Lindsay Clancy Mistrial

0:00this computer. Okay, so we're here to talk about the Lindsey Clancy case, the Miss trial as it were. I'm going to first thing I'm going to do is I'm going to run through the timeline. We're going to go through the timeline as best as I'm capable of going through the timeline. Then we will will read an article by Buck Johnson that he posted at his sub-stack through dissident media. And then if you stick around to the end, I will actually give you what my opinion is on the trial. And the way I look at it and how I'm trying to digest everything that happened with the trial. So I'm going to pull up my notes. So what we have to realize, we have to get the timeline down.

1:06Now some of the stuff, the stuff I'm going to like mention at first is undisputed. And I have five bullet points of things that are disputed. There are more things that are disputed. To me, these were the five main bullet points of what was disputed in the Lindsey Clancy trial. Then we'll talk about the burden of proof where the evidence had to point. What was the prosecutor's burden, what was the defense's burden in this trial? And why it ended up the way that it ended up? It's October fest. Shiner October fest. It's that time of year again. I love it. So it means falls right around the corner. So you had, Callan was born in early summer of 2022.

2:07But throughout the summer, everybody said that Lindsey was extremely happy with the way that her life was going, spending time with her husband, spending time with her kids. In September, just before returning to work as a labor and delivery nurse, she began to feel anxious. In October, she returned to work and Callan was refusing to take a bottle, causing more anxiety and sleeplessness. Her insomnia persisted after this. It was something that was ongoing after October. She continued to have insomnia. She began seeing psychiatrist. She saw things around six doctors in four months and was prescribed 13 medications, including Zolloft, a volume and anambian, among many others. In December, she reported to her mother and husband, she'd been thinking of hurting the children. Now, I find this to be one of the most important bullet points

3:09on this trial, because I don't think she ever stopped thinking about hurting the children. I think she stopped telling people. I think she told them the one time, and that was that. She never told them again. She never brought it up again. She was embarrassed by it. She was afraid that children were going to be taken away from her. And she was afraid that she could potentially lose her job as a labor and delivery nurse. She also never reported any of these thoughts to a psychiatrist for the same reasons. In January 24th, 2023, she murdered her children. This is not disputed. This was not disputed by the defense. It was not disputed by her husband. It was not disputed by her mother. It was not disputed by her mother in law. It was not disputed by anyone of any significance that was close to Lindsay Clancy in this trial.

4:10On that day, she was outside playing in the snow with her children. They said that this was the happiest they had seen her in years. Speculative note here. I heard a psychiatrist point out the fact that if she were already planning to murder suicide that evening, that this happiness was due to a finality in her diagnosis, in her mental issues, and that her happiness was caused not because she was outside playing with her children, but that she had already made the decision in how she was going to end that day. And what was going to happen that evening? Now, this was a speculative point made by a psychiatrist. I heard talking about this. Just want to point that out that this was, this is something that has been noted by psychiatrist among mentally ill people and patients. And this is something that should be taken into account when thinking about this particular situation. She then sends her husband out to get dinner.

5:17And she Googled, how long is it going to take him to get to this restaurant and get back? Plus get the dinner. Later on in around 515, she texted him and asked him to pick up pedialax from CVS. What is speculated here or what has been reported within the courtroom was that she asked him, will you stop at CVS and pick up pedialax when you're out getting dinner? He said yes. And then she texted him. There's an email that takes place at 524. The husband sends an email to co-workers. Now, it has not been established. It was never established whether he sent this from his phone when he was sitting in his car outside of CVS or he sent it from his computer before he went to CVS. But it was established. This email was sent at 524.

6:18At 532, the husband enters CVS. Now, somewhere between 515 and 532, because we don't know exactly what time the husband left the house. We know he left in between 515 and 532. That's all we know for sure. We don't know if at 524, he was already gone. So we don't know if he was gone when he sent that email to his co-workers or if he was still at home. But somewhere in between 515 and 532, she brought the children to the basement. She put Kora and Callan in Patrick's office. Then she took Dawson, the middle child, the three-year-old in which she had complained about on Facebook, about being the most difficult person she'd ever dealt with in her life. She brought him to the workout room. Both these rooms are down in the basement. The office was off to the left.

7:20The workout room was off to the right. So she goes downstairs, brings Kora and Callan into the office, leaves them there and takes Dawson through the basement to the workout room. She strangles all three of them. She starts with Dawson. She lays him on his belly, wraps the exercise bands around his neck and strangles him. Then goes into the office, wraps the exercise bands around Rapsin exercise band around Kora's neck, strangles her, lying face down on her belly, and then Rapsin lays Callan down on his belly, wraps an exercise band around his neck and strangles him. At 532, the husband enters CVS. At 533, the husband tried to call her to ask her about the type of stool softener he was supposed to be getting for Callan. She did not answer the phone at 533. She swiftly calls him back at 534 and he said she sounded like she was preoccupied or busy given the

8:27kids a bath, something like that. But she was distracted by something. At 538, the apple watch records her walking up stairs to their bedroom. She then shallowly slits her wrist, not deep enough to bleed to death, but deep enough to bleed quite a bit. She also shallowly cuts her throat trying to hit the carotid, but doesn't cut deep enough once again. And she intentionally falls or jumps or pushes herself out the window in some way, landing on her head neck area, fracturing her spine and paralyzing her. She laid there with her head facing towards the house, her feet facing away from the house. The bleeding stopped due to the cold. Her heart rate slowed immensely. Her

9:27body temperature began to stop to lower due to the broken vertebra and spinal cord injury as well as laying in snow. Her husband gets home shortly after six. There's been a little bit of dispute about when exactly he got home. Was it 605? Was it 609? He searches upstairs. He goes upstairs. He searches the kids' bedrooms. He searches the bathroom looking for the kids and his wife. He goes to enter his bedroom. Notice that the bedroom door is locked. He retrieves the key, unlocks the door, walks in. There's blood all over the floor. The windows open. He looks out the window. He sees his wife lying down at the bottom of the window in the snow on the ground. He runs downstairs, rushes to her side, asks her what happens, calls 911.

10:29The police arrive. Patrick goes to the basement. He's still on the phone with 911 and he finds the kids. I believe he said he found Cora first. He screamed. The police heard him. They rushed down into the basement. Find Cora. Get her to the ambulance. She's still breathing slightly. They get her to the hospital. She dies at the hospital. Callin is already dead. They search the basement and find Dawson. He is also already dead. When Lindsay wakes up in the hospital, the first thing she said, she was either asking for or if she needed an attorney. That to me was unclear. I was unsure exactly how she worded it. I don't think they did a good job of clearing that up. All of that is undisputed. The disputed facts, five

11:32points of the disputed facts. When Patrick left, she began hearing a man's voice commanding. She that she killed her kids and herself. How do we prove this? Has she ever heard the voice before? No. Has she heard the voice since? No. So it only existed in this short period of time, this 20, 30 minute period in which Patrick's not there and she's going through and committing these horrible crimes. The defense also suggests that she suffered psychosis and couldn't control our actions or know that her actions were wrong. But only this one time, only for the short period of time did that ever happen to her. She Googled the distance to the restaurant to make sure she had time to complete her task and added CVS to the trip to give herself more time to murder her children and offer herself. Or she Googled how long it was going to take him to go to CVS in the restaurant

12:40because she didn't want to be left alone. That's disputed. That's contested. We don't have a clear answer there. She did not testify. We did not hear what she had to say about the events of that night, probably for the best for her. The prosecutor has suggested that she was not taking the medic sentence as prescribed. Now, her husband Patrick had complained that she was on too many meds, but the prosecutor has pointed out that many of the pill bottles that she had only had one or two pills missing if any. That most of them she wasn't taking at all. That she had just refused to take them or refused to take them as prescribed. The other thing that's also disputed is that when Patrick gets back, rushes to her side. He calls 911. He asks her what happened. She said she tried to kill herself and he asked her where the kids

13:45are and she responded to kids are in the basement. We didn't get to hear the 911 call. Maybe we will get to hear the 911 call. Now, the prosecutor says you can clearly hear her say basement on the 911 call. The defense says you can clearly hear she can't speak and she's just moaning. I don't know. There was some thyroid damage from the broken spine, the spinal cord injury in her neck area that caused some thyroid damage. Some people said it crushed the thyroid. It did not crush the thyroid, but there was damage. Would she be able to speak? It has been suggested that when the injury first happened, you'd be able to speak and slowly you'd be losing the ability to speak. But then there are others that say no, there's no way she would have been able to speak. I don't know. I'm not a doctor. I've never seen injuries like this. I've never dealt with a situation like this. I don't have any clear discernment on what happened here. Now, why was this case so

14:54sticky? What was the problem with this case? What made it so troublesome? What made it so hard to deal with? Well, it was the fact that the burden was on the prosecutor. The burden was not on the prosecutor to prove that she killed the kids. We all know she killed the kids. She admitted to killing the kids. There's nobody is disputing the fact that she killed her children. The problem is that the burden on the prosecutor was to prove that she was not insane. See, the way that Massachusetts law works is that when the defense says that a client is insane, the jury must then be on the client side on the defendant side and say, okay, she was insane unless the prosecutor proves otherwise.

15:58So the prosecutor must prove a negative. They must prove that she was not insane. Now, one might say, well, Ted Bundy was insane and he was found guilty. Jeffrey Dahmer was insane and he was found guilty. But we're not talking about clinically insane. We're talking criminally insane. It's two different standards. And the standard was that the jury had to be convinced by the prosecutor that not only did she know what she was doing was wrong and that she intentionally maliciously did the perform the acts, but that she did so knowing that it was criminal. This is where the issue comes in. This is why the prosecutors had such a hard time. How do you prove the negative? How do you prove that she knowingly performed criminal actions

17:02despite her swearing that she heard this voice and she was encyclosis? How do we prove this? She'd never had psychosis before. The doctors that examined her never diagnosed her with any kind of psychosis or postpartum depression. So how do we prove this? Most people say, well, this was eight months later. I mean, psychosis didn't kick in after eight months. Did the insomnia and the drugs that she was taking regularly? I think she was pretty much accepted that she was at least taking the zole off as prescribed. So does the insomnia along with the drugs and the anxiety all intermingled

18:02together and create some sort of psychosis? I don't know. That's not for me to decide. That was for the jury to decide. What did the jury decide? The jury decided mistrial. That's what the jury came to. Today, it was declared a mistrial. Okay. We had 11 jurors. Well, we had 12 jurors. Nine jurors were women. Three jurors were men. 11 jurors went one way. One juror refused to move going the other way. Judging by the defense attorney, Reddington's performance the last couple of days, we can only guess that the 11 jurors wanted to acquit by, it's not guilty. It's not by reason of insanity. It's like a thing in Massachusetts that's not guilty for lack of criminal intent or something like that. Lack of criminal responsibility, lack of criminal intent, whatever, whatever, however

19:03you want to say it. So you had 11 jurors going that way, according to Kevin Reddington and one juror that was saying, no, she's guilty and you can't move me off of that. And he said, even though he had doubts that the prosecution had proven its case that she was not insane, he refused to move and budge off of that. So he tried to get the juror removed and dismissed. Ultimately, he failed at all his hellmaries there at the end and the trial became a mistrial there at the end. It will be appealed. There will probably be there will be a retrial more than likely. I don't know. So that's generally what the case is of the situation. There's a lot there to look at. There's a lot

20:05there to talk about. But what I want to do before I get into my opinion is to go to share, share screen. I'm going to share my screen. See where is I don't see it. So I'm going to have to lolly gag around here. Boom. There we go. And we're going to bring this up. We're going to make it bigger. So this is the article, but Johnson wrote the other day. One day was this August 31st. So the day after my birthday, Monday, August 31st, but Johnson wrote on his sub stack. You can go to his sub stack. There's the title right there. Counterflow with but Johnson. Did Lensy, Clancy do anything wrong? Mental illness, moral agency, and the things we explain away with but Johnson. It's kind of a chilling picture buck. I know you're listening. You told me

21:13you were going to listen. That is a very chilling picture. My man. Quora Clancy was five years old. Her brother Dawson was three. Call on the youngest was eight months old. I want to start with them because almost everything I've read about the Lensy Clancy case eventually becomes a discussion about Lensy Clancy and often skewed through the poisonous lens of ideology. Obviously, the trial itself is largely about Lindsay. I get that. The entire question before the jury revolves around what was happening in her mind when her children were killed. Her psychiatric history and her laundry list of medications mattered to them as does the possibility that she was suffering from postpartum psychosis. But before getting into any of that, I don't want three dead children to become supporting characters and an argument that I want to make about spiritual warfare, feminism, pharmaceuticals, secularism, or anything else. They were children and like way too many

22:17children over the centuries, they were sacrificed. Whatever was happening inside their mother's mind that night, they are they are gone. Editor, but you need an editor. They are are gone. They are gone. On January 24, 2023, Lindsay Clancy strangled all three of her children with exercise bands in the basement of the family's Massachusetts home. She then attempted to take her own life by jumping from a second story window. Quora and Dawson died that night. Callon died three days later. Okay, see I was wrong in my points. I said, Quora was the one that died at the hospital. It was Callon that died three days later at the hospital. My fault, I apologize. Thank you for the thank you for editing me, Buck. Clancy does not dispute that she killed them. The question at trial is whether she was criminally responsible when she did it. And that's where this starts to allow the public to grab their ideological lens and view this all through that pesky thing that we just can't

23:20seem to see anything without. I don't want to write that easy version of the story. Postpartum psychosis is real as is mental illness. Lindsay Clancy had clearly been struggling and had repeatedly sought help. She had seen multiple psychiatric providers have been hospitalized and in the months leading up to the killings have been prescribed an extraordinary number of psychiatric psychiatric medications. Excuse me. Really, I'm not particularly interested in arguing about whether something was wrong with her. Look around and you'll find a culture, a wash in diagnosis, disorders, medications, and therapeutic language. Often it's not even hidden anymore. It's an identity. Not only is it an identity, people are proud of it. People go around like victimhood. Is such a popular like metal to wear on your chest that people like

24:26have pride in their psychiatric delusions. They carry pride in their psychiatric diagnosis. And it's disturbing. What I found myself thinking about instead is what we now believe that means. Her attorneys argue that Clancy was suffering from postpartum psychosis so severely that she lacked the capacity required to be held criminally responsible for killing her children. The prosecution's argument is not that she was perfectly healthy. They contend that whatever mental illness she was experiencing, she still understood what she was doing and retained enough control over her actions to be responsible for them. There is evidence that makes this a genuinely difficult case. Prosecutors have pointed to what they believe was planning before the killings. Search is involving travel time to the restaurant where she sent her husband for takeout. A request that he also pick up children's medicine in the narrow period of time when he was away

25:31from the house. The defense says that her organization and careful planning doesn't prove sanity and that a person suffering from psychosis can still carry out organized and well thought out actions. Then there is the reported voice. You may know the voice. Clancy described hearing a male voice telling her to kill the children and herself. Defense experts have testified that she was psychotic. Prosecution experts have challenged that account and questioned, among other things, the timing and reported duration of the command hallucination. I'm not a psychiatrist and I wasn't inside that house nor was I inside Lindsay Clancy's mind. Neither was anybody writing Facebook posts about her or cheering her on outside the courthouse. A jury has to make the legal determination. A Massachusetts law gives them a specific standard for doing that. That's their job. I'm interested in a somewhat different question because the conversation surrounding this case reaches far beyond

26:35one woman's legal culpability. I'm interested in what happens when explanation slowly starts becoming absolution. We have become very good at tracing human behavior backward. Trauma, diagnosis, medication, hormones, how do you make a hormone? Childhood experiences, social pressures, relationships, brain chemistry, institutions. Sometimes doing that gives us useful information. It can help us understand people rather than simply condemning them from a distance. But I keep wondering what happens when we trace the arrows backwards so relentlessly that eventually none of them seem to originate with the person who acted. Because Lindsay Clancy isn't living in an otherwise mentally healthy civilization far from it, look around, we're not doing well. You can find the statistics if you want them. Depression, anxiety, addiction, loneliness, suicide, psychiatric medication, etc. But I don't think you need a spreadsheet to notice that something

27:40has gone badly wrong. I would have used the word horribly there, but... Scroll your social media. Go look at your Facebook feed right now. It's ubiquitous. In many cases celebrated and supported. We're medicated, begging for attention, self-worshiping, addicted to pornography, staring into phones for hours every day, fighting with strangers online, breaking families apart, and wondering why everyone feels lonely. Young people are reporting extraordinary levels of psychological distress while adults increasingly require substances, prescriptions, entertainment, politics, sex, food, shopping, or screens to avoid sitting quietly inside their own heads. A moment of silence. Uh oh, quick. Look at reels for 20 minutes. I have no problem believing we're a mentally sick society. I'd be shocked if anyone didn't notice this. I have a problem with the idea that the inevitable consequence of becoming mentally

28:41sicker should be becoming less morally responsible. If that were the case, then in five years, you won't find murder listed as a crime. No, it's... It's a cult. Post-birth abortion. It's not murder. If depression, trauma, addiction, psychiatric diagnosis, medications, abusive childhoods, and psychological disorders become increasingly common, and they will, we're going to have to get better at understanding how those things affect human agency. We can't simply accumulate explanations until the person disappears underneath them. There has to remain some distinction between something influencing our choices and something making choice impossible. And this is where I think our most completely secular way of discussing these things leaves us with a gigantic blind spot. We know how to talk about brain chemistry, trauma medication, diagnosis, hormones, attachment styles, environment, and social conditioning. Some of that language has been

29:45incredibly useful, but somewhere along the way we threw away half the vocabulary that cultures long understood, sin, temptation, the passions, conscience, repentance, and spiritual warfare. Repentance to me is very big here. We will talk about that whenever I get to my opinion. And maybe that's part of why the old vocabulary became so infashionable. Trauma asks, what happened to me? But repentance asks, what am I going to do about me? One of those questions is considerably more uncomfortable than the other. Those words sound positively medieval in a modern discussion about psychiatry. We can spend weeks debating which combination of medications someone is taking and what those medications might have done to her brain. But suggest there but suggest there could also be a spiritual dimension to what human beings do. And suddenly you've become the crazy person in the conversation. Maybe this is where being orthodox makes me look at the

30:48whole thing differently. Orthodox Christianity already assumes something is wrong with us. That's not exactly breaking news in the church. We spend half our lives praying for mercy for a reason. The orthodox understanding of the passions makes far more sense to me than the idea that we're basically autonomous little rational machines whose bad behavior can eventually be explained by finding the malfunction. Anger can begin to own us as can lust, pride, resentment, envy, despair, greed, and fear. We entertain thoughts, feed them, justify them, repeat them, and eventually things that once horrified us don't horrify us quite as much. My first lieutenant once said something I've never forgotten. Never underestimate the ability of the human mind to rationalize anything. Excuse me for a minute. I would like to have a drink. That doesn't mean schizophrenia is just pride or postpartum psychosis is necessarily a demon,

31:57but it certainly doesn't mean that dimension isn't there either. It means man has a spiritual life as well as a psychological and physical one. And when we erase one of those dimensions, we shouldn't be surprised when our explanations of human behavior start filling in complete. Orthodox Christianity has always understood that we can become enslaved to the passions, we can become addicted or traumatized, and that we can inherit terrible circumstances that we never chose. Orthodox Christianity doesn't then conclude that we're merely the sum of everything that has happened to us. If it did, repentance wouldn't make any sense because there would be nothing to repent of. There would only be symptoms of too managed, diagnosis to receive, medications to adjust and cause to identify. Sound familiar? We are here. Medications and trauma aren't enough to explain a human being despite the labels you see people give themselves as if that were the case.

32:59Excuse me. I have ADHD. Excuse me. I have ADHD. The medication part of the Clancy case makes this even more complicated because this wasn't a woman refusing help. She saw it, a lot of it. Her defense has argued that the medical system failed her badly. It clearly did on some level. She has free will to take pills or not take pills. They have free will to give her pills or not give her pills. It takes two or maybe more to tango. And obviously, you know, I'm certainly not going to sit here and write a love letter to the pharmaceutical industry. Hardly. In fact, forgive me if I find our sudden cultural willingness to question pharmaceutical institutions a little amusing. We just lived through several years when trusting those institutions was elevated to a religious status during COVID, questioning pharmaceutical companies, public health authorities or medical mandates could get you treated like you were personally trying to bring polio back. I know this because I was met with

34:02death threats, doxing, deleted and flagged episodes and attempts to have me fired. But if it's a woman murdering her babies, well then we can all of a sudden question big pharma. I'm starting to see the totemic nature of the victim class. Children are always at the bottom. Now we're supposed to consider the possibility that a woman could move through a medical system, receive prescription after prescription, perhaps become worse because the people and institutions treating her got things terribly wrong. Okay, I mean, yeah, I'm willing to consider that. Where where were y'all five years ago? I've been willing to consider it. If Clancy was recklessly overmedicated, let's find out. If combinations of drugs contributed to her deterioration, that matters. If doctors missed obvious warning signs, that matters. If pharmaceutical companies have minimized risks associated with any of these drugs, that matters too. As long as we are following up on each death caused by the jab too, of course.

35:08We good, we good still. Are you willing to break with CNN and Fox here? But again, none of those questions automatically answers the question of human agency. We do, we do have free will, not unlimited freedom, not freedom untouched by sickness, chemicals, circumstances, or the actions of other people. Anyone who has ever struggled with an addiction or a passion knows that human freedom can become horribly constricted. However, once we start treating every influence on a person's behavior as something that relocates responsibility away from that person, the principal doesn't stop with sympathetic defendants. Give me enough time with the biography of almost anyone who has done something monstrous and I'll find explanations. What type of attachment style do they have? The violent husband was abused as a boy. The addict was traumatized. The MS-13 gang member grew up surrounded by violence. The rapist has a personality disorder. The murderer has depression. The

36:10alcoholic has a genetic predisposition. The sociopath suffered neglect. See, it's not really their fault, is it? Some of those facts might genuinely affect how responsible a particular person was. They very likely do. But if our first instinct becomes finding the thing that explains the actor away, eventually we're going to have trouble explaining why anybody is responsible for anything. We are very close as a culture just sliding right into that milieu. And somewhere in this case is another contradiction that I don't think modern feminism can simply ignore. Uh oh, you ready for this? I thought one of the victories of feminism was supposed to be that women aren't children to be guided and coddled. Women aren't helpless creatures being pushed around by men and circumstances. They're adults. They have intelligence. They can make their own decisions. They possess agency. Oh, well, here we are then. They have agency that can can't only

37:10apply when they're talking about becoming CEOs, choosing careers, making money, having sex, getting divorced, legally murdering babies or doing all the other things were told to scream our support for female independence about agency has an ugly side because human beings have an ugly side. A woman can do evil. Can we all agree on that? That shouldn't be a controversial sentence, but it truly is. Watch out quickly. Some of the language changes when a woman commits something truly horrifying. Suddenly she can be again disappearing behind her hormones, her medication, her doctors, her husband, the expectations of motherhood, inadequate support, the healthcare system, society, whatever other forces can be assembled around her. Some of those things may actually matter enormously in the Clancy case. That's precisely why I don't want to wave them away, but feminism can't have it both ways. If women are full moral agents, then female agency doesn't disappear when acknowledging it becomes uncomfortable or mean. In fact,

38:16there's something weirdly old-fashioned and paternalistic about treating an adult woman as a creature so overwhelmed by circumstances that everything around her possesses casual power except her. To add to that, we're supposed to believe the women are rational agents. That their hormones aren't like causes from them making irrational decisions. That they can easily lead armies, that they can lead countries, that they can lead nations do so rationally, not only rationally, do so in a way that's constructive and productive, and that these hormones and emotions that drive women into madness won't somehow drive them to like, un-uncomfortable amounts of death and destruction and hatred and vehement around the world.

39:20We're supposed to believe that if only women were in charge, they're the rational ones. They're the calm ones. They're the weak ones. They're the ones who don't want to kill. They're the ones who don't want to get involved. But every time a woman is challenged with hormonal problems, you end up with two million women on TikTok holding their 18-month-old baby saying, same Lindsay, oh great, two million women on TikTok saying they've thought about killing their children too. Yeah, that makes me think that your rational human beings will able to lead large structures, large institutions like corporations, countries, and militaries. That doesn't give me confidence in your ability to keep your hormones and your emotions in check.

40:21And here's where I keep coming back to the same uncomfortable question. Did Lindsay Clancy do anything wrong? I don't mean legally. The jury will decide what Massachusetts law says about her criminal responsibility. And I certainly don't mean that I know the exact degree of moral culpability should possess that night. I don't. I mean culturally. When we finish discussing the medications and doctors and postpartum illness and healthcare system and social expectations and everything else surrounding her is there still a person left in the middle of the story. I think there has to be. And this is also where I have to check myself because it's extremely easy to write about a case like this and become exactly the sort of person I'm criticizing. My spiritual father, father turboquals says something that has stuck with me. When you attack evil by being evil, you're getting swallowed up by the same demon that is swallowing up your perceived opponents. I have faced that a lot in this trial. That quote right there about

41:26father, terrible. I have faced that a lot in this trial. My knee jerk reaction was locker in a dark room with her with a recording of her children screaming for their mommy on a loop until the day she does. That was my knee jerk reaction, torture her psychologically. But you can't do that. That's not how you handle situations like this. We'll get to my opinion. I promise I'm not going to give it all away before we get there. That's a hard teaching because outrage fills righteous, doesn't it? Three children are dead and reading the details makes me angry. Reading commentary that seems more concerned with protecting a political or therapeutic worldview than remembering those children can make me angrier. But hatred of Lindsey Clancy and the women cheering her on isn't the Orthodox Christian answer to any of this. Mocking mentally ill women isn't the answer nor is cruelty toward people suffering postpartum illness. Treating psychiatrists as demons or

42:32people taking medication as weak isn't the answer and yet all of these can all be a temptation. Maybe you hear the same voice. If I'm going to insist that's a spiritual dimension matters, then I don't get to conveniently abandon it when it requires something difficult for me. Orthodox Christianity doesn't tell me to hate Lindsey Clancy. That would be so easy. What it does do is it tells me to pray for everybody involved in this horrific mess, including her. This may be where the Orthodox Christian understanding of responsibility is so different from the way we've come to discuss it politically and culturally. Repentance itself assumes that what we do matters. I have no idea what God sees when he looks at Lindsey Clancy. He knows the precise state of her mind. Heart and soul that night. He knows how much free will that she had, how sick she was, what those medications did or didn't do, what thought she entertained, what she understood,

43:34and what she didn't, and where that voice in her head stemmed from. A psychiatrist can't know all of that nor can a jury and some guy writing a sub-stack in Texas definitely can't. The jury has a much narrower job. It has to apply a Massachusetts law to the evidence and decide whether the commonwealth proved criminal and criminal responsibility beyond a reasonable doubt. Whatever verdict comes back, I don't think it settles the larger question because Lindsey Clancy will not be the last profoundly troubled person to do something horrible. That will, in my humble opinion, increase substantially in the near future. If we're right that our society is becoming more psychologically unstable, more medicated, more addicted, more isolated, more spiritually sick, then these questions are going to become harder, not easier. And folks will start to bl- Folks will want to start to blame anything and everything but the person who committed to murder because they see how easily they could give it into the voice inside their head.

44:38We will need compassion for mentally ill people and we need to scrutinize pharmaceutical companies, but we will also need a culture that hasn't become afraid of the words responsibility sin and repentance. A civilization cannot survive by declaring its citizens less responsible and proportion to how sick the civilization becomes. And maybe before we turn Lindsey Clancy into a symbol for whichever side of this argument we're already on, we should return to where we started. Korra was five. Dawson was three. Callan was eight months old. Whatever else we decide this case means, I don't want to explain them out of their own story. Lord have mercy. Lord have mercy. Good job, but I really enjoyed that. Thank you so much for writing that book. I'd really do appreciate that. So, here we are. We're coming to the end of the road.

45:45At least coming on to my opinions about what is going on, what I think about this whole situation. As I said a while ago, my knee jerk reaction was locker in a dark room with recordings of her children screaming for their mommy on a loop until the day she died. Maybe you make it so dark she can't see anything. She's in there without a wheelchair, laying on her belly, crawling on her elbows across concrete floor. And then this eight by eight dark cell, there's one sharp object. Maybe after a day or so of crawling around, screaming, crying, flailing her arms,

46:48smashing her head into the wall, she finds that sharp object and she gets to put an end to it like she originally wanted. But that wasn't the right way to think about this stuff. The knee jerk reaction, that primitive reaction, that passion that made me feel good of vengeance. That's not how we should be contributing to the world around us. And that's what I talk about a lot is how do we interact with the world? How does the world see us? How do we change the way that the world sees us? And the most important part of that is changing yourself. You have to change, you have to pray, you have to be in touch with God and Christ. And truly ask for some direction and how to get past these thoughts, these feelings.

48:02Because a lot of these things are natural. Not everything that natural, that's natural is good. If you remember when Charlie Kirk was shot, I wasn't a big Charlie Kirk fan. If you remember the podcast I released, I talked about his children a lot. I have a lot of love for children. I do. I have a lot of love for children. I love to see the children at church trying to make the sign of the cross for the first time. Coming up and giving me a hug and telling me, hi, just truly enjoying the world around them. Having not seen any evil, having not experienced the evils of this world.

49:10I find myself envious in many ways of that. I would love to do that again. I'd love to be in that position again. Just to where I'm like, oh yeah, the whole, the world around me is just beautiful and wonderful and fun and everything's new and exciting. Every one of these children were in that position. Five years old is nothing. You don't know nothing. You may have started kindergarten, maybe. Three. It's just everything's an adventure. Everything's supposed to be fun and play. Their whole lives were taken from them. Their entire lives. The children of Charlie Kirk, they had their father taken from them and that's a massive thing.

50:14In this Lindsey Clancy story, I relate to Patrick a lot because he had his whole world blown up. His wife was gone. His children were gone. I've lived that, not in the same dramatic fashion, but I've lived it. I've had my whole world ripped out from under me. The whole, the carpet, it's pulled out from under me. You thought finally, okay, we're starting to get somewhere. We're starting to establish myself a little bit, moving in the direction of a career. God is a place. And then boom, 16 hours later. Boom. It's gone.

51:18Snap of a finger. It's one sentence. I don't want to be here. I want to go home. I don't want to be here. And everything around you shatters your whole world. Everything feels so unimportant. Because if Patrick were anything like me, he looked at that relationship with Lindsey as being eternal, as being final. See, you're tasked with raising your children, but your children leave the house. And once they leave the house, your spouse is there. So nurturing that relationship, being present for that relationship,

52:21is ultimately more important. There's an important job in raising children and preparing them for the world and sending them out into the world to be successful and to start their lives and to raise a family. But once they're gone, it's you and your spouse. And I believe that. I don't know if Patrick believed that, but when I see how his life was was completely blown up, I empathize greatly with that man. I can't imagine going through that. At least I still get to see my children every once in a while.

53:22But much like him, my wife was no longer my wife. And I don't mean that in the sense of divorce. I mean that in the sense of personality. You can't take the lives. You can't take lives without changing dramatically. I've never met a person who went to war, had to kill someone and came back and said, yeah, I'm exactly the same as I was when I left. That's not what happens. Something changes in you. Humans are not created to kill other humans. It's not natural for us. Our body rejects that, like poison. Because humans are made in the image of God. If you kill another human, you're essentially killing God. At least back in some psychological realm and some ancient, pre-evolved sense.

54:31And so, when Lindsay, whether they're psychologically or not, strangled, one of the most intimate ways you can kill anybody, strangled, killed. The life out of our own children. She wasn't the same person anymore. She had transformed into something else. If there was a voice, she became it. She embraced it in much the same way that I've embraced Christ,

55:39or that bugs embrace Christ. Now, so many people have embraced Christ by their move to the Orthodox faith. Lindsay embraced that voice. That voice gave her power. It gave her power over her own life. At least for that period of time that she says she heard it, it fed her. It nurtured her in some way. It completed her in some way. It offered something to her that she felt like she needed or that she desired. Now, I think I'm going to get it in other gear.

56:41energy item. old I think that I don't like this subject. I'll tell you that much. I'm in listening to this. That's one good thing about driving truck. Is I can listen all this stuff while I'm driving around? My days have been consumed listening to all the trial. I didn't listen to every day and every second of the trial.

57:42I didn't. I started seeing those TikTok videos and stuff like that. I was like, what is this? I started reading up on it. I asked my wife, I was like, you are this? She was like, no. I kind of got obsessed with it. I talked to her a couple of times. She's like, you're still talking about that? Jesus. That was like three days ago. That's all I've been consuming lately. It made me angry. It did. I'll tell you what I think. I'm getting to what I think. I don't think there was a voice. I'll just put that out there. I don't believe it. I don't believe there was a voice. I would have been ill-equipped to be on that jury because I could have never assumed that she was insane.

58:43I just wouldn't have done it. I'm not saying that. I mean, Buck deals with these types of people way more often than I do. Well, I don't know. Maybe I deal with them more often, but he's more hands on with them. He talks to them. I just see them when they're in their car cutting me off and I get pissed off. But that's another story. But he deals with these types of people. He deals with a lot of these uncomfortable situations. So he's more equipped to talk about that because he understands that. And he has a heart for those people. He loves his job. He loves what he does. And he's a good man. And he wrote that from a very, very compassionate perspective. And I appreciate the way he wrote that story. Round of applause. Thank you, Buck. Okay. Anyone?

59:44Yeah, I don't believe she was hearing voices. I don't believe she experienced psychosis. I think what happened was she wasn't sleeping. She began to have these intrusive thoughts. And as these intrusive thoughts began to take over. YouTube is a little bit behind. They're just starting to article on YouTube. Anybody over there? Anyway. As these intrusive thoughts persisted. She began to entertain them. And when she was trying to go to sleep, she would fantasize. These images. I don't know if you've ever been in that position where you're laying there.

1:00:44You can't sleep. You have images popping in your head. And you're like, where the fuck did that come from? That's not me. I don't think like that. Was she didn't have the willpower to continue saying that's not me? And she was on her own by choice. Yeah, she was seeing a psychiatrist, but she wouldn't tell them what she was thinking about. She told her husband and her mother once, but she didn't want to tell them that it was a persistent idea that she was entertaining these thoughts. Ultimately, she just freaking gave into it. She... It became almost sensual.

1:01:48It attempted her in a way that she believed it would feel good to go through with this. That it would cure everything that ailed her like the chili pepper that Woody Harrelson carried on his necklace in a cowboy way. Cures what else you. But it didn't cure what ailed her because she survived. It wasn't the death of her children that she was obsessed with. It was death in general. It was the last thing she was going to share with her children. She had been making snowmen with her all day. They had been constructing. Now it was time to deconstruct. Now it was time to become one in the afterlife.

1:02:57It's like a husband that catches his wife cheating on him, and he kills her and commits suicide. It's like we're going to be together one way or the other. We can't be together here because I can't control you. She can control Dawson. We can't be together here because here makes me miserable. But we can be together in another place at another time. When you let thoughts like that overtake you. There's a famous line, I say famous. It was one of my favorite lines. There was a show called Castle. Castle was a show, a TV show about a novelist who wrote thrillers about serial killers and murderers and mass murderers.

1:04:08Now it helped a police officer investigate crimes and solve crimes. There was one episode where the police officer, and I'm paraphrasing, because I don't remember exactly, this was years and years ago. You're talking about 2013, probably. The police officer looked at Castle and said, Castle, how do you do it? How do you solve these crimes? And Castle said, well, there's only two people that think this way. Serial killers and novelists. If you find somebody that thinks this way and they're not a novelist, they're going to be a serial killer. If you find somebody that thinks this way and they're not a serial killer, they're going to be a novelist. I used to have very violent thoughts.

1:05:09What in this trial they called intrusive thoughts about self-harm or harming others. Not my kids, I never thought about harming my kids, but others sometimes people close to me. Now what I did is I channeled all those emotions, I channeled all those thoughts, I channeled all those feelings, and I wrote. I didn't go through with harming people because I enjoyed writing. I found it cathartic. Lindsay Clancy had a lot of diaries, a lot of journals.

1:06:09And they said towards the end, they got disjointed. Like she was trying to express something she couldn't get into words. And I don't think she understood how to channel that rage as she was feeling, that hatred of people close to her. She didn't feel comfortable channeling that into words. So then her writing became disjointed. And she never released those demons that were active within her. So yeah, I have a lot of thoughts about this.

1:07:09I think as she continued to entertain these thoughts and these ideas, she couldn't help but act out on them. She had no way else to release them. There was nowhere else for them to go. They had to go somewhere. These thoughts of harming her children, harming herself. She may have even had thoughts of harming her husband because he was so much bigger than her, she knew she couldn't succeed. So she sent them away so that she could carry out this plan. I think she knew exactly what she was doing. I don't think she was at all confused about what was happening to her. I don't think she understood why it was happening, but I don't think she was confused at all about the actions she was taking and the consequences that it would have.

1:08:13I don't think she cared. She didn't care if she blew up her husband's life. She didn't care if her children never saw their first day of school. Never took their first step, never said their first word, never went to their first school dance, never got married for the first time. I'm just kidding. Never went on a first date. She didn't care. She didn't care all those things were gone now. Whatever good those children could have done in this world, it's over. They can no longer do it. They no longer have access to doing any good in this world. And I think she knew, I think the one juror that stood up and said, now the prosecution convinced me that she knew exactly what she was doing.

1:09:19I honestly planned this. She maliciously murdered her children and tried to take her own life. I think he was right. What I don't think is right is that had she been found guilty, she would have been. She would have been found guilty for first degree murder. She would have gotten life without parole. Second degree murder, she would have gotten life with a possibility of parole. Man slaughter, she would have gotten 20 years, times three, with a possibility of parole. Or not guilty by reason of insanity or lack of criminal intent or whatever they call it and Massachusetts. She, she, she can, she went and.

1:10:22I'm not in J4. Tages commented. As far back, as far as this YouTube is from where I'm at right now, it's crazy. Anyway, I don't think I don't think any of that's right. I think given the handicap, given the intrusive voices. I don't, I really don't believe she heard voice, a voice. I never heard another voice. It's just that one time. Oh yeah. It just seems convenient. It seems like very convenient story. If your child was a problem, he came home after work one day and your child had burned down your house.

1:11:27You know, like, what the fuck, dude? What are you thinking? And he goes, oh, I just heard a voice. He went by. No one would buy that. None of that makes any sense within the human experience. But had she said, hey, man, these thoughts got so tempting, so persuasive that I had to see what it was all about. The grass is always greener on the other side and it seemed like it was going to be so green if I went through with this. Yeah. That's what I think happened.

1:12:30And if I were on that jury knowing what the consequences would have been, I probably would have voted for manslaughter. I probably would have been on the boat and I was like, look, I know if she gets acquitted due to lack of criminal intent, reasons of insanity, that she'll be in a mental hospital for, you know, 10 years, 15 years maybe. But when she gets out of mental hospital, I don't want her to be, I don't want her to be in public. I don't want her to be around other people. I don't want her to be around kids. I don't want the possibility of her having more kids.

1:13:43I think what would have been smart is if the judge hadn't told the jury what the consequences were going to be, had they found her guilty or acquitted her. The judge should have been more tight lit with that as would have been in other states. The judge would not, in Texas, the judge would have never said, if you find her guilty, this is what's going to happen. If you acquit her, this is what's going to happen. That would have never happened in Texas. She would have been found guilty in Texas. I guarantee you that. It's up to the judge's discretion a lot of this when it comes to sinencing.

1:14:44I believe that Lindsey Clancy was not taking her medication as prescribed. I believe that she took a lot of risks by not telling her psychiatrist about the thought she was having, by not taking the medication properly. And this makes her guilty of manslaughter. The risk that she put her family in by not being completely honest, I believe makes her guilty of manslaughter at the very least. I think she should get 60 years in a psychiatric hospital, never to be released back into the public. I don't think she belongs in prison. Father Peter here said, the point of the death penalty, the point of retributive justice,

1:15:48when it comes to policing, when it comes to prison, is for the salvation of all involved. I don't think putting Lindsey Clancy in prison is salvific for anyone. I think Lindsey Clancy's problem is that she was coerced, attempted and seduced by these thoughts. And I know what it feels like to be seduced by thoughts that aren't yours, or thoughts that normally wouldn't be yours. If I go back and read some of this stuff I wrote 20 years ago, I'm like, oh my God, I was a sick bastard. But no one else was reading them. I wrote them for me. It was cathartic. It was for me. It was to keep me level-headed.

1:16:49In my worst moments, that's how I dealt with things. And when life was tough and I wasn't writing, I made some very bad decisions. I did some very bad things. I didn't kill my kids. I didn't murder anybody. But that was something I was into. I had to have that release. I had to push that stuff out. And all these people want you to feel bad for Lindsey Clancy. And I do to an extent. But I don't feel near as bad for Lindsey Clancy as I feel for Patrick Clancy. And I'm not ashamed to say that. I'm not ashamed to feel that way.

1:17:52I relate with Patrick Clancy in a lot of ways. Physically, my kids were never taken from me. Like murdered, I mean, by taking from me. They were never, their lives were left intact. And emotionally, I lost the connection with my kids that took years to repair. And in some cases, aren't repaired. And so there's a persistent pain there. There's a persistence. There's a persistent need to forgive. And part of my repentance is to forgive.

1:19:02But that's something I didn't see out of Lindsey Clancy. I saw no repentance. And that's sad. That's not to say it's not coming. I don't know where her soul is. I don't know where her heart is. I don't know where her mind is. I don't know what her relationship with God is. So I don't want you to take this the wrong way. But a person, I would think that a person in that position that was truly repentant, but truly, truly felt grief. Wouldn't be talking about doing a wheelchair marathon. But they'd be talking about how much they missed their kids. And how sorry they were for the actions they took.

1:20:03And would plead guilty. Given that, Lindsey Clancy had so many chances to not murder her children. Had she been persistent from December to January about these thoughts, total psychiatrist about them, let the kids go stay with your mom. Let the kids go stay with your husband's mom. Lindsey Clancy told Patrick, hey, instead of picking up dinner, can't we just go to dinner tonight as a family?

1:21:03Yeah, it's a painting. You gotta get three kids ready. All under the age of six, five, three, and eight months. You gotta get yourself ready. But that keeps you busy, that keeps you moving, that keeps you from idle hands. She had many opportunities to not do this. So she could have just as easily said, you know what, I had so many opportunities to talk to people and get the help for these thoughts. I had so many opportunities to not be left alone with the kids. Patrick was working out of the house. He had made arrangements to where he wasn't leaving the house for work.

1:22:06He was working from home. She had a husband that was trying to be supportive in every way he could. But the only way he could be supportive is if she told him what was happening. And she told nobody that these thoughts persisted and that there was a risk. There was a true risk to leaving her along with those kids. And because she refused to tell anybody out of embarrassment or not wanting to lose her kids or not wanting to lose her job out of pride and vanity. Those three beautiful children are no longer with us. We'll never know what they could have invented, what novels they would have written, what wonders they could have done.

1:23:07So yeah, she needs to repent. She should have played guilty. She should have said, look, stick me in a middle healthcare facility for the rest of my life. I did this. I need help. I don't know how to deal with these feelings and emotions that have overtaken me. But she didn't. And now it's left up to internet sluives and freaking feminists to figure out how to deal with Lindsey Clancy. And Bucks right, it's only going to get worse. Until people start taking responsibility for their actions, looking for true repentance. And understanding what that word means. Repentance isn't feeling bad.

1:24:07It's changing your your bad into the good. It's making your bad good. That's what repentance is. And a good way to start, if it's your life, is to say, yeah, I did that. And I'm sorry. And I'm willing to make up for it. And sometimes that first step is the hardest. And once you take that first step, it gets a lot easier. Anyway, that's all I've got for you or tonight.

1:25:07I'm going to jump in this chat and talk with some of these guys that are looks like Jason Marinchuk's here. J4 Taze here. My people have come to see me. So we're going to stop the recording here. And I'll probably go and stop this livestream too. The YouTube should check should catch up in a minute.