MacKinnon EJECTED as Avalanche struggle defensively against Edmonton | DNVR Avalanche Postgame

0:00I just want the league to defend the abs goalies, the way they do every team in the abs play. Welcome in the DNBR. I have a lead post game show line from the Toyota lounge. It's a loser's lounge, but a lot of things to talk about. And that loser's lounge powered by your front range Toyota dealerships. Abs fall to the Edmonton Oilers 4-3. They do take the L in this one. There's a lot of context here. There's a lot of interesting things to talk about. Kind of a weird game in a lot of ways. I don't know. I guess I just, the actual hockey played. I don't know that I have a good read on in this one, Jay Mike. I don't think it was the abs A game. That's for sure. A lot of sloppy mistakes in this one. And we'll talk about all of them. Some frustrating swings of momentum,

1:00officiated related that's going to happen sometimes. We'll get into all of that as well. But mostly I'm just annoyed that we stayed up for a game that was supposed to feature two of the best hockey stars in the world. And for the third period, one of those guys was absent. He sure was. Well, talk about that a lot. I'm sure let's hit with the 60 second rundown before we dig into this one. Abs score almost immediately in this game. Ross Colton, the shot from the point, hits some stuff and goes in. You'd love to see that for Ross and then he gets hurt later in the first period because the abs don't get nice things. Edmonton is able to punch back on the power play initially. A tough night for Brent Burns, just as a whole, which we'll talk about. But it's one one. The abs are able to get that goal back and get a two goal lead going with a power play of their own. Marty natious is able to score. And then in the dying minute of the first period, Edmonton ties it back up as the abs blow another defensive coverage.

2:05It's two two after one. You get into the third period, rather second period, I should say. And the abs just kind of struggled at times in their own zone. I don't think they have anyone else to blame for their loss in this game, but their own defensive shortcomings. It ends up being three to Edmonton in the second period. Then you get the Nathan McKinney situation. I've already over 60 seconds. So I'll just leave it at that and we'll talk about it later. The abs do tie it up at one point in the third period. But a penalty from Nick Law gives the Oilers another power play, which McDavid converts on and that's the game winning goal. I think there's a lot of conversation about this game. But at the end of the day, the abs lost this themselves. I'm not giving them any excuses for the defense that was frankly disastrous for the first 30 minutes of the game. And then a penalty that you just can't take in the third period. Yeah, I think a couple of things can be true.

3:06I think you can be frustrated with the wildly inconsistent, officiating when it comes to goal-tender interference. But that's not what cost you the game. I mean, you successfully killed that penalty. Then you immediately take another one, just moments later with a really untimely high stick. It feels like really since we've come back from the break now, the abs have had a knack for taking those really untimely penalties, third period penalties, tight game penalties. They've gotten away with it in some of these games. They didn't tonight. And between that and the mental lapses, I mean, you basically give up back-to-back goals on defensive miscommunications. I mean, the ice was wide open. The center of the ice, you could drive a pickup truck through there if you wanted to. It just, it can't happen against a team of Edmonton's capability. And you take enough dumb penalties against that power play.

4:06They're going to burn you. Yeah, 100%. The abs made a problematic bed of their own making, despite the other silliness in this hockey game. First of all, regardless of the game outcome, the biggest problem here is another injury for the abs. Ross Holden leaves the game, does not return. These have started to stack up on the wrong side of this Olympic break now. You've had Leckon and get hurt. You've had Landie get hurt. Kibby was hurt for a while. Thankfully, his wasn't bad. But now you lose, Ross Holden. And I don't, we don't know. He could be fine ultimately and be playing the next game. But the abs got to find a way to stop getting guys onto the injury list here. Your death is really getting tested now. And in part, this is why you make some of the moves that you did because you wanted to give yourself a little bit more leeway there. But that's a tough spot, especially given. You'd like to establish some continuity within these lines,

5:10especially if knock on wood, things go to plan and you're able to wrap up the division and cruise a little bit at the end of the regular season. Like this is the time you would like some of these new guys to be gelin with your established lineup, kind of going into the playoffs. So it's, it's not great. Hopefully Colton's okay. It's a bummer, especially after finally seeing him, you know, get on the score sheet again. Like, just kind of felt like bad vibes right off the bat in that sense. Yeah. The vibes in this game were weird to me because obviously by the end of it, the vibes are obviously bad, right? But at times it felt like the abs were still in control of this game, despite the issues that were occurring. Not that I think the abs played great by any imagination. But it's a game that got away from the abs and it didn't feel like the abs were comfortable. And so many games this year, we've seen the abs trail

6:10and it feels calm. It feels collected. It feels like the abs are going to get it back and they know what they need to do. The game, the issues started to spiral and it just felt like the chaos took over for Colorado avalanche. There wasn't that calmness that we usually see. I think that's fair. I mean, you're missing your captain, you're missing two of your better defensive forwards and like an end and land a scog. You're going to feel that to some extent and cadre, although he's been here. It's been four years. I mean, it's going to take a little bit of time but was not always that decimated as well. I just felt like this was one where you didn't have quite enough offensive fire power in the end. I liked what I saw five on five in especially a lot of that first period kinds of felt like they were pretty dominance kept a lot of possession.

7:10Real I mean, they didn't give up a shot for the first seven minutes of the game. The David woke them up in a hurry. like you avoid, you avoid taking that penalty there, you are pretty much dominant. But then it's too to when you look up at the end of the period. It was just, it was kind of one of those nights. Yeah, it's tough. And we'll get into some of the micro details and some of the players individually. But unfortunately, I think this felt like a systemic problem all game from the abs defense. Look at where all four of Edmonton goals get scored. Directly on the top of your crease. That's just not good enough from your defense covering the right areas of the ice. You need better, it's top to bottom from your team in protecting the right areas. And again, that's everyone. You went out and got certain guys like Josh Manson and Brett Kuleck. And I don't think they were the worst defenders on the abs by any stretch tonight.

8:12But their job is to defend that net front and it didn't get done tonight. I think it's especially frustrating when you just see it happen repeatedly. Yeah. It's such a fast game. Breakdowns and communication are going to happen here and there. Weird bounces are going to set up, you know, opportunistic angles and all that. For it to happen four times, it just was really maddening, especially because it felt like the first two were basically the exact same thing. And you're just like, where are you going, Burns? What are you doing? Yeah. Brent Burns was completely lost on both of those goals. And frankly, I don't think he got much better through the rest of the game. And there's this conversation of like, oh, well, Sam Gerard has gone. So all of that, Iyer has shifted. And maybe there is a little bit of harshness going on, Brent Burns, because of that. But when you watch him struggle in the way that he did in this game,

9:13that's not like, that's a legitimate concern for the Colorado Avalanche that he just looked like that against the Edmonton Oilers that that play cannot be like, oh, well, it's Brent Burns and he sucks at that move on. You have to be viable defensively at least in the systems to be making the right decisions and not directly costing your team goals. It has to be better than that. If you want thing, if he's just getting toasted on a two on one or something like that, but you're making the wrong reads as a veteran, you just can't have that. And I think what's especially alarming, if you're an abs fan is, it's been trending this way for a while. It's not like this is a fluke or showing felt like he really started the season strong, maybe exceeded expectations in terms of his impact at stages in November and December, but it's been trending the wrong way for a while now. And I don't know. I just wonder if it's too much tried on the tires

10:16at this point. He just can't run with these horses anymore. It's not, look, if it weren't for the Iron Man streak, I think Brent Burns probably would have sat out of game already. I think that's where it's at. I don't know that we need to go into more detail in that conversation, but the fact is the abs defense cannot play that poorly. That pairing of Manson and Burns cannot play that poorly because if they do, you're essentially running best case scenario, you're running four defenseman basically and you sit that pairing. And if you continue to keep playing them, it's probably going to continue to cost you goals because there is teams beat you. There are two teams on the ice. The Edmonton Oilers are trying to score on you. If you get beat, okay, tip your cap sometimes the other team is better than you, but you're non competitive. You're not even a conversation of

11:19affecting those plays at all for either defenseman, frankly, but in Manson's case, he's at least on a puck carrier doing something. Burns is just not reading the play like you said and floating into spaces where he's taking himself out of meaningful positions. And you know, in a perfect world, Mackenzie Blackwood bails you out, but those are unbelievably good shots and they go on your net and you're not defending them. Yeah, I certainly wasn't thrilled with what we saw from Blackwood early, but I mean, he kind of got left out to dry at various stages in this game and just to see your most veteran defenseman kind of struggle the way they did in this one. It's alarming, especially against the theme of Edmonton's caliber because if you want to win the Stanley Cup, you're going to have to go through offensive juggernauts like them. Dallas can burn you just as easily. That's not a team that lacks, you know, scoring capability. Yeah, and it's it's concerning in this stretch too,

12:22because you come out of the Olympic break. You have three weeks off. There should be no real mileage on those legs for Brent Burns. You play five and seven. All right, that's a that's a tough stretch. Yeah, you're playing a lot, but then you get two days off going into the Dallas game, the Minnesota game, and now this one. And that's not that crazy of a schedule to play every other day for three games. And you're it looks like Brent Burns has played 10 games in 10 days the way his legs are moving. And and it's nothing against the guy. I'm sure he'll get back. Come right. Right. Like this is also something we've seen earlier in the season where Brent Burns will have a stretch of good games and then a stretch of really bad games and then get back to it. But the bad games are really bad right now. They're loud. Yeah, I just I I respect the whole notion of the Iron Man streak and what that represents over the totality of his career. But frankly, if you're the avalanche, you don't give a shit about the Iron Man streak.

13:26You want to win the Stanley Cup. So whatever you got to do to get the best out of Brent Burns, you got to figure it out. Like what I didn't have your streaks and records. Nope, there's a big goal at the end of the season that matters a little bit more. We do need to take our first break of the show here. So let's make sure we're shouting out a few of our sponsors, including back with us is bet three six five. Go get your money's worth. Look, this was a wild game. The bet on, but easiest thing to do is bet the over and abs versus oilers. It's just free, buddy. You can't go wrong with that one with these two teams in the fold. Make sure you're getting on them as they are an official partner of the Colorado avalanche. When you sign up today with code DNVR365, you can bet $5 on your new account and get $200 in bonus bets. They also have a bunch of other amazing offers. The NHL is an early payout offer. If your team gets up by three at any point that you pick to win, you get an instant payout on straight bets and parlay selections get marked as a winner. So download that bet 365 app today.

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15:32Mountain Cancer Centers to ask one important question. Have you been screened lately? Don't drop the ball. This could be the biggest catch of your life. Rocky Mountain Cancer Centers, the official sponsor of Denver Sports Fans, had to Rocky Mountain Cancer Centers.com to learn more. Go do it. Cancer sucks. Beat that stuff. Amen. Second period of the DNVR Avalanche podcast. I do think there is some more stuff to get into, but I'm mad and I just want to talk about it. So let's get into the Nathan McKinnon Goli interference thing. As we always say, multiple things can be true. How that call gets called a major is mind-boggling. I truly don't understand how you possibly can come to the conclusion that that is a major penalty and a game misconduct on Nathan McKinnon, removing him from this game. I'm not a loss for words. I don't know how you can possibly explain

16:41that that's the call that got made there. It's just baffling on so many levels because you're seemingly going with the call based on outcome, which is obviously unfortunate. You don't want to see anybody get hurt. It was a violent collision, but you can see his skates turning. He's making an effort to avoid the goalie. Maybe there still would have been a little bit of collision there, maybe you still end up taking a penalty there for gold tender interference, but he's not trying to run him. The way that got called was as if the intent was to go straight through him. It just very clearly wasn't that. You can see he gets pushed into him. I really don't know what else he's supposed to do in that scenario. We have this image that was tweeted at me, Tiff. I don't know if you have it. It's very, very clearly. Nathan McKinnon's line is affected by Darnell theirs. There is no doubt in my mind that it altered the way that play played out.

17:44I think had they called it a two minute minor, I really would not have had that much of a problem with it, but I think there's a legitimate case that this shouldn't even been a penalty at all. Nathan McKinnon has the right to go for a scoring chance. You can see here, this is like as Darnell Nurse is crashing into him. Look at the angle of Nathan McKinnon's skates, if this picture will stay on screen. Look at where Nathan McKinnon is. You're telling me if Darnell Nurse doesn't push him into his goalie, Nathan McKinnon's going to collide into his head. Like, no, Nathan McKinnon's going to cut to the top of the crease and get out of the way every single time. It's just, they reviewed it. That's what's even more frustrating about it is I just don't, I don't get it. It's the inconsistency that makes these types of things so frustrating. Again, the whole reason that this game is being played late night, everybody stayed up because they want

18:48to watch the stars, right? And then to toss one of the biggest stars in your game, who frankly, I would assume would get a little bit more of the benefit of the doubt. He's played over 900 games, never gotten a game that's conduct before. He doesn't have the reputation. I just don't understand why you would do this. It feels like the league getting in its own way. You certainly wouldn't see, I just don't think like you'd see the NFL, you know, stand behind Patrick Mohm's or something getting tossed. I know it's not really comparable, but it's just baffling to see that call stand. And it's unfortunate because it had the potential to be a really fun third period. And again, the abs, you know, they lost this game for so many reasons outside of that. But it's super annoying. And there were a couple of other, you know, really frustrating miss calls as well. And it just, it leaves you sitting here pissy like we are tonight. I am definitely pissy. I will own up to that for sure. And I think it's two teams, two things, rather for me. One, I think abs,

19:53team and fans are particularly needled by something like this because of what we've seen happen a Scott Wedgwood over the last 14 months, stating all the way back to the play where he got injured and the rest didn't blow the whistle for seven seconds and allowed a goal to go in and count against them. Absolutely absurd. But you've watched through the rest of this season, even multiple plays where Wedgwood gets run into or something funny happens and a stick gets pulled out from him. And not only do they not stop play or not do anything to help, they don't call penalties on the other teams as we see the abs goalie get abused in these ways. And yeah, was this play significantly more violent than some of the stuff Wedgwood has faced this year? Absolutely. But then it all of a sudden becomes a five minute major and a game misconduct when the abs do this. When you watch it not go the abs way, when you watch Sam Bennett run into whoever the hell he wants at any given time and they barely give him a two minute minor like it's it's almost unbelievable how inconsistent

21:00repping in general is around goalies, the goalie interference problems the league has had for years. It's just crazy. And that brings me to my second point, which is the rule book is broken. You need better defined rules around plays like this. The rule the NHL rule book says on goalie interference in this situation. It's a major or a minor entirely at the ref's discretion. There is no set of things that you're looking forward to decide why it would be a major or why it would be a minor. It's entirely up to the ref's. And that is a object failure from the NHL. You need a better rule book. You need more defined rules. You can't just be making stuff up in the middle of hockey games. You can't do it. In 10 tasks to matter in a call of this magnitude, did you make an effort to try and avoid the gold tender? Was your line impacted? Were you trying to hit the gold tender the way you did straight up? If you make contact again, maybe

22:03it's a penalty because they got to protect the gold tenders. I get it. But to I mean you throw a five minute major one that's a game swinging call just from the fact you get the power play out of it. But it's a toss in like I just don't I don't get it. Yeah. Me neither. I really don't. And they go and review the play for 10 minutes or whatever it was on the iPads. And you come back from that and nobody believed that was a major penalty. The only people on the world that believed that that was a major was the refs who called it a major. Like I don't understand that you don't have the rulebooks set up to help the refs. You don't have the systems in place for them to make the right call. And then the system that's supposed to fix that with the reviews does not get you to the solution that I'm sure that Ed Minton or other fans probably wanted it to be a major. But anyone looking at this play and I'm trying to take myself out of this

23:08like not even including Ab's fans thoughts. Go scroll Twitter of neutral zone neutral fans and neutral personalities. And nobody is saying that that should be a major penalty. You even got the TNT broadcast to say, well, that's an unfortunate call. Like come on man. What the hell is going on? Well, I think part of the problem too is the lack of communication when you make a call of this magnitude. Yep. Like in the NBA, you got to get on the mic and kind of explain why it is what it is. You know, and the NHL could maybe stand to have a little bit better communication. At least explain the reasoning of why this call is happening. Yeah. It needs to be better. And I say that also understanding again, Ab's lost this game all on their own. Others didn't score on that major power play. Does not having Nathan McKinnon in the third

24:10period make a big difference? Yes. Absolutely. Let's not pretend like that didn't affect this game. But the Ab's mistakes that cost them in this game come entirely separate of that major penalty. So the Ab's don't get to use this as an excuse for why they lost. But fans watching the game, a nationally broadcast game. And you just took one of the best players in the game out of it by a terrible call. I think that's fair to be upset. We watched the game from McKinnon and McDavid, not for the Zebras. Exactly right. Don't make yourself the story if you can help it, Refs. Anyway, we can move on from this. I do want to talk about some positives because I think there are some positives in this game despite the struggles that the Ab's had. And number one, Marty nature scores a power play goal. And would you have loved a second one late in the third? Sure. But Ab's power play gets back on the horse here. They get a, they get the job done as far as percentages in this game is

25:13concerned. I don't really have an issue with that. You look at what they've done on the power play post Olympic break. You feel a little bit better that that Minnesota nightmare is maybe the outlier here in the games they're scoring in is the more consistent factor. You hope so. It seems to at least be trending the right direction as a whole. Still don't think it's perfect. I still think they get a little too cute at times, especially when you see like the speed with which Edmonton enters the zone and gets a good chance on their power play. It's like, man, I haven't seen anything like that in a while, but it does feel like it's going the right way. I feel better about it, but I still feel humbled about it because of the Ab's penalty kill. And this is a complicated conversation that Ab's killed that major like that's not worth nothing that also burns your legs out. But you're also in a game against the Edmonton oilers

26:13where you could make an argument that their penalty kill or maybe it's your lack of discipline that lost you this game. A power play, let's say I was back into the game in the first period, and the game winning goal ultimately comes on a power play. And well, yeah, sure, Nick Wacke can't take that penalty. And Ab's power play that was the top of the league continues to decline at an alarming rate at this point. I think it's fair to say that the Ab's power play, I don't know that they're falling apart, but it's definitely been a negative post Olympic break. It hasn't been quite as consistent. I mean, they've stepped up in some key stretches. I feel like early in that there is kind of a good example of that. Feels like they've given up a lot of early goals though in PK scenarios. Yep. And sometimes it's tough, you know, ultimately the game winning

27:14goal. Harmonic David's pretty good, man, like sometimes he's going to beat you. But you end up losing the special teams battle tonight, not because of your power play, but because of your penalty kill. And that just not even like from a statistical standpoint, from a mental standpoint, from a vibe standpoint, to go from a season where your power play as a disaster and your penalty kill is your saving grace to now your power plays finally figuring it out. And it's your PK that's letting you down. It's hard. That's tough, man. I don't envy having to do that mental gymnastics to get through that. I mean, some of it is the amount of penalties you're taking to like it would help with for you could just play with a little bit more discipline, you know, if a set of six, seven PKs in the night, if it was more like three or four, you're probably not seeing these numbers dip the way that they are. But it is alarming. Like it's definitely

28:18something where if this continues, it's going to make you feel a little sweaty going into the postseason. And you're trying to find that balance right now. You and I talked about it in the pre game. Was this one lined up to be a little bit of an emotional let down for the abs? Yeah, probably. And big picture, I think that's fine. But the feeling of being in a game three, three in the third period, use some nonsense has happened, but you can go win this game. And you dig your own grave with a penalty that obviously Nick Watt didn't do it on purpose, but you need to be in control of your stick. And especially from a bottom six forward type, you just cannot take those penalties. The timing of it was so brutal because it felt like you got a little bit of a momentum swing with the successful PK. And then it just immediately swings the other way. And that's the dagger. Like you feel it in the moment that you're not coming back from

29:19that unless you get something crazy, held by breath for a second when they pulled the goalie, just because he saw it the other night. But I think if I was most upset about anything out of the Olympic break, it's just been the seemingly lack of discipline, because it's been a pretty consistent issue now, basically every game. Yep. I think you had one, it's eight games post break now. You had one game where you had less than four penalties in it if you're Colorado. Got to clean that up a little bit. It has to not get enough. Yeah. That's and hopefully the abs can take the right mindset out of this game. Some nonsense absolutely happened in it. But there's plenty you can clean up as a team too. It's not like you went out in bombarded Edmonton. Your shot on gold totals are not awesome for the vast majority of this game. So plenty of improvement on both ends of the puck. We do need to get into our second break of the show.

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32:29Private dining spaces are available for corporate events or social celebrations. Make a reservation or learn more at STKStakehouse.com. I can use a stake right now. Helps me be less mad. Other good positives from this game, though. And I know, look, I've been annoyed as hell on this show. But there are things you probably should take. Valentuskin able to find the back of the net again. You do feel like outside of the big guns and even dealing with some of the injuries that you're dealing with. You're still finding some of that secondary production from your. I know the lines are mixed, but second line guys. Yeah, I think Val, the last couple of games has really been trending upwards. The scoring is obviously taken up, which is great to see. Just kind of feels like body language. And this is one that's harder to read, you know, watching on the broadcast versus

33:30being there in person. But yeah, that feels like it's been positive from what we've seen as well. Like just just kind of feels like he's taken things to that next gear over these last couple games. That's exactly what you were hoping to see from him post Olympic break. Like he's another one of those guys who didn't have to put those extra miles on, you know, the tires across the the globe. So like it would be great to see him, especially without some of these other guys, potentially, hopefully, you know, Colton won't be out too long. Who knows how long they'll ultimately be without land a scog. But this is if the abs are going to get where they want to go, they need this version of found the Chuchkin. I feel pretty confident in that. It feels good right now for sure, especially if we've seen now that I think Brock Nelson has played poorly over the last couple of games, but the goal scoring isn't flying into the net for him like it was earlier in the year to have balance. You can step up and finish a couple of those helps balance the abs line up a little bit. And really, you know, I think a lot of the abs,

34:35bottom six actually played pretty well tonight. They didn't get rewarded for it. Pucks just weren't seeming to find their way to the net too often for the abs, but you have a guy like Bartikov consistently creating chances. Brenley was working really hard. You know, what you get every night out of a guy like a kelly or a jury, it when you look past all of the nonsense, I don't know that I have a big issue with the abs offense in this game. No, it still feels like they maybe have to work really hard for some of their goals. Like it just feels like those ones that that feel like you're building up to don't necessarily happen like the two on ones and stuff like that. It just feels like those ones aren't falling for the abs pretty consistently. But when they're executing within the zone and they're setting it up, like I feel like they're doing a good job of creating good chances. It's just taking a lot of work at the moment. Yeah, and it is fair, especially against the team like Edmonton, you do really

35:43want to see them capitalize on their chances or their opportunities, maybe a little bit better. You ended up with a three on one at one point in this game that you don't even get a shot on net on. And sure, problem there, fine. If you take umbrage with that, I think that is totally within the realm of reasonable. It's tough. It's an Edmonton team. I was prepared for a shootout type of game here. But you look at the scoreboard and you see the abs put three shot, the three goals in and in the NHL most nights, three goals should probably win you a game. And they didn't get it done tonight. Yeah, that's a good point. I mean, it's certainly as far from a disaster. Like I don't want to come off as hypercritical or anything like that. I just, I would like to see them execute on a couple of those finish up. Maybe a little bit better rate. But yeah, I mean, frankly, you've got to be better defensively. Like that's what it comes down to. I don't think you

36:44leave this game ranting about the power play or ranting about, you know, the quality of the shots or anything like that. It just really comes down to a lack of discipline. And frankly, the other team was far more capitalistic than you were. You got a credit Edmonton. I mean, every time the abs beat a mistake, basically outside of the McKinnon major, they didn't score on that. But Edmonton really sees the every kind of opportunity that we laid on the plate for them. Yeah, they absolutely capitalize better than the abs did. Look no further than and these are five on five stats. So keep in mind, the abs scored a power play, a little Edmonton scored two in this game. They had the four minutes of the five minute major that ended up being five on four instead of four on four. But at five on five, the abs out course Edmonton 51 to 30 outshot them 18 to 13 out chance them 21 to 16 and out high danger than or rather did not out high danger them five to nine. So the abs, despite winning

37:47the possession battle, weren't generating the high danger of chances. Maybe at the rate you would have liked in a game like this. And it's yeah, we're there some things that win against the abs tonight for sure. Some of them were pretty significant, but that's hockey. And we've seen an abs team at times this year is fully capable of overcoming that type of stuff. You're in a three three game in the third period, regardless of what happened. You want to see the abs find ways to win and they didn't tonight and big picture. I don't think that's a big deal. I'm not going to take a lot out of this game as far as significant reasons for the abs to change something major. But you also need to file it away and say, Hey, we need to be better in games like this one. Yeah, without a doubt, I think also if we're playing devil's advocate, you had back-to-back games with which you were able to get that big goal against, you know, Minnesota and Dallas to force

38:50over time and then ultimately win. So two out of three game sample size, you're playing pretty clutch in what big moments. I think you could even make the argument that that should have been the vowel goal in this game, but you take a dump penalty and you let yourself down. So it's not for lack of trying. I don't think, but you got to find a way to tighten some of those screws. We do have line from ballerina Bailey Curtis calling in for the courtesy call on the Xfinity mobile calling line. Bailey, thank you for joining us. A lot of weirdness in this game. A lot of nonsense. What's your take from in the arena? It's it's difficult. I think when games like this start to get as out of hand as they did, frustrations evident not only on the ice, but but off of it as well. Despite everything they were going through, some of the questionable officiating, you're looking at a team that's running their forward lines without Ross Colton and

39:54Nathan McKinnon. They're still only one goal away. Yeah. They're one goal away from, you know, making this some sort of game they can grab two points out of, which I think just is a testament to what this team has been able to do. It's a fun one to watch. It's a frustrating one, but there's absolutely, I mean, it's when you get that head to head the best on best and they're keeping it that close. Those are some of the most fun games to watch. There's a big elephant in the room here. Your thoughts and the locker room thoughts on the major penalty? A lot a lot of frustration. I feel like that's the big word coming out of this game. At first, it happens so quickly that I'm on the devil's advocate side of this. I think, and I'm saying, like, you know, Nathan McKinnon maybe puts on the brakes a little too late. I don't like where this is headed. Looking at it from the different angles and seeing the contact exactly how it happened

40:57shouldn't have been called the way it was. Point blank period. Nathan McKinnon's inches away from missing Conor Ingram and and Darnell Nurse throws him off of his trajectory and it's unfortunate and I wish all the best for Conor Ingram. I really hope he's okay. It looked like he got pulled for a concussion spotter. It looked like he got a cut to the head. Really unfortunate situation should not have been a major and a game. I understand kind of where the major comes from. If you're looking at it from an injury perspective, but even then it's not McKinnon's fault. And that is where you talk to Conor. You talk to McCarr or you talk to Blackwood. Anybody in that room is going to sit there and tell you what did Nathan McKinnon do wrong. He's trying to miss the gold tender. What does he do to deserve that? Conor made it very clear in his press or two. I don't know as though I've ever seen a major call on gold tender interference. He's trying to avoid the hit at the top of the crease.

42:03You know, that's unfortunate. Out extending factors made that so that was not the case. Everybody was kind of baffled by it even code 20 because that was the explanation he was given to. It was that the five minute was given due to the injury. But again, why is that called when Nathan McKinnon's fault the injury is happening in the first place? It's just a lot of frustration as far as the punishment goes. Was not deserved. Yeah, I fully agree on that side. What's the vibe from Bednar then after a game like this? Because there was clearly some things that didn't go the abs way and then there were clearly some problems of their own making. There are a couple different things that I think factored into it for Bednar. The shaky second period, but overall really liked what he saw from his group in the first and third. Maybe a little trouble breaking out pucks to start the game, but overall really liked the effort his

43:07group was putting into keeping the abs in this game. From his perspective, it seemed like there was not a lot to be discussed in this one. The thing I do kind of want to touch on to just because it's been such a huge conversation as the goal-tending. I think Mackenzie Blackwood plays a huge role in this and he made it very clear in saying, I don't blame him for the goals, but looking at his trajectory throughout the game, you see some of the highest highs as far as saves go from Mackenzie Blackwood and you see some of the lowest lows. Some that are maybe routine saves that you expect him to have and he can't come up with them and that's kind of what Bednar mentioned. He was like in the first half of the game, you knew to save point blank. You need some of those saves that he was providing in the third period, you just were not getting them. It's really hard to be just pleased with how this shook out. I mean, you throw the officiating into it. I'd love

44:10the quote, it doesn't directly tie into Bednar, but something else that after the game is like refs are going to, they're going to ref how they want to ref and that's kind of the vibe that Bednar gave off as well. He's going to not say it, but he'll say it in his own kind of like perfomctorie way. And yeah, that's unfortunately just kind of how it shook out for his group. It really seemed like there was not a lot he was displeased with from his group. Even talking about it because he was asked about Brent Burns after this one. I think we can all agree that this was not Brent Burns's best game by any sort of mild or stretched. Didn't have a whole lot of bad to say about it too. There's no concern as to the effort or what Brent Burns is doing in the race as far as watching mentioned in the post game press or so. Some things that they definitely want to go back and watch. Discipline was a big word that was

45:11used in the presser today as well and saying things just need to be better. He pointed to some of the line changes that my dog man rushes that he really was not pleased with. But other than that, Bednar was, he liked a lot of what he saw tonight. Just going off of what you said there, Blackwood ultimately finishes the game with a 33 save percentage. That's not a great number. I do think he played better in the second half like you talked about. Are those high danger chances again? Absolutely. He also gave up three goals on nine shots in the first 30 minutes of this game. I mean, those are just tough numbers. Especially when you're looking at starting situation, the fact that McKenzie Blackwood is set to be your starter heading into the playoffs. The consistency is the big key for me here because looking at his games before the Dallas game, I can't sit and complain about the numbers that he's putting up there.

46:12It's just the idea of doing that in a consistent manner and as of right now, something Bednar mentioned after Morningscape today. He was talking, I asked about the pressure. Maybe put on a guy like McKenzie Blackwood after those kinds of performances and trying to respond. He mentioned that there's not a whole lot of pressure from the coaching staff, but he hopes that there's some pressure after those performances that maybe he's putting on himself to respond and create a conversation and make a case for himself after games like that. And I wouldn't say as though this is the response maybe McKenzie Blackwood wanted to put up. But in such a tight race, as this has become, at least in my eyes, when you're looking at the performances Scott Wedgewood is putting up in the numbers, he's creating for himself. He's got to be better. That point blank period, he has to be better.

47:14I was going to ask you about discipline, but you kind of already hit on that. So I want to ask you about Val Nechuskin, and if anybody had anything to say about his performance, because it feels like the production is taking up and just from an I test standpoint, he's really popped these past few games. So what did the fellas have to say about Val? Not a whole lot from the locker room tonight about it, but how can you not be pleased with what you've seen from him the last couple of games? You could tell the guys are super excited for him on the ice, and even walking in today, there's a couple of you know, it slaps on the back and things of that sort, but other than that, I think there's a certain level of expectation for a guy like Val Nechuskin. When you're missing Gabe Landestog, when you're missing Ross Colton and Nathan McKinnon out of that game, he needs to step up and you know, in a game like this, that's what you need to do when he did it.

48:15That's really all I've got on that front. They're coming off of two big wins against Minnesota and Dallas. Those games go all the way to a shootout. Is there a conversation about this game just being an emotional letdown game after those two? In a way, yeah. There's also something to be said to you about those two games were really grindy games from the team, and that's going to take a lot out of you. There's no taking away from that. Those are hard games to play, and so I think there's a certain level of grace to be given to the way the team played today, given how the last two performances have gone. There may be playing with some tired legs. You get a bit of a break with a no practice yesterday, but there is a certain level of exhaustion. Yes, they're pro athletes. Yes, they know how to deal with this, but they're also human at the end of the day. With that said, tying into that professional

49:19athlete type mindset that you need to have, exhaustion is really not a proper excuse for me anyway for the lack of discipline, the lack of emotion that kind of comes out of this one. They handled themselves well as far as, you know, their penalty is gone and kind of keeping themselves composed. And Kadri talked a lot about that next man mentality and how, you know, when you're only running the nine forwards that you're used to running on a game by game basis, like it's the guys did what they needed to do and they gave it their all. But at the end of the day, exhaustion is not an excuse for some of the mistakes that were made in this game. I don't know as though, yes, it's an emotional, maybe let down, but I don't know. These matches with Edmonton always tend to be a little more up on the emotional front. You see a few more scrums. You see some fights happen here and there. You're also looking at some of the best on best talent

50:23in the league too. So there's, there's a lot more that plays into it, I think, than just on the emotional front. Is this going to be the new normal down the stretch, Bailey? They cancel practice for tomorrow too. The schedule's brutal. I can't imagine you're heading towards too many practices for the last month of the season. I will be surprised if we see a full practice from here to playoffs. That is just my expectation. With the schedule, the way that it looks, it's condensed and it's hard. It is a brutal stretch from here to the middle of April and then after that, you've got a brutal stretch for playoffs. It's going to be difficult and I think if you're going to preserve as much as possible, that's exactly what you need to do. So they need all the rest they can get. I'm glad they're getting it where they can, but optionals from here on out if they didn't hold those, it's going to be the way to go. That's all I had, Bailey, any final thoughts and notes on this one?

51:25This is the next game. I'm done with these light starts. It's pretty good. It's a brutal, brutal stretch of timing with the, you know, daylight savings and all that stuff. I'm just ready for normal games. No, I think that's too bad. The ad leather play before noon or after eight, that's the loss. There's no end between. Bailey, we're going to let you go on this one. Thank you for calling in. That is Bailey Curtis. On the courtesy call line from the Xfinity mobile call in line, go follow on Twitter for a bunch of great stuff. Bailey Curtis with two wise. I'm, I'm just going to continue being mad. So maybe instead of listening to me, let's listen to a calmer voice in Jared Bednar and his head coaching presser.

52:31Yeah, first thing I looked at for me, I look at the overhead, me makes the plan the puck, and I got his toes cut and up ice, probably through the top of the paint and anger him on the goal line. I don't think there's a chance, there's no chance that he hits the goal if nurse doesn't run until he's not hitting the goal. So to me, I look at that and it's like, I checked the overhead first, he's going to go where his toes are pointed and they're going through the top of the crease with, with anger in the bottom of the crease until nurse makes contact with them and that's what causes the collision. So to me, that's, like I'm looking at that right away, I don't care if he's injured, not injured, it's a severe crash, not a severe crash, it's not penalty. You put, if you put guys in your own goal, it's not a penalty. That's why I see it. Colleen? It was a rough open and it was a big hit. What is, obviously the frustration line is pretty high,

53:32how do you keep the team focused when you're dealing with that situation? No, that was the easy part. I thought they were outstanding in the third period. Once we lost those guys and we needed to dig in, we needed a big kill, we got the first one, then we'd go and tie it, like I think the frustration in our group was because of our play in the second period a little bit, it's because I really liked their first. I really did. I thought we were for-checking, we were moving the puck, we had good always on play time. I think the frustration starts when you hand them two easy goals. Like penalty kill, rush coverage, guy driving the net, we step out, they find him, it's in the back of the, we can't step out there. Breakout, lazy routes, swinging away from the puck right to the net front all alone, should have had one, if not two guys in that area of the ice, they score again, right? And then second period, we're not,

54:40like it just wasn't good enough for part of the second, right? So then we start to work our way out of it and then it happens with Mac and then we're fighting it sort of chasing the game. But like based on the third period, shorthanded like the guys who finished the game, like they played their butts off, and I feel like we deserve. Even in the third period, like I'm not going to make it about officiating, but it's part of the game and like you were shorthanded taking slashes, it's not called, we're going to look away, then Nelson dances, the guy in the neutral zone and gets tripped, like that's what the penalties are for. If someone makes a high skill play, Mac David beats one of our guys and he's going to the net and we put a stick on him in the wrong spot or we hook him hold him whatever it is, like the officiating is supposed to reward the skill, okay? And they were going to call everything but this stuff when a guy makes a high skill play and gets into a dangerous spot. I just don't get it,

55:40but that's my frustration. I thought our guys did a decent job working through that and keep it on task, especially shorthanded. Ryan and Courtney, Ron, please, the game with an upper body, I do not. Just the fact that he took a shot from a player during the game and then like he kind of tightened up so he's got upper body injury and hopefully he's loosens up for tomorrow and can can can can play in Seattle. No, well not not a good one. I don't know, goalie's heard so it's five. Again, I really don't give a crap if the goalie's heard. That's that's on their D-men, not on our guy. Yeah, the same thing, the memory kill since the break is like less than something. Yeah, the thing that happened tonight is that a systemic thing or is there just another thing? No, it's okay. So like it's the same as our five on five, same as our power play. Like we're

56:41digging in on our team now because we've seen all the teams we're playing. It's been a long time since we saw Edmonton so we did an in-depth pre-scout so they knew what was coming at him. It's about detail and commitment and we we had some bad reads and some lazy plays you can't make. You're playing Edmonton. They're number one and expect the goals for over the last 10 games. They might be number one and expect the goals for in the year, okay? They've had some trouble keeping the puck under their net. Number one, you start with your defending details. So you got a penalty kill on the first one where we're that's a bad read like we're stepping out and they're finding the slot. Regardless of what our coverage is like you still got to make reads on the ice and they score. And on the last one, same thing. We go corner half-ball and then they make a play and they're back inside us. We didn't get either guy or Dees caught in the outside. It can't happen. So like their detail or our detail in our penalty kill isn't as good

57:43as what it needs to be. It's why it was so good all year, okay? And we got guys making wrong reads and not doing the job that they need to do to keep it out of our net. So they're going to start seeing it. Same as our power plays, third seed and they start dialing it up. Our five and five has been dialed up. I've loved our defending since the break and tonight it wasn't great. We had I'll give you an example. Three or four times at the start of the second period where we change, we try to go in on a rush and we lose it and change and they get odd man rushes and it's going to get boring chance against you. You can't do that. You can't do that against anybody. Never mind the best offensive team in the league. So they'll see it again and we'll decide on where commitment level is going to be for Seattle. Jesse, give us three goals on 10 shots for McKenzie's start. Then he had a couple of big saves. We need to save in the first half of the game. Like they had three or four quality scoring chances and three of them ended up in the net.

58:45I'm not blaming them for any of those goals but if we're going to win against a team that's really good, especially when our team's not playing well, you need some big saves. It's why we got back in the game, right? He makes a couple of big saves in the third period penalty kill big saves and then we go in the score. If we had that at the first half of the game then I think we're probably playing with the lead. Have it. You're missing some guys now, front and out, maybe so you need other stuff. I was at the Navy Parkhouse Pass game. I love this game tonight. I don't know what I ended up playing with him but I was trying to get him out there as much as possible in some different situations. He was outstanding. He looked fast, he was physical, he was checking the puck back, had some good scoring chances, missing a little bit of his touch. I'd like to see him get a couple of those chances on net. He draws a penalty or two. He was really good. For what expectations are, I was trying to use him as much as possible because he was good tonight. I just want to make it. It seemed like he needs some returns for that

59:49a little bit. Yeah. How have you felt about my friends coming out of the Olympic break? Is it any concern for you at the moment? No, I don't have concerns. I don't have any concerns on our guys, except for the fact that we need to be sharp every night to get to where we want to go. They made some mistakes. Some of the mistakes we made tonight, I've already touched on some of the changes. To me, that's a little bit of lack of discipline. Some of the reads in game from most two guys, Manson Burnside, they scored on twice. It wasn't their best, but I've liked those guys and I've liked the way they played through it. That wasn't a great night considering what we needed from our team against the Oilers. There's some things that I really liked and some pushback that I liked from the team in the third period, but for a full 60 minutes,

1:00:51it wasn't their best, but I can't say anybody out. It's been like going through it right now. I think our guys are working hard. That's a smart guy. He's, he knows what he's talking about in those pressors. I think that was a really honest one from him. Really liked it. He didn't beat around the bush with the roughing or the poor play or all of it. So props to him. We are in overtime here. Conversations in his online at the dmbr.com have obviously the the current schedule here. And I don't think there's a ton to worry about. You just played your hardest stretch of games and you went two and one. You do have Dallas again coming up, but you get Seattle, Winnipeg, Pittsburgh. Dallas again is a tough one. Chicago, Washington, Pittsburgh again. A lot of winnable games coming up for the ads. Yeah. I mean, obviously would have been nice to see him extend the

1:01:51win streak, but there's six and two out of the break. Yep. Really favorable stretch coming up here. McKinney gets to see Crosby. So I'm sure he'll be in a good mood. The vibes are going to turn back the right direction. Yeah. I think you can comfortably put this one in a box and put it away, especially if they go out and look good against Seattle on Thursday. We do have a couple of super chats to get to Ryan saying, Kelly Sutherland, special Nick Waw on my shit list. Yeah. The roughing was bad. I don't know what to tell you. It's like the NHL needs to do a better job of making their rule book more clear. And this is I'd bed and are talked about them. At this point in the year, I don't even have anything left to say what it comes about to the missed calls and trips and all of that stuff that happened. It's just an everyday occurrence in the NHL now. You just want to consist and see, or if anything, you want to be able to rationalize

1:02:58what you're witnessing. And it's just becoming tougher to do. Yep. Another one from Ryan that says play 11 seven burns constantly costing them too tired. I think 11 seven is a giant cop out. If burns is actually that bad, sit him. Iron man streak be damned. Like either he's helping your team or he's hurting your team. You don't half way it. Make the decision or don't. I know that's not how it works in reality. And I'm not even fully convinced that they should sit him. There is a part of this conversation that I haven't talked about a lot. But of course, the abs want to win their division and win the president's trophy and all of that. But what they really want is to have their guys in the best spot possible day one of the playoffs. And if playing through some junk from Brett Burns gets him to where he needs to go during playoff time, then fine. He's had some good moments. He's just he's 41. So the the miscues are loud.

1:04:03Yep. And then the last one $2 again from Ryan pay Gregory Campbell $20 million next year. Look, I get that penalty from Nick walk kind of makes him escape goat of this game for sure. Not a penalty you can take while was also the guy willing to drop the gloves and get into a fight in this game. I don't think the abs lack the grittiness, the physicality, man's in a fight. Nick, while we'll fight when you're healthy, Landy will fight. You have these bottom six grinders that get in there and hit people and mess it up and get in the corners. I just don't think that that side of the game is really an issue anymore with the abs current lineup. And certainly with an abs healthy lineup. I'm not worried about it, man. And frankly, it's easy to pin it on him, but untimely penalties has been a pretty common issue amongst the roster top to bottom over the

1:05:05last couple of days. So it's hard to like rant about him and what's been a trend for the team. Like yes, can't happen, especially frustrating given the timing that you just got off the PK. But I think he's going to assimilate just fine. Yeah, I'm not worried about it. I will say the next time someone touches Scott Wedgewood, the abs better, like go nuclear on if there's a no call. The president set, right? Yep. That's I also think there's a larger conversation. We don't have to get it into today because we have to end the show. But like if you're going to make calls based on injury, you're encouraging every player in the league to act hurt when they get a penalty against them. Like that's just not a rationale. Like guys get injured and hockey. And that's not trying to minimalize what happened. You hope the guys okay. It was a really violent collision. I know they want to avoid that. But like Betsy said, it's a violent collision that in

1:06:09large part was initiated because their own guy pushed McKinnon into him. Yep. And like again, a clear rule. You could make the rule tomorrow. You're not allowed to run into the goalie full stop no matter what the situation and players will stop putting themselves in that situation. It'll devastate your offense and you'll be back to where you were before the last lockout where everyone's winning every game two to one because no one wants to run the goalie. But if you want to make the rule book that you could instead, you've left a vague rule that nobody really knows what anything is ever going to be. I got stopped before we get mad again. So that's just it. Wrap it up and end the show here. Jay Mike, any final thoughts before we get out of this one? Some consistency would be nice. Watch a lot of sports cover sports for a living talking depth about football and hockey. If you put a knife to my back, I would be in trouble if they were like, articulately define gold tender interference or articulately define what is or what isn't to catch in football. Like I just the ambiguity of it all is maddening. The problem is nobody knows.

1:07:15There's not a single person on the planet that can tell you what those things are definitively. And it is what it is. Av's got to find a way to win regardless of the things happening around them. Hopefully they can go do that. We are out of here for today. We are back tomorrow for another off day show. So come join Bailey and I for that one. We'll see you over there. There's been the DNVR Avalanche podcast and that's it.