Polar Points Opposites

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All right, everybody. Welcome back to episode four of the Gluck House. My name is Jeff Gluck.

And I'm live still here in Phoenix. I've not left yet. My family came down for spring break.

So we've all been hanging out here in the desert, beautiful warm weather. Then I'll be heading

to Vegas from here in a little bit. But I've gotten to consume some of the content from the

the NASCAR podcast universe. Of course, it's always the NPU. I'm calling it this week. A lot of

the conversation was a lot about points racing. And I know that that's not the sexiest topic.

But you know what? I think it's a good thing. I think we've had so many years of controversy and

all this stuff of this off track. And we sort of forget about the on track product

of what's going on sometimes. I think it's nice to be able to talk about, hey, there's storylines.

It's giving us talk about the drivers who have gotten off to a surprising start. The drivers

who are off to a slow start, can they rebound? And then you might think, well, I don't know,

that's a temporary thing. Though that storyline, that whole angle might run out by may,

you know, the field will kind of be set. And what are we going to do all summer? But no, I don't

think so because we're going to be talking about who can make the top three, who can make the top six

because those seedings matter in addition to obviously who will get in the top 16. But

so again, it's not just about making the chase because you know, for some people they had higher

goals, but is it already too late for some of the contenders? Chase Brisco is only 53 points out of

a chase spot, but he's 178 out of a lead, 106 out of a top three seed, 66 points out of a top

six seed. Let's hear what Denny Hamlin had to say about that on Action Settlemental this week.

Your teammate, Chase Brisco's minus 178. To the lead, what does he do 16th? He's only got 20,

he's got 47 points. He's only got Brad and 16th has 100. Oh, he's fine. Because his medium

performance is enough. His championship hopes over. Oh, that's a good question. Because yeah,

we're saying that the champion is going to be in the top three. Listen, if he goes and he wins

to the next five races and and discuss some top fives and tens in the other ones,

I think we're talking about, look at this charge he just made. He's only 100 out of the

points lead a little too early for that. All right. Well, let's hear from the man himself. Chase

Brisco now kind enough to join us here on the glove cast. You know, there's a lot of people chase who

I'd be like, I don't know if I want to bring somebody on a show to talk about how their season is

not doing well, but I feel comfortable enough with you that I feel like we can have this conversation.

So thank you for joining first. Well, how are you doing? I'm doing good. Just as my season's going,

I have no power at the house that the house has lost power for the last hour. So that's about

powerful. The course for how this year's gone. So what are we doing here? Are we on your phone

with the with the cell signal? Yeah. Luckily that I found the one window. We had like electric

shades or whatever and this window was open. So that's that's where we're after lighting. Otherwise,

it's going to be pitch dark. Oh, man, when it rains of course. Well, you know, here you've you've

kept your humor through that. You also kept your humor, by the way, as you pound the fence,

you know, you're warning your team. I think we have a vibration. They're like, no, you know, don't

remember. You've had that in practice before. Yeah, I know this feels different though. And it's

like, well, you know, your team may have this in practice. Oh, just, you know, and then bam.

And you still have enough sense of humor to say, well, I've looked at the DVP map the DVP map

this week. So first of all, how are you? How are you able to not just

like in that moment just be screaming? And I mean, you might be inside, but at least you were

able to crack a joke. Yeah. I mean, look, I was certainly mad and frustrated, right? But me

getting on the radio or yelling and getting out and throwing stuff like it's not going to change

anything. You know, that point, the result already is what it is. So yeah, I mean, I have read the DVP

map that week. And so yeah, when they were kind of explaining to me where to go, I was like,

guys, I read the DVP map this week. I definitely was not going to make that mistake again.

But yeah, I think, you know, for me, there's nothing I was going to do in that moment that,

you know, yelling was going to, it wasn't going to fix anything. Same with getting out of the car,

throwing stuff. I remember as a kid, always my dad, you know, tell me that you never know who's

watching. And you know, you always even when, when you think you're by yourself or whatever,

like you never know what sponsor might be around or, you know, a kid might be watching. So

yeah, I've always tried to, you know, carry that throughout my career. And, uh, yeah, I mean,

I was certainly mad and upset and frustrated. But, you know, even in the big scheme of things, like,

yeah, there's just way more stuff that's important than, you know, even the result on Sunday,

you know, when I got home Monday morning, my kids were just excited to see me. They didn't care

if I won or crashed. So yeah, I think just keeping that perspective, you know, especially whenever

you've had a rough start professionally, you know, there's still a lot to, you know, be thankful for

certainly in life. Well, you know, I think it's, it's interesting that you're in this position.

I know you have a bigger perspective and can handle it, but it's certainly unfortunate,

especially, you know, this stuff's not really been of your own doing. It's not like you guys are

running bad. You're just having, you know, some terrible strokes of luck here. But it doesn't matter

how you got there. You're in a, you're in a huge points hole. So how are you looking at your season

overall right now? You heard that Danny Clip, you know, regular season title, but, you know,

maybe that's out of grabs already. Is it, is a top three seed still possible? Top six? Are you

just trying to make the playoffs at this point? How are you looking at it? No, I mean, I'm still

trying to, to win the regular season right now. That's certainly going to be a huge uphill battle.

But I mean, yeah, if you go on some crazy streak and, you know, even if you win, say somehow,

10 races in the regular season, right? Like, yeah, the, the DNS at the beginning of the season

hurt, but, you know, with the winning now and the added bonus points, I mean, you can gain

positions. I feel like way quicker than what you couldn't have passed. So yeah, I don't think it's,

you know, out of the question, James actually, he'd sent me some data and analytics on stuff the

other day. And I think if we average 37 points a race from now until the end of the regular season,

there was like a 7% chance you would still finish in the top three. And in the playoffs last

year, with the DNF and finishing like 19th of Phoenix, we, we averaged 39.8 points. So yeah,

it's certainly not out of the, the equation, you know, we, we obviously have to run really,

really good. And that's, I think the exciting part is is, you know, we've been running good enough

to do that. It's just, we haven't had the finishes. And it's all been stuff kind of out of our

control. But certainly, it's hard when you feel like you're putting in the work and you're doing

everything that you need to do to, you know, being contention to win these races. And then, yeah,

I joked with the guys the other day. I mean, we scored 44 points at Atlanta and we have 47 points

after four weeks. So it's just crazy. Like the, the speed that we've had and tell only have three

points in three weeks is certainly a tough tough bill to swallow. Wow. That's unbelievable. Well,

I, I think to your point, like last year, we saw, and I think this is, I'm, maybe there's been

other big rises up the standings, but this one got my attention because it was for the point

sleep. But we saw Chase Elliott. He overcame a 112 point deficit. Went from fifth to first in six

races in June and July. So that was at a time when, you know, the standings had sort of already

settled a little bit. And he was able to get up to the point. So now he ultimately didn't win the

regular season title, but you would think that because, and I don't think he actually even won in

that period, if I'm not mistaken, maybe he won at Atlanta. But now there's 15 points, you know,

available for your win as well. Like you mentioned, you would think that that 112 point deficit

could be top. So I don't completely dismiss at all your idea that, you know, 178 or whatever it was,

it's totally out of the question. I mean, especially as good as you guys were at the end of last

season. But yeah, it would be a monumental effort. It's just going to be like, I mean, do you,

do you view it as like, we don't have any Mulligan's left? Or, you know, we just have to run

as well. I think so. I mean, I feel like the regular season, you're always awarded, you know,

two, three, two to maybe three like Mulligans, right? But in those Mulligans, a lot of the time,

you still maybe get one or two stage points, you know, Mulligan day might be like less than 10 points,

you know, somewhere between five and 10 where ours have been one point each time. So that changes

things a little bit. But I mean, look, if we can win, say we can win five races right in the regular

season, which is obviously a very, very hard thing to do. But that's 75 points right there that

nobody else can even get, right? That's just in the bonus points. And then you add in the fact that

you're probably going to be running better, you know, in the race and other guys in stage points.

I mean, it's not out of the question by any means. But yeah, I think for us, we just have to get

on a streak right. I just have in some really good consistent days. And that's the hard part. I think

for us right now is is, you know, where we're at and points and then what the finish is from the

week before, you know, you go out so early in qualifying like this week, where the first car out

to qualify. So more than likely, you're probably going to be 20th on back. And it just makes it super

hard to run, say in the top three in stage one. So just is a constant thing where you're buried

because of your points position and where you got to qualify. And it just makes it even more and

more challenging. So yeah, it's definitely going to be an uphill battle. But, you know, like you

kind of mentioned earlier, like our speed has been there. It's just a matter of getting the finishes.

And once we get the finishes, I think that hopefully we can quickly climb back up to the points.

Does this change anything about the way that you feel about the points system in general?

Like are you like, oh, man, I wish we could go back to the elimination thing now that this has

happened to me or anything like that. I mean, I definitely wouldn't be as like down in the dumps

if it was winning you're in because I mean, I feel like as a team, we're confident enough that we

would probably win at some point in the regular season. But yeah, you put you have all these high

expectations right of, you know, we're going to win the regular season. You know, that's the goal at

least and not that it's not possible now. It just makes it extremely challenging. You know,

when you have three out of the first four weeks ago, like this, like luckily Atlanta went as good

as it did because it could be way worse than even what it is. So yeah, I think for us, it just

changes the mindset. You know, you probably do have to be a little bit more conscious when you're

in certain situations, right? Like, you know, me trying to, you know, maybe get third on the final lap

that is a high risk move, you know, maybe it's, it's just smarter to finish fourth that day instead

of risking, you know, trying to get to third and, you know, potentially crashing yourself or whatever.

So you just have to be really, really smart now because, you know, you have used up those mulligans.

When you look at your career as a whole, you know, what, what experience do you use, you know,

for the points racing part of it? What experience do you use for the going for it part of it?

You know, we've seen you try to balance both at times, like depending on your situation,

what do you pull from, hey, like, it is smart to do that here versus going for it. I mean,

obviously, if you're going for it, and there's 15 points on the line, though, that could be different

versus one spot. But how do you, I guess, what are the calculations inside the car when you're

thinking about that kind of stuff? Yeah, I think it definitely is situational awareness, right?

Like it depends on your situation just in general. So, you know, I kind of think of the Bristol

dirt race, right? You know, if I don't have a win at that point, you know, and you're potentially

racing for a cut line spot at the time, you know, I probably don't make that move because it was a

highly risk, obviously, high reward, but the odds of it working out were very slim, where

having a win, like, second did nothing for me at that point. I already won at Phoenix. You're in

the playoffs. The added bonus points are way more worth me trying to win the race versus,

I finished, I think, 28th that night because of that, where 28th and second was that, honestly,

the exact same for me as far as the playoffs go, where now, you know, if I was in that situation,

again, the difference in second and 28th is now 26 points. Like, it makes way more sense to,

yeah, I can still try to win the race, but not throw this huge hell marry that the odds of it

working out are probably less than 10%. Like, you just have to be way more calculated now in those

situations. And, you know, I think it just really depends on where you're at and the points,

right? Like, if I'm, say I'm 12th and points right now, then yeah, you probably can be a little

more aggressive and try to get those added 15 points, but being 34th or whatever we are in points.

Like, you can't afford to give up 25 points because that could be the difference in, you know,

all of a sudden 34th and now being 22nd in points. Like, it just is so tiger right now that,

you know, the variance is so, so tight that you have to be really smart about what you're doing.

I feel like in just the position you put yourself in.

I was looking at Vegas stats and Martin, despite not even racing last year, is still tied for the

most top 10s at Vegas. He was six for six. Obviously, you finished fourth at Vegas last fall. You

still work getting used to these cars, I believe, at this time last spring. I don't remember what

happened in that race, but obviously James knows how to put a top 10 car together. Obviously,

the Toyota's were fast last year. Is there anything that, you know, do you look at this as like,

we should be able to come back with the same type of speed? Is there anything that could have

changed in the offseason that makes you worried or anything? I don't think so. I mean, certainly,

you know, I think that the amount of halfs that are what Toyota and JGR are always extremely

strong on, right? So yeah, the fall race, you know, we were a really, really good car and

ended up fourth there at the end. Even the spring race, I had no clue what I was doing at the time

in the JGR cars. I think, if I remember, we went like four laps down, got back on the lead lap,

and I don't know, we finished like 15th or something, but JGR cars should be really, really good.

My only half-wise speed wise last year, we were really, really strong, especially the second

half of the year. So yeah, qualifying is going to be in a pill battle, I think, just going out first.

But once we kind of get through the chaos of starting the mid-pack, I think that our car

should be good enough to kind of move through the field, and we definitely need to have a good

solid day. And even, you know, we were talking about it already, like you just got to put a number

up on the board, essentially, just for even Darlington, because if you don't go out early,

or if you go out early in qualifying, like you have no chance of qualifying, get it Darlington. So,

you know, it's crazy that you're thinking so much farther ahead, but it's the truth. It really

does bury you, and then it just sets you back for us the day.

Sorry for my ignorance here. When everybody's talking about the disadvantage to going out early

in qualifying, is it simply that the track conditions, like the not enough tire rubber laid down,

or the track's not cleaned off yet, is it temperature? Because I mean, some of these qualifying

sessions, you don't know what the temperature is going to be. I remember, you know, it used to be like,

oh, we caught a cloud, you know, when it was random qualifying, and that would help. But what is

the biggest factor now to being a detriment to going out early? Yeah, and look, it's not

every time, like last week, we went out third, right? We qualified 20th. Cinderk was literally the

car after me and qualified third. So, yeah, I think that, you know, some tracks are more

aggressive than others, but like Vegas, for example, you know, if you're left first car to qualify,

the track is really, really hot, just because they literally just get done with practice. I think

there's five minutes in between, and then, you know, you go straight on the race track, and the

tracks dirty. So those first couple cars are just picking up all the rubber from the guys that

were just out there in practice, you know, even like coming up to green, you know, up by the wall,

we all all run the wall, coming to green, like that'll be just marbles and dirty. And it takes,

you know, probably five to 10 cars to finally, like, clean that up. And then, yeah, as the qualifying

session goes, the track starts getting cooler and cooler and cooler and cleaned off more and more.

So the grip is just higher as you go. So really, the rich kind of get richer in qualifying,

because if your metric score is, you know, if you have a low points position, like you always go

out fairly late, where if you're buried in points like we are, even if you have a good finish,

you're still going to probably go out somewhat early. And it just makes it hard. You know,

I remember talking to Riley about it a lot last year, just, you know, he's always kind of buried

in points, even if he, you know, had a 10th to 15th place run, he goes out in the first five to 10

cars the next week and you just can't ever get ahead of that. So, you know, I've heard Harvick say

that, okay, I'd really like to see them go back to a random draw. Do you feel that way? Like,

I mean, obviously in your position right now, you might, but in general, would you, you know,

would you like to see them do the qualifying metric like they do now, or would you rather have it the

old way? I don't know if I like the random deal, because then you're just at the mercy of, you know,

the pill draw, where at least now you, I mean, you do determine your own destiny, right? Like,

if you can, you know, win the week before, like, yeah, even with those at points, you're not going

to go out dead last, but I think it's 70% of where you're ever your finishes and only 30% of your

points positions. So I like how they do it now. It does stink at some race tracks if you go out early.

But it's more better than a random pill draw and at least for me, I think.

I'd like to get you out of here on this. So on Denny's podcast this week, he was talking about

the lower horsepower and he, I don't know, I don't know if he meant to give quite a plug for

Darlington, but he perked everybody's ears up by saying that Darlington is going to be insane,

like, absolutely wild with this higher horsepower. And, you know, like, I guess it's going to just

wear the tires out even more. I think he said there might be, might be four seconds of fall off.

You're a Darlington guide. Do you think it's going to be possibly super crazy next week?

It's going to be out of control. It's going to be, I think, the hardest track that we run on all

year long. I mean, the added power is one thing, but the biggest thing is just taking the diffuser

and everything off. I mean, I've ran the sim now for probably a week and a half and you are

crashing every corner, every lap, even on new tires. Like, it is out of control. It'll be very

interesting and practice qualifying to like, literally the whole weekend, I think is going to be

must see. And one team is going to hit it right and they are going to murder the field. I feel

like just because of how drastically different this thing drives. So yeah, you know, truthfully,

I felt like we were pretty dialed in on the old package. So I'm not super thrilled about it,

but it's going to make us earn it for sure. I'm super excited to go to Darlington. I mean,

you're already kind of on the ragged edge there. And now I mean, you're going to leave there

absolutely exhausted. Like, I can't imagine the Southern 500. Like, you're going to be absolutely

wore out. It's going to be a lot of fun. Wow. That's insane. Well, thank you again for hopping on

here. I know it's not like, oh, wow, I can't wait to come up, come on a podcast for 20 minutes and

talk about how crappy our season is going. But I appreciate you being willing to do that. So

thanks a lot. Yeah, absolutely. I appreciate you having me. I was hoping my power would come back

on like in the middle of this. And it would be the turnaround of the season that I needed. I'd be like,

oh, a light switch. Let me pop on. And yeah, we like, there it is. Yeah. Yeah. That's what I was

hoping for. But then you're lucky. Hopefully you can also turn around your good race pull luck,

of course. But that's been just as bad. Yeah, that I don't know. I apparently I got really lucky

the first two times I did it because I think I even told you I got within like three tenths. I think

both the two times I did it. And I've learned that it's way harder inside the car now to really know

how the race is. And like, my perspective of it is different, I guess, than like Washington on TV.

So I don't know. Maybe I need to like start looking up highlights as soon as the race is over or

something, but it is way harder than I expected. I will say real quick. Big Joe Wall who keeps the

score noted that you're the two races where you were running up front the most is with your closest

guesses this year. So I mean, I think when you're in the garage early or in the DVP area that you

use the map to find, it's pretty hard for you to judge the quality. I mean, it is hard. Yeah.

Yeah. Like, like, even last week, I, like, I was driving, you know, I went to PF Changs and got

some food. And then I went to the airport. So I like didn't even see the end until the last like 10 laps.

So yeah, it is hard. Like the last two weeks, I've beat the race traffic out early, which is not a good

thing to be doing as a race car driver. But yeah, hopefully it'll turn around. I feel like definitely

when I'm in the mix, it makes it a little bit easier to do the race. I would think so. I would think

so don't give up on yourself yet. When you're in the car running in the top five, you'll see it's

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Moving on, our next guest, we're going to expect to have SVG here joining about seven minutes,

but I did want to reminisce a little bit in between here as I'm throwing my producer Bobby for a loop.

Because I, you know, NASCAR put up a clip yesterday of Kyle Busch doing that everything is great.

Everything is great. And that was, that just brought me back to a really pivotal moment

in my life and career essentially. So just to set the scene here, I had left, I was at USA Today,

and I had left to go on my own to start JeffGluck.com, a Patreon funded site. So all a lot of you

watching this or listening to this were helping me out at the time, $5 a month, $10 a month,

whatever. It was going okay. I was, I was having enough to survive. This was like, I think Vegas was

either the second or third race, though, that I had been doing this. So I mean, it just started.

And it was sort of like, I don't know if it's going to work or not, right? Like, I don't know if this

is going to keep my career float or if I'm going to be, you know, working at Starbucks shortly and,

you know, getting out of NASCAR. And it was, it was just sort of a big career risk.

So then I go to Vegas and, you know, at the end of the end of these races, I've said this before

of it, it's so hard to express what if you leave the media center early, how disconnected you feel

from what's happening. So all I saw was that, you know, the cars were coming back around and then

suddenly, you know, something had happened with, with Joey and Kyle. And I didn't even know what.

And then I see Kyle get out of his car and start like marching down pit road the wrong way.

And I had no idea who he was even mad at. Like, I didn't, actually, I don't even think I

knew the Joey part at all. I had no idea who he was mad at, but I just saw him walking. And so I

just whipped out my phone. And this is why I have this YouTube channel, I believe. Let's play the

clip here of what happened next.

Hey, I'm going to go.

I'm going to go.

I'm going to go.

I'm going to go.

Kyle.

Kyle.

So that was that fight video. And the reason that that, um, went viral if you've seen that before,

or whatever is because somehow Fox had missed it. It was not on camera. They caught it late as

he was walking away, but the actual punch and all that was not filmed by TV. So it would turn out

to be an incredible stroke of luck for me because I was the only one that had this video.

And then all these people started asking me for the video. And so I, I have it up on YouTube.

And it got like over a million views and stuff, but it got demonetized. Some people put like

copyright strikes against it. And I couldn't get it with YouTube, but turned around.

You know, like, because I, I guess they thought it wasn't my video or something.

But so what I did was all these outlets like all over the world, um, they're just like,

oh, you know, can we use your video, whatever. And I was like, as long as you credit, you know,

JeffGluck.com, which again, was like a month old. Um, and so I was able to, I got all these, um,

Patreon patrons to my site. And I had people in the industry that were saying, hey,

this is why JeffGluck needs to be at the track. You got to support JeffGluck because nobody

would have seen this fight, you know, all this stuff. And so, man, that was like a career

saver in a way like, uh, I even thanked Kyle before, um, for going down to in that punch because

I'm like, you have no idea. Like that was a, it was a big moment. It kind of set me up to be able to

travel to the rest of the races that year. Um, and so yeah, we need more fights for the content

these days, but, um, that was definitely a time. So if you were around back then, um, thank you

for, for supporting that, that site. And of course, I ended up staying there and doing that

until the athletic came calling, um, in 2019. I actually thought I was going to do that for the

rest of my career. And I was like, you know what, um, I'm good. Like, I love just working for,

for the people like directly. And it was great. Um, and then when we were having kids, and I

realized, you know, um, health insurance would be nice, like stable health insurance. And, uh,

because the other thing I noticed back with the Patreon patron days was my, my, the amount of

people it's funding me and supporting me would go up and down per month. And you could see why they

canceled. And people would write in the comments, well, I didn't like that NASCAR made this decision.

So unfortunately, I'm not covering the sport anymore. So I have to cancel your funding. And I

would like go down by like several hundred dollars a month that I'd be like, oh crap. Like,

I don't know if I want to ride this out. And then I'm actually thankful that I joined the athletic

when I did before I like had to because, um, I don't know if I would have survived their pandemic then

because the pandemic obviously was, uh, a few years later in a year after I joined the athletic.

And if you're asking people, you know, for money and funding during that time and all that stuff,

that would have been a pretty hard thing. So that might have been the end of my journalism career as

well. So, um, anyway, I'm thankful to still be here. But part of the lore, I guess, is because of

that video, which was nine years ago now. Um, and so now here I am still at the athletic and trying

to do some YouTube stuff and podcast stuff with dirty mo and the club cast and all that stuff.

Anyway, the next person coming up in just a moment here is going to be Shane Van Gisberg. And I

want to talk about, um, you know, it's not even just that he's fifth in points because you would say,

well, he's fifth in points, but it's, it's because of, you know, the road course, right? Well,

no, he didn't win that. So that's 15 more points that he could have gotten. And he said, maybe

say, well, he's fifth in points, but he must have had a good Daytona finish, right? No. He crash

out of Daytona. Well, he's fifth in points because he's stayed out of trouble. Well, he's actually spun

four times in the last, uh, two oval races. He spun twice at Atlanta. I remember he got taken out

by Larson. And he's been again on his own. Then he's fun twice at Phoenix. Um, but he finished

sixth at Atlanta, eleventh at Phoenix. So, um, that's pretty remarkable in the sense of like

he's able to, you know, somehow stay out of trouble, stay out the wall. It reminds me of that

story. I don't know if anybody saw Brad keselowski on the Dale junior download this week. And he

was talking about how, okay, you know, he Jack Rausch had a decision to make between, um,

uh, Kirk Bush and Greg Biffle at the time. I guess this is obviously way pre pre-Brad, but he was

just asking how, how he decided this. And he was saying that both guys would spin in the cars,

but Kurt had a way of spinning and not wrecking. And Biffle was hitting things when he was wrecking.

So because of that, he ended up going with Kurt to elevate him to cup first. And, you know,

that's obviously a skill. So, um, I'd love to ask SVG about that when he hops on. But, um,

you know, I think as well, it's just like, everybody's doubted him on these ovals. I don't know

if anybody, uh, any of you watch the runaway kiwi documentary that he was part of.

But, you know, there's a moment there in his dad says, um,

um, if he keeps his eagerness to win, his desire to win, he'll get there. He'll find a way of

winning the ovals. He'll be fine. And, you know, I think Nascar fans are more skeptical of that,

right? But like, you look at, well, I mean, the people around him, his dad, his family members,

like, who have seen him do this, they all know, like what he's capable of and how quickly he

adapts. And it kind of reminds me of what I'd done this interview with Connor Zillich, uh, with his

parents before the season. And I wrote this big feature for the athletic. And I was talking to his

dad and, you know, his dad's, you know, talking about all these people, like, oh, you're so surprised

that Connor's doing this and in, uh, Xfinity at the time. And, and he's like, no, because I've seen

this my whole life, right? So I think those around SVG have felt similarly like, right? Like his,

his family knows what he's capable of, his, his friends know he's capable of, they've seen this

adaptability. So they're not going to be surprised to see him doing that well on ovals. Um, and let's,

by the way, bring in SVG. Now, well, first, let's play, um, this clip that Kuzlowski said on, on, uh,

the deals you're not allowed about SVG before we bring him in. SVG was kind of like happy Gilmore,

if he could learn how to putt. You know what I mean? Yeah. Like he's got this massive drive.

He could get into the green. Like if he could just learn how to putt, which is like the ovals. Uh-oh,

SVG learned how to race on a novel. Yes. So he got exactly what's going through my mind.

All right. Let's bring in SVG now. Um, Shane van Kizberg and so happy to have you on. How are you doing,

Shane? I'm great. How are you? Thanks for having me. Oh, absolutely. Um, first of all, do you know,

are you happy Gilmore fan? Have you seen that movie? I have. I actually saw that on Twitter a couple

of times last year, people saying similar stuff, but yeah, I saw that clip of his pop up yesterday.

I saw it was pretty funny. So well, uh, you know, I think it, it makes a lot of sense because, um,

you know, as I was just referencing before you came on, I watched the runaway kiwi documentary that

I loved, by the way, people should go watch that. Um, and your dad had that quote where he was just

absolutely sure, you know, he says, um, he'll get there. He'll find a way winning these ovals. He'll

be fine. Um, you know, obviously, I'm sure you see on Twitter as well. There's the skepticism

from NASCAR fans. Oh, it's going to, he'll never be able to catch up. He's too far behind.

You know, he doesn't have that background. Um, and you know, those around you have this belief.

So how do you react to that when people are like that? I don't think it'll ever happen. Uh,

I try not to read into it, you know, and just focus on my own stuff, but

it's tough. Like, um, yeah, this is a completely different discipline or different sport to

anything I've done, you know, but I feel that I keep saying I feel these light bulb moments every

week. I'm still suck things are clicking. I'm still getting better and better. And I know, like,

I can, I can see where it is now, you know, whereas when I first started, it was, it felt like,

what the hell? Where am I losing a second? Sometimes. So yeah, it's, it's coming, but, um,

I still have so much to learn and, um, to gain, I guess it's, it's going to keep coming.

Well, something that's been remarkable is I was, I was up in the press box at Phoenix,

which is right above start finish. And I feel like I saw you spin right in front of me twice.

And then somehow I'm looking up at the end. And I'm like, how the hell did you get back up there?

Like, I still have no idea what you got, what, what the strategy was or what you guys did. And,

and then to finish 11th out of that race, what, what happened at Phoenix? How did you guys do that?

Yeah. So we actually started pretty decent. We're running well. Um, Phoenix is a track.

I've kind of struggled at really. Exfinity and then, um, in cups. So yeah, the race started well.

Like we ended the first stage, 13th or 14th, like we'd move forward and we're competitive. And then

yeah, it unraveled. We had a tie go down. I spun. We lost a lap and then yeah, it got it back. But

our speed was kind of, uh, 8th or 10th to 15th, which is pretty good for us. You know,

it's a big gain for me. And then we kind of were getting back to that area. And then at the last,

last yellow Steven made a good call to go on two tyres and two tyres is always something I've

really struggled with. You know, I've never, because the car feels so different and feels funky on

two tyres. And yeah, that's the first time I've been able to stay in a good position when we've,

you know, made that risk of jumping and, and for once we weren't the last car on two tyres,

you know, so I had a buffer and yeah, I had some good restarts and it ended up working really

well. So to come out 11th, what the day like we had was, was pretty amazing.

Can you tell me so like, aside from spinning off the track, uh, several times that trackhouse

motorplex, uh, I've never spun or lost control in a vehicle, right? Like knock on wood. Um,

and it always like, it seems to me that you lose your sense of where you are so quickly. Like,

in those moments that I spun off in a go kart even, it just was such a whirl and a blur and I,

there's no way I could have kept driving it or understood the sense of where I am.

Um, how is a driver, you know, you've spun four times and these overraces this year and barely

hit anything. What, how do you control your car? How do you find your sense of presence of where

you are still to be able to drive out of that and not destroy your day? Uh, I feel like most,

yeah, I feel like you do have a good sense of where you are. Like the first thing I'm thinking

about is where's the wall and how am I going to stay off it? So, you know, like when I was spinning

at Phoenix, it was pretty much just holding it wide open to try and get the car at least away from

the wall and then then you're trying to pick up your senses and get going straight ahead as,

as quick as you can. So, yeah, I feel like you do know where you're at roughly and then

as you're spinning, you're, you're thinking, yeah, you want to stay away from the wall,

but you're also, you're creating a lot of smoke. You don't want someone to come flying through

and hit you as well. So, it's a fine line, I guess, too. Yeah. So like, do you, if you are spinning

and you're trying to stay off the wall, do you have to concern yourself with where the other cars

are or is that just, you're, you're just hoping like when you're skiing and somebody's coming down

uphill behind you, it's their responsibility to try not to hit you. So like, is that the same as

in a car? It's a weird, weird thing to think about it. I don't really think about it that deeply,

but I think I'm just trying to keep off the wall and keep my race going, you know, if you,

if you just have a harmless spin in most other racing, they, you know, you carry on with it,

but in Asuka, the track gets yellow flags straight away, so you pretty much can get going and

get back in the race pretty quick, but it's a, yeah, it's an old mindset to go into full protect

mode is just spinning. Yeah, no, it's, I think, I just think the car control is, is unbelievable.

Now, obviously, sometimes it's not in your power, you know, last year, people go, well,

first of all, people are going to look at your, the Vegas last year and say, well, he had two,

two DNFs, but what they don't remember is that last fall, there was a huge crash and you were running

six at the time. I think that was another two tire situation, but you were, you were going to

be headed toward a top 15. And that was going to be one of your best over results period. And that

was in the playoff race and everybody's going for it. So despite that moment with, with the crash,

did that help build your confidence going into this Vegas race? Oh, for sure. I was leaps and bounds

ahead of where I was at the start of the year. And I think it started the year we were in the

35th or 36th most of the race. And then second time we went back there, I think we might have even

scored stage points of 10 to 9th. And one of them, and I was, I was running really well. So I think if

I can keep in those positions, sort of eight to 15th, the sort of where we're at and where,

where we're building towards. And that's awesome for where we've come from. So I just got to keep

doing that. And every time we can get stage points as great for us. And yeah, last year's race was

really fun. But again, another two-tar call, but we probably would have been just on the

fringe of that top 10 anyway. So it was cool to, cool to be up there at a track like that because

it was there's more than half there. We were really, really tough. So to finally be in the mix,

there's pretty cool. Do you get out of the car each week or get home and, and look at the points

and try to look at the cut line and see how far you are and all that stuff? Yeah, well, now I do

this, yeah. And it's been cool. Like it's only four races, I guess. So not getting ahead of ourselves,

but we have a really cool sort of points projecting system of where, where you need to be, where we

are on target for and how many points per week we need to score to make the cut off. And it's a

pretty cool system and it's nice to be well above the line at the moment. But it's obviously a

long way to go in very different types of tracks, but it's a very different mindset for someone

like me at the moment to make sure that we're in the, in the top 16 and accumulating as many

points as we can every week. So it's very, very different to last year. Yeah, so we just had chase

Prisco on before you and he was saying that they gave him an average points that he needs again

per week too. So like it sounds, I guess teams must be doing that with the new system, right? Like

they're looking at, okay, well, this is our target. This is our goals. If you can get,

get us as many points a week, we're going to be okay. Is that fair? Oh, 100% yeah. And you see

and like we have it for Ross and Connor where they are and they're there and average points per week,

they need now is greater than mine. You know, it's only small at this point, but it's,

it's cool to have those targets and what to work towards. But again, as I said, you see how much

of a different stage points make, you know, and I think it's Bubba's scored the most and he's way

ahead of where he should be because of trade stage points, you know, it's really, it's really

highlights qualifying. I think for me, I need to be qualifying better. So I have that chance to

score them, especially in the first stage. So yeah, it's, it's been a cool adjustment to focus on

points again. I've come from season long points and all the series off competed in. So

that's something I thought was a strength of mine, you know, maximizing bad weekends and

trying to score as many points as you can every weekend and hopefully that my experience of that

pays off. I got two more questions for you. One is from the chat here for those watching on YouTube,

right behind you, you have a bunch of steering wheels. And people are wondering, are those

sim racing wheels or those wheels from stuff that you've driven in your career? Yeah, yeah, that's

like sim wheels. We got some more. And then there's my sim there. Oh, got you. Okay. Yeah, nice.

I have a whole bunch like oval stuff and road core stuff. I don't have as much time to do the

sim racing now, but I do it when I can, you know, okay. Yeah. And then the other thing is,

you, I was looking at the pre-race news releases from this week and you were running an

absolutely eye catching paint scheme for the Vegas race. And it's a famed street artist who I wasn't

familiar with. I'm not very good with art, but Mr. Brainwash is done your paint scheme for this

week. So there it is right there. Yeah. What was your reaction? I mean, this is like, wow,

holy cow. This is going to be amazing. What was your reaction to seeing this? Yeah, well,

even the day time of 500 car was super far. I was pretty out there as well with the

with the gold, I guess, on the side of it. And it's it was pretty out there seeing it at the shop.

And the more you look at it, the more you see, like all the details on the side. And

that's one thing I like about NASCAR and super cars. We'd have the same

page job the whole year, you know, full-time sponsors. And this year, it's cool going

into the shops and oh, what sponsor have I got this weekend? What do they come up with? And,

you know, with super far windies is always pretty out there at the bush cars. And yeah, it's

cool to see. It's definitely different. But, you know, it's kind of cool to do something different

and get people talking. Well, Shane, it's it's really been cool to see your success because with

this return of this point system, we've been hoping that it gives more storylines for everybody,

right? And like, if it had been just the same guys up there that we see all the time, I don't

think it would have been as special at this time of the season. So see you just fifth and points

right now and be following you every week and saying, man, can he stay up there? Like, what's he

going to do now? Give us something else to watch in the race. It's been really neat. So,

appreciate you giving that to us and thanks for coming on here. No, thanks, Jeff. Yeah,

hopefully we can stay out there. It's always the go. Sounds good. Thanks. Shane Van Gisberg and

everybody. And we'll go off to Vegas and see how he does. And again, like, I think that's so fun

for the point system. And this is why they brought it back, right? To just be able to see,

you know, every week. And I don't think that it's bad to hear people talk about points racing.

I know that was a big concern with coming into this new format. Oh, people are going to be

talking about points racing again. But it's a championship. It's a season where you have to get

as many points as you can. And it goes over from week to week. So like, yeah, there's going to be

times when they can't win and you have to get the points that you can get. And again, maybe it's

not even just the good guys up there. Can they stay up there? But it's the guys like Chase Brisco.

And so you're watching somebody at all points through the field. You're not just saying, okay,

who's going to win today and punch their ticket? Right? Or who? Oh, he's already won. He got five more

playoff bonus points. And everybody else's finish was pretty much irrelevant on everybody else,

by the way, that the line might move. So the line's currently 15th and points, but it might move

up to 12th. So all this talk is totally irrelevant if somebody else wins some flu grace at a super

speedway or a rain short race. You know, it's just so much more authentic this way. But the

downside of that as well is, you know, there's there's points where like if you're if you're injured

or something like Alex Bowman is, that's some of the other news of the week. And we were talking

about on the tear down, well, if Alex Bowman comes back this week, you know, he's 70 out or whatever,

he could still make a run. Well, now he's missing the Vegas race as well. We still don't know if

he'll be back in time for the next one. And it's like, man, now, now it really does seem like

Alex Bowman's playoff hopes are probably toast because if he comes back and he's going to be,

I don't know, 80, 90 points out. And again, you're assuming he doesn't miss any more races,

even for a Hendrick car, that's going to be pretty tough without being able to win a bunch.

I just, I don't know, I think it's going to be really tough. And it's just a shame for him because

this was such an important year for Alex with a contract year, you know, trying to really need

to get off to a good start to make sure he's going to be able to stay at Hendrick. This obviously,

you know, not his fault. And he already had, you know, some crashes before that,

just it really stinks. But hopefully, he'll be able to rally.

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Now, moving on to a different topic real quick. We've got IndyCar had some news this week,

and they unveiled the course for the Washington DC race. Now, I was a little bit skeptical when

they announced this race because I was like, eh, maybe I'm, maybe I have PTSD from Chicago and all

the stuff of like how you hear the inner workings of how hard it is to have a street race.

And then in Washington DC, around the national mall, you're like, ah, this is just this,

and how are they going to do this? I mean, yeah, the government's getting behind it. Yeah, there's

an executive order, but this is harder than it looks. But a man who went out there last week to see

the course unveiled, to see this course that goes past the Smithsonian and the National Archives and

through the National Mall twice was our close friend, Bob Pokris. Let's bring in Bob now.

Bob, I was just with you over at Phoenix. And, you know, suddenly you were, hi, Bob, how's it going?

I'm good. How are you doing, Jeff? Good. I was just with you in Phoenix and we were, we were

finishing up work and you were like packing up to go to the airport to fly on a red eye flight.

I was exhausted. I was just going to go eat dinner and go to bed. And your day was just starting

because you were going to fly all the way to DC. Then you land in DC, you get to this course

announcement and there you are seeing this whole thing unveiled with all the media there,

all that stuff. Just DuGarden was there, all these government officials are there.

What was your impression of all that you saw and experienced when you were in DC?

You know, Jeff, you, some of these street courses, they're iconic or picturesque because,

you know, they go by water, right? You know, they're, or they're, you know, coming in a pretty

area of kind of the town or an expo center area of the town. And here, you're in the middle of,

of the national history, right? You're in the middle of some of the most iconic

buildings and places in the US. So I just think it's just quite different to think about

racing and having a start finish line where when you see, you see the cars across the start

finish line, you're going to see the capital and the background. What is the difference? I mean,

is it just, we, you covered the Chicago thing and the whole street coursing and

NASCAR so much as well. And we heard all the pushback and the community and didn't want this,

didn't want this. Is this just the difference between the government fully getting on board versus

a government, at least that was partially, hey, like we're, we're, we want more money here,

we want this. You know, things can happen when the government is all in is, I don't know,

I don't understand why this looks so smooth from the outside so far. Well, there are people who

are concerned about disruptions and, and the, the people at an indie car saying that they'll

be limited disruptions as far as how, how often roads will be closed. The difference is that,

I think the people in Washington are used to events, right? They're used to inaugurations,

they're used to having things kind of disrupt their, their lives when it comes to roads and

everything. So I think it's just something that they're more accustomed to, to dealing with

than maybe in some, in some other cities. The other question I want to ask you, Bob, is you're

there in Arlington. We see behind you, you're at this new race for indie car around the Dallas

Cowboys stadium. I, I really haven't followed this that much in terms of like what, what indie

car people are expecting or what, what it's supposed to be like. What, what's the anticipation level

for that race are going to have a good crowd it sounds like. I guess they go, you know, it's a pretty

long course around the Dallas Cowboys stadium in the, in like the area, the parking lot, the roads

there. What, what's it supposed to be like? Yeah, well, right now I'm sitting in the media center,

which is a, I think a concession concourse in 18 and T stadium. So, so, you know, I think you should

they're selling hot dogs or something in this area where I'm sitting in right now. So, but the

course kind of winds around, in the roads around 18 and T stadium and then also a globe life field

where the rangers play and it's a 2.7 mile course. And, you know, when you talk about other street

courses that, that indie car runs, none of them except for the new course at Markham's longer than

two miles. So, the drivers are excited about this because they're going to be able to do laps of

90 seconds instead of 50 seconds. And so, they feel like they'll really be able to get into a rhythm

and everything. All right. Well, Bob, we hope you have a great weekend out there. We'll miss you

at Las Vegas, but we'll be following you around the Cowboys stadium and seeing if you catch some

glimpse of Jerry Jones. So, thank you, Bob. All right. Thank you. See you. Bob Pockers, everybody,

on the Glutcast live from 18 T stadium. And, you know, I think that it sound like his Wi-Fi was

just about as good as the hot dog stand you would think from there. So, poor Bob, you know, we had

some Wi-Fi problems at Phoenix this week. It was not good at all. So, I feel Bob, I feel for Bob

that he's now back-to-back Wi-Fi issues. I hope they, I hope they, they juice it up for him there

before the race weekend starts because Bob needs his Wi-Fi, folks. So, in a little bit of a

Las Vegas preview now, because we will be heading there tomorrow. It's hard to believe it's already

Thursday as I'm on spring break and you lose track of what day it is, what day the week it is. But

just to remind you, so these were the two races last year where Josh Barry had the upset in the first

one. And it was like, whoa, okay, Woodbrothers, definitely for real. And then Danny Hammond's famed

60th win that got him into the championship four. Listen, there's, there's a lot on the line here

in the sense of even the drivers at Phoenix were like, Vegas is the race where you're really going

to know what you have. It's, yes, we're into the real season now and we keep saying every week now,

the real season for real season starts, real season starts. Phoenix is so different, right? And

yes, there, you know, I think we learned some things at Phoenix, but there was more that's,

you know, it was, it was also a similar race to what we've seen before, right? Like,

Penske was good. The Toyota's were good. Hendrix struggled a little bit. So the real question comes

out of Vegas. Are we putting too much into this race? Are we putting, oh my gosh, if the Chevy

body isn't as good here, are they going to be off for this part of the season behind the fours

in the Toyota's? If Toyota doesn't run as well as they did last fall, is there something up with

Toyota's? If Ford makes a statement, does that tell us something? This is the big jumping to

conclusions race for me. And some people don't like that. So people are like this, you're making too

many assumptions. My coworker, Jordan Bianchi for one of those. But let's hear from Joey Logano,

a clip that I have from him from this week and see what he has to say about meat jumping into

conclusions too much. I have a tendency to jump to conclusions prematurely. But if I look at

this race some next week, is someone safe to be able to do that in terms of who's good right now?

I don't think so. Yeah, I don't think so. But it doesn't mean when you go back in the first

track, the case later, that scenario is the same because there's so much distance between, right?

Like, it's a good judge to see, okay, what happened over the last season, right? So we get the

new body, was that a fly? We certainly get a better idea of what that is, but we've got to

forward six months. So maybe it helps to jump to conclusions for now, although we already heard

in this episode not for Darlington, because that sounds like it could be an outlier as well.

But at least for these next races coming up, maybe for Kansas in a month or so, maybe for Texas,

maybe it'll matter there. Now let's look at the stats for the next gen races,

because I don't really think that pre-next gen applies too much in a lot of these cases. So

eight next gen races at Las Vegas, Larsen and Lagano have two wins each, but Larsen has 595

laps led way more than anybody else. Byron is second with 266 laps led. So

Larsen is totally dominated in terms of laps led. Larsen and Ross Chastain have the most

top 5s with 5 each. So that tells you the trackhouse cars could be good here this week, right? Which

would be good for SVG, because SVG was meant, remember again, running six when he got

wrecked last year in that fall race. So that could be a good sign for him. Maybe it's a sign that

Zillich can rebound. And Chastain, Chastain needs some points too. So that could be a good moment for

them. Larsen, Byron, Chastain and Truex, as I said earlier in the episode, have the most top 10s

with six. I just can't believe Truex didn't even race Las Vegas last year, two races. And he

still is tied with the most top 10s there in the next gen car, not just for his career. So

again, Toyota had four of the top five in the fall race. So that's certainly notable to see if

they can do that again. And then we'll be watching the Chevy's to see if their nose, if their

new body makes a difference. So let's talk about the weekend race times before we go. There's

another F1 race back to back to open their season. They're in Shanghai, China on Apple TV at 3am

Eastern time Sunday morning. Now, I don't know if you guys have seen all the fallout from the F1

race, but man, the drivers are pissed. And not only that, F1 is seemingly starting to get into

the censorship program. So they are, they have been hiding comments, angry comments from fans on

their X replies, on their social media replies, hiding comments so that there won't be negative feedback.

And from what I saw in my timeline, when Max Verstappen criticized the cars again in his Shanghai

press conference today, earlier today on China time, at least, they cut that part out of the video

that they posted. So F1 is in full damage control mode over these cars that the drivers hate and are

trying to keep the drivers silenced. Listen, I lived through the area, the era of secret fines in

NASCAR. And I could tell you it doesn't end well for the sanctioning body trying to do that because

it always gets out. The drivers end up speaking anyway. It's trying to silence the driver's opinions

is just a losing battle. And we've seen this before. Again, we talked about last week. We've seen

this stuff with F1 with NASCAR before with the decisions F1 is making. I just, I just don't see

it going well for them. They, they need to get out ahead of this and be honest about it as opposed

to trying to deny it. But I don't know. I, I, I, NASCAR fans, you, you know what, what happens in

this cup practice and qualifying is Saturday, uh, 230 Eastern time on prime Indie car. Their race

is Sunday at 1 p.m. Eastern on Fox. So they will not be conflicting head to head with the cup series

race, which is 4 p.m. Eastern on FS1. So I'm glad they're, they're not going head to head after

Indie car just had some great ratings. I don't know if you guys saw that with the double header. So

that was good. And then the O'Reilly Auto Parts series race another evening start on the East

Coast 5 30 p.m. Eastern on the CW seems like the CW likes, likes those very, very late afternoon

or early evening starts. Of course, it's 230 p.m., uh, Vegas time, but still a little bit, uh, late,

I guess, and I really don't like that the, um, the cup race is so late. I think it's a 4 13 p.m.

Actual green flag time for Sunday, which is 1 13 p.m. local time. I look at,

that's just, that's just getting kind of late in the day. I get why TV does it. You know,

every hour they go later is a, is a boost. I think 5% in viewership, but

from a viewership standpoint, like, I would prefer personally to just start those West Coast races

at noon, um, which is 3 p.m. East Coast, but I don't get a vote. Anyway, um, hope you enjoyed this, uh,

spring break edition of the Glutcast, please, uh, like this video and subscribe to my channel,

here on YouTube. Um, thanks to our guests, Chase Brisco, Shane Van Gisberg and Bob Pockress.

By the way, uh, Chase Brisco's text in me during the show is powers back on.

So if you're looking for a little, uh, little moment, um, he's got the power back on now.

That could be, it could be the sign we're looking for. Thanks to my producer as well, Bobby Marcos

for running the stream. And I will talk to you guys Sunday night on the tear down. See everybody.

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