Bitcoin Is the Only Asset That Matters… Everything Else Is Garbage? w/ Charles Menke

When people start to disassociate from their conviction, from their understanding, price will change everything.

I don't care about price. Why? Because I didn't build conviction on somebody else's opinion.

What's up everybody? It's LG News here and welcome to the milk road show, the daily crypto show that wants to know

if people are going to buy crypto again once they can't afford their gasoline. That doesn't even make any sense.

Today is Monday, March 16th. We're actually up a little bit from the lows. Bitcoin broke 74K earlier.

We'll see if it has legs. My guest today started mining ETH way back in 2017 almost 10 years ago.

But in the last great bull cycle, he actually pivoted and sold it all and bought a ton of Bitcoin.

Now he's deep on the technical side of Bitcoin and actually daylights as the head of ops at one of the

biggest financial media platforms in the space and and finance in general will financial.

Charles Manky is on with us today. Today's episode is brought to you by Shareland Trade Real Estate like stocks,

Nexo or an interest borrow and trade crypto and Fortis X, your idle crypto's worst nightmare.

Charles, what's up, man? What's up, dude? Thank you so much for having me.

People were crying right now because I told them that you sold your ETH five years ago.

But ETH is half the price it was. Yeah. I think I think candidly I don't think ETH.

When I got into ETH, originally I was just looking for something that I could do passive

passive income on. It had nothing to do with having an ethos or a thesis on whether ETH will do well.

I candidly am hyper bearish on ETH. I really don't think it's that great of a platform.

Oh, why? I mean, like we have so many permits for ETH on our side.

Sure. And you have so many people saying like this is these are the rails of the new financial

system. And yet we have somebody from a big finance media company telling me the opposite.

Yeah. I mean, okay. So I spent some time with a lot of the original Bitcoin devs and

going to these conferences, talking to them at length about like how Bitcoin works,

how ETH's code works. I think ETH originally moving from, and it's not about a POW versus

POS like proof of work versus proof of stake. I think fundamentally ETH has first mover

advantage, but technically it's actually not necessarily in the best spot compared to other

chains. Like it has this huge labyrinths and this huge molehill. And like when I talk to a lot

of these developers, so basically I don't know how much you know about. I'm sure I'm sure

a lot. I'm sure you know a lot, but like landscape typically how it works is this. If a developer

wants to develop a platform, he always follows liquidity. And liquidity almost always follows

innovation. And this is like the the the cat and mouse game that happens between two people that

are building on top of a blockchain. Well, ETH having all the liquidity in the beginning,

what ends up happening is innovation leads towards the liquidity and vice versa. And ETH has

been in this really weird place where it has pivoted a thousand times. If you look at the code

base, it's a labyrinth of code and all the stuff that we've seen issues on. I mean, look at the

NFT cycle craze. Like I think I've made 12 I think I've made $1,250 for a transaction one time

to to Minta Kara Fuku and NFT man, it was bad. And no, and there's something fundamentally wrong

with the platform and candidly like the amount of I don't know dementia it takes for people to pay

$1,250 is insane that I even got to that place. And so, you know, I think fundamentally the

platform is trying its hardest to make this thing work. And candidly, I think a lot of the

traditional finance people that are coming in are looking at the liquidity, they're looking at

the innovation, they're thinking like this is going to be the rails for the new financial

landscape. And I'm not opposed to that being the case. But I'd love for it to be instead of a

Frankenstein where it's like, yeah, this is our Frankenstein chain where it's got this dude's

face, they've changed 17 times. The lines of code are so fat at this point and they still haven't

fixed all out of the issues that comes around gas fees. You've layered toed everything and

layer two and layer three is just a fancy word for a database that it's literally all that's

happening because the truth is is all they're doing is they're going back to like pre-on chain

everything and they're saying, Hey, what we'll do is we'll do all of our typical transactions

on a regular database. And then we will put them down to the base chain after it. All the benefits

that you had from being on chain are completely lost. And now you're going back to a trusted

system, which is a layer two and layer three system. And obviously there's a lot of details in

that that, you know, I think I'm probably pretty green on like Z casing and some of the security

stuff that you get into it. But most of the time you're losing a lot of the benefits of being on

chain. And so why would love to see another chain come up and beat Ethereum? I just don't think

it's going to be the case. I think we'll Ethereum will infinitely pivot until fixing all of its

core issues. And that liquidity is too much of a finger looking good time for developers. And

they're going to keep building innovative stuff on top of ETH because that's where all the money is.

It just doesn't make sense. I mean, think about it like a developer is like, yeah, I'm going to go

build a bunch of innovative tools on a chain that has no money. It basically is a death sentence.

And so no matter what people are kind of leaned towards ETH, even if it's not that easy to work with,

even if the foundation's tough, even if the code sucks, even if they pivoted a thousand times

because that's where the money is. So that's why I'm not like super excited about ETH overall as a chain.

But you're telling me that it's, but you're also, but you're kind of painting a bullish reason

though, that it's like despite all those issues, the liquidity stays there. And as a result of

the trucks, it tracks the developers. So what would change that? And you're saying that there's not

going to be a competitor. So what would change that current trend? I think it's just stuck.

It's just always going to be that. It's just always going to be this clunky thing that all these

devs want to use like crazy. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, it's a good point. I guess my

bearish case is the bullish case is that people are just going to keep following the liquidity.

I just wish it wasn't the case. I wish we had a chain that was a little bit more. And I think maybe

it takes another two to X years to get a chain that's top to bottom exactly what we needed. It's

really hard off first rip to get something right when it comes to technological innovations.

That's one thing that's interesting about Bitcoin for me. Usually the first, the first innovation

that you get in a tech becomes archaic. I've been in tech since I was 15 years old. Bitcoin is not

really having that moment. And so usually when you look at all these chains like in 10 to 15 years,

I imagine we'll probably think that some of this tech is archaic and not the right way to go.

But that might not end up happening with Bitcoin and East also at least 99% Bitcoin.

Everything you're listening to today is also covered in our daily crypto newsletter. And on

Sundays, we even recap the best parts of the entire week's worth podcast. So check it out at the

link below. So tell me more. Give me your bull case for Bitcoin from the technical side.

Because I feel like this is a take that we don't hear very often. So what? And to start from

the beginning, because you were you were mining your ETH 2021, I guess you came to this realization

going to conferences, talking to devs, all that kind of stuff. What was that turning point

into Bitcoin then at the time? Yeah. So Bitcoin kind of, it was too folded. I think some things

that people get wrong in Bitcoin. And I went to the Bitcoin conference, I don't know 2021, 2022,

something like that. And I had been doing a bunch of research into how the chain works, into

basically how blocks are aligned. And difficulties increase when difficulties increase.

You sum it down into this like very simple measure. There's basically a certain amount of zeros

that has to happen in front of a stringed character or a hash that like all of the chain ends up

having to look for. And if they need if the chains are the blocks are timed too short or if they're

timed too long, they add or take out a zero. And so basically they just take probability and they're

like, okay, so we're going to X the probability by a certain amount of X so that all of the hash

rate that's happening towards this right now has a harder time finding a string of characters with

the many zeros in the beginning. Like this is a very dumb down version. There's a bunch of concatenation

and stuff that's going on the technical side. And you know, I encourage anybody to go on chat,

GPT actually understand the tech you're investing in. And I went to the Bitcoin conference,

I started talking about how cool the tech was. And I was like, oh man, it's so exciting because like

this and this concatenation and you can see the tree and it all goes down into a hash and you get

pushed into the next block. And people were like, yeah, dude, trustless. And I was like, what?

Yeah, I mean, like, but what don't you think that's cool? Like, dude, they're using cryptography

to create like a safety between layers and it's trustless and nobody understands. And I mean,

almost I would say one to two percent of people probably understand so far. And obviously,

I mean, everybody actually understand the depths of Bitcoin. And I went to like some private

meetups of like all these Bitcoin related people. Most of the time people trust the keywords.

They don't actually trust the technology. And so we were like, oh, yeah, I believe in trustless.

Oh, yeah, I believe in this. And you start drilling down into the psyche of why they believe in

this. Most of it is adjacent belief from another person. They had some some key figure that was like

it's this. It's that it's whatever it may be. So this kind of drums back into it. I realized

at one point that I was the same as everybody else. And I was borrowing conviction. I didn't really

have any of my own conviction because the truth is is real conviction is built on understanding,

not adjacent understanding, not somebody else's. And how downstream this conviction had been. I

wasn't even sure. It could have been from this guy that actually understood the tech told this

guy that it's amazing. It's trustless. You it's permissionless. It's all these things that make

Bitcoin a benefit. That person told that person to not person that person. And you end up with

like 15 trees all the way down where nobody actually understands what they're they're talking

about. And I realized at one point I was I was this pleb. I was this giant voice for something

that I truly didn't understand. I didn't know why it was a technical

feat. I didn't understand why trustless and permissionless was truly great. I didn't understand

a lot of this stuff. And so I started really digging in. I spent a long time maybe maybe two to

three weeks of sitting behind chat GPT and understanding cryptography. I'm I'm I dug into shot

256. How it works. How it actually moves things. It's super simple. You stick one string of characters

in. It blends it up in the exact same blend quality. And then you get an output on the other end,

which is like the private and public key. And a lot of this stuff never made sense of me. And the

thing that's crazy too is like I know I'm like building this sort of bitter die trap. And I'm not

trying to. But the core point here is like when people start to disassociate from disassociate

their conviction from their understanding price will change everything. I don't care about price.

Why? Because I didn't build conviction on somebody else's opinion. Whether Bitcoin goes to 25 or

55. The reason that I think it's fundamentally worth it is because I understand what the tech

gives capacity and ability to do. And there's something extremely powerful for somebody in some

foreign country within a looming regime for them to take $100,000 and stick it in their wallet.

And they can memorize a song that has 24 characters in it and they can go to another country.

We have no touch point in the US. And so like the things that make Bitcoin inherently valuable,

like a US-minded person will look at Bitcoin and think thoughts like this. It's a financial

asset that I can two and three X my money. But if you take anybody that has any type of harsh regime,

tough political pressure, Bitcoin becomes this freedom lever that they can instantly push. And

there's a massive value in that. And when you've only had it good, it's really hard to understand

the key value around Bitcoin. And so I say that to say once I really understood what trustless

meant, digging into like anybody can participate, like freedom of commerce is back. Like go try to

commerce at a gas station in your own way where you have a chicken or you have some type of thing.

It's like totally impossible. You have to use Visa. You have to use Mastercard. You have to use

the United States system. It doesn't exist anymore. But commerce is now directly from person to

person and it's brought back. And I hate to be that. I'm probably just a bit close. I'm like

every Bitcoin that's ever existed right now. But yeah, I didn't. The main thing is I didn't borrow

conviction. And I think it happens pretty much anybody who's listening, I'm sure you've borrowed

some conviction at times. And when price goes down, you get a little uneasy. You're like, oh man,

that feels bad. Like what's going wrong? Like where did you get your fundamental thesis from

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Fortis X to put your portfolio to work. I just want to tell you that we actually trade our pairs

every year for some food from a farm. I'm just going to tell you that in rural Canada,

this does exist. Okay, we have like three, I have three giant pair trees and make like 300 pounds

a year. Okay, there's way too much to eat and we just go trade it in some farm for some of their

eggs. You know, cars exist in my world, but I'm not taking away from you set obviously.

No, no, no, no. In the United States, if I want to go get milk from a farm, I cannot buy it.

It is illegal. If I buy a farm cannot sell me unpasturized milk. It is a crime. I literally cannot

pay for it. The only way that I can go get unpasturized real raw milk that hasn't been shipped through

35 people and then suck on to a shelf is I have to literally just trade for it. I have to barter.

There cannot be any exchange of money because they've totally made it a crime. It's insane.

Sorry to hear that. Sorry, you can't drink your unpasturized. Okay, so

Charles needs his real proteins and his all his bacteria. He needs it. He needs it to stay strong.

Okay, hold on. There's a term you use that I think is fantastic that we've never really hear on

the show, which is downstream conviction. I love that. And I think how much, you know, you also,

you run a massive financial platform and you guys talk about everything. Same as we do.

You have a massive audience on X. So you have a lot of experience here. You know, you know how people

react to financial news and how they latch on to narratives. How much of how many people's opinions

are actually just downstream convictions? I mean, I don't want to be bearish on humanity, but

99% it's, dude, it's crazy. Like think about it like this.

Massive creator posts that he's entering a trade. Trade goes sideways. Everybody's angry at him. Why?

Why would you be angry if you understood the thesis? If you accepted the thesis of the creator

and you understood it, stood exactly the selling point. He wasn't giving you a buy signal.

He was giving you a thesis and you agreed with a thesis, which means that it's your buy signal.

See, you only fundamentally get mad at the creator that posts a buy because you never tried to

understand why he was buying it at that entry. Because if understanding was the prerequisite for

your purchase, you can't get mad at anybody because you made a full decision around that purchase.

Look at how much anger there is on the timeline. Somebody posts and it's positive and they're

super happy. Somebody posts and it's negative. We work in the creator ecosystem.

So like most of these creators a lot of times have a huge difficulty around backlash and just

having a thesis around trading because nobody's going to do the fundamental analysis.

Nor are they interested. I mean, I can take this another step. Look at the copy trading platform.

So if you look at eToro, it's based around copy trading. Like that's been a lot of their big

thing for a long period of time. All of the wealth when you look at copy trading goes to the top

one and two portfolios. It doesn't go anywhere else. What is that telling you? People go onto the

platform. They go X percentage up. Most green copy. The truth is is people, people fundamentally

want to make money. But I don't think that they actually have a desire to seek to understand the

tech. And that's why the people that deeply understand the things that this goes back to Warren

Buffett too. I have a friend from Pakistan. He says Warren buffet. This goes back to Mr.

buffet. And he said, I don't invest in anything. I can't understand. He goes tech is great. It's

awesome. I have no idea how it works. He goes, but I can understand a burger. And I feel like a lot

of times we've lost this fundamental thesis for retail, which is I only I only invest in things

that I can understand. And most of the time people are just looking at the gains of other people

on social media. They're borrowing the conviction for a short period of time. When the price goes

negative, they start to lose trust in that person. And then the creator gets attrition around the

followers. And unfortunately, like, dude, I think the truth is, is people just flat don't have time

to invest in single stocks. They probably have enough time to stick it in QQQ or VU. But they're

trying to act like a single stock trader. And it's just not going to work. That's why Bitcoin for

me. I bought it 125. It hurt a little bit more than buying it 68. But I bought it 125. I bought it

68. I bought it 52. All of it is the same to me. It doesn't matter. It's a 10 to 20 year hold.

Like, I fundamentally believe whether even the United States is going to be successful as a

country that even even stuff crazy stuff like that. And I'm poor the United States. I love my

country. But even if the United States doesn't do super well, I feel like I have a really good asset.

I wouldn't want to hold in US dollars if that's the case that it goes negative. So for me,

I'm hedging the bets. I've got 5% of a doomer in the back end. And I think most of the time people

are fundamentally investing into other people. One is just a time thing too. So what is 5% of a doomer?

What did you say? Yeah, I mean, like, I feel like you got to be a little bit like the things that

make Bitcoin inherently really, really valuable. You have to be a little bit of a doomer

to hold to that value. So, okay, this is a good perspective. So we're doing shows for a long time.

And when we talk about Bitcoin from a United States perspective and the people speaking from

the United States perspective, they don't really understand inflation. It's just a number on a

piece of paper. They've never really gone to the store and bread increases in price 5x overnight.

We've had some. It's been kind of slow. It's been trailing. But if you go look at Turkey and

bread is $2.50 and the next day at $65 or $45 because I have 50% inflation rate year of a year,

whatever it is, like those people really understand Bitcoin. Until you start to get like a little bit

of that sour taste in your mouth for what doesn't work about the monetary system, Bitcoin's value

is a little bit lost on you. And it just becomes like words on a piece of paper. And that even

goes for me, you know, like I don't really feel inflation in the way that somebody like Turkey

or a place like another country that has crazy inflation. It's the same with like having like a

political regime that's unfriendly. There was a story originally about a girl. I don't know,

she's in the Middle East. She put all her money into Bitcoin. And because the banks was taking

everybody's cash, this happens that I believe in Africa as well, where the banks will languish and

take your wages. And if you can just take your wages, take them into Bitcoin, memorize the 24th

seed character, and then move over to another country. You can take your wealth with you,

which you could never do. You can't even do that in United States. And Michael Saylor talks about

this, you know, 10,000 times. And obviously, this is like the key statement around Bitcoin.

But until you have a feeling and actually experience that, and that's why I say it takes a little

bit of a doomer perspective to see the value in Bitcoin. Because if you have a zero percent

doomer perspective, you think of it as just like an adjacent gold that's better than gold. Yada,

yada, yada, it's an asset that can go up in value. But there's a lot of safety mechanisms for

having a negative person, a negative leadership over you and whatever, whatever way it may be,

whether it's political, whether it's, you know, the regime, whether it's yada, yada, yada.

Like all that stuff is a major benefit because Bitcoin was really made out of the 2008 housing crash.

I don't, I'm sure you guys have talked about this on the show a bunch, but whole, yeah,

whole idea is that he was like, hey, we can no longer trust the United States monetary system

because now they are bailing out the banks yet they've failed. And at that point, he created

Bitcoin, you know, cryptography meets monetary system and, you know, mixed effect.

Are you a gold holder? I would be. I would be. I don't hold any gold candidly. For me, I'm a

one trick pony. So I was buying gold, maybe $2,200, $1,800. I sold most of it and I bought all Bitcoin.

For me, I think it's an ease thing and there's more safety in Bitcoin. Like, you know, I can put,

I can basically make like an iTunes song where I put 24 characters into the song and I can upload

that to iTunes and my little, my little seed phrase can go anywhere at any point in time and I'll

go play some random music from some random guy that I uploaded. Gold is hard to travel with and

I've got like 5% of a doomer in me. So at that point, like if I'm broken into gold can be taken,

you know, all that stuff. And Bitcoin is literally just safer than gold when I'm thinking from

my 5% doomer, but you don't live. You haven't buried some gold bars in the woods behind your house.

No, no, I don't know. I may. I would rather hold guns than hold gold candidly.

Do you, do you look at, okay, you already said you're a one trick pony. So I know the answer to

this, but what do you think about things that are Bitcoin adjacent? Something like, like iron,

right, which is, you know, is no longer really a Bitcoin thing. It's no longer a Bitcoin stock,

but it was a Bitcoin mining company. Now it's kind of pivoted to AI. Is that something that you even

pay attention to when something like that happens? And I'm not saying do you invest there, but do you,

does that factor in for you at all? Yeah, they're yellow bellies. It makes me sick to my stomach. I hate

them. No, I'm joking. No, no, no, no, I'm joking. No, iron's a great choice. Yeah, you're such a

Midwest American guy with an expression with yellow bellies, man. That's a great expression.

I love that. I mean that in a very nice way. That's all expression. No, dude, iron's a great

choice. Look at AI. I mean, what are you trying to do? Do you, here's the thing. I have a little

bit of a doomer in me. So fundamentally, I don't really like enjoying holding stocks. Why? I can't

take stocks with me anywhere. If things don't go well for whatever agency, like look at the stock

market from if you can only take, I think it's a seven to an eight percent downturn before they

will pause the market. The fact that they can pause the market in the first place tells you that

there's serious central controls. So I wouldn't love holding stocks candidly because I already said

that some kind of hedging my bets. But if you're trying to create wealth and you're looking at these

companies thinking like, oh, these are the data center plays that were in Bitcoin and now they're

pivoting to AI because we're going to have literally the next five to 10 years of the most

AGI centric tech boom that's ever existed in the history of mankind. I think you're making a

pretty smart bet. You know, I'm not huge on the contracts themselves. I've got good buddies that

follow all the contracts from all the AI companies who they're contracting through how much they're

worth, where they're building, who actually has the real estate. And I did an interview with the CEO

of CleanSpark and he talked about how the real estate is a lot more valuable, not the real estate,

but the land is a lot more valuable than you think. It's not about just putting a data center

anywhere. The data centers for inference have to be really, really close to the place that you're

actually going to do the inference. So he's like, if you keep power highly separate, you have key

issues. And so they're land focused and have been land focused for 15 to 20 years. And so yeah,

you know, if you're going to invest in companies like iron, like deeply understand those companies

and what they're doing, look at all the contracts, make sure you can actually follow the assets

themselves. Don't just, you know, invest in the narrative. If you invest in the narrative alone,

like imagine you'll take big Ls, dude, like, you know, you don't actually fundamentally understand.

What about any, what about like micro strategy or coin base? Like again, those are not,

they're not as bullish as your Bitcoin thesis. I'm just thinking that those are things that as

over 20 years could also appreciate in price. What is your reason for not for sticking only to

Bitcoin instead of other stuff like that? So there's a lot of benefit around MSTR and some of the

treasury companies that you're not going to get in Bitcoin. One, you have all the option tools,

you can short, you can long, like you're going to get a lot more financial tools around MSTR than

you would ever get in Bitcoin. Things I do like about having Bitcoin is that I can take loans

against it. So if I want, like, I'll double expose at, I don't know. So like, Bitcoin's at 62,

I'll loan against all of my Bitcoin. I'll double expose to the upside because we're probably

bottoming out or close to. And then at the very top end, I'll sell the Bitcoin and then pay the

loan off and have double exposures at the top end. You can do that with MSTR, but you can pull out

an option where you're leaping one to two years. If you think it's going to do well in it,

we'll do well in one of these three points, three points, six, two percent of the market,

even if he did the math and Bitcoin goes to half a million or a million, he's going to be the

most infinitely wealthy person that's ever existed. So I think MSTR is a good play. I don't know if

you've talked about in the show, the fundamentals of Treasury and how it works. But the general idea

is that they can ATM, which is basically issuing shares. And if they're at a positive

nav to Bitcoin holdings, they're positive. I have to look at this again, but basically if the stock

price or the market cap is 1.2 to the Bitcoin holdings underneath, they can ATM the shares all

the way down to where the market cap and the Bitcoin holdings are absolutely equal. So right now,

I think MSTR is on sale. I'd have to look at the nav, but I think it's like 0.99. So anytime you

dip below into the 0.8 or 0.7s, meaning that the market cap is 30% cheaper than the holdings of Bitcoin

that are actually inside the company. You're buying your Bitcoin at 70% of the value. You are

trusting a centralized actor to hold your Bitcoin for you, which is a huge consideration. But

candidly, we talk into Bitcoin content all the time. Most people don't even understand self-custody.

We work on the traditional finance side. I think for spaces, we have one of the biggest shows,

and we tried to market some of the self-custody companies into the traditional finance. And even

people that held Bitcoin fundamentally cannot understand why they would hold it themselves.

It's actually a risk to them. They're like, why wouldn't I put this into an ETF so that somebody

who's bigger has more money, more safety would hold it for me in comparison to me trying to hold

it myself when I have a chance to just send it off in some random place. There's right now,

traditional finance is having a Bitcoin ETH moment, but they haven't experienced an FTX moment,

like the crypto natives have. And so they don't understand honeypots. They don't understand that if

you steal money under traditional rail, they're just going to freeze it. If you steal it on Bitcoin,

there's nothing to freeze. There's nothing to roll back. If you do it on ETH, you might get

to tell it to settle a bit and be like, do we roll back? Obviously not, but we've had those

tweets, but there's nothing to roll back. And so right now, fundamentally, I think a lot of this

money is going to pour into all of these traditional. And MSTR, I'm sure you've talked about this

at length. There's a ton of international benefits to MSTR. Like right now, you can't invest in.

I can't remember the country. So I'm going to say some off the top if people in the comments

are like, this guy's an idiot. Like, yes, I can't remember the country specifically. But Brazil

has issues around investing directly in cryptocurrency. And so a lot of the publicly traded entities

actually give capacity for you to benefit. I think Japan is the same way you can't invest in

cryptocurrencies directly, which is why meta-planet went so crazy. Because the tax benefits are

on investing in the stock in comparison to crypto is like, it's insanely different. I have to go

back and do all the research for the numbers exactly. But I think the spread is like a 20% tax

difference. Do you know what it was? No. Okay. Yeah, it's a big spread. There's huge tax advantages

to investing in local companies that are local tickers. Because cryptocurrency, when you look at it,

a lot of times to a foreign regime, they look at crypto and they actually think that it's an

aggressor to the local currency in some ways. And so when the local companies buy that thing,

well, the country is incentivized for their companies to do well. And so they'll actually give

benefits to those companies in comparison to cryptocurrencies. And so a lot of times this is just

the vehicle in which way people are investing into these assets. It has nothing to do with

the companies themselves. It's because locals can't invest directly into crypto because it's a

hostile environment in that country. So there's, I mean, it depends on where you're at in life,

what part of the country you're in and why you would invest in those things. And candidly,

how much stress you have from Michael Saylor, he seems like he's off the rails around Bitcoin. So

I mean, he's probably going to do you pretty well. Real estate is one of world's largest asset

classes, $300 trillion plus. But buying it, that's a nightmare. Brokers, paperwork,

massive down payments, and your money's locked up for years. What if you could trade real estate

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at milkrow.com slash Shareland. I guess I guess maybe one of my last questions for you,

Charles, is what would there ever be anything that invalidates your thesis, right? You've given

us a lot of great reasons. Yeah. Contemporary Bitcoin. What? Contemporary is one of it. Yeah,

especially as a tech person. Tell me more. I mean, so there's two algorithms that govern Bitcoin

right now. One is shot 256, which is fairly safe. The other one is the algorithm around the wallets.

I think it's basically elliptical curve cryptography. ECC is the one around the wallets. So basically,

imagine that you take the algorithm that you're scrambling and you put it on more of like a

geographic plane and you start plotting. That's how ECC works. ECC is not that safe in comparison to

shot 256. Shot 256, the difficulty for it to be hacked infinitely scales. So even if you put a bunch

of compute onto the chain, the safety mechanisms around the central chain are high. Now, the safety

mechanisms around the original wallets are not ECC is relatively unsafe. So I mean, I have issues

around this. Candidly, I don't know enough about quantum and I'm looking at like this is where I'm

borrowing thesis from other people. People will post on it like Bitcoin, screwed, quantum.

I have no idea. That's the true. I don't know enough and the problem is for me to really,

really dig down. When I've started to dug down into quantum, quantum doesn't multi-modal well.

It doesn't change functions the way a computer would well, but it can do one function very well.

And they've talked about it doing ECC or shot 256 and that one function very, very well.

So and there's even people, if you look at like Martin Screli, Martin Screli is actively spending

money through quantum companies to see if he can break shot 256 and ECC all the time. So he's

even testing the waters and being like, okay, can I mess with this thing? So and I feel like every

cryptographer, whatever it may be, there's the honey pot of the century, which is Satoshi's wallet,

which is the original wallet has not been changed over. I think it's original ECC.

It's susceptible and so I'm sure people over years have been trying to break it and it's

technology. It's cryptography. It's a compute issue. So one computer can compute 50% of the

hash rate fairly quickly because it's a million times X faster than whatever the original hash was.

There's risks. So for me, that's the only thing and I'm looking at Bitcoin and I'm like man,

sometimes, sometimes gold would feel good. And I think maybe a 50, 50 portfolio gold and

Bitcoin in that in that world probably makes sense. You'd hedge your bets a little bit. Gold's

not going to get cracked. There's an inflation rate to gold. I think it's 1.25 to 1.35 percent,

which is the gold they mine out of the ground. Bitcoin's now at 0.8 percent inflation rate next

year after the having it go to 0.4. So you do have to deal with a little bit of inflation around

gold. And as gold gains more value, they will mine more of it. So the inflation rate will go up

with gold as it keeps gaining value. Maybe up to 2.5 percent. But outside of that, like,

I feel really good about Bitcoin. It's it's non-nation dependent. Whatever happens in any case,

I can stick a pneumonic in my head and I can go to whatever country and retain my wealth, which is

more than you can say about just about anything. Well, I hope that doesn't come to pass what you

said about the quantum part. But I feel like that's a developing story. Something that people

like it's really hard to just know what that would happen. But I didn't know that about the Satoshi

wallet. So that is interesting. It makes it more susceptible. It's definitely something concerned.

How much Bitcoin is in there? A million Bitcoin. I think it's a hundred billion dollars.

Ish. Maybe last, maybe 70 billion?

The casual hundred billion. It's a pretty, it's a, it's a, it's a good, early buy.

Yeah, good. It's a good thing to target. I didn't know that about Screli either. The constant,

the recurring villain. I didn't know that at all. So that's hilarious. Okay, Charles,

we're at the end of the show. You got it. Where can people find you, man? And tell us a little

bit more about what's going on at Wolf? Yeah, absolutely. You can find my personal X is Charles

one. Just literally the number. I don't post much. It's not going to be a, I think it just

changed the handle. Yeah, there wasn't Charles. And then I'm, obviously, you can find Wolf

Financial everywhere. It's just at X. It's Wolf underscore financial. We have probably 10

in house assets. We just purchased stock market news. And right now, there's not really a B2C

play, but tune into any of the finance shows. We'll talk about futures, swing trading, day trading,

futures trading effects. Like if there's a financial market that you invest in,

we probably create content around that. And if you go on the Wolf Financial page on X,

if you scroll down to the first pin post, you can see all of our show schedule. We do 40 hours

of shows across X across Wolf Financial, Wolf Bitcoin, Wolf Trading, Wolf crypto. Wolf crypto

is probably the, the newest to power up. So I wouldn't expect huge things out of there right now.

But you guys can find us tune into the shows. If you guys are interested in being a part as well,

you guys can message us. We're always looking for talent. And people are excited to grow on social

media. Charles, great to talk to you, man. Thank you for all that. And what a pleasure. Honestly,

this is a refreshing episode. We don't get, we don't get this angle very much. So I appreciate that.

And the, the ETH Maxi's in the audience will be, will be in shambles a little bit. But I don't,

I don't think you're, I think that even what you said about ETH to them will be, what was the

term you said that I, that I like your downstream downstream conviction. I guess downstream

fund as well. They're not going to, they're not going to let that infect them. I feel like they'll

stay bullish for the reasons that they have, which is also what you recommended. Have your own

conviction, right? So, yes. You know, people don't, don't take it too seriously. What Charles said,

unless you really like what he said, then message him and ask him some more. Charles, good to see you,

man. You got it. Thank you so much. One insights on what's moving crypto markets and how we're

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