Canada: A Roadmap for the Future | UK Column Interviews

0:00Hello and welcome to the UK column. Today I am joined by Matt Errett. Welcome back to the program Matt. It's been a little while since you've been on. How are things going? Oh, hi, Mike. It's always a great pleasure to join you and, yeah, keeping busy. The world's giving me a lot to think about. So I'm having at the very least an interesting time with our crisis. I don't know if it's necessarily optimistic, but it's interesting. Well, of course, most people know you live in Canada and Canada clearly in the process of being encircled at the moment as Trump aims to get hold of Greenland. How seriously do you take this desire for Canada to become the 51st state then?

1:03Well, I try to think like an oligarch, you know, I try to put myself in the shoes of one of the Dungeons and Dragons game masters who are trying to treat humanity like it's a board game. And there are games within games and, you know, when you take a step back and you recognize as we've all worked to do the deeper conspiratorial undercurrents shaping many of the big developments throughout history. We realize that there are the most people we live with think very short term moment to moment paycheck to paycheck, those who don't worry about such things and are incubated in a different cultural matrix than your average person who goes to a community college or whatever. But if you're if you're part of these upper upper echelon families, you do tend to get trained to think long term, deep past deep future and act accordingly. So not saying that that's good. I'm just saying that that's that's what we're dealing with is a quality of thinking that most average citizens are not used to dealing with. So on the short term, I don't think that necessarily I would expect to see Canada falling into becoming a 51st state.

2:12But in the longer term, I do see that perhaps as the consequence of let's say a manufactured blow out of the transatlantic system, which could and will unless very drastic measures are taken, which I don't see currently where and who is pushing the type of necessary measures that I know would be possible and necessary, I don't see it. What I would see as a consequence of the lack of action, appropriate action would be the breakdown of supply chains, the blow out of a major financialized speculative bubble in the period ahead. What day we don't know what time we don't know, but we're living in it right now. Currently speaking, I do think that the ambition to create to expand a jurisdictional control over Greenland over as much of Canada as possible over much of, you know, Mexico, Latin America, down to much of South America is part of a pro. It's part of a plan. I think there is a blueprint to get there. I know what the details will be step by step getting there is underdeveloped in my mind. I have many hypotheses, but I don't think that Carnie's, Carnie is here for a reason.

3:22I think it's been many years of planning to situate him and to create the terrain that would be ripe to impose him as the replacement to adjust in Shredo. I originally recorded a segment back in 2013 when I had a podcast there, going through the origins of the bailin mechanism and Carnie's specific role working at the Bank of International settlements with Mario Draghi and formulating the bailin regime. This is back in 2010 that he was doing this while he was governor of the Bank of Canada. And I did a presentation where I made a point that it was as though he was being situated to be highly placed in political position, the way that the media was portraying him as a great hero in the zeitgeist, the type of language wise with something I'd never seen used for civil servant at any regards. So I got the sense even then that there was a preparation to impose him as a much more competent albeit dangerous high priest of banking.

4:24I think that his job currently is to play a very important role, a very highly valued role to his masters within the city of London and broader imperial structures. And I do think though that there is that he was assisted whether Trump knows what he did or not. I'm going to reserve judgment for the moment, but I would say that he would not have become the prime minister of Canada had the decision had the decision not been made to begin the language that Trump deployed to make Canada the 51st state, which triggered a subconscious fear factor embedded multi generation. Across most Canadians all over, maybe not Alberta, but most Canadians have a fear of America. It's been baked in by design since the 19th century and Trump or whoever wrote his speeches and created this plan invoked by design that such that the conservative not to say he was a good person, but definitely would have given people more to work with.

5:30Then, then, Karin, he failed to succeed where he all, all polls, favored, before the election and then after the 51st state comments began, then everybody was induced to rally around the big red comfort logo of the L, the liberal party, L, and Karin, who was the, the embodiment, the archetype who was going to be the great, you know, savior, just as he saved us in 2008, 2009, while he was running the Bank of Canada. He saved us from the banking crisis, and so he's going to do it again, and that's what happened. So I do think that there's part of a gaming out of planning factor in a lot of this, which most people I know don't pay attention to. Okay, so the reason I asked that question in the first place, of course, was because of his speech at Davos, which got all kinds of traction on social media and all kinds of people thinking that this was the most amazing thing that they'd ever heard. And of course, what was he talking about? He was talking about this idea of middle states. Now, you'll have to remind me, who it was, you sent me a video clip that you thought was a source for that speech.

6:40And I sent you a video clip of Bronwyn Maddox from Chatham House, which I thought was, was the source of the speech, but nonetheless, what we seem to be saying is amongst some of these types at that level, clear agreement on, on a sort of policy that has been introduced at Davos by Mark Carney is the most peaceful at this idea of the middle states getting together to fight the two big beasts of the world, which is now the United States and China, of course. So, I mean, what do you think, what do you think he was expressing at Davos? And, you know, where do you think the policy has come from? Yeah, the person I was hypothesizing was Jeffrey Sachs, who bragged, not just a little bit after Carney's speech at Davos. He bragged how proud he was of his former student and how he knew that as he was teaching a younger Carney that he had all of this great potential. And now he's seen it manifest what a proud mentor he was. So, you know, there's that. But I think that this policy was largely formulated in its current incarnation in the ascension of Carolia Trudeau.

7:52And, apparently, Trudeau gave a 1969 speech describing the new configuration of the middle power policy of Canada, because it is a middle power. It's not, it's not a strong power, but it has influence. And he said, the policy when he was asked, what is your policy objectives by journalists? He said to create counterweights. That's all he said, very ambiguous. But what that meant was whenever the geopolitical mannequin balance of the Cold War, which was premised around this dichotomization of, you know, capitalism. Are the beings of light and freedom and democracy and then communism is the authoritarian anti-freedom darkness and everything had to always be sort of balanced on this game board such that whenever the geopolitical point of gravity moves a little bit too much towards favoring, let's say, an advantage towards the communist authoritarian side, then Canada would take a leap and give its support to some policy measure of a Reagan or a fature. What have you to balance it out? And then, inversely, whenever the gravitational center of balance would move towards the capital side, then Canada would throw, you know, its love over to fiddle Castro or to the Soviets in the 70s, which was always the way PLA Trudeau managed it. And I think that that was part of a mathematical sort of cybernetics mechanism of control of influence to use Canada as an asset within a broader terrain to advance the agenda of those who control Canada.

9:19And people might say, well, who is it? Is it Canadians who control Canada? Not at all. Canada is a monarchy. It's run by a pretty council, a pretty council office governor generals and entire unelected civil service, which is an enshrined deep state structure, which is baked in to our constitution, so called since the 19th century. Most policy decisions don't come from Canada. It comes from these groups and an array of think tanks that are loyal to the round table movement, like we have the Canada International Council, which is sort of the analog to the CFR, the Council on Foreign Relations, which is a big policymaking bureau. We have the Canada 2020 think tank, which was what created and installed in just in shiro and shaped much of today's liberal program. It brought in many of the behaviorists around Barack Obama to play a big role in that as well in the 2008 to 2014 period. So, you know, we have this whole subterranean mechanism that is loyal to systems of transnational empire far removed from anything here in North America, even though, you know, and so.

10:25What does it want? Well, it wants feudalism. It wants hegemony. It wants to get rid of the nation state system, which has been a troubling innovation over the past few centuries, which has resulted in giving the people a means of defending themselves from empire itself, right? And so everything that I interpret the actions by those who are its devoted servants in political positions as tied to that general grant objective. Now, what are the greatest threats to set objective day? I think China and the Russian Alliance together have provided a troubling disruptive influence of certain civilizational forces that are not willing to necessarily acquiesce to the depopulation reset agenda. The way it was formulated in over many decades, and especially China, which has managed to keep control over its banking system. It avoided a major color revolution where many other nations failed. It expelled George Soros many decades ago and has been able to unleash a type of paradigm of long term anti zero some thinking, which provides for large scale infrastructure to be built that empowers nations.

11:41And so it's not just those who work with China businesses and people who also benefit by that infrastructure, despite the sliders that we might hear from a lot of the three letter agency run media outlets that try to say something otherwise the facts to speak for themselves trying to do to eliminate, you know, a massive amount of poverty, a billion people pulled out of poverty in a relatively short time. We offer to the world to the United States to Europe to many countries to say if you want to break out of the the Titanic that you're on. Shift gears and stop pushing war with us and instead work with us on building projects that will benefit you and create a foundation of trust building and other things so far we've been very hard headed. And instead we've we've chosen to accelerate the economic asymmetric and other kinds of war in and around China. And I think Karin's current objective is to try to do his part in loosening the China Russia Alliance by trying to put a new kind of language to repair to repair the the broken relationship that Canada and China had over the past decade.

12:47It was completely annihilated over especially since 2017 when China realized what a dangerous beast Canada was and they canceled their Canada China free trade agreement, which was a decade long plan, which they just canceled by simply allowing Justin Trudeau to land in Beijing. Nobody was there to greet him and the same day he was forced to get back on the train on the plane fly back in embarrassment thinking that he was there as a he was supposed to arrive as a hero finalizing this long awaited trade deal. A solid message was put forth saying that China is no longer interested in the offers of of tapping into Canada's resources, which are abundant and underdeveloped, but that was the promise. If you work with us will create all sorts of advantages and you'll be able to access resources that you need. But if you try and I think recognize at that time that if they allow that dependency, then those taps could be turned off at the whimsy of those who otherwise wish to destroy them and they chose to instead keep their their destiny locked in with Russia instead, even if they're going to be paying a little bit more than what was being offered by Canada.

13:54And I think, and you know, the Ming Wan Zhu Huawei scandals, the rest of the two Michaels, all of these things were the consequence of these battles. A lot of the Canadian government had come in forcing China to to disinvest from its various mining interests in Canada. So there was a very hostile battle and I think almost a healthy battle that had occurred because of China's realization of what Canada was. But I think now with the new strategy, Karni is able to say to China and the Chinese elite, look, you're being bullied. We're being bullied. You have a hostile America on your back here. We have a hostile America. We're different now. And Jeffrey Sachs has been sort of for those who have noticed for the past couple of years, he's been creating an intellectual terrain on the media circuits to try to persuade the Chinese intelligentsia that there is this, this, this, this healthier Karni, Karni like state, state craft waiting to come into being that wants to work with you, which is more enlightened than the big bad, baddie Americans.

14:55And to what degree that that persuasion has been working, I don't know. But I think that that is what is applied and what Karni is trying to do right now to, to basically provide to say, okay, look, we're going to be able to work with China. We're going to have a new special relationship and he's walking a fine line because, you know, it's, it's a bit difficult with, with what the narrative has been, has been built up to do in the US, which is, you know, the Trump's whole mandate, a lot of his narrative has been around the idea that China is our existential enemy that we have to mobilize our resources against, even if that means sanctioning Canada. So there's, there are certain, you know, consequences to narratives that don't mesh that are creating these interesting dramas. And I'm curious to see how that unfolds. So obviously, Karni in China, what was the two weeks before he went to Davos, Starmer in China, we were recording this. Starmer, Starmer is still in China at the moment. But can China, can China stand up to being propagandized by two such illustrious world leaders?

16:04China's got some pretty smart, smart people running the show. And I would, I would like to think that they've got a pretty good handle on the duplicity of these groveling schmucks. I really do think so. Now, does that mean everybody in decision making positions is that wise? And I mean, I don't, I wouldn't say that either, you know, that people like stacks have been working very, very slowly and patiently building up followers, you know, he brags how he lectures regularly in Beijing universities and has been doing that training, Beijing technocrats and not Beijing, but Chinese technocrats and people who are in influential positions to adopt his way of thinking now, keep in mind, this is the guy who, despite what he says now in denial of what he did, he did oversee for the IMF the complete rape of Russia under Perestroik. And I don't believe for a second that he was simply misguided and thought, you know, well, but, you know, bad things happened by accident. I don't believe that in any way. I think that he was very self aware and got exactly what he wanted and has been trying to rebrand his disastrous policy.

17:10But he was, he's the guy himself is a religiously devoted keen Zian cyberneticist. He's given lectures at the London School of Economics on the importance of everybody to pay field to the doctrines of John Maynard Keynes, as well as the doctrines of Lord Bertrand Russell, the Godfather of cybernetics, which he's also a believer in as far as the language of power projection and control of systems. Yeah, just for people that don't know, just explain what you mean by cybernetics. Yeah, that was a certain computing. He was a, he was a language of control developed after World War II by Norbert Viener and advanced also by by John Vaughn Neumann. Viener was a disciple of Lord Bertrand Russell in Cambridge in when Russell was still publishing his famous Principia Mathematicas, which professed to try to basically control all knowledge of the world in a radically, in a radical, positive manner rooted in certain limited axioms and postulates that he said if you just get enough data plugged into your basically a computer formula, you would be able to with those limited axioms,

18:19be able to linearly extrapolate into the future and past all possible knowledge becoming effectively omniscient, kind of like having an oracle that an oracle that gives us access to all knowledge that could ever be and ever would be and ever was with his formula. But he said it wasn't practical. It was too theoretical and he challenged his disciples of which Norbert Viener was among the brightest to find practical ways of applying this to manage human systems, which was always the idea or create a lens through which we can we could analyze the new science, the new scientists could analyze and interpret all systems of reality, biologic, ecologic, astrologic, human sociologic, you name it. And so that became do you think modern AI systems are being built on this model? It's entirely built on this model. Yes, so Norbert Viener and his work on the human use for human beings and his actual literal book cybernetics, which was funded by Eugenics Bankroll and Josiah Macy Foundation operations, which is what gave rise to the Macy cybernetics conferences.

19:26Now again, we're funding Eugenics in Nazi Germany and Canada and the US throughout the 20s and 30s. That's for the 30s. That's what was funding cybernetics. And in his books, he's very clear that machines will. Well, first he starts with the fallacy that the human mind is a form of machine that uses essentially computer like feedback loops to a central mechanism that that simply interrupt plugs in data into patterns where those patterns come from or what gives meaning to those patterns in his mind is metaphysical absurdity don't think too much about that because that gets us into the into the realm we're not supposed to go is as slaves. But from there, he says, based on that that fallacy, which he says is true, that we can know that these primitive binary computing machines that were being developed by John Nash and others, you know, in the World War two that he was a part of would eventually become, as he says, self thinking could become self reproducing.

20:28And such that this approached automation, he said would eventually would inevitably deterministically render more and more human beings irrelevant in time. So he did completely create the foundations. Yes, of the current AI cult that does believe that human beings are these ultimately inferior useless eaters that have to be made redundant and exterminated by some imaginary future singularity moment, which was, you know, colored by people like Jewel in Huxley and and put out of the char bay in the 1950s, they added some detail to this Omega point or whatever you want to call it that gave rise to the language. That was refined by people like Ray Kurzweil at others around this, you know, future imaginary moment where machines become self thinking and we become Skynet and we all we all get to die or Yeah, yeah, so, but China seems to be taking a slightly different approach to AI and they don't seem to be quite so or at least they seem to be putting more controls on the direction of travel that they're heading in with that particular technology.

21:39I mean, have you got any thoughts on on that? Yeah, I'd love to get your thoughts on that as well, but I've noticed as well for my standpoint what I've observed I've been impressed by China's completely different approach to educating their people about the nature of AI and the responsibilities that the people have towards their own minds in dealing with something like as destructive as AI. And so China's like, you know, you can go to CGTN there and see many documentaries, many presentations where they're encouraging the reading of original texts to develop the philosophical qualities of wisdom within the minds of young people who will then be able to see where are the limitations of the AI and where it's usefulness. So they're much more considerate in providing that understanding where is in the West there is no such consideration there's only brainwashing that's being messaged out to convince us that there is only one approach to AI which is to wait for it to render you extinct.

22:42While you go and maybe drugs and video games to distract yourself while you're getting you be a universal basic income waiting to Peter out as an obsolete machine that couldn't afford to merge with Newerland. Now in China, it's a different approach. They've also got because of their national paradigm, which are their civilizational paradigm, which is very much generate or driven by an informed much greater informed set of lived experiences of the deep past than what we have. We've been much more cut off of the positive experiences of the Western society that's been erased from our collective memory. China has greater access to it. So things that happened 2000 years are having a much more deeper and important impact in shaping their current strategies, especially around things like the revived silk road of the Han dynasty, which has become the foundation philosophically of their of their current foreign and internal policy of building. Building a community of common principle, as John Quincy Adams had formulated this in the 1820s and 30s, a community of principle would be the only foundation around which a non-Hobsy and structure of humankind could work where we realize that our self interest is not in weakening our neighbor, but in helping our neighbor, even if they're different from us, become better.

24:00So our security, our power of having better business partners, of having more trustworthy neighbors will all improve, which is a truthful thing that again, we used to have more access to it in Santa times in the West, but we've lost it. China, which does have a revival of that, they have national goals that define the behavior of their economy, of their governing class. So they have things like, if you look at recently, they built one of the, I think the third largest dam in the world, hydroelectric dam. We haven't built any hydroelectric dams in the West in probably 50 years, since the 70s. China's built, I think, seven of the 11th biggest dams over the past 30 years. So China and some are really big. Now this one that I was telling you about, the third biggest in the world, it's massive. It's going to improve the quality of life of so many people, provide abundant electricity, flood controls, you name it fresh water access. All sorts of good things are happening, but almost no human beings were involved.

25:01It was entirely organized by automation, a highly organized AI managed system of machines working. And you had very, you had some, but very, very, very little human input. But that was machines at the service of the needs of humankind, because it is very dangerous. You don't want to necessarily put people if you don't have to through that type of hostile environment working on dams. Very dangerous again, very arduous. That in my mind is a very good use of AI. But if we don't have a society that has any big visions, big missions, that define our next generations better living standards, which we don't have, then AI will increasingly just be used to pacify, entertain, distract and control. As I think are our static society that's been floating on too many years of consumerism as a drug, have allowed ourselves to sort of, we lost that idea of John F. Kennedy's think about the next generation, think about the next five generations, which China still has very strong access to into the degree that you do.

26:01I think all of those dual use technologies as AI is one of them, include the atom and atomic power being another one would be typically used to service that future goal. If you don't have that, then these things will be used typically for more destructive ends. Let's just just this might be a little bit diversionary, but let's just talk a little bit about about the Western, the Western view of AI. And the way I'm saying this, I'll be interested in your, in whether you think I'm even close to the market, but how it seems to me is that we, during 2021, 2022, during the lockdown period, we demonstrated to people what life would be like sitting in front of their sofas, sitting on their sofas in front of the television, watching Netflix all day. We paid them to be at home by putting them on furlough schemes and so on. And that, you know, this issue of UBI, because you mentioned it a second ago, has been doing the runs for many years, and there have been a number of pilot schemes.

27:02Of course, the question in most people's minds was, well, where does the money come from to pay for the universal basic income that is going to be handed out for free to people while listening watch Netflix. And of course, the answer to that is clear now it's going to come from AI and robotics doing the productive work, the financial, the money generating part of the work, which humans used to do, but humans will no longer be doing. Therefore, it's no problem just to hand them a bung to sit in front of the television. But of course, that, that life, that vision of what society is going to be like in the future, seems to be one that the, you know, the billionaire class, the AI billionaire class gets very excited about. But, and maybe, maybe some people that there are finding that the jobs that they are forced to do in the West are not that appealing, maybe that idea appeals to them as well.

28:05But of course, what it, what it absolutely does is put the, put the top on the, the, the, the icing on the cake of the, the sort of panopticon idea that, that, that our British home secretary is so keen to implement at the moment, it is the final level of control, because, of course, if you don't behave yourself in the right way, then your universal basic income is taken away, and there's no real economy. So, it's not only of any kind for you to take part in, which would allow you to even eat. So, so this, this, as I see this developing over the next, I mean, actually, I think it's going to develop very, very quickly. No, it's a pretty dark looking future for people, if, if we don't, if we don't recognize what is actually going on, and, and consider how we might, if we are to run this vision that clearly musk and others have. So, so what do you think? I mean, I far off the mark with that, that assessment.

29:12No, no, I don't think you're far off the mark at all, unfortunately. I think that's much, much of what is desired, you know, I started today's chat by just encouraging people to take a step back and to think sometimes, as you would, I did one of these sociopathic oligarch types who'd see themselves, Godlike game masters, and I think that when you do that, there's a lot we can, we can work with as far as things that people think, oh, but what happened in the 1930s is so disconnected in time from what we're living in today. There's nothing I can, I just mentioned that China's experiences from 2000 years ago are having a direct influence in shaping their strategies in shaping the, the Belt and Road Initiative of New Silk Road today. For a good way, that's like a healthy version of learning from the past and how the past affects the future, which I mean, again, we're shaping the future in the present. But inversely as well, bad toxic ideas, you know, we mentioned feudalism is always the ambition for the restoration of some form or a variation of feudalism is one of the constants amongst all oligarchically managed societies that believe that human beings are simply another variation of wildlife.

30:24To be found, you know, if we don't differentiate the qualitative transcendental nature of the human, you know, the human versus let's say the wolf for the cow, if we don't make that differentiation because there's similarities DNA wise and, you know, we all poop and breathe and eat food and have sex and so we're all the same. If we just end there, then the consequence of how we choose to organize that type of bestialized society will involve some form of alpha wolves controlling the beta wolves and omega wolves as subspecies as feudal lords do thinking themselves as hereditaryly superior masters to inferior born slave families. And so whatever the spin might be low is be the same kind of effect keeping slaves dumb, pacified, distracted, maybe in a state of terror, if possible, if not at least placate them by giving them an over abundance of stimulation that's hedonistic that disrupts their ability to think about what freedom is or what's being lost. So that's sort of things always in today's world it's just applying a bit it's adding to the ancient formula with a bit more technology, you know, it's coloring, but in the 1930s as you mentioned Elon Musk his father or his grandfather.

31:30Joshua Hall, the man I think was part of something which is have having a it didn't disappear let's say that after World War two and that thing that Joshua Hall, the man Elon Musk's grandfather was involved with was technocracy incorporated and anybody looking at the. The maps of the technology technocracy incorporated which was an organization set up in 1932 to solve the Great Depression by this guy Howard Scotch and the idea of this was to simply say let's get rid of the elected class let's get rid of the capitalism it's just corrupt by its nature and let's create a society of. Engineers from the top managing a sub regional techniques with the North American technique being part of their study guide that was sort of the Bible of the of the technocracy incorporated movement which again Elon Musk's grandfather led in Canada he was the regional director of Canada for that that movement. It was quite influential they had 500,000, 500,000 members in California alone was quite big and getting popular with the despair people were feeling and suffering from the Great Depression and part of what they wanted was essentially a program of UBI energy credits.

32:42That would be premised around the notion that you could calculate all consumable goods and the energy associated with all consumable goods and how many people there are consuming those goods which will be subdivided mathematically to provide credits for the course of the life spans of those people. Now what determines the life spans of those people and you know that that's up for question because this organization was also full of eugenicists who promoted the idea that human beings were just were just a form of machine and like machines that can get rusty and obsolete so too can humans that you should put in the in the dumpster when they're too old so. So in but i'll have to say they they sold themselves as a pacifist you know the absolutely pacifist organization yet at the same time not so genuine because if your board if your borders are going to expand to Greenland Canada Mexico all of most of Latin America. Then as well of Panama Nicaragua would have most of Colombia if that if that's really what you see your jurisdiction those countries are probably not going to just lay down and do it peacefully so your pacifist you know things are probably a lie that being said they didn't have the computing power available in those days to properly take the data or you calculate the type of data they wanted to.

33:54And so it kind of was left in a in a to ambiguous realm and couldn't quite get the type of whole that Joshua Hall to mine and others wanted by the way the guy who actually shaped this was a fellow by the name of Thorstein the blend. Who is a well I actually I was sorry I could you'll go on with that in a second but I was just going to ask are there are there parallels to the shape of things to come actually. Yes yes and you know this is where it gets very interesting because in HG Wells even said it doesn't matter if we move through socialism or through capitalism we can get to world government in either direction and. HG Wells was a leading Fabian society Fabian society thinkers as people know a big eugenicist and was also somebody who was sort of a partner an intellectual partner dance partners in so many ways with both Julie and Huxley as well as Bertrand Russell they all kind of dance together to play the game of or the he was actually the innovator of board games actually HG Wells founded a small worse that was the name of his his first board game.

35:06In like 1907 and he would basically train he saw this as a great way to train the young to become potential recruits to a managerial class like he was because he wasn't from a high family he wasn't high born but he knew that he had certain creative powers that were lacking in many of those overlords that he was devoted to serving and and was very frustrated by the rigidity of the old hereditary classes and was trying to get them to loosen up a little bit and open up and realize that they need to find ways of making. The creative process available to young people in a way that also in a woke sense of wolf like Hobbesian zero some feelings in young people who by playing these games that became things like risk and monopoly and those small wars games would create a psychological framework out of which you could more easily recruit talent that will be useful for managing the type of thinking lays out in his.

36:06The world brain and open conspiracy programs and other things like that so I think additionally what you said about the the the things to come story is is is important because yeah he's talking about a Soviet of engineers right that's what what invoked that that association in your mind and that's a big part of of his story is that this this world left to human devices alone naturally turns into a play grid and war written hell scape of. Dystopia you know I think he actually innovates the first zombies that that's a popular later on he convinced that the walking flag or whatever and the only people to save the day are these sonic engineers the wings of the world that have merged out of the skies to save the the the war written sovereign nation state written world by imposing a higher order from above which is exactly how Thorsten Berblin. Was thinking when he called for a master strike of the engineers in his program for the the technical lines that was a branch of the john dewey's new school set up in 1919 as a fading society outlet in in the United in New York this is this generally was staffed by a lot of figures who went on to create the council on foreign relations in New York.

37:27In that same 1921 period Walter litman played a big role in new school as an outgrowth of Columbia and Thorsten Berblin again he was the the the master mentor of so many of these young disciples like Howard Scott. And he also work with the workers of the world's unite to create data sets that involve psychological profiles as well of the workers to see what do they what do they want what are they stimulated by what are they afraid of what are the corruption so there were it wasn't just simply energy credit or energy data that they were accumulating or agricultural data though they were doing that. They were also looking at psychological profiles for their idea of managing human resources so this what again at jot you must grant father innovates in and advances for the Canadian outlet of this agency and and he's arrested for being on the wrong side of world war to because he's clearly fascist they're clearly promoting. You know something which is insurrectionary to our entire way of life and and he has to go on it but I think that as you said this you be I think it would only work if you completely render the current system defunct through a controlled demolition as we as we were witnessing right now and out of that maybe a new mathematics type of digital credit could be created that might be associated with the amount of measurable energy and behavior in the system that people can be allocated.

38:53There are certain numbers and that can be reduced if they behave badly or maybe rewarded if they do things you know that that please the elites they might get more bonuses or whatever but yeah a very very dangerous idea that didn't disappear after world war two. I mean what you've just described in the in the last couple of sentences there was I suppose something that we could call social credit but of course there's we've been talking about you be I there's another economic policy that does the runs which is also called social credit by strange coincidence but was designed by a guy called Douglas I mean I see a lot of people pushing pushing that idea. As a potential solution to our economic world but but to me it just looks like a UBI and other guys it is it absolutely is and I've seen the same thing it's very there's a big discussion around social credit in Canada because Canada is one of the few places where it actually gained political power in the 1930s and 40s and 50s actually British Columbia it was the dominant political party from 1952 until 1991 except for three years in Alberta as well for many decades.

40:08And there's still a certain romanticization of what this is as a as a as a philosophy as a system but sure enough you're right when you do look at a major C.H. Douglas who was himself a disciple of a certain cultist by the name of Alfred Richard or Raj who is a high level fiosophist who was a Luciferian who ran a magazine actually called new age he was a fading society member. For a number of years and he's the one who actually claim he gave the term to Douglas social credit to define Douglas's system because Douglas was publishing in his new age magazine from 1919 1929 1921 and in the mechanical view of economics published by Douglas he was still trying to find a name for this this ephemeral thing and it was underdeveloped it was like an underdefined idea but in general form and this word or as I got the word it's social credit and so he gave it that label. Onage by the way was also the disciple and personal assistant to Gurgiav another famous occultist who people studying espionage occult espionage and black magic would have encountered a Gurgiav's name.

41:20Sorry I don't want to interrupt you through the thought too much but I'd just like to go a little bit deeper into Gurgiav because of course if anybody is aware of him at all it's because he produced a book that's got a quite a famous title B.L.C. Bob's Tales does grandson which if anybody seen it is I don't know how anybody actually reads it but that's a whole other issue. But I mean what what was his relationship to intelligence and this kinds of these kinds of operations. Okay for that that's such a big one let's put that as a thing. For the time because I this is an important idea of the social credit thing I don't want to and we don't have a limited amount of time ahead of us here. So basically what Douglass did is he serving this network around a Raj so a Raj breaks away from the Fabians this is you need to people need to know this if they want to understand social credit in 1919 that emerged in 1920.

42:24They need to know what happened in 1912 why do a Raj break with the Fabians because he didn't break by himself he there was a controlled sort of the fearcation or splitting off that's what these occult agencies always seem to do with the break off. In these little disputes like a hydro with many heads to create these control dialectics they always create not in ones but in twos so they create a left hand of the right hand control dialectic. And then they get people to get gravitationally pulled into the debate of do want Fabian socialism top down state run controls bad completely don't care about really human free will and personal agency so much like that's all sacrificial to the greater collective concepts. Or do you want some form of bottom up spin on proto libertarianism where only individual matters and not really the collective that's an absurd ephemeral idea but it's all about the individual now. In the case of of orages network that Douglas was a part of what they did after he split from Fabian Fabianism as he started promoting something called guild socialism.

43:29The idea of devolving power to local commons and in Douglas's writings and his many speeches he makes the point that not only should in an abstract sense power be developed from the nation state which he doesn't even believe should exist is he says nation states actually don't play should not be tolerated because they're outlets of corruption and control. He should devolve power as well as we should heal he says that and I've got a big quote from him describing how industrial civilization himself is a corrupt aberration and that we should go back to energy intensive forms of artisanry. You know you could see clearly the the the fault or the thoughts of people like John Ruskin and William Morris were sort of the founders of this guild socialist pre-refinite romanticization of medievalism pre pre pre nation state medievalism pre renaissance medievalism which is influencing or is influencing every Ruskin and Morris are everywhere here. So they're creating this idea that okay from just had these beautiful little utopian commons without advanced technology then we all have liberty and freedom and we would have progress and abundance and naturally you know again it's very very mat it's like magical thinking that people will just organize into self organized systems and then progress will happen corruption will disappear and will have this future that's great.

44:55But planning is bad in any any type of role of a nation planning something for the future as China is doing now with the BRI or as the U.S. had done under JFK or FDR or whatever or Lincoln that's bad that should be eliminated. And so yeah he was marketing his stuff actually just like keens like keens was actually propping up so John made our keens another Fabian who was all about top down planning was actually propping up Douglas by setting him in his general theory. Both keens and Douglas were writing letters to the Nazi high command to Hitler directly which is all available both keens and Douglas marketing their systems to the Nazis making the point that the Nazi type of governing governing system is ideal for each one now the problem is the irony is that each one appears to be opposing. One seems to all be about bottom up emergent self organization the other ones all about top down national planning but they're working together it's a control dialectic and they're they both correctly identify that their systems.

45:56And it actually wasn't a letter by keens by the way it was his preface in his German edition of the 1936 general theory for those who might want to say hey you never wrote a letter. He wrote the general theory the preface and he says it's in Hitler's Germany that you'd find the best application for my system under it doesn't work under under democracies. So you know you got this thing in the fact that Joshua Haldemann is moving from technology ink which he's running for until he's arrested in 1940 and it's made illegal because now we're in world war two. He immediately goes on to become the head of the social credit party of Canada or of Saskatchewan sorry and he does that from 1943 up until 1949 he's running for office and he's pushing social credit which you would think is the opposite of what he was pushing with technocracy ink or earlier when he was working for three years as the head of the Fabian Society of Canada which is what he did from 1933 until 1936 is Joshua Haldemann was the head and founder of the Fabian Society of Saskatchewan which meant he was the head of the Fabian Society of Saskatchewan. Which meant he was directly receding orders or at least looking with five road scholars were the founders of the Fabian Society many of whom were pushing genetics anyway and the replacement of capitalism and democracy by a managerial class of elites that's what the Fabian Society wants and always wanted and their Canadian branch became known as the cooperative Commonwealth Federation that became known as the NDP today the orange party which is the middle party and it merged in the 60s with the Liberals.

47:24It pretty much became one thing and I mean I say merge they still exist but pretty much all of the pearly attrudeau was an NDP technocrat and he basically went with all of his fellow NDP technocrats and became Liberals to gain political power so I'm saying that you know they didn't merge officially but they merged in essence and that's what Joshua Haldemann so he has these three phases in his Canadian political career all of which seem different in different ways but they're actually in different ways. Identically driven by the same agenda of of maximizing the illusion of personal liberty from the bottom up perspective but maximizing the reality of top down controls by a world governing class which is why also I'll just say this beef even globalist eugenicist like Bertrand Russell also is a self-professed anarcho syndicalist who says that that's the best form of organizing society. At the same time as he's proposing and fighting for one world government under a managerial class as is Elon Musk who actually wrote a tweet two years ago saying anarcho syndicalism for the win as at the same time in the same day that he was calling for a Martian technique.

48:40So you've got the same language the same naming protocols as well by Elon and company who are all transhumanists they think in the same terms as those I was just referring to as far as human beings being machines to be merged with other machines if they want to stay relevant because we're in theory or biological machines. They promote the idea of drugs and video games to distract the useless leaders will be made irrelevant. And you know peer feel Elon who were incubated in South Africa where you were Joshua Hall them on went in 1949 when he got too exasperated by the lack of acceptance of his doctrines he went to the freest place on in the world and began promoting. He became essentially a promoter and an a publisher of conspiratorial anti-Jewish narratives of you know republishing the protocols of Zion which is what Douglas major Douglas was also promoting with a Raj as well as the Canadian social credit party which was the only part to impose eugenics as well and support eugenics and sterilization of the unfit especially natives but across the board in Canada in the 1940s 50s onward.

49:47They were also promoting they were the only political party promoting and publishing the protocols of Zion that are probable forgeries cooked up by the theosathist themselves. You know decades earlier and that's what Elon Musk grandfather is also citing and promoting in South Africa which is he's arriving at the beginning of apartheid which I mean I don't have to I hope I don't have to say anything to the audience about why that was a bad idea. But that's where long and fear feel are incubated in inner and are grown out of this sort of like Nazi utopian environment of districts and you know identity cards that give people mobility rights or don't in South Africa that was what was done under a very very I would say that there's probably a lot of unreconstructed Nazi controllers were probably active managing that shit show. That inspired Elon's grandfather and father and and probably himself to a certain degree I would say yes wow where do we go from there so so I could say I mean I can say more but I I think like but here's the thing right like a lot of people they they they want to believe so badly that um they want to believe so badly that Elon is this great genius that I mean Tesla you know you can say say what about that too right like the fact that Tesla was also in New York in five star hotels in 1920s.

51:09Tesla is also on record calling for a global system run by eugenicists and and and he's on record in interviews with Hitler's principal lieutenant in America George Sylvester V Rake in 1930. But this can't be right because she had been Tesla Tesla has held up by by Freedom Advocates as being the man who's who's fantastic inventions would have changed the world and he's he's suppressed by the by the globalists right. It's a magic trick. But yeah no it's actually I you know it's a big part of my book on Rose accrucian golem here but oh and I tell a lot of the story about the interfacing of Tesla and these technocrats and eugenicists as as part of a big magic trick that is transgenerational in its effects the idea was not to necessarily act upon the world that they were acting on but to create a narrative foundation. So it would obscure the source of real discoveries that were attributed misattributed to a Tesla as a cardboard synthetic sort of self identified human automaton.

52:16He didn't believe he had a soul he didn't believe that souls existed he believed that he was a machine that had been endowed by special clairvoyant powers to see see things from the beyond. It's sort of mystical self identity that made him perfectly pliable and because he was very much full of himself too as was people like Isaac Newton and other Rose accrucian affiliated pseudo scientists were marketed to the world as being the great sources of the discoveries that were actually made by real tech the real engineers and scientists who were being creative but whose ideas had to be stolen and repackaged and attributed to somebody right in this case it was Tesla for most of his ideas you could find them actually sourced by other other greater minds than he. But he had hadlers he had managers I mentioned here George Sylvester the rake is as the guy who went to jail because he was Hitler's top lieutenant in America working to spread Nazi propaganda all across the United States with senators in Congress that he was that were on his payroll and this is the guy who Tesla practically lived with and wrote poems weird weird poems in homage to the greatness of the rake.

53:22The rake is one of the first people if you read his writings in 1933 exposing the federal reserve he sounds like Alex Jones he sounds like the type of useless muleens conspiratorial. Expo like narratives that we here tend to encounter but the reason why is useless muleens was the disciple of the rake the rake himself was a disciple of Crowley they were doing black magic rituals in Long Island together openly and there's books that have been written about their association so you got one degree of separation between Alistair Crowley a British agent British secret agent six six six in America organizing to pull the USA into world. One he still added world war to building up a whole network of occult black magicians pushing fascism which is also at the heart of fascism in Nazi Germany is a black magician class of foolish society new temple freaks trun and vogue demons and usher in an age of horse or an age of whatever Odin for a thousand year millennial high.

54:24You got these same networks everywhere overlapping each other and you got these things like the blue shirts of Adrian Archon working with the social credit party the social credit party sorry about I'm just spewing out stuff here but anyway the social credit party. They are the green shirts they actually have brains and they have a whole you know fascist inspired uniform system called the green shirts they're working with the Adrian Archon blue shirts there sometimes it battle with the black shirts of Oswald Mosley. But they're they're all kind of like the technology anchor the gracious they actually well but look the grandson of Oswald Mosley is currently. Head of Palantir in UK so again we've got the connections back into the technology once again so they these people never stray far from the. You know they're never too far away are they. They're never too far away they like keeping this in the family and I think you mentioned to me the other day that you got the MI6 director as well who's a grandfather had some peculiar relationships in in Ukraine in a in the world world two period too right.

55:26Absolutely absolutely so we never have to go too far look you said you were just spewing stuff out there but actually this stuff is really important to understand because because we are in a in a world where we have these types of networks. Apparently at each other's throats on steroids and you know how are we to just to conclude this for today because this this conversation needs to continue but how how how do people decipher or get a picture of of modern events of current events and the types of people that are you know appearing to be at each other's roads when in fact they're working ultimately to this image and the higher people supposed to interpret. What they're saying in front of them. I mean I think if they're watching the show they're already in a pretty good place as far as progress to wrap their minds around things that they've been told are unthinkable no we have to go to the places that were being told are forbidden in this realm so that's a good start I I think that what I what I've tried to do with my wife Cynthia is make a lot of these seemingly complex but actually not super complex ideas as intelligible.

56:41As possible through our books that we've published the you know we've done the clash of the two America's book series that's four volumes of the untold history of Canada I built I wrote that over the course of a decade that's four volumes of reconstructions of Canadian history they're all short to they're not too long and you know our science and shackled books are revenge of the mystery books a mystery cults synthias books on the blacks and any one of these could be a good entry point to begin I would not to to my own horn I just think that that's why we did them so you're asking. Your own horn I mean this is you know this all helps I just yeah I feel sometimes it's maybe a bit presumptuous of me but I you know I also do a lot of documentaries and I think the thing to focus on is where did the old and garkey fail because the way a lot of the conspiratorial research is framed that is available and has become very popular especially in the post-COVID age is to map out.

57:41All the all the ways the oligarchy has gained power enjoyed forever power has been evil doing evil but there's very little focus on the times and moments in history where they've failed to succeed what they want to do. And I think that that for me has been one of the most important attitudes that I adopted early on is to obsessively try to focus on like well discover where are those moments where the oligarchy tried to do something and were prevented were blocked were flanked by by human beings thinking like human beings on a much higher creative and I think a level of natural law that's in tune with God's law. I mentioned that the the Chinese flank of the Han Dynasty's invocation or not invocation there their creation of the new of the silk road 2000 years ago was one of these fantastic ways of breaking free of its system of controls by a high priesthood that wants to keep people fighting divided in an ignorance that was a great way of doing it and it lasted for a while but it was sabotaged eventually there's different moments in history where I've tried to sort of zero and shed light on where did.

58:49The crusades which were supposed to have begun 200 years earlier than they did how were they how how did greater greater minds more dignified minds like those allies of Charlemagne and al-Quan were part of the Carolingian world work with their Muslim counterparts to create alliances and to create sharing of information with Jewish networks and Chinese networks as well from the Tang Dynasty. We're all able to collaborate to work together to create an idea that our self-interest and our destiny is much more in harmony than than at discord and it's all tied to creating you know Renaissance movements and so these things that gave rise to the American revolution the best of what Lincoln did the best of what we saw in in why why did Hitler lose World War two when all of these bankers were funding him and all of these occultists were backing his movement. Why did that not succeed when it was supposed to why did they abort that so these types of that way of thinking I think is just more valuable than simply mapping out the evil alone.

59:52But it gives you your people the strength to see well where are the weak things in this very intimidating looking of this parasitical ancient evil so there are weaknesses there are insecurities that has that I think are being acted upon in an authentic manner. By you know many many of those leading policy right now in China especially but many of its allies are doing things that are might be flawed it's not the same and we need to talk about how this social crisis different from that social credit which maybe that could be a future. Yeah we do yeah we need to do that too. Absolutely. But I want to say it's like this is a sort of thing that I think would empower people to understand like what are the the practical options available even if they are unlikely because we've wasted time decades have been wasted in letting ourselves mentally and morally physically entropy as as human western human civilization we do that to ourselves we allow that at least I mean you can say the oligarchy did it to us but we allowed it as well it happened with our consent.

1:00:52So you know it's more difficult than it would have been maybe when you know Bobby Kennedy was alive 60 years ago but it's still practical we see that China has given us something to work with as far as a way of thinking about global self interest and avoiding avoiding wars and what have you. But we have to just I think get over our prejudices be more courageous in terms of thinking about what what type of thoughts were capable of lifting it's like a gym you know we tend to want to stick with the easy thoughts that are that are lighter but those are actually useless and you know in the long run going to kill us I think we have to just allow ourselves to press on the unknown a little bit more with more confidence in ourselves that we that we understand that we can make the discoveries by leaning into the unknown. And and and building on discovery after discovery to have real knowledge instead of something we've memorized from a persuasive influencer that we're listening to that gives us things we write down but it's not really a power of changing things it's power more of just knowing how screwed we are which is often what would often you know we see in the in the echo chambers of the internet these days too you know so that that my words with wisdom as I as I hope they are.

1:02:03Okay well let's let's leave it there because that's a great place to end for today we've clearly got two two programs more to do it very least the social credit versus social credit conversation and also. Gertjeff because because Gertjeff I think I'd like to know a lot more about and so we'll do that in the not too distant future so look thank you very much for joining us today and we'll keep you posted on on any responses there'll be information about how to find Matt's work in the show notes of course as to do support if possible and thanks everyone for watching we'll be seeing next time bye bye. you