Asia and Ashton Brown

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Criminology is a true crime podcast

that may contain discussion about violent or disturbing topics.

Listener discretion is advised.

Hello everyone and welcome to episode 399

of the Criminology podcast on Mike Ferguson.

And this is Mike Morford.

Mr. Morford, how you doing this week, man?

I'm doing pretty good.

I'm getting ready for my last flag football game of the season.

I've been coaching this year and hasn't gone as good as we hoped.

I think our record's like two and six.

But the kids are excited for the last game and I am two

and then it's playoff time.

All the teams make the playoffs.

So that's when I'm not working on criminology,

I'm working on plays for our flag football team.

All right.

All right.

Well, a two and six.

I would imagine you get a high draft pick next year.

I'm hoping.

Number one pick.

Hey, let's go ahead and give our Patreon shout outs.

We had Sally Smith come in with some new support.

That's awesome.

We really appreciate it.

Yeah, thank you so much, Sally.

Thank you to everyone else that supports the show.

If you want to help us out, head over to patreon.com slash criminology to get started.

All right.

We have to jump into this episode.

In the case we're covering this week, it's no doubt a tough one.

But let's face it, right?

All of the cases we cover on criminology are tough.

We're often talking about victims who went through terrible or deals.

And in many cases, they're far reaching ripple effects for their loved ones.

But sometimes we cover a case that is so shocking, so senseless and cold-blooded that it really hits your heart.

And it sticks with you.

And I think this week's case is one of those.

We're talking about the 2015 murders of 22 year old Asia Brown and her two year old son, Ashton Brown.

And this is a very timely case, which is why we chose to tackle it in this episode because it happened 11 years ago this week.

And police are still seeking the person who killed them.

So it's our hope that we can help spread the work about their case.

In 2015, Asia Brown and her son Ashton were living together at the J.T.

Harrison Memorial apartment located at 1208 Orchard Street in Greensboro, North Carolina.

Asia was working as a security guard at the Greensboro auto auction.

And young Ashton was usually in daycare while she worked.

The mother and son were very close.

One of Asia's friends, a man named Charles Visi, told the Greensboro news and record that Asia was a doating mother, and she spooled Ashton.

He said, she loved her son, she was all about Ashton.

You should have seen him at Christmas.

He loved Mickey Mouse, he had Mickey Mouse everything, toys, covers, clothes.

A resident of the Harrison Memorial apartment complex told the newspaper that Asia was friendly, and that she always spoke when she saw me.

So it's easy to tell from everything Morph just mentioned that Asia was a loving mother, and she was very close with her son.

And her neighbors and friends liked her and had nothing but great things to say about her.

She also was a very reliable employee who didn't miss work.

That's why people became alarmed when no one had seen or heard from her or Ashton since Friday the 20th, 2015.

Calls the Asia's phone had been going straight to voicemails since that day.

On February 22nd, just before 7pm, after Asia not showing up to work, for two days in a row without explanation, her friend and coworker Brittany Greenwood called 911 to report her missing.

I have a friend that's missing. She hasn't been working two days. She won't ask about that. No one's seen her for two days.

I want to buy her apartment. There's no sign of her. She has a meal.

I guess for her, there's stuff in her door that she hasn't been home to check for. It's clear she hasn't been home.

And I'm always concerned now. Her phone was straight to voicemail. It has been for two days she was saying why she hasn't come to work, which is completely out of care until she's delivered the report.

We'll see how she was last seen. I don't know. I the last time I spoke to her was Friday afternoon.

Okay, and I had a six. She's seen her in over a week. Over about a week. I saw her last week, and I thought that was odd.

You know, but I said, well, maybe you know, we got sick or something or whatever. And after the odd day of calling, and no response, she never called her. She probably told him why she didn't show up. She wouldn't do that.

So I did a good thing here. It is two days later. She still has yet to contact anybody. We were making plans to go out to eat. And I thought that she read it. I was just come over. So she said, I'm fine. She's going to go to get some stuff straight with my car because she's been looking for a car.

So I sent you, you know, you know, you know, browsing around us to be sure, you know, try to find a deal with something like that. You know, we're going to get different cars.

And I said that I had my daughter. And if she could bring her son, it was fine. You know, it could play. And I said to just let me know if she never responded to that.

So I think that takes it 140. And she just stopped taking some of that. She never responded again. I said to her, nice to be on the spot. She didn't show up for work. They wanted to release me.

She didn't have problems with all that.

You can hear from that audio that Brittany was clearly worried about Asia, just the panic and her voice. She knew something wasn't right with the situation.

Brittany knew her friend well because they had known each other for two years. And even before working at the auction together, they worked at another place together.

Brittany regularly watched Ashton for Asia because they were both single moms and worked different shifts.

Brittany was the first one to start working at the auction company and she helped Asia get a job there. She would have known Asia's habits very well.

Brittany told the Greensboro News and Record, you don't jeopardize your job as a single mother.

One piece of information Brittany couldn't give with complete confidence was the type of vehicle Asia might be driving. She thought it was a Mustang.

But she also mentioned to the 911 dispatcher that the last time she talked to her, Brittany was in the process of trying to buy a new car.

So she wasn't entirely sure what car she might be driving.

Police took Brittany's call very seriously and immediately began to look for the missing mother and son.

One thing that is really jumping out to me here is Brittany talking about being a single mother.

You mentioned that they were both single mothers and Brittany said, one thing you don't do as a single mother is jeopardize your job.

And how could you? You are solely responsible in many cases as a single mother for not only yourself but your child or your children.

And that job is such a big part of that.

I think it's clear that Brittany knew her friend Asia well and knew this was out of character for her and credit to her for coming forward so soon and saying something's not right here.

I've got to get the police involved because in so many cases we talk about somebody knows or recognizes something might not be right but they don't do anything about it.

But in this instance to her credit, Brittany did she got involved calling 911 and the police seem to take it seriously right away too.

And a lot of times we hear, you know, they'll give excuses.

We don't really look for somebody until they're missing for a certain amount of time or, you know, maybe she's just out having fun and she'll be back whenever they jumped into action here.

So as quickly as Brittany was able to report it, they started investigating.

At around 330 in the afternoon on Monday, February 23rd, the day after Brittany called 911 workers from the city of Greensburg who were performing watershed maintenance came across a suspicious vehicle.

The car had obviously been at some point completely destroyed by fire and it was hidden on a service road in a wooded area near Buffalo Creek just beyond the end of thirst and avenue.

Which was a dead end street. It was invisible from the road, which is why it hadn't been discovered soon.

What the city employees found inside the trunk was unmistakable. They were looking at human remains.

They immediately called the police to report their unexpected discovery, investigators quickly determined that there were two bodies inside the trunk and adult as well as a very young child.

Paired with the missing persons report for Asia and two-year-old Ashton, authorities were pretty sure that the remains in the trunk belonged to them.

Unfortunately, a snowstorm in the area began not long after police arrived on scene and continued overnight and that delayed much of the investigation because any evidence in the field near the crime scene was buried in snow.

Investigators had to conduct their ground search days later and the car was up to the scene overnight. It wasn't towed from the area for several days.

It took an entire week for authorities to fully examine the crime scene.

Police initially believed the car was a Nissan Altima but later learned that it was a 2005 Buick lacrosse.

That's how badly damaged this vehicle was from the fire, likely due to the use of an accelerant.

In fact, on Wednesday the 25th, two days after the car was first discovered, two people, a firefighter and a crime scene investigator, got so sick from breathing and fumes at the scene that they had to be taken to the hospital.

The Buick's license plate was not on the car but it was found at the scene. There's no information as to whether it was also charred from the flames or it had been taken off and tossed at the scene.

More if we talk often about people going about their daily life, maybe it's their job, maybe it's a hobby and they stumble upon human remains and how tough that would be.

This one though, I don't know what must have been going through these people's minds.

They're at work. They find this car that's obviously been on fire and then in the trunk find the remains of two bodies, one of which is a child. It's just unimaginable.

When police get to the scene, they're ready to start knowing their investigation and to their dismay, this storm comes in and that's going to prolong things and I think that first time after a crime scene is discovered is crucial.

You want to collect evidence as quickly as possible as efficiently as possible and then you have a snowstorm that comes in that can damage evidence, destroy evidence and just delay the investigation overall.

So I think they just had a bit of bad luck on their side.

Yeah, you know luck is not something we talk about all the time, but you can have good luck in an investigation and you can also have bad luck.

And obviously, like you said, this was bad luck, this snowstorm, the damage to the bodies inside the car was incredibly extensive.

So many times when we hear about remains being discovered in bad shape, due to the effects of time or weather, authorities have to rely on dental records or x-rays in order to make a positive identification.

But in this case, they were completely useless due to the extreme fire. The DNA match was the only way for investigators to confirm that the bodies in the trunk of the car were actually those of Asia and Ashton lead detective Mike Matthews told the Greensboro news and record, this is one of the few cases I've worked in my 10 years where we've had to use DNA to do a positive ID.

Although we believe from the beginning, it was them. The DNA analysis to confirm it was Asia and Ashton took almost three months to complete.

The fire damage to the bodies was so extreme, the medical examiner was unable to determine whether or not Asia and Ashton were dead before their bodies were burned.

He also wasn't able to determine how they died, let alone win. The official cause of death for both Asia and Ashton is listed as homicidal violence of undetermined memes.

But based on Asian social media activity, the timing of unreturned calls and text, and the last sighting of Asia at an auto zone store, detective Matthews seemed to think that Friday the 20th, specifically in the afternoon was very important to the case.

He told the Greensboro news and record, I need people to be focused on Friday afternoon, February 20th.

Asia's iPhone was found inside the car. It's unclear whether it was in the trunk with her like it had been thrown in with her or had been in her pocket.

Or if it was inside the car, like maybe she kept it in the center console while she was driving and the killer didn't touch it.

It's also unknown whether the killer intentionally turned off Asia's cellphone, causing it to go straight to voicemail or whether the battery just died because she wasn't able to charge it before she was murdered.

And then there's also the possibility that calls were going straight to voicemail because the cellphone had been destroyed in the fire.

Detectives needed to piece together a timeline for the case. They had no idea when the car their bodies were found and was parked off of that service road behind Thurston Avenue, and they don't know when it was set on fire.

We know that Asia was alive and well in the morning of February 20th because she was active on her social media accounts.

Nothing seems off with her post from that Friday morning. She was still fine a few hours later, as far as anyone could tell from surveillance footage.

Asia was seen shopping at an auto zone on Randleman Road at around 320 that afternoon.

This is the last time investigators can verify that Asia was alive and it's the last verified sighting of her.

Detective Matthews told WFMY News 2 the timeline stops at the auto zone.

And more of to me, this is one of the big differences between, you know, a case in the last 10, 15 years versus a similar type of case that happened 40 or 40 years ago.

The advent and proliferation of social media, as well as surveillance video.

I mean, those two things alone provide information that possibly couldn't be attained way back then.

I mean, you think about people on social media posting, some people post daily, many, many times a day about what they're doing.

It almost helps create a timeline.

Yeah, in a case like this, I think every little clue matters because it helps police establish a timeline.

Maybe they can narrow down a window of, of when something happened to Asian Eston.

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Asia apparently purchased that but just hours before she went to the auto zone where she was last seen alive.

She registered the car in her name at the DMV office in high point at 130 p.m.

It's about a 20 minute drive from that location to the Randleman road auto zone.

Ashton was seen with Asia when she visited the DMV about 10 minutes later.

Asia's friend Brittany sent Asia a text which she never replied to.

It didn't seem like Asia had asked with her when she went to shop at auto zone though.

Which would complicate things.

Now it's possible that he was in the car and just couldn't be seen since he didn't get out.

But that's still unclear.

If he wasn't with her, investigators don't know where he was but feel it could be important.

Detective Matthews told the Greensboro news and record.

Did she stop somewhere to let someone keep Ashton?

That's going to be very important to this investigation.

We would love that information.

Detective Matthews stressed what a big clue that could be.

This would get them closer to knowing who the last person to see Asia was and potentially lead investigators right to her killer.

If Asia did indeed drop Ashton off with someone, it seems that they didn't arrange it on her cell phone or social media.

Otherwise, investigators would have found that communication since they were able to access Asia's text messages, emails and social media accounts.

If she was involved with anything shady or dangerous, they likely would have found some trace of it.

If she did stop somewhere to drop Ashton off before going to auto zone, investigators believe it would have had to be close to the store.

No one has ever come forward to say they were watching Ashton while Asia went to auto zone.

But again, we don't know if anyone at all was watching Ashton while his mom was in the store.

Perhaps he was asleep and Asia left him in the car while she went into the store.

There are mixed reports about what it is Asia was looking for or actually bought at the auto zone.

Some reports say she was looking for car parts while others say she was there to buy accessories.

While we don't know what she bought, investigators likely do since they have access to the security footage from the store

as well as having conducted interviews with staff there.

But they may be holding that information back because it could be something that only the killer knows.

Especially if whatever she bought was still in the car when it was set on fire.

More if you just mentioned holding something back, right, that only the killer would know.

And with so few clues, that was really one of the only things they could hold back to try and prove that whoever knew that information was involved in the crime.

For example, toward the very beginning of the investigation, after realizing the car wasn't a Nissan Altima and was actually a Buick,

authorities wouldn't even confirm what kind of vehicle Asia was driving.

It wasn't until they ultimately decided that it would be more useful to generate potential tips from the public that they released that information.

Police also refused to confirm or deny the use of accelerants in the fire, though that news kind of got away from them due to the reports of people getting sick from papers at the scene.

It appeared that the car was burned at the scene after being parked where it was found.

With so many businesses in the surrounding area, it seems impossible that not one camera captured someone suspicious walking away from where the car was found burned,

which could have helped investigators figure out a direction for their canvas of the area.

It's also possible more than one person was involved and someone drove them out of the area in a second vehicle.

The area where Asia's car was found seemed like a big clue to detectives.

They were certain that this was not an area that could have been stumbled upon and felt that the killer knew that area well and was familiar with it.

And going back to, you know, investigators holding things back, we know they do that.

They have to do that in many cases, you know, someone were to come forward and confess.

Well, they have to have a way to either confirm that confession or rule that person out.

But I can imagine that that's a very tough decision.

You think about some of the cases that we've done that go back 30, 40, 50 years.

And I can remember in some of those, it's 20 or 30 years later that police release some of the details.

So in many cases, they hold on to things for a very long time when possibly kind of letting that information out to the public could give them the break they need.

But for my way of thinking, it can't be an easy decision.

What do you hold back and what do you release?

Yeah, to me, if it's one thing, if there was something very specific that Asia had bought at AutoZone and it was found in the car and later on in the killer came forward and mentioned that.

Then that's one thing that sure you can hold something like that back and it helps you later on.

But things like just the basic car description, you know, I would think you would want to get that out there as fast as possible.

So you get witnesses coming forward because if you ask somebody that question, weeks or months down the road, if you release that and say, hey, we were looking for somebody that saw this car.

I don't know about you, but I don't remember cars that I saw weeks or months ago.

Half the time I probably wouldn't remember something I saw at the Home Depot that I was just at yesterday.

So I think you risk losing potential witnesses the longer you wait to release certain details.

Yeah, I'm with you and you say, you know, weeks or months, sometimes it's even years.

And who is going to remember a car five, 10, 15 years later, I mean, it just, it gets very tough.

Asian, Ashton's murders were not the first in that area with the same hallmarks.

The area had been in the news for a somewhat similar crime, maybe coverage of that murder and the subsequent trial and appeal

gave someone a terrible idea in March of 2010.

Multiple trash bags full of human remains were found in the wooded area behind thirst and avenue.

Based on missing persons reports, authorities believed it was the body of 41 year old Ritha Cook Simpson.

A DNA comparison ended up confirming this.

Her body had been dismembered and burned before being dumped in the woods.

Due to the state of the remains, the medical examiner could only rule that her cause of death was from undetermined homicidal violence.

Her husband, Winford Simpson, was arrested and charged with her murder.

In early 2013, he was sentenced to life in prison with no possibility of parole.

In May of 2014, his appeal was denied.

Articles about his arrest, the trial and the appeal all described the wooded area off of thirst and avenue

where a murder victim remained undiscovered for days.

Maybe whoever killed Asian Ashton had heard about the area in news articles about the Ritha Simpson murder

and felt like it would be a good place to leave Asian Ashton's bodies.

Police once again decided to focus on the timeline, leading up to Asian Ashton's murders and felt that Brittany might know Asia's movements the best.

Asian Ashton were supposed to go over to Brittany's house for dinner, but last day she heard from Asia, but they didn't show.

The original plan had been to go out to eat together, but Brittany wasn't feeling up to it and asked Asia if they could just do dinner at her place.

It was a little bit more low-key and her daughter and Ashton could play together while their mother's finished eating and hanging out.

When Asia didn't come to dinner and stopped replying to text, Brittany figured something had come up and the Asia would explain it when she showed up and relieved her at work the next morning.

When she didn't show up the next day and her phone was going directly to voicemail, Brittany thought that maybe Ashton was sick or something had happened to Asia's phone, leaving her unable to call into work for the day.

When she missed yet another day, Brittany was positive that something bad had happened to Asia.

She would have found a way to contact someone and let them know what was going on in where she was, but with no word from her at all, it was clear, something was wrong.

After texting and calling and getting no answer for a full weekend, Brittany went over to Asia's apartment.

She knocked on the door but no one answered. She didn't hear anything inside.

In fact, it seemed like Asia hadn't been there in days. Mal was piling up waiting for Asia to bring it inside.

This piling up Mal is reminiscent of umpteen movie scenes I've seen of cases where somebody's missing or something's going on and you see all this Mal piling up at their door.

Usually, never a good sign because if somebody is on vacation or whatever, they'll ask a neighbor to take care of it or ask a friend or family member to come over and pick it up.

But when you just see lots of mail piling up at somebody's door packages, that kind of stuff, that usually means something's not right.

Yeah, there might be one day that we forget to go out and get the mail, but obviously if you have a mailbox, that thing's going to get pretty full fairly quickly.

And nowadays with so many packages being delivered to people's houses right Amazon and so many other companies who doesn't want their packages.

And who wants, you know, to leave them out there and give maybe a porch pirate or or something like that a chance to steal it.

So, you know, I do think more of as you said, some of that stuff is a really bad sign.

Investigators were able to determine that Asian asked hadn't stayed at their apartment the entire week they were last seen alive.

And this could be a very big clue while we don't know what the reason was that they weren't staying in their own apartment.

It may have played a role in their murders and it does lead to more questions.

Was Asia afraid of someone and chose to say some place else if she and Ashton did stay with someone else who was it and why have they not come forward.

Police may have those answers, but publicly they haven't shared them if they do.

Police also revealed that there had not been any 911 calls made from Asia's apartment.

So, based on, you know, all of the facts and circumstances at the apartment,

police theorized that whatever happened to Asian Ashton likely didn't happen there.

One thing a lot of people gravitate to in this case is the situation with the multiple cars Asia may have been connected to.

We mentioned that investigators first thought that the burned out car could be a Nissan Altima.

This is likely because one of Asia's neighbors at the apartments on Orchard Street believes she drove away Altima.

But her friend Brittany mentioned that she was last driving a newer Mustang.

People wonder did someone maybe multiple people lender these cars?

If so, who? The fact that she bought a new car the day she died certainly jumps out.

Could the murders have something to do with that purchase?

Unfortunately, police haven't released many details surrounding the purchase, which has only fueled more speculation.

None of the available materials or news articles have mentioned whether Asia was dating anyone at the time of a murder or whether she had recently broken things off with or rejected someone.

There are also zero mentions of Ashton's father outside of the fact that his DNA sample was used to help confirm that Ashton's remains were in the trunk of the destroyed car.

There's been speculation that Asia didn't even know who the father was since it seems like he was completely out of the picture.

But if authorities were able to find them and collect his DNA, then his name must have been documented somewhere or known to Asia's family members or friends.

If they were able to get a DNA sample from him, it seems very likely they also checked on his alibi and looked for any potential motives like child support payments to Asia.

The most popular theory online based on the combination of Asia not staying in her apartment and constantly switching cars was that she may very well have been afraid of someone and trying to hide from him.

If that's the case, who was she afraid of and why and did that person finally catch up with her? If she was worried about someone, it seems like she might have confided in her friend Brittany since they were so close.

But as far as we know, she didn't. It brings up an interesting scenario that if Asia is trying to avoid someone, maybe she was killed by someone that she trusted and let her guard down with.

Perhaps that person was close to her, so close they were worried that maybe somehow little Ashton might ID them and he was killed too in order to silence him.

But if a stranger killed Asia, how likely would it be that a two-year-old could provide enough information to police to ID them?

But at his age, he likely could say a few words or names and perhaps the killer could not take that risk.

And we said it right up front, right? This is a horrible case. You have a mother killed. You have a two-year-old child murdered.

So for me, you know, I always wonder, first of all, who could kill anyone? But we know that does happen, but who could kill a two-year-old? And why would they do it?

So if you're looking at a total stranger situation, is it likely that they would kill two-year-old Ashton?

It's possible, but would they really feel the need to do that as opposed to someone who was familiar to Ashton?

And felt as though he could more easily identify. And that's the thought that kind of goes through my mind.

Now we know percentage-wise, right? Most people are killed by people they know, you know, is that the scenario here?

Yeah, I think you're spot on with that because a total stranger would have no reason to kill a two-year-old boy unless that he felt that there's just a chance, even a slight chance that he's going to say my name to police when they question him.

If they try to question him like they do children sometimes in crimes, and he might blurt out my name and I just can't take that risk.

But what's frightening is if this person did this to Asia alone is bad enough to do it to a two-year-old boy, what else could this person be capable of?

You know, you can, your imagination could run wild with the types of brutal and cold-blooded crimes they could commit.

So it seems like the longer this person's been out there, the more victims they could have, because if they could do this once and especially do it to a little boy, they could have done it several times or done other crimes like it as well.

Yeah, my thought is if you can kill a mother and her two-year-old son, I don't know that you have many limits if any, because that's about as bad as it gets.

Another theory surrounds the car that Asia had just purchased.

You know, perhaps in a case of mistaken identity, she was killed by someone targeting the person that sold it to Asia.

She literally had the car for less than a day.

There's also speculation that the murders were a random act of violence and that Asian-Ashton were carjacked or robbed and something went wrong and they were killed in the process and the fire was set to destroy evidence and erase anything linking them to the crime.

So another theory is that Asia had witnessed something or knew a secret about someone and was killed to silence her.

Unfortunately, there's no evidence that we know of that points in any one direction.

So in a case like this more, obviously you're going to have all kinds of speculation and theories because that's really all people can do.

Some of them, you know, are interesting. Could it be possible that someone was targeting the person who owned this car before didn't know that they had sold it?

I guess it's possible, right? Anything's possible. You have to kind of keep everything on the table in a case like this.

Random violence is possible, but it's also very possible. This is someone who was known to Asia.

And maybe she did overhear something, find something out that the killer was afraid she was going to disclose.

For me, this kind of goes back to, you know, why had she not been at her apartment as the authority seemed to believe was the case?

Was she hiding from someone?

That's a very good point because if she wasn't at the apartment for a week like they suspect she had to be staying with someone somewhere

unless she was, you know, had gotten a hotel or slept in her car.

She most likely stayed with someone and that someone if they're out there never came forward.

So then the question becomes why? Why haven't they come forward just to say yes.

She was here and you know, because of this reason or that.

So that could be suspicious, but I think the problem with this case and for investigators is that

when you don't have a motive and you don't have anything specific for road to go down,

you're sort of spinning in circles because you don't, you've just got to look at all the facts, the details,

and the clues are there, but you don't have any avenues to go down.

So I think that's part of why this case remains unsolved, you know, over 10 years later.

Yeah, my thought is, you know, they've looked at all the facts, they've talked to all the people that they're aware of.

So what can you do?

I believe they're waiting for that next tip, that next clue to come in.

We touched on it earlier.

Investigators confirm that they had accessed Asia's Facebook account, her Yahoo email, her iCloud, and her bank accounts.

If they found anything relevant to the case, they haven't released that information to the public.

As far as we know, there's no indication that Asia was involved in any illegal activities,

or anything that might have put her at risk.

And all these years later, the murder of Asian, Ashton still shocks and haunts people,

and they can't fathom who would murder and cold blood the loving mother and her son.

Asia's friend Charles V.C. told the Greensboro News and Record,

I don't know who could have done this.

What would have been their intention?

What would have been their motive?

It just doesn't make sense.

It's just tearing me up.

Asia's friend and coworker Brittany has always felt that this was a deeply personal crime,

and believe that whoever killed Asia knew her.

In Brittany's opinion, this wasn't a random crime.

And Detective Matthews told the newspaper,

this case is frustrated investigators.

It's been one challenge after another.

And I kind of agree with Brittany.

For, you know, a couple of different reasons.

One is that, you know, the percentages favor that, right?

The perpetrator being someone who knew Brittany.

It not being a random crime.

But then also, as we talked about,

someone being able to kill Ashton as well,

I think it lends itself to someone who was known to both of them, in my opinion.

And, you know, Charles talking about motive.

And you talked about it as well.

To me, that's the big one, right?

As you said, what road do police choose to co-down without having any idea

what the motive was for this murder?

The motive is such a huge thing.

And when you don't know it, I feel like authorities,

a lot of times, are left spinning their wheels.

Yeah, and I'm with you.

I sort of tend to think this is somebody that,

Asia knew and knew Asia.

And you have to believe that police have scoured, you know, her social media,

her friend group, her co-workers,

and probably just put everyone in a file

and went through them one at a time looking for anyone talking to them,

seeing if any of them had a motive or any issues with Asia.

And because there's been no rest,

you have to assume that none of them rose to such a level that police felt they had the right person.

That leads to more questions,

because if for friends, people like Brittany, her close co-workers, family, all those people,

if there's no one within that group who's a suspect,

and none of them could provide anyone that might be a suspect,

that makes it harder for police,

because then what leads do they have?

Where do they go from there?

And it's just very frustrating.

Thousands of dollars offered over the years.

As a reward for information have yielded no lead so far.

Even early on, it didn't seem to be enough incentive for anyone.

Even a troll or a prankster to call in a tip.

In May of 2015,

Detective Matthews told WFMY News

that investigators hadn't had a lot of information come in.

This seems surprising because this case involves the murder of a two-year-old.

It seems like this kind of crime would have sparked outrage,

and people might be turning in potential suspects left and right.

This makes it a real possibility that whoever killed Asian,

Ashton acted alone and never told anyone.

Detective Matthews also noted the potential that no one out there knows anything,

saying it could be that maybe there's not a lot of information out there.

If that's the case, without any kind of deathbed confession,

we may never learn the truth,

especially as fire may have destroyed potential evidence.

Despite the lack of tips,

Detective Matthews was clear that investigators would not be giving up on the case,

and hinted that there could be promising leads to follow,

even if no one spoke up.

In 2015, he told WFMY News,

it's nowhere close to being a cold case at this time.

In 2016, in an interview with the Greensboro News and Record,

Detective Matthews called this case the most challenging case of his homicide career to date.

He had been working the job for more than a decade at that point.

Ten years after he made that statement, the case has still ensolved.

We still don't know who killed Asia in Ashton Brown.

We don't know why.

And when someone is willing to kill a toddler,

we truly don't know what crimes are capable of committing in the years after.

Way back in 2016, Detective Matthews told the Greensboro News and Record

nothing's been ruled in, nothing's been ruled out.

That's where this investigation is at.

From what we can tell, that's exactly where the investigation still stands today.

Ten years after he made that statement,

in 2018, he told MyFox8.com,

we've chased every lead.

We've done everything forensically we can do.

And we get to this point where I don't want to call it a cold case

because we're still working on this case now.

We get to a point where we really don't have a lot of avenues to go.

Ashton Brown would have been a teenager this year.

His love of Mickey Mouse would have probably evolved over time

to a love of anime, video games, music, or sports.

All of the things young teenagers are into.

But someone snuffed out his life before he had a chance to really live it.

We can only hope that Asia didn't see her little son murdered

and that whatever happened in their final moments happened quickly.

None of Asia or Ashton's family members

have ever given any kind of public statement or done interviews.

This decision is one that can likely be attributed to their grief.

But it makes you wonder part of that is because they don't know who did this.

And that maybe it's someone that they know or trust.

And I have to imagine more of that.

That's a very scary thought.

Horrible that they had to deal with the losses of Asia and Ashton.

But for so many years now,

you know, not knowing what happened to them

and the thought that possibly it could be someone that they know.

How tough would that be?

Yeah, that's just seeing people that knew her, you know,

maybe at family gatherings or groups of friends.

You know, if I were in their shoes,

I might be looking around saying could that person there have been involved

or maybe thinking about a disagreement that Asia had with someone

and then wondering, well,

maybe that disagreement led to something else.

It seems like it would just spiral over time

and that you might never be able to escape suspicion

and maybe that's why they've choose just not to talk about it at all

because it probably would be too hard for them.

Well, in the other thing that I would think is that

it would make it very hard to trust people moving forward.

There was still a reward of up to $15,000.

Being offered in 2024,

the total amount of available rewards in this case

has continued to dwindle over time.

In 2022, it was $20,000.

Hopefully, if anyone out there had information,

they would come forward with it not for a reward,

but because it's the right thing to do.

If you have any information about the murders of Asian,

Ashton Brown,

you can give your tip anonymously to crime stoppers

by calling 336-373-1000.

So more if we wrap this case up.

Obviously, it's a tough one.

A loving mom.

People said glowing things about Asia.

And there's no doubt that she loved her two-year-old son,

Ashton.

I think, you know,

as a single mother, he was her world.

So the thought of them being murdered,

possibly together,

you said it, you know,

did she have to witness her son being murdered?

Or did he have to witness her being murdered?

I mean, this is just a horrific case.

And whoever did this still has not paid for it.

And not only have they not paid for it,

it's possible that, you know,

they were out there committing more crimes.

It's just scary all the way around.

Yeah, this is one of those cases that just hit you hard

when you think about this loving mom or young son.

It seems like they were really each other's world.

And for someone to come in and take that away

and murder them in cold blood,

there's just not any rational explanation for that.

Especially Ashton.

I mean, we know that people do horrible things.

They murder people at the time.

But it takes them especially cold and callous person,

I think, to murder a young child.

It's just, it's hard to get in that headspace

and try and understand that kind of person.

And I hope the case is sold one day.

But I have a feeling that even if we got a name

and even if that person gave details,

it would probably still be incomprehensible

why they did what they did.

There would be no answer they could give

that in my mind that would come close

to even explaining or justifying what they did.

Well, there's just some things that you can't make sense of.

No matter how somebody explains it,

it's not going to make sense

of why someone felt they had to murder these two people.

But for me, you know, this is one of those cases

that's very tough to talk about,

but needs to be talked about.

Because I believe Asian, Ashton deserve justice.

And right now they just, they just haven't got it.

And hopefully, at some point in the future,

they can't, they can get it.

And I'm usually someone that tries to keep an open mind

and stay hopeful.

But in this case, I'm just worried because now all this times past,

there was so much damage to the car.

The fire was very tough on the crime scene.

We had bad weather that affected it.

So I just feel all the way around that there's a lot

that stands in a way of this case being solved.

And maybe it would take like a deathbed confession

or somebody that knows something eventually coming forward.

But I'm not very hopeful unfortunately.

Well, and I think this is the type of case

that it's even more important to talk about

because it's less likely that it's going to be solved

through something like DNA because as you mentioned,

the crime scene was just brutal, destroyed.

But that's it for our episode on Asian, Ashton Brown.

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So that's it for another episode of criminology.

But Morphin Eye will be back with all of you

next Saturday night with a brand new episode.

So until then, for my...

Ed Morphin, we'll talk to you next week.

Take care, everyone.

Bye.