Post Trade Deadline Wild: How Much Better Are They?

0:00Hines had and the Hines was like it's on you guys. It's not a guarantee win It's not inevitable you win once you get up in the game and he was like I'll piss after the fire's game And I'm like okay, so who's who's shoulders it fall on when the wild just like stop trying I won't say you're fun there when you say a lot of us you mean you I I feel so old Have you ever looked into this man's eyes Kind of I hate to agree Welcome back to another episode of wilderness talk the trade deadline is behind us the wild mates and awesome acquisitions But the play on the ice, especially over this weekend And I bring up some some heated takes here on the show, but before we get there

1:01Let's introduce Justin Hein Luke Sims Myself Justin Wiggins guys. How are you doing with all that snow up there enjoying it? All that snow when do we become so soft When when is when was seven inches is it is a lot of snow? No, it's not We do have a five hour foot in the last 24 hours according to the apple weather I don't care what apple weather says step out the door. I have no more than five inches. Oh snow I don't know my brother in Lakeville. He's sending me photos, and it looks like it's about a foot at least Sounds like the real propaganda to me. I Don't know. I don't know. You they could be right. I think there is more snow in the south, so Do you do you guys still get out like a kid and go play in the snow or is this a hunker in Watch hockey all day or whatever else is on TV and so the wild play tonight against the Maple Leafs I have a dog who poops all over my yard, and I have a very small yard, so I do not go out and play in the snow

2:04Yeah, it's very smart. So she is excited to see all the snow. Oh, that is fun. That's really cool I don't think she's actually been Like able to live through this much snow before So yeah, we probably yeah, because when they get winter storms down there, it's mostly like ice storms and that's actually more Dability they get they get like joy that yeah, they just kind of get cold and you can't really do anything They now you don't they rarely get over like three year of orange snow, and that's like a record snowfall So it would get cold for sure, but snow was snow was pretty rare so to get like everything is and everything is covered in snow white out is Is fun, so we'll probably get we'll go out there and Get the dog out and play around. Go show her what it's like to be a snowball fight veteran for your entire life Yeah, tell her you'll take it easy on her, and then just buddy the Elf So for probably a bad bad idea to go buddy the alpha my 30 weeks pregnant wife

3:04Yeah, you know if you get her running away Then you can get her in the back, and I think that'll protect the the child. Yeah, yeah until she slips on the belly Well, we only got about a half inch of snow here in Denver, but we're gonna be literally all week in the upper 80s So it's gonna melt and we're just going straight to summer. It's gonna be It's gonna be nuts But we'll see if the wild played a night. I know that there was there was that issue there with Maybe the Maple Leafs coming in and playing Monday and set it today, but I think with them being already on national TV The NHL was pushing hard for nope Yeah, yeah, it's gonna happen So let's get into that before we talk about kind of the obviously the wild have had a really really poor start to the weekend It was Thursday against the flyers Lost against a team that's just not quite you know Not quite exactly what I would call a powerhouse I know they're flirting with a playoff spot in the east But those that are flirting with playoff spots in either conference this year especially are just gonna get boat raced

4:08In round one they're just not quality teams and and then getting at least that was in a shootout and then losing in the way They did it yesterday against the New York Rangers. We'll get into that and maybe if there's some concerns there But now that we've had about a week here of seeing the new arrivals from the trade deadline week For the Minnesota wild let's just go into those acquisitions and just talk about whether you know We see them as viable fits for the playoff run maybe even long-term just want to get you guys's thoughts because and I'll tee it up here. I'll tee it up here I'm starting to believe that a second-round pick for Michael McCarran was actually fair value Wow kind of a good player. He's been good. He hasn't been good. Definitely noticed well out there on the ice You don't want to differ about him and some of those big players before I before I get Heinz opinion here on the on McCarran I just want to throw this out there Bigger name or big in size Big in size big in size, you know Garen's done this for the last handful of deadlines, right?

5:08He gets a Ryan Reeves and Nick DeLorean those guys are more of of fighters But my issue with some of his acquisitions on those fourth line players has been just it really You can notice the foot speed the decline in foot speed on the fourth line Like those guys just didn't bring much and and when he got Nick Felino and Michael McCarran in the same week I was thinking my god here we go again Sure, we needed an upgrade over Hennestrow's the likely but I I didn't like the idea of losing all this speed But we'll get into Felino in a little bit But just to for me to wrap up on McCarran the guy can move around the ice He's not a detriment out there on his skates. He's rather agile. Yeah, and I mean it seems like yeah, he brings a little more to I think he's a definitely a different player than a Reeves or DeLorean But I think he brings more in that role than a Hennestrow's it does I'm not as upset about losing the speed on the fourth line Because I think fully like the combination of having Fabries decently fast I guess used to be if you want to plug in a speed guy instead

6:11So I think I just think Felino is a more complete player. Felino does a lot for you That a Hennestrow's about pit like Ben Jones simply can't do So to have both of those guys kind of playing in tandem especially with how well churnian does and those roles Um, I think gives you a lot of options because you don't feel I mean, I guess personally. I don't feel I don't love having Yakov training on my third line I don't mind having the Felino on the third line And then even have McCarran on the fourth like that's I think it makes a lot of some flexibility to the bottom six way better Yeah, I mean Felino is still a guy who has something left in the tank I mean like in and Felino isn't like McCarran has never been in offensive in offensive guy Can't really say Yakov trainings been an offensive guy either Um, where it's Felino is a guy who has had 50 points in a gel. He scored 25 goal before and he's like a consistently actually decent contributor I mean, yeah, if you look at his career page like he has multiple seasons of He had said that he had 73 is more a while ago

7:14It was more a while ago 10 10 years ago, but I mean like it's in him. He had 35 He had 35 points two years ago or the last year at the hawks. He had 35 points 37 the year before that. So like he's a guy who can ship in some offense So there's definitely like reason to think he can be a decent like third line player Be a middle six player and you don't love it, but I feel better about that Especially with everything else he does intangibly human phase off. He's just onto it offensively. Yeah, I mean just smart player So do you feel better about having him on in the third line role? Then I would like a training or even a McCarran like McCarran is a fork line center Hi You're the one who wrote weeks before the deadline about how the wild really needed to revamp the fourth line And then you came on here and explained that in an episode about a month ago And I wasn't even thinking that until you brought it up and in the points you brought up. I thought wow Yeah, that you know We're talking about for the last year about this team adding a top six center Especially since that huge trade right like that's the final piece But you kind of elaborate a further at the time better if you can revamp your fourth line

8:19How much of an impact that can make so I want to get your thoughts then on a McCarran trendian Felino fourth line. What do you what are your thoughts on those two specifically? We'll get into some of the other deadline ads, but Felino and McCarran have they provided that boost you were hoping for Yeah, they definitely have they're much better than what the wild were bringing out on the fourth line prior to The trade deadline And I think this was part of the plan so I don't want to fault the wild for bringing that fourth line in that fourth line Was there to be cheap and to accrue some deadline space because they didn't want to go after a first line center There weren't really options there But they did technically have space to acquire a stemcoaster and O'Reilly and you have to wonder if they had lost You know three more games prior to the trade deadline Would those guys have been available? I would bet probably yes So the plan worked is just that the first line center wasn't available But they still had the ability to go out and to fill up that cap space with some depth And turn a weakness into a strength on that fourth line

9:19What I really like about McCarran and Felino when you compare them to the previous fourth line guys Hinesdroza pitlick and Jones Is that while they don't have the same foot speed that some of those guys brought McCarran or sorry Pitlick Jones and Hinesdroza could skate fast But I don't think they could play fast which kind of renders your foot speed obsolete When it's really good sure you get you get to a puck But then you lose it in the corner or you dump it because you you know You're stick handling isn't good enough to get around the defenseman at the blue line or whatever happens there um McCarran isn't getting around defenseman either But once he dumps it in he brings you a lot more um McCarran especially I've It's probably he's probably going to come down to earth a little bit because what I've seen from him is easily been third line value Um, that's not what he's been in the past. He's more of like a bottom six center Uh, but I I do love the way that he plays in the corners um, he does it in a way that is He gets himself time in space compared to maybe like a Jordan greenway where he does he would throw the body around

10:25But it wouldn't always result in turning the puck over and you know Getting it back for your team or getting possession and being able to put it into a dangerous area McCarran does a really good job of that and it also gives the wild a different flavor of offense where they can play from Below the opponent's goal line rather than doing more of this possessive style where they have three players at their own blue line and you can run that possessive style with anybody I maybe as they get more up to speed in the system um, they'll look more homogenous from the first line to the fourth line But I think that McCarran is just worlds better than the guys he's replacing because he's able to Play that grinding style, but actually result in getting the puck back and getting it to his teammates Yeah, that's the biggest you you you spoke about it way more uh eloquently than I was going to uh with the with how you said they you know They're able to play faster hold on the pucks that was that was really by big takeaway was how much more Possession that line has you know, Nick Felino is very good along the boards Michael McCarran

11:30Not not exactly as good as Felino. I mean Felino has always been a pretty skilled player Until age caught up with him, but I really like the way those two look Well, maybe not always those two, but really whoever's out there with McCarran whether it's Trennian with him or Erickson I love They're penalty kill right now with just how much reach they have with those two forwards up top and especially on zone entries Now posing teams. I don't know, but I got to probably look at the numbers to see it But the eye test shows me that they're they're stopping opposing power plays at their blue line More effectively and at a higher rate right now than they were before and I just think the Cheer reach of the size of those guys makes it really hard for For teams to enter in Cleanly at the moment that's leading to what we've seen as a really really really good penalty kill And that was starting before they tried to line a little bit But after the deadline to you can see you kind of ramp up more and to me that that's the encouraging thing the additions Garen made in the last couple years never seemed to impact the penalty kill

12:31These two have and if that's what value they bring is a little bit more of an elevated five on five play But improved penalty killing That's a huge win for a team that has been getting cratered in the special teams department in round one for the last ten years That goes back to what sims had brought up about the The both flino brothers really about how if you do you if they do happen to get time in space They do have the the hands and the skill to convert chances that has a lot to do with like hand-eye coordination And once your speed goes as long as you can stay in a passing lane when you have that hand-eye coordination You can actually cut off saucer passes a little bit more often And it makes you a lot more valuable on the penalty kill when you're trying to get your stick into passing lanes Either at your own blue liner in your own zone Yeah, which is why boldie has always looked like a good partner killer But having these two guys it does it does allow you to be not throw boldie out there as much But that is a big difference That's why any show teams have moved that direction over the last three four five years is putting some top players

13:34On the penalty kills. Why Mitch Marner is such an amazing penalty killer Um, you know Not only are they playing on the power play so they understand what the other teams trying to do But it's just their ability to disrupt stuff it it looks small when you're watching on TV or if you're watching in person But every time you can disrupt a pass like that and hopefully get a clear that that that's a win. That's a win so All right, so we're positive on Felino and and McCarran I don't think we need to talk too much about the other additions because they do seem to be more depth guys like the Petrie Jeff Petrie we haven't seen him yet Enter into the blue line mix. I don't think you're going to unless there's injury Um, no, and the gochins the gochins has looked way better since Like I've seen some of the best in backpagotian play Sense like a threat for him to actually being the lineup is gonna push him right, you know That's that that and that's what a Robbie Robbie Fabry does too. We've seen him from the lineup Who's been fine when he's in he's looked okay, right? Yeah, like Robbie I mean, I would consider him an upgrade over Hinesh Rosa. I mean hind is the expert on this topic

14:37um I'd consider him better than like a pet like or I mean he's different than mid-jones But I consider him an upgrade even had a position um Because he's also a guy that you know similar to like what you were saying wigger One of you were saying about how you know even if the foot speed's not there He's a guy who's proven he can put it in a net um or have the hand-eye to do something positive with the pocket. Yeah defensive zone um And I don't know what Fabry I don't know why he obviously Fabry isn't the same as he was after three ACL tears Um in terms of actual like north south skating speed Yeah, he's not the corner. He's still looking good out there. He can move around Yeah, he's a average fourth line player, I guess, but he's not a he's not a liability. He's a guy you feel okay with Um and for free, I mean I do think the wild did a lot with Not actually giving up too much at the deadline um Because if you can say what you want about David Eurichek, but like Well, they got three guys for a combined seventh round pick. Yeah, right?

15:39I was nothing Fabry was nothing and Petri was a seventh round pick like you got three A seventh round pick that won't cash in Petri has to Petri will have to dress at least eight games No, no, hold on. I think it's it's it's a seventh round pick regardless It can move up to a fifth if the wild make the Stanley Cup final and he played half the games I think I thought it was that it's it's a seventh round pick if Petri plays in 50% of the games and the wild win two playoff rounds Which yeah, no Petri plays in 50% of the games the wild are not Playing in two playoff rounds Most like yeah, probably not if he does play half the games. It's gonna be tough for the wild He's in there for uh, he was a heck of Oh, he was sick back in the day. Did he play with Gary? Is there any way just Petri played with Garen and Pittsburgh back in the day? I don't know if he's that old Oh, no, he what he didn't he didn't okay. He played for the penguins recently

16:40I thought he was there like way back in the day. Yeah, he started in 2010 Bill wasn't quite In the league at that point That was that would have been right after because they won the cup in 09 So it would have been right up, but yeah, he was in Edmonton. Petri's prime just studied Montreal for many. He was really good Yeah, he had if he does have to be four straight years and 40 points I like him better than if you wanted to bring up like a lamboist for somebody, you know, if it's He is a dipping into your life. He has a ton of actual playoff experience. Yeah He's a guy that yeah, he's been there before We're kind of burying the a topic player though. We haven't talked about Bobby. He's been injured Always been storing two goals in a game. Yeah, he looked sick in the homecoming. That was fun to see So yeah, we started with the depth players because we say we've seen more of them Um, and be we wanted to save the best for last. Let's get into the Bobby brink then Obviously trading away David your check. I know you guys got to it

17:41Last week after the deadline a little bit, but man he uh He the the bits that we've seen him. He's looked awfully good next to boldy Yeah, I think he's exactly as advertised Uh, right in that shot Exactly the way that we kind of thought he could fit in Uh, he seems to fit in in exactly in that role Uh, I feel like he's going to settle into the third line spot with the urub and teres of the urub and teresink online Um, I just think they love jojo a little too much to put him up there and that fit just works a little better Because I mean, I agree to begin to look awesome the boldy um, but so would you or I but why wouldn't you do that Let's get let's you know and hi and I would bring online too Yeah, fine. Do you agree with me? It seems like Luke you're okay with him being on the third line I want him in the second line like I know. Yeah, I'm fine in there. He's fine there But I want more than like Bobby brink could The thing with jojo is that he does everything really well until he needs a score

18:43and You've got too good of a player and met boldy setting up golden chances for his teammates like I like the what sure I don't know if Bobby brink is as consistent of a player right now as jojo is just because he's younger in his career He's still learning I he's actually a pretty good defensive forward So I'm not saying it's a huge step back But I just think the ceiling goes so much higher with Bobby brink I I when he gets healthy I'd like to see that the rest of the regular season you can go back to jojo in the playoffs It bring doesn't bring much in the last 15 games But I want to see it and see if they can raise that ceiling I could see it two different ways So one one school of thought would be that you want to have a variety of different types of player on a line To me brink is very similar to Eric Sinek in that both are net front guys even though Obviously brink 58 Do you wouldn't think so but he he does get a lot of his stuff from the front of the net? Yeah, he's very small. He's not Tiny He's also not very Yeah, he's pretty much I think he's greater than zukurillo

19:45I don't think zukurillo is actually 5-8 is the thing I think he's just more like 5-6 I think he's more like 5-6 probably but Getting getting back on topic like if you're if you're at home and you want to use boldy Eric Sinek and brink as like checking line I could totally see that like kind of Let's say you're playing Dallas and maybe they've got a scoring line that is not very solid in their own zone Maybe you put those two way guys together so that you've still got the skill But you've got you know a player in brink who can do more On a two-way level and turn that puck over and give boldy a ton of chances on the other hand if you're at home and you want to threaten The other team with Johansson speed I could see that working as well to open some space for Caprice off because then if you're at home You have kind of a pick your poison which line do you want to check the other one is gonna get opportunities I will say with how much depth they have in the bottom six though Maybe you don't need that checking line. So maybe that will result in Johansson staying up on the second line

20:48But I think the while they're in a place where their bottom six has a lot of options And their middle six has a lot of options at the wing So I don't think there's a ton of wrong answers here But it is gonna become this thing it'll be a lot like like Marco Rossi's role was for a lot of years where People will yell no matter what happens It just depends whether they want brink on the second or third line And we're probably gonna talk about it way more than we actually need to Because like it just doesn't make that much of a difference to me You know what these additions told me Following the deadline obviously, you know There's other things that are that are more important right the the Bobby brink impact is gonna be Could be really huge for this team if he does Kind of take a step up from those those terrible lineman's that he had in in Philly compared to what he's got here in Minnesota But to me it signals that there is not a spot for Charlie Strommel on this NHL roster come playoff time I don't think we're gonna see him Because who's he who's he gonna replace? No, I just no no no no I think that

21:51I've seen Strommel now a black ace maybe maybe a black ace role But we're not gonna see him get in this lineup. I don't think no I could see him get in if they go really deep They might throw him out there at the right wing or something if I mean fabric is an injury prone player If you get an injury and fabric goes down That's a pretty foreseeable Possibility for Strommel to get in But it really does depend how he looks in those practices obviously That's step one is you've got to jump from college to the NHL and then you've got to be better than Robbie Fabri or whoever is that depth guy that is coming in as the first over the boards for an injury Um, so I don't really think it's possible This is one of those seasons where you wish your Iowa team was better And he could go on a playoff run in the NHL, but it's too bad. They suck so bad. That's not a possibility. Yeah All right, well the deadline's behind us. It's been nice to see these guys get into the lineup But the results over the last week have been pretty mixed for the Minnesota wild As a team in general, right? They had some great games against come you know

22:55Contender type teams they they beat up on Tampa Bay they beat up on Utah, but then especially this weekend You know, we're recording recording before they play the Toronto Maple Leafs at home tonight But the last two home games especially yesterday against the Rangers just Flat on their faces not looking like a team that is playing with a ton of urgency At the moment. So are you are you concerned? Flyers game was in a shootout now. Obviously if if if one player for the wild scores and that result changes I think it kind of Changes our tunes. I want to I want to make sure I do this with the grain of salt Look at this too negative But are we concerned with this trend lately because it's not just been these last two games It's been a thing for about the last month that when they play teams that are out of the playoffs or or A French team that likely won't make it. They're just not looking impressive at all Yeah, and it's It's the thing Hines tried to address after the flyers lost, but I mean it's If like if we walk through the flyers game

23:55It's the wild kind of come out flat Going to this going to the first intermission down one nothing and then be like oh wow We're a really good hockey and start playing like it and then take it to one lead going into the third, but then they don't play to win Then they let miss off goal at the end of the third or it's halfway through the third period And then they just take it in overtime and then they lose in a shootout. It's like I don't know I'm not inherently mad about losing in a shootout or not winning over time or anything It's just the like you you show a clear domination in one period And then you shift and not continue to play that way And I get I mean, it's I suppose it's difficult to play really really strong high here 60 minutes But the teams that do typically go far in the playoffs And then in the Rangers game it kind of like the wild The range gives a little bit different story. They just kind of led in some bad goals And weren't able to solve sister again That one I'm less upset about that just kind of feels like a one-off kind of you at gold game But the flyers game is an effort that is really disconcerting of the like

24:57Clearly show you have the ability to take home the game and then not do it If I dive into the analytics on those two stinker games I see a pretty clear picture which is that these losses are on goal tending In the flyers game the flyers are the most boring team in the NHL not in an insulting way But in terms of like if you look up the expected goals They don't score. They don't get a lot of chances, but they don't give up anything So it's not surprising at all that the wild played a pretty tight game with them They did still generate two expected goals against them Philly was held to 1.17 So I think it's fair to put that on goal tending you got into a defensive duel You did not give me a lot of high-game chances You remember that goal to tie it up that was really that was a bad goal by Wallstead That's a very hard time. I'm glad you're reminded of that I mean that one is is like hey, sometimes you have a bad Sometimes you miss one in a game right when you when you see 20 or 30 shots

25:59Sometimes you're gonna miss one But the rangers game was worse in my opinion By the time the the rangers had their fourth goal they had only accrued 1.5 expected goals And anytime your goalie does that even though it's only halfway through the game I just you're not going to it's going to be very difficult to come back with you have to open it up and the wild actually Until the last five minutes of the game or six minutes of the game They kept the rangers from producing scoring chances even as they were stacking up a lot of chances trying to close that lead So I think it's fair to put both of these on goal tending You give Wallstead a little bit of grace on that on that one soft one And I'm usually Philip Gustafson's biggest defender if he has no fans. I'm probably dead But that is a stinker from Gustafson So and he's been playing so great Leading up to that hind like his games out of the out of the Olympic break He I mean, he's single-handedly pretty much won them that game in Colorado that first game they were there. He's played

27:02You know to expect a guy to play at that level for the rest of the season I'm with you. Hi, and I'm glad you brought this up because it does paint it in a better picture It's like look you it's not out of the NHL norm to have back-to-back games where maybe your goalies weren't their best And that's all we can chalk it up to Yeah, and you don't want to overindex to that and on that point talking about Heinz's comments after the game He felt they were trying to skill their way into the game for the first half I only got to see pieces of this because I was at a dinner, but uh, I think that Having two bad losses that are somewhat explainable by goal tending and the wild do have other numbers that I can't look at like they'll have Um, they'll have more detailed Numbers because they have a guy whose job it is to chart this kind of stuff for every game and give it to John Heinz, right Taking away from these two games which you can mostly put on the shoulders of the goalies Saying that now we need to practice more as you're coming down into the final 15 games of the season before the playoffs

28:04I don't know How great an idea that is maybe they're just gonna have like a battle drill battle drill like punishment practice or get bagged And then they'll go back to what they were doing before Um, but I don't think More practices right now is the answer when it seems like your skaters played pretty well Well, I yeah, it's hard to say how team we're at You know, I've got a theory on on the Because I do agree hind that the goal tending You you could chalk it up to just two two poor games and that happens, but I do think I do think the wild have not looked great from some of their better players like Caprice off Over the last two games has not looked all that great Quinn Hughes has had some really weird turnovers Um, and I honestly I thought his game against the flyers. It was one of his One of his poorest since he's been on the wild and I'm just when you look at the standings And I want you guys to tell me if I'm if I'm nuts or if I'm or if I've got something here with

29:04I when you look at the standings they're very very much Concrete it almost 99% chance. I would bet if you look at any betting model to finish third in the central They've fallen behind Dallas and Colorado in the last week even when they were playing better than they did just this last weekend Because those teams are on fire they're ahead of Utah I just think inherently these pros are looking ahead of the playoffs looking at their spot in the standings and go Why would be overexert ourselves to potentially injure ourselves Against the flyers and Rangers when we're going to be in the third seat Let's just yeah, I just I don't think they're talking about it as a group and going guys Let's not try as hard let's say but you there is some self preservation likely going on out there And I'm not saying that's what's happened lately It could but I'm just warning fans for we could as see a team go 500 the rest of the regular season Because of that where guys just really want to make sure they're healthy Come playoff time and I don't know if that's a good thing or a bad thing I don't want to see teams just try to flip a switch and they get it to playoffs

30:04But I just think it is inherently something that props up at this point the season It's ridiculous because if the wild were I mean sort of the standings right now The wild have 14 more points than the mammoth do the mammoth are in fourth in the central At 74 points the goal of Knights are in first in the Pacific and they have 76 points So Utah is going to go if Utah is the first wildcard team They are going to get to go And play on the road Or like Utah could potentially finish the more points than Vegas And they're going to have to go on the road to go play a Pacific team Instead of that they finish ahead of So they will be they will be a wildcard team with more points on the road than the team they have to go play So should the wild just hang out and be the first wildcard team go to Vegas and then get to play like the ducks for the orics They don't really want to play the oilers, but Just to play the docks or the stars or what it's a fun exercise and you're not wrong Luke

31:07But how do they tank themselves 14 points below like I just don't know the runways even there They'd have to almost start like 15 games ago Yeah, I mean they'd have to go like two and 13 the rest of the way in order to let the that you time catch them Yeah, so give give Corilla mystery injury sit only Start uh give your boy Samuel uh That's what they should have done. They should have done the Mark Stone treatment at the deadline Put Caprice of what LTI are and then go get somebody else Yeah, I mean they they would be in a better spot if they were in that um that wildcard It's dumb. It's pretty objectively true. That's so dumb Yeah, well like what are you going to do you got to play somebody good eventually? It's that this isn't like the way anybody that works in the NHL or plays in the NHL is wild So it never it's never going to come up, but yeah, it is annoying It is supposed to annoy you though as a fan You are supposed to be pissed off that you have to play the stars because then if they beat you

32:08You will hate the stars more and then you get five games where you are more engaged as a fan because you play the stars Who you hate Rather than getting up for a game against the Golden Knights who we hate because they bounced us last year But then you're not going to get the NHL is not going to get the same return and you as a fan are actually probably not going to have as much fun So the system is working as it's designed It is driving you to hate the teams in your division I just think that might I hate the NHL. I see through that facade What I what I don't like about it is why are there eight teams in a division? I feel like if you had four or five team divisions Then you could kind of concentrate that hate and you also Yeah, and you wouldn't run into this as often and I know I know we did not plan to get into The most boring talking point that comes up way too often, which is the NHL's playoff format But I do think smaller divisions would be cool because

33:09like If only the avalanche or only the stars were in your division you would get to go be a wild card team probably Because you probably would only send the division winners You wouldn't send an arbitrary top three from four divisions And have to play more teams in your division. You just go on the road against a weaker opponent So this is you know the 15th time that I've said the NHL should just do the NFL's playoff format on this podcast, but What's one more time? So let's go back to my original question because I You're not and we're going to hear this so much over the next month like you know as this disparity like if if indeed Utah ends up with more points than who they played in the first round like A lot of this has been coming up this year because of the top three in the central and everyone saying well It's not fair that probably one of Dallas and Minnesota has gone in round one Um, but it's heating up even more when you say wow Utah Top four teams in the central we're finishing the top four in the west. It's just gonna

34:10This is gonna come up more and more uh, but we've seen you know Luke laid it out It would be great to them for the wild to finish his wild card one But when you see the point disparity, I just don't see it as happening even if the wild tried That'd be really hard and they're not gonna get to the two seed it seems now So do you guys think that my theory has legs that we're gonna see in the next 15 We're gonna see more stinkers because of that like the wild They're they're they're they're truly gonna have a hard time getting up for these games when they physically Don't matter in the standings, but they could matter whether someone's available come playoff time I don't think so because they do have a pretty light schedule coming up And they're gonna look at that and say let's go get home field advantage because I do think when teams I don't know if they can that's that well if they don't make a schedule though Why not that that's what I'm saying it's I'm so you say While you're talking you just I need to look at the wild schedule and you're telling me that it's light enough Well, you think they could catch one of those guys Dallas has a more than I think Dallas has a more difficult schedule ahead and then the wild do they have more good teams to play

35:16I can pull this up and Demand if the sabers are a wagon or not Well, I guess actually it's fairly comfortable to do the wild The wild starts have to play the abilance twice The wild has to do that the stars have to play the avalanche twice The sabers can't be saying that the wild twice I guess then they don't really have that many tough games flames ranger wait who plays the wild twice stars do Oh, that absolutely means they can catch them with a weak schedule and Dallas on your schedule twice You can steal four points from them right there. Dallas has to play I mean you have a fine team Vegas is a fine team the devil the devils could beat them, but I mean they have easy wins against the flames and the rangers Okay, I've got I've got some room now. I'm a believer now that they can get back to the two seed I didn't really they play them twice. There's a lot of back but Dallas has a game in hand though And they've been on an absolute here

36:179-0-1 in their last time At this point, I think it's better chance that Dallas catches Colorado than the wild catches Dallas Well, Colorado also has a game in hand on Dallas, which means two games in hand on Minnesota. Well, they play each other twice It's true Colorado is better than Dallas. I do have it pulled up here Tom Lutgerson's model will have a pretty good pulse on this Um, he's got the Minnesota one I can get close. I'm pretty good at scaling first of all. Okay Minnesota has the fifth easiest schedule in the league. Colorado has the fourth easiest schedule in the league And Dallas has the sixth most difficult. So pretty big difference there uh, meaning that Wild two stars three is definitely in play that strength of schedule stuff in the NHL even when you aggregate it out like this I don't think it's that big of a deal, but I think it opens the door because it's it's easier to go on a crazy run

37:19Against an easy schedule. It doesn't mean it's gonna happen I think his model still thinks the stars are favored a couple of points above the wild. I have that here too actually Mm-hmm I just noticed the wild he thinks the back-to-backs the rest of the year either no more back-to-backs from Minnesota Dom's model projects the wild will finish like three points behind the stars So it that makes sense given the strength of schedule and how far apart they are. I think It's the month the smart money is on Dallas keeping that second spot But it's probably pretty it's probably a lot closer to like 60 40 than You would think just Lansing at the points and the games remaining in the standings Does Dom's this Dom's model taken to account back-to-backs? I asked that because I saw I just maybe a little Yeah, the wild has no Dallas has two more yet to go It's a pretty small impact. I think I know that um The hockey vis guy Micah Blake McCurdy has done some analysis into that and it's like you dock a team like

38:21three to five percent win probability If they're on a back-to-back and the other team is rested at least two days So that that rarely happens and like if you have a back-to-back the other team could be on a back-to-back too Because if there are back-to-back it's because of the condensed Olympic schedule partially So the back-to-back thing is Toronto played yesterday as well That's a good point because that's happening tonight both teams back-to-back Yeah, it's a big narrative the back-to-backs, but it's actually much less impactful than you might think Uh because coaches do a good job planning for it and moving the goalies around to optimize so that you know the second game isn't meaningless Hmm. Yeah, I wonder I wonder if the fact that teams teams play both goalies way more often now than used to back in the day I wonder if that has a bigger impact because like if you're Minnesota and you've got to go back-to-back You feel pretty good about Gus Wally But you know back in the day if it was you know Lundquist I don't remember who was backing up Lundquist in those days But I'm sure they didn't feel as good if they're back up and to play one of those two games So I wonder if that plays into it, but that's interesting. Okay. So we're so we're still hoping so

39:26So you're saying that I can stop with my stupid take and we can still root for the wall to get the two seed I think they'll I mean they're definitely gonna try We'll see if they can get there But the team in the room they're gonna try. I mean they're probably still trying to get to the one seed Which is as possible. It's just not likely It is possible If they play a whole 60 minutes It would be very funny if they got the one seed and then played like the sharks who are in the wilds kryptonite and It wouldn't be funny maybe I would actually probably be pretty sad, but I would be thrilled Okay, so one more question dark from Dallas And if it's the Kraken One more question for you guys before we depart for the week And I'm gonna ask this question again Right before the start of the playoffs. All right. I want to see how much this changes Okay, but the one thing that I took away from if you guys read Michael Russo's article on Jared's version his thousandth game I think Spurgeon probably

40:28Emulates what most of the guys in that room feel and this coaching staff that this Feels like the first team At least in this iteration of the wild like the last decade this feels like the first true contending team Like but they they firmly believe they could make a run. All right, so what is it about this team right now You know, what's one thing about this team that you that gives you the most optimism For a deep run like what's different about this one in the last say two three four years I think they have the horses I think we've never seen a more talented forward group than The one we have now I guess maybe at the high end, I guess like they have the high end to players We've never seen the defensive in the caliber of use. We've never had bolly I guess this is the best season bolly's had we've never seen the well. I've never had a pair like krill and bolly Actually playing together because it's really because in the playoff rounds in the past It was just like where are we gonna get that goal from who's gonna score

41:28And it's like they can play a competitive game And the team can be solid all around and they can out depth the other team But at the end of the day The other team do it with talent and star power and I think we finally have the ability to match that With bolly's ascension and getting used Yeah, the only team that's even close up front and I think they're actually probably comparable would be the I think it was 22 to 23 when they lost to Vegas But they had fiola bouldy and Capriceau at the height of his powers That was a really good team Their decore was also deep. It wasn't quite as high-end because they didn't have the hues of course But I think the difference between this team and that team They had a they had a magical 38 point for any good row Zookie has 70 points Kaelen Addison had 29 points. Wasn't Victor Rask still number one center? Uh, I think this was I think Victor Rask had already been exiled at this point

42:29This was a pro-favor Hi, I think I think hi and probably that's the year they got a bunch of dudes the deadline Nyquist Johansson, Klingborg, Sunquist To me the difference between this year and that team Uh is just versatility the ways that you can attack in different ways that's a terrible way to phrase that The areas of the ice that you can attack from with different players are very different You you had Capriceau who could go to the net and rip a one-timer you had fiola who could rip a one-timer and Go to the net or turn the puck over it was usually like a 60-40 proposition He would turn it over more often, but it was sick when it worked Um, but it the power play was a little bit one-dimensional because it was all lefties and you had Capriceau in this weird bumper roll and Fiola as the one-timer guy it was There was also Different I'm getting a little too into the weeds on that, but adding cues more so even more than just the fact that it's another

43:29Player who's better than Boldy was at that time and Boldy's better and Carilla's better than Fiola was at the time It's just that you can attack from different areas. You have a elite playmaking defenseman who can get the puck anywhere He sees the whole zone He opens up your power play because he can be a threat himself from the point I think that the versatility the the fact that if a team is loaded at forward But they have a suspect defensive core you can attack that if a team has a really good defensive core But maybe they don't have the depth of the bottom six like the wild do where you could have he was attack those players more Uh, I think it makes them much more Durable Robust is maybe a better word they can attack you in different ways and they can be good at it no matter what Faceoffs is like the one problem they've got right now, and I we're just gonna see how big of a deal that can become in a playoff series It's almost like they don't need the game script to go their way to win a game

44:30Because they can do it in so many different ways like those teams in the past those teams in the past like if they gave up four power plays in a game And they went you know, and they couldn't score anything on the power play was like well, they're done They're done So over now it's almost like they've got the ability to if a team comes at them With a ton of speed and a really heavy forecheck they can negate that with their their mobile defenseman If they need to win a game two to one against Colorado and really lock it down they almost can and then obviously they can score in bunches It's it does feel a lot different. I agree and I think the one you guys said was the most important You know you add you add Quinn Hughes and then Matt Boldy is now a superstar It's like they added two stars this year. Boldy came into that mold and they added Hughes so You know for for me though specifically And we're gonna do this a lot before the playoff star for me. It's just it's simply if if their special teams combined Powerplay poundy coke and remain in the top three the rest of the year like it has been for the last couple months That's just totally different because how many times would we see the Dallas stars or Vegas nights going to power playing the third period and go

45:35crap here it is. It's done and it just it feels different this time Yeah, I would agree. I think the ceiling is higher. I think there's a realistic. It's like You can move the goalposts beyond like I hope we survived the first round like to see you can you can and maybe that's premature But you can see like obviously it's difficult in any other year Like we don't have to play two of if our first two rounds aren't the two best teams in the league um I think you could more realistically set your sights on like uh, okay, how do we how do we prepare for rounds two and three? How do we get farther instead of just saying? I really hope we make it pass round one because I think that's a mentality shift Um, I think that really did start with the Hughes trade and the way they played after that because I mean I'll look at it at the start of the year like we take ourselves back four months five months before the Hughes trade like This team was like three six and five we were talking about fire and we were talking about hiring peer-to-bore

46:39That's where we were at We're talking about firing John Hines um To where we are now forget where the mentality is about watching z bulliam I it's like I can believe forget that he was a part of like he was such a fixture on this team and how in grain We were with bulliamen times have changed So I think that's a it's a mentality shift and I think they feel that in the locker room As you said like with Spurgeon. I think the guys are I think they think they know this could this is the year Um, and they're hoping you can do it next offseason, but for guys like Spurgeon for guys like zucarillo even dudes like you a Hanson Um, this this could be the last shot So I think if there are as ever you're gonna do it. I think those guys know this could be the one And with that we'll wrap up another episode of wilderness talk It is that fun time of the year like even if the wild are gonna be stuck in that third seed There are just so many storylines whether it's talking about the recent weeks of games Or we can really start looking ahead to their first round playoff matchup

47:41You know what what's the fourth line gonna look like with this log jam of fourth line forwards when everyone's healthy We're gonna have plenty to debate As far the wild this week They've got Toronto tonight and then they do have a It's not a back-to-back, but it is a home-and-home Series with the black hawks Tuesday and Thursday before a giant weekend Being next Saturday home against the Dallas stars That could be the game that decides if they have any chance at the to see legitimately could be it's gonna be fun But we'll come to you then for recaps and then obviously looking ahead as we roll through March year Getting ready for the playoffs for Luke Sims and Justin Hein. I'm Justin Wiggins This has been another episode of wilderness talk Boy I think that's a really good point to end on I don't get up to yeah, I was gonna say something, but then Sims wrapped it so perfectly that I was like no

48:44Just we're just gonna let that breathe