Don't Clip My Wings, You Cockroach!

0:00This episode is brought to you by Peloton. Break through the busiest time of year with the brand-new Peloton Cross-Training Tread Plus, powered by Peloton IQ. With real-time guidance and endless ways to move, you can personalize your workouts and train with confidence, helping you reach your goals in less time. Let yourself run, lift, sculpt, push, and go. Explore the new Peloton Cross-Training Tread Plus at 1Peloton.com. From athletic stuff like a full-core pickup game, swish to athletic-ish stuff like a half-mile stroll. Get those steps in! Head to Sierra or Sierra.com for the brands you want at the prices that let you do it all. From athletic to athletic-ish, Sierra's got it. The last show with David Cooper procrastinate your life away with us. Nothing says romance like eating a body part of your partners, and nothing says romantic like talking about cockroaches. Our next story involves both things.

1:01We are joined by Dr. Cliff Redford. It is vet talk. It is pet talk, but maybe less on the pet side, unless you've got a pet cockroach. Cliff, welcome to the show. There are people who have pet cockroaches, and my heart is a flutter. I'm all hot and flustered with this topic. We should have done this Valentine's Day. True. But I don't think this research was out on Valentine's Day, so... Well, apparently these scientists already knew that some cockroaches are solitary mates, like they pick a mate, and they're exclusive. They have an exclusive relationship. I had no idea. I also had no idea that a lot of cockroaches support the bi-parenting situation. Where they both care for the young. This is so beautiful. Now apparently cockroaches also eat their partner's wings. Oh, they clip their wings.

2:02They force their wings. They force their wings. It's like the movie Misery. It is. Oh my gosh. That's right. I love you as she breaks the dude's ankles, or in the book, cuts off his legs. It's like a new version of the ball and chain, right? Ta-da-da. Like you are not going anywhere. I am not. I am not going to make it so you are not desirable for anyone else. You can do the same to me, and then we love each other forever. And scientists, we always talk about how people do this research that we don't really need to know. I needed to know this. Scientists actually did research to prove that two cockroaches that eat each other's wings are exclusive to one another, whereas other cockroach mating pairs that haven't yet taken the plunge, David, they haven't yet grounded their relationship to the point where they're eating each other's wings, they are less exclusive. Is it more about marking than it is about actually grounding?

3:04Because cockroaches don't really fly, unless it's super hot out. My understanding is they don't like the hotter it gets, the more likely they are to fly. I did not know that cockroaches could fly. I know. That's why we didn't do it. I have seen a flying one, not in New York, but I've seen one in Mexico City. And I was horrified because this thing was, I don't know, inch and a half in diameter. This thing was huge. And it had wings, so therefore it was open to relationships. Yes. It was on the market. It was on the market. Maybe it had a spouse, but it was willing to try something else. So let's talk about this study, because this is a show only about science, David. We know that. Come on. This is very, very serious. So these scientists, these researchers. These cockroach scientists, these cockroach scientists took a group of cockroach mating pairs and separated them into, you know, into their each, they gave them each their own little nest. They gave them each their own little homes and they had a bunch of them that were wingless.

4:08So committed relationship, a bunch that still had their wings. And then after they got comfortable in their new nest, you know, they figured out what side of the bed do each of them sleep on doing regular everyday stuff, keep the garbage or take out the garbage. They introduced a third party. Can we just pause because there's a great country song called Who's Gonna Take the Garbage Out that I just love and I just wanted to say that. Keep on going. Okay. ADD much, David. Come on. Yeah. That's a great John Prime recording of it. Who's gonna take the garbage out? I'm just imagining cockroaches taking out garbage. Okay. They wouldn't take it out. David, come on. Yeah. Okay. So they're in their garbage dens. One group is wingless. One group is winged. Right. And they basically introduced a third cockroach. They introduced some temptation into the nest. I see a TV show, a reality show about this. Cockroach Island. Let's see.

5:08Pan-pending is my idea. And so anyways, what they ended up finding out is for the pair of wingless committed cockroaches, 99.5% of them created hostile acts towards the new cockroach. They basically body slammed them. Apparently, that's how they fight. They slammed their shells, their outer ecto, whatever. I am a scientist sort of. They basically kicked them out. Hey. Can't you see that my woman's got no wings and I've got no wings or vice versa? Can't you see my man's got this and that? And they kicked them out. Whereas the ones that had their wings, almost none of them showed hostility. Those ones put out a little cockroach bowl for people to put their keys in and they had a key party. That's right. That's exactly what it is. They were swingers. Yeah. That's exactly what it is.

6:09They were wingers. They were wingers. I love that we're joking about this, but this was in like a really like prestigious medical journal called the Royal Society Open Science Journal. This is like real science. But I mean, this is fascinating. This is absolutely fascinating. I just want to know when a Disney movie is going to be made about wingless cockroaches that take care of their young together. We could learn from these guys. What is the comparison to people? I mean, is it just a ring? Putting a ring on it. Yeah. We had wings. We would bite them off, but because we don't, we just use a ring. We just use a ring. And rings with wings. Oh. This is there's weird parallels here. There is. There is. We're learning from the cockroaches. Do you ever see that movie Joe's apartment from like the 90s or 80s where the guy lives in like this grimy apartment and the cockroaches talk to him and stuff? No, I'm pretty sure I was in vet school when that came out. So I was studying. Yeah. I should have been studying about the cockroaches, David. You certainly should have been, yeah, I live in New York.

7:10This is horrifying. Cockroaches are gross. And the one benefit is it doesn't get quite hot enough here for them to fly. These are creatures that should not fly. They have enough disgusting stuff going on. You were asking at the beginning of this fascinating segment about people having pet cockroaches. Oh, yeah. And that's the occasional person. When I was doing my volunteer work at the Polish Ukraine border, a woman brought her pet snails. She had three pet snails. They were like the size of baseballs. And we had to basically say, yeah, your snails aren't slimy enough. So you need to give them some moisture. You got to give them a little spray bath every day. And other than that, they're good. You're good to gain a little rabies vaccine and said you're good to go to wherever you're going. Slither along. Send them on their slithery way. That's right. Yeah. You've seen like videos, viral videos. There's a woman who tried to bring an emotional support peacock on an airplane. I'm find cockroaches to be horrifying, but in a perfect world, I would love them and

8:12have them as a pet. And I would bring them on airplanes as my emotional support cockroaches. But I never have. So that's... Yeah. I mean, if you have an emotional support cockroach, that's a legit. You definitely need some emotional support, so... When we come back after the break with Dr. Cliff Redford, a veterinarian, we will continue our conversation about veterinary science studies that are maybe a little ridiculous, but also very interesting. Somebody studied how dogs and cats behave when humans need help and the results are in. One of those kinds of animals behaves like little humans trying to help. And the other, I guess, just kind of sits there and does its own thing. Is it a cat? Is it a dog? She, I wonder which one it is. Using shark facial proglow, a first of its kind at home facial, pro level extraction removes impurities, and dual temperature technology boosts radiance and deep puffs with both insta-heat and insta-chill technology. Treat yourself to a hydro-fueled glow in minutes, and because shark facial proglow fits in the

9:17palm of your hand, you can get that luminous, post-baw glow anywhere. Visit sharkbeauty.com to learn more. All right, the results are in our dogs or cats super helpful and try to act like humans when people need help. Scientists have researched this one, and I'm joined by Dr. Cliff Redford, a fully accredited and practicing veterinarian who definitely helps animals and definitely is here as well, and it's vet talk. And my introductions for you always seem so mean, and they seem like they're funny, and then by the time I get to them, I just feel bad. It is good that I am not insecure. So I seem to be coming more insecure when I come out of the shirt. If you really... I love veterinarian. What are you doing? I know, but if you really think about it, like if you weren't a veterinarian, why would I make fun of you for that? That's just mean. It's only really funny if you are the thing, so the making fun of you makes no sense. Yeah, you remind me of that guy from Princess Bride that had the, tried to poison Wesley. Yeah. And he's like, but did I put it towards me or did that? You would think I would do that, but maybe I knew you'd think I'd do that.

10:19So I did it the other way. Is that Wallace Sean? No, Wallace Sean was the poisoner. Okay. Not important. Let's get into study. So we're going to say, you know what, the title gives it away, but the title is Dogs behave like toddlers when humans need help. Cats usually don't. When I first heard this, I pictured like a dog screaming and having a snotty nose and running around just like me, me, me, me, me. But apparently when you need help finding something, the average toddler between 16 months and 24 months will help you look for it or will indicate it and say, hey, there it is. You know, the point to it or whatever. Even if you don't ask for help. So again, some scientists needed to know if dogs are more like toddlers in this effect or cats are. So they basically, they just did a bunch of studies, a bunch of sort of scenarios where people were looking for an object. It was not a toy, nothing that would be sort of personally attached to the animal or

11:23the toddler, something like a dish sponge and 75% of all dogs and 75% of all toddlers either indicated or found the object without asking for help. None of the cats helped. They basically watched and then walked away. Well, that's helping. You know, sometimes I'm struggling for something and my girlfriend's just sitting on the couch and she's just staring at me. You need to figure this out yourself, mom. Dad, the cat is providing emotional support by watching you, but the cat knows that you can do this thing on your own. Okay, except then they did the same study where they took favorite toys or treats and all of a sudden, 75% of the cats decided to help out. So basically, the best is at the end, the author writes, the results are not a quantification of affection, but our evolutionary history. So the basis is it doesn't mean the cat doesn't love you.

12:24They were just evolved to care more about themselves. All right. Well, the cat is just saying, what's in it for me? Come on, you've never had somebody ask you for help and you say to yourself, what's in it for me? Not when it's a family member. No, if they need to find the dish soap or the dish cloth, I'm going to help them find it. Of course, then they're going to make me wash the dishes. No, no. If my brother needs help finding the dish, I'm like, where are the candy yet? I ain't helping you until you give me the candy. So you are more of a cat person and I'm more of a dog person, David, that's what we learned. All right. We are going to do something a little different. We are going to take you listener, your questions on this show. People have been calling and emailing us questions anyway. So why not just open it up? If you've got a pet-related question, you can call it 1-triple-8505-6644. If we don't pick up, leave a voicemail, record your question, or email me at davidatlasho.pizza that is dot pizza, dot dot com cliff. You look confused. Okay. First question from our listener, hey, David, question for your veterinarian. That's you.

13:25You're my veterinarian, Cliff. My cat has feline, IBS. She throws up way more frequently than normal. She's a super picky eater and it is super difficult to get into a routine. I get her a depot injection every 30 to 90 days. Number one, I'd love to know more from your vet that I can glean. Then I can glean from the internet and what diet they'd suggest. Number two, she's all white, so I get her kibble from Scandinavia that is supposed to target cats that are white. Is that a real thing? Thank you. Dominique. I think I know this is my friend Dominique. It really seems like my friend Dominique. All right. First of all, feline, IBS, irritable bowel syndrome. It is in the umbrella of inflammatory bowel disease conditions. Most of the time, the diagnosis is kind of made by exclusion and you're guessing because the only real way to diagnose is surgical biopsy and it's kind of invasive. Evasive, yeah. So diet does make a difference. In fact, diet is key. We typically use a hypoallergenic diet.

14:27It is not an allergy per se, but a hypoallergenic diets reduce or calm down the immune system. That's what these IBD conditions are. I would though wonder why they're using depot injections, which they seem to know what that is. It is a slow, acting, injectable cortisone. And we do use corticosteroids as immunosuppressants, as a key treatment for inflammatory bowel disease because it is kind of an autoimmune condition. You have to calm down the immune system. But the problem is, is you give the injection and now it's in them. It's in them for 30 to 90 days. And if you need to give them more, you can't really. If you need to reduce the dosage, you can't at all because it's in them. So instead, you either do oral like pills, or you can even get a cream that you rub on their ear that absorbs into the bloodstream. And the nice thing about that is you can do it for a couple of weeks at a higher dosage, then reduce, then reduce. Our goal is to find out what the effective minimum dosage is, which sometimes is zero of

15:31these corticosteroids and then utilize food as a long-term treatment. Now what about this all-white Scandinavian? It sounds slightly racist. It's just going to put that out there. What about this all-white... It does sound slightly racist. It sounds fully racist. That's a couple of Scandinavian... Is there such a thing as a kibble that's specialized for a cat's coat color? Come on. I'm sure there is because marketers will find anything that will help them sell it. And is this a real thing? What? That the cat's all-white? Sure, that's a real thing. Okay, but there is no such thing as an all-white diet. No, no, not that's appropriate. It doesn't... Their skin tone, their fur tone, does not dictate their nutrition. I hope our listener isn't racist. I'm just going to go out in the limb and just say that they aren't. I don't think so. They're just trying to take care of their Caucasian cat. All right. We got a voicemail from another listener. We are going to take it and play it. And I don't know why I'm saying that. I'm just going to do it now. Hi, David. I love your show. I listen every night.

16:34I have a question for Dr. Cliff when he's on the show again. I have a side-east cat that's four years old. And I realize that the cat has terrible halitosis. And upon further inspection, I can see that her rear teeth are discolored. And there's a little bit of redness around the gum line. I'm concerned about what needs to happen next. Are there specialists that treat cats for dental work? And if so, what generally happens to the cat is their extraction that occurs. What type of pain is the cat in after coming out of anesthetic? And what is the duration of time required for proper healing? Thank you.

17:34I love your show. And hopefully you can ask Dr. Cliff. Thank you. Good news is we're answering this question. The bad news is we have about 40 seconds to do so Cliff. So speed round, what can we do for this cat? And if we do the dental stuff, will it hurt? Yeah, so this cat definitely needs a dental cleaning and likely some extractions. Now, this is something that a regular veterinarian, most regular veterinarians can do. They're going to anesthetize the patient. They're going to check for pockets and damage and nerve exposure, do X-rays. And if there's periodontal disease, which is disease under the gum line, likely those affected teeth have to be removed. There are veterinary and dental board certified specialists, but they generally deal with like root canals and unusual tumors, things of that nature, braces. So this cat needs to have these teeth removed. It will be covered with pain medication. It won't be able to eat hard food for two weeks and that it will do fine. It's a two week healing process. But a little halitosis, a little bit of stinky fish breath. That's normal in cats, right?

18:35That is normal. It's normal in cats. It's normal in dogs. It's normal in us. They're enough. We just utilize a list of reen and things of that nature. You did a great job. Speed round, Cliff Redford. Call us, email us with your questions. Cliff, it was a joy having you on the show. Always fun. Thank you. This episode is brought to you by Athletic Brewing Company. No matter how you do a game day, on the couch, in the crowd, or manning the snack table, Athletic Brewing fits right in. With a full lineup of non-alcoholic beer styles, you can enjoy bold flavors all game long. No hangovers, no buzz, no subbing out for water in the second half. Stuck the fridge for tip off with a variety of non-alcoholic craft styles available at your local grocery store or online at athleticbrewing.com. Near beer, fit for all times.