Expectations for Jaxson Dart, Abdul Carter + Giants Mailbag | 960

0:00For a limited time, get one of these Jimmy John sandwiches, Jimmy Chips and a drink for only $8.99. Choose the fan favorite turkey tom with all natural turkey or the Pepe with smoked ham and provolone. The $8.99 meal deal at Jimmy John's. Oh, that's good. Limited time at participating locations, valid on turkey tom and the Pepe 8-inch only includes chips and regular fountain beds, up charges apply on bottle beds, premium sides and desserts, not valid with other offers, tax add-ons extra. Hello and welcome back to Talking Giants, presented by the Phenatic Sportsbook. It is Friday, March 27, 2025. I'm here with my very good friend, Sean Marrash, and we are doing a part two of our mailbag show. This is going to be a way less like at least for me, Sean. I'm putting my hair down this episode. I have some nice questions here thanks to everybody for submitting these questions. And if you want to do me a favor, I'm going to do a YouTube podcast thing. If you can like the video, if you can hype the video, whatever the hell that does on YouTube now, I greatly appreciate it because I think we've been crushing

1:03it recently, Sean. Justin, good to see you twice in one week. Good to see you. You know what? Two mail bags, you know what we call those? Fun bags. We got two fun bags here this week. We're recording this on Yankee's opening night in the cold or opening day. Weird, very weird. Did you see that I had a tweet that has caused quite a stir today? I felt I feel like you. Well, so obviously I saw you go nuts with the How Bad Day banks. Thanks, Tweet. Is there something else? Well, this is with Yankee's. I didn't see you have a Yankee tweet. You're going to have to like me. 10, 10 AM. You probably were just getting on air, right? That's probably why exactly. So this tweet right now, you know, when it's six hours old, it is two and a half thousand likes. So there are people that feel a certain type of way about this. Excited for the Yankees to have a stretch where they look unstoppable, then struggle heavily during the summer, then have one good round of the postseason, and then look abysmal and another, and then the season will end.

2:03Every year, same story of baseball. I mean, you could argue that's the most accurate opening day tweet of all time, which I feel bad because if somebody were to just, if there were like a baseball lifer and a baseball only fan where to just come after me and be like, why the FD even watch? Why the FD even care? The giant sucker for a year? I'd be like, go kick some rocks. So that's like me tweeting the first day of the Yankee season. It's like, why don't you even care? Why don't you care about this 162 game excursion that's going to take up a half of your three quarters of the year? Why should you even care when it's going to end the same? So especially coming from somebody who I really, I used to love the angst man. Yeah. I used to live and die with almost every game and like same thing with baseball. I kind of don't anymore. And I feel bad about I feel like an asshole, but that's kind of how it goes every year. You know, it's funny. I feel more living and dying with it now is like, like, I get the old person loves baseball thing. Like I'm 38. I got two kids. I own a house like, I love baseball over the summer. And I loved baseball and I was younger. And I probably had that stretch in the 20s where I was like, ah, is it this important as it once was? I'm all in counterpoint. I'm going to tie this into

3:06the show we're doing because I'm very much like you can be negative on the Yankees. What if I told you, John Harboh is hired by the Giants has me thinking something different. We're going to get back to the Yankees being good. John Harboh, Jackson, Darth, they've changed the vibes. And what if I told you, the Yankees make a run in October while the Giants are like six and two at the point that Yankees get to the World Series. Oh, same would explode. And we get back to the good vibes. I think Jackson, Dart and John Harboh's vibes will trickle into the Yankees. And that's why we talk, Johnny. And the nicks are coming off the title. Well, I would say the nicks aren't coming off a title, but probably are getting they are coming off getting Yannis next summer. Okay. We'll go with that. Maybe St. John's is coming off a title. Maybe Nick's a better shot there. No. Nobody is a shot. Justin. This is New York. And we all stink. Great point. Why are we even doing this? All right. That's let's bring it to the mail like Sean. What is the first question of part two of her mailbag this week? All right. Let's get back. This is Igor. Igor tweets in. I'm

4:10not going to pronounce his last name. Do you think the Giants interest in love that being Jeremiah love is a reflection of Harboh liking the player or not being sold on scataboo? This is everything. Yeah. I really want to hear your perspective on this because obviously I think to not like, oh, we're going to just dissect. What do they think about this guy? What do they? I think if they were to take Jeremiah love, it's because they really love Jeremiah love at five. Or I don't necessarily think that would be the biggest indictment on cam scataboo. It would be a big indictment on cam scataboo because you're removing him from being seemingly this team starting running back. So that's the indictment. But the further indictment would be we love Jeremiah love and we view him as this game changing running back. That's what they would do at five. Yeah. Look, I think this is very simple for me. Just to stick to the question itself and then we can kind of branch off. I think this is more an indictment if he does take him at five that you love Jeremiah love. You're not taking. For the debate about when you should take a running back in the first round, you're certainly not taking a running back in the top five of the draft.

5:10Based on you don't love the player you already have at the position because then I would argue, well, why are you not taking, you know, Mauioga, the guard from Miami, the tackle guard, you know what I mean? Because you don't love your guard play. There's certainly other positions where you can't love a guy Caleb Downs. Do you love Tyler Nuban? So I think it just it would be more about that is how in love they are. And John Harbour preached his opening press conference how much he wants guys that love football outside of Jackson Dart does anybody love football on the steam more than cam scataboo. So that seems like the exact guy Harbour would want. So I think this is more about if it is all true, how tantalizingly Harbour loves Jeremiah love. I usually never think like this, Sean, but I recognize that some people do. And like maybe even maybe even coaches and people inside the building do think this way, right? Do you take do you put any stake into man, I don't know if cam scataboo and that like his play style is sustainable over time. And that's why like the giants would look to upgrade that position or even view it as an indictment

6:15on cam scataboo like his play. I don't even I never think like that. No, but also let's just be real. He he saved a mileage this year in his rookie year by turning his foot in like that is that is such a twisted you you did this immediately. I will always remember that he was posting pot. You did use two you didn't even let two weeks go by. You said it that Sunday after he took this freaking leg and you're like, yeah, he's going to save a lot of mileage. I know it's the thing about it's the most true factual statement I may have ever said I'm talking giants, but her the more Justin in this day and age and running backs, whatever happens after the life of the four-year rookie contract for cam scataboo happens, right? I think the thing is you could not the viewers going to find out the scataboo, but let's just use Tyrone Tracy example. You could find day three running backs to keep adding them into your filter and keep churning them out. So I don't think the long term what you think about cam scataboo and staying healthy and all that stuff has anything to do with germ i love because I would argue you should probably just think of any I would

7:18argue you should think about that with germ i love by year three of his rookie contract too. How you know how long is he going to go because that's just the nature of that position. So no I don't think you look at cam scataboo and like his style of play and wonder if that's the case because you guess what you could easily do that in round six and round five and round four this year add a running back and that shouldn't change anything. Yeah I agree like I just don't think like I never have the tendency to think about well well what if the worst thing happens here like I don't operate like that like yeah I'm not going to I'm not going to have my rooting interests tied to the only time I would do it with specific players I would do it with sterling shepherd because every year it's just like all right this guy is going to miss six seven games like yeah every single year you six seven if when it gets to the point where you know that so an inevitable bad thing is going to happen until it gets to that point then don't plan on that inevitably bad thing happening that's how I kind of operate as a fan so I'm not looking at cam scataboo being right now especially let sure you got he gets his foot twisted and he yeah so the one

8:22thing maybe I will say is you know what man if it's going to be the difference between a half a yard on a second and nine and it's still going to be a third and three and a third and four like I don't know maybe I don't need you twisting your body and twisting you know your whole whatever to get that extra half yard on a second down if it's a third and down if it's a fort down okay sure but time and place maybe that's the lesson that I'm telling cam scataboo but nothing to like nothing as like a whole indictment of him as a player and the one thing shown the one thing that I've heard you say as we've talked about running back and how the giant should view scam cam scataboo which that's where I kind of want to lead start with this right now we'll talk to our my love in the draft as April all thread April but you have said on this show that like anybody that views cam scataboo on the field that cam scataboo off the field anybody that views like hey mess like a not like not really impactful player for this offense and if you just think that a guy maybe like that is just super ultra-replaceable like I don't really know what you're watching like

9:25you've set that point on this show before yeah and I think it bears repeating I don't know what it is with cam scataboo where there seems to be this faction I guess of like some football median you know deep divers here like cam scataboo could absolutely be an engine for an offense he when he is on the field good things happen we saw him get hot where it just felt easy like scoring touchdowns for the giants used to be hard and with cam scataboo and Jackson darp but when cam scataboo is on the field just and you know from watching how many of these games this year when cam scataboo is healthy it felt like some like looking at third down screen he had in Denver like stuff that you would not expect the giants normally to score on in the past he is a touchdown machine he is an engine for points for the giants offense and I do think he was an engine obviously at Arizona state as well it doesn't mean he's going to be Eric Dickerson it doesn't mean he's going to be Derek Henry but cam scataboo is not some kind of one off give him seven carries a game and he's your second running back he absolutely is an engine churner and a lead in a tandem for a team

10:27yeah almost 44% of cam scataboo's carries he averaged three or more yards after contact that was 15th in in the league every run of cam scataboo from from weeks three to seven scataboo was tied for ninth and most runs of 10 plus yards that was a he was 11th and rushing yards during that span and then 45% of his yards during that kind of month stretch came after contact to and also this shown when he was on the field for 289 snaps giants had a offensive success rate of 47.4% when he was off it for 848 snaps it went down to 41.4% that and I think that number does not allow you because it again I like I've said this on the pod earlier in the week I've been going through the rewatches of some of these games specifically early in the season it is noticeable the impact cam scataboo has on a football game so does that mean it prohibits you if you really loved your my love no but I think what's going to happen if the giants do take your my love and we do get

11:28to talk about this over the months and the whole summer is I think cam scataboo still has a major presence which will then lead to the next argument which is well if he still has a major presence why are you using the top five pick on a running back only the still used to running back so I think that this is all going to be folded into one but no cam scataboo is going to get his his opportunities I don't know how john harbour wouldn't be in love with him 47.4% success rate when cam scataboo was on the field if you do spread that out over an entire season that would have been sixth in the NFL in front of the Dallas Cowboys and then I said 41.4% and six offenses success rate when he's off the field that is the difference between fifth and 29th in the NFL I mean you think that's a big difference it's a very big difference it's a very big difference incredible yeah all right are we sticking with this we're going to question two no again I I kind of wanted to make that more about like scataboo and yeah you know hey she's never really like had like this big game where

12:35you average like five six yards per carry and there were some games that were more explosive than others like he's never I don't know if he's ever going to stuff the statue in some major major way that makes it go holy crap like 120 yard rushing game something like that yeah I'm sure he will have that in his career but will that be like in every week type of thing no but I agree with that it almost feels like at times like he is an engine that makes you go and then also just from I think hate to talk about vibe there's probably a better word than than vibes but that football team did gravitate towards him well that's why that's why I specifically used a word engine yes I think that's the word like he he's the energizer bunny of that team or that you see the way that he plays and the effort that he gives and what he's willing to put on the line and you can't tell me that that means nothing to the guys that are around him and that are playing next to him and even the opposite side of the ball you can't tell me that it means nothing you know I you know now that we're here because this is a game that we cannot shake the Denver game that game if you remember that week

13:41going in all the trash talk that was going on and the belt to ask stuff remember all of that stuff just in the players got involved like it is not like that week is so crazy to look back on the giants and Broncos had this random week long rivalry cam scataboo if he is not on the giants that game I don't think they have that big I don't think that they match the energy of the Denver Broncos and what that defense was coming I think I think cam scataboo there was nobody on that giant offense that he couldn't feel up to the moment because cam scataboo would not allow it you would look like a chump if you were not raising your level of energy based on what cam scataboo is bringing to the table the giant and I would even go to the Thursday night win versus the Eagles where scataboo was so like unbelievably present those two games and the way we watch the giants play football in those games did not happen the year before and we could point the Jackson dark and I'm sure a lot of it to do with it I think it had every bit to do with cam scataboo's presence as well. Yeah yeah for sure and I'm glad you mentioned his receiving ability to because that's shouldn't be something that we should just brush under the rug I think like legitimately he is like a good

14:43receiving NFL back not just like a weapon out of the back you know we were talking about Barclay I never thought Barclay was this good receiving back I thought he was a weapon I think cam scataboo was like a legitimately like a good receiver out of the back field I would rather have cam scataboo catching passes with his hands and his just kind of I would say the waiting game in the screen game more than sake one doesn't mean sake one wasn't the better player but you know in the passing game I think scataboo does those things better or at least more consistent next question all right let's go to Ryan I love this question who is the one role player that you expect to be better in a new scheme fit Ryan is also Ryan is always left really good questions I'm like stuck between three to four players and they're all on the well maybe there's one on the offensive side who do you have here okay I wish stuck between two players yeah but I will give you the one and it's going to be a cheap answer but I also think it's the real answer it's Tyler nuban for me yeah okay nuban say what you want to say and I was frustrated as hell

15:47what I'm last year I think Shane Bowen ruined Tyler nuban I do I don't know what Tyler nuban ceiling still is we could argue was he a reach of a second round pick like I forget all of that for a second there is no way that Tyler nuban can be or will be as horrible as he was at taking angles under Shane Bowen it just feels like it almost feels that he wasn't coached like at all it feels like Tyler nuban or if he was coached he was just in his head and taught the wrong thing and as far as what Denard Wilson's going to bring to the table and his safety play nuban I know has been a good tackler I know that in Minnesota he also had the ability to kind of hawk on balls that we still haven't seen through two years in NFL he may end up just being a flop of a second round pick but if you're asking me who I'm excited for on these role players I'm not ready to throw the second round pick Tyler nuban out the window now they drift Caleb downs okay and on him and juban holland are gonna play and maybe that says a lot more but I think in Denard Wilson's defense Justin I I think there is a place for Tyler nuban not to look

16:49like a total a total safety bag of turds like he did last year for last year I'm with you I I could not get over that in the two years of Shane Bowen we did not see one time one time a safety break on a football yeah like in the air that besides them being like in straight up man coverage inside the red zone or in a tight end or anything like that but like remember McKinney in the last year Patrick Graham how many interceptions that he had like half field responsibilities and then he would break on a football near the sideline and get those interceptions like and you watch football almost every Sunday and you see safeties making plays on the football in the air we we didn't see that one time in two years reflection in year one of Shane Bowen forget Tyler nuban himself we didn't see that one time any safety doing that in two years of Shane Bowen I am not ready similar to you where Tyler nuban has played some bad football and

17:51you know you could say whatever you want about about Shane Bowen and bad Shane Bowen and bad coach and bad scheme and everything like that I think it's tough to be a secondary plier in the NFL and only and only touch a football you know on one hand the amount of times that Tyler nuban has touched a football I could fit on one hand and this includes force fumbles fumble recoveries interceptions passes defense everything like that like everything fits the amount of times that he's such a football in his two year NFL career I could fit on one hand that's not good and that's kind of hard to do in my opinion even with the bad scheme but with that in mind this isn't like Joe Shane drifting Cordell Flaw who's barely had any college interceptions this is not like Joe Shane drifting somebody like Deontay Banks who barely had any interceptions and did not have good ball production at Maryland through two three years there this is somebody who his MO was getting after the football making clutch plays too I just did a name search of Tyler nuban I'm like all right what did I tweet about him when he when he was first drafted and I said all the main thing that's sex out is that he makes these clutch plays in the fourth quarter like a lot of

18:53times when he's making these past deflections and these interceptions he's making them and they change the game in the fourth quarter in a big conference too on not a great team with the golfers like in the big 10 my buddy my buddy Robbie lives in Minnesota lives and dies goal for football first thing he texted me I'll never forget on draft night is you got to see what a bull hawk this kid is and we haven't seen it for two years so I'm not ready to just throw that away I'm not ready like hey draft night Deontay Banks I'm pretty sure I sat in this seat and we were like I don't know man like I don't know if we see it so that's that example of you if I'm gonna stick by my guns and stick by the you know what what I saw and what the stats that you compile and you know the trends that say that if you're a ball hawk on college it maybe should be a little bit of a ball hawk in the pros I'm not ready to just throw that away fully what makes me a little nervous is that much better tackleer much better physical safety in 2024 and that was like the good things that we established about Tyler nubin and man did that just go away in 2025 and that was

19:58like the one thing that we were really holding onto I am worried that this is a player that is not confident and I don't know like I don't know Tyler nubin personally but I am worried that this is a guy that has maybe lost his confidence but if he hasn't which you kind of need to be a little bit of arrogant when you're a player in the secondary right you got to have a short memory you got to have the memory of a goldfish but this is a guy at Minnesota that outworked everybody that like I am going to study quarterback traits to try and gain an advantage of how can I bait quarterbacks to make certain plays like he did everything right everything right I'm not ready to just give up on that and I hope that he is not mentally out of it yet yeah well even if he is just and again think back to what Ryan asked here based on scheme fit who what's the role player we think can improve yes even if he got mentally defeated over the last year and a half based on whatever was going on where he just was getting lost as a professional shame bone not helping this is why

21:00at the core we are more excited or we were excited when a guy like john harwell became available while just the new and I went live that night when pull Schwartz broken at the core if you boil down why you're pumped up about john harboh it's this he could rebuild the confidence it's why john harboh why we can't stand that he signed Evan Neil and Joshua Zoodoo again it's the idea of like he can through the coaching staff he hires in him rebuild guys and I and even if Tyler Newman was mentally broken at its core if the good that was Tyler Newman got drafted I kind of view him as the exact prototype for what this coaching staff can rebuild and get back I really do I hope and you know what like if it's if it's defeated it's defeated but this is why you hire a harboh and trust on the higher staff is exactly the type of nubans on this team I hope I mean that that really turns some things around and you know that would really even help the perception of that 2024 draft class two man you know if they don't go Caleb down that regardless if they do where they don't javon halm does on this team probably for one more year so then you're looking for a second

22:03safety anyway even if you go Caleb downs right so then you'll still have tower nuban there'll be the last year of his rookie deal what are you going to do this is a huge year regardless of who they draft and who they don't draft and the amount of snaps that he's playing he's going to see playing time I don't know if I like the rumblings of they see him as an in the box safety I don't know because what he saw what he did let if we're talking 2024 Tyler Newman okay yeah maybe but also again I'm not ready to give up on the notion that this guy can be a center field or at least half field safety and make these plays down the field and coverage I'm not ready to give up on that because he did such a good job of that at Minnesota and we were all literally sitting here talking about like this guy learned from Antoine Winfield and is coming from the same bro type of prototype and what they were doing there Antoine Winfield absolutely kicks ass yeah I'm not ready to give up on that I'm with you I'm actually one guy yeah the one guy that I

23:03want to bring up Sean and I've talked about him before I'm not going to go on for too long but I don't even feel like confident about this scheme fit scheme fit is the question from Ryan Paul Sanadebo I like this okay I'm not ready to give up I'm not it was bad last year uh I saw a stat on on next gen that he was one of the corners at least through the first like 10 weeks of the season he was one of the corners that followed teams leading receivers the most so the giant Shane Bowen last year did kind of what they were you know sort of expected to do when you sign the guy like Paul Sanadebo is you put him on the team's best receiver and that's exactly what the giants have allowed him to do so you know what man like if my cornerback one is gonna allow some catches because he's playing some really good NFL receivers because NFL receivers are really good and NFL offenses do a great job of getting the ball to their best players if he's getting targeted a good amount all right man whatever if he's allowing some catches here in there all right

24:04whatever but do I have a guy that can make plays on the football I think in press Paul Sanadebo can led the league and dropped interceptions last year had one interception dropped three of them even if two of them go his way and we're talking about Paul Sanadebo with three or four interceptions that would be around where he is throughout his NFL career and I think we're feeling a little bit better just based on the interception number alone for Paul Sanadebo but if you put him in press and not giving so much cushion like Shane Bowen did especially with his outside corners last year they're gonna put him in press and I think they're gonna be putting Paul Sanadebo in a much better spot to be successful and how he's been successful throughout his entire career so I think Paul Sanadebo could have a solid year we conceived the reasons why we signed them in the first place yeah and his bad even wasn't nearly as bad as some of the other players we saw on defense especially when he was healthy again go back and watch that second Dallas game while it was a free for all and it felt like arena football he actually did a fairly good job on George Pickens at times and far as being physical with him as well but I'm with you too that he absolutely

25:07can benefit here with the narwhales and I think that's a good yeah for yeah for we go on to the next question I got to talk to you about Warby Parker because today's episode is sponsored by Warby Parker buying glasses used to feel way more complicated than it needs to be confusing pricing limited styles and somehow everything felt expensive Warby Parker changed that by making the entire process simpler and more affordable and I can attest to this because all I had to do was just put in my subscription I need a new pair of sunglasses because I'm going to some races I'm going to some NASCAR races this summer if you're going out to the ballpark then Warby Parker has got you covered with some nice pair of shades or even whatever glasses you need and they've got a huge selection of modern frames great customer service prescription glasses starting at just 95 dollars and I need like prescription glasses like I'm legitimately blind as a bat if I don't have prescription glasses and Warby Parker offers that so if you're getting stylish high quality eyewear and you're getting it for a fair price right now you can buy one subscription pair and get 20% off any additional prescription pairs at Warby Parker dot com slash Giants that's 20% off additional prescription

26:11pairs when you go to W a R B Y Parker dot com slash Giants and after you purchase they're going to ask you where you heard about them please support our show tell them that we sent you over there Sean next question the world baseball classic is back take on real life world baseball classic team from all over the world with your diamond dynasty squad in the online mode step up to the plate in brand new world baseball classic ball parks create your legacy from the first pits to the final inning with the most immersive MLB the show yet visit mob the dot show slash john boy and use code john boy to unlock a pack for use in diamond dynasty internet connection require available now on PlayStation 5 Xbox Series S and X and Nintendo Switch created for everyone all right next question oh this is the this is the one that excited me the most on this whole chart ready yep uh can I read the name the name is so good yes please read read the read the exact handle the exact handles I underscore piss underscore excellence underscore 82 so I piss excellence 82

27:16uh I guess this is on Instagram says who has more to prove this year dark or quarter I am so passionate about this answer all right give it to me it's Jackson dark we oh yeah oh yeah I thought about this a lot of my uh train ride home from wf a okay okay can we have an honest conversation now let's be real between what happened last year between the john harbor hiring process and understanding how big an influence of jackson dorks presence being here attracts a john harbor we are now as we wheel towards the draft and we wheel then really into like the workout programs ahead of training camp this summer we have to come to an understanding the honey moon phase of jackson dork is now concluding for us giant fans and that doesn't mean that something beds about to happen but what now needs to happen is the feel good story of the rookie they didn't have to spend a top 10 pick on that shined that made all of these plays that we all got hopped up on that

28:17made the giants attractive now we need to expect more because when these rookie quarterbacks play on their rookie contracts that is when you should be able to attack as an NFL team and build like this monster roster which I expect the giants with the cap space next year to do in the year after before you have to pay a guy and what I do not want to have happened Justin is even a half step backwards for jackson dork this year and whether that's not staying on the field whether that's hey a full year of tape on jackson dart and all these defenses are ready and suddenly some of the arm strength questions we have come into question you don't want to end year two going and jackson dork's good but is he going to be great and I don't want my worst fear is to get to year four of jackson dart and based off what we saw in year two based off year three and go I think jackson dork's good I question how great jackson dork could be and then how much are you ultimately going to pay a jackson dork come there year two if he takes just a full step forward I'm going to have to take two

29:22or three steps forward ball placement arm strength you know playing to his strengths as far as now he has Malik neighbors back you want this offense to hum you don't want this being just a magical rookie year like we saw with Daniel Jones I'll be a jackson dart and have the fumbles jackson dart now will officially enter pressure season it's not a feel good story more he's expected to rise in and at least hover towards being a top 10 quarterback and football that's it it's a great point and I think it ultimately just comes down to this is the nature of the beast with the quarterback position that you're either that you're either shit or you're the best yep and there's no in between and that kind of sucks that kind of sucks with quarterbacks than that like I made a cubic tear maker video for jam football this year and I literally had a tear right put a lot of quarterbacks being like you're really good and there's nothing wrong with that yeah because there's so many quarterbacks in the league that's like you're you're really damn good like a Brock Purdy I put Jalen Hertz preseason because he was coming off of the Super Bowl um you know who else is in this tier DAC is in this tier but he has his postseason troubles I'm

30:26having trouble thinking of quarterbacks but I think I understand my point Matthew Stafford is also in the is in this here like you're are you the big four no right but you're really good and there's nothing wrong with that um I I'm gonna give a case for Carter okay I understand it's it's quarterback and like I said you're either shit or you're the best right so the the pressure of like maker break who has most approved it always is quarterback but I'm gonna give a case for Carter dude there were people before you kind of went on that run those final four five games to end the year if he didn't have that run where he got like a couple sacks there even with all those pressures even with all the advanced stuff and I would still feel really optimistic about Abdul's car about Abdul Carter's future there would be a lot of people being like what the hell was that yes and I'm sure there are still people saying what the hell was that with the low sack total

31:27and just what what feel because pressures you sometimes don't feel pressures as impact right yeah no it's the age old argument pressures are really good and pressures impact the game and everybody wants to get sacks aren't the end will be all okay but when you don't get home and don't finish pre you could pressure Caleb Williams a ton he's still making the plays and getting out of it in the bears away games results there are people that are like question like him is like a dude and as a football player and especially like they were questioning him is like a a worker when all of the conversations started about you know the practicing and are we attentive we're falling asleep in meetings like there was a lot of croat that was being kind of thrown his way and at times like rightfully so yeah rightfully so at certain points of his rookie year and let's not like he ended his rookie year really really strong especially when you consider hits and pressures and then he kind of sprinkled some sacks there over the last five games with like three three is right that's not like fully setting the world on fire like he didn't have a multi sack game that made you go

32:28oh man there it is he had like five you know three four five quarterback games we're gonna if you make a little bit of a highlight and you watch like you know you're watching that all 22 and it's like oh man look at up to a quarter and I think we will see that in 2026 I'm so excited about a dual card in 2026 but man like the average Giants fan is looking at up to a quarter being like I have no idea what to expect because you didn't really do anything yeah no listen I hear that but I think I would boil down the question more to this I totally get where people are coming from that and I'm not suggesting that I think Abdul Carter will be a boss by any means and we obviously need him to take a step forward this year but the worst of Abdul Carter like let's just say the worst case scenario what is Abdul Carter in the NFL let's call him cave on tibana where there's some frustrating injuries there's some you know playmaking sacks but ultimately is a guy that you want like playing forward I think if you just said Abdul Carter became cave on we'd all be disappointed but Abdul Carter being that kind of player is survivable

33:32for the Giants franchise Jackson Dart not ending up being like the true answer and just like a middleing quarterback yeah that fucks the Giants more than that but that would be and I agree you know I agree but that would be so disappointing for Abdul Carter the type of dude coming out of Penn State and the expectations if if he's like I kind of fizzles out to be a cave on tibito player that that'll get you like I think cave on tibito for the rest of his career if cave on tibito is a seven eight sack NFL player and then maybe ever once it all he pops off and has a double digit sacks season last year in 2023 if that's up to a Carter's career all right I'm massively massively disappointed there's no doubt there's no doubt we put I think this is one of those questions just and obviously we're going to be disappointed if either of these things happen but like giant fans let's all look at us in the mirror we've talked our shit about Jackson Dart we've talked our shit about it yeah this can't pull up on our face this year and he can't just be

34:33the same player he has to get better and improve on what he was that excited us that's why I think this is more a proveer in year two because now we can't talk our shit ain't like if he's not better what what did we do we fell for the banana the tailpipe again yeah rookies always have a little bit more of a shine we don't talk about this all the time you know I I never sat here and thought that the ante banks is rookie season was good but the conversation that I've seen over and over again about oh the ante banks was good as rookie year you want to know why he was good as rookie year because you were willing to accept his mistakes in his flaws yeah because he was a rookie yep all right uh drawven davis s justin do you think the giants go over 40 this I guess ties in abdool card do you think the giants go over 43 and a half sacks totals a team and now he gave some context in 2025 they had 39 sacks that was last year in 2024 they had 45 sacks in 2023 34 sacks in 2022 41 sacks now he had a part two to this question you want me to get that out of the

35:35way or just start with one yeah part two is will the giants have two players hit double digit sacks love the show keep it up love y'all thank you drop and we love you too I love driven I guess let's start off with the second part because I think it'll be the big context for first part will the giants have two players hit double digits sacks this year I say no no I say no yeah I'm going I'm going to be I think I'm going to be disappointed if they'll do a quarter doesn't get double digits sacks well but what if I do a quarter to double digit guy and brine burns has not right you know and that's because let's not act like brine burns has not been like in every year he's got double digits sacks twice in his career that's 22 2025 that's where I'm going with the question and it doesn't mean brine burns is going to have a bad year by any means right but asking brine burns to now replicate or at least come close to replicating what he did last year in a sack total I think would be asking a lot the bigger question comes in on what kind of decks we're getting this year yeah yes dude I like that's why I'm going one I

36:42expect double digits from abdool quarter but I could totally see like an eight and a half nine sack year for brine burns and maybe that combines with you know a seven sack year we came on and it's kind of like two players of double digits sacks because you're getting basically three edge positions to provide that much yeah and I could see that too because again brine burns let's see what a 17 game rate is I have this right here his 17 game average it is 10.6 sacks because so whenever he's not getting double digits sacks he's close to it and the 16 and a half sacks season that he had this year just totally raises that up in year seven that he had 16 and a half so his 17 game average is 10.6 but that's you know hey that's one sack away from not being double digits so let's just say and along with brine burns did get a lot of untouched stuff last year like that is that's not to diminish what he did in 2025 you cannot take that away from him but when trying to predict the future you have to account that brine burns and in that system was the beneficiary of a lot of untouched pressures and especially sacks so okay let's just say he doesn't

37:44but we're around 10 Dexter Lawrence is a great call Dexter Lawrence had nine in 12 games in 2024 burns had eight and a half in 17 games in 2024 now you talk I'm going to try and find the last time that two players were kind of that close to 10 sacks and same same season all right and then going through the rest of this while I'm figuring that out too I would expect aries Alexander to be on the field more and maybe he gets you know four sacks this year we don't three and a half last year right so four five okay good point and now I think the real question as far as when we go up to will they get over 43 and a half sacks total Shane Bowen not necessarily blitzing as much as we would have liked at times certainly not nearly as much as the wink martindale style had yeah I don't know I don't think dinner Wilson is going to be all that aggressive either okay and that's the big question because he wasn't as aggressive but I do wonder if denard Wilson learning from what went wrong in Tennessee maybe looks at the strengths of some of these players like I'll tell you right now I think drew Phillips should blitz more on this giant defense we talked about you know the

38:50newman holland that will this be a defense that likes to send extra bodies Edmonds Edmonds I think is a better blitzer guy at least that could be an animal that runs side on the sideline then Bobby Ocarake so when thinking about getting to 43 and a half sacks and just focusing on like the edge is doing that I do think by virtue of committee again this is going to be you know what denard Wilson feels comfortable with the giants can eclipse that number because I think they do have more bodies that are willing and able to do that from the back seven let's call them at that point yeah I the light just went out I don't care I'm locked into this right light go out on broadway in 2016 2014 JPP at 12 and a half and seven 2016 Olivier Vernon had eight and a half and seven like I'm going back like a decade plus I understand the job let me just go back to 2011 20 what that says remember talk missed a lot of games in 2011

39:5016 and a half for JPP and nine for OC so that's the closest that we've gotten so far yeah and then let me just go to happen man let me just go back to like oh wait oh wait was a good year and then I'll go back to oh seven and then I'll wait remember they only had two pass rushers all year because OC towards meniscus in training camp talk had 12 q and nuka had eight so then oh seven and then talk wasn't really like a big feature not in oh seven oh seven was straight hand and oh seven I think is the last time where you had OC with 13 oh talk talk Jesus talk at 10 did talk at 10 in the regular season wow in 16 games and and nine sacks for straight in so that is easily the last time that I mean they had three players that were close to double digits yeah and now okay and it goes back to my point about why everybody's rushing the trade uh cave on tibedo yeah it's okay to have sacks come in waves so I'm gonna say no I don't think they get there double digits I think they'll get close um and it ultimately still could put them over the 43 and a half when the chip ends come here from cave on from decks you know maybe getting

40:53back to each sack something like that yeah I think they're gonna get over 43 and a half I really do I really hope that they do uh the 2024 team they were really set the world on fire through the first half of the you know half of the season when duxer Lawrence was getting nine sacks and seven games uh and then after dex goes out they kind of really cooled down I mean everything cooled down yeah with that 2024 team Titans were able to get 42 last year with Jeffrey Simmons and jihad ward leading the way amazing so uh I have like I have like five sacks coming from safeties and cornerbacks like Sean I think it's a good point is it because the Titans had like a lot of rotating cast of characters I'm gonna say probably but the Titans had like a ton of players have like one to two sacks so I think there's going to be guys that denord Wilson is going to send at various times and let's just say in this defense maybe that's drew Phillips yeah if we want to use Tyler nuban and kind of like this aggressive like in the box he probably will get a sack maybe

41:55two drew Phillips maybe gets a sack behind for two Phillips to blitz a little more from the nickel dude it just feels like that's such a strength to his the way he tackles which I feel like denord Wilson will do so I have like five sacks total coming from safeties and cornerbacks so then we're talking about 43 and a half let's say 44 so then that's 39 sacks that needs to come from the rest of the defense and of Abdul Carter's the only player that's getting double digit let's just have him with 12 and a half I was gonna go 14 I say 12 and let's just say 12 and a half that's a huge jump that be a huge jump what was will Anderson's jump oh that's a good question let me look at will Anderson I got it right here all right will Anderson went from seven to 11 than 12 and then what did Jared verse do very different types of players that were looking very different four and a half the seven and a half and we look at hey we look at Jared versus like a as like a really good player so maybe we're really I don't know I'm just so excited about Abdul Carter I am to me maybe double digit in second year after having only what he ended up with three and a half four

42:59but I also think it's different think about where he ranked in pressure rate in the NFL it's it's kind of one of the best exactly my point so like those numbers think about it like his pressure rate you could argue might go up but by virtue of just luck his sack rate should go yes yes we're like you know the difference between like Brian Burns didn't have anywhere near the same like pressure rate in court and pressure rate and things like that especially the quick pressures yeah yet he ends the year with 16 and a half sacks and of door quarter ends the year with four and and Abdul Carter could get off to a start where like the first four weeks he has six sacks because everybody so focused on Brian Burns what the year he's had where it just he stashes a bunch in his pocket early which is kind of what Brian Burns did to start the year let's say five Brian Burns had two sacks on one drive versus the commander's on opening day yeah I think Bobby O'Carrick is a better blitz than the Tremade Edmonds I don't think he's gonna do that a ton we've talked about that before it's just a speed of Edmonds though like yes yes

44:01I actually think his length may work against him because if Lyman could just kind of get underneath them the last thing that I'm on is sacks for tibs and gulston so let's oh how much of them like either take a Vantibito alone or trauncy gulston or then even both of them combined why let's say they get eight combined okay here we go so let's get out the calculator 12 and a half for Abdul Carter maybe much rich okay plus eight gives me 20 and a half I said eight and a half for Burns okay all right I said six for decks 28 34 and a half plus eight for tibs and gulston plus I said five for Darius Alexander two from Tremade Edmonds 41 and then five from the second there it's 46 I think I have 47 okay well we're close enough point is it's over the 43 and a half so that's just over the 43 and a half yeah yeah so that we're going over so we agree we're going over but one guy with double digits yes okay how about that and that doesn't

45:05even include okay so if you want to take if you want to take four sacks away from Abdul Carter that's four sacks you can give to Elijah Chapman where Robertson Harris gets one another like Mike and McFadden gets one or two like she always has one Shelby Harris maybe by that maybe hey maybe by the time this episode comes out Shelby Harris is a giant that would suck because I would want to talk about Shelby Harris but we're not going to we're not going to do an emergency pot for Shelby Harris but he's had long enough to sign he doesn't deserve an emergency pot I hope that was entertaining because I love stuff like that yeah and now I love over-unders I'm more prepared to help my daughter figuring it out live okay we ready for Brandon Brandon Nixon I want to read it man be quiet sorry no I wanted to I did that intentionally this episode is sponsored by the fanatic sports book you guys may have heard but we're excited to announce our new partnership with the fanatic sports but you're probably no fanatic for their merch and their power how do you

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47:09terms apply see fanatic sports book app for details thank you fanatics fanatics doing a great job by the way in baseball season kind of a nice home run promotion coming out nice nice can you tell I spoke with some fanatics people if you your parent or spouse served in the military you could join our family our members saved an average of seventy dollars a month on auto insurance when they switched tap the banner or visit us a dot com slash join today to check your eligibility restrictions okay um branded sends in i think this is on the old twitter machine with the noise dying down on joe shane's job security and how free agency has played out so far is there any reports of him having a hand in the new free agent signings if reports come out saying that joe shane hasn't been is involved past in past years for roster building and the giants are successful this year do you still think the giants move off of him or stand out i guess they mean standpoint standpoint yeah there's been certain reporters that have kind of come on the show i think

48:10dug in was the last one to really say that this is kind of like an audition period for for joe shane that he's almost like auditioning for his job not the fact that he's not fired or still here or whatever that's not to say that his future is set in stone but if john harboh a kind of sits back and looks at this roster heading into the 2026 season and likes where it's at and likes the collaboration process the collaborative process with joe shane then he may stay if he doesn't like where it's at and doesn't like how things went along then joe shane may be gone and that may be done either in season or even heading into next season i would hope that it would be done before the season because then you you need to hire a new scouting crew and then do the draft and prepare for it as the year goes on so what's your take on that as i know some beat reporters have come on and said something along those lines well i mean again i don't know any like this is i've got no information if if he's not as involved in the roster building i like to me i i don't think that

49:11whatever happens in free agent the rest of the way is going to determine i my guess is the giants have already made up their money whether they truly want to extend joe shane or not and it's going to come down to what he wants years money wise or whether they're going to move on i really i don't think that what is done now to this point is going to sway that one way or another it could just be john harbor wanting to see the working relationship with joe shane is gone more so than what he's actually done that's just my observation that being said is i say a likely signing here if this is just a joe shane production probably not right all the ravens we've talked about probably not the one guy i will look back on though and i'll say are we sure that this had nothing to do with joe shane edmunds he was in buffalo joe shane was was there in buffalo with him so i got to think there was at least some kind of relationship there at some point but it's honestly just it's one of those things john harbor made the giants more attractive to for guys to want to come play here right i think we could all agree with that if you're if you're breaking ties and it's not just money and you're trying to think about what's going to fit

50:12your situation fit your family you know the giants are now a serious organization with john harbor so joe shane might have made the calls to all of these guys but it's a possible need to say like oh yeah joe shane good job proving the john harbor you can win a guy over where i'm kind of convinced most of these guys are probably coming to the giants either based on money or at the very least based on hey i think the giants are more serious now because john harbor is here so you know like how do you really judge how much shane has had to do with that no i don't think you can right now i don't think you can i also wonder like how did that aluminum or how did that aluminum or process go down yeah knowing that i i have not liked the way that the ravens have built their offensive lines over the last couple years too and yeah um i really i wonder how that how that went down and like who who had like a you know who deserves some credit on that we just don't know and you know the main consensus that i think we reach when dan dug and was on here last and we were talking about joe shane it is just like this is right now it's kind of like a wait and see yeah i don't

51:13know i don't know if he's say right now because i i think i don't and i don't know if harbor ball would pigeon would would kind of pigeonhole himself into saying yeah this is the guy and this is what we're going to go with and we're just going to roll with this let's let's get that extension ready for him to sign after the draft i don't know if that should be the approach because all up until the end of the draft seeing how that relationship is going and seeing how that working dynamic is i think that's something that harbor ball should continue to explore and then feel out himself exactly it's all about right clearly that his contract hold up was about reporting structure and workflow and he brought in dawn aponte i i think it's less about the free agents and what he's had a hand in and more of john harbor's observation on how these couple months have gone that's it and i would be shocked after the draft if there is not more shakeup in that front off like forget i agree forget shane as it like as himself as an entity know the scouting department like the whole scouting department pro personnel department wherever i'd be shocked if there isn't more

52:21turnover there and that's kind of crazy that you look at like there's some really like there's former gms that are working with joe shane and on the surface it's like there's like pretty qualified people that are also like in this giant's front office so then who is harbor ball really going to bring it probably from Baltimore or maybe even Los angeles because it's again the sister swapped the cousin and kiss each other's sisters that the harbor balls do with each other with the staff members so i'm anticipating all right joe shane what's gonna happen there what's that relationship like but then also what is gonna be the aftermath of other front office members of the front office possibly coming here with these harbor ball ties and harbor ball breaking them over here so i'm with you so we're going to our old friend here next we're going to our old friend johnny five j five j five all right j five asks a question some my alley is the schedule will come out around my birthday every year may 13th 2026 opponent you're looking forward to seeing the giants play and

53:24what are your win expectations for the season so i just want to remind anybody if you're not familiar you are obviously we know the division opponents twice at home cardinals browns jags saints niner's titans on the road lions Texans colts rams seahawks okay and according to the fanatic sports book the giants over under seven and a half wins seven and a half okay so i guess i'll start with the what opponent i'm looking forward to play can i just be honest i always look forward to the division game so for the sake of this question i'm going to eliminate it i really obviously want to see how the giants match up can they continue like can they be filling again like of course we get all of that but when i'm thinking about like the spiciness of the season i know there might be some that say like the tenancy titans brine dables coaching the offense there and and yada yada yada honestly i'm really excited to see the giants on the road playing the Indianapolis Colts i want to see i'm sorry i'm sorry if that's not a sexy interferby but no i like didn't even i didn't even comprehend that that like you said oh colts i didn't even comprehend

54:27what that means all right to Daniel Jones is going to quarterback that game you would think now based on the killies and and everything that's coming out of it he is going to be amped for that game yeah the giants i think in the new refreshing era of john harbor were trying to like exercise the demons of the past they can't lose that game you can't lose the Daniel Jones this year i'm sorry like that's unacceptable and the colts with Jonathan Taylor run the hell out of the football is this giant run defense going to be better because there is going to be no bigger litmus test on being better against the run then what the hell does Jonathan Taylor do to you in that game and thirdly and this is going to tie into the next point as far as expectations in a win total for the giants if we're being fair and you think about the giants taking the next step in 2026 and you look at the schedule that kind of middleing they could be a playoff team in their conference they could fall flat on their face the Indianapolis colts are the exact kind of team the exact kind of roster and the exact kind of situation that the giants should be done losing to like they need to

55:30beat the middle of the pack teams in the NFL now they need to like obviously we go look at the Cardinals and the Browns go yeah the giant should win those games forget the Eagles forget you know the Seattle Seahawks are on the Super Bowl if you want to take the next step of the giants being like good this year or being in the mix to win nine games 10 games the colts are that kind of let's call my peer tier we sometimes like to say team that I'm looking forward to the giants playing and they should beat this year so I want the Daniel Jones stuff I want to stop Jonathan Taylor and I want to beat the Indianapolis colts and also Carlier say I you know I would love nothing more than to watch her with the stupid headset on the sideline and getting all these bouquets go beat the colts I know it's it maybe it's not crazy for me I want to beat the colts this year she looks like she's got 101 Dalmatians and her try I've had I've had it with her storyline too I like a sneaky team I hate randomly the colts it's already Dalton feeling what's the what's the line on that game we're we're doing a little bit who was that show on the ringer that's no longer on the ringer like the one of the biggest podcasts in the world yes for Silla no for Silla rhyme so that's on the road

56:36colts two and a half boy favorites that's what I was thinking to I was thinking two and a half colts minus two and a half go win the game okay when you look just be real if all team both both sides are healthy in the game do you think the next conventional sip the giant that's the kind of game the giant should be winning in 2026 how many games are they favored in I say they're I say their favorite against the Browns yeah favorite against the Cardinals let's let's do home first okay I am yeah I don't I don't think I think they're favored against the Browns the Saints is a toss up but I say they'll be at home they'll be favored versus even if it's a pick them Cardinals yes yeah Titans yes yeah that's for it for me that's half the ones you're giving you so far no they actually they've nine home games this year so that's four out of the nine Cowboys Eagles commanders no lions no Texans no colts no I don't they're not going to be favored as of now as of now preseason there are not going to be favorite on a single game on the road that's a hard road schedule not it is but it's also as hard as it is their winnable games

57:41like all three division games I mean the giant shouldn't go over three in the division on the road this year you want to tell me one or two the lions were thinking that game probably ends up in Germany they almost beat them last year you never know what lion team it's going to be Texans defense is going to be a chore but look CJ Stroud can be terrible yeah and they could win that game but that's what like think about all the road games staring at you the game the giant should win is that Colts game so even despite all that the over under seven and a half I expect eight this year and I'm disappointed I'm not disappointed with seven I want eight yeah I would be diss I guess I want eight to I would be disappointed with seven it depends how the eight looks yeah they did all this stuff with special teams to clean up the margins Justin so yeah oh what by the way what's the team you're looking forward to playing the most I went in this whole random at the Colts you got it you got to beat the Titans I mean forget the whole dayble and

58:42and you know the former players thing every single day I open up that app Twitter and there are Titans fans and giants fans going at each other's throats it's the new Broncos it's but the Broncos was just for one week this has been this has been going on since Harbaugh because they wanted Harbaugh and then they didn't want Harbaugh and then they were happy with solid happy with table and everything like that so we got to that is that's a must win we can't let have Nashville Tennessee have that I'm with you and they want revenge from the game you were at in 2022 oh great time great time great time all right Sean that's a mailback that's a healthy podcast I love this episode I love it yeah kind of I put my hair down a little bit I didn't spend the whole day doing a bunch of proud I wanted to come and have some conversations and I feel like that's exactly what we did so we're gonna see you next week it'll be the start of draft month I believe Wednesday

59:44next week so get excited unbelievable Sean and I we're gonna do some mock drafts and I'm gonna have some conversations with some smart people that'll tell you what you got to look out for in the draft and things like that and we're gonna have a lot of fun so let's go giants have a good weekend we'll see you next week Liberty Mutual customizes your car and home insurance to save you money that's it that's the ad no bells and whistles no guys I said no bells and whistles no trombones are fun visit Liberty Mutual.com and make the switch today