SouthEastern Bow Hunter - Bows and Turkeys w/ Michael Pitts

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1:00Must be physically located in Virginia. TNC's apply. In app only. Alright, what's going on guys? Welcome to another episode of South Asian bow hunter podcast. This is the first episode. Well, the last episode we're recording until turkey season 2026 starts. So I thought who better than to get the turkey man. At least that's what I call him this time of year. Mr. Michael Pitt from RealTree, RoadTrips, all that stuff, all the good. Good, good shows that we've seen pits on and you know, he's become a really good buddy of mine over the past, I don't know, year or so. So I figured pits knows how to kill turkeys. He knows how to run for Mr. Green jeans and. It's just going to be a really good episode. So before we get into it, I hope you guys really enjoyed last week's episode with Dustin. Talking about men's mental health. That's probably something that's going to come up a lot here in the next. I don't know. Weeks is the podcast gets rolling and just everything. Because it's it's just the thing that we've, you know, I've really started taking a very important look at.

2:00So before we get into it, Mr. Michael pits, we got to run through the partners real quick. Looks like this mic is kind of messing up. I can't fix that. Okay, hopefully it doesn't slowly go down. I'll keep an eye on it as we're going. It looks like it might be moving. But anyway, you guys know I love messing around with these mics. Yeah, so partners before we get into it with pits. This podcast is brought to you by sportsman's empire. You probably heard Dan's ad in the beginning, but I got to do my part and talk about it. Sportsman's empire is a group of podcasters like myself. Dan being one of them who actually runs sportsman's empire. And it is honestly just a group of really good podcasts. So if you guys want some other content than just this or maybe you're typical, you know, Joe Rogan's or Sean Ryan's or whatever, go check him out. Let's see. Next up, I see a year I'd actually just got the brand new. Leafy early season jacket. I do plan on using that during turkey season this year a little bit, but I mainly got it because I wanted to have something that is going to be more

3:00into with my style of bow hunting that I'm going to be doing this year. You know, I'm planning on getting a little lower, getting a little more close to their trails and the thicker stuff because you know down in Georgia, we have a lot of thick brush. And yeah, I'm not going to be getting up as high. So I see how it makes my opinion the best camera on the market. I absolutely love it. So go try it out. And just for I say this every time, but just so everybody knows all the discount codes for all these partners and all of the websites that will take you to their website. If you want to get some other stuff, it's all listed down in the description below. Let's see. The next up is a boutique. I'm going to run through these kind of quick, but the boutique makes the best arrow wraps in the game. Go support him. G five outdoors. They've got that new dirty bird broadhead. I absolutely I love it. I think it's it's one of the coolest looking broadheads we've seen in a very long time. Yeah, this thing is definitely sliding down. I'll play with it in a minute. But anyway, G five. They always knock it out of the park with their broadheads. Let's see. We got prime archery. So got my new divide completely set up ready for tax cited in.

4:02Got the stakes got the got everything that I need for it. So if you guys are looking to get a prime, I highly recommend. You check out the divide series. If you want to get something that's maybe a little bit older, but still just as good. We're shooting just as good. Head over to Ace Hardware. They are running a special right now. They have seven prime RBX bows. I think there's five. RBX 34s and two RBX 32s. All right. They're trying to get those things out of there. And I told them how to help them out on here trying to get, you know, some people to go get those bows. They're really good bows. Prime makes the best bows on the market in my opinion. So go check them out. Please go support them. You will get a killer deal. Tell them that we sent you. Let's see. Next up, dialed archery. So my, my proof is working great, man. It was super easy to side in. Look, be on the lookout for small batches coming. Let's see. Next up, mulchery. Mulchery cams were working fantastic. Had deer on camera this morning. So that's really exciting. I actually found a bearded hen. So that's, that's kind of cool. Let's see, bow hunting league.

5:02Talk about him every week. If you want to be a state sponsor, go to the website. Get, get signed up. It's only $100 a month. And tell them that we sent you over there. Bowening archery. Still running the alphas. Scrape doctor. Gonna probably start getting scrapes out here in the next couple of weeks. Victory archery. Running the HLRs all season. Catalyst archery. That is the, dude, I'm drawn a blank. It's been a very long day. I'm sorry. Catalyst is the stabilizer company that we started working with not too long ago. Where you can get top notch stabilizers for a quality affordable price. And last but not least, it's going to be unbound archery, which is a string company that I have partnered up with this year. Been buddies with Nick for a while. And dude, best strings out there. I absolutely love them. So that is all the partners. I'm going to run through this kind of quick, because this mic is trying to follow me if you're watching. I mean, you could see. I've got to fix it. But anyway, if you guys don't know who Jesus Christ is, please, please, please, please, please.

6:07Give me a shot. All right, I did. And it is the best decision I've ever made. I absolutely cannot thank him enough for everything he's done in my life. You heard me and Dustin talking about it a lot last week. And yeah, I think there's a lot of people that need him right now. My self included, I always need him. But Jesus offers something that nobody else can. And that is, it's a life changing experience. So if you guys are going through anything, you want to talk about it, reach out to me. But yeah, that's a little intro. So remember, go reach Bible, go shoot your bow. And let's get started with Michael pits. Southeast or bow under podcast. All right, so you look, I say this every time you read the title. You know who the guest is is one of my favorite people to get on here.

7:07Honestly, in the past year and a half, he's probably the most consistent one, which is great. We got Mr. Michael pits from real tree. Back on the podcast, we're going to talk a little bit. We're going to talk about some different things, right? Like I think you came on not that long ago. Talked about your season. So we know how dear season went. Right. And this is two days before the turkey opener here in Georgia. And everybody that listens to this knows I know nothing about turkeys. I do plan on going out and hunting them this year if I can find the time. But dude, so before we before we get into turkeys and all that stuff. And I just kind of go slack jaw and you're just explaining everything. And you can tell that I am zoning out. Yeah, yeah, what what have you been up to, man? Here lately. Oh, typically between dear season and turkey seasons where I take a little break. Because nothing's really going on. So I can get caught up on, you know, stuff around the house, errands, just stuff I need to get done.

8:11So, you know, since dear season went out mid-January, I've just been catching on. I've got a bunch of little things going on around here. The house trying to do some remodel and then that kind of stuff. But typically about mid March, early March depending on if I go into Florida or not. I'll start getting up for turkey, which I didn't go into Florida this year. But we just got back from Texas last week. So that was pretty good little run. It comes in a little earlier out there. So we started hunting out there pretty early. Typically we took these out there. Yeah, typically we go out there about once a year. But good little group we hunt with out there and we kind of kick it off out there every year. You know, that's usually our first hunt if we don't dip down into Florida. But I hadn't been in Florida the past two years. So kind of the Texas deal has been my kickoff. So what do they have? Like what type of turkeys are down in?

9:11I mean, obviously we got Easterns and stuff in Florida. But like what else are down there? Aren't there osseolas and stuff down there too? Yeah, osseolas are going to be, you know. NWTF states Jacksonville's the kind of line right there between your eastern and your osseolas. But I think it's a good bit further south before you start getting into your true osseola birds. Yeah. I think before you get into your really true osseolas, you got to get down around kind of Orlando area. You're kind of dealing with hybrids, you know, a little bit north of there. Yeah. I was going to ask you about that if you've ever seen an eastern osseola hybrid. Yeah, there's a bunch of them in there, you know, around that Jacksonville area. Yeah. There's a lot of your hybrids in there. You know, you got a lot of states Kansas has got a lot of hybrids because Kansas has got easterns, reos. There's little cornering kill mariums in. So, you know, there's a lot of states that have your hybrids.

10:13But, you know, the osseola is so secluded to really pretty much half a state being Florida. Yeah. And, you know, it's pretty expensive to dip down there. The people, the landowners and outfitters know that they know what they got. They've got the prize land, you know, especially for folks trying to get their slam and that kind of stuff. So, it's gotten pretty expensive down in Florida. But, you know, hunting osseolas are really fun. And, you know, you can get into the woods a little bit earlier when you creep down in there. And, you can start hunting a little bit earlier in early March. That sort of deal. So, the people that really are into turkey hunt will start down in Florida. And then they'll end up, you know, way up north where the seasons will go to the end of May. So, you can stretch your turkey season out, you know, by starting in Florida and going away north. Or you can be like, why don't you get the slam in 24 hours?

11:14Yeah. They've got the funds on the time. I'm telling you, that's so crazy to me. That is one of the most amazing things I've ever seen. That's got to be a world record, right? I think it was. I think it was. But, that's just unbelievable to even five of them being able to do that. You know, we did beer's robust a few years ago with real tree. And we had three different teams that tried to do it from the vehicle. And all of us completed the slam because you got so much traveling. You got to incorporate into it. You can't spend too long in one area or whatever. So, it is tough to do, you know, by vehicle. Now, Michael did it with using air transportation. Like the only way you could. Yeah, that's about the only way you can do it in 24 hours. But it would be a tough run. You know, you can't just be any solter. And another guy that was real trees and the name was Jeff.

12:15I can't remember his last name. But they did it back. Gosh, it does a years ago. And they completed the slam. And I think seven days by vehicle. But it's tough when you get into there. Because I don't care where you are. You know, everybody talks about how mariums are easy to kill. And this and that a turkey can be a turkey at any time. and give you more fits than you want to deal with. So, you know, you've almost got to hope that the birds are acting right everywhere you go. And there's a lot of things that got aligned to make it work. So, just to remind me, I see all those are the ones that have like the blue heads and rainbow fans and all of that, right? Now, that's gonna be your oscillated birds. Oscillated. That's where, oh, yeah. Yep, that's gonna be out of the country, all. So, they don't have those down in Florida. No, no, the Oscillola's kind of like a smaller Eastern, I guess you would say. It's a little bit there about 18, 19 pounds, you know.

13:17I like to call them little velociraptors because they got long-go legs and, you know, it's just, they come creeping out, it's pretty cool. But, you know, I would say you're, Oscillola's in your Eastern's probably two hardest birds to kill, you know, as far as you're slam goes. Yeah, yeah, if you're not those two out, you know, Aureo and the Marium, you know, they should be pretty, pretty easy. But, yeah. And it's just like I always tell people, even within the Eastern species, which covers more ground than any other, you know, sub-species of the turkey goes. They hunt different in different states, like, I don't care what people say. You get middle Georgia, Alabama, Mississippi, and even into Louisiana. That little middle line right there, through there, some of the toughest turkeys you'll ever hunt, regardless anywhere in the country. Why is that?

14:17I don't know if it's territory or what, because when you go all-in-up into Tennessee and, you know, North Carolina, Pennsylvania, all the way up, you know, into Maine and all that, the turkeys hunt a lot better, a lot easier, you know, especially Tennessee. Can be really, really good when those birds are all fire. And they hunt very easy. And I don't know if it's a terrain or a pressure deal or what it is, but you dive down, you know, just five hours into mid-Georgia or whatever. And it's like a totally different bird, even though they're both Eastern's, they hunt totally different. And that's one of the cool things, you know, you get to see when you get out and travel and hunt different birds. And, you know, it's the same with deer, because deer hunt different and different territories, you know. So that's one of the benefits of getting out and traveling. And if you'd like to travel, get out and travel and hunt. And, you know, you'll see these different tendencies that you hear people talking about all the time. And it's really neat to learn it in all, like, you know,

15:20I hunted up in New York last year, we're going back this year again. But in that big mountainous country, you know, we're pretty much flat land down here. And you start getting, you know, up into your Pennsylvania, New York, all those areas, you start getting into the mountainous territories. And you've almost got to work those birds from an elevated position. You want to be higher than the bird is or at least at the same level the bird is. When you're below the bird, they don't like to work well. They don't want to come to you. They don't want to come downhill. So, you know, there's so much to learn. And like I say, all this just with terrain and the temperament of the birds is all within the Eastern species. We hadn't gotten into reos or ociolas or mariums. So, there's so much to learn. And I still learn every time I step foot in the woods. And I always ask questions why this, why that, you know, just trying to figure things out when I'm in new territories.

16:24Because that's part of the fun of it to me is, one, I like to travel. I like to see new places, meet new people. And, you know, two, it's learning the aspect of animals in that area. Because I don't know what it is. Like, you know, we've had like Drake Lamb for instance. He was filming with us for a while and he was coming down from Iowa. And he just thought he was going to come down here to Georgia. And we were going to run through him like you do in Iowa. If you learned real quick, it doesn't like that. Not like Iowa. You know, their times you want to wrap your gun barrel around the tree and just run all screaming. I mean, they will push you to that limit. I mean, you'll hunt all day and never hear a gobble sometimes. So, you know, I will say if anybody can kill a turkey, you know, in that middle Georgia, Alabama, Mississippi, Louisiana area, you can't want anywhere in the country. You know, the pressure's off if you can do it. Do it. Like, I feel like when I go, I'm going to feel kind of cocky

17:27because I have this track record somehow finding turkeys where you wouldn't, you just wouldn't expect it would be. Like, I don't know if I told you the story, but this past, I think it was November. It had to be late November, early December. I went to this job up in, where was I? Jefferson. Uh-huh. So, you know, North Middle area. And, um, it did, it's like 6.45 in the morning. Sun's just coming up or maybe it was a little bit later than that. I don't fully remember. Uh-huh. But I'm pulling in this parking lot and this is the band in warehouse. All I got to do is their fire inspection. So, I'm just checking stuff out, you know, easy going day, right? And I pull around the corner and, you know, these abandoned warehouses, they always have a ton of woods around them. So, I'm looking for deer. Right. Because I'm like, dude, it's deer season. This looks like really good property. There's a little swamp down here. And then there's, you know, uh, ridges and stuff. And like, uh, no one's ever here, right? These deer might be getting yelled at by the police thing. It's like, you're a trespassing on private property.

18:28That's it. Yeah. And, uh, I come around this corner, dude. And I see what I think is a dinosaur. I mean, legitimately, a velociraptor. The tallest, biggest turkey I've ever seen in my life. Sucker was past my knees in high, like, he was huge. Yeah. And so I'm freaking out. And I'm like, oh, that's how big is turkey. Because I've been chased by turkeys. I've almost fought with turkeys at zoos. Like, I've got to pass turkeys, right? I mean, I, I had one time, I know I'm telling two stories here, but I'll tell the second one quickly. I had this one time I was at a zoo down in Savannah. They had this turkey. And I don't know what the thing's problem with me was. But like, literally, I'm standing there. I'm looking at it and it's snooed goes from like, like hanging over its face. Uh-huh. And I lock eyes. Yeah, I lock eyes with this thing and it just goes straight up. Oh, yeah. And then I start to fan in and he's like making weird noises. And I'm like, uh-huh. I think he wants to kill me. I didn't do nothing to you. And I was at this Veterans Camp in Fayetteville, got chased by two

19:28jakes on a golf cart. I just don't understand what it is. It's like, and then, and then after. So I see this giant bird, right? And I'm freaking out. I go do the job. Suns up at this point. It's like 8.30, 8.45. And I'm done and I'm leaving. And so I go to the back of the property or the back of the building because, you know, I want to look in the woods. I'm like, okay, cool. I saw a turkey. There's obviously birds here. There's animals here. I'm gonna go see what I can see. So I drive around the back, prime deer honing. I mean, dude, the land out there, you have everything you need in like a very small area. So I would personally be like, oh, there's deer here, for sure. Yeah, gotta be. And I don't see any though, which kind of sucks. But I go up to the front of the property and about to leave. I look down in the, um, so basically the way it is this building is up on a small ridge and then you got a bigger ridge on the other side. So you got this tiny little saddle in the middle of it. And that is fed by this small little pond. It's a kind of swampy pond, but you know what I'm talking about.

20:31Oh, yeah. And I look down there and there's four hens, just clocking away. And so I get out and I can't turkey call worth a crap but I'm gonna try anyway. So I'm like, and they look at me and they just are like, bobbing their heads and you're gonna walk away. I was like, man, y'all are rude. I was like, what's up, man? So, yeah, I feel like, yeah, like I feel like when I go in the woods this year to hunt a turkey, I, I'm not gonna be able to help it, but feel like, okay, God, you've put them in front of me when it's not season. Apparently I have a gift for finding these things in places I should. Every time I go scout on public, I find turkeys. I don't know why. Can I please have at least one bird? That's all I want. If I kill one, I'm good. I'm gonna throw a bow like I'm good. And, but I know I'm gonna get humbled. That's the thing, because I have no clue what I'm doing. So, just, it's just learning. I learned better from my own mistakes and that stuff. If I make a mistake, I learn 10 times better

21:32than somebody telling me not to do it. You know, when I actually do it, I go, whoa, that didn't work. I'm not doing that again. So, you're telling me deer hunting, isn't it? When we get all our Midwestern buddies and they're like, man, try this and it's like, all right, and it doesn't work down here. Yeah, it can be problematic at times. Gotta love it, those frickin' birds, man. Well, the thing is you actually have a, you know, you kind of have a little bit of a leg up, I feel like, because you could probably call Waddle anytime, like, hey, Waddy, what's happening? Because I feel like of all the people I know, the two that I, or the three that would stand out to me that no turkeys that I know relatively good, or would be Tim Knight, Jay Maxwell, and Michael Waddle. And I know Waddy's busy, so I probably would leave him for last. Yeah, yeah, really, I know he's got like no time, but if I got any turkey questions, I always hit up Jay, or I'll end up Tim Knight, and I'm like, hey, I'm planning, and I did this last year too,

22:32and then I just didn't have time to go. But I'm like, can you guys tell me what to do? And I mean, I got lists of stuff, and I'm like, yeah. Well, I thought deer hunting had a lot to it, man. This turkey stuff is nuts. So, I'm telling you, he can be tough. If a turkey can smell, you never kill it. You know, I mean, what is it with their eyes? Man, I heard something about their eyes are like. Yeah, their eyesight is so phenomenal. It's unreal. I mean, you've got to be super, super still. You've got to plan your movements and that sort of thing because they can pick you off so easily. It's not even funny how quick they can pick you off. In fact, hunting, lots of times, you know, if you're hunting an open territory, like a plantation cut or something like that, it's pretty much impossible. You know, unless you just won't sit there and deer hunt them or ambush them or whatever like that, but actually interact with them. You know, it is really, really tough when you get an open territory because they can see you way before you can see them.

23:35They've just gotten extremely good eyesight. Have you ever thought, and this is just something I was thinking about the other night when I was going to bed? Have you ever thought about trying to hunt turkeys out of a tree stand? I never have. I wouldn't want to do it just because I'm a running gun type guy. That's what I like doing is covering a lot of ground. You don't try to get a goblin turkey because to me, just sitting there waiting on them is no fun at all. I want to interact with them, call to them, call them in. Yeah. And you know, a lot of people don't like that style or that method into each their own. And there are times where I'll sit down if nothing's goblin or whatever, you know, I might sit up against a tree in an area where I'm seeing a lot of sign, you know, struck marks or tracks or whatever. I might sit in that area a little bit, just to try to listen, see if anything gets going. That sort of thing kind of game my bearings a little bit, take a break, whatever.

24:36And lots of times you'll hear burst because lots of times when they're not vocal, they're coming to you just don't know it. They're not responding to you. So lots of times if you sit tight for a little bit, they'll come up on you silent. You'll just look over and he's standing there. And lots of times I've seen it like to wear if it's a one road track or whatever and I've got to go up in there and then come back out the same way when you go up in there calling, you know, those birds are hearing you and kind of ease and towards your location. When you come back down, you'll end up busting them. They'll be sitting there in the road or right where you were calling from, you know, looking for whatever was making that sound. So yeah, lots of times they're coming right to you and you never know it. So, you know, when they're not goblin, which I typically I don't like to hunt much when they're not goblin or not responding because I just love to interact with them and hear the gobbles and all that. So when they're being real quiet, you know,

25:37if I'm not doing any good, lots of times I'll go to the house because if you sit there and try to hunt them, running gun style while they're not goblin, you'll end up bumping them and educating them and everything else. So you can do a lot of damage. You just got to kind of watch it. So when days are not goblin, yeah, I might sit on the ground a little bit more. So I'm not running around and busting up these gobblers, they're there, but they're just not responding. So I don't know they're there, which it's not very fun hunting that way to me because I just like to be on the run and gun and moving and cutting up and talking, having a good time, you know, that kind of thing. So you're not really much of a ground blind hunter then? No, I don't think, I honestly don't think I've ever turkeys hunted out of a ground blind. I mean, it's because it's basically the same idea like what I was saying. That's what led me to think of it because I'm like, okay, Jordan, Jordan, I talked about on his episode and I was like, yeah, and he's killed plenty of turkeys. So I'm like, I don't know what to do. He's like, dude, if you're hunting with a bow,

26:37get a ground blind. He's like, because trying to draw back and all that other stuff, yeah, I don't see you. And so I started thinking about it more after that. And I'm like, well, dude, I don't have one yet. I was planning on buying one, right? Right. The same reason I never got a table. So life comes up. The life shows up. The life of a poor is so difficult. But no, I was thinking, I'm like, you know, I've got tree stands. Yeah. Why not just try that? And, you know, because I mean, Kurt from working class, he killed a very nice mule out of a tree stand, which you don't see a lot. So I'm like, it can't be that you can't just try it. And if you've got some birds that are patternable, like they're flying down in this one field every morning, you know, getting in a ground blind, setting up a couple of decoys and just letting them do what they're going to do, you know, you can kill them a lot of times that way. If you know exactly what they're doing and where they're going and that sort of thing, you know, off a roost hunt in the field,

27:39you know, blinds work pretty good and that sort of thing. But typically I just like to be able to take off on foot and do this and map and everything else. But yeah, yeah. But with a bow, you know, that's a totally different thing as well because I don't ever hunt, I've never even hunted turkeys with a bow, you know, big game. That's pretty much all I do. But I've never done it with turkeys because of the fact that I don't burn any powder during deer season usually. So come turkeys season, I want to pull a trigger, you know. I mean, I want to burn some powder. If you want to pull a trigger, I have an extra finger or an index release you can use. Yeah, same thing. That's right. That's right. But, you know, yeah, I've always enjoyed hunting, you know, the turkeys with a shotgun. And I think it's due to the fact that I do, you know, so much bow hunting on the big game side, you know,

28:41with deer, you know, you've really got to talk me out and put my bow down, you know. Yeah. If it's my choice, I'm taking a bow to stand every time. Oh, yeah. But, you know, sometimes I have to take a rifle or hear it in there. And it is fun to mix it up, you know, a little bit because I went for like 15 years and didn't even take a rifle in the woods, period. Yeah. You know, not even shoot those or anything. So, but I will from time to time just to mix it up. And, you know, I think that's why I like to carry shotgun when I'm turkey hunting this for that simple fact. Yeah, it's a chance to burn a little milder, you know. Everyone, it's funny because like I'll talk to my buddies that turkey hunt and, you know, they're all the same way. Like one of my good buddies that I talk to frequently, named Hunter, he calls me around this time of year and we're, I'm like, yeah, man, you know, you know, cause G5 came out of that new dirty bird head. So I'm like, yeah, I can't wait to use that. And he's like, man, I'm just going to take my shotgun out there

29:43and I'm just going, and I'm like, I can't even relate to it. Yeah, I'm like, I feel like the black sheep are the group because I'm just like, yeah, no, I just don't. It's been, it'll be seven years of this, this deer season that I have not taken a gun into the woods. Right. Well, taking a rifle into the woods, right? And I don't know what it is, man. I just, and again, it's just like you said, your own personal preference, right? But there's something about the challenge that just, yes, it seems so fun. Close quarters, you know, and that's kind of, you know, the turkeys close quarters too with shotgun or bow or anything. And I think I like that close quarters, combat kind of stuff, you know, more than it just got, when I was, when I had a rifle, it was just routine and machine like, there was no emotion. There was no anything in, you know, when you're shooting at something 300 yards away, the wind is no concern, you know?

30:45So, you know, you're there. There's not even a lot. Exactly. Exactly. When you, when you try to get within 30 yards of them, that's where it takes skill and knowledge and reading the weather situations and knowing what to do and where to set up. And, you know, it's same thing with deer and turkeys. We talked about that little center line, you know, at Georgia, Alabama, Mississippi, Louisiana. If you can kill a deer anywhere in that area, you can kill them anywhere in the country. Don't even get me started on the way it is. I've made some people mad saying that it's so bad that, so me and my buddy, Josh, we share a hunting spot, right? He mainly left it to me to deer hunt, but he wants to go turkey hunting because we've had some birds on camera. Which, by the way, we had a bearded hen on camera. I've never, I've heard of him, never seen him. Crazy as thing because I see the beard and like, in kill him in some states you can't. We can't, we can't in Georgia.

31:47So I'm like, no, I think you can in Alabama though. Dude, I honestly be able to in Alabama, but I'm not sure. Yeah, I was going to play the dummy for being my first season. I'm like, maybe. But then I thought about trying not a good idea just because I, you know, I don't want to break the law or anything. So that's right, that's right. That interest of thought got thrown away real quick, but it's just cool to see because she's the only bird there. So I'm like, it is. But he, you know, we're talking and, you know, it's, it's funny the, as far as I've seen, the inconsistency of these, of these birds. And like, you know, getting, getting to that and then the inconsistency of the deer lately. Because the deer, and I know, I said, we weren't really going to talk about deer, but I have to tell everybody this. I've been feeding at this place since basically season ended, right? And I was feeding during season two. Right. Haven't hunted it. Haven't done anything in there.

32:47I took my stand down end of January, right? Right. Two months ago. Yeah. And not only have I had a buck that potentially is still holding, which is crazy to me, right? The deer were gone for like multiple days at a time. And I finally got them to daylight today. So I'm like, are we going to have another weird year? I know it's very early in the season. There's no way to tell, but it's like, yeah, I haven't even done anything. I haven't peed in the woods. I haven't, you know, I've gone once every three weeks. Like, what's happening? Right. We still got a lot of acres on the ground. Oh, dude. Well, and that's very possible. That's very possibly what it is. Because walking in, it's the same thing. Like, a lot of them are broken open. A lot of them are rotting. But where the, where the feeds at, right? There's still tons. And I'm like, dude, this needs to go. I'm about to get a break. Yeah, just take them out of there. I know it. And that's a lot of what it made it hard hunting for us this year,

33:49just because of the fact that the food source was so abundant with all the acres. Because I don't care what you put now if it's protein feed or it's corn or whatever when those agents start dropping, you know, in late September, October, they're, they're, they're done messing with your feed. Oh, yeah. Apparently they're, they're getting a lot of money because of that. Yeah. And I mean, my pictures will go once they can start dropping, my pictures will go from, you know, 250 a day to 17, you know. Oh, I forgot you're on it. You're on a really good farm. So 70, I could see. 70 for me is like, oh, man, they're all in there. Oh, right, right, right. But they just, they love acres. There's no way to compete with them. And I was out in the woods the other day. And I cut a couple open with my pocket knife, just to see if they were still good and they were still still good. Are they red oaks or white oaks? I mean, what are they? How the ones I cut open were some water oaks. Oh, okay.

34:50Yeah, they were some water oaks, but, you know, if there's water oaks, there's the others that are there too. So they're still good. But yeah, there was just so many of them this year. Gosh, you know, I've never think many. Do you think that because of the huge crop that we had last year that these deer are going to go into the growing season like with a lot more, I don't want to say potential. But like, do you think that we might see some, some bucks blow up this season because of all this food? It's going to help for sure. Okay. It's going to help for sure. But typically they're, you know, just now starting to regrow their antlers and all as the acre and crops kind of diminishing. Okay. So, you know, typically, you know, that's where your protein and stuff that you feed year-round comes into play because they're getting just as much protein out of that as they are the acres or whatever. It's just what's available at the time. And in the summer, you don't have typically, you don't have acres.

35:53You know, you might have some that make it through. Like I say, there's still some good ones on the ground right now. So there's that. But, you know, during the summertime, they hit that protein hard. I mean, they literally will demolish it, you know, during starting June, July, all good. They put such a hurt and all protein. It's, it's unreal. Oh, it broke my bank, man. Last year, no joke. Just that one spot. Remember I told you I had all those bugs on property? Right. I was going twice a week. Oh, yeah. And it'd be gone in a day. And I'm like, you're gonna eat me out of house and home, man. I need to, because I put a food block out and they wouldn't touch it. But you put that, you put corn or buck bourbon or any, you know, not to do like a shameless plug or whatever. Because I mean, I don't work with them. But it's stuff that works really well. Oh, yeah. I mean, I was spending 80, 80 to $100 a week. Yeah, just on feed. I'm like, yo, next year, y'all are getting a food plot. I can't do this. Like, I'm gonna make a micro plot. I'll throw some clover out.

36:53Like, I'm good. And that's the best thing, you know, clover's such a good food source that gives you your own protein. Yeah. And it's got a real good protein content. And it's their year round. It's not like soy beans and oats or that other stuff that you're just catching for a time period out of the year. You know, those perennials that have high protein is just, you know, it's good stuff that works year round. Because your turkeys will feed on clover like no joke. I mean, you know, you can look in their crawl. I always look in their crawl to see what they're eating and all. And, you know, lots of times the majority, everything is in there's clover. So maybe that's what I need to do then. Maybe I'll stop putting food out and just, because the thing is like, one, and I think I might have told you this last time. I don't remember, but one property, I need to go over there and cut everything to the dirt or as low as I can before it rains and then plant it. Right. But the other one, I have, I'm basically gonna have to take a backpack,

37:55blow it and just clear out a whole, because it'd be a very small, like probably, 30 by 30 foot patch of clover, right? Because it have to be a microplot. I don't even know if you'd call that a microplot. I don't know what you would call that. But the biggest thing is making sure it's got enough sunlight, making sure it's there's rain. And I mean, I saw somewhere that we're supposed to be in pretty much a drought for the next like three weeks. It's very well-cooked, baby. Yeah. It's through everything in the blender. And I'm like, well, I guess we'll just see what happens. But I want to switch gears a little bit back to Turkey. So one thing I've heard a lot of people say, and I don't know, does again, never been Turkey. I've heard people compare Turkey hunting to elk hunting. Yeah. Is it similar? Yes, it is a very good analogy actually, because if I was made of money, I would live in September out west elk hunting,

38:56because it is a joint of two of my favorite things, kind of Turkey hunting and deer hunting. It kind of combines the both of them, because you're able to call the elk in that kind of stuff. So you're calling like your Turkey hunting, which you don't do with a deer. So it's like Turkey hunting for a huge animal is basically what it is. And to that aspect where I told you earlier, if a turkey could smell, you'd never kill him, elk hunting, you've got to take the smell into consideration, because that elk can smell. And that's what makes it a little bit tough bohunting for the elk is you've got to watch your wind. They don't, in my personal opinion, they don't have quite as good of eyesight as a white tail deer does. You can kind of get away with a little more movement with an elk. They're not as jumpy per se is white tail.

39:58So they don't jump strings, right? Yeah, they don't, you know, they're a little bit more, I guess just being such a bigger creature, you know, bigger you are the hard it is to be agile. And I don't know if that's it, or if their brain processing is just a little slower, I don't know what's going on. There's a little bit dumber than the average white tail. Let's just say it. I don't know quite. We don't mule deer. You know that mulees are probably the dumbest deer species on the planet. I've seen so many videos, man, where someone gets a shot off and then just bound off 20 yards, and then they turn around like, what about that? And then they take another arrow and I'm like, see, I like you guys. Y'all look cool. And elk can respond a lot like that as well, but yeah, elk hunting is, I would live out west September if I could, because, you know, here in those bugles, it's just unreal. I mean, it makes a hair on the back of your neck stand up. Now wish I could do it more than I do it. You know, you can go out there. There's a lot of public land out there that you can hunt.

41:00And so you can go out there, but most of us, you know, over here on the east coast, you know, we've got jobs. We can't afford to be gone from our job for two to three weeks just to find some elk. And it can take two to three weeks to find what you're looking for out there. And it takes a lot of hiking into that backcountry to be able to get to where they are. Because it's just like public land and everything else, you know, around the roadways is hunting really hard. So you got to push way back in there to find the good stuff. And it's a lot of work and, you know, it's really a lot of work to find a good bull or to find a good herd that you want to watch, you know, that kind of thing. And we don't have three weeks to take off to go do that. So a lot of what we're doing from here is paying for the convenience of a guide to already know where these herds are and take you straight to them. So what I was going to suggest, we have to spend a little bit more money to get that.

42:02Let's see, here's the thing, I have a great idea for you. And I don't mean to cut you off, but you got to hear this because it just comes to my head. Yeah, get with Tyler. Okay, sit down with Tyler, say Tyler, buddy, brother. Can I call your brother, brother? I want to kill a big elk. So here's what we do. Real tree pays for you to go to Colorado or whatever, whatever, you can even do OTC, right? Real tree pays for the trip, cover expenses, whatever. You guys film it, you make a video of it. And the kicker is you do with DNR over there, what you did with DNR when you did your turkey video. Uh-huh, yeah. You know where I'm going with this? Oh, yeah, I know. Tell me that wouldn't be great. That is good on TikTok, that's good on YouTube, that would hit. So just an idea, I don't know if Tyler and anything would be into it, but I don't know.

43:03I don't know if their DNR would be into it. We had to work that way up the chain in the real chain. If real tree, if somebody from real tree, if, if, if bill, called them, hey, yeah, probably knows them by name. Hey, we want to do this. We have this idea would one of your officers be down. I promise you somebody would be down. Yeah, I guarantee it. They'd be stupid not to. But I know Colorado is a little funky. Like I'm going there next year, at least I'm supposed to. Uh-huh. And some of the stuff I've looked at, I'm like, dude, this ain't Georgia. It's so different. Right. Yeah, when you get out West, this is totally different mentality. And going back to the turkeys a little bit right here, when you go out West, they hate a turkey. They do not understand why we want to kill them. Really? They're like a nuisance to them out West. You know, you get in Colorado, New Mexico, Wyoming. All those good turkey areas out West. And they sit there and look at us like we're stupid to want to hunt them. They hate them. They hate them. They wish you'd wipe them off the map.

44:05So reason? No, they just don't, I guess they're just not big turkey hunters out there. You know, a lot of those outfitters and all that kind of stuff out there will tell you the only customers we get are from y'all over on the East Coast, you know, in the Southeast area. And, you know, you get in the Southeast area and we're huge turkey hunters. Oh, yeah. But you go out there and they care nothing about them. Like I was in Buffalo, Wyoming a couple of years ago. And they walk, the turkeys walk through the town. I mean, it's crazy. They are literally, we saw two on Mount back of the feed store picking up busted bags and stuff. Just turkeys all through, I mean, like down Main Street, there's turkeys walking the sidewalk, you know, and they hate them. And there's part of the community, man. Exactly. Exactly. You know, they'll watch your dog for you. But they'll sit there and go, yeah, they sit there and go, we have no clue why y'all want to come out here and kill these.

45:06Yeah. Well, it's probably because they have elk and they have moose and they have you leaves like, I get it, right? And I still. It's a bit of a fallacy. Yeah. And I mean, I do feel like it's funny too, because you know, I got my uncle that lives in Colorado and all that. And we'll talk about the differences between Colorado hunting and like, George hunting. And we have noticed knowing, like, you know, we both know people that are from the West, that are from Midwest, North, whatever. The funny thing is I feel like down here in our area, especially Georgia, it's hunting fishing. Right. It doesn't matter what it is, like, yeah, you're going to go do it. Right. Year. Turkey's bears. I mean, Bobcat. I saw some dude. He posted something about beaver hunting. Yeah. Yeah. It's great. I mean, iguanas in Florida iguanas in Florida. Yeah. People that go down there and shoot them with pellet guns and all kinds of freaking Paul Centagron with Centagron outdoors, dude.

46:06They go every year and the funniest thing is when it gets cold down there and they start falling out of the trees. Yeah. Yeah. Imagine just standing out there by the water and an iguana hit you in the head. Yeah. Little 20 pound Godzilla flying out of the. Yeah. They just literally start falling out of the trees. It's that that amazes me. See, that's what makes us out. So interesting. I'm telling you. I have big deer, but we got some interesting animals. We do that. That's. That is for sure. That's wild. So what, um, changing gears a little bit, what is your, what's your setup look like this year? Bowies and arrow and all that stuff. Bowies and all that stuff. Bowies and all that stuff. You know, I, I still run hoyd, I absolutely love the hoyd brand. I'm running the X three this year. Oh, instead. You didn't want to go with the X 90. Do what? You got the X 90 man. I can't pull all that weight. I'm getting old. I'm getting old. The thing I like about the hoids the past few years is they've been coming in a few

47:09pounds heavy, which is putting my bows about 73 pounds roughly and that is just perfect for me. And, you know, really, there's no need to go over that. I mean, you know, like 10 new jujuts, 48 pounds and hunt animals all over the world. Today's bows are so efficient that you really don't have to put all that weight. Now, if I was out west and constantly hunting bigger game like, you know, your elk, moose, grizzlies, that kind of stuff, you might want to amp it up a little bit if you were comfortable doing it. 70 pounds is plenty enough to do the job, but you could shoot a little further, get a little flatter trajectory and that sort of thing. If you were up there around that 80 pound, there's very few people I've ever dealt with that get out of the 70 pound above the 70 pound category.

48:09What else one of the only ones I know, what else runs an 80 pound bow, but he's also hunting moose. He lives out west during September, hunting elk. Oh, believe me. I know. Yeah, he's hunting grizzlies. He's hunting grizzlies before. I mean, he's hunting these big animals where you need it. But honestly, I'm probably counting on one hand, the 80 pound bows I've dealt with over the year. Here, at least in my area, it seems like everybody wants to start pushing heavier, right? Yeah. I shoot 75. My buddy Hunters got his up to like 94 and it's RX 4. So I'm shocked. He hasn't even blown up on him yet, but it is funny too, because you know, I nerd out on this stuff, right? Right. So I'm sitting here with my like 72, 73, at least that's what I think it is. I probably need to check because no joke. It feels heavy. It feels like it's drawing heavier than what it should.

49:10Yeah. Which I'm okay with. You know, I had to drop arrow weight this year just so I could maintain relatively the same speed. Yeah. And that's why a lot of people are kind of amping up on talentage a little bit because heavy, heavier errors and FOC has been a big trend. And especially if you have a shorter drawling, I've noticed some of your shorter drawling people that are trying to amp it up a little bit because there again, speed is a factor. Could you lose in 10 feet a second per inch of draw? So the shorter you are, the more speed you're losing and you're losing it quick. So the best way to gain your speed is through poundage. So that's why you see some of your shorter draws amping up a little bit. As long as you're 28 to 30 inches where a majority of the people are, you're okay without amping up into that 80 pound category because I typically like my error set up to be between

50:15about 270 and 290, you know, that's where I want to hit and I kind of build my error around that of what I'm warming with a 70 pound bow. So I just kind of craft my error around the speed I want like right now with my bow set up at like 72, 73 pounds in my error set up, I'm running right at 280, which is perfect for me. Yeah. It's a solid set up. So and I do like a little bit heavier error. I don't get carried away with it. A lot of people are getting really, really carried away with this FOC in my opinion and they're putting out over 600 grain errors and all that for a white tail deer. I mean, to me, that's taken it a little far. Yeah. That's too much. As far as white tail deer go, that is just too far, you know, I kind of like my set up is usually around 470ish, give or take a little bit depending on what veins I'm running

51:20or if I'm running light at night or night or whatever. You know, typically that's about where I want my error weight at and it's good enough to get really good penetration on the deer because my whole deal with the deer is that exit hole so important to me is far as finding the animal and getting a good blood trail. So I want to do as much as I can to get that error out the other side and, you know, so I tend to go a little bit on the heavier side for me, but there's some people running some heavy, heavy, heavy stuff that's just, you know, it's, I sit there and go, why, you know, into the day, why? Just grab a spear. You're going to do the same thing. Yeah. So, I mean, what, so what drawling through you 29, 28, oh, okay, so we're the same, we're the same drawling then. Yeah. So what I've noticed with like my arrow build, because I always do, especially going to

52:20tack every year now, I always do a tack build and then right, a hunting build, which typically will pretty much fall in the same weight range. I guess it's just what I like to use and what I'm comfortable with, confident with, whatever. But this year, I did a little test because my boat, so the boat that I shot last year is like 13 foot a second faster than my boat was this year. Right. And so taking that into account, because I want the same speed and still heavy after her. Dude, I dropped it. Like, I was running 445 last year and I think when I weighed the ones that I've been shooting, I've got without lighted nox and 125 ground point. I'm at 432. Yeah. But I want to use a lot of nox because I'm going to start filming this year and if I was like, if I do that, it's going to be heavy and I'm going to be slower than what I'd like, right? It's not going to make a huge difference. But I'm already working with, you know, a slower bow. Right. Because I got the, uh, the seven inch brace height instead of the six, so, you know, comfort

53:23is going to be more forgiving in that. Exactly. Exactly. And then dropped to a hundred grain point with a lighted knock and it's like 418. Yeah. And I shot them both, um, it wasn't, yes, it was two days ago, three days ago. I shot the 432, no lighted knock, 418, lighted knock. No difference. Right. At 40 yards, 45 yards, no difference. So I'm like, that's good. Doesn't really matter. But see the thing is I can't run, though, because I want 125, because I'd like to be around 15, 16% FOC, but I just want to be able to see the arrow when I shoot it. Correct. So what do I do, you know, though, I think I'm just going to stick with the 418. And if that doesn't work, then I'll switch and deal with it. But it's, I do this every year, you know, and that's what I was curious like what your setup is, because I used to run, you know, low fives, high fours, and I don't, I've noticed

54:24I've been going less and less and less. Right. But see the thing about speed, and I'm curious your opinion on this, I've heard so many arguments that you're never going to get an arrow to the deer quick enough, which is true, but you also don't want to have too slow of an arrow to give it more time to react more. Correct. And I've listened to everybody in, it's an age old argument that'll never be settled. Yeah. It would just never be settled, but you know, it's kind of like me throwing a ping pong ball at your face versus me throwing a bowling ball at your face at the same mile per hour, which one's going to hurt worse and do more damage, you know, exactly. I understand the speed and getting there fast and deer jumping the string and all that I do. But I read an article and it's been a long time ago, but it was one of these big mathematicians

55:25that crunch all the figures and everything. And he said, if a deer is going to jump your bow at 260, he's going to jump at it 300. Oh, yeah. It doesn't matter. There's not enough math in there to justify beating him jumping that string. Yeah. There's, there's no leeway, you know, if he's going to jump at it 260, it didn't matter if you were shooting a 320 feet per second bow, the outcome was still going to be basically the same. Yeah. As far as him crunching the numbers and adding everything together, they said it didn't matter. They said there's not enough feet per second difference in that little area between slow bows and fast bows to make a difference on a deer jumping your arrow. Now, I don't know because I can't crush those figures, but this guy sounded smart. And so we trust him.

56:26But then again, I go back to that same deal about, you know, everybody's going to argue every side, you know, I can throw out a positive, you're this person that's on speed is going to throw a negative right back at me. And it just comes down to a personal preference and shoot what makes you happy. Yeah. You know, I see too many people going, you're, you're an idiot for shooting this man. If you're happy with it high five, high five, if that's what you want to shoot, what you feel is the right, you know, Arab builder, both for the job, go with it, go with do it, do you, you know, but there's a lot of people that if they're not doing it, if you're not doing it their way, you're wrong. Yeah. And in the archery world, there's more than one way to skin a cat, you know, multiple people can be right.

57:26Yeah. Yeah. So I have multiple people can be right, but some people don't see life or bohunting or whatever through that same aspect. Yeah. But I know me and T-bone got into it a couple of years ago, not got into it like already right just to go into the topic. And I did a whole thing one spring on arrows, right? Yeah. I might have told you this, but I've had, I had ranch fairy on, yeah, and he advocated for 650. Mm hmm. Fine. And he's big on a lot of way. Oh, yeah. More power to it. Yeah. You're going to get good penetration. Yeah. You'll get penetration bass. The bass. Yeah. Then I had Tim Gillingham on, yeah, who shoots sub 400 with a 33 inch draw length, right? So I'm like, I'm going through this and I'm planning out the rest of the episodes. I'm like, man, you know who I need to get on here? I need to talk to T-bone, dude. This I think was before you and I met. So, right, like, I just need to get T-bone on here because he's just going to shoot

58:28it straight. So I remember asking him, I'm like, T-bone, what would you say for the average guy, 28 inch draw, 70 pounds, you know, decent speed bow, right? Like the single cam stuff, that's a whole different topic. But our bows are typically anywhere between 315 to 340. You shoot, you know, a cicario, you're shooting 360, but whatever. Brown. Brown. What's the what's the middle ground arrow build? He goes. Yeah. 450. Yeah. Like 450 is the middle ground that you can get away with a lot of stuff and so like that and then I remember kind of hearing from someone else, I might have been J or somebody, they were shooting low fours. Oh, no, you know what? It was Josh Jones and he was talking about how he hunts elk with 420 grain arrows. Right. And I wouldn't be scared to do that. Yeah. Honestly, I wouldn't be scared to hunt them out. And a lot of it to be honest, we bulls-down shot placement more than, you know, our stuff. If you hit, if you hit the animal, where you're supposed to hit it, you know, a field

59:34tip with a standard 350-year-hanging arrow is going to kill him every time. So you know, I would work more on your efficiency to put that arrow where it needs to go versus, you know, so much as far as the arrow build. But you know, it's just like you say, you'll talk with people, you know, as long as you stay above five grains per pound, you're not doing any damage to the boat and you're fine. So as long as you're, if you're shooting 70 pounds, that's 350 grain arrow is the minimum you want to shoot. Now you start going less than that, you're going to start damaging your boat. Love it. It's going to start functioning like a dry fire into a degree. So you want to make sure you're above that, you know, five grains per pound. What's your above there? Do whatever the heck you want to and make you happy. But I know, I'm more than that teabon there to where I can ride that middle maybe a little

1:00:36bit more to the heavy side. But I'm not going to, I'm not going to argue with anybody over it because if it's what you like and what you believe in, a lot of it's all up here, you know, it's like me. I sit here and look at an arrow and I look at one that's one thousandths and I look at one arrow that's three thousandth straightness, okay? In my mind, I know I can't shoot the difference between one and three, but what am I going to buy? The one thousandths. Exactly because it's up here. Now I know I can't shoot the difference between one and three, not with my human element involved in the situation. So, you know, but it's, it's got to be up here if you're headed and right, you're not going to shoot right. So that's why I say, man, whatever you believe in and whatever you think is going to work and whatever, you know, you've had success with, that's where you need to be.

1:01:39Whether it's a 150 grain arrow or a 650 grain arrow, you know, whatever, that's the great thing about America. It's, we're free to do whatever the hell we want to do. Yes. Yeah. For now, we'll see how things go, but it's legal and not hurt near equipment, man, I'm going to give you a high five all day, all day, all day, but there are a lot of people that take it personal. Oh, dude, I've gotten into so many arguments, so many. And like, that's why I bring it up on here sometimes because it's like, I know how I am and what I'm probably going to end up doing is second guessing the lighter build and just go back to what I know works because let's be honest, you might want to run the lighter build. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I'm talking about when the air season switch over to heavier, you know, air, exactly. And there's lots of, lots of different things you're doing as far as different weights. I know a lot of people that will change up from a white tail to melt. They'll change their whole air setup and all. I don't do that because I wouldn't do that.

1:02:41I'm running an era heavy enough. I feel comfortable with, you know, with deer or elk, but I do know people that have two different setups when they go out west, they run a totally different era with a different weight, maybe a different side, that kind of stuff. Yeah. I use my deer setup for here, anywhere I go. Well, let's be honest, kids, where we're hunting that, what's the farthest shot we're going to take? Maybe 40. Maybe. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. If you shoot past 40 in Georgia. Well, where are you? In most people, honestly, don't need to shoot past 40. No, I'll completely agree. You know, as far as when you take the movement of the animal in there, it's just like if I can see a deer at 80 yards, can I make that shot? Yeah. I can make that shot. But what is that deer going to do from the time the air leaves my boat till it gets to that target? Exactly. I think a step or two, and I went from a kill shot to a gut shot or a wound shot or

1:03:46a miss. So it's not all about your capability. It's what can go wrong in between the release of that era and when it gets to the animal. And that's when like where I'm at, deer jump your string, they're edgy, they're, you know, just skittishes all get out. So anything over a 40 yard shot. Yes, you can make it. But is it really the right decision in that what each individual now in the Midwest where a deer is much more laid back, I push it to 60 yards, or maybe even a little further than that if the deer's really, really laid back. So isn't there something, because I've heard people talk about this in depth that have actually taken these shots, probably the shot I've ever taken was 25 yards, right? Right. I don't know nothing, but what I have heard from a lot of people is between 30 and 40.

1:04:49I don't want to shoot them because at 20, yeah, they hear the noise, right? They go off. They might, they probably hear the arrow coming, but it's such a short distance that you have less of a chance of them actually moving. But from 30 to 40, they hear it. The arrow's not there yet, right? And then they move. So it's like, yeah, I just, have you seen that? I, I had watched a lot and kind of dove into it and gone down a lot of rabbit holes as far as wide deer's jumping the string. In the most consistent, accurate information I've gotten is that the deer is here in the veins. It's not your bow going off. It's not your release clicking, not anything. It is the veins of the arrow in flight. You know, if, if you will sit somebody down, you know, about 10 yards from the target. Let's just say you're, you got somebody shooting at 50 yards.

1:05:50If you put them about the 15 yard mark and just let them listen, is that air comes by? It is making a lot of noise. Oh, yeah, it's like a, oh, yes. And so, you know, I shoot a flat, flat vein, which is very thin, but yet very, very durable. And it's probably got about the less noise, you know, as far as aerodynamic flight noise. It's, it's not very loud, but I've shot some veins before that man. They sound like an F, F 16 coming in front of you. But you never really know it is the shooter. But if you'll do that when you're out shooting with a buddy or whatever, don't stand right in front of the target, you know, stand up to the side before it. And about halfway between the shooter and the target and listen to that air when it comes in front of you. So I do believe that the deer is, is responding off the sound of that fletching.

1:06:52I don't think they're really hearing the bow as much as many people think they are. Yeah. I was at the, I was at the range with Josh last weekend, you know, siding the bow in and just kind of shooting. Right. You don't even have to be with some arrows, right? Some veins. You don't even have to be 15 yards. You can be standing next to him and I'm here. And we're shooting 70, 70 plus. Yeah. And as soon as he let that thing go, I heard it just go. Right. And I'm like, huh, I'm right next to you and I could hear that. Yeah, it's crazy. So that is correct. And each little arrow dynamic thing, each thing you change on a bow. I mean, I've had veins do it. I've had knocks do it. I've had inserts that, you know, were kind of, you know, flared out a little bit. Any little thing you do changes the noise level of that air. And you don't really notice it from the shooter's perspective. You know, it's something you kind of have to back up on.

1:07:54But you'll see tests where they do decimal tests and all that on veins. And Easton's been doing a lot of really good, accurate dives into this kind of stuff. As far as broad heads, errors, veins, they did a real good thing on veins last year. As far as, you know, flight noise, that kind of stuff. And so, you know, as technology moves on, we're able to capture more data and more areas and actually see what different things are doing from a controlled environment, not adding human element or whatever into it. But yeah, there's some good stuff out there. I mean, what's crazy to me, like, I was listening to, I think it was the podium archer podcast. And they had the owner of DCA, yeah, it's the super sabers. Yeah, he was talking about how he ran a bunch of tests, tested his against other veins and stuff.

1:08:54And what it's doing to the air, because, you know, I'm big, like, I'm a weather nerd, like tornadoes fascinate me, right? So when he started talking about this, my ears perked up because he was like, you're creating little tornadoes. Right. It's basically what you're doing. He's like, when you're that air that you're hearing, that's just a mini tornado coming off the vein. For example, like, if helical has stuff to do with all of that, I mean, some people put a really radical helical or five degrees. Yep. On their stuff, you know, and typically I'm, I like between two to three on the three fletch. And that's another argument that'll, that'll go on forever. You know, was three fletch, four fletch, I profiled, I profiled, there's so much that goes into the equation there. Yeah. But try telling campaign's not to run four fletch and see how that works out for you. Yeah, I know it. But, you know, if you're running a fixed head and a heavy set up, I could see where it might be a little bit beneficial, you know, when he's out there in that kind of territory

1:10:00where you run that kind of stuff, you know, you're going to have a little bit of heavier air, you know, that sort of thing. So, you know, I would say if you're going to run four, that's definitely the place to do it. Yeah. I've done it. So fixed head. But I've ran four, but it just, I don't know, man, I've, look, I can't shoot the difference. I'll tell you that. Right. Like, I've got some four fletch behind me. Yeah. I've shot him at distance. They don't have heavy helical. And the thing is, I'm kind of getting away from like the major helical stuff. And if you do that with a four fletch to where it starts wrapping over and cutting the next vein off, you can end up in some big problems. Yeah. I had that happen. I mean, that I built like two years ago, three years ago, something like that, just playing around, you know, because this time of year is when I do that. And I was running a five degree four fletch and I shot it at distance and I could literally see the back end of the arrow just wobbling or crashing.

1:11:01Yeah. And I'm like, oh, man, like it dropped out of the sky. It was crazy. So I do like the heavy helical for, you know, close, right? Like hunting setups. That's right. Because those those groups are ridiculously tight. But if you're shooting distance, I mean, I experienced it this past weekend shooting what I have because I mean, I was when I was siding in, I was noticing like, you know, on the dialed side, it's got the numbers, right? So you start zero and then you five, 10, 15, 20 all the way to, I guess, 100. I don't even know. But yeah. And then you just match it up to a tape or whatever. So we started at 20, 30, 40, figured that out. And then we went to 50 and we go to 60, 70, 80, and then we jumped to 100, right. And the difference, you could plainly see, yeah, and I know it was because of the helical. Yeah. They're good to a point. Once you get past 70, it starts dropping like crazy. Right. So I, I make it away from that. I love how we, we started this off, meaning to talk about turkeys and we have 30 minutes

1:12:05of it. Now we're talking arrows and deer and all that. Yeah. I don't know where my mind's at. Oh, I'm bad about that. I'll circle talk and end up over here and come back to here and ain't no telling where I'm going to end up. But that's what makes it fun. Exactly. That's why people listen to this because all the day guys in this episode, we're talking to so and so about this. And it's not about that at all. And it's not about that at all. Yeah. One thing I want to bring up with you before we hop off here and it's been, I did, I don't know if you listen to it or not. If you haven't, please listen to it because it's very, very good episode. It's not me plugin. It's not me trying to promote or nothing, but it's, it's a very good episode that I just dropped this week with a buddy of mine, Dustin Cole. And the topic was men's mental health, which we don't talk about enough. Right. How do you, I guess without getting too personal, right? Yeah. You struggle with that. I mean, especially being the, in my opinion, the legend in the industry that you are, like, do you have, hey, listen, man, ain't nobody got it.

1:13:09I hope Doug hears this. No one's got a stash like you. All right. I'm just going to throw it out there. All right. Fight me. But all joking aside, like, you know, because I've dealt with the imposter syndrome and like dear season's really rough and all that. But do you deal with that? Like is that something that I do, I do deal with it. I mean, I'm not going to lie there will keep me up at night sometimes, you know, just trying to figure a mile, play in different scenarios. This, that and everything else, what situations, what wins, what this, I think I have a problem with overthinking a lot of stuff that I'm doing periodically. And it can really get my head. And there was a year, about six, seven years ago where I had a specific deer. I wanted to hunt and kill. I had a lot of history with the deer. And I became obsessed with him. And that was one of the only years I've ever had to where I didn't kill a buck in Georgia period.

1:14:09And it just got in my head and got me all messed up to where it was that deer, no deer. And you know, after season, I kind of sat back and realized that I'd let that deer creep into my head and take over and, you know, so I told myself I never let that happen again, you know, when I haven't, but yeah, I'll go down some rabbit holes and get thinking and overthinking everything as far as a lot of it goes. Yeah. I mean, like, how do you combat, like, when you get, you know, because as men, like, we have a lot of weight on our shoulders, right, Ron, I mean, how do you combat that? Like, I go at it with my faith where I'm like, yeah, God, I'm, I'm, I'm in a dark place right now, man. I've had two days this past month where I literally wanted nothing to do with anyone, like, dude, I told the story last week, I'll tell you this, too, and this is how bad it got, right? And I'm not trying to get like, you know, depressing or anything, but people need to do these things.

1:15:10Yeah. There was a day that me and my daughter went to church. My wife was out of town. And I was just in this weird mood, like, I woke up and it was in a very weird mood, tried to fight it, was happy to be at church, but church was a little, like, I just felt this connected. And so the family was there. And my daughter wanted to go to her grandma's place. Yeah. And my, my new, excuse me, my sister-in-law just had her baby in January, right? I love this kid. She's right. My little niece, like, she's tiny, like, baby's terrifying me, but I always want to see her. And do that day. I'd tell my daughter, I was like, hey, you can go to your grandma's house, you can go to Gigi's. No big deal. Right. Right. But, yeah, I'm going to go home. Yeah. And I just literally went home. And right. It was the weirdest thing. And I told my wife, I'm like, I don't know what is wrong. Yeah. And, you know, obviously, I'm very open about my faith on here. So I prayed about it and got through and everything was fine.

1:16:10But like, I'm just curious to hear from other, other guys, like, how do you deal with it? Like, what gets you out of that? Yeah. You know, it's one of those things where you've almost got to just sit down and tell yourself, it's just a deer. Yeah. You know, I mean, like, in life in general, I'm not talking just about hunting, you know, talking like when it maybe isn't even related to hunting, like, right, right. What? Because the thing is, I could sit here all day long and say, hey, man, take it to Jesus, do what you got to do. And I'm being honest. Right. But there's people that listen to this that maybe don't have a relationship with them or maybe they've got their own thing that, you know, is keeping them from doing that. And I just, I'm trying to think of ways that maybe I can be like, all right, well, if you don't want to go down that rabbit or that route, I'm not going to, you know, I'm not going to force it down to anyone's throat. Right. But I'm trying to think of ways where I could be like, okay, well, maybe try this, you know, so like, if I'm prying, let me know. No, no, you're not prying, you know, but I'm big in, you know, my fake too.

1:17:14So, you know, that's definitely a go to praying about it, that kind of stuff that, that tends to ease my mind a lot, you know, as far as that side of everything goes. But maybe that's just the answer then. Yeah. You know, I mean, it's the best answer. That's what I'm saying. I'm just here. Yeah. But, you know, a lot of it's, you know, when you get down, when you get beat up, you know, when you feel like life's just not going your way, lots of times I have to sit down and focus on all the positive things that are going on, because I'll focus and dwell on the negative too much and I have a problem myself of being my own worst credit, you know, nobody's really got to get on to me because I'm being hard enough on myself already. Yeah. So, if I know I've messed up, you really don't have to say anything to me. Yeah. Without you saying anything and I beat myself up 10 times worse than you could ever.

1:18:16It just makes it worse when they get on to you and they don't know. Yeah. In a lot of times. Yeah. And a lot of times I just have to sit down and, you know, go, yes, this is going bad. And it's not where I want it to be, but what all good is going on around me. Yeah. You know, and you can even put pen to paper and do a pros and cons list. And I guarantee you the pros definitely outweigh the cons. Yeah. And when you start realizing that, I think it shifts your mindset a little bit. Yeah. I think you start realizing, because there's lots of times we all sit back and think we're being beat up and kicked while we're down and stuff of that nature. But, you know, I mean, I had something like that happen recently, man, where someone kind of called me out on, and the thing is, I didn't even think I was being. Like negative or right or anything, right? Right. And I got called out on it. And I did the whole day and I was like, yeah, you know, I do sound very ungrateful with

1:19:18a lot of stuff that I do, right? Yeah. And I don't mean to. And maybe it's just, you know, my sarcasm, right? I'm very sarcastic. You know this. So. Yeah. Well, a lot of people don't like other people being direct. And I like a direct person to deal with me because I don't ever have to worry about what that one person's thinking, you know, because they're going to tell me, yeah, lots of times I need to be told that and it might shock me initially or whatever, but when you sit back and think about it, you know, they're right. Yeah. And this is going on and I do need to fix this and maybe I am doing this a little bit wrong. Yeah. So, you know, a lot of times you just got to sit back and reflect on what it is. And if it's something you need to work on or if it's something that's not, because you got a lot of people in the world now that are spewing hate, just a spew hate, they don't

1:20:19mean anything. They don't even know you. I mean, we get people coming in on all our videos on stuff. They come in and make these negative comments. Yeah. So, if you let that kind of stuff get to you, it will. Oh, yeah. I've had my fair share, dude, I told you before I did an episode on the Rumpola book. That's the negative comments I've ever gotten and like people are, people are literally jumping on there and I read them because most of them are funny, but there's been a few that they're like, man, these two idiots and I had one guy comment, now this video is two years old. Okay. Right. So, the shows you people are still, which is crazy, but people are still watching it. And this guy commented, I think last night or this morning and all he said was, man, one of these guys has to be Blacky Chan from the skeptics group and I'm like, well, I left the group. So, it ain't me. I don't know if this dude was one of them, maybe, but it's crazy, man. And like, there's people, some of the most negative stuff I've seen, right? And in Joe Road, you've got a great quote, don't read the comments, just don't.

1:21:24Exactly. Some people that, man, it gets in their heads and ruins their days and stuff like that. And I'm like, man, you know, there's some people that just hate their life so much that they have to try and make other people's lives miserable and I truly feel sorry for that person. Oh, yeah. I pray for you. It's so miserable that they've got to try to make other people miserable because nobody that's living a happy life and it's happy with themselves and happy with others is going to stoop to that level. Oh, yeah. You know, so you're dealing with somebody that's got, you know, issues somewhere as far as being able to make a comment like that. I've been on social media ever since social media was a thing and I've never left one negative comment anywhere. You can't talk to the teenager. When I was a kid, but there are people, I truly believe this.

1:22:25There are people that get up every day in trouble. Oh, yeah. Then happy. Russia has a lot of those accounts just for people who are listening that don't know. No, it's crazy, man. Like I see it a lot. I feel sorry for that person because you've got to be a miserable person for you to get an enjoyment out of trying to be a little other people in a point with me is calm. I mean, it is I just sit there and look at it. The thing for me that I always have to remember and this is for, you know, maybe you need to hear it. Maybe people listening to you. I hope one person listening to this hears this and is like, dang, he's right. But if God woke you up today, you have nothing to complain about because there's people who went to sleep last night. Yeah. And did not wake up and it's like, you know, the older I've gotten, because you know, I'll be 31 on Saturday, right?

1:23:26So yeah, that's not all. Thanks, buddy. That means a lot coming from you. I'm going to quote that, frame it, it's going to my bedroom. Probably sleep with it. But no, I, the older I've gotten, I've really started thinking about it where it's like, dude, you know, I thank him for everything I've got every night, every morning, right? And, and even when I struggle with stuff, because I still, the, the old me, I said this last week too, the old me loves to try and rears ugly head, right? And those are I get to him completely dying the more he tries. Yeah. And when that happens, even when that happens, it's, you know, I go to God for it. I talk to Jesus about it. And I look at, I'll take a step back and be like, okay, what, like you were saying, make a pros and cons list. Right. That's a good stuff. I have a beautiful wife. I have a beautiful daughter. I have a roof over my head. I've got food. The podcast is doing great. I have a good relationship with the Lord. I've got friends.

1:24:26I can, I can hitch you up anytime and be like, Hey, Pits, what's going on? And I don't feel like I'm bothering you. Right. And it's like that sort of stuff. I've got to be thankful for because there's, there's, it could all go away like that. Oh, you know, and it, I don't mean to get so deep on it, but like it really has been a thing. Cause I mean, let me put it this way. I know guys that felt so down and beaten and everything that they literally had a loaded pistol next to them. Oh, yeah. We're about to pull it. Right. Some divine intervention came in and they didn't. And I thank God for that because to get to that point, I mean, I've been there before. I was a teenager. So it could have just been hormones, right? But, you know, I think Joe Rogan, the best thing he, he said once was the worst thing that's ever happened to you is the worst thing that's ever happened to you. Right. I think a lot of people, you know, we all have different upbringings like my upbringing

1:25:26is completely different than yours, right? Right. I'm sure there's things that have happened to me that to you would be like, absolutely no big deal. And I know, especially in the field that you're in, I know you've seen things that would probably break me. So it's just like, I feel, I guess what I'm getting at is I feel like, you know, I'm getting to feel like we need to be more as, as a, either society or let's just say the hunting community. Right. And he wants me a big butt killer. Everybody wants to be, you know, the next leelis or the next whoever, Ron, the, what's the, what's the, what's the word I'm looking for? The bashing and the negativity that I see, you don't know who you're talking to. Like you don't know what that person's going through, right? So why do that? Yeah. I guess that's why I love getting you on here, man, because you're not, you're not one of those people that's like, oh, I'm not, my balls are bigger than, than, than, down the street. Like I killed a one tonish. And I'm the best dancer. I'm a baddest man in the world. But like, you're not like that. And it's, it's a lot of people are unfortunately.

1:26:29Yeah. I just, you know, it's just me. I, I can't believe somebody like you won't stop to me. I mean, you know, it's just, it's just, you know, it's, if you've seen them, it's just seen the videos you put up. I mean, I, it's just, come on, I'm shocked, listen, I'm shocked that you don't have women knocking your door down with that room you got on and all this other stuff, dude, they watch your videos. I won't let Jessica watch them. I'm like, hey, that's too much of a man. That's the closest damn thing to Dale and Hard, after the met, don't, all right, don't even play. That's fine. No, dude, you, you, like I said, you are a national treasure. I say this every single thing. I don't know if I truly, I go that far, but I think you are. I just, I just have fun with what I do, but that's what we need. That's all it is. That's what we need because everybody's so serious, like I've had people on this podcast that worship, dear, yeah, and I'm talking night and day, it's all I do about, and that's fine. Hey, right?

1:27:29Right? But if I sit you down and I say, hey, tell me about your life story, and I'm not laughing within the first 20, 30 minutes, yeah, and it's just stone face, like this is what you do together. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Hold on. Where's the personality? Where's the person behind this? You tell me this is all you think about, you know, and I'm sure you, I could probably tell you who I'm thinking of and you would know exactly, like, you, oh, I'm sure to, but sure to, there's, there's some things I get to the extreme. And I get it, you know, like, but see, there's good extremes and there's bad extremes. Leo is good extreme, oh, yeah, unnamed people, bad extreme, that's right. So it is what it is. I'm not trying to bash anyone. And I know I'm kind of right, but it, it's, I guess what I'm getting out with this whole entire thing is we need to really start talking more about men's mental health and how important it is because we were raised, hey, man, if you got something wrong, bottle it up. Don't talk about it. Right. Nobody cares. Exactly. Exactly.

1:28:30And it's like, no, there's people that care. I've got a buddy of mine literally, don't even know this dude from Adam, but he, he and now we're talking last night and we were just, I was laying it all out and he was laying it all out to me and like, how are you struggles with stuff and how I struggle with stuff? And it ended with both of us being like, yo, bro, you ever need anything? Yeah. Hit me up. I don't care what time of the day it is or anything. Hit me up. Like, no doubt. Because I don't want to see anybody go down that, that, that no hard rabbit hole, I guess. Yeah. Now, so they do it when there's help, you know, out there. Yeah. Exactly. Yeah. We need to finish this on a light note. So are we going to see you, are we going to see you running for Mr. Green jeans in another video soon? Or when can we expect to see some turkey videos drop? Who takes us all to drop here for long? I'm not sure where they're at in the editing process, all in all that, but I would imagine within the next week, it'll probably be coming out on real three road trips, probably

1:29:32in Spring Thunder, side of a real tree. And then I believe Saturday is a matter of fact heading to Redstone Armory for that veteran stunt. We're doing it again this year. And that's always a really good hunt because they let us into areas that have never been hunted. Like last year, we were into areas that hadn't been hunted since the 70s. And we got 80% of the veterans a bird on the first day. And by the end of the second day, we had 100% all the veterans killed a bird. So it's always a good hunt. And I like Redstone Armory. It's just a, it's an interesting place because you got all four branches in the military there. Where's that at? The eye there. You've got NASA's there. That's where space camp and all that for the kids is. It's in, it's in a, a Hutzville, Alabama, okay, where it's at.

1:30:35And it's a really neat place and it's fun to go up there and it's really good turkey hunting. And then we get to get these veterans birds. So it's always fun time. So we're heading up there. So I'm heading up their Saturday to do take part in the youth hunt. And then I think we start hunting. I can't remember when it is, but the veteran hunts two days, but I'm going in a little earlier to do some youth hunt. So it'll be fun hunting up there. Well I'm looking forward to it, man. Give me, give everybody a shameless plug before we sign off of here. What is a shameless plug? Like where they can find you all that stuff. I mean, they probably know by now, but for the social media, you want me to do it for you? I've got you. I've got two Facebook page, Michael Alton Pitts, and then Michael Pitts outdoors on Facebook.

1:31:36And then on Instagram, it's at the real pits is what it is. I mean, better with my social media. I'm in that older crowd that computers scare the heck out on me. And so, you know, I'm not as active on social media as I probably need to be. I need to get better at that and post more. Just hire a kid to do it for you. I'm sure there's some get out there that loves hunting that would love to do it. Yeah, I know what I need to. I need to do that. Real tree gets onto me all the time because I don't post enough. I mean, I need to get a little better with my social media stuff, you know? Dude, it's hard. I ain't going to lie. I put out like a couple of things a week. Yeah, with me, it's just, I don't know, part of me scared the computers, honestly. And then part of me is just so busy, it's hard for me to, you know, sit down and find a couple hours to just spend on social media and get stuff out there. And it's one of those things I'll sit there and kind of put off and put off the next

1:32:40thing. You know, it's just I ain't even done it. That's, that's one, that's one thing I need to get better, better doing for sure. Well, all you ladies listening off two of you, uh, if you, I'm tied down, no, okay, okay. I didn't know. I'm just that mustache, man. Okay. Well, I'm sorry. And she's going to be going, uh-huh. I'm going to hear about it. All right. It's, it's his girlfriend. I am so sorry. I did not know. I just mess with. I don't know. We just broke a couple of hearts, but that's okay. Um, no, for real, man, thank you for coming on and everybody, everybody needs to go follow you. They need to go support you. Don't blow them up on, on Facebook, though. I did it. It blows me up. I don't know. Okay. Blow him up. He says blow him up. I'm just, you know, I'll get back to you soon or later. Yeah. Yeah. Dude, I'll tell you what, out of all the things on social media, that's the one thing I'm bad at. Yeah.

1:33:40It's for crying. Like, I've probably got messages from three weeks ago that I'm just like, uh-huh. Yeah. We'll get to it later. And then the wife and kid get home and I'm like, ah crap, I never messaged so and so back. Dang it. Yeah. That's like more. I'll do it tomorrow. And then it's, it's bad, dude. But seriously, buddy, thank you for coming on. I, I know we got derailed this, this podcast went a little bit longer than I expected, but I don't care because it was a lot of, see, this is why I like doing them in the afternoon because I have to worry about, oh, it's 9.30, I'm old, I'm going to go to sleep, you know. I know it. It's, it's more fun. So, but dude, thank you for coming on. If I kill a bird, I'm going to name it Michael. And then, um, and I will send you pictures, hopefully I can find time, dude, that's, that's the biggest thing. Yeah. It's so much like works about to get crazy and, you know, everything else. So it's just, oh, yeah, it's going to be fun. Anyway, pits, thank you, thank you, thank you, we are going to eventually do an in-person episode. Yeah.

1:34:41Land is when that happens, we'll be talking deer, so we can dive into it and we can figure out how to help my wall back here that's got tiny deer because apparently I don't roll with that. Hey, nothing wrong with it. It tastes the same. But that's right. Yeah. Yeah. Awesome, buddy. Well, I guess until next time, man. Yeah. Yeah.