"That oath appears to have been pushed aside"

0:00Hey everybody, it's Rachel Maddo here. I wanted to tell you that more than a dozen of us from MSNOW are going to be in Texas on Saturday, September 26th. I'm going to be there, Lauren Soudon will be there, so we'll Jen Socky. A whole bunch of us are all going to be there in Texas. Tickets started just over 30 bucks each, and if you buy a ticket, you will get access to our new MSNOW membership free for a year. Tickets for Texas are on sale now. You can learn more at ms.nail slash together. Hope to see you in Texas. Hi everyone, it's 4 o'clock in New York. I am so happy to be back with you. The oath of office is a hallowed affirmation taken by just about anyone who serves in public life, elected leaders, judges, members of law enforcement, a lot of staffers in places like the White House, and of course, the men and women at every level of the United States military.

1:01The oath that we take, that people take, is about to put our country and our constitution above everything else. It's a promise to serve that larger purpose and not the wishes or whims of a single man. That oath appears to have been sacrificed and pushed aside by the man who currently leads the US military, as he is hellbent on reshaping the institution in his image and Donald Trump's secretary of defense Pete Higgseth in his 19th month on the job has overseen a massive purge of high ranking military officials. It's a purge that the New York Times reports, quote, does not appear to be driven by job performers, but rather is part of a broader effort by the defense secretary to fashion a force, particularly at senior levels that is aligned with his political and ideological views. And that's according to military officials. The Times reporting comes along with news about the sheer magnitude of Higgseth personnel turmoil inside the military.

2:02Quote, Higgseth has fired or blocked the promotions of more than 80 generals and admirals, a purge that has hit about 10 percent of the military's top officers and shows no signs of slowing. In recent days, Higgseth targeted seven army officers who've been selected for two-star general rank by a board made up of senior army leaders. That's according to current and former military officials who discuss sensitive personnel matters anonymously. Monday night, of course, we saw the announcement of army secretary Dan Driscoll's resignation. He's leaving his post after repeated clashes with Pete Higgseth. He felt Higgseth's leadership was getting in the way of the modernization he wanted to bring to the army. He also reportedly took issue with Higgseth's purges. The removal and driving out of so many high ranking officials has reached a point where even Republicans are voicing their disapproval. Here's Congressman Don Bacon of Nebraska yesterday speaking about Driscoll. I think he reflects a view of many of us.

3:03The secretary has gone overboard on the firings, the red lines with no explanation given. I've had people who have worked with him, they've got a fire, they're good people. And they don't even know why. It's not right. I mean, I think he's at the constitutional rate. How does it make it morally right? Does it make it wise? I'm not sure. Spoken like someone who is just watching all this from home, not someone serving in a co-equal branch of government. Hmm, there's more of that chairman of the House Armed Services Committee. Microaggers of Alabama told reporters this, quote, I'm tired of all the churn. I want to see stability over there. Republican Senator Mike Rounds of South Dakota posed the question, quote, where is the leadership at end quote? And said we've had some very good generals that are no longer there that we respected. Congressman Mike Lawler of New York said on this network earlier today that Hegseth needs to provide answers. I think it's critical, frankly, that Pete Hegseth come forth and talk about exactly why these

4:07changes have been made and what they are doing to ensure stability at the Pentagon. So, we begin today with Democratic Congressman from Connecticut, Jim Himes. He's the ranking member of the House Intelligence Committee Congressman. Thank you for being here. Thanks for having me, Nicole. What does it mean to you that they're publicly complaining and doing nothing? I mean, they're speaking as though one, they're not in the majority and two, there's no part of their job that includes controlling the funds that go to the Pentagon or overseeing the person that runs the Pentagon. Yeah, Nicole, it's part of a much broader pattern, right? I mean, when we talk about the Pentagon and whether they're good leaders at the Pentagon, we're talking about some of the most serious stuff on the planet. So, it's particularly disappointing to hear the traditional pearl clutching and, you know, oh, I'm not sure this is a good idea. I mean, remember, with all due respect to the hardworking men and women of the federal government more broadly, we are talking about the people here who make life and death decisions for 6,000 sailors on, you know, nearly a dozen aircraft carriers who control the nuclear

5:08weapons who make decisions about or help the president make decisions about whether we should go to war in Iran. We really are talking about some of the most dangerous things that we do and important things that we do. And, of course, now we know exactly who Pete Hegseth is. He's a guy that, unless you're a white dude who can do a lot of push-ups and, you know, talk about things like lethality rather than the things that actually really matter to projecting power around the world, you don't have a place at the Pentagon. So, to get back to your question, you know, they don't raise ill and alarm about people being built, you know, through liberty, financial and meme coin corruption. They don't raise an alarm about you would think that they might raise an alarm when the most powerful and scary and dangerous entity on the planet is being mismanaged, but no, that's a step too far for them. I think when people look back at the history of this time, they will study and try to understand why no one did anything while Pete Hegseth destroyed the military. What is the conversation among Democrats about what you will or can do when you retake or if you retake the majority in November?

6:10Well, I mean, there's two things to say about that, right? I mean, accountability is going to be visited in November, right? So, the president got a lot of very bad advice. I don't know exactly from whom or why, but he got a lot of very bad advice and made a bad decision about, in a Ron war, which we were promised would be a month long and now we're in more than six months. And Americans are paying a dollar 20 a more for a gallon of gas with no end in sight to that. That's what happens when you have bad people giving bad advice to a guy who's not a terribly smart decision maker. And that is that that is going to cause a lot of pushback. This is why the Republicans are back on their heels politically because bad decisions are being made and the American people are really fed up about it. But you asked a different, you asked a slightly different question. I'm going to say that one of the things that we need to do, if and when we get the majority of the Congress is to say, we need to rebuild these institutions. In my own world, the intelligence world, people were fired who were probably unreproducible. They had skills in mathematics or in code breaking or in language skills. People that got fired just because they didn't sort of, because they did their jobs.

7:15And so a big chunk of what we need to do in the coming years is rebuild with competent people with a real meritocracy, the elements of the federal government. I want to understand your point about Trump getting bad advice. Whatever it is, do you have the mistakes in Iran were because he was given bad advice? Well, so I don't have a huge amount of granularity into the conversation that happened in the White House. But during that period of time, I was talking with very senior advisors to the president. And I said to them, the one thing I said to some of the senior advisors was, look, I know it's hard to tell the president is a bad idea. And I've watched Middle Eastern wars in my lifetime. This ends the Trump presidency, a quagmire in the Middle East when he promised that that is not where we were going to go ends the presidency. And I think that is going to actually born out to be true. Now by the way, I do think because I know many of the players involved, people like the Secretary of State and the director of CIA, I bet you that they gave careful, careful, but reasonable advice.

8:17The president didn't take it for whatever reason. But can be done for the men and women who spent their careers, many of them in combat. I know that one of the reasons behind Dan Driscoll's resignation is that all of the combat tested generals are included in the people who are being purged. I mean, these are the people to whom the country owes the most. And they're being treated the worst with no one in the majority. I mean, obviously the Democrats don't have the power, I suppose, to intervene the way the Republicans do. But what could be done for those individuals who have not just been purged, but the ones who are being passed over, whose entire decades-long service to the country is being sacrificed in the woodchipper of Pete Hegg says political delusions. Yeah, I mean, it gets back to what we were talking about before. If you look at, and I do mean look at, the people who were denied promotion. If you look at the people who didn't achieve flag rank, low and behold, there's a lot

9:19of African Americans, there's a lot of women in there. And that is not a meritocracy, right? That is something much darker. And so look, we have a lot of work to do to rebuild this because, and my Republican veteran colleagues around here, they understand this better than most because they've been in combat. I serve on the Intelligence Committee with lots of guys who have been in combat. If you could get two beers in them and get them to be really honest about this stuff, and you say, do you really want to be led your decisions about your life, whether you return to your family by the guy that Pete Hegg says likes or the guy that the generals recommended for promotion, they would tell you, we're talking about lives here. It's got to be a meritocracy, which is not what it is today. So ironic that you have to get two beers in Republicans to tell the truth, and everyone wants to keep those same two beers away from Pete Hegg's death. What does it say to you that this is spilling into public view? I mean, what does that say about, I mean, the military is pretty opaque for people outside the military, but the New York Times reporting is extremely granular in detailing the consternation

10:25and distress about the purchase. Yeah, I mean, two things to say about that. First, no surprise, right? I mean, this administration had been in power for about 15 minutes when the Secretary of Defense decided to set up a private signal group and invite Jeffrey Goldberg, the editor of the Atlanta to be part of that signal group. So no surprise here at all, but more importantly, remember that when an organization is coming apart, when it's been divided, when people are infighting and at each other's throats, this is what happens. These things get made public. This is Washington DC. Yeah. Leakes begin to happen. People start talking. So unfortunately, it's a sign of an institution, inter-bul-disrepair, and we really don't want our Pentagon in that condition right now. Congressman Jim Himes, thank you for starting us off on all of this today. Thank you. I want to bring into our coverage our panel, Frank Kendall Sear. He served as the Secretary of the Air Force under President Joe Biden. He's now a senior fellow for the Center for American Progress. And with me at the table, Paul Reikov joins us. He's the host of the Independent Americans podcast. He's the founder and CEO of Independent Veterans of America.

11:28Secretary Kendall, you have an op-ed in today's New York Times about how those in the military can no longer afford to look away from what the Trump administration is asking of them. And you write this quote, denial is one of the two approaches. The nation's senior military leaders seem to have taken to cope with Donald Trump's presidency. When they aren't ignoring how abnormal things have become, they turn to the other approach, claiming that they have no responsibility for the actions the armed forces have been ordered to take because those orders were policy choices outside the scope of their duties. This is a cop-out and it is putting our democracy at risk. This is something that I think will land with so much power because of who it's coming from. It doesn't mean anything from someone who hasn't served the way you have. But just tell me what brought you to write those words. It was a long journey, but my career, I'm a West Point graduate, the service in our army officer for actually for about 11 years,

12:28and then retired from the reserves eventually. I've been a senior executive in the civil service and the Pentagon for several years. And then on multiple occasions of political appointee, I've never seen anything like this. You heard earlier about some of the dysfunction we're seeing. The removal of senior officers without cause is completely unprecedented, taking people off of promotion lists for whatever reason. But the peers to be associated highly with gender and racial identity and so on. This is created a horrible climate of fear in the Pentagon. It's not like anything I've ever seen before. I've always enjoyed and admired the fact that as I've gone through transitions between administrations and party leadership, that the Pentagon just keeps on going. The meritocracy has worked. It's been very a political policy's change. People line up to support the policies of whoever's in power. That's not what's happening now. What we're seeing is attempt to transform the culture basically into politicized Pentagon in a way which is very destructive of the institution.

13:31And I agree with the comment. It's going to take years to recover from this. The coping mechanisms I'm observing, I understand them, but people that are trying to get through this are good people. They're qualified capable professionals for the most part. But what they're doing I think is a disservice to the nation. And I'm particularly worried with the election coming up and how the military might be used or misused in the context of the election. I've been to a number of events in the Pentagon. People are proceeding as if this is life is normal. Everything is fine. We're just doing our jobs here. It's not normal. None of this is normal at all. It's not even acceptable. But when you accept the unacceptable, it becomes the normal. So I was calling that out. I was also calling out the idea that there's some artificial line you can draw, particularly at the most senior levels of our leadership. The Chairman of the Joint Chiefs and our combat and commanders, the Forest, our generals, you are responsible for vast numbers of forces in very important areas of the world or functionally. I'm sorry, but you can't just draw a line and say, I'm going to do the military stuff and ignore the policy stuff because that's not my job.

14:35You owe the Secretary of Defense and you owe the American people and you owe the president the best possible advice you could give. So the artificial line between what we can do and what we should do, it doesn't exist at that level. You're there as it represents the military and you're there in support of that oath you took that you mentioned earlier to the Constitution and you need to speak up. And when it gets to a point where in good conscience you can't do what you were told to do, then you have to say no. And I was trying to point that out. I think that that's very fundamental to the professionalism of our military and honorable conduct. Performing with character as a leader makes that necessary. There's no easy out here where you can avoid that responsibility. And ultimately you're going to be judged. You're going to be judged by the people you lead, by the American people and by history. Help me understand how they've successfully eroded the fabric of, I think, what people on the outside understood to be the greatest strength of the military.

15:35And that is the unit. It's shocking to see so many qualified generals, women and people of color fired without mass resignations. Help me understand the culture surrounding the purges. I know it's not fear. These are not people who scare. So tell me what it is. Well, there are people who care about their rank and their position. Maybe overstate as they say, it's fear exactly, but into the end of the day I think it is. These are not people who are cowardly. They're ready to go give their lives, put their lives on the line and take enormous risk operationally. But it's a very big thing for people who spent their entire lives working their way up the ladder to walk away from that, to stand up and say no. That's asking a lot. When you get to the most senior positions in particular, that's what we expect to people. We expect that kind of leadership, that kind of character. And I realize it's unfair in some ways. I had that point out to me by retired four-star generals. It's not about fairness.

16:36It's about doing the right thing. And no, it's not fear that you're putting this position, but you took the job and now you've got the responsibility to do it. Paul. You and I have been talking about this for almost two years. Really? Nine years. He is the Secretary of War, culture war. This is what he was brought in to do. This is why he was nominated first. He is ripping through the Pentagon with a chainsaw. He's gone through the fat, passed the muscle. He's into bone now. And he's on plan. This is what he was put there to do. And I think Frank's wake up call piece is very, very important because this is a time for senior leaders to break glass. Driscole leaving is very important. A lot of us hope that headset would be gone and Driscole would be in his place. But the opposite is happening. Driscole's out. He was a conscience. He was a circuit breaker. Driscole needs to speak out. General Donahue didn't speak out. CQ Brown didn't really speak out. Driscole and hopefully all of them can speak out now ahead of what Frank is forecasting could happen because it's about our national security. And we continue to have a war that's never ending, potentially new wars.

17:38But this is what headset is supposed to do according to plan. He's ahead of plan. I think your question for the congressman was right. What are you going to do to stop him? If you're not removing him, he's going to continue on plan until something stops him. You know, I was thinking about this. I had a little bit of time off and I was thinking about you when we look back at this time, one of the things people try to understand is how did he destroy the military? Nobody did anything. And I wonder what it says to you that Republicans who are tethered to political dead weight in Trump and Hexat, the only thing more popular than Trump is Hexat's war in Iran. Why do you think they don't break rank with him? Cowardists. They're putting themselves ahead of their country. They're going to lose their seats anyway. I mean, I don't know how else to explain it. I mean, it's cowardice. It's a lack of patriotism. It's a lack of honor. It's a lack of integrity. They're failing in their duties that they're appointed or elected to do. I think there's a lot of people covering their own butts.

18:38I mean, they're thinking they can weight it out. And a lot of folks in the military and politics are not afraid to die, but they're afraid to lose their career. And they're afraid to lose their pension. And I think, Frank's right. I think some folks think they can treat this like a normal time and maybe things will be different after the election. But he could be in Cuba by then. I mean, he is all gas, no brakes. He's been that way for two years. And Hexat is the tip of the sphere. And it's not just about the Pentagon. It's about a overall culture war and the Pentagon as an instrument for that. They've got the Pentagon now. And they're turning it across our culture in ways that are very, very powerful. And they're not going to stop until they're stopped. So for the Republicans and for the Democrats, what are you going to do to stop? If you haven't called for his resignation, if you haven't called for him to be removed, I don't know what else is a higher priority. Because this is our number one priority, especially as we enter the 25th anniversary of 9-11. We're all going to be reminded of how high the stakes are. And Hexat is the guy with his hands on the wheel and he's driving us off a cliff. I want both of you to stick around. I want to ask both of you to put this conversation in the context of a hot war with Iran and

19:39repeated and renewed strikes in Iran. Much more ahead for us. We're also going to talk about why there is some relief today for the nearly 5,000 sailors and Marines aboard the USS Abraham Lincoln. Also ahead, furious Democrats in Texas after major changes were approved, that impact voters just 60 days ahead of the midterms there. And conveniently, just on the very same day, on the very same news cycle, in which the Democratic Senate candidate pulled ahead of the scandal, tarred, and struggling Republican nominee. Plus, they can run, but they cannot hide. Donald Trump is apparently so politically toxic these days that dozens of Republican congressional candidates plan to be busy and otherwise occupied for Donald Trump's big midterm party slash convention next week. We'll get to all that and why no one except for a few corporate cowards felt there was anything wrong with Lake Ontario, all those stories and much more. When Deather Minehouse continues after Quick Break, don't go anywhere today.

20:43Saturday, September 26th, join MSNOW Live in Texas for our biggest event yet, with Rachel Maddo, Jen Psaki, Michael Steele, and more for a day of powerful conversations and timely insights in a crucial state for the midterms. The democracies heal and advance themselves by engaging everybody where they are. Plus, exclusive community experiences, MSNOW Live Together in Texas, September 26th. Get tickets today at ms.now slash together. It was a spot of good news to tell you about today. The beleaguered and visibly rusty aircraft carrier, the USS Abraham Lincoln, made it to a port call in Thailand earlier today. This is the first time service members will be able to get extensive free time on land after spending nine and a half months on that ship. The 286 days spent at sea was an extended deployment when that Trump said, quote, wasn't long

21:46enough due to the Iran War. It's one where sailors and Marines face supply and food shortages, exhaustion, and concerning living conditions were back for Secretary Kendall and Paul Rykhov. Secretary Kendall, there is what these men and women had to endure. And then there's what has been carried out as punishment for talking to the American people about what they've had to endure. What is your sense of what awaits these men and women when they finally make it home? Well, I think there could be some very happy family members to see their load ones back. Yeah, right now they're in Thailand. I think the single guys are pretty happy to be in Thailand. The married guys I want to get on with fast as I can. I hope there's no retribution for anything. People have shared with their families private communications what's going on and their families have come forward. I don't think there should be any retribution for that. We need to get to the truth of exactly what happened here and why, but it's a pretty apparent

22:46there were some deprivations that got pretty severe over the course of that very, very long deployment. Nicole, I've got the floor. I want to respond to something John said earlier. It's about the word cowardice applied to our senior military leaders. I'm going to take coverage with that. These people are not cowards. Many of them have risked their very lives for our country and we ought to admire them and respect them for that. What's asked of them now is moral courage, which is much rare, unfortunately. And I left as I left the Pentagon, I gave a speech where I told people that you need to know now what lines you're willing to cross because the two great enemies of moral courage are self-interest and rationalization. And that's what I think I'm seeing from our senior leaders right now. They need to get past that of things and do the right thing. Let me just put that footnote on the earlier segment. I appreciate that. I want to let you respond. I would say the rationalization though is the longest story of what feels like the longest chapter in American politics, the Trump story, the rationalization that people like a

23:50termic master made if I leave someone worse will take my spot. That lots of people have made is something we've seen and it's also hallmark of abusive relationships. I mean, that is not a way to run the United States military. Yeah, I think Frank and I are probably in heated agreement here. I mean, moral courage is the right way to be more specific about it. But I think there's something bigger here. Like my generation mostly joined and went in after 9-11. We have seen two decades of failure and refusals of people to speak up and the war in Afghanistan and the war in Iraq, stop the war in Iran. We're tired of all of this. And that's part of what headset and Trump have been able to manipulate into this purge of the Pentagon because a lot of the country is disappointed with failure and with disappointment. But I think when it comes to Lincoln, it specifies something really important, which is truth. Like the Lincoln reveal that you can't trust them to tell the truth. Frank's right, like the single folks are going to be really happy and the married folks want to get home. Like they have to stop in Thailand in part because they probably can't make it safely all the way back to San Diego.

24:51They have to stop and retrofit and fix that ship in part because so many of our military assets have been blasted by the Iranians, which is another part of what they haven't been transparent about. And then it comes to the wounded and casualties. They haven't been transparent about that. So when we come back to headset, I think we have to focus on the fact that he's not being honest with the public. He's not being honest with military families. He's probably not even being honest with Trump. And that might be the straw that breaks the camel's back with him after this discussion with Driscoll. But I'm going to keep saying it. We need someone to break glass. Driscoll, Donnie Hughes, somebody has got to be the first to break that seal and speak out. So other, especially recently retired or removed folks will have the courage, moral courage to step forward and speak out too. Frank, do people come to you for advice on the present cons of speaking out? I have asked a number of retired officers to speak out and I've had zero success with that. Again, self-interest and rationalization, right? I think they're reluctant to do that. I had an incident. I went to a retirement ceremony recently and I talked to a retired forced art general

25:53there who said that they would like to speak out. They were glad that I was speaking out, but they couldn't because they thought their daughter might lose her job. And she either works for a contractor or for the government or for the government directly. And my thought was, you know, that's why you should speak out. We're living in America in 2026 where people have those fears. That's something new here. And it's not acceptable. And, you know, it's self-interest, I think, plays into this for a lot of people. Their organizations that they're in, whatever boards they might be on, whatever consulting clients they might have. But I think we're in a crisis here and I think we're going to confront a much more serious crisis than we already have when it goes through the election. I'm very worried about that and have been ever since Donald Trump was elected. We already know what he does when he loses an election. And we're going to get another chance to fight experience out here in a few weeks. So people do need to speak out. It is a break-class time. I agree completely with John on that. That's where we are. And more people do need to be speaking up. Paul, what is your sense of how close some people might be?

26:57I mean, I would guess that Republicans who are not the tip of the spear, but the scraggly tail on the courage front are hearing from people inside the military before they go out and say things like the clips that I played at the beginning. I think there's smell in the politics after being home in August. I think you had Representative Mike Luller on, who is on MSN now. He's speaking out against headset. That's a change. He's also in a dog fight against an army veteran who's a Democrat for his seat. I think that is a real indicator of where Republicans might be, especially if they're in real elections. Hex said this is very unpopular. The war in Iran is exceptionally unpopular. And I think... Hex says the only person I think who's individually more unpopular than Trump, who's historically unpopular. And I think after being home, some of the Republicans are going to smell the coffee on that. But I think more importantly, the ones that are in tight re-election campaigns are going to start to run away from him faster than they're running away from data centers. But I want to go back to something also that Frank mentioned that you and I have talked about. I think it might have been Senator Slotkin. In Hex's confirmation hearings, they asked him if he would put the military against

27:59American civilians. He refused to roll it out. He refused to answer it. And now we're at that moment. We're 60 days out. That day is coming. Hex said, told you what he was going to do. What are members of Congress going to do about that now if it comes to bear in the next two months? Frank, because you just put it out there in Paul Fowler, I have to ask you, what is your fear? And General Kelly spoke about this in a, I think his only recorded interview ahead of the election two years ago, that his fear, if that's the right word, his concern, was that Trump would put the military into position in the streets of American cities against other Americans. And he said that because it's something you wanted to do in the first term. What is the scenario you fear most? There are a lot of scenarios in an armored vehicle with running to figure this out. I think Paul and I are exactly the same place on this one. What did he do last time? Fake electors tried to browbeat state officials in the changing the results.

29:00Trying to get Mike Pence to not certify the result to the election. Called a mob into existence and then unleashed it. And while I was ransacking the Capitol for two hours did nothing to stop it. I do not think there is a limit on what this president is capable of doing. And it's just a question of what form it's going to take. He gave a prime time speech just a few weeks ago about this great communist Chinese threat to our election. I don't know what he's going to do. I'm scared stiff of what it might be and there are a number of things. And a lot of people working try to get state governments ready to deal with whatever happens. He's already put the military in a number of cities using the National Guard under the excuse of trying to reduce crime. Generally speaking, those were not places that wanted to see the National Guard in their streets, including Washington. I'm afraid we're going to see more of that. Whatever steps he takes to deny the election results, people are going to be in the streets. They're going to be very upset about that. And that's where I'm afraid the military is going to be used against them. I think this is a conversation through Beth need to continue having.

30:00I hope we can do that. Former Secretary Frank Kendall, Paul Reikoff, thank you both so much for starting me out today. We want to mention Secretary Kendall's must read new book, Lethal Autonomy, the future of warfare, whether we like it or not. It's out right now. It is must read. After the break, Texas Republicans may be starting to panic. Senate Democratic candidate James Talleriko says the closing of nearly 100 polling sites is proof. They're terrified of people exercising their right to vote in November. We'll have that story for you next. Home to the Rachel Maddo Show. Morning Joe, the briefing with Jen Socky and more voices you know and trust. MS now is your source for news, opinion and the world. Learn more at MS.now. I think the leaders in Tarant County, the leaders in this country are terrified of working

31:02people showing up, voting and holding them accountable. And so they're going to do everything they can to stop folks from voting by closing a third of the polling locations in Tarant County. We're going to see longer lines. We're going to see longer commutes to polling locations. We're going to see lower voter turnout. And that's the opposite of what we should all want. Amanda, that was Texas Democratic nominee for the US Senate, James Talleriko reacting to the consequences, the harm that will be done by Republicans in the third largest county in Texas who have decided to make it harder for people in that county to vote come November. And so the county commissioners in Tarant County voted yesterday along party lines to shut down 92 polling locations. That's nearly a third of the county's voting precincts. So why on earth would Tarant County want to do that? It's a county that voted for Donald Trump by more than five points in 2024. Well, Republicans in favor of the measure argued that the number of polling locations after

32:03the cuts would still meet the mandatory minimum. They also cited efforts to cut costs, citing low voter turnout, and various polling locations. Or, or curtain number two, maybe it has to do with this guy. The disastrous candidacy of the state's Attorney General Kim Paxton. How about it? Is he? He is a candidate who is so bad that Republicans are fearful of losing a Senate seat they have held on to for three decades in the same state that Donald Trump won by 13 points 20 months ago. A candidate so bad that the Texas Senate race has produced poll after poll after poll showing Paxton trailing or just about even with Democratic candidate James Talleriko. A candidate so bad that our own politics team has now officially shifted the Texas Senate race to a toss up something that was unthinkable for a long time. But especially when Trump surged back to the presidency, as we said 20 months ago. I want to bring in Tarant County Commissioner Alisa Simmons.

33:04She was in the room yesterday, putting against the closure of polling sites. She's also the Democratic candidate for Tarant County Judge, also joining us Democratic Strategist and Chief Communications Officer for the political organization. Move on, Joel Payne is back with us. Alisa, tell me, I mean, it seems stupid to ask how this happened, but just tell us how this happened. Well, to understand yesterday's vote, your viewers need some context about Tarant County. It is the last largest red county in the country. There are other red counties. This one is the last largest red county in the country. And the leaders are trying to hold on to power. In Tarant County, the county elected officials, there are 69 elected officials that run this county.

34:05County clerk, the sheriff, the DA commissioners, the county judge, which is the county executive. Eight, only eight of those, only eight of us are Democrats. So the 61 are Republicans. They want to hold on to that power. And it's also clear that Trump has had his hand in Tarant County for years. And so Tarant County is important to not only Texas, but this country. And tell me what the people, the citizens who live in Tarant County want. So I'll tell you, and it's not what I think they want. It's what the numbers have shown us in the March 3rd primary. We had 40,000 more Democrats vote in the Democratic primary than voted in the Republican primary.

35:08So that's very telling. We had a special election for a state Senate seat, Senate District 9 up here in the Tarant County area. And Senate District 9 has been held by Republican. And Trump won SD9 by 17 points. We had a Democrat win that seat, Taylor Rimmitt. And so the numbers look good for us. And that is exactly what they are fearful of. I am running for the County Executive seat. So you will not have someone like my colleague in the current County judge cutting 92 polling places. 92, that is significant. That's a significant number. Taking polling places off of college campuses. That's why I'm running. And there is so much momentum.

36:09You saw what the people wanted. If you caught any glimpse of our Tarant County commissioners court meeting yesterday, we had four, four and a half, almost five overflow rooms. That's just our main chamber. We had four and a half additional overflow rooms. People are sick of it. I'm telling you about 98% of those people came to say, do not cut these polling places. So they are energized. We are canvassing. We are on the ground. We are on the phones and have been for many, many months because Tarant County, Texas, was the beginning of redistricting. So they saw how successful it was here in Tarant County. My colleagues on the commissioners court redistricted me, my precinct and made it more Republican. They cracked it.

37:09They took Democrats out and packed it into precincts one, which is a Democratic precinct, because they blatantly said their aim was a four one majority Republican majority on the commissioners court. And so they redistricted me and I said, well, I'll have a better chance running at large county wide. And so that's why I'm the Democratic nominee for the county executive. We call it county judge seat here in Tarant County. So the people are excited about my race and we've got qualified Democrats running for every county seat in Tarant County. It's just amazing that Texas has just become the center of the political universe. At least we will stay on top of your race. Thank you so much for spending time with us. We'll pull Joel in on the other side. We'll be right back.

38:10We in the Senate don't have the money budget for Texas. We need help for the president. The president says he has $850 million in his campaign accounts. That's a lot of jack. We are certainly hopeful that the president and his team, Maggie Inc. will be engaged in some of these races. I'm sorry, you know, have you talked to the president about that money and obviously it's a big concern to both of you. We it is and we continue to weigh in. And you weigh in at four in the morning when he's posting AI slop on social media. We're back with Joel Payne. The dysfunctional relationship between Trump and Republicans in the Senate is like the only part of the Trump story that I find comical at this point. The rest of it is so destructive and tragic and horrific. But these guys going on Fox to boo who whine about how Trump should spend his own money on Texas is just amazing.

39:11Well it is and also as I was listening to that Nicole, all I could think about is you break it, you buy it, which is essentially what they're all saying to him is like you broke this. You created a competitive seat out of thin air. I mean, I actually think James Tolerico could have been competitive and would have been competitive with John Cornyn too, but it is no doubt that Ken Paxton is a significantly weaker Republican candidate. And you know, Nicole's I was listening to your conversation with the previous guests, the candidate there in Texas. And I'm just thinking about Texas. There are so many other interventions that Republicans could easily think like there are so many other rip cords they could pull. They could go and try to turn out their voters. They could go and and and actually make different decisions about their agenda. I mean, there are a number of interventions that they could do, but they actually they could choose a better candidate. But the intervention that they choose is to rig the rules and to make it easier to escape accountability. And that is actually not just the story of Texas, that's the story of this entire term

40:13of John Trump's presidency and the Republican Party that upholds and uplifts him. And I don't think that they are going to meet the type of, you know, remedy that they think they are. I think they think they're going to be able to evade accountability by closing polling locations and, you know, using the US Postal Service to make it harder for people to use the mail-in voting system that we have. And, you know, threaten using National Guard and all of these other things. And if you talk to people in the cold out in the world, people are so hacked off about this economy. And they're so upset about Donald Trump and his agenda. I don't actually think that all of these efforts they are making to suppress voter energy and suppress the voter turnout are going to be successful. That doesn't make me any less concerned about them and any less vigilant about them. But I don't believe they are going to be successful in being able to move the over to window in this moment. There is going to be an incredible need to reverse all the voter suppression. I mean, how do you deal with all the attempts at disenfranchising voters?

41:16Well, a few things, you know, in the space that I work in, the phrase that a lot of us have adopted is, you got to make it too big to steal and you got to make it too big to suppress. That means that people have to show up. And by the way, it's going to be great to have people show up on election day, but they got to show up early. People have to take advantage of all the different ways to vote because we know the closer we get to election day, the Trump administration and their allies and their satellites are going to do every single thing they possibly can do to make it harder. And they're going to have the help of the Supreme Court. They're going to have the help of friendly Republican governments all over the country and red states. So we have to get our people exercised and motivated. The good news here in Nicole is you look at the energy, you know, in the voters who I think are going to be voting for accountability for Trump. The account that the enthusiasm gap is so significant that Republicans, I don't think we'll be able to gerrymandor, to rig, to suppress their way out of accountability. And I think we just got to keep our nose to the grindstone and not let up and not let

42:20people think that it's going to be enough. Yeah, I mean, even some Republican voters, even some Trump voters have an appetite for accountability for all the grift and for the war and the wrong and the price of gas. Joel Payne to be continued. Thank you so much for joining us today. Ahead for us, what Donald Trump is shilling to Americans for the low, low price of $1.54, something unsurprisingly worth less than $1.54. We'll solve that mystery for you next. Today is the day we've all been waiting for. There are new gold colored $1 coins available now featuring Donald Trump's face on them. They're finally in circulation if you've been waiting. They're available to you at a markup of more than 50 percent above their face value, but of course. And it's only at the second time in our country's history that a living president has appeared on U.S. coins.

43:21You can see that one side of the coin features an image of Trump's face and is inscribed with liberty and God we trust in 1776 to 2026. So while all Americans suffer and say they are suffering from high prices at the pump and at the grocery store because of Donald Trump's needless tariffs and his war of choice in Iran, if they want to, they can now pay $1.55 to get a $1 coin. And, a lot of Donald Trump's face on it feels like a metaphor for everything. Washington Post reports that according to U.S. code, quote, only the portrait of a deceased individual may appear on United States currency and securities end quote. It's actually a law that's sprung from a colonial era tradition against putting current presidents on American coins to distance them from the British monarchy. And unless something changes since we've been on the air, the United States is not a monarchy.

44:22Up next for us, House Republicans conveniently finding anything else to do than attend Donald Trump's party is big midterm convention next week. The rats may be starting to leave that thinking ship after all. The next hour of deadline White House starts after a quick break. Ever since I was young, I've watched people working hard chasing opportunity making sacrifices, doing everything they can to build a better life. And now we're shining a light on what matters most. Our economy, our national identity, our democracy, our future. The stakes have never been higher. It's all on the line. On the line with Alicia Menendez, weekdays at 12 PM Eastern on MS now.