Are You Wasting Your Life Saving Money?

0:00If you've listened to the podcast for a while now, you'll know that in my early 20s, I had a lot of debt. Tens of thousands of pounds of the stuff. It wasn't really a great situation but it did teach me a lot and a lot of those lessons still shape how I think today. We've also had the pleasure of speaking to guests at Amy on the podcast, who pulled money out of an index fund during a market scare and then tried to stop pick to recover those losses. If you've had an experience with money that's changed the way that you think we'd love to hear about it, there's a short form linked in the description so if you're happy to share it, just fill that in. Have you read this book? Diwazero is by Bill Perkins, a trader who became a millionaire before the age of 30. Me and Tomane have recently and we're going to discuss it in detail today because of a question that we got from a listener called Susan. First of all, thank you Susan for sending in this. Tomane, you're going to read it out for me mate. For sure, shout out Susan. What do you think of the Diwazero philosophy by Bill Perkins? I know many people working so hard that they never get to enjoy retirement. There were three widows in my gym group in their 50s.

1:01I know many people holding their money in their late 70s, frightened to spend anything. We're really going to get into the details of the book and the core philosophies but I guess you could sum it up in one sentence and says, Bill Perkins thinks that if you die with money, you've wasted an opportunity because you've essentially worked to earn that money and then you didn't need to work as such if you've got money left at the end, right? You could have spent it on experiences. Or you could have just not worked because if you die with a hundred grand and it's taken you five years to save that up, you've worked five years longer than you need to. What were your first impressions of the book when you read it? How did it make you feel? It made me feel great. For once, I mean, you know me, I've been a bit spending my life. I like to enjoy experiences, travel the world and only since we started the podcast, I've really started looking long term investing and since I've had my kid looking at the future. So for me, die with zero kind of like reaffirmed how I've lived my life. We always have people on the podcast talking about invest for long term, start investing your pension, start early

2:02compounding. But die with zero kind of says enjoy life, maximize your experiences and because I've had like, you know, one of them, but I've had like my first girlfriend passed away in a car crash, my best friend passed away in a car crash when I was like 16 and like 14. So I had like death young from, I knew life was short and mean you have a friend that passed away. We had a few mates that killed themselves. Exactly. And like, like when we're a bit older. So life is short. So I've always wanted to like, if I die tomorrow, I know I've lived a full life. I've had loads of experiences. I traveled, I spent time with my friends and family. So for me, the book really affirmed a lot of how I've lived my life. How about you? If like, if you're worried that you've started too late, this is a great book to read to reassure you that what you've done is the right thing. Exactly. You know, if you're like the person who's gone book wild in your 20s and 30s, this is the book that will make you, oh yeah, I did it. I did it right. I did it right. Enjoy experiences while you're young. Yeah. I think, so at first reading the book, I read the book in two sit-ins like in full. And the first half of it, I was kind of like, all right mate,

3:02yeah, I get it. Like, Diabasero, yeah, yeah. It's important to Diabasero. It's like one of those books where it's exactly what it says on the tin in terms of the title alone could make you think, okay, I know what that book's about. And I was kind of, I was thinking he's just like filling the pages. It's quite a short book, but it felt like it was dragging on. But then the second half, he gets really into the weeds and the practicalities of how to actually die with zero. And at that point, I was like, this is a good book. I really enjoyed it. And it has reshaped some of the ways that I think about certain aspects of my life and what dying with zero means. And not just like the death, but I think it's a book about life. It's not a book about death. Yeah. Do you know what I mean? It's a book about how to live your life. Definitely. Which the title might not give away. Yeah. And it has lots of nuances and practical tips in it. Really practical financial tips around certain types of products and things. And he is an American, but I think he's structured it in a way that applies to everyone. Definitely. Let's, let's, okay, the book starts with a fable,

4:06the ant versus the grasshopper. Now, this unlocks like core childhood memory for me when I heard the fable. So just to summarize the fable, this is like, is it like an A-sop's fable? Is it one of those where there basically there's an ant and a grasshopper. And the ant every day gets up and basically saves because he knows winters come in. So he's like, very in food or stored enough food. Working, working, working. And the grasshoppers like Maniana, Maniana, laughing around. Life's too short. I'm going to live for today. Long story short, winter comes. The ant like retires into his luxury like a boat with all his food and the grasshopper freezes to death. Yeah. It's like a cold hard end for the grasshopper. The one thing I want to say first of all is how deep are these fables as kids? Like I remember hearing that as a kid and I think it deeply impacted me as in I was like, oh my god, I don't want to be the grasshopper because I grew up in a situation where we didn't have much money. And I felt I am the grasshopper if I don't

5:08save. I need to save. Yeah. Honestly, it was like someone, it was like a call memory like inside out kind of thing. Who's this? Someone stuck it in the block and showed me a little version of myself listening to this grasshopper in the ant's story. And I feel like maybe a lot of my over-saving comes from that kind of story. And I really worry about the kind of the viciousness of the stories that we tell kids. I mean, I think it's great. I see that this is how we sort of book and I love the first half more than the second half. You like the second half more than the first half. But I am that I was I am the grasshopper. You are that ant. Yeah. And he does say that it's not about trying to be the grasshopper. It's trying to be more like the grasshopper. So enjoy yourself, enjoy the summer. But we can take parts from both the ant. You've got to look after yourself for retirement or for the winter. But everyone's trying to be too much like an ant and we need to be a bit more like a grasshopper. So it's like finding the balance in the middle. Yes. So the fable is the grasshopper is the bad guy or the what the idiot. You know, the grasshopper's having fun.

6:08No. In the fable, the fable, he dies mate. He freezes. Yeah, but he has a great time before he does. He has a great time. He has a great time. The fable is definitely the grasshopper. Yeah, but that's for me. That's having started. He's had no fun. He's alive. He had no fun. Yeah. You already did his work. Work, work, work, work. Just to eat his little measly stuff in the winter. Yeah. I mean, if you took it that way, that's wild. But like, I think the original fable is set up in the book. He says, no, I'm not talking about a book. Like, listen to what I'm saying, your grasshopper. Like the original fable is structured to suggest that the grasshopper is doing something wrong, that his approach to life is wrong. Bill challenges that by saying no, I think we need to be a bit of van and a bit of grasshopper. Yeah. And what I mean is that the initial fables that we tell kids are a bit one dimensional in the sense of it's like, be the aunt, be safe, save up your money so that you don't die cold and miserable in the depths of winter, like the grasshopper.

7:09Bill is a bit more balanced with it, right? Yeah. He has a good way to illustrate it with the story of his friend who was 20. They were both working in, I think they were getting 18k a year. So not loads, but they were well off back and back in those times. And one of their friends, his friend took some time off and went on traveled Europe, took a loan from a loan shop 10 grand, traveled Europe had the best time ever and came back to the same job and their careers kind of stayed in trajectory. And he says his friend said he would never give up that experience for no amount of money. So like going to travel Europe when he was 20 was like amazing life-affirming great experiences. But then Bill said that he went to travel like late from life and he didn't have as much fun and he would have, he didn't want to backpack and stay in hostels like we did when we were like in our 20s. He didn't have the same experience. So there's some experiences you can only really enjoy when you're younger, which is kind of like the grasshopper. Like you can enjoy it when you're younger, you can't go skiing when you're 70, but you can go skiing when you're 30. So that's kind of a story that related to me that he gave to explain that. Yeah, risky behavior

8:16taken out a loan with a loan shark to go and give it up in Europe for three months. I wonder if that trip had gone badly. Have you ever seen Euro trip? It's cool. It's cool. Sometimes the whole thing is like with the trailer. The flugan, the flugan, the flugan, the wonder if he'd come back and go, yeah, that was worth it. I don't always take grab to load sharks. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So like, you know, he had a great trip by the sounds of it. And he said he was jealous, right? And there is this thing of in our earlier years when we were in our 20s, I think we're like all on this race to set ourselves up and get ahead. And what we don't realise is we can actually take time out and still kind of re-enter the workforce and not much happens. He was talking about three months, wasn't he? Yeah. It's like an extended summer break. And then he comes back and all that happened. He got the job straight away and then and was just like, oh, I've got that experience now. And yeah, yeah, one, a reverse of that for me is a bit like university of I entered the workforce and I looked around and I was like, all these people here are like four years ahead of me,

9:16three years ahead of me. I went, do you know what I mean? Like they just went straight into school too. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Kind of I felt I felt in a reverse of what I went to university and I just messed about for three years. Didn't get much out of it. Got to load a debt and then went into the workforce and everyone was like four years ahead of me. Maybe that's the ant way of thinking about it. Yeah. You got to think like a grasshoppy experience. You got to meet this guy. That was a highlight of your, that was worth every penny of your university. Mate, when to comes and you're dead, you're dying. I was going to be like, tough titties. No, mate, I'm the grasshoppy like, you're right. And can I get some of that some of that grove you've stood on. I mean, I know what's coming. You're going to be like, oh, what? Conversely, he did have a nice story that counteracted that because I like this book because he gives two arguments on both sides. He doesn't just say, be like the grasshopper, go spend money in Europe because he said some experiences like Vegas. He said he had more fun at Vegas at 40 than he could have gone to Vegas at 20 because he wouldn't get to two years and then we're going to Vegas. Would it be a podcast episode for Vegas?

10:16Yeah, yeah. No. No, I don't want to do that. I don't want to document anything that happens in Vegas. The losing money podcast. So yeah, he said like, you can't go to Vegas when you're 20. Well, you can, but you can't have as much fun as 40 because you can spend more, you can gamble more, you can, he lost poker. So yeah, he said some experiences are worth waiting for, but a lot of them you should enjoy with your young. Yeah, there's like these elements of experiences that are moments in time, you know, backpacking around Asia is probably something for, you know, your 20s because when you're in your 30s and 40s, you don't want to sleep in sweaty hostels. Yeah. His central to his thesis is this idea that you've got to balance health, time and money. And at different points, we have more of each asset and that we need to spend them accordingly. And some of it's quite contrarian in the sense of, you know, I think the notion is, for most 20 to 30, you've got lots of time, you need to work lots really hard, grind to get

11:17yourself ahead. Whereas he would say, no, you've got a section of time here now where there's certain experiences that you should enjoy that you'll never get that opportunity again. So go do that because you've got your whole life to work. You've got your health and you've got time where you're younger. But you might not have the money, but when you're older, you might have lots of money, but no health. Your health is deteriorated. Or if you're in the middle like me, you might have lots, you have money or you have tight health, but you don't have time because you've got kids, you've got jobs, you're busy, busy, busy. So throughout your life, there are different stages where you have more of one and the other. One pushback on this point that I was reading and then I was thinking was, I had no ability in my 20s to really go traveling in a big way like that. Not like the kind of stuff that he's talking about, you know, like backpacking and things. I was skint, mate. But I mean, a lot of my holidays weren't that expensive. You go to Europe, like we're so lucky living in Europe. You can just pop over to like Germany, France, I went up some holidays and had some experiences. Went to China. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I haven't been

12:19anywhere. I was late 20s then, the different kind of lifestyle, right? He's been always jumping on an easy jet or jet to holiday when you're like in your 20s with your mates, you know, go on a lads trip, go with your friends, go wherever. No, I did that, but I think he's kind of got this, you know, like go to Machu Picchu, the holidays of a lifetime, backpacking around South America kind of vibes. And I think I don't think that that's still an expensive thing to do. He's quite wealthy though. That's what I mean. I think there's a fair bit of privilege. We'll get into him as well because as part of this, we looked into Good Old Bill and he's got some wild behaviors of his own. He's definitely trying to die with zero. Yeah, but this thing about balancing health, time and money, I do think is an interesting way to frame it. I mean, we'll go into the different sections, but let's talk about health as one interesting section. People will save up their whole life to spend loads of money on health care at the very end of their life, extending their lifetime when they can't basically move. And you're in a bed and you've

13:23got a very poor quality of life. Yeah, so you've essentially given up a period of life of like in your 20s, 30s, 40s and 50s where you have great health to extend your health when you don't, you can't leave a bed, which just seems ridiculous, right? He argues instead that we should spend more on our health when we're younger so that it kind of compounds. And you get the dividends when you're older so that you have a longevity of life when you're in your 80s, you're more mobile. And you don't have this kind of thing of, oh, I'm just kept together by drugs and like nurses and stuff. So it's like, yeah, compounding health is like a really good point he talks about. Like if you're overweight, you'll put in more pressure on your knees. So like eventually you're going to need knee surgery or so these are things that you can work on. You can like stay active and then it means you can have a better quality of life for longer and you can do more things for longer. You can go on hikes when you're older rather than you can't walk for the age of 70, like you want to be able to be active, get to enjoy the world. I recently went out with my

14:26uncle, I probably told a story before and like obviously I've seen my uncle age over the years, you know, he looks older today than he did 30. You know, you've got that mind's eye of what your family are and then normally it's like in their 30s and you were like little like you have this image of your parents or whatever and you've seen them age a bit. But I also know some of his friends and I've seen them, you know, in dots throughout my life. We went out with one of his friends the other day and I could just see the difference in them in terms of, oh, you know, my uncle looks great. Like it's really good skin and all of this stuff. My uncle has been vegetarian for years because he doesn't like the taste of me makes a meal and he's always been super fit and active. He ran like triathlon. I don't know if you, do you run a triathlon? You do everything on a triathlon. Yes, I mean, you swim running. Engage in a triathlon. Complete, complete in this triathlon. Yeah, yeah. Well, he, he, he did do iron man's to be precise, not just triathlons, like big boy ones. And I think like health and compounding, the way wealth compounds it all

15:32happens at the end. So it like hockey sticks, because the 10% return say that you might average, you know, past performances, no guarantee of future results. But it, it all happens in the last few years. Health is like that. Of you, you trundle along and then all of the bad things, all the bad behaviours hit you at once, like a, like a boss. And I think you kind of fall off a cliff in terms of like you deteriorate really quickly. You can, you can get away with it in your 20s, 30s, maybe your 40s. But then if you've been hammering it, all those hours, 50s, you just, and I can see the separation in him versus his peers because of a lifetime of good health decisions. He still drinks and things. He always says, you can either drink smoke or not exercise, like you can only have one of those things. Yeah, you can't do all three. What is that cuff there, mate? That's for the smoky side. I think that, yeah, that's such a good point. My godmother, she's, I think she's around 60, 70. She treks over at work, fell over brokerhip. And just like a normal fall, not like down the stairs or anything, brokerhip, I went to go see her,

16:36she's like in bed. And I, the reason I really got into calisthenics is because he was a guy who was like 75 and he was just there banging on muscle ups and like press ups and pull ups. And I'm like, how old are you? He's like, I'm 75. I'm like, and he looks ripped, like way more ripped than me. And I'm like, how long have you been doing this for? He's like, I've been doing this for about 40 years. And he looked in impeccable shape. And you will never have guessed he was 75. But because he's been at the calisthenics his whole life, he's just like, he looks like a 40 year old who's in like peak condition. That's why I like calisthenics, because you get the mobility in the joint movements. But it's not, you know, if you want to get big and swell, you lift weights. But there's such static movements, you miss like the kind of mobility and the balance and the kind of, like the tendon work. The joint and the ligament. Which I think is. To me, and I know you've been setting up your business recently, so how has that been going? Pretty cool. Tion limited is out and about. One thing I have found, I was looking for a bank account and a lot of the big players in the game, they don't, they're not covered by the financial services

17:37compensation scheme. So a little bit worrying because I want my money to be safe. So I think I'm going to go with tide because they cover up to 120,000 pounds. It's a little bit worrying to me that you think you're ever going to have 120. I use tides instant saver account because I can earn interest on the money in my business account that I don't need day to day. With the tide instant saver account, you can get up to 4% AR variable. Plus you'll get a hundred pound cash back if you deposit £5,000 into your account in the first 30 days. If you want to try out, you can use the code making money or one word or just use the QR code that's on screen. We've also left a link in the description where you can find the terms as well. Variable rate is correct as of the 15th of January, 2026. So T, tell me the riskiest thing you've ever done. Mate, the cameras are rolling. I can't do that. You're trying to get me cancelled. I mean, most of my riski things were probably in my teenage years. But one thing I could say about finance risks definitely invested in stocks with zero research just because my friend told me to

18:37his research was trust me. It didn't go well. Wow. So clearly risk affects you in both your personal and business life. And that's why we're really happy today to be partnering with Vanta. They automate a lot of risk processes and help you see the risks in a centralized platform so you know what really needs your attention. Besides risk, the main thing Vanta does is automate compliance with security protocols that you need if you only do business with larger companies or grow internationally. This is stuff like GDPR, HIPPER, ISO 27001 and SOC 2. The beauty of Vanta is they make it easy to prove your compliant with these standards, saving up to 90% of the time it takes and on average half a million dollars. You can get started at Vanta.com forward slash making money. There's a link in the description. Okay, let's talk about relationships because he's got a lot to say there, hasn't he? I mean, I think one point that he mentioned is that it kind of ties into like giving. We want to we'll touch on that more later. But like he says a lot of people will I swear when I was in boarding school, a lot of people their parents

19:39are just giving a big set big like pocket money, give them loads of money but they never spend time with their kids so they don't really have a relate there. The dad might be in America, they send their kids to school in England for boarding school and then they see their parents like in holidays for like a couple of days and they get loads of money and then the parents die and they leave them loads of money but they haven't had any experience with their parents. They don't have a relationship so a lot of people want to just wait and leave it to their kids but really it's about the relationships. It's time you spend with your kids. Those are the memories. They're not going to remember oh my dad left me 200 grand. Cool but I don't know where's favorite collar was. We never have any holidays, any memories. Whereas if you spend time with your kids that's that's a different type of memory dividends. You're giving them memories and like stuff to build on and something tangible and like making them helping their development. So a lot of times we don't focus on relationships. We just think let me save up loads of money and I'll give it to my kids when I'm older and then they'll be set but you've missed a whole lifetime of spending time take them on holiday experiences. Now I'm very lucky because my parents, my grandparents always

20:41like let's go on a cruise, family holiday, family lunch on Sunday so like I've got all those memories of life and even if they leave me nothing I'll be like they gave me so much during my life so it doesn't really matter. So I think a lot of people think I've got to save loads, make loads and then leave my kids a million, leave my kids 10 bit coin, leave my kids whatever but what about when they're there and you're there and you can actually give them something experiences. Yeah there's like this is this image of cartoon and it's a dad and a son sat on a part bench and they're both thinking about there's like a thinking bubble above them and their dad is thinking about work so that he can provide his better life for his son and the son is just thinking about sitting on the bench with his dad not thinking about work and it's just like a deep and I think what Bill says in the book is he adults justify hard work by saying it's for my kids and often it's not it's for your own ego it's for your own view of yourself because actually if you said what does my kid want all your kid wants is your time yeah and to have some fun with you

21:41and you know how many people actually think back to their childhood life and go oh you know I'm so glad my dad did all that work and bought us a nice house they just think oh I remember that time we made a box for you know I remember my dad teaching me how to drive like my first time I go on a car yeah okay when I think it was New Year's Day and he's like all right this is even learned to drive and I was like 13 and then he just took me in a car in Nigeria we're driving school playground like school play not playground playing fields playing fields yeah move the kids I'm sorry no around the play playing field in Nigeria just driving around in loops and that's my first experience driving eight thirty you still can't drive so it's a bad teacher bro need to have a word with a senior a carol a yeah dude this that I think of is if you've got a childish 12 you've already spent 75% of all the time you'll ever spend with them wow he talks about time buckets and that's like the last time like I've got to I've got to three or the last we used to watch this show called mr. tumble and he's like oh mr. tumble and

22:45like it was really cool we watched it when he was like one two and then I'm like oh he's like I want to watch TV I'm like you want to watch this stuff I don't like that anymore and I was like what and so for me it was like a shock that was the last time we watched that show together he's like growing out of it but you don't realize in in life you have a lot of time buckets the last time you see your teacher your favorite teacher before they die the last time you get on a plane the last time you play basketball but at the time you don't realize it's the last time so it could be the last time your kid wants to play football with you the last time your kid wants to watch a TV movie with you and at the time it's insignificant you don't notice but then one day you look back and you're like oh my kid doesn't use the pot anymore my kid doesn't you know he doesn't like this show anymore so you have to bail says in life you should look at these time buckets and be like okay what do I want to do in this time bucket and split your life into different buckets even in retirement be like what do I want to do for the next five years next 10 years of retirement because people think they retire oh it's cool I just travel the world and after year they're bored they want to go back to work they're depressed they don't know what to do with themselves and so yeah he said it's really important to have time buckets be like what do I want to get out

23:47of the next five years you should hold your son's hand a lot mate because I do but why because that there'll be a day where they want doesn't want to hold your hand anymore in his heart breaking oh no don't set me off again mate three months ago I held my son's hand for the last no mate don't get me crying two days of the row in the podcast a little bitch like cry a little bitch anything to do with it I'll be there licking your tears right I get stronger it's a statement your tears to stay me yeah cry for me a little bitch no yeah yeah now it's like he won't hold my hand yeah and I knew it was coming honestly one of my biggest kind of like fears is like my son growing older now so you feel like the it's like sun slipping through your hands yeah sun slipping slipping away you know that song no time slowly slipping never mind come on is I keep keep going you know the song okay I think before we carry on let's talk about Bill himself

24:54because I kind of got a vibe from the book of this is a rich man talking about rich man things he had a different tax back it buddy yeah yeah yeah well the ability to die was zero most people don't live live at zero you know he does say he does say at the start anyone can read this book and benefit from it but it's really for people that have the ability to don't have got money not loads of money but they you know if you're hand to mouth in you know in in sub-Saharan Africa the idea of dying was zero is like I might die because I've got zero yeah whereas you know the average person in the western world might be faced with a situation of like oh I've got a pot of money at retirement like how do I deploy that so he does try and cover that but he certainly is a rich man so we've got some facts and stats written down about him here so he was a trader he's made a lot of money in his life he was a millionaire before 30 he's a poker player

25:54he's like to travel the world to play poker which is like the most expensive version of traveling pretty much on his 45th birthday he had a huge party on an island and fill out his parents all his friends his family to just have a big party because he's like I can do it when I'm 45 I might not be able to enjoy as much when I'm 15 just blew loads of money at a sick party who else you know makes pop do throw sick parties for people mate were you going this weekend oh yeah Christmas party yeah in February it's cheaper yeah making money not spending money poker yeah yeah it's not that much cheaper but yeah we're we're opening it a little bit from last year excellent yeah we're playing poker we're not playing poker we're playing roulette oh I like poker yeah yeah yeah we got we got he left tables um sorry there's the next one over inconsiderately decided to book some building work on the exact day that we filmed the podcast if you hear about hammering and drilling um going on that's that's what it is he bought a painting so Bill Perkins is a black man can I say that your brother he's a man of color I don't know what I can

26:59can I say yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah that's that's that's a cancel him yeah I'm offended ah twenty twenty six black man's okay yeah okay cool well he he is a black man you might not guess that with a name like Bill yeah it feels like a white man's name um and he bought a painting by a black artist that was valued at 250 000 how much did he pay did he pay 12 million something I think it was 12 years and his justification was like I'm supporting the black cause so Bill's got money yeah that's excessive but he does say one point he does say that like you can exceed obviously you should have some money but he says you can experience some things when you're broke so like you know yeah for going for a hike you know do these things running around going um dancing these are things you can like you don't need money for that you should do more of when you're when you're young because you can't really go on hikes when you're 80 yeah but I do wonder like what is Bill's version of Diana Mazeiro if he goes from a point of being worth say 50 million quid and and when he dies he's got a hundred grand in the bank he might be like

28:01yeah did it but most people might not only have a hundred grand for their whole retirement yeah so like his version of zero or near zero he's coming from such a high base that I wonder how detached he is from reality yeah and also I think like this guy's gambler he plays poker um he his friends describe him as a living like a billionaire when he's not you know so he he all he lives above his means as well clearly has a really high appetite for risk because of the poker and stuff and I wonder if he understands that there's certain people in the world that really gain a lot from like stability and buffers and knowing that they have money in their bank account yeah but I mean like I feel like you could take everything away from Bill and he'd be like well let's let's go again I feel that's a very that's a personality trait and I wonder you know I imagine there's lots of people listening myself included right I take a lot of like peace

29:02and like mental pressure off myself by having money in the bank you know but do you think when you get older and it gets to a time that you're you're still gonna have lots of money because he says like people find it really hard to go from saving and stacking money to spending yeah and that's like a big transition in life when you get towards the time or towards the late age you need to start spending and people keep accumulating I have some stats for you go on their mate all right so pensioners a lot of people he says don't spend enough money in the first 20 years of retirement because as their income decline they're spending declines as well and he said people with over half a million on average spend 11.8% of their capital before death and when was this book written I don't I think like you could probably inflate inflation adjust some of these numbers but I think you get a vibe but more worrying for you a third of retirees increase their assets rather than spending which sounds like you know sounds like a dream what you're like 95 you're like oh I've

30:07like doubled my net worth for the last year yeah yeah yeah you're outside in the cold mate yeah I'll be outside the collar please sir yeah you'll be like oh he's in your middle mate yeah okay got any more stats or is that you know that's it but it's I think yeah spent oh pensioners spend the least of their wealth so if you have a pension so like a lot of people in the Western civilization if you've got a pension you're even less likely to spend because you've got that and then you don't spend your wealth as well so the main issue I think this really highlights the main issue in the book like if you get to retirement and you're spending 11.8% of your capital before death like it's not ideal yeah which left a lot of food which comes back to the question from Susan it's this people people really struggle to decumulate and I think we've seen that with financial advisors many times haven't they that if you spent your whole life accumulating 180 and that is a tough challenge so some of this spending aspects in my life that I struggle with at the minute and I really annoy me and I'm trying to get over since reading this book are tax inefficient spending I'm

31:08like hemmed in by the fact of you know like the hundred grand cliff for earnings things like this like these tax cliffs where it's like oh if I take any more money out of my business past this point it's going to be tax at 60% so it feels to me like I shouldn't do that or you know I would like to buy myself a house like a nicer house but like the ripping the money out of the business it's like I struggle to make the decisions that are not about money like having a place that you love to live or a nicer car or whatever I always view them through like a tax lens and I know that at the end of my life I'll get them be like why did you give a shit about the amount of tax you were paying why didn't you just do the things that were nice do I mean I'll spend loads of money on holidays I'll spend loads of money on meals out I'll spend all of these things but like stamp duty on a property and I'm like oh you know I'll just stay where I am thanks do I mean and that's what I'm trying to get past yeah that kind of spend him yeah um I think like whatever you spend it's the experience I think I never regret any money I spent unless I've lost it in like

32:11you know like when I got scanned yeah when I got scanned but yeah apart from that like I never regret any money I spend like it's you know it's part of he says all these experiences in life make you who you are so like every time you spend every time you enjoy something that's adding towards your your your personality your character your experiences your outlook on life so it's never wasted I think time isn't wasted when you're getting wasted yeah it's philosopher asher off how much of you're like how much of your don't care attitude you think comes from the fact that you are you have wealthy parents um is it like a piece of mind that you know it's coming I mean that probably when I was growing up but now I'm not okay so probably when I was growing up uh subconsciously and also because of the school I went to like they told us for like oh you guys are all really smart you guys can like rule the world you're the best so like there's always been they told you that I'm I don't really want to say what they said I mean I'll be honest they

33:15said like you guys as I cried I don't know say it yeah say it they said like you guys pushing my channel what are you doing stop you're still pushing it stop pushing um they used to say in Winchester uh boarding school they say you guys are smarter than 99% of the country so you guys will be all right pretty much and they like it was like this you know boarding school English boarding school stuff they just drill into your head they're like you guys you guys are better than everyone else and it's just that yeah this is why you get people coming out of boarding school who are absolute that's why I mean hang yourself ever met he's a no bit because they they're told from the age of 13 you're smart and everyone else it's like yeah I don't think that's the best thing to tell 13 you want because then it goes to the head yeah they literally look down on me at Durham University I was going with you yeah look at me now bitch a little bitch crying heinish a little bitch why is heinish gonna get so hot is a little bit I never met heinish in my life mate never got to Durham every other white boy is called heinish Hugo heinish I know a lot of you guys a

34:16lot of heinishes yeah yeah yeah I mean I'm sorry there's gonna be heinishes listening to this you ain't little bitches just the ones we knew yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah no I think it's I mean also because I want to say it's because of that I think I'm like a peter pan I'm just care free because yeah how much of that comes from the fact that that's like like behind it all you know the one day that you're gonna be there's this block of money coming I mean it's I like to think that but I mean as you get older it's like as you get older one of your kids you think you're sorted yeah but then as you get older you realize things like the life like you realize my pants sort of their house they down size like you notice they've been it for a bit they've been in your life they had to pay stamp duty all these different things so it's like you realize that like the pot isn't it's big and everything I've got two siblings also one thing they've never given me money like they hold me out here again but my dad's like you've met my dad he's like you will work go and get your money this is my money go get your money but like he'll help me with like he bought with my first car they gave me health insurance but they don't just like give me money do they

35:18do they like you've got to work for it is that your sister like the princess yeah because it's the only girl so yeah and I mean my brother and my brother's a youngest so he gets like you know oh you're the youngest and I'm just like yeah you're the oldest get to work go go set an example for your siblings so yeah so for me it's more like I know I'll be all right generally just because I'm like an optimistic guy but I think I'll leave me something but not buy me a house would like leave me like half a million anything but maybe that realization is kind of why you've been saving more it is actually honestly because I thought I'd be sitting there as I got all done like wait a minute they have they have their own bills to pay they've got their own medical staff they might have to yeah they're thinking about getting in place in the countryside so yeah they I don't want to be like leaning on them I remember asking my mom when I was like younger once have you saved any money for me because like there was other kids at school they were like oh yeah my parents have took away the child benefit every month and there's there's like 20 grand in an account I'm in a buy a house or so I don't know who's like 14 15 I remember asking my mom she's like I don't I didn't have any money to save and fair enough but yeah yeah this is like

36:24all these generations that have come before me and you're telling me there's no generational wealth no one needs to put a little bit of money to any bit of size only generations have been here I've got nothing hundreds of generations to lead to me and not a single person for oh you know what I'll talk something away for the generations I'm going to be the guy that creates the generational wealth I think it's we actually especially living in London like you think you have so much more money because you get big salaries that's why I thought I was generally like how much they're getting paid but like the outgoing they had a business in Chelsea medical centre on full and road and like just like business rates like going up every year like the cost of running a business in London is so high so they sold it now but like it's when you actually look into the details like someone might seem rich but then you realise all their outgoing than I actually is so liquid as you like to think so James Smith who's a big like fitness youtuber I was on his podcast recently he was telling me a story I don't think you'll mind me that he took over his parents mortgage loads like oh I've made it I'll take care of it for you

37:30and he thought oh well they've been paying this thing for 30 years it'll be nearly gone and his dad was like oh cheers and that the mortgage was more than the house the value of the house when they bought it he was like what the hell's going on and he was like well you know your childhood mate that was good yeah I was just refinancing the house and spending the money I decided to prioritise your childhood over my long-term financial future at that point and I think we can often have views of our parents of maybe you think you know you might look at your parents go oh they're sorted financially but actually they might be whittling them up now that's so far I had a conversation with my parents recently like we went for lunch and like about finances and then they were like my dad was telling my mom was like why would oh we don't have enough to leave the kids and then my dad's like yeah but we've given them so much like in life we couldn't have given them more like in their experiences so like even if we don't have as much as we like to leave them like we've given them and I I appreciate I don't know if my siblings felt the same but like I was like that's why your brothers running around the house dibs in all the artworks you literally is I'm having that he did see my dad's car and apparently this was like this was before he could

38:36drive you can't go to car like 10 years ago apparently I just found out I lost weekend yeah you just went on a mad shopping spree one weekend you'll go around the house dibs in everything you can't do that honestly yeah you should you should you should you should you should you should like a dibs in a pension yeah yeah work out somewhere I need to start dibs in some stuff yeah dibs in some stuff honestly a madness a whole whip I was like what okay yes thanks for that mate I appreciate it not sure your siblings will let's talk about some of the practicalities of diameter zero and what that actually means so and then we're going to come onto some of the other pushback which is like what about the kids because there's a whole section about what about the kids so we don't know when we're going to die and there's a potential longevity risk of you might live for a long time above the average or you might die well below the average so you want to kind of get the most out of it because you know averages they don't tell the full picture yeah it's so it's hard to manage that as an individual and I think what a lot of

39:40insurance does is manage the averages for people whereas what Bill's trying to do is say like here's a way that you can look after it for yourself in certain ways right so one thing he's big on his annuities economists love annuities as well because what they do as a product is they allow you certainty over a certain level of income and what he would you can explain you can explain them go on oh put me on the spot annuities you got you put you got to put them money you give it to an annuities broker yeah and then they will pay you a certain amount every year for as long as you live yeah so it's ensuring again I don't think there's an investment as Bill says think a bit of it as like ensuring your life in case you live for ages yeah yeah and yeah so never run out of money people hate them because you don't get they take your pot of money and it's gone and Bill argues actually you want that income because you don't know how long you're going to live for and actually you will probably get a higher amount from the annuity provider than you

40:46would spend of the pot yourself because we know from your stats before tea that people tend to be quite cautious if you give a hundred grand to an annuity provider they might say I will give you seven grand a year or whatever whereas you might only spend four of it and yeah so they kind of give you that permission to spend because you know every month I'm getting that money in my bank account whatever so I can just blow it yeah and it just allows you to take care of like the base layer costs so he's big on those his idea of dying with zero is not just like blowing all of your money you know he also talks about gifting and things but we'll get onto that so let's have a look what else has you got he also talks about life work insurance so you're ensuring your family in case something happens to you and you can't work so it says like these are ways that you can help yourself to die with zero because you're always covered you're covered for death you're covered for injury don't be your own insurance basically yeah yeah so the annuity is a big thing how what's some of the other ways oh it like valuing your time so working out how much you

41:50you know how much your hourly rate and stuff how much it actually costs you to deliver an X amount of money into your bank account in terms of the time and then weighing up you know how much time you think you'll have at the end he's really into kind of like this is my hourly rate this is how much I'm worth tasks like cleaning and things like this he thinks you should get rid of them yeah and he also says you should figure out go and do some medical tests I think you're going to go do some somewhere and like check your body basically regularly check how your body is and how like if you have any illnesses and make sure that you get ahead of it so that you can kind of estimate how long you're going to live for and a bit more accurately rather than being like I'm 70 I'll probably live to 80 and then not knowing that you've got something wrong with your kidney and you could have had a full body scan to check it out yeah I was looking at an S data around life expectancies and people under 60 underestimate how long they'll live by a decade so you know everyone's like I won't make it to 65 yeah you will make statistically you will people who are 75 and over over estimate how

42:50long they'll live so they think oh no one who's 75 wants to say I've probably got five years left they'll be like oh I'll live for another 10-15 years so they tend to over kind of estimate it on the other side that creates problems because that person who's near 80 should be spending money yeah you should be spending their money getting a new idea to cover the basics because you know probably in the next few years you're going to get to a point where you don't want to do much anyway and go live your life and then the people who are younger need to understand that actually I might live for another 20-30 years because it's dire or zero it's not run out of money 20 years before you die I mean and then be broken old yeah I found that really difficult he was talking about the countdown app which shows you a life expectancy to the day and then it shows you how many hours days weeks you've got left I had to pause it and I think this is why so many people have problems with you know dying with zero or like looking at thinking of how long you're going to live for because it is quite dark and it's for me it's depressing you know me I want something

43:50sets me off I start getting emotional and depressed so like it's quite dark thinking about your death date but you if you're realistic with it then you'll probably more likely to die closer to zero or basically not have like hundreds of thousands of pounds sitting on the table on your death when you die yeah you all need to kind of face up to your own mortality and honestly I'm bad at that I'm always thinking oh hey I just going to just yeah it's going to make me live forever this up I probably don't want to admit to myself that I am going to die and like a part of that is because I don't I'm worried that I'll regret that I'm not done enough but I also think that what we should say is that like you can have this conversation where it's almost like oh boy by the time you get to 67 it's too late for you yeah I think what Bill argues is that the things you'll want to do just change and don't delay the things that you should be doing in your 30s and 40s he has like the party of a lifetime at 45 because he's like I'm not going to really want to do crazy like that in 20 years and in one of his parents though as well yeah yeah yeah so there's plenty of things that people do in their retirement that they love and enjoy and there's so much that you

44:52can do with that time but if you're saying to yourself oh I'll travel around Bali in my 70s maybe you won't maybe actually then you'll be like I just want to be in my garden you know and like doing that kind of stuff so yeah so not delaying those memory dividends and things like that um the inheritance one I think is good because let's he says the most common pushback is what about the kids if I blow all my money but actually he's really in favor of inheritances and gifts and and changing people's lives but he's he wants you to do it while you're alive yeah since then he says that it's like you said recently if you receive your inheritance at 60 it's very different to receiving it at like 30 or 40 because if you're if it's money for a flat or a house you can enjoy that house from the age of 30 40 for the rest of your life but if you get it at 60 you've probably already got a house or you know it's not going to be as valuable and you can't see your kids enjoying it like if you give them money for a house you want to see them in the house you want to go to the house you want to have memories birthdays see the grandkids yeah you go

45:53around and it's like this is the house I paid for yeah look at how much everyone's loving it and the grandkids are running around and you like this is me and you can enjoy the grandkids and have time with them but if you do when they're dead when you're gone you don't know if they'll yeah you want to enjoy it he argues that waiting to die before you gift or give to charity is a selfish act which is like quite challenging because basically he was pushing back on people that go oh it's selfish to die with zero and he's like no it's selfish to wait until you're dead to give yeah because actually you've prioritized your own needs first and then you're saying whatever's left is okay whereas what I do is go I'm going to carve out money for people today so that they can enjoy it and benefit their life like the charity stuff he's like the charities need the money now and it can help more people sooner yeah yeah yeah and that compounds yeah you know like you give them the money today he's got all this advice around making sure that the charity actually uses the money today and doesn't just sit on it and things he goes into it in detail but yeah I do think his idea of dying was era is about the money you have for you and he certainly allocates

46:55money for kids for friends for family and that isn't the money he's talking about dying with zero with exactly it's like no the pot that you've allocated for your experiences and own life that's the money you should settle down to zero and you you protect against dying before that runs out with an annuity and you also get to avoid inheritance tax if you give it to them when they're yeah there might be other tax implications to consider yeah but you you avoid the inheritance if you give it to someone your kids when they're 40 like given money for a property or something it's gonna be a lot one should be more tax efficient than after you pass away right one of the things I love the most it like it's so weird is given like I get like a lot of joy out of giving you know um to charity I've got like the victim support stuff was like I've got those pictures frame where they wrote letters uh someone I know recently um a friend of mine a woman she used victim support and she was I was talking to her because she had a bad relationship and a breakup

47:55and she was using victim support she was talking to me she was like I'm getting this help from this really great charity called victim support I was like oh I donated the load of money for you my audience today load of money I was like look at these letters they send and she was like no way they're like oh you paid for a full time helper for a whole year with your donations and all this and I was like I like this is a good charity and you can enjoy that because you were like yeah I was like you're welcome so this experience yeah that's a memory that's it's a dividend and you feel good yeah if you don't when you don't you want you want no one can say oh this charity helped me because you'll be dead and yeah exactly and yeah I think uh I think that's some of the best stuff in the book around inheritance and charities and and actually to wait until you die could he could be considered a selfish act because you've taken care of yourself and then it's like whatever's left and also the compounding point around like you say the charities need the money now yeah but really giving is a selfish act because it makes you feel good it's not selfish but it's not selfless and living that glory mate didn't make you didn't make you think anything

48:59different about how you're going to leave stuff to your son like obviously I did my will yesterday in the episode so I was like yeah I want him to have money at 20 oh he's got a junior so I want to get money at 25 I want to get money at 30 so he can enjoy it and use it well hopefully well I'm still around and like he can make a difference to his life younger rather than when he's 60 so do you want to change anything with uh so yeah like there's two elements of how I think about with my son it's I want him to get ahead in life but I want him to I want him to have desire and drive and I think everything that I'm proud of about myself has been born out of the struggle do I mean like born out of like forged in the fire kind of thing yeah and I don't want to take that away from him and I know many rich kids that have are very dissatisfied with their own lives because they feel like they they're just living in the shadow of their parents success right so it's like how do I deliver that how do I make him have desire and also I think that a big problem in the the world we operate in is many parents feel this pressure of I need to

50:01say for my own retirement but I also need to carve out something for the kids so I think what I'm going to do in this much changes I'm going to only have for him a junior isa and a junior sip so he's got an I the the isa that it kicks in at 18 and then a pension and I will contribute to those over time and I'll probably pay into his pension for quite a while even when he's an adult I might have been incentivized him and do like an employee a match kind of scheme where I'm like if you put in a hundred quit I'll put in a hundred quid or if I'm gifting money I'll be like oh I'm going to put some money in your pension for you because what will happen is you'll get that junior isa at 18 and I'll try and tell him to buy a house you'll probably blow it on a car on a holiday and then he will regret it in five ten years good he then lives with that regret and like kind of that oh shouldn't have messed that up but I know that his pension or kicking when he's like 60 odd but he I hope he's not the kind of person that goes well I'm just going to sit around and not do anything in life waiting for that I don't think he will be because it's it's a lot of it's from the parents

51:02like from the parenting like my dad was like from the age of 13 he's like in the summer holidays he's like go you're doing work experience like you need to know the value his favorite phrase you need to know the value of money like you I don't want you to just think money's free so I'll start you know my friends are partying having fun and I'm working like a law firm like work experience working in a medical center work experience so it's a lot of it is on the parenting like I've got friends who'd never worked a day in their life and they're just their parents giving the money and they just sit home doing cocaine all day and like drinking and just like spending money and literally have no drive no no will to succeed no because they don't have to they've got butlers they've got cars they've got drivers they've got everything they need big house in Chelsea so it really does depend on like the parenting so you've got to drill into your son like this is my money you've got to make your money but you need to know the value of I'll be here to help you but you need to know how important money is and like the value of it so yeah and you get that from working I think but I do I do think like it also if I go if I just go he's got a junior izer and a junior sip and I will be generous in that sip so that I know in retirement he's

52:04sorted and actually he will probably have access to those funds before I die anyway because I have my son pretty young that's 25 so you know I'm going to live forever but at 60 I could be 85 so I could be alive right but at 60ish he might be able to access that money so actually he might get that sooner anyway I can put him on a good path in his early life of like I've saved up this money so you can buy a house but I could he can also learn the lesson of blowing it but I then also get to say every bit of money that I've scored away for my retirement is mine to blow I can blow this money don't no one is waiting for this money don't have to consider anything you've used your son's life to leverage the benefit of time to build him up a nice part in retirement and I think that's probably what I'm going to do yeah and hopefully as well it's like well you've got him when you're 18 may you get him when you're at 60 the middle's up to you like enjoy your life you know like go go and strive and things whereas if it's like oh if I just say to my dad come on dad give us 20 grand yeah

53:08yeah yeah do it once you do it then never yeah you'll never have the work done a lot of people on that day yeah yeah I got I might one of them dogs that you see just walk around there's been overbred but the nipples are just dragging on the floor I mean like let him leave her alone there's one anymore babies we'll just chase him after like I've got a little baby picking there and all this house he on the teeth I mean like it's like he's raising rabbits and all sorts everyone wants to taste me yeah yeah yeah just an old man mate spent yeah anyway I think I think I don't know if I don't know how it'll change and I don't know if I'll be able to turn down my son with his puppy dog eyes and my question is life but I really want that because then I can just say to him and I can incentivize him to save into his own pension and free myself of the burden of thinking I've got a carve out money in retirement for him and just go buck wild yeah yeah and then yeah so that we talked about that what about your

54:13son what are you going to do you you kind of I mean same same as you I've got the junior I junior sip and then I do want him to have something at like 25 30 for property the 18 I don't expect him to buy property 18 like I was not in any position like mentally even if I had the money to buy a property 18 I would have just like let every the boiler would have been on fire also oh yeah yeah yeah so like if he spends his eyes some money on a car that's cool my parents got me a car at 17 I'll get him a car 18 yeah but it mate like he's going to be buying like a bloody like brand new Mercedes no not a Lambo my first car no my first car was a Persia 300 even I've been paying into that since the day he was born and I'll pay until the day turns 18 and then he's off the tee he's like please I'm called a man that's another set of eyes I won't be able to turn down yeah he's got you guys but he's like can I borrow you for a minute that's what he does he comes over does he's like I borrow you for a minute anyway um to be fair my son's always like daddy please can you buy me this and I'm like you're three odd you know about this and like he doesn't go to his

55:16money come straight to me like daddy can you buy this I mean like he'll be a significant amount of money in their mate yeah and like if you're saying oh yeah buy a car with it he's going to be his first car will be like a we're like a 2050 plate Mercedes god I thought that's too much for an 18 year old yeah it's got to stop someone selling your pose a little pose if you go of course they humble yeah oh and one thing we didn't mention is knowing your peak yeah he views it through half time and money again so it's knowing your peak ages for certain things he does his big party up 45 because he's like it's probably in peak me in terms of the amount of money I have and the ability to like whether a massive hangover I guess you know I mean and like bringing in your family and stuff it's like peak it's like his peak kind of yeah ability to enjoy himself in that sense not his peak life overall he's got a lot to give but it's knowing those moments like the peak for each bucket in a way what's peak with your son probably like seven eight nine years old before he starts going away to come more about mates yeah

56:19and then peak of like how much is enough I've got that number pretty well fleshed out for me I think you know if I had two million pounds in in assets I would say like that that that is a figure where I'm like you've told yourself for a long time Damien that is enough I might want more than that I might strive for more than that but I've got to have a word with myself in the mirror at that point going you've said for years and you've crunched the numbers that this is enough because that would produce maybe say six seven thousand pound a month net in income and if you've got a house it's paid off as well which is probably more I mean like net assets yeah you've got paid off house you're bringing in six seven grand a month like you're right Damien you're right so that to me then is like about going in am I changing the gears here am I still going to work strive for money or am I going to strive for something else strive for enjoyment right having said that though he says that trade when the book he says he had a friend who's a trader he said if I make when if I make three million dollars and I'm still working punch me in the face got to three

57:19million dollars yeah that'll be once you hit two million mate I'll be like he said he got to three million um kept on working I think he ran up like two hundred million or something like and then he's a billionaire now is he eventually got to be there but like a few years later he had a couple hundred million and he's like why are you still working and he kept on working then became a billionaire and he's like I could have retired so much earlier and enjoyed more of my life so it's really important when you get to that we've got that number and you get to two million you you be like okay one am I going to change and not just keep going through it and just keep doing the same thing yeah a big thing for me about it there is more just enjoying it along the way otherwise I will just run at that number and like think oh life cannot be enjoyed until I get to that number and that's some that's the biggest mistake um which is like some of the changes that I've some of the changes that I've made or I will be making I'm tying in some other elements here and I've spoken about them in some of the other episodes we've recorded recently because this thing called like the big ass calendar or the big ass year the guy the guy was is a billionaire he is he's all

58:21about living the best life to me if you are moving in an episode that might not have come out yet as well name dropped him it's funny how it all connects anyway he's got this calendar and he like it's so huge and he sits down and he plans out his year the fun stuff first and then everything else has to fit around it so he'll be like okay he's got a friend who says you need six mini breaks a year so every two months you've got to go away and do a little mini adventure that could be oh I'm going to go to Lisbon or I'm going to go camping or I'm going to you know jet ski or just something that is like oh that's different and he's not the same thing every time it's like if you always go to Cornwall and do the same thing just go do something it's a bit different I'm going to go ice skating I don't know oh and and he blocks those out so then you've got six of those he does like the big holidays with family and friends like this is the big one and then he has this thing called a Migosie I think it's called a Migosie I'm sorry if I pronounce that wrong

59:24future Damien here just reviewing this footage and yeah I 100% said that wrong it's a masogi not a Migosie he says that it's this Japanese tradition of doing something challenging each year he's actually wrong I think I looked at it and and where it comes from is these certain Japanese monks who stand under freezing water for like until their master or their like chief monk goes or you can come out and it's about self-discipline and really testing yourself physically now he's adopted it as doing something once a year that's like year defining that's a bit of a challenge that's completely out there because then every single year you have this event that you go oh 2026 I I did that I learned to play the piano in 2027 I ran a marathon 2028 I went to every space come 2029 the podcast did a live show like whatever it's like something that's going to really push you and it's just this one thing a week so that over a year you collect all of these things because

1:00:24we might have 50 of those right and then it like you can look back for the years and be like I did 50 things that were just mental and like I think that's a really good thing and that's living life that is living life and then he's he sells this big calendar I bought one and then I'll just like roll it up and like store them and I'm hoping like over my life I've just got these all up and I can just like roll them out and be like oh look at 2026 look what we did you know anyway because I have I have a very big tendency to kind of like I will be happy when I get to this yeah and that that constantly moves away from you so running on a treadmill so I'm for me dying with zero is not about a money it's about getting to the finish line and be like I am spent yeah I have nothing left to give this world I have like left it all on the table you know I've lived a rich life and I have gotten I'm ready to die now take me my titties are spent just dragging out there somewhere

1:01:24yeah just put me down out the back I can't give anymore do you know what I mean anyway I went on a bit of a rant now and this sparked that view of it and yeah the Migosis and all the little the little adventures and I'm excited me I'm excited for life now oh welcome to the party buddy yeah yeah yeah waiting for you for a while yeah we're going to do Migosis over here within the business sense and we're going to do it I'm probably saying it wrong again sorry there's going to be some Japanese people like a load of haymishes and a load of Japanese people this guy's a dick there's a Japanese haymish somewhere in the world what did I do yeah nothing me you did nothing and yeah and we're going to do I'm going to do them in my personal life and I've got to work out what those things are but yeah I've got Migosi going on a live podcast on squiggly careers pop up with it that is my Migosi and gozy you've got to write it down and log it every week do one yeah so that you can go not every week Jesus Christ no because you said every week

1:02:28no he's I he says that you do one a year and you know you're we might live for another 50 years so at the end of that I mean I'm not talking this has got to be like a big thing mate big thing big thing that really challenges you that might take the whole year to kind of work up to not just going and sitting on stage I think maybe that's big for me what's yours then for this year I don't know I'm going to figure out I think the thing for the podcast is we're going to do a live event yeah and it's going to cost us loads of money we're going to lose loads of money but we're going to do a live event because that that's like a real challenge for for the podcast um maybe last year or the year before was I bought the podcast you could say oh that's the year I bought the podcast you know maybe one is like I bought a house you know like you could say that like oh that that was my Migosi because that's a big thing for like someone you know I bought a house that year I made my first investment they yeah they're big to you maybe when you're 85 is I went out the house do you know what I mean or like you're 95 and it's like I walked a mile

1:03:31you know what I mean like they they can scale with your age and they they're relevant to those time buckets you're 21 I went I went uh I moved out of my house uh with my parents I I travel around Asia I don't know it just means that you don't like just go through the motions and you have these memory dividends and you consciously plan them and you sit down at the start of each year and you go what's my big thing what's going to be the thing that in 2030 is I look back on and I go oh I did that because there's a quote in the book actually made that I want you to read that I think kind of kind of sums this up real nicely this idea what's that last line right now there's months there you go so uh part we both like the conclusion of this book sums up very nicely um bill says but I still ask you why wait until your health and life energy have begun to wane rather than just focusing on saving up for a big pot of money that you're most likely not be able to spend in your lifetime live your life to the fullest now

1:04:34chase memorable life experiences give money to your kids when they can best use it donate money to charity while you're still alive that's the way to live life always remember in the end the business of life is the acquisition of memories so what are you waiting for before you go it's really important to remember that nothing we said there was financial advice the reason it's not financial advice is because it's not tailored to you if you want advice it's tailored to you it's worth speaking to a financial advisor as with everything financial please do your own research we really encourage that because no one cares more about your money than you i'm demo i'm tea jack and ben and flow spire film and edit for us roots up producer and well is the co-founder at most see you next week