hi, TCV team. I was surprised that no new entry to division one was made in the last broadcast. The following north was listening. I had a brainwave. Please suggest a phrase, taking it to the corner flag, be added to division one. Perhaps scene for 18 Augusta Masters Gold flags can inspire this idea. I know it's quite a literal thing to say, taking it to the corner flag, but for those who are listening to the commentary, this phrase pretty much sums up how one team are clearly trying to protect their lead. You can almost guess what the score is from hearing that one player is taking it to the corner flag. I guess I said that myself this week about Arsenal. That's probably division one, isn't it, Vicki? Yeah. Well, the only thing I would say any touches on it there, it is quite literal. So, would you ever use that as a phrase, unless they were actually taking it to the corner flag?

54:24So, is it more descriptive rather than? It is fitting for a glossary. Would you say, okay? I'm loving so. And we've got one more from Chester Fan Dan. I've only recently discovered your podcast. I've been catching up from the start and I've loved it all, obviously, apart from the two outrages, not Canton Argate from last season, and then the travesty of each month's consume gate this season. Anyway, I love the glossary you've been building. It was great to hear leaping like a salmon this weekend in the Sunderland game, and then a midships in the Chelsea game. I felt moved to submit a voice note thingy to suggest a phrase that I've only ever heard in football commentary. The phrase is, we were right behind that. I love this phrase because it makes the listener feel they're right at the ground. This is the beauty of radio commentary, I think. You can really picture the ball going from somewhere out wide up to where the owl sleeps. Keep up the great work, and thanks very much. I think you were Dan for catching up, and I think already on this particular episode,

55:26we have demonstrated that right behind it, Ali, because you said that about Rory McElroy's point. That's the perfect bookend to the podcast. Perfect bookend to the podcast, and Phil, our engineer, has been sitting there patiently in Reykjavik. I must include this at the end of the glossary. Now, this is not looking for terms to go into Division 1 and Division 2, but Phil is a supremely talented linguist, and loves all things to do with language, and I think has been, his interest has been perked by being over in Iceland. So he sent me a message, and he says it seems the Icelandic language has changed little in a thousand years. In fact, they actively discourage the adoption of new words. They just combine words that already exist and then bolt them together to form compounds, or they recycle old words that have fallen out of use and they repurpose them. So in Iceland, an idea is a mind picture. Psychology is soul study. The telephone is the long thread. So we'll be joining you on the long thread.

56:29But Phil's favourite, he says, and I absolutely love this. A computer, possibly the optosupercomputer, John, is known in Iceland as a number-profitess. That is excellent. Well done, Phil. And Vicki, I expect to hear some of those in the commentary on SportsExtra from... I will do my very best. So let us summarise. Oh, one more, I must mention it. I've heard this virtually every day at the moment, and it needs to go into the glossary. The champagne is on ice. We're all the time, and it's a division, it's a division, but that desperately needs to do it in the glossary. So summary for the glossary this week, we have Pyle Driver, which we are leaving in division two for the time being, asterisk, needing Snookers, division two, points on the board, division two. We were right behind that, division two.

57:30Champagne on ice is going into division two, postage stamp division one, and taking it to the corner flag, division one. Three, and that is it for this episode of the football daily. Do keep the unintended tub names and glossary suggestions coming in, tcv at bbc.co.uk, or you can send us a message or voice note on WhatsApp to 08000-289-369, tell a member of the family, a friend, about the commentator's view, who might not listen. I was in the library this week, and a volunteer in there was telling me that he listens to our commentaries, with his 13-year-old grandson, so well done to him. And remember, you can find each and every episode of the commentator's view by scrolling down your football daily feed. We've got the same pen, isn't that fascinating?

58:32Now, have you got a yellowy bake or an old school? Orangey, yeah. Orangey, yeah, I've got three oranges and one. Yeah, and some trinkaus moustache, I meant to mention that. Oh, yeah, moustache. I'm Rich Hall, and this is Sports Strangest Crimes Presents Confessions of a Super Bowl Strieker. When people ask me what I do, I say to them, well, by day or by night? The story of one man's mission to conquer the holy grail of Strieking, the Super Bowl. Mark troubles us too largely for this body. He's just like the entertainer. Mark pushes the boundaries of what is socially acceptable. No chance, Texas. It's really strict, but then the moral follows about here. What do you want to find on? What are you about? Sports Strangest Crimes presents Confessions of a Super Bowl Strieker. Listen on BBC Sounds.